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1

Mini-Set Design Contest / Re: Another one of these

« on: August 26, 2013, 01:51:50 pm »

Excited about the Treasure Chest content. I think it's a great idea and I'm looking forward to seeing what people come up with.

I'm of both camps in terms of simple vs. innovative card designs. In a perfect world, a card is both: a simple idea that adds something new to the game. The challenge is that a lot of simple cards aren't innovative, and a lot of innovative cards don't add enough to the game to be worth the complexity of playing them.

I expect this community to come up with the best of both worlds for this contest.

Any more guidelines on number of entries, timeline for voting, etc.?

2

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Simple card types and mechanics which didn't do it

« on: August 15, 2013, 04:04:25 pm »

I really like the $2 Attack card idea--I think it would interesting for one or more to exist, just for the variety.

I think you could make certain mechanics work, though they'd probably need to be balanced by adding one of two base benefits (+1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Buy, +$1).

A couple of ideas that might work:

Idea 1: "Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand draws a card then discards 2 cards."

Less damage to your opponent than Urchin, since they get to draw a card before discard, and it doesn't necessarily drop them down to four cards (if you'd played Governor, Council Room, etc.). Cycle has some chance of helping them... Not sure what base buffs to give this version.

Idea 2: +1 Card, +1 Action. Each other player with 4 or more cards in hand draws a card then discards down to 4 cards.

I like this version. It's similar to Urchin, but can't bloom into a mercenary. And spamming it isn't helpful because subsequent plays actually help your opponents. So it's a $2 cantrip Attack that's only effective in low doses. Everyone will likely buy 1, few people would buy more than two unless they were trying to use it as part of a three-pile strategy.

Idea 3: "Each other player gains a Copper, putting it into his hand."

With the right balance of buffs, this might work. Maybe +1 Card, +1 Buy or +1 Card, +$1. You don't want to make it easy to spam.

To prevent spamming, maybe you could have it be: "+2 Cards | If this is the first time you've played $2-Attack this turn, each other player gains a Copper, putting it into his hand."

Or, you could have it be: "+2 Cards | Each player with 5 or less cards gains a Copper, putting it into his hand."

I think this last version is the most interesting, because of how it could synergize with hand-size attacks if you have the extra actions... If you can reduce the person's hand size then hit them with a few of these, to add multiple Coppers to their hands at once.

No matter how you run it, adding a copper per turn to opponent's hands is effective, but because it's in hand, it helps them with early buys, so it's a balancing act, particularly if good trashing is on the board. This is definitely less powerful than something like Ambassador. Some versions of this card would actually be most effective mid/late game when you are trying to dilute a player's deck.

3

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Vassal & Aristocracy

« on: August 13, 2013, 10:55:46 am »

If Vassal were changed so that it gained VP tokens equal to the VP points of the Victory card, it would be more balanced; I'd probably give it 1VP of it's own so that it could trash copies of itself for benefit if you wanted it to... suggested nerf:

Vassal
$4 Action/Victory
1VP.
You may trash a VP card from your hand. If you do gain VP tokens
equal to the VP value of the card.

This would be most similar to Island, in that you are removing Victory cards from your deck to prevent clogging without losing any VPs. However, in many instances, even this version would be more powerful than Island, since one copy of Vassal could keep being reused... upping the cost to $4, eliminating the overpay and reducing the benefit, and I think you'll have a working card... but a card that may not be different enough from Island to be worth it.

4

Dominion General Discussion / Re: A Kingdom for Beginners

« on: August 13, 2013, 10:35:28 am »

The second game, the presence of beggar, and the fact that 3 of the 4 players were playing it a lot, led to a non-kingdom treasure pile running out for the first time in a game I have played.

I had that happen in one of the first half-dozen games I played, but Trader was the culprit. That realization that "what? WHAT? Everything can turn into SILVERS? One silver can turn into THREE silvers? None of us knew what we were doing, and were trashing silvers for silvers, traders for silvers, everything else for silvers... Silvers were the first pile to go. Was pretty funny in retrospect.

