Dominion Strategy Forum
Miscellaneous => Forum Games => Mafia Game Threads => Topic started by: Grujah on September 25, 2012, 06:50:32 pm
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Setup is Alternating 9P. (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alternating_9P)
Mafia Ruleset (blatantly stolen from Axxle, as per tradition)
Rules with * are new or changed, read them.
Game Rules:
Sign-ups and Pre-game:
1*. First 13 people the sign-up will play. Any additional sign-ups will be put into replacement queque, in case somebody drops out.
2*. Once we get 13 sign-up. I'll send Role PMs. Your either get a "VT" "Mafia Goon" or "a PR" role. You won't immedately know what PR are you.
3*. We will wait until everybody confirms. Prolonging this stage might be considered cheating.
4*. After everybody confirms, Mafia gets 24 hours to decide which PRs to choose. After they do, they will be distributed to selected Townies and than the game will begin.
General Gameplay and Etiquette:
1. You may not quote private Moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind. Paraphrasing (for role claims, etc.) is acceptable.
2. There is to be NO personal communication outside of the forum postings unless your role PM specifically allows it. Mafia members may communicate at night and during the confirmation stage via Quicktopic.
3. If you have a role with a Night action your choices are due to me by the posted deadline. If I do not receive your choice via PM by the posted deadline you will forfeit your actions. In case of multiple submissions, the last valid one before the deadline will be used.
4. Roles with Night actions will not be able to submit an action on Night 0 (i.e. during the confirmation stage).
5. Any player with a Night action may instead submit a “No Action” PM to let the Mod know that you do not want to perform your expected action that Night phase.
6*. You can send early or conditional actions if you are sure what you will do during the Night.
7. As a general rule you should aim for one post every 48 hours, minimum, to keep the game moving.
Voting, Deadlines, and Player Death:
1. A simple majority (rounded up) of all living members must agree on one person for a lynch to occur prior to deadline.
2. Once you have reached a simple majority no further unvoting will change someone’s fate. Further votes will also be ignored.
3. Once a player is lynched the game enters twilight until I post a death scene; all players including the one who was lynched may continue to post during twilight.
4. Please submit votes as: Vote: PlayerName. Votes will NOT be counted if they are not bold or do not follow this syntax! Obvious abbreviations or nicknames will be counted so long as they are unambiguous. *Format might change if I get around to making an auto-counter.
5. Please submit vote revocations as either Unvote: PlayerName or Unvote. Unvotes are not necessary before changing votes.
6. You may Vote: No Lynch - a simple majority of these vote types are required to send the game to Night phase without a lynch.
7. This game will generally have 7 days day deadlines. Some deadlines will be extended so that the do not end on weekends but on Monday instead.If a player or No Lynch does not have a simple majority at deadline, no lynch will occur, and the game will go into night. And 2 days nights.
8. Once you are killed (either via lynch or night kill) you may no longer post. This means that you do not even get a “Bah” post. The dead in this game are silent.
9*. Dead Mafia players will be restrained from posting in Quicktopic.
Miscellaneous/Mechanics:
1. Bold, green text is reserved for the Mod. No invisible/small text is allowed, nor is math-based cryptography.
2. If you have an issue/problem with the game, please PM the Mod privately. Do not post issues/complaints in the game thread.
3. The Mod may make mistakes - please point out any mistakes gently. Mistakes will be corrected where possible, but sometimes mistakes are made that cannot be reversed. These will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. Please bold all requests to the Mod so that they don’t get missed.
5*. Prods of missing players will be issued automatically after 72 hours of no activity or upon request after 48 hours of no activity on demand by players. A prodded player has 48 hours to respond or risks replacement. A player who has been prodded 3 times is subject to replacement without further notice.
6. Rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, up to and including a Modkill.
7. If you anticipate being unavailable for more than a 48-hour period please post a notice to that effect in the thread. Treat this game as a commitment. Be considerate – don’t leave us hanging.
8. If a one-shot power is roleblocked, the power IS used up.
9. Do not edit or delete posts. We don't want some players having more information than others. If you want to clarify posts, feel free to double post.
10*. Because I am anal about this, any file to be linked (a picture, document, etc) is to be sent to me, so I can host it and than you'll get a link that I can guarnatee won't change. Links so mafiascum, f.ds, and other informative sites will be allowed.
11*. Any question to the Moderator concerning your role or similar hidden information is to be PMed. Any public question that you might ask need to be written in red.
The Golden Rule:
Please remember that this is a game and your main objective is to have fun! Be considerate of each other, don’t get personal, and enjoy the game.
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Playerlist:
Tyler Durden
Sakon and Ukon
Aggron Stonebreaker
Professor Quirrell
Harvey Dent
Smeagol
Doduo
Dr Jekyll
Zaphod Beeblebrox
---------
SwitchFromStarcraft
Voltgloss
Galzria
Robz888
Eevee
Axxle
jotheonah
Ashersky
Glooble
cayvie
Insomniac
shraeye
theMunch
pingpongsam
Archtype
O
Captain_Frisk
DSell
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In.
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oh god so in
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Ok, this will be a game where more people will share a single account. (mostly likely 2 per 1 account).
First, as I am not 100% sure on format, I would like some input if you are interested in playing(I have most of these already decided, but I might change based on answers):
1. Should who is behind which account be public or private?
If private:
2. Should players know whom their partner is?
3. Should scum know whom are actually players in their scumteam?
4. Should there be a guessing minigame for players/specs?
5. Should there be a post restriction on revealing/speculating your/other's identities?
6. Should there be some basically VT roles that have some "player investigation powers"?
7. Should all hydras have same amount (2 heads)?
Oh yes, important one:
8. Should hydra heads (partners) be allowed to speak to each other a) during day b)during night?
If I figure out some more questions I am going to post them.
Also theory kinda needs to OK me making these extra accounts.
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1. I think accounts should be private
2. Players should know who their partner is
3. I don't think there's a reasonable way to keep scum from finding out who the players in their team are.
4. Of course there should be a spectator guessing game! Players, maybe not; I think there will already be plenty of speculation, no need to encourage it.
5. There should be a restriction on revealing your partner's identity. Maybe one on revealing your own as well. Speculation is fine.
6. No. Player investigation is a bad road to go down.
7. 2 heads sounds good, certainly stick with that until we figure out the nuances of this variation.
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I assume pairs will be randomized? I guess I vote for maximum transparency (tell everything), even though secrecy would indeed create a fun minigame in guessing who is who.
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Oh yes two heads for everyone certainly.
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/in
Hydras should probably be public. People are going to mess up anyway and accidentally post in their main account (unless we do this offsite).
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I'll tentatively /in
I think pairs should know each other, but in every public aspect it should be secret. Part of the fun will be in not knowing what meta's are attributable to which account.
I would even be hesitantly interested in the players themselves not knowing who their partners are. Hydra heads should be uniform however, and a full list of active players in the game should be in the lead post. Also, when a Hydra dies, I think it should be revealed who was behind it.
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what are hydras and how do they work?
I'm probably not in unless they're really awesome, MXI and RMM3 are enough for me to keep track of.
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8.) is one of more imporant ones, ie should heads talk to each other or not (I think yes, btw).
ftl - Hydras is this:
There will be new accounts. 2 players will control 1 account. All rest is regular.
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8) is one of more imporant ones, ie should heads talk to each other or not (I think yes, btw).
ftl - Hydras is this:
There will be new accounts. 2 players will control 1 account. All rest is regular.
Wouldn't they pretty much have to know who the other is, since they could message themselves? And this really isn't be something that could be regulated.
I'm proooobably not in unless it's still really far from starting.
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I'm interested, but we'll see how things are looking when sign-ups come around.
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in
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In.
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in if I am dead in MXI when this starts. out if I am still alive.
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Heh, same, I'd definitely be in if I'm dead in one of my other games by then, but probably not if they're all still going.
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In.
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Out
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If there's space, /in
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IN
Now Ill go read about the setup...
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in if it's small.
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hope to be in. This sounds fun.
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in if it's small.
The number of players may be large, but with accounts shared hopefully the town size won't be huge.
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in
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in if it's small.
The number of players may be large, but with accounts shared hopefully the town size won't be huge.
This. Rules will come soon, also.
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How many people is this looking to be?
These games are just getting bigger and bigger to accommodate crazy mod ideas which takes a lot away from them in the actual getting to know people bits.
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In for a D1 lynch ;D
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In for a D1 lynch ;D
Oh you
Out, due to RL commitments.
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How many people is this looking to be?
These games are just getting bigger and bigger to accommodate crazy mod ideas which takes a lot away from them in the actual getting to know people bits.
+1
13 is my new limit.
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How many people is this looking to be?
These games are just getting bigger and bigger to accommodate crazy mod ideas which takes a lot away from them in the actual getting to know people bits.
+1
13 is my new limit.
This is true for me as well.
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(That said 26 is the new 13 for hydra)
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Yeah, 9-13 is my goal. Gonna update this after I watch the new DKR. (Protip: so far it looks like it's gone to be batshit awesome).
Edit: DKR as in Dark Knight Returns, not Rises. Rises was not awesome, only ok.
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Oh, dissapointed it wasnt Democratic Korean Republic!
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now that I'm dead in Robz's game - in.
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Needs more players, come on peoples!
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We got 14 yeses and 4 maybies.
We need 18 yeses to make 9 player games, that would be fine.
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Eevee
cayvie
Axxle
Galzria
O
Robz888
Ashersky
Archetype
Insomniac
ehunt
shraeye
jotheonah
pps
Glooble
Maybe:
Young Nick
Dsell
yuma
ftl
are these the pairings?
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Those are not the pairings. Pairings will be random.
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I am definitely out.
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I'm not in
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more people should sign up for this >:|
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more people should sign up for this >:|
Agreed.
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I'm in, right? /in again!
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Dsell yuma Ozle and Young Nick and boom that's 18! Lets do this!
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Can I be in? Now that I died in XI (sorry guys, I didn't know until Shraeye told me that I wasn't allowed to post my pm) I kinda want to do this one, but only if I can be paired with Shraeye. :P
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Dsell yuma Ozle and Young Nick and boom that's 18! Lets do this!
I am hesitant to play while I am still in MXI... if it is only one slot that is left to be filled I'll consider it at that time. But for now I am still tentative.
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Yeah I never said I was in. I'm not as of right now.
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I was just planting ideas to your heads. :)
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Can I be in? Now that I died in XI (sorry guys, I didn't know until Shraeye told me that I wasn't allowed to post my pm) I kinda want to do this one, but only if I can be paired with Shraeye. :P
This would be acceptable.
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Ok....gah...I actually really don't want to miss this game.
I'm insaaaane.
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Ok....gah...I actually really don't want to miss this game.
I'm insaaaane.
Dont lie. You want to see Shraeye/TheMunch Hydra in action.
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Ok....gah...I actually really don't want to miss this game.
I'm insaaaane.
Dont lie. You want to see Shraeye/TheMunch Hydra in action.
Policy lynch! ;D
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I'm totally kidding. :P
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I want to see Insomniac / O
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I want to see Insomniac / O
Can I ask why?
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I want to be paired with Morgrim.
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I think time zone pairing would be helpful...anyone else in Australia or this side of the world? Isn't someone in Japan?
Personality-wise, I think Eevee would be my best partner.
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I think all this talk is ridiculous and it should certainly be random.
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I think time zone pairing would be helpful...anyone else in Australia or this side of the world? Isn't someone in Japan?
Personality-wise, I think Eevee would be my best partner.
Morgrim is in Japan!
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I think time zone pairing would be helpful...anyone else in Australia or this side of the world? Isn't someone in Japan?
Personality-wise, I think Eevee would be my best partner.
Morgrim is in Japan!
And I'm an insomniac (with a lower case i). I'm very often online at the same time as Morg.
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I think all this talk is ridiculous and it should certainly be random.
I agree it should be random, but it's fun! Why do you think that, ashersky?
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Who do people think should be my partner?
As speculation. Of course it will be random.
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would you want to be online at the same time as your partner?
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Should theoretical partners be matches, compliments, or opposites?
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would you want to be online at the same time as your partner?
Wouldn't it better to be online at different times so at least one of you would be around more often?
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Lol. I'm excited for when we have two posts by the same user separated by 30 seconds: "Eevee is so scummy" and "Eevee is obvtown." XD
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I just realized that the probability that I post to this game while accidentally logged in under the name ehunt instead of my hydra-name is basically 1.
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Lol. I'm excited for when we have two posts by the same user separated by 30 seconds: "Eevee is so scummy" and "Eevee is obvtown." XD
Just trying to stay straight will be a pain in the arse.
Each day I wake up, I'll need to reread carefully to see what I said while I sleep, lest I say something opposite and then get called scum for it. "In post #412, you said green is red. Here in post #547, you say Green is yellow. SCUMSLIP!"
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Lol. I'm excited for when we have two posts by the same user separated by 30 seconds: "Eevee is so scummy" and "Eevee is obvtown." XD
Just trying to stay straight will be a pain in the arse.
Each day I wake up, I'll need to reread carefully to see what I said while I sleep, lest I say something opposite and then get called scum for it. "In post #412, you said green is red. Here in post #547, you say Green is yellow. SCUMSLIP!"
i'm basically resigned to getting into a fight with my other head
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Who do people think should be my partner?
As speculation. Of course it will be random.
theorel
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from my count two more (offical players are needed) I will be /in if someone else /ins as well to make the full 18.
Let's get this game started!
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So this is a normal 9 player game, but with the strange confusion that there are shared accounts? What is the purpose of the shared accounts?
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/out
sorry, I didn't realize how soon this was starting, I can't commit to a game right now.
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eh /in
i'll let my alter-ego do the heavy lifting. maybe.
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What is the purpose of the shared accounts?
For fun! :P
I think opposites would be cool, but I have a feeling they would just argue with eachother about posting things and nothing would get done.
Similiar personalities seems like the best way to do it. Matching up people with others of similiar personality, like what Robz did in his game.
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i vote completely random
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i vote completely random
Strongly agree
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I'd say random but with as different timezones as possible so that there is more frequent posting.
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do these forums allow for two people to be logged into the same account simultaneously?
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do these forums allow for two people to be logged into the same account simultaneously?
I'm logged into my account at home, at work, and on my phone and don't have to log in/out each time.
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do these forums allow for two people to be logged into the same account simultaneously?
I'm logged into my account at home, at work, and on my phone and don't have to log in/out each time.
Further, I can post three separate things in three separate threads from my mobile, desktop, and iPad all at the same time, so there's no conflict with an account being active in multiple places from different sources at the same time.
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Im /out but this has to be random surely
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Yeah I'm for all random.
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Allrandom cept possible shraeye-TheMunch team (unless they agree to separate :P)
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I can't tell if I'd prefer random or shraeye-Munch. The 2nd could be easier for us, because we wouldn't have to worry about not talking about the game (or would we still be disallowed from discussing with eachother even if we're the same person). I guess us only communicating ingame about this game makes sense, as other people won't be able to talk to their partners. Or will they? If nobody is allowed to talk to partners outside of the thread, then you should seperate shraeye-Munch, because that would be super hard.
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If we're going by mafiascum hydras we should be allowed to discuss out of game. The reasoning is that it's basically two people sharing the same brain.
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Was it decided if head combos would be public? I sure hope not! I like the idea of not knowing, or having expectations of, the meta's of each head. It would be fun to try and work them out.
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Also, where in Japan are you Morgrim?
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If we're going by mafiascum hydras we should be allowed to discuss out of game. The reasoning is that it's basically two people sharing the same brain.
It will be like this.
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This doesn't seem to be able to fill. Options:
1) Scrap and make a more standard game
2) play some weird setup with 8
3) 2 players are not hydras (sucks for them).
