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Messages - randomdragoon

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26
Game Reports / Re: Really fast game
« on: April 09, 2012, 10:07:29 pm »
Multiplayer games with everyone spamming Governors can also go by extremely quickly.

27
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Some cards my brothers and I came up with
« on: April 07, 2012, 02:37:43 pm »
+2 buy is something that's very hard to balance -- most games it is no better than +1 buy, but some games the +2 buy is extremely overpowered.

Also, there are some big memory issues with Peon -- say I played 7 Peons in one turn. How the heck am I supposed to remember what I get the next turn?

28
Dominion Articles / Re: Request: Shanty Town
« on: April 03, 2012, 10:14:22 pm »
Another thing to consider is that sometimes the action fork is mandatory and there's no other choice -- Torturer usually does this.

Shanty town really sucks with terminal non-draws: The hand shanty town-swindler-copper-copper-estate is very bad, and it's situations like this that beginners tend to forget about when they evaluate shanty town. shanty town-swindler-swindler-copper-estate is better, but is it that much better than silver-swindler-swindler-copper-estate that you will risk the first situation above?

29
Dominion Isotropic / Interface badness: card selection constraints
« on: April 03, 2012, 10:05:14 pm »
On Firefox, if you try to start a custom game with card constraints, it is very difficult to actually select a constraint from the dropdown, since as soon as something updates in the game lobby (which happens quite frequently when Isotropic is active) the dropdown menu immediately closes.

30
I'll finish the base set $2s.

Cellar    
$2 Action   
+1 Action
Discard any number of cards.
+1 Card per card discarded.

A mediocre sifter, but hey, what are you expecting at $2. It becomes more powerful when you can increase your handsize (e.g. laboratory, tactician, +cards/+actions engines), but conversely is weakened in the face of handsize reduction attacks. Like all sifters it becomes less useful if you can directly trash the junk in your deck.

Moat    
$2 Action – Reaction    
+2 Cards
When another player plays an Attack card, you may reveal this from your hand. If you do, you are unaffected by that Attack.

Consider the damage you do to your own deck by buying this card before you get it to stop attacks -- +2 cards is a very weak effect to waste a terminal action on. You probably want to bother with this only against the most powerful of attacks. However, this card becomes better in a multiplayer game, as more attacks will hit you between your turns and one Moat can stop them all.

31
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Self-tortured
« on: April 03, 2012, 02:10:52 am »
Thanks for the feedback guys.

I agree the wording on the bottom is clunky, but I also want to avoid making this a Duration card if at all possible. It feels pretty wrong that the Duration part of this card would be purely downside, and Durations also tend to miss reshuffles which I don't really like. I worded the second downside as a "discard down to 3" so the card can self-synergize a bit (playing additional copies won't hurt you more) and also to make this card kind of a delicious combo with Outpost rather than just sucking with Outpost.

Regarding gaining a copper - here are the reasons why I chose Estate:
1 - Estates will empty sometime, likely after the Curses do. This card is very sad when Curses are gone and at least it's just an expensive Smithy once Estates are out too.
2 - Estates cost $2, curses cost $0. There might be some interesting strategies where both decks are being junked up but trash-for-benefit cards generally work better on Estates than Curses.

Gaining coppers has merits too, though, I will have to think about this one.


An alternate downside I was considering was "... or draw only 4 cards (instead of 5) during this turn's cleanup phase". It's probably too brutal though.



32
Variants and Fan Cards / Self-tortured
« on: April 02, 2012, 02:59:41 pm »
Here's an idea I thought of randomly - you have to torture yourself in order to get a powerful effect. Either a self-militia or a self-witch (I have you gain Estates so that the Curse pile doesn't run out too fast)

Dark Consultation - $5
Action - Attack
+3 cards
Each other player gains a Curse.
Choose one - Gain an Estate, or discard down to three cards in hand after drawing cards for this turn's clean-up phase.

I'm not sure about this - I feel like you would take the self-militia in the early-game (you have crap to discard anyway, hopefully). This would lead to an excess of Estates, which would make this card a bit painful once Curses run out. But if this gets ignored early game, the 2VP swing would be quite powerful later.

This might be really good in a BM-smithy type deck (smithy + 2VP basically) but my intuition would be that doublejack still beats this.

33
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Cheap, double-edged curser
« on: April 02, 2012, 02:30:18 pm »
I think it would be good as it is originally at $4. Compare to Sea Hag, for instance. Sea Hag gives you a "dead" card (Sea Hag itself, which doesn't give the user any direct benefits) in exchange for a powerful curser. This card also gives you a dead card (a curse) in exchange for a powerful curser. Unlike Sea Hag, this card doesn't collide, but the curse doesn't go on top of the deck either. Sea Hag also kind of screws 5/2 openings but that's life sometimes. Then again, Sea Hag is the most powerful $4 card and you might not want a card that powerful...