Upside was that we all had plenty of money to start greening. If I remember correctly, that game was actually won by the friend who picked up a couple of Harems that gave him the edge when the provinces split.

5

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Some of the best/interesting Kingdoms you can think of!

« on: August 12, 2013, 11:14:08 am »

My wife and I played this kingdom last night, and it was one of the more interesting/complex games we have played:

(5) Inn, Royal Seal
(4) Island, Remodel, Sea Hag
(3) Ambassador, Oasis, Watchtower
(2) Native Village, Fool's Gold

She opened Remodel/Ambassador and I opened Ambassador/Sea Hag. Interplay of cards, and the ability to stack decks when buying Inn made for some crazy turns, especially with Watchtower around. One of the more fun boards I've ever played.

We've got it reset for tonight with a couple of changes--trading out Sea Hag for Salvager and Royal Seal for Spy. Will be a radically different game; curious to see how it plays out.

Enjoy.

6

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Most undervalued Kingdom cards according to councilroom.com stats.

« on: July 31, 2013, 04:50:05 pm »

My takeaway: Consider buying Venture instead of usually ignoring it.

7

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Showdown

« on: July 31, 2013, 04:43:32 pm »

I'd note that you don't really need all the expansions to make Dominion a great game. One expansion is really enough to have a lot of variety, two is ample for a fun game. The fact you have a huge choice of expansions beyond that if you want to go deeper is a pure positive.

I'd agree strongly... We started with the Big Box (base/alchemy/prosperity) and that was really more than we needed. We've since been gifted Seaside and Dark Ages, but neither is really necessary... I've borrowed other sets so I've got familiarity with most of the cards.

I'd guess that for most regular gamers, 3 sets (Base/Prosperity/other big set) would keep them happy virtually forever, and would provide enough possible game variants to keep Dominion a mainstay for years... of course, since there are more sets, we're all going to want them, but that doesn't mean they are a necessary add to ensure fun and strategic gaming.

I include Prosperity with base as the two most "necessary" sets because I feel like the option of Plat/Col add some of the greatest strategic variance to the boards... The same kingdom w and w/o Plat/Col can play radically differently and require totally different strategies... also, I've found a lot of more casual gamers appreciate the slightly slower pace of Plat/Col games. On their own, I think base/Prosp need something else to shake up the overall set of available kingdom cards, but whether that is Seaside/Hinterlands/Dark Ages doesn't really matter in terms of long term enjoyment and replayability.

8

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas

« on: July 29, 2013, 10:07:50 am »

Was thinking about how Harem makes no thematic sense. One of the weirdest names in the game. This is probably an equally offensive card, but at least it maintains a consistent theme:

Brothel ($2)
+3 Actions
When you buy this, trash all your treasures.

Low entry fee, lots of action, but you end up penniless.

9

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Lucky Town and Jackpot (both benefit from 3 of a kind)

« on: July 26, 2013, 11:27:18 am »

Buffed versions. All cards now have +1 Card as their only guaranteed effect, which enhances the theme, providing a "lottery" element in whether or not you will draw the card you need to get 3-of-a-kind in hand.

All cards also gain +1 Action when they activate, meaning that if you win the lottery, you get to keep playing.

However, because there are only two of each kind of card, I think the variance will keep them from being too strong, because you can't build a reliable hand solely around their effects -- you will still need a primary strategy to drive your game; this are only meant to be support cards. That, somewhat like Wishing Well, add an element of cheap fun to the games they are in.

More interesting or too strong? I still think it will be hard to chain them together, but definitely easier than it would have been in the original version. And, most importantly, do you think these versions would be fun to play...? (For the record, I play mostly IRL casual games with friends.)


LOTTERY. Two of each card, all shuffled into one kingdom pile.

Jackpot ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Card
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard or trash one of the matching cards and +1 Action, +$3.

Lucky Town ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Card
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard or trash one of the matching cards and +1 Card, +2 Actions.

Raffle Ticket ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Card
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard or trash one of the matching cards and +1 Action and gain a card costing up to $5.

Lucky Draw ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Card
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard or trash one of the matching cards and +1 Action, +2 Cards.