4) Wait.
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Are you going to bully me into signing up for another weird game?
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Are you going to bully me into signing up for another weird game?
It'll be a fun game and its essentially nine players (very small amount) where the commitment is low because half the time someone else will be posting for you
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I say we just wait. It's a weirdish one that requires a lot of people so I think the best thing is probably to just let it get full. I bet we'll get there soon.
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/In against better judgement.
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/In against better judgement.
Weeeeeeeeeee just one more!
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If we're going by mafiascum hydras we should be allowed to discuss out of game. The reasoning is that it's basically two people sharing the same brain.
It will be like this.
Will each hydra have its own qt?
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Yes. I will also but some measures to insure you guys don't post from wrong account.
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What about an offsite forum with anonymous accounts?
I'm using this for an anonymous game, not sure how much work it takes to get a forum started: http://www.zetaboards.com/
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THough about it, but would be awesome if it is actually on f.ds.
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God I am interested in this but can't sign up. If I die in MXI...
Then again, I wanted to be in the Chicken game, too, but that filled up fast.
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just sign up and let your other head do the heavy lifting
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Do it Young Nick! Sign up! Lets get this started! I'm tired of watching XI continue without being able to say anything.
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We still need 1 more?
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We still need 1 more?
Post 1 shows 17 signed up, so 1 more indeed.
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We still need 1 more?
Post 1 shows 17 signed up, so 1 more indeed.
Unless post 1 is mistaken.
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oh hell, since I'm dead in M-XIV...
/in
i still have, like, very little understanding of how this is going to work
no good can come of this
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oh hell, since I'm dead in M-XIV...
/in
i still have, like, very little understanding of how this is going to work
no good can come of this
Do not worry, I have very little understanding either.
Now that we have 2x9, main question is, do you think you guys can maintain 2 accounts thing (regular and hydra) here, or is it smarter to play it elsewhere? I think I prefer to play it here, as f.ds is home :D, with some reminders/remedy for miss-posts.
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vote: f.ds
Gotta be here, if only for posterity. It'll join the list of finished games.
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bah /out
i'm really sorry, i can't commit to this
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bah /out
i'm really sorry, i can't commit to this
I should have called it because I knew this would happen.
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/out
Fickle, I know, but Ozle's game takes precedence.
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/out
Fickle, I know, but Ozle's game takes precedence.
I'm in the same position, but I'll wait to /out until I know about when launch dates will be. If it happens that Ozle's gets off the ground and I'm dead elsewhere, then I would just end up re/in'ing (wow, that's weird) anyway.
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This game sure turned it to unlucky number 13. "The dreaded mafia game that never was! Mwahaahah, join if you dare."
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The thing is with how long this game is taking to start I don't think that outting is necessary Ozle's game won't start for a while and neither will this :P.
Mafia games in general are having a tough time firing right now.
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Robz's behemoth has made people too scared of joining any new games.. especially one's with a lot of pöayers. It's a shame, especially here because this would be less timeconsuming than a normal game and also is an awesome idea. >_>
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The thing is with how long this game is taking to start I don't think that outting is necessary Ozle's game won't start for a while and neither will this :P.
Mafia games in general are having a tough time firing right now.
Mines not starting till rm3 ends.
Presume this wont start till normal mafia game finishes, so plenty of time
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I'm really close to scraping this and making 13 Rebels in the Palace or Second Chance or Disability RM or something, but I know you guys wouldn't want that.
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Robz's behemoth has made people too scared of joining any new games.. especially one's with a lot of pöayers. It's a shame, especially here because this would be less timeconsuming than a normal game and also is an awesome idea. >_>
This was actually the goal of my game--to destroy Forum Mafia.
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I'm really close to scraping this and making 13 Rebels in the Palace or Second Chance or Disability RM or something, but I know you guys wouldn't want that.
Maybe just run it with less Hydras at this point.
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we still have 16 ins right? so an 8 hydra game wouldn't be horrible.
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I'm out if we're not playing 9.
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Yeah I'd really prefer getting 9 too.
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If it will help get things started, I guess I would be willing, but someone is going to have to explain the concept to me. I haven't read the thread, just saw the plea in the Mafia Queue thread.
Will it move pretty quickly?
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If it will help get things started, I guess I would be willing, but someone is going to have to explain the concept to me. I haven't read the thread, just saw the plea in the Mafia Queue thread.
Will it move pretty quickly?
Its essentially a 9 player game but each play is 2 people which alleviates a lot of your burden.
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So will we be making new accounts to be shared?
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So will we be making new accounts to be shared?
I think Grujah does. Say you and I get paired he might make a forum account say "Bill" and he would say hey Ins and SFS here is your user "Bill" with password "p1234" heres a QT for you two to talk during the day/night, you guys are a cop.
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Ok, well that's enough to go on for now. I'm in. We need one more?
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What Ins said.
Dunno of many 8p setups.. I've found:
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=True_Love
These things with 7:
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Bird_7P
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Bodyguard_7
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Pie_E7
...
Any suggestions welcomed.
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Ok, well that's enough to go on for now. I'm in. We need one more?
I think we are ready to go actually!
Volt left ><, so no.
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Well, since I left Ozle made clear his game isn't starting until after RMM3 ends, SO:
/in
Let's rev this ridiculous thing up and see where it takes us!
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Ok, well that's enough to go on for now. I'm in. We need one more?
I think we are ready to go actually!
Volt left ><, so no.
OOH, OOH, OOH, if Volt left can I be with Frisk?. Huh? Huh? Can I? Can I? Please, please! Can I? Can I?
NINJA'D!!!!
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YAYAYAYYAYAYA Volt came back!
Also the pairings aren't determined SFS they are gonna be random. he was grouping by 2 to show how many people we have with 2 heads.
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KK, starting this soon, as soon as I determine who's with whom, make QTs and accounts and so.
Setup is going to be some easy one, http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=F11 or the like, suggestions welcome. (Volt hosted these newbie games, he knows some I'm sure!)
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What about JK9 (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=JK9)? 2 Mafia Goons, 5 Vanilla Townies, 1 Town Tracker, and 1 Town Jailkeeper?
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Or maybe that's too close to M-XII, now that I think about it.
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These are up for consideration, too:
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alternating_9P
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=FAC688
JK9 look fine.
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I like alternating C9 best of those, I think.
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Kinda fits "alternating players" flavour too :P
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I'm up for alternating.
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I'm /up for anything, but alternating seems like the inverse of role madness
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I'm also up for anything, just glad this finally started!
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Listen, just send me my PM and we'll be even.
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does pps still read these forums?
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does pps still read these forums?
If not, it's pretty impressive how he managed to post here this morning at #110 ;)
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I'm good for anything.
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does pps still read these forums?
If not, it's pretty impressive how he managed to post here this morning at #110 ;)
:P
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Quick bit of meta before PMs go out...do you guys think you'll try to change your style to be more consistent with your partner or just stick with how you usually post? I'm seriously just asking out of curiosity and it's fine if people don't want to answer. I'm just wondering how autonomous the heads might be or if they'll attempt to work as one.
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I plan to mimic Morgrim.
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I'll be copying Grujah.
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I'll be copying theory.
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Think I'll copy pops.
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Stop lying - everyone's going to copy morgrim.
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pronouns are going to be fun
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PMs being written and sent.
Notes:
1. Pairings between players, roles and hydra character names are random - there is no info to be gained there.
2. Due to forum forbidding me to create 9 accounts in a day, you will have to make your own. You will get instructions in PM.
3. Confirmations are done by posting in your character QT and by your hydra account confirming in thread. Pre-game time might be extended if I see the need to, do not drag due to get more pregame chat.
4. Player names are in post 2, general rules are in post 1. Hopefully names are not too complicated. I choose characters that have some sort of duality, i.e. multiple heads, personalities, identities or all 3.
Also
5. You can talk to your head at anytime, even during the day. In QT only.
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If it is ok for an outsider to suggest:
I would say to have the heads put in the avatar of their hydra character (tyler durden, etc).
also is there a list of fds players in the game? I see the old one I was looking at before has been replaced by the hydra heads.
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If it is ok for an outsider to suggest:
I would say to have the heads put in the avatar of their hydra character (tyler durden, etc).
Already though of that.
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I approve of all the names.
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C O N F I R M E D
O N C I F R D E M
D O I E N F M C R
D E M O N C I F R
D E M O N I C F R
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Confirmed.
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All PMs sent. Almost all of them had an error of sorts. Sigh. Off to sleep.
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Also speccy is available. There will be speccy mini-game, of course.
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/confirm
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Confirmed.
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Its only after we've lost everything that we are free to do anything.
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Confirmed.
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Confirmed.
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Don't confuse me with a dolphin, I don't eat fish.
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CONFIRMED!
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We are definitely going to play good cop bad cop, lol.
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Sigh, christ, that came off like a good ole fashioned role-claim, eh? Well, it truly wasn't intended as such.
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O needs to confirm in qt and we're off!
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GAME STARTED!
Deadline is Monday, the Fifth, as we said days wont end on weekends!
Go!
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Do we like, get a deadline on Monday? My Intergalactic Gargle Blaster may not last me that loooong, man.
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Like, I mean, what time on Monday?
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TBD, too tired now for that and "misspost" rules.
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Vote: Aggron Stormbreaker because at least one of my heads doesn't know who that is.
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I'm not sure what I am either. Or, at least, one of my heads doesn't.
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I use growl to lower the attack of the mafia! There, now their kills are weaker.
At least one of our heads also does not know about Aggron Stonebreaker, except that aggron is a pokemon that doduo would very much like to avoid. Professor Quirrell is a servant of the Dark Lord though, so I don't feel great with him around.
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Don't lump me in with the back of my head! When I rule the world I want to plant flowers and read Jane Austin novels (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3c9K6MKCIs).
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Vote: Tyler Durden for a noncompliant sig.
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Vote: Tyler Durden for a noncompliant sig.
I am free in all the ways you are not.
Vote: Ogre Magi (Aggron Stormbreaker) because both our heads know who he is and randomness has no place here.
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I do not know who Sakon and Ukon or Aggron Stonebreaker are. They probably stole my preciousss.
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Vote: Dr. Jekyll, for not changing their Tyler Durden vote to Aggron Stormbreaker
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Vote Count:
Dr Jekyll(1): Zaphod Beeblebrox
Aggron Stonebreaker(2): Tyler Durden, Professor Quirell
Tyler Durden(1): Dr Jekyll
Not Voting (5): Doduo, Sakon and Ukon, Smeagol, Harvey Dent, Aggron Stonebreaker
Takes 5 to lynch.
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UNVOTE
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Vote: Zaphod Beeblebrox
Voting and unvoting after only a post count seems a bit jumpy.
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Vote: Zaphod Beeblebrox
Voting and unvoting after only a post count seems a bit jumpy.
Almost like he has multiple personalities.
Vote: Doduo
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Vote: Zaphod Beeblebrox
Voting and unvoting after only a post count, the passage of 11 hours and 53 minutes, and the change that made the vote misleading seems a bit jumpy.
FTFY
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Vote: Zaphod Beeblebrox
Voting and unvoting after only a post count seems a bit jumpy.
Look man, I just slipped on a pair of Joo Janta 200 Super-Chromatic Peril Sensative Sunglasses™ and realized that, like, all this RVS stuff is silly. Right? Don't get your digital watch all out of whack man. Sit back, relax, and enjoy the ride.
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You gonna share?
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You gonna share?
Man, you know I always have a spare pair for my other hair. Alriiight.
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Word.
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However much I like listening to Zaphod, I think there are some very interesting flavor elements that may or may not have had any influence on our roles. I was trying to look up the flavor of some of our new personas, and there are some who have duelling personalities and some with two heads that are non necessarily in conflict.
What I mean by this is that smeagol (for example) has two personalities that can at times be seen arguing with each other. These dueling personalities also exist with jekyll, quirrel, tyler durden, and I think zaphod as well. I don't know too much about doduo and sakon/ukon. But harvey dent and aggron don't have conflicting personalities.
Harvey has two faces as a result of an accident/attack, but he still has a single personality. Aggron stonebreaker simply has two heads, but they aren't in conflict with each other. Could this similarity help us find mafia?
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Not bloody likely.
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vote: doduo
Trying to make something out of nothing.
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These red sigs are surprisingly distracting!
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Vote: Harvey Dent for lurking.
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Vote: Harvey Dent for lurking.
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We have a shorter deadline, and it's approaching fast, people!
Vote: Harvey Dent
Now it's a wagon. Discuss. (And Harvey, get in here and talk. We still don't know if we can trust him (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBsdV--kLoQ).)
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Vote: Harvey Dent
Lurking with short deadlines is terribly anti-town.
Also it would be great if we actually knew when the deadline was. It wasn't on the last vote count.
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Monday, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time.
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Vote Count:
Aggron Stonebreaker(1): Professor Quirell
Doduo(1): Dr Jekyll
Harvey Dent(4): Sakon and Ukon, Zaphod Beeblebrox, Doduo, Tyler Durden (L-1)
Not Voting (5): Smeagol, Harvey Dent, Aggron Stonebreaker
Takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline: Monday, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time.
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We're seriously at L-1 already! Geez, this is the closest we've ever been to lynching during RVS. Which I suppose is a lot like a random lynch, which has occasionally proven effective.
So the question is, as it often is, are scum so bold as to push that wagon.
FOS: Tyler Durden for pushing an RVS wagon to L-1. Zaphod and S/U don't look great either.
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Vote: Tyler Durden
Putting someone at L-1 and not announcing it is very scummy.
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We're seriously at L-1 already! Geez, this is the closest we've ever been to lynching during RVS. Which I suppose is a lot like a random lynch, which has occasionally proven effective.
So the question is, as it often is, are scum so bold as to push that wagon.
FOS: Tyler Durden for pushing an RVS wagon to L-1. Zaphod and S/U don't look great either.
Obvscum for trying to spread around suspicion. OMG! People voted! They're suspicious for doing so! ::)
Right.
Still, Unvote - Not that I'm worried about a hammer (since anybody doing so really would be obvscum), but RVS'ing a wagon to L-1 is ridiculous.
That said, Harvey has a whopping total of... 0 posts! So if D1 continues to happen at the rate it's been going, I've no issue with seeing his lynch go through.
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Yeah, not really liking that Tyler Durden put him at L-1 there. Lynches come much faster in 9-player game. Still, I like discussion!
It seems less likely that a two-person player would be so totally lurky, and yet here it is. I'm fine with the lynch if we're nearing deadline but really it's best if he just shows up.
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Might be some metadata available here, for the mini-game. East coasters, no power perhaps?
There is a mini-game, yes?
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There is a mini-game, yes?
Yes, I originally planed it only for specs, but don't see why you can play (except you have more info).
Head's identities of dead players will be revealed with a slight delay, and you'll be able to guess in meantime.
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We'll Vote: Tyler Durden for an RVS L-1.
Apologies for the late arrival, but you'll have to excuse my face.
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We're seriously at L-1 already! Geez, this is the closest we've ever been to lynching during RVS. Which I suppose is a lot like a random lynch, which has occasionally proven effective.
vote: Professor Quirrell
This wagon was not RVS.
Don't mischaracterize.
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unvote
I don't know. It's hard to imagine that putting someone at L-1 this early is actually a scumtell and more just a characteristic of aggressive play.
Lynch mafia, not scum.
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Hi. Time to get serious.
Is there any reason, aside from fun, not to reveal who each and every one of us is? Yeah, guessing is more fun, but from a strategic, "Beat the mafia" perspective, I don't see why we should keep it to ourselves. The mafia thrive off uncertainty. Why give them that?