Another idea I have is

Brown Magic - $5
Action
+1 card
+1 action
Each other player gains a curse.
---
When you gain this, you gain two coppers.


34
Dominion General Discussion / Re: HoP Combo - How to?
« on: March 29, 2012, 03:31:08 pm »
Hunting party isn't good at getting multiple HoPs in your hand, and you can't play HoPs before your actions. For building a megaturn engine (one that aims to convert several HoPs into provinces at once) I would prefer Lab over Hunting Party for this reason. Lab's drawing power is good enough that you can get enough variety, anyway.

35
if the attack was young witch a single lighthouse could work as well.
Well, he did say it came from the Black Market deck, so probably not...

36
- YW normally, but pearl diver isn't a bad bane, since it's non-terminal (imagine if moat was +1 cards/+1 actions instead of +2 cards). My money is on Sea Hag on this board.
- On 5/2, I would curse my luck and pick up Sea Hag/Pearl Diver. At least the pearl diver will still probably be more useful than normal, due to being the bane.

37
The problem with scheme is that initially, scheme+workshop does not workshop as fast, on average, as double workshop, and later I would probably prefer to drain the workshop pile than take a scheme. And you do have the other problem you  mentioned of splitting your pile-draining on two different piles.

38
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Card Ideas: most playtested
« on: March 08, 2012, 04:18:21 pm »
My thoughts:

Lucky break: it doesn't need the "if you do" clause, since the first effect is mandatory and the second effect will fail if you fail to do the first one anyway (see remake)

Silver amulet: Unlike lab, it's not spammable because it reduces your handsize, so I'm not surprised that the person who bought too many of these lost. I woudn't compare this to lab or even Market, but rather Upgrade. Both give +1 card/+1 action but ultimately reduces your handsize; Silver amulet temporarily changes one of your cards into a silver and upgrade permenantly changes one of your cards into something better (or nothing, in the case of copper/curse). It would seem Upgrade is better at the beginning, but Silver amulet would get good when you start greening. Also, Silver Amulet seems like it would be strong with a "draw up to X" card like Library.

Battle Charge seems too good. It's almost strictly better than Smithy, which is not a bad card at all. Remember, Masquerade, which is +2 cards/trash a card from your hand is one of the best actions in the game. Also, I think you could lead to a degenerate game in 4p if 3 of the players agree to choose "trash" every single time they play it.

Scavenger: The "While this is in play" line would be at the bottom of the card separated by a horizontal line. The whole "discard source" concept seems confusing though.

Celtic Metal: interesting card, gives players a way to trash curses they might choose to gain from this. The attack might actually be a boon for the opponents, at least in the early stages of the game (discard an estate, trash an estate)


Untapped ruins: My initial assessment is that this card seems weak. A card that gives just +2 actions is worse than $2, and you have to discard a lot to get more than +2 actions from this. On the other hand the ability to get +3 or more actions is really strong on some very special boards, so I don't know. Seems like this card would be extremely niche if anything. Maybe if this cost less, or gave +1 card in addition (or maybe +1$? for a lesser buff), it would be better.


Villa: The wording is weird, but basically it's this: whenever you draw a card, you don't. Remember how many cards you would have drawn for your entire turn , and then between your action and buy phases discard that many cards, and get +1VP for each card discarded. Also, multiple villas don't stack, since the first villa replaces the draw effect and the second villa has nothing left to replace.

This card has the problem of being completely useless on a board with no +card effects. Which is rare, but it happens. At least Tunnel is the best VP you can get for $3, so it might have some use if there are no discard effects, but this doesn't even give that. Also, I feel that this card could lead to a degenerate never-ending game where people just play out their engine with this in it, gain 12 VP, and buy nothing forever, and that this degenerate game is much easier to set up than a degenerate game involving monuments.

Township: pretty interesting. You could use it as an island and tuck away your bad cards (probably what will happen most of the time) or try to build a megaturn with this. This might be a bit too good as a "trasher" though (compare to Upgrade - this doesn't give you silvers for your estates but doesn't lower your score either, and gives you +2 actions). Although native village is probably better for the megaturn because of the cheap cost, just like how workshop/gardens is better than ironworks/gardens.


39
Other Games / Re: What other games are as good as Dominion?
« on: February 29, 2012, 10:38:31 pm »
I really like Space Alert -- It's a fully cooperative game, so no ganging up, but it's also played in real-time (everyone plans out their actions at the same time, and there is a time limit. Afterwards you go around and resolve the actions to see how you did) so it doesn't have the "Leader decides what everyone does" syndrome, because no one person can usually track everything that's going on at once. I find it really fun for a cooperative game where, instead of being able to tell someone exactly what moves to make, you only have enough time to say something like "Can you take care of that space octopus over there?" and have to trust that your teammate will do the right thing.