Pawn Shop ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Card
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), +1 Action and you may trash one of the matching cards and gain a card costing up to $3 more than the trashed card.

10

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Lucky Town and Jackpot (both benefit from 3 of a kind)

« on: July 26, 2013, 11:11:39 am »

jackpot is in the early game worse than coppersmith
and coppersmith is allready a weak card on most boards.

But Coppersmith costs $4.

Agreed. Coppersmith vs Jackpot... with either card in a hand with CCCE, Coppersmith gives you a total buy of $6 that turn, and so does Jackpot (+$1, discard a copper, +$3 more). In a hand with CCEE, Coppersmith would give you $4 and Jackpot would give you $3. In a hand with CCCC, Coppersmith would give you $8 and Jackpot would give you $7.

But at $4, Coppersmith is competing with a lot of strong cards, not to mention Silver. Jackpot (or other lottery cards) aren't competing with the same cards.

Functionally, it's easy to admit that all of these Lottery cards pair best with Copper, since that's the card you're likely to have the most duplicates of in the early game; but they don't have to pair with Copper, which makes them more versatile than something like Coppersmith in a wider variety of hands. Once you start trashing Coppers, Coppersmith is worthless. But Lottery cards are still worth something, and might be worth a lot, depending.

It may require rebalancing their activation effects -- the trick is that I don't want them to be a single card strategy. As they are now, they can't be a single card strategy, because if you drew a hand of five Lottery cards, you could only activate the first one.

Maybe if they helped provide card cycling to increase activation odds... add +1 draw to the top of every Lottery card, so you always started with a hand of 5 cards...

11

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Lucky Town and Jackpot (both benefit from 3 of a kind)

« on: July 26, 2013, 10:57:45 am »

What if the bottom of all of these cards were adapted to allow trashing...

i.e., "Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard or trashone of the matching cards and +X."

This would be a minor buff, but maybe enough to make it interesting, since choosing the trash option would reduce your odds of drawing 3 of the same card, but it would allow some early Copper trashing.

I honestly think these have the most potential to be interesting later in the game when you have an engine that's drawing a bunch of cards... or as support cards for a more unusual strategy involving something like Alchemy or Counting House, where you could have hands that would have a bunch of matching cards, enabling activation of several Lottery cards.

(I love Counting House, and am always looking for situations in which it becomes a viable strategy.)
 

12

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Lucky Town and Jackpot (both benefit from 3 of a kind)

« on: July 24, 2013, 12:15:26 pm »

Had another idea about how to make this work. Knights style, with more variations. I think this version is more interesting, and expands upon the luck theme... However, I still think these would be a skill card to play well, since they risk being Ruins throughout the midgame. But the odds of buying a bunch of them and hoping they hit together is also a possibility... still would need some other +draw to bring enough into hand to make them viable, and even so, they don't generate enough coins to make them function well standalone.

LOTTERY. Two of each card, all shuffled into one kingdom pile.

Jackpot ($2)
Action-Lottery
+$1
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard one of the matching cards and +$3.

Lucky Town ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Action
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard one of the matching cards and +2 Cards, +1 Action.

Raffle Ticket ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Buy
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard one of the matching cards and gain a card costing up to $5.

Lucky Draw ($2)
Action-Lottery
+1 Card
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), discard one of the matching cards and +2 Cards, +1 Action.

Pawn Shop ($2)
Action-Lottery
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand (or three Lottery cards), look through your discard pile; you may trash a card and gain a card costing up to $2 more than the trashed card.

13

Help! / Re: This type of kingdom stumps me...

« on: July 24, 2013, 11:49:59 am »

ashersky --
I'm with you, I haven't been playing Dominion long enough to intuitively know how to play a board like this -- the Tactician, in particular, would have confused me. But what DG and shark_bait suggest makes sense. It just hard to remember that even "power cards" are only powerful in the right kingdom.

14

Variants and Fan Cards / "Best of" or "Hall of Fame" for fan cards?

« on: July 24, 2013, 11:34:43 am »

So there are ~800 different threads in the Variants and Fan Cards subforum, and I know a lot of those have multiple cards, and most of those threads have several suggested variations of each fan card. So I'm guessing there are several thousand fan cards that have been proposed and discussed in these forums.