(And I'm sure you can tell who I am, anyway.)
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The fun aspect is enough for me to want to keep it a secret. Posting times make guessing easier, but I try not to take not of such things. Smeagol has nothing to say about the wagon.
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The fun aspect is enough for me to want to keep it a secret. Posting times make guessing easier, but I try not to take not of such things. Smeagol has nothing to say about the wagon.
Whatever you say, Galzria.
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The fun aspect is enough for me to want to keep it a secret. Posting times make guessing easier, but I try not to take not of such things. Smeagol has nothing to say about the wagon.
Whatever you say, Galzria.
Master betrayed us. Wicked. Tricksy, false. We ought to wring his filthy little neck. Kill him! Kill him! Kill them both! And then we take the precious... and we be the master!
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The fun aspect is enough for me to want to keep it a secret. Posting times make guessing easier, but I try not to take not of such things. Smeagol has nothing to say about the wagon.
Whatever you say, Galzria.
Master betrayed us. Wicked. Tricksy, false. We ought to wring his filthy little neck. Kill him! Kill him! Kill them both! And then we take the precious... and we be the master!
... she could do it. Yes! And then we takes it once they're dead! Once they're dead.
I mean, ppppoor ssstuttering Qqqquirrell doesn't know anything!
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Vote: Dr. Jekyll for lurking. I don't see too many Jekyll posts.
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Hey man, let me like, get one thing clear here:
If there's anything more important than MY ego around here, I want it caught and shot. Now. And the first place I would look is Aggron or Harvey. Both only have a single post. Seeing as I'm one to have no clue who Aggron is (but c'mon, he can't be cooler than me, right? I mean, 7 time consecutive worst dressed sentient being in the known Universe awards? Galactic President? Heck, even my left-cranium was voted hippest place in the Universe by Playbeing), I'm more then awesome in laying down a Vote: Aggron.
As for the Dark Lord's puppet, man, I'm Zaphod Beeblebrox. That's all you need to know. Got further questions, then look me up in the Guide man. I'm sure Ford's around here somewhere... He'll get you all hooked up.
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Is there any reason, aside from fun, not to reveal who each and every one of us is? Yeah, guessing is more fun, but from a strategic, "Beat the mafia" perspective, I don't see why we should keep it to ourselves. The mafia thrive off uncertainty. Why give them that?
Gollum also want's to keep secret from stupid fat hobbitses (for fun purposes). We hate's them. *Gollumgollum*.
Zaphod: That vote still looks like RVS, and I think we're past that now. You're on my shortlist of scum.
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Is there any reason, aside from fun, not to reveal who each and every one of us is? Yeah, guessing is more fun, but from a strategic, "Beat the mafia" perspective, I don't see why we should keep it to ourselves. The mafia thrive off uncertainty. Why give them that?
Gollum also want's to keep secret from stupid fat hobbitses (for fun purposes). We hate's them. *Gollumgollum*.
Zaphod: That vote still looks like RVS, and I think we're past that now. You're on my shortlist of scum.
First off man, who are you to decide when RVS is over?
Second, like, the vote was not at all RVS. You got a problem with me you piece of filth then vote for me. But anybody with two heads that can't find the time to post is, like, totally scummy.
Ha. But then I guess as Gollum you wouldn't find lurking all that unusual, would you?
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The Infinite Improbability Drive all but guarantees that Zaphod is mafia, see?
Vote: Zaphod
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Is there any reason, aside from fun, not to reveal who each and every one of us is? Yeah, guessing is more fun, but from a strategic, "Beat the mafia" perspective, I don't see why we should keep it to ourselves. The mafia thrive off uncertainty. Why give them that?
Gollum also want's to keep secret from stupid fat hobbitses (for fun purposes). We hate's them. *Gollumgollum*.
Zaphod: That vote still looks like RVS, and I think we're past that now. You're on my shortlist of scum.
vote: smeagol
Mentioning a "shortlist of scum" as a vague threat without elaborating.
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Vote: Smeagol
Definitely, what is that guy doing!?
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Unvote
His last post gave me a good truthful vibe.
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Hi jo!
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Hi jo!
Nah, never mind, that's wrong.
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Hi jo!
Nah, never mind, that's wrong.
vote: sakon for trying to figure out secret identities, see. Too much like that winged menace!
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We're seriously at L-1 already! Geez, this is the closest we've ever been to lynching during RVS. Which I suppose is a lot like a random lynch, which has occasionally proven effective.
So the question is, as it often is, are scum so bold as to push that wagon.
FOS: Tyler Durden for pushing an RVS wagon to L-1. Zaphod and S/U don't look great either.
So we, as in S/U, don't look so good for having cast the first vote for a perfectly legitimate reason?
Explain.
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Can we please get an updated votecount?
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Vote Count:
Aggron Stonebraker(1): Zaphod Beeblebrox
Doduo(1): Dr Jekyll
Harvey Dent(2):Doduo, Tyler Durden
Dr Jekyll(1): Professor Quirell
Smeagol(1): Sakon and Ukon
Sakon and Ukon(1): Harvey Dent
Not Voting (2): Aggron Stonebreaker , Smeagol
Takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline: Monday, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time.
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We are not voting for anyone.
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We are not voting for anyone.
The babelfish tells me that in English this would be:
Post 224 makes the vote count in 230 wrong.
The bablefish finds the original boldface difficult to pronounce.
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Fixd.
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While I found Smeagol keeping a "short list" and putting people on it publicly scummy, the fear of "5 to lynch" and the vote count difficult to count up made me hesitate, and that got me to thinking. The hydra mechanic creates a interesting predicament, while there are 9 "players" there are actually 18 people playing. This means that in order to lynch, all that needs to happen is for a subset of 5 out of 18 to agree (not 2 from the same head in this scenario, obviously).
So wagons may have a tendency to grow really really fast in this game. Normally most of us find it very natural to plunk votes down on whoever is looking the scummiest at the moment, but it is maybe a good idea to talk things over with your other head to see if they confirm your read or not. Other than in the head QTs, we could do this by using FoS as an indication that one of the pair wants to vote for a person, and the other could then follow up with an actual vote if they agree.
At the very least, we should strive to make votes more thoughtful, and promote an atmosphere where discussion is our main tool, and we use votes at the end. At least instead of doing the f.DS standard of ignoring any case that is made without an accompanying vote.
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Smeagol keeping a "short list"
8 people is a pretty short list right?
You bring up a good point though about votes getting thrown around.
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Vote Count:
Aggron Stonebraker(1): Zaphod Beeblebrox
Doduo(1): Dr Jekyll
Harvey Dent(2):Doduo, Tyler Durden
Dr Jekyll(1): Professor Quirell
Smeagol(1): Sakon and Ukon
Sakon and Ukon(1): Harvey Dent
Not Voting (2): Aggron Stonebreaker , Smeagol
Takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline: Monday, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time.
That is a confusing vote count. Typically the parenthetical number indicates the number of votes standing on the preceding name and the names following the colon are the those who cast the votes.
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Upon further review it appears that most of the vote count is correct and I am certain the Sakon and Ukon and Harvey Dent names have been incorrectly reversed.
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What
We're voting for Smeagol, last I checked.
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Thats how it is.
Votee(#): Voters1, Voter2.
You are voting from Smeagol, hence:
Smeagol (1): Sakon and UKon
Harvey is voting you, hence
Sakon and Ukon(1): Harvey.
I'll recheck for errors.
Recheck, all seems fine.
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My apologies, this hydra business confuses me; thanks for rechecking.
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Mr. Durden, does the player who put Mr. Dent to L-1 at #200 agree with your thoughts as set forth in #234?
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Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
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Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
vote: Tyler Durden
Being worried about presenting an appearance of consistency is a scum trait.
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Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
Huh?
Vote: Tyler Durden
Deliberately creating need of the babelfish to translate from your native language to your native language is an anti-town trait.
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Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
Huh?
Vote: Tyler Durden
Deliberately creating need of the babelfish to translate from your native language to your native language is an anti-town trait.
vote: Tyler Durden too, for this reason. No one should care that much about how they look.
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Unvote
The other half of this head thinks that statements like this aren't scummy in the slightest, and he actually holds a decent point that if all heads are inconsistent every head is going to look scummy, making scumhunting much harder.
I disagree with his methods, however. I think you just need to directly address your other head's points where you disagree with them (say, as I am doing now).
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Unvote
The other half of this head thinks that statements like this aren't scummy in the slightest, and he actually holds a decent point that if all heads are inconsistent every head is going to look scummy, making scumhunting much harder.
I disagree with his methods, however. I think you just need to directly address your other head's points where you disagree with them (say, as I am doing now).
vote: Tyler Durden because its the right thing to do. Clearly, this inconsistency is inconsistent with my line of thinking.
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I'm getting a highly scummy vibe from Sakon and Ukon.
Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
vote: Tyler Durden
Being worried about presenting an appearance of consistency is a scum trait.
In some ways this is a key phase for scum. By influencing the overarching meta for hydra play, they can create a climate that's more or less chaotic, and therefore better or worse for scum. This is a somewhat "jokey" post, but it's clearly trying to discourage clarity.
Vote: Sakon and Ukon
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Knowing my own alignment and understanding quick wagons on D1 are always on Town and ignoring how this appears reactive to the professor; Unvote[/b ]
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Call it OMGUS if it appeases you but I'm Vote: Prof Q for never responding to my question directed to him specifically. Prof is either tunneling a fellow Townie or he is actively painting a Townie for a lynch. Both are irreparably stupid D1 play.
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...understanding quick wagons on D1 are always on Town...
Replace "always" with "often" and I agree with this observation. Let's take a look at our quickwagons to date.
Harvey Dent quickwagon:
- Vote #1: Sakon and Ukon
- Vote #2: Zaphod Beeblebrox
- Vote #3: Doduo
- Vote #4: Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden quickwagon (starting at #243):
- Vote #1: Sakon and Ukon
- Vote #2: Zaphod Beeblebrox
- Vote #3: Harvey Dent
Vote: Zaphod Beeblebrox for hopping onto both quickwagons, um, quickly. The "safest" way for scum to push quickwagons is to do so early. That means leaping in as vote #2. Doing that twice in a row raises my suspicions.
I'd also like to hear from Sakon and Ukon as to whether they suspect any of the players who joined both of the quickwagons they (S/U) started.
And I also agree that Prof Q needs to respond to S/U's question in #228.
As an aside, I find Doduo's #199 (voting TD to L-2 while saying "We have a shorter deadline, and it's approaching fast, people!") and #206 ("Yeah, not really liking that Tyler Durden put him at L-1 there. Lynches come much faster in 9-player game.") to be hilariously at odds. Don't know if that's scummy so much as two heads disagreeing, though.
Now if you'll excuse me, some anarchist in a top hat just dropped a bomb at my feet and I need to get the heck past it. ...Good, I'm at least thirty feet away, no way the explosion could hiBOOMOW OW OW
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Vote Count:
Harvey Dent(2): Doduo, Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden(2): Zaphod Beeblebrox, Harvey Dent
Sakon and Ukon(1): Professor Quirell
Professor Quirell(1): Sakon and Ukon
Zaphod Beeblebrox(1): Dr Jekyll
Not Voting (2): Aggron Stonebreaker , Smeagol
Takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline: Monday, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time.
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Sorry, thought I had answered that. It's such a hassle to log out and log back in, sometimes I compose posts in my head and mean to post them later but then never actually do.
It was a mistake to include S/U there, I thought they were wagon hopping, but they were really wagon-starting. I just misread.
However, my latest vote on them I totally stand by.
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Unvote
FOS Zaphod for being early man in both quick wagons. Entirely agree with Jekyll's analysis.
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Yes, because scum have always jumped at every opportunity to be at the front of each and every wagon. They never just sit back and let things happen.
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Yes, because scum have always jumped at every opportunity to be at the front of each and every wagon. They never just sit back and let things happen.
We already voted the lurker so it is not playing out in the absolutes you are trying to frame it in.
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Yes, because scum have always jumped at every opportunity to be at the front of each and every wagon. They never just sit back and let things happen.
We already voted the lurker so it is not playing out in the absolutes you are trying to frame it in.
And you're pushing a lynch that's never once led to a scum lynch, but is an argument that's been made time and time again. Why? Because it's easy to hide behind.
Guess what? Town needs to use their vote. It's their primary weapon. I've been 2nd on the wagon of 2 people, and I'll happily be 2nd on the wagon of 6 more.
Way to analyze wagons without flips to back any credibility you might have though.
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I'm getting a highly scummy vibe from Sakon and Ukon.
Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
vote: Tyler Durden
Being worried about presenting an appearance of consistency is a scum trait.
In some ways this is a key phase for scum. By influencing the overarching meta for hydra play, they can create a climate that's more or less chaotic, and therefore better or worse for scum. This is a somewhat "jokey" post, but it's clearly trying to discourage clarity.
Vote: Sakon and Ukon
What.
That post was in no way a joke.
vote: Professor Quirrell
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Yes, because scum have always jumped at every opportunity to be at the front of each and every wagon. They never just sit back and let things happen.
We already voted the lurker so it is not playing out in the absolutes you are trying to frame it in.
And you're pushing a lynch that's never once led to a scum lynch, but is an argument that's been made time and time again. Why? Because it's easy to hide behind.
Guess what? Town needs to use their vote. It's their primary weapon. I've been 2nd on the wagon of 2 people, and I'll happily be 2nd on the wagon of 6 more.
Way to analyze wagons without flips to back any credibility you might have though.
Willingness to be on literally ANY wagon. How VERY pro-town.
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Just for the record half of us are opposed to voting the Professor.
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Just for the record half of us are opposed to voting the Professor.
Whyyyyy
Listen to this guy
Yes, because scum have always jumped at every opportunity to be at the front of each and every wagon. They never just sit back and let things happen.
We already voted the lurker so it is not playing out in the absolutes you are trying to frame it in.
And you're pushing a lynch that's never once led to a scum lynch, but is an argument that's been made time and time again. Why? Because it's easy to hide behind.
Guess what? Town needs to use their vote. It's their primary weapon. I've been 2nd on the wagon of 2 people, and I'll happily be 2nd on the wagon of 6 more.
Way to analyze wagons without flips to back any credibility you might have though.
Willingness to be on literally ANY wagon. How VERY pro-town.
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As an aside, I find Doduo's #199 (voting TD to L-2 while saying "We have a shorter deadline, and it's approaching fast, people!") and #206 ("Yeah, not really liking that Tyler Durden put him at L-1 there. Lynches come much faster in 9-player game.") to be hilariously at odds. Don't know if that's scummy so much as two heads disagreeing, though.
This is exactly what I was talking about before. If there isn't some reasonable amount of consensus between heads, people will be allowed to make hilariously contradictory statements. An atmosphere where within-head consensus is actually discouraged (see post #243) will give scum the freedom to not bother to put rational arguments behind their fake assessment of a situation. If they're ever caught in a crazy contradiction, they could just say "that was my other head."
Being able to daychat with my other head seems exactly like being a mason in a normal mafia game. There's another player who I can consult anytime about his reads, and trust *completely* in his opinion. Why would we not take advantage of that powerful tool?
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Because you both have to use and both be in agreement on when and what to post. I liken it to a 3 legged race.
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As an aside, I find Doduo's #199 (voting TD to L-2 while saying "We have a shorter deadline, and it's approaching fast, people!") and #206 ("Yeah, not really liking that Tyler Durden put him at L-1 there. Lynches come much faster in 9-player game.") to be hilariously at odds. Don't know if that's scummy so much as two heads disagreeing, though.
