Dominion Strategy Forum
Dominion => Dominion General Discussion => Topic started by: brokoli on May 24, 2013, 06:17:20 am
-
Remake is an interesting card, but often used as a trasher, more than its upgrade effect.
When do you use remake for other things than coppers and estates ?
I can only think of IGG / Cultist / Border village...
-
well for fortresses but i think this is allredy well known as combo.
also to gain grand markets
-
Mid-game, you can turn those cheaper engine parts into better ones. A typical example: a hand of Remake-Village-Silver-Copper-Estate. You could “go fish” with the Village, but it’s probably better to Remake your Estate into a Village, your Village into that Smithy you always wanted, and buy another Village with the remaining in your hand. We removed an Estate from our deck, replaced it with a Smithy, and added a Village as well. That’s even better than just buying a Smithy and a Village in one turn, because we’ve also removed the dead card (the Estate) from our deck.
How often do you do this kind of things ?
-
In a Familiar game, when you've trashed Curses, you can trash a Potion that has outlived its usefulness for something like Market.
-
Remaking Remakes into $5 cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or
Scouts $4-villages. And random $4 cards into Duchies in the end-game.
-
Remaking Remakes into $5 cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts $4-villages. And random $4 cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first 4 Provinces.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent 5 turns buying Copper, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
-
Into cities, e.g.
Also remaking forges in really slim decks.
-
Remaking Remakes into $5 cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts $4-villages. And random $4 cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first 4 Provinces.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent 5 turns buying Copper, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
Oh that's just the epitome of evil.
-
Remaking Remakes into $5 cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts $4-villages. And random $4 cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first 4 Provinces.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent 5 turns buying Copper, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
Oh that's just the epitome of evil.
Well, to my defense I had never run into the possible pin before in ~3000 games or so so I wanted to try it out just to see what the fuss was all about. :)
-
I remake cards mid-game pretty frequently. Often, a $5 card is just better than the $4 you trashed.
-
I'm pretty sure I've done some sort of ironworks, worker's village, menagerie, remake, merchant ship, laboratory, mountebank sort of deck in the past.
-
I remake cards mid-game pretty frequently. Often, a $5 card is just better than the $4 you trashed.
That's definitely true, but you also have to consider the opportunity cost of not playing that $4 card this turn.
-
Remaking Remakes into $5 cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts $4-villages. And random $4 cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first 4 Provinces.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent 5 turns buying Copper, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
Oh that's just the epitome of evil.
Maybe it is too early in the morning, but I am not making the logical leap here - what were you going to do - Remake KC into Provinces? He already had 4; had you been able to steal/trash any of his already?
-
Remaking Remakes into cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts -villages. And random cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
Oh that's just the epitome of evil.
Maybe it is too early in the morning, but I am not making the logical leap here - what were you going to do - Remake KC into Provinces? He already had 4; had you been able to steal/trash any of his already?
Key words: "Once he had nothing left"
-
Remaking Remakes into cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts -villages. And random cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
Oh that's just the epitome of evil.
Maybe it is too early in the morning, but I am not making the logical leap here - what were you going to do - Remake KC into Provinces? He already had 4; had you been able to steal/trash any of his already?
Key words: "Once he had nothing left"
Ah, yes, that would do it. Somehow I latched on to "no handsize decreaser" and figured it was a partial pin, so didn't read carefully enough. Thanks for setting me straight.
-
After I realized that I have never actually tried KC-Masq, I get the opportunity in the very next game:
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130524/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1369413493273.txt
Without a hand-size decreaser, it was very hard to pull of, especially because my opponent countered it well by buying Death Carts and I felt the need to buy a Copper each turn out of fear that my opponent would play a Band of Misfitted Masq (which in hindsight I should only have started doing in case he indeed made me pass one or two of my KC's). Halfway I began to wonder "okay, this is going decent, but how the hell am I going to get some points!?" Then it occurred to me that I should try to get a BoM instead of Masq so that I could use it as a Workshop to 3-pile end the game on my last turn, which I was fortunately able to do.
I admire my opponent's patience and will gladly grant his post-game request to never play this against him again. Maybe there should be some sort of clause that prohibits KC and Masq appearing in the same kingdom? It really saps out the fun...
-
I wouldn't say that these are "unusual" uses for Remake. They are about as unusual as using Develop to gain cards instead of to trash cards.
lespeutere destroyed me once in a City/Watchtower/Remake game; that's all I remember.
-
I remember a game where I played remake to turn 2 Silvers into tournaments after buying a province or 2. It seemed like a sweet deal.
-
Very, very often I'll pitch a copper or something in order to gain a late game duchy with Remake.
Remake is also pretty good with strong on-trash benefits - Cultist becomes a Gold & draws 4 cards, Squire makes for a Silver and maybe a Goons, and Catacombs gives me a 4 and a gold, and Market Square still gives golds (which can be really fun with Rats, Oge, or Cultist - discard the Mrksqr on the first trash, draw the Mrksqr back if you have little/no discard, and then discard it on the second shot).