So the question is: is there any way to create a sticky "Best of" or "Hall of Fame" for those cards that rise above the rest. I know there have been periodic fan card design contests and whatnot, but it's difficult to sort through all these threads to find those "bests."

It seems like it would be helpful to have one thread people could go to who are interested in seeing all the top designs.

Thoughts? Is there any way to make this work?

15

Variants and Fan Cards / Lucky Town and Jackpot (both benefit from 3 of a kind)

« on: July 24, 2013, 11:27:42 am »

So I was thinking about anti-Cornucopia cards and settled on the idea that 3-of-a-kind is a win in lots of games of chance: poker, the lottery, slot machines, etc... So here are a couple of cheap cards that want you to have matching cards in hand:

Lucky Town ($2)
Action
+1 Card
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand, discard one of the matching cards and +1 Card, +2 Actions.

Jackpot ($2)
Action
+$1
Reveal your hand. If you have three cards with the same name in your hand, discard one of the matching cards and +$3.

Early on, it seems like these have a high chance of being drawn in a hand with 3 Coppers and giving a slight boost to your early economy. After that, it seems like they clutter up your hand midgame, usually functioning as Ruins, but then, if you can get an engine going, they can become very powerful towards the end of the game.

I am a fan of inexpensive cards that have interesting effects -- I'm also a fan of cards whose power fluctuates up and down throughout a game, making it tricky to know when and how many to add them to your hand.

Thoughts?

16

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Scavenger - fan card

« on: July 24, 2013, 11:02:26 am »

Scott and Asper -- I like what you all are thinking. There is some sort of interesting mechanic that could gain unpopular cards. But I also agree with Warfreak that it would be way to swingy and hyper powerful in some games, especially with first player advantage.

What if we combined the two ideas -- a stack of 10 cards, five each of Scavengers (needs a new name,  let's call it "Scrounger" for now) and 5 each of a gainer for unpopular cards... setup: Scroungers on top, unpopular gainers (let's call them "Freeloaders") on the bottom.

That would keep the Freeloaders from grabbing strong cards too early, and would force people to pick up Scroungers early if they wanted to rush to the Freeloaders.

Alternatively, you could set this up with a Hermit/Madman dynamic -- I think that idea is worth teasing out.

Also, I'm thinking that some of the comments here are spot on that these cards would mostly be pure cantrips, cluttering the deck and wiping out a pile early. My thought is to make them stronger on first play, but non-cantrip on subsequent plays to reduce the ability to spam them. This way, too many will slow down a deck, but the on-first-play +Buy makes it easier to pick up more of them -- also means they still have value late in the game for the +Buy. This means every player will want at least one, even if they don't want two.

So here's what it might look like:

Scrounger ($2)
Action
+1 Card
If this is the first time you played a Scrounger this turn, +1 Action, +1 Buy.
If any kingdom piles have two or less cards remaining, you may gain a card from one of these piles, your choice.

Freeloader ($2)
Action
+1 Card
If this is the first time you played a Freeloader this turn, +1 Action, +1 Buy.
In any kingdom piles have 9 or more cards remaining, you may gain a card from one of these piles, your choice.

Setup rule (not written on the card for space reasons): Scrounger and Freeloader are always in play together -- 5 Scroungers on top, 5 Freeloaders on the bottom.

Realistically, I don't think counting the cards is that much of an issue IRL -- it's easy to tell which piles have two remaining, and it's probably easy to know which piles have 9+ cards remaining, since people usually have a pretty good idea whether or not they have purchased anything from a pile. At most, I'd guess there would be one or two stacks on a table that people were unsure of, and counting to 10 in a couple of piles is still much faster than mechanics like Philosopher's Stone... Regardless, that's far easier than putting tokens on piles and then removing them.

Also, I like the the 9+ rule -- it means that in games with 2 people, you'd never be able to use a Freeloader to grab a kingdom Victory card, but in games with 3+ people, if no one were going for the Alt-VP, you could grab up to 4 as freebies...