This is exactly what I was talking about before. If there isn't some reasonable amount of consensus between heads, people will be allowed to make hilariously contradictory statements. An atmosphere where within-head consensus is actually discouraged (see post #243) will give scum the freedom to not bother to put rational arguments behind their fake assessment of a situation. If they're ever caught in a crazy contradiction, they could just say "that was my other head."
When have we ever lynched scum for self-contradiction?
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I'm getting a highly scummy vibe from Sakon and Ukon.
Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
vote: Tyler Durden
Being worried about presenting an appearance of consistency is a scum trait.
In some ways this is a key phase for scum. By influencing the overarching meta for hydra play, they can create a climate that's more or less chaotic, and therefore better or worse for scum. This is a somewhat "jokey" post, but it's clearly trying to discourage clarity.
Vote: Sakon and Ukon
What.
That post was in no way a joke.
vote: Professor Quirrell
I disagree with SU's kneejerk-reaction vote on Quirrell solely because he called a post jokey when it wasn't. A vote should indicate that someone is likely scum in the eyes of the voter.
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Don't tell me what my votes do, don't, and should mean
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My vote was because I found that post of Quirrell's scummy.
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And, by the way, I think that both you and Quirrell are missing, and possibly intentionally obfuscating, the point of my original post, which was--
It is scummy to be worried about seeming consistent.
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I'm finding it a bit hard to tell what people are actually saying, it seems like there is quite a bit of contradiction or at least lack of clarity. I don't think this is so much of a problem as something that'll take getting used to.
I don't find being on every wagon to be scummy on day 1. It can be a perfectly valid town tactic to get several wagons going in order to have more to analyze, and I'd think that scum might feel a bit hesitant to put themselves out there like that. So Sakon and Ukon don't look especially scummy to me. I could see Professor Quirrell's attempts to paint them as scum for it being a little scummy, though. Scum likes to point out unusual or aggressive behavior on day 1 because those are the types of day 1 lynches that usually happen. And the day 1 lynch is usually on town. At this point I think it's enough for me to Vote: Professor Quirrell.
@Tyler Durden, I think the contradiction is really part of the game and might even be useful for catching scum. I can understand wanting to be consistent in order to mitigate confusion because confusion is helpful to scum, but I think that if we can manage the chaos we might be able to see through some of the contradictions to the ones where the contradictions ring false.
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Post Count!
Sakon and Ukon: 27
Zaphod Beeblebrox: 19
Professor Quirrell: 10
Smeagol: 9
Harvey Dent: 7
Tyler Durden: 7
Doduo: 5
Dr Jekyll: 5
Aggron Stonebreaker: 1
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This having to switch accounts before posting is making me even more reticent than usual to weigh in on day one when I don't have good reads. I assume my other head feels the same way.
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Ok, I just reread everything. I kind of agree with Tyler Durden about within-head consensus, but this presents a problem for me as I am a known lurker and so is my other head. If we have to discuss every vote, we will probably never vote.
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What the hell happened to this game? Did another mafia game end? There was nothing for days, and now everyone is talking?
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Ok, I just reread everything. I kind of agree with Tyler Durden about within-head consensus, but this presents a problem for me as I am a known lurker and so is my other head. If we have to discuss every vote, we will probably never vote.
Post count shows you're lurking and there you are...scummy.
vote: aggron
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unvote we're going to get lynched D1 at this rate. Don't be so trigger happy about finding anyone who disagrees with you scummy.
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vote: aggron insufficient response; remains suspect lurker #1 although everyone is currently guilty
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can i get a big ole w t f ?
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People are afraid to lynch. It's like we're moving backwards here. f.DS was finally getting over their "omg a wagon formed! Scuuuuumy!" behavior.... Yet here we are.
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Vote Count:
Harvey Dent(1): Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden(1): Zaphod Beeblebrox,
Sakon and Ukon(1): Professor Quirell
Professor Quirell(1): Doduo
Zaphod Beeblebrox(1): Dr Jekyll
Aggron Stonebreaker(1): Sakon and Ukon
Not Voting (3): Aggron Stonebreaker, Smeagol, Harvey Dent
Takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline: Monday, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time.
I believe this is accurate.
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Argh, did not realize this deadline is in a couple of hours.
Vote: Aggron Stonebreaker for incredible lurking (1 post between 2 players for almost the entirety of Day 1) until called out by a post count... and then giving a "response" that reads like an attempt to make lurking excusable.
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Vote: Tyler Durden
Think this is our best target to lynch scum.
Think Aggron is a mislynch.
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Ha! I copied that count from the last official, and just adjusted names and numbers... But I didn't actually look at the deadline. Wow. 2.5 hours!
I am fine with an Aggron lynch. There are a few heads sub-10 posts, sadly, but his was the worst offender at - as pointed out by Jekyll - 1 until called out, when he posted 2(!) more.
Vote: Aggron
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Vote: Tyler Durden
Think this is our best target to lynch scum.
Think Aggron is a mislynch.
Are you basing that on his plethora of posts that gave you a townie vibe, or the fact that you're scum and know his alignment to be town already?
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Smeagul, can you elaborate more on your Tyler case?
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I also didn't realize that today was the lynch deadline. Our vote was on the lurking HD but he is being more active. I will move our Vote: Aggron. There is especially no excuse for lurking when two players control the acct.
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Vote Count:
Tyler Durden(1): Smeagol
Sakon and Ukon(1): Professor Quirell
Professor Quirell(1): Doduo
Aggron Stonebreaker(4)(L-1): Sakon and Ukon, Dr. Jekyll, Zaphod Beeblebrox, Tyler Durden
Not Voting (2): Aggron Stonebreaker, Harvey Dent
Takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline: Monday, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time. (T-1 Hour)
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Aggron: Any claim - or are you just going to lurk yourself to death?
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How many people are online and watching this right now?
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We're nearly all guilty of lurking some here, this is definitely something we need to try to do better about day 2. Aggron is definitely the guiltiest, and even admitted it without trying to change it, so that's really annoying at the least.
Vote: Tyler Durden
Think this is our best target to lynch scum.
Think Aggron is a mislynch.
This struck me as odd because of how certain he seems based on 2 whole posts from Aggron. But it seems super unlikely for the scumpair to say something like that day 1, so I'm not sure how to interpret it. Strikes a bad chord with me though. Ugh I don't feel like there's nearly enough from anyone to go off of except to vote for practically everyone for lurking. I guess Zaphod is doing some Information Instead of Analysis too, that's a bit scummy.
Vote: Zaphod Beeblebrox for blending in and IIoA.
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We're nearly all guilty of lurking some here, this is definitely something we need to try to do better about day 2. Aggron is definitely the guiltiest, and even admitted it without trying to change it, so that's really annoying at the least.
Why wait until day 2? The people who are online now should get in here and discuss doing something before deadline.
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We're nearly all guilty of lurking some here, this is definitely something we need to try to do better about day 2. Aggron is definitely the guiltiest, and even admitted it without trying to change it, so that's really annoying at the least.
Why wait until day 2? The people who are online now should get in here and discuss doing something before deadline.
Agreed! Is Aggron's lurkiness such an issue that we just can't overlook it on future days? Is it gonna be so bad that it will distract us from proper scumhunting?
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As far as I can tell, there are aren't enough people online to lynch anyone else.
I prefer Smeagol, but I don't know if Dr. Jekyll will let me vote.
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Smeagol strikes me as odd too. I just don't see how he can determine that it's a mislynch based on just a few posts.
I'm down with a Vote: Smeagol
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How am I doing Information instead of Analysis? Because I'm posting updated votecounts? I could've not posted anything at all and nobody would know the deadline was approaching....
Seriously?
I've also had the second highest postcount in this thread. Hardly "lurking and blending in". Especially considering how many of those posts were votes or actual discussion.
If we weren't 30 minutes from deadline and looking at no-lynch, I would absolutely be voting Doduo right now over his ridiculous statements and vote based on things that are completely untrue.
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We're nearly all guilty of lurking some here, this is definitely something we need to try to do better about day 2. Aggron is definitely the guiltiest, and even admitted it without trying to change it, so that's really annoying at the least.
Why wait until day 2? The people who are online now should get in here and discuss doing something before deadline.
Agreed! Is Aggron's lurkiness such an issue that we just can't overlook it on future days? Is it gonna be so bad that it will distract us from proper scumhunting?
You have to remember the size of the game though. It IS a 9 player game, which means you get at most 4 lynch days, and only room for two mislynches. If you don't deal with the chronic lurking now (which may or may not be scum related), when do you? Tomorrow when, if the lynch misses today, another would put you in lylo? Or would you rather have a chronic lurker in lylo? If he's scum, you can't dare to mislynch him then, and if he's town you lose his voice for finding the remaining scum.
This isn't a long game, you can't "wait until later", because by the time "later" comes, it's too late.
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Votecounts are good, don't get me wrong! But by just giving votecounts and saying "the deadline's almost here" without doing much else besides voting the lurker, it looks blendy-inny. You have been more active on the thread than I remember, so that's good, but nothing you've done has stuck out at all. However, that could be my own fault. The problem is I just have no good reads at alllll right now. So it was a really minor thing that stuck out and I voted and there was some discussion. It's all working out.
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This isn't a long game, you can't "wait until later", because by the time "later" comes, it's too late.
Gah this is true I was forgetting this game was so small.
15 minutes left is anyone else interested in lynching smeagol or are we gonna cut the lurker?
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I WOULD switch to Smeagol based on his statement of towniness regarding Aggron, which somehow he feels confident enough to claim as a mislynch over, despite Aggron's total of 3 posts.
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I WOULD switch to Smeagol based on his statement of towniness regarding Aggron, which somehow he feels confident enough to claim as a mislynch over, despite Aggron's total of 3 posts.
That is, I actually found the statement itself scummy, as compared to Aggron's scummy lurking.
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Thats 3 for smeagol.
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We have just 10 minutes and Jekyll has agreed to it too, it'd be close but it's possible.
Is there plurality lynch here?
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There is NOT, which would mean no-lynch.
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IF ANYONE ELSE IS HERE AND WILLING TO VOTE FOR SMEAGOL, SPEAK UP FAST
Otherwise I'm ok with hammering Aggron.
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Tyler is following.
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But not posting.
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FoS: Durden
You've gotta have something to say.
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We have just 10 minutes and Jekyll has agreed to it too, it'd be close but it's possible.
Is there plurality lynch here?
This is Hyde btw. Jekyll is a pussy.
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4 minutes. :-/
FoS ALL lurkers. Srsly.
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Still at 3?
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Even if Tyler Durden shows up to vote smeagol we'd still just have 4 so Vote: Aggron to ensure a lynch. What, 3 total posts? Fewests posts to be lynched, maybe?
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Yeah. Terrible D1 lurking around here. Shocking with 18 players. At least I get a -somewhat- townie vibe from you two for being here and caring. Doesn't make you town I suppose, but it's better than nothing or no read at all.
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My head combination guess for Aggron:
Some combination of O, Axxle, and Glooble.
Probably....
Glooble/Axxle?
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Even if he's town, he was useless (3 posts, no votes), so if we did mislynch, at least we won't have dead weight tomorrow.
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vote: aggron if needed
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With the number of votes I fear we hit a townie but it remains possible scum just bussed at the end to remain low profile. Policy lynch is no iffy lynch. If the lynch did hit scum the sidetrackers don't look so hot.
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With the number of votes I fear we hit a townie but it remains possible scum just bussed at the end to remain low profile. Policy lynch is no iffy lynch. If the lynch did hit scum the sidetrackers don't look so hot.
We barely scrapped together what was needed! We didn't hit 5 until 2 minutes to deadline. Harvey's came 10 minutes late. Do I'm not sure saying "number of votes is worrisome" is at all accurate. I just wish more people had been on so we could actually have a real discussion about lynching scummy words instead of scummy lack of words.
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Appears even the mod is absent.
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Can we lynch the Mod for lurking?
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He only has 10 posts since the game began.
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But there's only one of him, so I guess those 10 posts count for double?
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Ahh, good point. So he's really at 20, which is "reasonable".
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Forgot the deadline was at 3pm forum time. I thought it was more toward the evening like other games.
Moot point now but I don't think Aggron is scum because I don't think he would lurk through so much suspicion as scum.
I wanted Tyler Durden because of a bit of mod WIFOM due to the sig, for this silly post:
However much I like listening to Zaphod, I think there are some very interesting flavor elements that may or may not have had any influence on our roles. I was trying to look up the flavor of some of our new personas, and there are some who have duelling personalities and some with two heads that are non necessarily in conflict.
What I mean by this is that smeagol (for example) has two personalities that can at times be seen arguing with each other. These dueling personalities also exist with jekyll, quirrel, tyler durden, and I think zaphod as well. I don't know too much about doduo and sakon/ukon. But harvey dent and aggron don't have conflicting personalities.
Harvey has two faces as a result of an accident/attack, but he still has a single personality. Aggron stonebreaker simply has two heads, but they aren't in conflict with each other. Could this similarity help us find mafia?
For the L-1 vote
A tiny bit of OMGUS and talking theory instead of catching scum in this post:
While I found Smeagol keeping a "short list" and putting people on it publicly scummy, the fear of "5 to lynch" and the vote count difficult to count up made me hesitate, and that got me to thinking. The hydra mechanic creates a interesting predicament, while there are 9 "players" there are actually 18 people playing. This means that in order to lynch, all that needs to happen is for a subset of 5 out of 18 to agree (not 2 from the same head in this scenario, obviously).
So wagons may have a tendency to grow really really fast in this game. Normally most of us find it very natural to plunk votes down on whoever is looking the scummiest at the moment, but it is maybe a good idea to talk things over with your other head to see if they confirm your read or not. Other than in the head QTs, we could do this by using FoS as an indication that one of the pair wants to vote for a person, and the other could then follow up with an actual vote if they agree.
At the very least, we should strive to make votes more thoughtful, and promote an atmosphere where discussion is our main tool, and we use votes at the end. At least instead of doing the f.DS standard of ignoring any case that is made without an accompanying vote.
While true, the survivalist thoughts in this post tend scummy:
Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
I don't like how this post says "hey look at this thing!" without saying if he thinks its a scumread or not:
I disagree with SU's kneejerk-reaction vote on Quirrell solely because he called a post jokey when it wasn't. A vote should indicate that someone is likely scum in the eyes of the voter.
The end.
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Thread Closed.
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Aggron Stonebreaker has been lynched. He was a Town Odd-Night Doctor.
f.ds really has an anti-doc agenda.
Night starts.
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Spectators and Players can send their guesses (as PM) about Aggron's heads' identities, which will be revealed in the morning.
1 point for 1 correct head, 3 for both.
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Feel asleep last night, didn't get to open.
Professor Quirrell is dead. He was a Vanilla Townie.
Thread Open.
Oh, and you examined the heads of the two headed Ogre. They were... *drumroll*:
Archetype and Glooble. Two lurkers apparently don't work good together.
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Lurking is bad, mmmmmmkay?
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I feel somewhat vindicated that my half of me got a town read on Quirrel through our earlier exchange. Aggron was a good lynch regardless of alignment and regardless of role both of which are unfortunate. That said this is the lurkiest 18 player game that ever happened which makes Town's job practically impossible.
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Vote: Tyler Durden for being around during the end-of-day scramble, but not posting anything after putting his vote on Aggron. Not even commenting on the Smeagol alternative. That has a "staying out of the way to let nature take its course" feel to it, and when the end result is a lynch of town, I find it suspicious.
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Vote: Tyler Durden for being around during the end-of-day scramble, but not posting anything after putting his vote on Aggron. Not even commenting on the Smeagol alternative. That has a "staying out of the way to let nature take its course" feel to it, and when the end result is a lynch of town, I find it suspicious.