Remake is also very nice with Vineyards or Fairgrounds - late game being able to pull off a 2/3 action hand (e.g. remake two Silvers into Remakes and buy a Haven) is pretty big in with Vineyard mirrors, likewise swapping say a spare silver & gold into two unique cards and buying a 3rd is a pretty big boost if you are hitting Fairgrounds. Both bring up another thing I like about Remake - you can gain a lot of cards quickly and do things like pile out with no +buy with 3 four coin cards left in the third pile - this works really well with City decks.
A final fun shot is using limited draw (e.g. Minion, Menage, Lib) and villages to quickly boost hand value and clear out draw clogging cards. Somewhat related, Remake can be a really quick accelerator for a Tac deck - gain value without spending money ... even if the only +coin is at 5 or 6 it doesn't take too long to get up there and then to thin down the double-Tac deck.
-
Once, in a game IRL, I started out getting some money to get key engine components, like KC. Then, when I didn't need the money quite as much anymore, I played remake, turning silver into fortress and gold into KC. later, KC-remake with fortress in hand= 6 5-cost cards. That was pretty huge.
-
I love Remake-$7 setups--especially King's Court engines that suddenly trash all the KCs for Provinces at the end.
To date I've only managed it with Upgrade, although I once managed to end the game with a deck of 6 Province-1 KC-1 Upgrade. I was really proud of that one.
-
I love Remake-$7 setups--especially King's Court engines that suddenly trash all the KCs for Provinces at the end.
To date I've only managed it with Upgrade, although I once managed to end the game with a deck of 6 Province-1 KC-1 Upgrade. I was really proud of that one.
I did once by dumb luck draw a hand of something like KC-KC-Remake-Province-Province. And then I was like 'aw, man, of all the hands to draw KC-KC, with no target for them.' And then I was like 'wait a minute...!'
-
Hmm, I would probably just play 1 KC on autopilot, realize what was going on and be happy they weren't Throne Rooms.
-
Peddler to Platinum is always fun, though sometimes with a remake-streamlined deck the peddler is more useful than the platinum.
-
Remaking Remakes into $5 cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts $4-villages. And random $4 cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first 4 Provinces.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent 5 turns buying Copper, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
Sorry what was the remake for? For remaking KC into provinces? And wouldn't you have to pass him the coppers in your hand when you played masquerade?
-
Of course, with Remake and four Kings Courts, he can get the last four Provinces in the next two turns. He doesn't have to play the Masquerade, though probably he can get away with it because his opponent also only has Copper to pass back, and he doesn't have to trash.
I had a game today where my opponent went Catacombs/Tunnel while I went for Kings Court->Knights. He was getting so many Golds back from Tunnel/Gold hits that it took rather a long time to get his deck down to little more than the three Provinces he had; he probably could have piled out Estates and Tunnels before I bought the remaining five Provinces, but he resigned when I played Kings Court->Upgrade, trashing Kings Court, trashing Kings Court...
-
Remaking Remakes into $5 cards is also very common. Or Silvers into Conspirators or Scouts $4-villages. And random $4 cards into Duchies in the end-game.
I once played a game in which I tried the old Masquerade pin in a unique way.
The problem was, there was no handsize decreaser. My opponent completely ignored it and steadily built up to take the first 4 Provinces.
By that time I had my deck down to KC-KC-KC-KC-Masq and started chomping at his deck.
When he had nothing left I spent 5 turns buying Copper, Copper, Copper, Copper, Remake.
Once I had the Remake, my opponent resigned.
Sorry what was the remake for? For remaking KC into provinces? And wouldn't you have to pass him the coppers in your hand when you played masquerade?
He stops playing the Masq after buying the first Copper.
There's still something I don't get in the linked game: Leaving cards in the opponent's hand, the lock player has no insulation from his opponent's Masquerade. He can keep a Copper in the deck as defense (with 3 KCs and Masquerade), rebuying it every turn, but that means the opponent gets 3-card hands.
If I'm the opponent, I could try to use Death Cart to get a KC and mirror the deck-killing strategy, but I'd rather counter with the following:
1. Use the threat of Masquerade so that my opponent is forced to give me 3-card hands
2. Buy a Band of Misfits, which can be used as Masquerade, Workshop, or Vagrant. Now I don't need the Masquerade to threaten Masquerade.
3. While my opponent tries to trash my deck use BoM-as-Workshop and my buy to remain card-neutral
4. Empty the Silver and Copper
5. Buy 7 Duchies
6. Pass the first 6 to Masquerade (opponent trashes them)
7. Buy the last Duchy to win.
My only question is, can the lock player use KC-Workshop to get money quickly and convert to a faster Province strategy than I can create? And can I prevent this from happening by picking up some strong cards, e.g. KC (using Death Cart to get them, possibly) before tipping my strategy?