Thoughts? I really appreciate all the ideas -- I think it's becoming a more interesting and stronger card, and one that I think would require high strategy -- and a lot of attention to how your opponent is playing -- to play well.

17

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Discard/Trash for benefit

« on: July 23, 2013, 11:22:42 am »

EDIT: Alternatively, I could stipulate that the gained card cannot be a Victory card. Any opinions about that?

Eliminating the Victory card is probably enough of a nerf to make it work, but it would still probably be a very strong opening card in most kingdoms, especially kingdoms with limited trashing, since it allows you to make every card in your hand useful as fuel for the TFB process. And when Redistricts collide you always have the option of trashing one into a Gold -- or into Goon or Grand Market. The speed at which this could start grabbing GMs is pretty frightening.

In Colony/Platinum games, this would be really powerful because of how quickly you could get to Platinums.

At least if you restrict it from gaining Victory cards, it's just powerful, but it can't be a one card strategy -- it would just accelerate some other potential strategies.

That said, I like it as a card idea.

18

Variants and Fan Cards / Scavenger - fan card

« on: July 22, 2013, 03:16:10 pm »

Scavenger ($2)
Action
+1 Action
+1 Card
If any kingdom piles have two or less cards remaining, you may gain a card from one of these piles, your choice. If you gain a card this way, return this Scavenger to the Supply.


Would this (or a variation) work? Would it be interesting?

I feel like it's presence could change the pace of midgame strategies, because it might discourage players from grabbing a lot of the same card for fear of allowing their opponent a cheap pickup of some expensive cards... at the same time, if you have a way of gaining cards during your action phase, you might be able to use a couple of these to snap up the last 3-4 cards in a pile in one fell swoop, using these to change the balance of the game.

Obviously, it would be most dangerous / potentially game-changing in kingdoms with $6 cards you want multiples of (Grand Market, Harem, Goons)... Since this is a cheap cantrip, I have the card returning itself to the Supply to make it harder to use this card to three pile the game.

Thoughts on the card? On the concept?

19

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Excavation -- quick description: Native Island meets Ruins

« on: July 22, 2013, 01:09:14 pm »

Thanks for all the suggestions.

I think the wording that requires shuffling the Ruins pile at the end of a turn when Excavation is played is mandatory for speed of play reasons -- if people were allowed to stack the order of returning Ruins to the Supply pile, it could potentially significantly slow down the game.

I think you all may be right that it is underpowered as-is at it's current cost; based on great feedback, there are several ways to buff it that I think could work:

OPTION 1: Adding +1 Buy (makes it useful in most games as a cheap, non-terminal +buy, no matter how slow it is to build up to a megaturn). This option keeps the cost cheap, which I like. I have a soft spot for $2 non-terminals, and probably overbuy them.

Excavation ($2)
Action-Looter
+1 Action
+1 Buy
Choose one: Gain a Ruins into your hand and place any number of Ruins from your hand face up on your Excavation mat; or play all the Ruins from your Excavation mat in any order. During discard, any Ruins played by Excavation are shuffled back into the Supply.

OPTION 2: Raising the cost and making it a cantrip:

Excavation ($4)
Action-Looter
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: Gain a Ruins into your hand and place any number of Ruins from your hand face up on your Excavation mat; or play all the Ruins from your Excavation mat in any order. During discard, any Ruins played by Excavation are shuffled back into the Supply.

OPTION 3: Increasing the cost to $3 and making it draw twice as many Ruins; for this, I think Setup would need more Ruins in the pile:

Excavation ($3)
Action-Looter
+1 Action
Choose one: Gain two Ruins into your hand and place any number of Ruins from your hand face up on your Excavation mat; or play all the Ruins from your Excavation mat in any order. During discard, any Ruins played by Excavation are shuffled back into the Supply.
-----
Setup: Add 10 extra cards to the Ruins pile.

OPTION 4: Allowing it to both gain and play Ruins on the same turn, making it more versatile:

Excavation ($2)
Action-Looter
+1 Action
Gain a Ruins into your hand. Place any number of Ruins from your hand face up on your Excavation mat. You may play all the Ruins from your Excavation mat in any order. During discard, any Ruins played by Excavation are shuffled back into the Supply.