Both of our heads have IRL responsibilities that happen right around/before the deadline and we were unable to comment after our vote. We will be making a case on day 1 after I have time to discuss/flesh it out with my other head.
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Vote: Tyler Durden for being around during the end-of-day scramble, but not posting anything after putting his vote on Aggron. Not even commenting on the Smeagol alternative. That has a "staying out of the way to let nature take its course" feel to it, and when the end result is a lynch of town, I find it suspicious.
Both of our heads have IRL responsibilities that happen right around/before the deadline and we were unable to comment after our vote. We will be making a case on day 1 after I have time to discuss/flesh it out with my other head.
Oops. Thats disappointing.
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Alright so this part of the head is going to submit his thoughts on all players because we need some conversation in this town.
Tyler Durden -- Was online at lynch yet didn't contribute, had some early theory talk, scummy.
Sakon and Ukon -- Town read has been talkative and I think in a game like this it's much easier for mafia to give into the temptation to lurk since well...everyone is
Aggron Stonebreaker -- Town Doc
Professor Quirrell -- Vanilla Townie
Harvey Dent -- Seems really jumpy, every post had a vote or unvote in it and he only voted for some people not as all over the place as he might be as town
Smeagol -- Mentions the *short list*. Self votes, Has the Tyler Durden redirect at the end of the day, like he was sure Aggron was town
Doduo -- Obvtown
Dr Jekyll -- Was also fairly present during the lynch, cautious town read for now
Zaphod Beeblebrox -- Was also fairly present during the lynch, cautious town read for now.
So this part of the head would like to Vote: Smeagol Over the redirect at the end of the day, even though I find Tyler Durden scummy Smeagols actions read far more like scum play.
I'll also
FoS: Harvey Dent
FoS: Tyler Durden
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Smeagol -- Has the Tyler Durden redirect at the end of the day, like he was sure Aggron was town
Zero point in doing this as scum. I'd just post it the next day. I posted it last night since I didn't know if I would die or not.
It was pretty obvious one of the heads was Glooble, and I thought the other was O, so I was pretty sure the lurking wasn't malevolent.
Vote: Tyler Durden
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I'm also up for a Doduo lynch, I'm thinking that he's buddies with Durden.
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Yeah, also 2 IRL days to post your guesses on Quirell's heads. (Both Players and Specs)
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No, that was NOT a good lynch. That wasn't even a standard policy lynch. A standard policy lynch would have at least waited for a claim at L-1. Many people, including my hothead partner, decided to hammer immediately because well, why not?
I think we should policy lynch a hammerer (yes, even Harvey Dent is up for option here, though I don't think my partner hammered) for lynching without waiting for a claim.
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Harvey, the hammer went in with 2 minutes prior to deadline. There was plenty of waiting for a claim.
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@Smeagol lol a little OMGUS eh. Why not post your thoughts on everyone there is only 7 people, maybe we get to see the short list finally
@Harvey Dent - It was deadline...
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ah, the time delay between the lock and the hammer threw me off.
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@Smeagol lol a little OMGUS eh. Why not post your thoughts on everyone there is only 7 people, maybe we get to see the short list finally
Mostly because you keep being fosing Tyler Durden but never really commit to it.
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@Smeagol lol a little OMGUS eh. Why not post your thoughts on everyone there is only 7 people, maybe we get to see the short list finally
Mostly because you keep being fosing Tyler Durden but never really commit to it.
Oh and there never was a literal list. It's just a figure of speech.
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Looking over various day 1 stuff, and Dent’s contributions pop out.
We'll Vote: Tyler Durden for an RVS L-1.
Apologies for the late arrival, but you'll have to excuse my face.
We still stand by that L-1 vote, it was helpful, it got town talking, finally this game had some momentum. We’re perfectly ok with having sparked some of that.
But then his other head immediately unvotes, having the opposite read that it was simply aggressive play and not mafia-play. Something that’s somewhat interesting here is in between Dent’s vote and unvote, S/U votes for Quirrell because Quirrell called the wagon on lurking Dent RVS. In the post directly above S/U’s vote Harvey Dent called the L-1 vote we gave an RVS L-1, but S/U never mentions this and only focuses on Quirrell’s statement.
Then Dent makes a joke vote on Zaphod for being associated with the Infinite Improbability Drive, and a joke vote on S/U for trying to figure out the identities of Smeagol.
Next vote he casts isn’t a joke, he’s got a serious reason, and (surprise) it’s for Tyler Durden.
Yes, we are in agreement on the posts we make. It's a bad idea to post first, and then argue with your other head. This gives scum the chance to say any "contradictions" were just a disagreement between heads. So our heads are in agreement on the L-1 vote of a lurker and in agreement over the thoughts regarding how fast a lynch can form. There is no cognitive dissonance, our experience with the Harvey Dent vote and the thoughts on Smeagol culminated in the realization of the tendencies of hydra votes.
Huh?
Vote: Tyler Durden
Deliberately creating need of the babelfish to translate from your native language to your native language is an anti-town trait.
vote: Tyler Durden too, for this reason. No one should care that much about how they look.
But here again, he has an interesting interaction with S/U. The post that Dent quotes is from Zaphod, and talks about using a babelfish to translate from native language to native language being anti-town (im not sure what this flavourful analogy means exactly, actually). But it’s Sakon/Ukon who talked about us caring how we look. So he’s sheeping S/U’s reason, but quotes Zaphod instead.
The other half of Dent immediately unvotes, this is the 2nd time that they’ve almost immediately flipped positions on us. It seems to us like one head is feeling very upset that we put them to L-1, and is trying to find survivalist reasons to lynch us, while the other head is trying really hard to avoid looking like those are just OMGUS votes, which it seems like they are. So far, Dent has made 4 votes, two on Tyler Durden with reasons given, and 2 joke votes on other people. So Dent is pretty hardcore focused on getting us lynched it seems. And then the OMGUSing head revotes Tyler Durden.
Later, closer to the deadline Dent is the first to vote Aggron over lurkiness (after S/U posts the most recent counts), and again the cooler of the two heads unvotes, this time with a joke, possibly to dispel suspicion around this crazy voting pattern.
unvote we're going to get lynched D1 at this rate. Don't be so trigger happy about finding anyone who disagrees with you scummy.
That joke isn’t even accurate. Until reread, we hadn’t found Dent particularly scummy and didn’t disagree with him, and Aggron most certainly wasn’t “disagreeing” with Dent.
Then finally at deadline is the “oh I guess if I haaaave to”-hammer.
vote: aggron if needed
Also,
Many people, including my hothead partner, decided to hammer immediately because well, why not?
I think we should policy lynch a hammerer (yes, even Harvey Dent is up for option here, though I don't think my partner hammered) for lynching without waiting for a claim.
At least one of Dent’s heads most certainly hammered. What exactly is meant by “don't think my partner hammered”? Literally in the same post Dent admits to his partner hammering.
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Aggron Stonebreaker has been lynched. He was a Town Odd-Night Doctor.
f.ds really has an anti-doc agenda.
Night starts.
Can we get a final votecount?
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Aggron Stonebreaker(4)(L-1): Sakon and Ukon, Dr. Jekyll, Zaphod Beeblebrox, Tyler Durden
Even if Tyler Durden shows up to vote smeagol we'd still just have 4 so Vote: Aggron to ensure a lynch. What, 3 total posts? Fewests posts to be lynched, maybe?
vote: aggron if needed
Dent didn't hammer.
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Aggron Stonebreaker(4)(L-1): Sakon and Ukon, Dr. Jekyll, Zaphod Beeblebrox, Tyler Durden
Even if Tyler Durden shows up to vote smeagol we'd still just have 4 so Vote: Aggron to ensure a lynch. What, 3 total posts? Fewests posts to be lynched, maybe?
vote: aggron if needed
Dent didn't hammer.
True fact; consider the statement regarding hammers redacted. I missed Doduo's vote there.
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Come on guys, I didn't post that case cause I like typing. What do you guys think?
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Vote: Harvey Dent
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I was willing to vot Dent then and I'll Vote: Dent now.
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What happened to the 20 post per game day cap we were playing under?
Oh... You mean that was just a suggestion for ANOTHER game? Could've fooled me...
Anyway, glad to see things have changed since the D1 lynch. It was absolutely the right lynch, despite it's outcome. Anybody who thinks otherwise and WASN'T around to make a case/vote for an alternative (Smeagol) is just being a poor town player.
Right now my biggest scum reads fluctuate between Durden, Dent, and Smeagol.
Durden: Was online and here during the deadline, but never posted even though those of us that WERE participating were actively looking for a different lynch possibility.
Dent: The five minute late non-hammer vote read incredibly disingenuous to me. Now, I realize scum would already know that Aggron was town, so wouldn't want to be associated with the wagon... But I also think a good scum player would know this, and by placing his vote AFTER the hammer, he wasn't *really* part of the wagon. It's just a load of WIFOM, and it's my weakest of the three scum reads. Because ultimately, you WOULD have to believe that a scum player, knowing a townie lynch had just gone down, rushed in to throw his name on the wagon. Possible for WIFOM reasons, but not particularly likely.
Smeagol: Speaking of "knowing Aggron was town", Smeagol seemed to have knowledge of this after a totally convincing 3 posts by Aggron. His statement that "The Aggron lynch is a bad lynch" without any supporting evidence read incredibly, incredibly hollow to me. I know that when I'm scum, claiming a lynch wagon that I'm not on as being bad is a great option, because if the lynch goes through, I look better for it. My issue then with Smeagol's claim isn't that he was right - I'll grant town can get genuine town reads on people as well - it's that there was nothing to base such a claim on. It isn't like Aggron had a whole bunch of posts to make a genuine read of one way or another. It's why so many of us were looking for an alternative at the deadline - because it was nothing but a policy lynch that removed deadweight. Smeagol's claim that Aggron was a bad lynch really stood out to me then, and it does now too.
Of those 3, I'm willing to discuss Durden further, but my vote is going on Smeagol. Vote: Smeagol
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I do think Smeagol should explain why he thought Aggron was a bad lynch.
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Ukon has a scum read on smeagol so I expect he will weigh in on that later. Sakon voted Dent.
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Aggron was town because the only case people had on him was not posting. He wasn't even actively lurking by posting fluff posts. He just wasn't there.
There is definitely scum on his wagon. Zaphod Beeblebrox looks the scummiest getting on, but I think Durden is scummier in general.
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Aggron was town because the only case people had on him was not posting. He wasn't even actively lurking by posting fluff posts. He just wasn't there.
There is definitely scum on his wagon. Zaphod Beeblebrox looks the scummiest getting on, but I think Durden is scummier in general.
Funny thing, if you actually go back and look, that's been the #1 place to find scum across pretty much every game. Lowest count (or close to it) will have hit scum far, far more often than a simple random role. Thus "not posting" is a much stronger case fir being scum than it is for being town.
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Jekyl and Smeagol while your around would you mind actually posting some analysis on all living players it's not like theres a ton of us
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I am on my way out of town for a funeral but it does not look like I will be any more absent than anyone else.
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In fact, it appears I will remain the most present.
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Vote Count:
Tyler Durden (2): Dr Jekyll, Smeagol,
Harvey Dent (2): Tyler Durden, Sakon and Ukon
Smeagol (2): Doduo, Zaphod Beeblebrox,
Not Voting (1): Harvey Dent
Takes 4 to lynch.
Deadline: 15th, Noon PDT, 3pm forum time.
Quirell were jotheonah and Robz888
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unvote with 3 l-1 wagons if Dent were scum why not hammer?
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Well, because he only has 2 wagons because 1 is on him. I don't think we have all 3 scum at l-1. If we do there is some bussing underway. What we do have is a pathetic lack of participation.
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No, it's because with 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch, not 3, thus there are 3 wagons at L-2, not L-1.
I do wish there was more going on here. I feel quite comfortable with my vote on Smeagol. I asked him forcclarification on how he found Aggron to be townie, and I don't think he answered adequately.. But people don't feel like engaging - which is sad because there are, I think, a couple of decent cases out there , and we WERE talking for awhile there...
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Yeah, this head apologizes for not participating more, if anything yesterday should have taught us that we need more participation. To me, Beeblebrox seems like the most townie person here. I agree with him about the three that seem scummiest but I don't know which order I'd put them in. I probably should reread everything to get a better idea. Smeagol is definitely suspicious, though some of his accusations seem almost too strong to be mafia. The flip side of that coin, though, is that he could be mafia who knows everybody's alignment already. I still don't like that he stated with so much certainty that Aggron was town shortly before the deadline based off of THREE posts. However, some mafia players on f.ds speak with more certainty than they mean, so I kinda have to account for that in my read. Durden is weird because I can't understand why either mafia or town would want to appear online without posting right before the deadline. I appreciate the people who were on, but it's just weird to be online without posting. I am actually more suspicious of him for seeming to have middling posts and not really standing out to me. I guess I/we are guilty of having a middling postcount too, but Durden hasn't stood out to me, so again I'll reread. I'm fine with our vote on smeagol right now.
Oh shoot I forgot Jekyll was in this game, yeah I need to read more but I hate it when that happens. I apologize for some of the hedginess in this post, there's not loads of content to go on, it feels kinda like day 1 still in that regard.
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I don't have too much experience in games this small.
Do people think there's value in trying to pick out scum pairs this early?
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I would like to see analysis from Harvey Dent.
His only posts so far Day 2 were to say "policy lynch a hammerer for not waiting for a claim," to which several responded that there WAS waiting for a claim and the hammer was thrown right at deadline, which Dent then acknowledged with an apology. And that's fine. Misunderstandings happen, especially when there is a delay between hammer and threadlock.
But there has been NOTHING ELSE from Dent today. Zero. Zip. Nada.
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I don't have too much experience in games this small.
Do people think there's value in trying to pick out scum pairs this early?
I think this is something we should always be keeping in our minds. If you have a good theory, you can put it out there and see what others think. It definitely helps scumhunting I feel to hear theories and thoughts like this, especially in a small games. The better fleshed out the idea is, the more useful it will be obviously.
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I would like to see analysis from Harvey Dent.
His only posts so far Day 2 were to say "policy lynch a hammerer for not waiting for a claim," to which several responded that there WAS waiting for a claim and the hammer was thrown right at deadline, which Dent then acknowledged with an apology. And that's fine. Misunderstandings happen, especially when there is a delay between hammer and threadlock.
But there has been NOTHING ELSE from Dent today. Zero. Zip. Nada.
We also agree with this. We would love to see Dent respond to our case on him, or post some analysis of his own.
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Sakon still favors a Dent vote and recognizes now the wagon was not L-1 and would like to hear a response but is suspicious of the number of others pressuring him as well ; not that the pressure isn't warranted but that the number indicates scum is included in the pressure group.
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Yeah, 4 to lynch. sorry.
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Sorry for the long delay, folks. Luckily, there wasn't much to catch up on.
@Durden, asking me to respond to your "case" is a bit silly, given you have none. You point out that my other half and I seem to flip flop, but that in itself is no reason to vote. Your misremembering of the hammer vote is of no help to your cause, either. I voted for you on D1 for okay reasons--you seem to still feel sore about it, and are now tunneling me. What's the worry there?
Everyone seems to be asking for my analysis, which is nice. I'm getting a town read on S/U at this point--his Q about finding scum pairs was a pro-town suggestion. As mentioned above, I think Durden is way too combative for the relatively safe position he seems to have found himself in. I do think Smeagol is suspicous, not for his D1 redirect, but for his naming of a scum pair so early into D2 (as opposed to discussing possible pairs) and could get behind that lynch.