40
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Worst Kingdom Design Thread!
« on: February 28, 2012, 05:13:45 pm »
Here's my submission for worst kingdom design:

Hamlet
Swindler
Smugglers
Scheme
Chancellor
Sea Hag
Throne Room
Scout
Margrave
Adventurer

The key cards here are Swindler and Sea Hag. Chancellor, Scout and Adventurer only exist to give good swindle targets at 3,4 and 6. Scheme, Hamlet, and Throne room are there to facilitate early and often attacking. Smugglers for some added randomness and another option for opening. And Margrave for a discard attack, but one which makes it more likely that everyone plays there attacks as often as possible.

Personally, I like Farmland as a $6 swindler target much more - they only get the benefit on buy, not on gain.


41
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Worst Kingdom Design Thread!
« on: February 28, 2012, 03:20:02 pm »
I don't think we've had a thread like this since Hinterlands. I challenge anyone to come up with a kingdom half as annoying as this one.

Scrying Pool
Secret Chamber
Ghost Ship
Hamlet
Spy
Moneylender
Pearl Diver
Cutpurse
Inn
Young Witch (Bane: Pawn)

Might be more annoying if it was Margrave instead, so your opponents have to do something every time you play it, not just the first. Replace Moneylender with Spice Merchant to cause more clicking. Also, if there is a way to fit in both Treasury and Alchemist into that board, then each cleanup becomes a massive pain as well (Isotropic will repeatedly ask you if you want to clean up Treasury or Alchemist or some irrelevant card first, and when you click on one, it will ask you again if you want to put it on top)


42
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Mining Village
« on: February 18, 2012, 03:36:41 am »
A good way to think about MV is to think of it as a one-shot Grand Market.

43
Dominion General Discussion / Re: To veto or not to veto
« on: January 24, 2012, 01:32:06 am »
I play veto mode when playing in real life, mostly because my playgroup likes constructing engines more than anything else. The result is that instead of hoping that a village-like card appears in 10 randomizers, we get 13 or 14 chances instead (no one ever vetos the village)

44
(1) I disagree with your analysis for 3rd card, and perhaps even with your 2nd card. If you buy a 2nd Smithy, you now have more ways to make your Smithies collide (drawn together in same hand of 5, or Smithy A draws Smithy B, or Smithy B draws Smithy A). With a Village, only one of those is happening. Certainly when it comes to the third card with 2 Smithies, Village is helping loads.
With a village, you have additional bad cases (cases where village is worse than nothing):

Smithy A draws Village
Smithy A draws Smithy B and village
Smithy B draws Smithy A and village
Smithy B draws village

The following cases are made better:
Village+Smithy A+Smithy B in hand
Village+Smithy A, draw Smithy B
Village+Smithy B, draw Smithy A

All other cases are equal to before. I'm not convinced that the village would be helping loads if you have just two smithies in an untrimmed deck.

Quote
While the end result is correct, the reasoning clearly isn't.

Note that there is entirely no reason why your buy has to optimize your current deck. One of the key advances to a better player, I assume, is to consider both things: how a buy affect your deck immediately and how it will be a role in the deck you are building up to.

Or for an example, strictly following this logic opening chapel won't do any good. The starting deck only gets worse, in terms of buying power, with that extra chapel.
Maybe not, but you usually want some pretty near-term benefits to buying a card, and the longer you have to wait, the better the reward ought to be. Chapel makes your deck much better very soon after you buy it. Villages in a deck with smithies do no such thing; you will need some kind of huge reward from a third card (goons for example) in order for it to be worth it.  Is monument a good enough reward? Probably not.

45
Dominion General Discussion / Village/Smithy: A thought experiment
« on: July 18, 2011, 02:12:23 am »
Village + Smithy is one of the first combos many beginning Dominion players see, especially since it's present on the recommended first set of 10. It also happens to be pretty terrible of a combo.

I had this thought experiment back when I was playing on BSW, and it made me realize why my old foolish days of playing village/smithy were horribly misguided. Here it is:

Say that the only cards available are the basics, village, and smithy.