Any thoughts on which version works the best? Personally, I really like Option 4; it's very close to the original, but adds more choice and more potential strategy in terms of how the card is played. It will require playtesting to see if it's powered/priced correctly, but I like the potential.

20

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Fan card: Boost

« on: July 22, 2013, 01:08:14 pm »

Oh, and I realize that, for better or worse, that third version would be one of the best Gardens enablers in the game, and would actually be HELPED by cursers, since it would clear curses and would three-pile faster. But I don't think that's a breaking point (it's still slower than something like Beggar/Gardens). The number of games that Boost3/Gardens appear should be minimal, and at that point, a mirror strategy would inevitably play out, giving the game it's own sort of challenge.

But here's the simplest way it plays out:

Open with $3, buy a Boost.
Turn 2 has $4 and a Boost; play the Boost to gain two Coppers and trash an Estate for a total of $6 and two buys; buy two Boosts.
Turn 3 probably has $4 and two Boosts; play both Boosts to gain four coppers and trash two cards for a total of at least $6 and two buys; buy two Boosts.
repeat.

Assuming your opponent isn't mirroring and you did nothing but buy and play Boosts, you should be able to clear out the Boosts no later than turn 5 and should finish turn 5 with 30 cards in your deck. Subsequent turns, every hand should have at least one Boost. Play the Boost to gain a copper and buy a Gardens. At the end of turn 13, you'd have 46 cards and all the Gardens. At that point, pile out whatever your opponent has purchased the most of, gaining Copper + X every turn until the game three piles. Worst case, pile out the Estates, so at the end of turn 21, you'd clear the Estates and have 62 cards in your deck, giving you 56-59 points, depending on how many Estates you trashed for Coppers in the early game.

Again, powerful combo, but I don't think a card-breaker because of the precedent of several other cards that have similarly powerful combos with Gardens.

21

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Fan card: Boost

« on: July 22, 2013, 12:37:10 pm »

Thanks for the feedback. I agree with most of the comments -- it is similar to Nomad Camp and Baker, but I think it's enough different from both to warrant trying out. Yes, in theory, Nomad Camp is the closest card, but Nomad Camp doesn't address the possible power deficit in a 3/4 vs 5/2 opening with a power $5 on the board.

Baker does address the opening split it a really interesting way. I think, in spirit, Boost is closer to Baker, but without the Coin token dynamic. Boost wants to give a choice that helps even out game opening, while also allowing for some fun potential mega-turns later in the game.

I've toyed with the idea of adding a single use +1 Buy to Boost, to accompany the +1 Action, to make it more interesting later in the game, but was afraid that would make the card too powerful for a $3, and I want to keep it a $3.

Boost ($3)
Action
+$2
-------
When you gain this, set it aside; at the start of your next turn, +1 Action, +1 Buy and put this card into your hand.

Or what if I nerf it this way:

Boost ($3)
Action
Gain a copper card; put it into your hand.
-------
When you gain this, set it aside; at the start of your next turn, +1 Action, +1 Buy, +$1 and put this card into your hand.

This way, it still makes a $5 turn guaranteed within the first shuffle, but becomes a much more interesting late-game card to set up big plays. Late game, the turn before reshuffle, buy one of these to kickstart a series of hopefully great turns -- buy these without the intent of ever playing them.

Or, a third option, with slow trashing.

Boost ($3)
Action
Gain two copper cards; put them into your hand. Trash a card from your hand.
-------
When you gain this, set it aside; at the start of your next turn, +1 Action, +1 Buy and put this card into your hand.

I really like this third option--it's potentially strong as an opening because it allows the crucial $5 purchase, and the trashing does make it possible to clear Estates out of your hand, but because the trashing doesn't actually make your deck smaller -- it just turns dead cards into coppers -- the trashing doesn't overpower the card. Especially because with any TFB cards in the kingdom, trashing Estates for Coppers actually makes those TFB cards less useful, so you would be unlikely to use that functionality.