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Sakon has warmed up to a Smeagol lynch. Sakon sees no real town overtones there and Ukon has expressed suspicion. I'd still like to see Ukon's reasons and for him to cast the vote.
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Smeagol totally gets why he is being suspected. He has been ridiculously lurky, and also his other personality has made some unfortunate statements I'm not surprised are viewed as scum slips. Deadline is two days from now, and we have no consensus. Bad bad bad.
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Just reread day 2. EVERYONE IS SO SCUMMY. Sakon and Ukon or Zaphod maybe least so, but still. Bad bad bad.
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Just reread day 2. EVERYONE IS SO SCUMMY. Sakon and Ukon or Zaphod maybe least so, but still. Bad bad bad.
What leads you to this conclusion?
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Just reread day 2. EVERYONE IS SO SCUMMY. Sakon and Ukon or Zaphod maybe least so, but still. Bad bad bad.
What leads you to this conclusion?
They seem to be the most active in making things happen. Wouldn't be shocked at all to see the entire scum team just watching no one post and secretly patting eachother in the back because they got the easiest win ever.
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Okay, trying to put some reasoning behind my bad feelings about Smeagol.
Vote: Tyler Durden
Putting someone at L-1 and not announcing it is very scummy.
Reads like an attempt to gain some easy early towncred by attacking aggressive play as scummy.
Gollum also want's to keep secret from stupid fat hobbitses (for fun purposes). We hate's them. *Gollumgollum*.
Zaphod: That vote still looks like RVS, and I think we're past that now. You're on my shortlist of scum.
Similar, looks like fake scumhunting to me again. Waving around a "shortlist of scum" as an empty threat seems off.
Then it's mostly jokes jokes jokes for awhile until...
Smeagol keeping a "short list"
8 people is a pretty short list right?
You bring up a good point though about votes getting thrown around.
and then, in the next post
Vote: Tyler Durden
Think this is our best target to lynch scum.
Think Aggron is a mislynch.
of course, I take this with a grain of salt, considering how different heads are likely to have differing opinions. On the other hand, there's no attempt at explanation as to why Aggron is town or why Tyler is scum--until after the Aggron lynch has gone through.
I don't know. It just all adds up to a bad feeling to me.
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All the posts you quoted were from my very scummy looking friend. Idk, I realize we look pretty bad here. I have barely posted, my other head has been lurky too and when he has posted he has said some scummy looking things. We have a played a bad town game, one that deserves votes. But, we are town, so lets lynch someone else!
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My other head has not posted in quite some time, and expressed difficulty getting excited about this game in our QT. I can't say I blame him.
So. Deadline is tomorrow? I will Vote: Smeagol. That's L-1. My other head had suspicion of Smeagol Day 1, and my own suspicions of Smeagol have increased over the course of Day 2. I think this lynch has a reasonable shot at hitting scum. What do the rest of you hydras think?
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@mod: are we allowed to username claim?
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Vote: Smeagol
Methinks the suspicion makes sense.
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Drats. Hammer without giving us a chance to claim?
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Harvey Dent, ladies and gentlemen: Employing a fine and useful tool for town.
Here's hoping the hammer was only quick-, and not derp-. And especially hoping that Dent didn't just quickhammer our other power role, which Smeagol's latest post certainly suggests (unless he's scum trolling, which is certainly a possibility).
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Drats. Hammer without giving us a chance to claim?
Yes. Username claiming wouldn't have helped you, anyway.
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Harvey Dent, ladies and gentlemen: Employing a fine and useful tool for town.
Here's hoping the hammer was only quick-, and not derp-. And especially hoping that Dent didn't just quickhammer our other power role, which Smeagol's latest post certainly suggests (unless he's scum trolling, which is certainly a possibility).
The hammer may have been fast, but the discussion leading up to it had plenty of time to simmer. This isn't like acid thrown on your face, you know.
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Drats. Hammer without giving us a chance to claim?
Yes. Username claiming wouldn't have helped you, anyway.
I think it would.
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Oh my word, I was going to work on analysis tonight and we have a quickhammer? Are you kidding me? Ugh ugh ugh Smeagol had better be scum.
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Nope, we were just a VT but that's still ridiculously antitown and please god policylynch him tomorrow it's not like town deserves to win this game. >_>
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Doduo looks scummy.
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Oh my word, I was going to work on analysis tonight and we have a quickhammer? Are you kidding me? Ugh ugh ugh Smeagol had better be scum.
It was your wagon, too.
Nope, we were just a VT but that's still ridiculously antitown and please god policylynch him tomorrow it's not like town deserves to win this game. >_>
Fine enough to argue from the grave. Where was everyone when the game was ongoing? Little to no action for days. At least this gives us something to talk about.
Doduo looks scummy.
Why?
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Doduo looks scummy.
Thank you, thanks for that. If you're actually town, you are screwing us even more. What is this I don't even...
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EXPLAIN TO ME HOW IS IT BETTER TO NOT LET US DEFEND OURSELVES / CLAIM AT ALL. Derphammer ITT.
Idk, I was suspecting him before and that comment looks sort of forced. Not really smart to say it maybe because if he is town, mafia can just use that as a tool to go against him tomorrow. I don't know. don't listen to me.
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Oh my word, I was going to work on analysis tonight and we have a quickhammer? Are you kidding me? Ugh ugh ugh Smeagol had better be scum.
It was your wagon, too.
Yes, well it was my other head's wagon. I was going to work on doing big analysis tonight. I approved of the vote but I didn't want there to be a quickhammer like that.
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Yeah no I have no reads, accusing someone for reasons that are this vague is just not going to be helpful. My other head might have something?
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Can't turn your back on this town for 2 seconds. In the first you're all quiet as a sleeping baby, and the next you're screaming at the top of your lungs.
I'm still hopeful Smeagol flips scum, but I wanted real conversation, not amazing quick hammers. Well, I'll own my part of the lynch one way or another, but man you guys drive me crazy.
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Doduo looks scummy.
Why?
Other head answering: He was voting for us and now is completely backpedaling now that he knows he'll be on a townie lynch. It's not damning but should be taken into consideration.
This is a very good case for why derphammering is really antitown, since Doduo would have had a chance to unvote if this head really was unsure.
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This is a very good case for why derphammering is really antitown, since Doduo would have had a chance to unvote if this head really was unsure.
I don't know, this "derp"hammer seemed to have sparked the most useful conversation this town has seen for days.
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Also killed a townie? You don't care about that?
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This is a very good case for why derphammering is really antitown, since Doduo would have had a chance to unvote if this head really was unsure.
I don't know, this "derp"hammer seemed to have sparked the most useful conversation this town has seen for days.
I think an intent to hammer would have created just as much discussion.
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Also killed a townie? You don't care about that?
I care; or at least, I will care, if you flip town. Mafia will sit and do this all twilight, after all.
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Also killed a townie? You don't care about that?
I care; or at least, I will care, if you flip town. Mafia will sit and do this all twilight, after all.
Who is scum if we're town?
Who is our partner if we're scum?
Everyone is free to answer this question.
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Grujah will probably get on in 5 hours or so, anything you want to ask from a soon to be confirmed townie?
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Wow - even the mod is bored with this game eh?
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It was definitely an interesting and unique game theory...
I wonder how it could've been implemented better to make it more interesting - or if we're all just so ingrained now in our meta's that a game of "unknowns" no longer excites us. Maybe we continue to play the games we do because half the fun is arguing with people you already know, and in turn analyzing their behavior and responses by comparing it to what you expect. Without expectations, it's a lot harder to feel the desire to push, because you can't tell if a particular response means anything.
I don't know. Certainly an interesting question. Is it the multiple personalities? The lack of identity? Is it switching accounts (Protip: You can avoid this, even on a single computer, if you use multiple browsers (Internet Explorer // Firefox) because the cookies are stored separately - you can, essentially, be logged in as both ID's)? It'll be interesting to talk about after.
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There's a couple of factors I think:
1. Even with the multiple browsers trick, it prevents phone posting.
2. Lack of meta makes everyone unreadable. The explicit goal of hiding your identity makes you consider every word you type - reducing desire to post.
3. Day chat reduces in game posting.
4. Interhead bickering sounds interesting, but may cause some players to not post ideas in thread because they've already been shot down in day chat, or for fear that their other head will be pissed.
We can address items 2 by releasing the identity of our heads. Would that kick the game up a notch?
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1. Isn't an issue for me as I use multiple browsers on my phone as well. (The default was terrible and I never used it - making it the perfect tool for this).
2. I agree, which is the point I was making above. However we're just awaiting Grujah to flip now, and assuming Smeagol is telling the truth we'll be in lylo tomorrow. While I'm not super opposed to headclaiming, it feels against the spirit of the game - and at this point the game is probably close to over anyway.
3. Isn't an issue for me either, as my other head decided he had more demanding personal obligations, and backed out of this (along with many other games). Finding a replacement seemed silly given the nature of this game and how many were alread "playing" away.
4. See 3. :)
I recognize of course, that just because they don't hold true for myself, 3 and 4 (and even to an extent 2) could discourage posting here. Ultimately though, like I said, the game theory sounded cool, but I just don't think that it's practical.
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Snip
3. Isn't an issue for me either, as my other head decided he had more demanding personal obligations, and backed out of this (along with many other games). Finding a replacement seemed silly given the nature of this game and how many were alread "playing" away.
And I took the babelfish with me, too! So there!
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Snip
3. Isn't an issue for me either, as my other head decided he had more demanding personal obligations, and backed out of this (along with many other games). Finding a replacement seemed silly given the nature of this game and how many were alread "playing" away.
And I took the babelfish with me, too! So there!
Hey! Back down, you! I'm in control now!
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Thread Closed.
Night Starts, lasts 2 days.
Smeagol has been lynched. He was Town Vanilla.
Identity guesses on PM.
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Day 3 Starts.
Thread Unlocked.
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No night kill?
We're in Mylo, right? (2 scum, 4 town)?
That's No Lynch, right?
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Huh? Was the even night PR also a doctor? I thought we had a cop on even nights.
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Should cop claim now?
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Should cop claim now?
I'm confused by no kill, that doesn't seem like a reasonable strategy. If we have a cop, then I'm not sure claiming now is best, especially if he only has info about a townmember. If we no lynch because of mylo, then mafia can hit the confirmed towny. Then again, if the cop has investigated mafia, then I think he shoudl claim, because we can't risk him getting hit at night.
I think that's the right action, yeah?
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Should cop claim now?
I'm confused by no kill, that doesn't seem like a reasonable strategy. If we have a cop, then I'm not sure claiming now is best, especially if he only has info about a townmember. If we no lynch because of mylo, then mafia can hit the confirmed towny. Then again, if the cop has investigated mafia, then I think he shoudl claim, because we can't risk him getting hit at night.
I think that's the right action, yeah?
Depends. Think of it this way: we have 2 mafia and 4 town. If cop claims and clears a townie, you have basically 2 ICs. So then it's 2 vs. 2 with 2 confirmed town. If you like those odds, it could be worth it. Mafia NKs either confirmed townies on N3, for sure, but as long as we lynch mafia today, you still go into D4 up 3 to 1 with an IC.
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Wow. Absolutely insane that there was no night kill, that's an incredible lucky break that I don't quite understand.
But...we have good news! I am the cop. Tyler Durden is mafia.
I would tend to suspect Dent the most after that, but nothing like a modconfirmation.
Vote: Tyler Durden
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Wow. Absolutely insane that there was no night kill, that's an incredible lucky break that I don't quite understand.
But...we have good news! I am the cop. Tyler Durden is mafia.
I would tend to suspect Dent the most after that, but nothing like a modconfirmation.
Vote: Tyler Durden
That was easy. I am the real cop, and Zaphod is innocent.
Vote: Doduo.
For tomorrow, is Durden the actual partner, chosen to give cred to Doduo?
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Wow. Absolutely insane that there was no night kill, that's an incredible lucky break that I don't quite understand.
But...we have good news! I am the cop. Tyler Durden is mafia.
I would tend to suspect Dent the most after that, but nothing like a modconfirmation.
Vote: Tyler Durden
Yeah, I guess mafia has to counterclaim here. Well I now know that Dent and Durden are the mafia team. Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
That was easy. I am the real cop, and Zaphod is innocent.
Vote: Doduo.
For tomorrow, is Durden the actual partner, chosen to give cred to Doduo?
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Sorry about the quoting error. Here is the proper post:
Wow. Absolutely insane that there was no night kill, that's an incredible lucky break that I don't quite understand.
But...we have good news! I am the cop. Tyler Durden is mafia.
I would tend to suspect Dent the most after that, but nothing like a modconfirmation.
Vote: Tyler Durden
That was easy. I am the real cop, and Zaphod is innocent.
Vote: Doduo.
For tomorrow, is Durden the actual partner, chosen to give cred to Doduo?
Yeah, I guess mafia has to counterclaim here. Well I now know that Dent and Durden are the mafia team. Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
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It's fairly possible that Durden is mafia, to make yor claim look real. Hey Durden, who do you think is telling the truth? Are you willing to sacrifice yourself and admit to being mafia to protect your partner's fake claim? Or will you vote Doduo?
This seems like a cooked up plot to me. I've been a single head for quite awhile now, so no one to talk to here. This does fit my real meta though, unbelievable PR that everyone finds scummy.
But no NK, fake claim, bus own partner through said fake claim...sounds like Robz, or another expert vet.
Up to others to choose, but if you lynch me, we lose.
Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
How, exactly, do you know Zaphod is town? Oh right, because you are mafia. Nice scum slip there.
Whoops. Should I delete myself?
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It's fairly possible that Durden is mafia, to make yor claim look real. Hey Durden, who do you think is telling the truth? Are you willing to sacrifice yourself and admit to being mafia to protect your partner's fake claim? Or will you vote Doduo?
This seems like a cooked up plot to me. I've been a single head for quite awhile now, so no one to talk to here. This does fit my real meta though, unbelievable PR that everyone finds scummy.
But no NK, fake claim, bus own partner through said fake claim...sounds like Robz, or another expert vet.
Up to others to choose, but if you lynch me, we lose.
Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
How, exactly, do you know Zaphod is town? Oh right, because you are mafia. Nice scum slip there.
Whoops. Should I delete myself?
So I did. Mod kill me if you want, but the rest of it stands. I full quoted with my name so nothing is missing. Just made it so only hydra names have posts.
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It's fairly possible that Durden is mafia, to make yor claim look real. Hey Durden, who do you think is telling the truth? Are you willing to sacrifice yourself and admit to being mafia to protect your partner's fake claim? Or will you vote Doduo?
This seems like a cooked up plot to me. I've been a single head for quite awhile now, so no one to talk to here. This does fit my real meta though, unbelievable PR that everyone finds scummy.
But no NK, fake claim, bus own partner through said fake claim...sounds like Robz, or another expert vet.
Up to others to choose, but if you lynch me, we lose.
Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
How, exactly, do you know Zaphod is town? Oh right, because you are mafia. Nice scum slip there.
Whoops. Should I delete myself?
So I did. Mod kill me if you want, but the rest of it stands. I full quoted with my name so nothing is missing. Just made it so only hydra names have posts.
Not at all. I know for a fact that the scumteam is Durden and Dent. Everyone else is confirmed town to me.
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Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
How, exactly, do you know Zaphod is town? Oh right, because you are mafia. Nice scum slip there.
Not at all. I know for a fact that the scumteam is Durden and Dent. Everyone else is confirmed town to me.
[/quote]
Funny. As the real cop, I know you are mafia, I am town, and Zaphod is town. Best guess is Durden for your partner.
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Argh, messed up quoting.
Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
How, exactly, do you know Zaphod is town? Oh right, because you are mafia. Nice scum slip there.
