Dominion Strategy Forum

Archive => Archive => Innovation Rules Questions => Topic started by: tyr10n on July 23, 2013, 05:08:09 pm

Title: Free foreshadow action with "If would meld .. instead"?
Post by: tyr10n on July 23, 2013, 05:08:09 pm

An issue came up in a this thread about bugs in isotropic: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=8949.0 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=8949.0). I'm posting it here because it applies to the game in general. The foreshadow rule states:

If you take a Meld action (but not when an effect instructs you to meld a card!) you may afterward meld a card from your Forecast that is of equal or lower value than the melded card. You may then take a free Dogma action (not counting as one of your two per turn) choosing the card you melded from your Forecast.

So how does the free Dogma action interact with figures which state "If would meld ... instead". For example, Imhotep says: "If you would meld a card over an unsplayed color with more than one card, instead splay that color left and return the card." So when attempting to meld a card out of forshadow, do you still get to take the free Dogma action even if it wasn't melded? I can think of reasons for both interpretations:

• Yes. You still execute Dogmas on a card even if they are removed by an echo effect. This is similar. The fact that the the card wasn't melded doesn't prevent you from getting your action.
  
• No. The FAQ states that "instead" karmas prevent "If you do" dogma effects. The card was never melded so you can't get a free action from the "melded" card.
  

I lean towards "No" because it's not clear how/if you resolve echo effects.

Title: Re: Free foreshadow action with "If would meld .. instead"?
Post by: popsofctown on July 23, 2013, 09:20:31 pm

Is that wording from the Figures in the Sands rulebook?  The echoes rulebook seemed different.

Title: Re: Free foreshadow action with "If would meld .. instead"?
Post by: cchudyk on July 24, 2013, 07:05:08 am

From Echoes:

"After you take a Meld action, you may meld one card from your Forecast of equal or lower value to the card you melded.  If you do, you may immediately take a free Dogma action with that card.  This only occurs after a Meld action, not if you meld a card due to a dogma effect."

When playing with Echoes and Figures, if you choose to take this free action after your Meld action, and a Figure's 'instead' karma prevents the meld-from-forecast from occurring, "If you do" is false, and the free Dogma action is also prevented.

Title: Re: Free foreshadow action with "If would meld .. instead"?
Post by: tyr10n on July 24, 2013, 12:44:55 pm

Great, that makes sense. Though it's not necessary to be playing with Echoes for this situation to arise, since there are foreshadow effects in Figures. (That's why I looked in the Figures rulebook for the wording on foreshadow.)

Title: Re: Free foreshadow action with "If would meld .. instead"?
Post by: popsofctown on July 24, 2013, 07:30:45 pm

I really was looking for an if "you do" when i read the rules, I guess i missed it.  That's how it is, then.

Welcome to the forums, carl.  Not entering with much fanfare it seems.