Mid-game, it's helpful to turn Curses/Ruins/Estates (if no TFB) into Coppers in-hand, helping reduce dead-turns, but at the expense of adding Coppers to your deck. Though this does help guarantee more $5 turns early, helping build a powerful deck.

Late-game, it can be purchased for it's on-gain effects to set up some big turns.

Thoughts (on any of the versions)?

22

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas

« on: July 19, 2013, 12:45:33 pm »

Vengeful Mob ($6)
Victory-Attack
-2 Victory Points
At the end of the game, all losing players grab a handful of Tokens/Coins and hurl them at the winner. Repeat once for each Vengeful Mob in your deck.
-------
Setup: All available Tokens, Coins and spare change are in a pile on the table.

23

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Victory cost reduction

« on: July 19, 2013, 11:59:52 am »

I think I like this card... but I suspect it would be too powerful at $4 because it's non-terminal and has such powerfulcumulative effects -- in many games, this would be more powerful than Bridge.

The reason being that since the point of the game is Victory cards, this allows all sorts of tricks like the one you mentioned. With two Chamberlains in play, you'd suddenly be able to use Rogue and Knights to trash your opponents' Provinces or Swindler to turn Provinces into Golds. And Rogue or Graverobber to pull those Provinces back out of the trash and into your deck. Yes, you can pull some of those tricks with Bridge, but it's much harder to do so since it's non-terminal, and the Swindler trick wouldn't work at all, since Bridge reduces the cost of ALL cards.

Same with all the TFB cards... a couple of Chamberlains, and all of a sudden Forge, Remodel, Expand, etc... have a much easier time churning out Provinces...

Still, I like the card -- I like those kinds of tricks -- but it would need playtesting to determine cost to see at what cost it is balanced.

24

Variants and Fan Cards / Excavation -- quick description: Native Island meets Ruins

« on: July 19, 2013, 11:45:49 am »

Excavation ($2)
Action-Looter
+1 Action
Choose one: Gain a Ruins into your hand and place any number of Ruins from your hand face up on your Excavation mat; or play all the Ruins from your Excavation mat in any order. During discard, any Ruins played by Excavation are shuffled back into the Supply.


I'm still trying to find other ways to play Ruins and make them useful. This is the best idea I've come up with. Seems to me like it would work well and make for some interesting turns and mid/end-game strategies.

I think this also synergizes nicely with the other three looters (Death Cart, Marauder and Cultist); it still hurts opponents to give them Ruins as it slows down their decks and effectively reduces their hand size, but this gives a way to make those Ruins useful. It also makes it less likely to run out of Ruins, so those Attack-Looter cards keep being effective instead of running out of Ruins.

Also has some fun synergies with things like City... you could empty the Ruins pile with Excavations, play all of your upgraded Cities, then play all the cards from your Excavation mat to refill the Ruins supply so that your opponent's Cities didn't get the upgrade.

What I'm not sure about is how powerful this card could potentially be in a 3 or 4 player game. I don't think it would break the game because there are still a finite number of Excavations they take up hand space, and there are a finite number of Ruins, and the fact that you have to play them all at once means that while they can facilitate a mega-turn, it takes a while to build up the mega turn and it's an all-or-nothing use if you go that route.

I suspect, Excavation will be most effective to help give a slight boost to mid and late game turns, perhaps playing out the Excavation board every time you get 3+ cards on it.

This may be my favorite fan card idea I've come up with so far. Really am curious to see how it would work and if it would actually be effective.

Thoughts?

25

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Fan card: Boost

« on: July 19, 2013, 11:20:49 am »

It's an interesting card, seems like there shouldn't be a problem with it. I like the possibility of using the +1 Action on something else instead, it could be a boost to an engine too! Not sure about the name, though. Jeweller, perhaps?

It becomes a junk card in many decks; could be great with Procession.

You're right -- name is weak and needs to be revisited. Was going for form over function.

At this point, I'm working on getting together enough interesting fan cards that work together to try to complete a fan expansion (small set), at which point I'll probably give everything new titles to help fit a theme.

Thanks, as always, for your feedback.