Not at all. I know for a fact that the scumteam is Durden and Dent. Everyone else is confirmed town to me.
Funny. As the real cop, I know you are mafia, I am town, and Zaphod is town. Best guess is Durden for your partner.
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Separately, on my mistake posting, I PMed Grujah, so we'll see what happens to me. Hopefully it hasn't affected (or ended, with mod kill) the game.
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Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
How, exactly, do you know Zaphod is town? Oh right, because you are mafia. Nice scum slip there.
Not at all. I know for a fact that the scumteam is Durden and Dent. Everyone else is confirmed town to me.
Funny. As the real cop, I know you are mafia, I am town, and Zaphod is town. Best guess is Durden for your partner.
You had to claim because otherwise you would be dealing with a confirmed townie who had a scum investigation on your partner, which obviously puts you in a very bad position.
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Zaphod, you are indeed town but don't let Harvey sweet talk you. He couldn't call out someone as mafia because that would prove he was lying, so he had to say he investigated someone as town. You are an IC now, but please don't make the mistake of believing him because he claims to have investigated you.
How, exactly, do you know Zaphod is town? Oh right, because you are mafia. Nice scum slip there.
Not at all. I know for a fact that the scumteam is Durden and Dent. Everyone else is confirmed town to me.
Funny. As the real cop, I know you are mafia, I am town, and Zaphod is town. Best guess is Durden for your partner.
You had to claim because otherwise you would be dealing with a confirmed townie who had a scum investigation on your partner, which obviously puts you in a very bad position.
My gosh we are failing all over the place here. Sorry. I'll just leave my post. Of course I stand by what I said still.
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This is a great mafia ploy, I realize. Finger your own partner, wait for real cop to counter claim, then your partner will side with real cop, so if he's lynched it looks even worse for the real cop. Well-done.
Except if town believes me, the real cop. Still, amazing gambit. With MYLO, you can press to lynch me by calling me a liar, or wait to lynch your partner, then lynch me tomorrow because it seems like you told the truth all along.
But you are lying. And you confirmed Zaphod based on what you claim to be the word of a liar. You know Zaphod is town, though, without investigating, because you are mafia.
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Vote: Doduo
Because he's lying scum. Here's what proves it; his theory that Dent counterclaimed to not deal with a confirmed townie and an investigation on his 'partner' is insane. Let's run through the hypothetical that Doduo wants everyone to buy. He's the real cop, and investigated Tyler Durden as mafia. THEN scumpartnerDent counterclaims, trying to gain credit by saying Zaphod is town. If people still end up believing Duduo, then Dent just served town the second mafiaplayer (himself) for no effin' reason.
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No, I know Zaphod is town because I know that you ARE lying because I am cop. I also know that Durden is mafia because I investigated him. That makes everyone else remaining confirmed (to me) town.
And that's really all I know. It's not a gambit. You are gambitting though because you are forced to. If I had investigated town, I don't know if you would have counterclaimed, but because I caught your partner you basically had to and now you're hoping that at least Zaphod will believe you and vote me along with your partner Durden and yourself. You are trying to make friends, and as mafia you don't need as many as I do.
Anyway, I investigated Durden because he was my 2nd biggest scumread. I really suspected you were scum after you quickhammered Smeagol, so I wanted to get more clarity on my other reads. Did you miscalculate yesterday and think you would win if you hammered Smeagol? Anyway, you and Durden are scum and that is that.
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Basically, the case Doduo is trying to sell everyone on Durden/Dent is just plain garbage.
Dent, obviously you're the real cop, and I have no idea why you're still tunnelling us so bad.
God, I feel like I'm arguing a wall as both copclaims seem convinced I'm scum.
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Because I investigated his partner Durden, Dent just needs to convince one more person in order to cause a stalemate and thus a no-lynch. Idk why Dent decided to counterclaim instead of Durden, Idk why they didn't do a NK, Idk why Dent showed his hand by quickhammering Smeagol yesterday. I just don't know. But obviously he needs the town to believe him instead of me and right now it's 2 vs 1.
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Dent, Dodue, Durden:
Why did you no-kill last night?
Cops: explain your targets.
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No, I know Zaphod is town because I know that you ARE lying because I am cop. I also know that Durden is mafia because I investigated him. That makes everyone else remaining confirmed (to me) town.
And that's really all I know. It's not a gambit. You are gambitting though because you are forced to. If I had investigated town, I don't know if you would have counterclaimed, but because I caught your partner you basically had to and now you're hoping that at least Zaphod will believe you and vote me along with your partner Durden and yourself. You are trying to make friends, and as mafia you don't need as many as I do.
Anyway, I investigated Durden because he was my 2nd biggest scumread. I really suspected you were scum after you quickhammered Smeagol, so I wanted to get more clarity on my other reads. Did you miscalculate yesterday and think you would win if you hammered Smeagol? Anyway, you and Durden are scum and that is that.
More ridiculous garbage. Are you suggesting that scumDent miscalculated yesterday and thought that he could hammer Smeagol, then submit a no-kill and then somehow still win? That's like a gambit within a gambit and it's all stupid. NOBODY would do that. I already showed why it was a terrible idea for scum to counterclaim a "cop" with a scumread. This is just bogus.
PPE: What???? You are just making facts up as you please if you are saying that Dent and I are pushing for a nolynch. I'm pushing for YOUR lynch. Why the f*** would a scumteam submit a no kill, JUST TO TRY TO PUSH THE NEXT DAY INTO A NO LYNCH?????????
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Durden is sounding like frustrated mafia right now. I'm biased at this point, but still. I cannot urge town strongly enough not to fall for their claims. Like I said, if just one town member votes with scum here, they can force a tie (and win tomorrow) or if two town believe them, they mislynch me and win outright.
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Also, I want head claims from all three of you, in this order:
Dent
Doduo
Durden
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@Durden, of course you're pushing for my lynch, but if just one townie votes with you guys (and 2 with me) then we'll be tied and in a no-lynch scenario. Which is VERY good for you because you can kill off one of the townies voting with me and then pretty much win outright tomorrow.
@Zaphod I have no idea why they didn't kill. I already explained why I investigated Durden here:
Anyway, I investigated Durden because he was my 2nd biggest scumread. I really suspected you were scum after you quickhammered Smeagol, so I wanted to get more clarity on my other reads. Did you miscalculate yesterday and think you would win if you hammered Smeagol? Anyway, you and Durden are scum and that is that.
After Smeagol's flip, I really thought Dent was mafia, so I investigated Durden to know if I could trust him.
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Dent, Dodue, Durden:
Why did you no-kill last night?
Cops: explain your targets.
I chose to target Zaphod because of D1, and confirmed town Smeagol's reads. I thought he seemed like eager scum on D1, and would have investigated him on N1 if I had been odd-night instead of even.
I honestly think scum just missed the deadline. But if it was on purpose, it was to force a mislynch with the fake claim.
PPE--ashersky, obviously, from my misposts.
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@Durden, of course you're pushing for my lynch, but if just one townie votes with you guys (and 2 with me) then we'll be tied and in a no-lynch scenario. Which is VERY good for you because you can kill off one of the townies voting with me and then pretty much win outright tomorrow.
Hold up, are other people seeing this crap too? Doduo just suggested that if town ties 3 for Doduo, 3 for Dent today, then a Dent/Durden scumteam would kill the townie voting on Dent, and that would give us a win the next day. That NOT ONE person would be suspicious that the wagon on Dent is the one dying?
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@Durden, of course you're pushing for my lynch, but if just one townie votes with you guys (and 2 with me) then we'll be tied and in a no-lynch scenario. Which is VERY good for you because you can kill off one of the townies voting with me and then pretty much win outright tomorrow.
Hold up, are other people seeing this crap too? Doduo just suggested that if town ties 3 for Doduo, 3 for Dent today, then a Dent/Durden scumteam would kill the townie voting on Dent, and that would give us a win the next day. That NOT ONE person would be suspicious that the wagon on Dent is the one dying?
Durden is sounding townier, for sure.
As it is, I think we should focus on the Doduo lynch today, then figure out what to do on D4 after we see who the other mafia NKs.
I think by not NKing, they actually really helped town out.
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@Durden, of course you're pushing for my lynch, but if just one townie votes with you guys (and 2 with me) then we'll be tied and in a no-lynch scenario. Which is VERY good for you because you can kill off one of the townies voting with me and then pretty much win outright tomorrow.
Hold up, are other people seeing this crap too? Doduo just suggested that if town ties 3 for Doduo, 3 for Dent today, then a Dent/Durden scumteam would kill the townie voting on Dent, and that would give us a win the next day. That NOT ONE person would be suspicious that the wagon on Dent is the one dying?
Actually this is probably true. Ok, so there will be more WIFOM involved than I initially was thinking. Still, causing a no lynch today would be very bad for town and causing a mislynch today is a guaranteed loss.
Our heads are Dsell (obviously) and Insomniac.
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I think by not NKing, they actually really helped town out.
I agree, I can't see how not NKing benefits scum. I have no clue at all why they did that; it's like they wanted to create confusion, but basically it was just a bad move.
Our heads are Munch/shraeye
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My other head was O, but he's been silent for quite awhile.
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My other head was O, but he's been silent for quite awhile.
So did you just have your math wrong when you quickhammered Smeagol or was it just a rookie scum mistake?
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O is here.
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Durden: Name me the scum team.
Dent: Name me the scum team.
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Durden: Name me the scum team.
Dent: Name me the scum team.
Well, irrelevant now anyway. Whoops.
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My other head was O, but he's been silent for quite awhile.
So did you just have your math wrong when you quickhammered Smeagol or was it just a rookie scum mistake?
This is that senator wife question, right?
You think scum hammered Smeagol's on accident, then decided not to NK to boot? Who do you think will believe your accusations?
Town hammered Smeagol.
(The irony there is that although it was a derphammer, and O is part of this Hydra, it wasn't him that hammered.)
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My other head was O, but he's been silent for quite awhile.
So did you just have your math wrong when you quickhammered Smeagol or was it just a rookie scum mistake?
This is that senator wife question, right?
Yep, it pretty much is, and I don't care much because you are guaranteed mafia. Feel free to answer after the game instead of now if you want.
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Durden: Name me the scum team.
Dent: Name me the scum team.
I think it is Doduo/Durden. Planned gambit.
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Durden: Name me the scum team.
Dent: Name me the scum team.
Well, irrelevant now anyway. Whoops.
Why irrelevant? We had started name-claiming anyway. Hilarity to ensue if someone counterclaims being someone.
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Wow. Absolutely insane that there was no night kill, that's an incredible lucky break that I don't quite understand.
But...we have good news! I am the cop. Tyler Durden is mafia.
I would tend to suspect Dent the most after that, but nothing like a modconfirmation.
Vote: Tyler Durden
That was easy. I am the real cop, and Zaphod is innocent.
Vote: Doduo.
For tomorrow, is Durden the actual partner, chosen to give cred to Doduo?
Dent, can you explain to me your perceived logic here?
Your claim that scum!Doduo would claim scum!Durden to be scum to earn town cred doesn't make sense to me. scum!Doduo would know that as soon as he claimed he would be counter claimed, thus ensuring that the claim or counter is the lynch for the day since we absolutely have a scum between the two. At this point, if we believe scum!Doduo, they win. If we believe you instead, scum!Doduo is dead and has earned 0 town cred. So... I don't see how this could've been a logical gambit by scum!Doduo to get his partner lynched in an attempt to earn town cred.
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I again realize that I'm very biased here because I know Dent is scum, but his reasons for "investigating" Zaphod feel thrown-together. He says it's "because of D1" where Zaphod reads as scum to him, but it doesn't make much sense to investigate someone on night 2 based on day 1 reads unless very little of note happened in the meantime, and I think quite a bit did. He makes a reference to Smeagol's reads but I don't understand the relevance. Perhaps I need to reread the end of D2 to see what he's talking about but I thought Smeagol was more suspicious of Durden and, at some junctures, myself.
In fact I just looked back at the end of D2 and Smeagol actually says that everyone looks suspicious except for Sakon and Ukon. Before that he said that "Zaphod looks the scummiest getting on [my wagon], but Durden is scummier in general." So I don't see some strong connection here that makes Zaphod a good investigation, I see scum reaching out to town in an attempt to win trust.
Zaphod, should I switch my vote to Dent? Since they are both scum I do not care at all which I'm voting for, but you appear to be willing to only vote for him or me, which makes sense. Actually this is pretty clear from your post so I'll vote: Harvey Dent.
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Wow. Absolutely insane that there was no night kill, that's an incredible lucky break that I don't quite understand.
But...we have good news! I am the cop. Tyler Durden is mafia.
I would tend to suspect Dent the most after that, but nothing like a modconfirmation.
Vote: Tyler Durden
That was easy. I am the real cop, and Zaphod is innocent.
Vote: Doduo.
For tomorrow, is Durden the actual partner, chosen to give cred to Doduo?
Dent, can you explain to me your perceived logic here?
Your claim that scum!Doduo would claim scum!Durden to be scum to earn town cred doesn't make sense to me. scum!Doduo would know that as soon as he claimed he would be counter claimed, thus ensuring that the claim or counter is the lynch for the day since we absolutely have a scum between the two. At this point, if we believe scum!Doduo, they win. If we believe you instead, scum!Doduo is dead and has earned 0 town cred. So... I don't see how this could've been a logical gambit by scum!Doduo to get his partner lynched in an attempt to earn town cred.
Is Volt your other half? He loves the ! thing.
My argument above is that Doduo probably fingered his own partner because: if town goes with him, he gets forever cred for being right and the counter claimer looks even worse for it. If town agrees with him, but kills the counter claimer, who flips cop, he's dead the next day, and fingered partner gets another night to kill. If town disagrees with Doduo and lunches him, the partner can argue scum tried to get him mislynched.
So in all scenarios, it works out for scum. In another format:
Doduo claims/fingers Durden as scum, then Dent counters.
1--Doduo is believed, scum Durden is lynched. Doduo gets town cred, Dent gets lynched D4, mafia wins.
2--Doduo is believed, real cop Dent is lynched. Doduo will be lynched D4, partner gets 2 nights alive to win.
3--Doduo is disbelieved, scum Doduo is lynched. Lylo on D4 leaves Durden to argue he was set up by Doduo.
So #3 is worst-case, and it isn't so bad.
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
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I again realize that I'm very biased here because I know Dent is scum, but his reasons for "investigating" Zaphod feel thrown-together. He says it's "because of D1" where Zaphod reads as scum to him, but it doesn't make much sense to investigate someone on night 2 based on day 1 reads unless very little of note happened in the meantime, and I think quite a bit did. He makes a reference to Smeagol's reads but I don't understand the relevance. Perhaps I need to reread the end of D2 to see what he's talking about but I thought Smeagol was more suspicious of Durden and, at some junctures, myself.
In fact I just looked back at the end of D2 and Smeagol actually says that everyone looks suspicious except for Sakon and Ukon. Before that he said that "Zaphod looks the scummiest getting on [my wagon], but Durden is scummier in general." So I don't see some strong connection here that makes Zaphod a good investigation, I see scum reaching out to town in an attempt to win trust.
Zaphod, should I switch my vote to Dent? Since they are both scum I do not care at all which I'm voting for, but you appear to be willing to only vote for him or me, which makes sense. Actually this is pretty clear from your post so I'll vote: Harvey Dent.
Your reason for investigating Durden was "he was my second strongest scumread". That's not anymore sensible than my reasons, which were I had a scum read on Zaphod, and so did Smeagol, and he was at a scummy spot on the wagon.
Switching your vote to me looks like flailing mafia caught in a lie.
We're also disadvantaged that Galz is the arbiter...we all know well he reads me. I am not lying about this.