- I am buying my first actions card. Will I take a Village or Smithy? Well, the village doesn't do anything (it replaces itself), so I should get a Smithy, because it actually helps my deck.
- I am thinking about a second action card. If I get a second smithy they might collide and make me a sad panda. What about a village? Wait, taking this village makes my deck worse! I might draw the village in my hand, in which case it replaces itself, but I don't have two other actions so it won't do any good. If I draw the village with the smithy, it's dead! That could have been a silver or something. That would have been way better.
- I guess I should get a second smithy then.
- A village now? If I get my dream hand of village, smithy, smithy, I can draw a lot of cards! Wouldn't that feel nice. On the other hand, I might draw my village with my smithy, same problem as above. Yech. What are the chances I get all of my action cards together like that anyway? A silver is probably more helpful to me...
- A third smithy? That's just asking for mega terminal collision at this point.
- Maybe I should just get a lot of villages, to make sure I draw one with dual smithies. Man, I feel like a village idiot doing this. Meanwhile, my opponents are starting to take provinces, while my deck isn't really improving in a meaningful way -- the two smithies aren't really glued together or anything, I'll spend turns playing village-village-village-smithy, not knowing where my second smithy is.
- You know what? Villages aren't helpful in this setup. I'll just get silvers instead.
- My smithies draw silvers, and I am happy buying provinces while my opponent complains that he drew his villages and smithies in the wrong order.

+cards/+actions can make some pretty scary engines, but they had better have more going for them than village/smithy or you'll be too slow to grab the green cards before they're gone.

46
Dominion FAQ / Re: Dominion Lingo Dictionary
« on: July 16, 2011, 10:31:40 pm »
Actually, thinking about the "hard counter" vs "soft counter" some more ...

I don't think moat could be considered a hard counter a lot of the times. When I think "X hard counters Y" I tend to think "The presence of X makes me not want to buy Y at all". In this sense, there are very few hard counters in dominion, but they exist (bishop vs gardens comes to mind). Moat doesn't hard counter Witch in this sense because no matter how many moats you get, I'm still going to get Witch (either the curses screw you or too many moats does). Moat vs militia is even worse; you stop the militia attack but you give up a slot in your hand for a fairly weak action.

Warning: half-formed thought ahead

Maybe the definition of "counter" can be determined objectively by looking at "win rate with" and "win rate with given other card's existence". So maybe (making numbers up) Minion has a win rate of 1.1 overall but Minion has a win rate of 0.95 given that Horse Traders is a kingdom card. You could define cutoff points in the difference in win rates to define "hard" and "soft" counter. You'd probably want to filter over games involving people over a certain level as well. Oh boy...

47
Follow-up: I couldn't run a proper simulation, but I did try out a comparison of Chapel vs. Remake-trash-coppers with perfect shuffle luck. Best case scenario, the Remake strategy is in far better shape than I assumed against the Chapel strategy.

By the end of turn 6, Chapel had a deck of Chapel and 3 Silvers. By comparison, Remake had a deck of 3 Copper, 3 Estates, but 2 Silvers and a Gold. So, Remake has better buying power at the moment, and also can scale up faster because the Estates are still around to convert to Silver.

Play details, if anyone is curious:
TurnChapelRemake
1Buy ChapelBuy Remake
2Buy SilverBuy Silver
3Trash Estate x 3 & Copper x 1Remake Copper x 2
4Buy SilverBuy Silver
5Trash Copper x 4Remake Copper x 2
6Trash Copper x 2;Buy Gold
Buy Silver

Even if the Chapel player decides not to trash the Copper on turn 6 in order to buy a Gold, the Remake strategy can still scale up faster because the remaining Estates are Silvers-in-waiting for Remake.

I'm not too surprised; chapel+big money is actually not that strong. In your above example, remake currently has more buying power, but if there is any strong action combo on the board the chapel deck is going to be able to hit it first, due to having vastly fewer cards.

48
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Combo? Contraband/Expand
« on: July 15, 2011, 08:17:28 pm »
I think it works better with contraband/forge. Contraband will allow you to get a very early gold or very early forge, both of which are quite powerful. Then you can later forge the contraband into something useful. Getting an early expand is not as good, imo. It only trashes a single card and doesn't do much with copper. Yes you can turn estates into 5s, but if there are any really good 5s, you probably should just buy one of those 5s instead of contraband in the first place.

I think the main point is you can expand a contraband into a province, when normally a contraband is a major liability when you are going green.

49
Dominion FAQ / Re: Dominion Lingo Dictionary
« on: July 15, 2011, 04:03:00 pm »
What about "soft counter"? A possible definition would be: a card whose function allows a player to recover or minimize the impact from a type of attack, although the card is not technically a reaction card. Examples include Library against handsize reduction attacks or Masquerade against a Sea Hag.

Library vs. Militia I would consider a hard counter, since their Militia actually helps you (most of the time, having a library is better than having a Moat vs Militia). A soft counter would be more like Wishing Well vs. Ghost ship. You are still somewhat hurt by Ghost Ship because you will have only 4 cards in hand after using your Wishing Well to get the two cards you put on top back into your hand, but having a Wishing Well takes a lot of the bite out of the Ghost Ship attack.

50
Dominion General Discussion / Re: I have a problem
« on: July 15, 2011, 03:52:31 pm »
There's no leaderboard IRL so do whatever is fun for you.

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