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
This cannot possibly be relevant to anyone else here. It is unverifiable, why are you even asking? You'll claim that I'm lying and it will be your word against mine like it already is.
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
This cannot possibly be relevant to anyone else here. It is unverifiable, why are you even asking? You'll claim that I'm lying and it will be your word against mine like it already is.
Also known as you don't know the right answer.
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I again realize that I'm very biased here because I know Dent is scum, but his reasons for "investigating" Zaphod feel thrown-together. He says it's "because of D1" where Zaphod reads as scum to him, but it doesn't make much sense to investigate someone on night 2 based on day 1 reads unless very little of note happened in the meantime, and I think quite a bit did. He makes a reference to Smeagol's reads but I don't understand the relevance. Perhaps I need to reread the end of D2 to see what he's talking about but I thought Smeagol was more suspicious of Durden and, at some junctures, myself.
In fact I just looked back at the end of D2 and Smeagol actually says that everyone looks suspicious except for Sakon and Ukon. Before that he said that "Zaphod looks the scummiest getting on [my wagon], but Durden is scummier in general." So I don't see some strong connection here that makes Zaphod a good investigation, I see scum reaching out to town in an attempt to win trust.
Zaphod, should I switch my vote to Dent? Since they are both scum I do not care at all which I'm voting for, but you appear to be willing to only vote for him or me, which makes sense. Actually this is pretty clear from your post so I'll vote: Harvey Dent.
Your reason for investigating Durden was "he was my second strongest scumread". That's not anymore sensible than my reasons, which were I had a scum read on Zaphod, and so did Smeagol, and he was at a scummy spot on the wagon.
Switching your vote to me looks like flailing mafia caught in a lie.
We're also disadvantaged that Galz is the arbiter...we all know well he reads me. I am not lying about this.
Caught in a lie? What lie is that? Is this O? Because I thought that all of those reasons for investigating Zaphod were Asher's reasons because you've been gone for a while. Now you're claiming those reasons for yourself. You completely agreed with Ashersky on all of that reasoning?
I felt I had a lot more to learn by investigating Durden than from investigating Dent. I already had a pretty strong scum read on you, as expressed in my very first post today, BEFORE you counterclaimed. Of course after the investigation I was only sure of Durden until you counterclaimed.
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
This cannot possibly be relevant to anyone else here. It is unverifiable, why are you even asking? You'll claim that I'm lying and it will be your word against mine like it already is.
Also known as you don't know the right answer.
What? I don't understand this. If I were scum, I could fake something and maybe it would be the right wording and maybe it wouldn't, but the point is that nobody would know or be able to verify (aside from you in our hypothetical). So it's meaningless to post the exact wording. Unless you are trying to get me modkilled? I don't know what Grujah's take on quoting mod-supplied info is but it's not even worth risking when the town literally cannot know whether I'm telling the truth or not.
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
This cannot possibly be relevant to anyone else here. It is unverifiable, why are you even asking? You'll claim that I'm lying and it will be your word against mine like it already is.
Also known as you don't know the right answer.
What? I don't understand this. If I were scum, I could fake something and maybe it would be the right wording and maybe it wouldn't, but the point is that nobody would know or be able to verify (aside from you in our hypothetical). So it's meaningless to post the exact wording. Unless you are trying to get me modkilled? I don't know what Grujah's take on quoting mod-supplied info is but it's not even worth risking when the town literally cannot know whether I'm telling the truth or not.
Wrong again. Even if I was lying, as you argue, the real cop could catch you in the lie. You are caught in this.
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
This cannot possibly be relevant to anyone else here. It is unverifiable, why are you even asking? You'll claim that I'm lying and it will be your word against mine like it already is.
Also known as you don't know the right answer.
What? I don't understand this. If I were scum, I could fake something and maybe it would be the right wording and maybe it wouldn't, but the point is that nobody would know or be able to verify (aside from you in our hypothetical). So it's meaningless to post the exact wording. Unless you are trying to get me modkilled? I don't know what Grujah's take on quoting mod-supplied info is but it's not even worth risking when the town literally cannot know whether I'm telling the truth or not.
Wrong again. Even if I was lying, as you argue, the real cop could catch you in the lie. You are caught in this.
I AM THE REAL COP. How does what you're saying even make sense? You ARE lying, but it doesn't make sense for me to catch myself in a lie. From what I understand of the setup, the three remaining town players are VTs. No other cops to prove me wrong or right. You are really, really reaching here.
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You are lying. I am the real cop.
The rest of my townies, you decide.
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This is a great mafia ploy, I realize. Finger your own partner, wait for real cop to counter claim, then your partner will side with real cop, so if he's lynched it looks even worse for the real cop. Well-done.
Except if town believes me, the real cop. Still, amazing gambit. With MYLO, you can press to lynch me by calling me a liar, or wait to lynch your partner, then lynch me tomorrow because it seems like you told the truth all along.
But you are lying. And you confirmed Zaphod based on what you claim to be the word of a liar. You know Zaphod is town, though, without investigating, because you are mafia.
um
this ploy is dumb at mylo
you don't finger your partner, you finger an innocent
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This is a great mafia ploy, I realize. Finger your own partner, wait for real cop to counter claim, then your partner will side with real cop, so if he's lynched it looks even worse for the real cop. Well-done.
Except if town believes me, the real cop. Still, amazing gambit. With MYLO, you can press to lynch me by calling me a liar, or wait to lynch your partner, then lynch me tomorrow because it seems like you told the truth all along.
But you are lying. And you confirmed Zaphod based on what you claim to be the word of a liar. You know Zaphod is town, though, without investigating, because you are mafia.
um
this ploy is dumb at mylo
you don't finger your partner, you finger an innocent
Which head are you?
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god damn it
it's me
this hydra thing is breaking down today
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At least we're all playing now.
Why do I have the sinking feeling we're headed down yet another "town loses because they lynched ash on the last day" scenario. It seems like every game lately. Do I just come across as an evil person?
I am the honest town cop here. It should be clear from D3 posts.
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
This cannot possibly be relevant to anyone else here. It is unverifiable, why are you even asking? You'll claim that I'm lying and it will be your word against mine like it already is.
Also known as you don't know the right answer.
What? I don't understand this. If I were scum, I could fake something and maybe it would be the right wording and maybe it wouldn't, but the point is that nobody would know or be able to verify (aside from you in our hypothetical). So it's meaningless to post the exact wording. Unless you are trying to get me modkilled? I don't know what Grujah's take on quoting mod-supplied info is but it's not even worth risking when the town literally cannot know whether I'm telling the truth or not.
Wrong again. Even if I was lying, as you argue, the real cop could catch you in the lie. You are caught in this.
I AM THE REAL COP. How does what you're saying even make sense? You ARE lying, but it doesn't make sense for me to catch myself in a lie. From what I understand of the setup, the three remaining town players are VTs. No other cops to prove me wrong or right. You are really, really reaching here.
Ask yourselfs: is the outrage of a real Cop whose pitting against a fakeclaim, or an overly-emphasized piece of acting that''s really just thinly veiled satire?
Note the excessive use of capitalization and other forms of emphasis, while maintaining perfect grammatical form. Also note that Dsell does not behave like this as town or scum in normal circumstances, so it's probably the other head reacting to pressure.
Ashersky's claim that they're doing double-scum gambit makes no sense: they never would lynch the alleged investigation if there was a counterclaim (unless both claimed to return scum on the same person).
Finally note that Ashersky was the first to ask whether cop should claim. This is either setting up for a fakeclaim early or feeling out honest answers to the correct path, depending on your point of view. Then, if I read correctly, Duduo CLAIMED WITHOUT ACTUALLY HAVING SAID CONVERSATION ON WHETHER TO CLAIM OR NOT.
What SHOULD have happened is this: We should have went person by person and announced our results like this: "IF I am the cop, THEN player X is [guilty/innocent]"
The downside would be that certain people who confirmed scum as innocent in their anouncments are confirmed VT to scum (probability says one person roughly would do this).
The bright side is that the cop can possibly hide: They only must claim if they or the person they investigated was innocent.
At this point I realize duduo claimed to have a guilty result, so this actually is moot because you almost certainly want to claim if you have a guilty result.
But the lack of discussion in Duduo's rush to first-claim and the overdone emphasis of exasperation on the quote are the best case I can provide given I lurked through most of this game.
This is most likely because they felt that the first person to claim is naturally more believable than the second.
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Last line is out of place, should be much higher, ah well.
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the problem is that i don't understand why you immediately jump to "doduo is fingering his partner!" and not "doduo is attacking an innocent" which was way more likely
answer: you know durden is scum, he's your partner
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because ashersky's a hothead who doesn't immediately understand the impliciations of MYLO.
Sakon and ukon is poorly positioning himself for tomorrow when duduo flips scum. I suspect scum will be going all out today (no bussing).
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the problem is that i don't understand why you immediately jump to "doduo is fingering his partner!" and not "doduo is attacking an innocent" which was way more likely
answer: you know durden is scum, he's your partner
I jumped to it because the gambit plan sounded best. I laid out how I saw it playing out from their perspective. Also, they chose not to NK, or forgot. I can conceive of no good reason for that, at all. If they're capable of that gambit, they are capable of the plan I laid out.
Also, if I know Durden is scum and he's my partner, as you posit, why fake claim at all? Why not bus? Why not just play along as VT? If my claim were fake, it would be a horrible gambit. Worse that Doduo's, for sure.
O lays it out best for us, obviously. Mislynch us today and town is in horrible shape tomorrow.
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O lays it out best for us, obviously. Mislynch us today and town is in horrible shape tomorrow.
if you're a mislynch, there is no tomorrow
i'm pretty convinced here, gonna wait for my other head to weigh in
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Getting caught up now.
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First reaction on reading both copclaims, without reading anything else afterwards:
1. If Doduo is the Cop, then both Dent and Durden are the scum.
2. That means that, immediately upon Doduo claiming that Durden is confirmed scum, then Dent - not Durden - put himself in an "either/or" situation with Doduo.
3. Durden was on at the time. If Durden/Dent were scum, there was no urgent need for Dent to counterclaim. Durden could do it.
Either Doduo is scum, or this is an excessively complicated plot cooked up by the four players behind Durden and Dent to (1) inexplicably no-kill, (2) discuss whether a Cop should claim in the opening posts to entice the Cop into claiming, and then (3) counterclaim to win via mislynch.
Reading the rest now to figure out whether this is the simple story (Doduo = scum) or the complicated story (Durden/Dent master plan).
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#425, by Dent, makes no sense because it starts from a false premise. It assumes we will lynch Durden. Why would we lynch Durden? We know either Dent or Doduo is scum. Why wouldn't we lynch one of them?
Point towards the "Dent/Durden master plan" theory, because Dent describes a master plan that isn't the one mafia would have made.
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#426, by Durden, is flawed.
Vote: Doduo
Because he's lying scum. Here's what proves it; his theory that Dent counterclaimed to not deal with a confirmed townie and an investigation on his 'partner' is insane. Let's run through the hypothetical that Doduo wants everyone to buy. He's the real cop, and investigated Tyler Durden as mafia. THEN scumpartnerDent counterclaims, trying to gain credit by saying Zaphod is town. If people still end up believing Duduo, then Dent just served town the second mafiaplayer (himself) for no effin' reason.
There IS a reason for scum-Dent to counterclaim in this way: to make town less likely to believe Doduo. Sure, if the town believes Doduo, then the entire scumteam just outed themselves. BUT, Dent's counterclaim - backed by the argument "scum would never DO that" - makes it that much less likely the town WILL believe Doduo. And if they don't believe Doduo, they lynch Doduo - and if Dent/Durden are scum, that wins them the game.
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There has to be a reason scum failed to nightkill. Both Dent and Doduo were on right after deadline, and one of them is scum. I do not believe at all that scum, whoever they are, simply missed the deadline to nightkill.
The question is: does our being at MyLo instead of LyLo better support Doduo's supposed scumgambit, or Dent's supposed scumgambit?
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#426, by Durden, is flawed.
Vote: Doduo
Because he's lying scum. Here's what proves it; his theory that Dent counterclaimed to not deal with a confirmed townie and an investigation on his 'partner' is insane. Let's run through the hypothetical that Doduo wants everyone to buy. He's the real cop, and investigated Tyler Durden as mafia. THEN scumpartnerDent counterclaims, trying to gain credit by saying Zaphod is town. If people still end up believing Duduo, then Dent just served town the second mafiaplayer (himself) for no effin' reason.
There IS a reason for scum-Dent to counterclaim in this way: to make town less likely to believe Doduo. Sure, if the town believes Doduo, then the entire scumteam just outed themselves. BUT, Dent's counterclaim - backed by the argument "scum would never DO that" - makes it that much less likely the town WILL believe Doduo. And if they don't believe Doduo, they lynch Doduo - and if Dent/Durden are scum, that wins them the game.
This is correct, Durden/Dent are going for the win by having Dent counterclaim. It makes 2 vs 1 rather than 1 vs 1. If one of them is lynched and we see the flip, they'll lose, but like I've said they only need to woo one townie to their side to stay alive today and then face a WIFOM battle tonight with who they kill. Either that or Ashersky made a quick judgment and didn't want to let me get away with a cop claim uncountered. Possible that Durden would have counterclaimed if his partner didn't.
And there was no reason to delay posting my cop result. I fail to see the merits of having everyone who's not a cop make up fake cop investigations, that only seems to add confusion.
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Jekyll is seeing what I did last night, but choose not to post because I didn't want to lead without personal contributions from the innocent.
First:
Dent countered less than 10 minutes after Durden was fingered. This is so unnatural a play that my initial reaction is that Dent is telling the truth. He didn't even give Durden the time to fake it, or step up, etc. He simply stepped forward and counter-claimed.
Second:
Scum intentionally no-killed last night. Dent (I believe?) Suggested they simply missed the deadline. While possible, it's very unlikely given all three of the heads in question were around before we unlocked. Scum wouldn't need to go through the hassle of switching accounts to post in their QT a night kill.
Third:
Dent's arguments about "lynching the real cop first, then lynching the fake for sure D4" is ridiculous. My very opening post D3 explained that we were in MyLo. If we lynch the real cop today, it's game over. His missing this is a rather glaring oversight.
Fourth:
Dsell/Insomniac are Doduo. Certainly possible for them to be behind an elaborate no-kill, fake-claim plot. Ashersky/O are Dent. Given Asherky's oversight (intentional or not) above, I have a hard time seeing HIM being behind such an immediate counterclaim. O could handle it and the Gambit and WIFOM after, but it's not Ashersky's style. In the respect, I've got to believe that O was online, on Dent's account, AND active, AND cooked it all up, all in ~10 minute window. That's not impossible, but O is so rarely around (forums in general. He's busy irl, and he lurks his games because of that) that it's a stretch to think all that was true.
Fifth:
Dent, as irrelevant as it may be (and I agree with you here), would you mind providing the investigative wording? You've written two or three paragraphs explaining why it makes no sense, instead of just giving us the results, pointless though it may be.
Conclusion:
I don't know. I don't like that Doduo didn't wait for others to chime in or discuss the no-kill night. Additionally, the odds of an investigation hitting scum are less than one hitting town. Dent's immediate counter-claim didn't feel forced either. If he's scum, and Durden is scum, this wasn't a win/lose scenario for them - but he single handedly made it one. Additionally, common knowledge is to "lynch the counter-claim first" - this could explain scum!Doduo jumping the gun, since if we mislynch the Cop they win.
However, many, many of Dent's posts since then have felt a little "off", whereas Doduo has felt a little more "in the right".
I would probably lean towards lynching Doduo here. There's reasons for me to feel otherwise, and as always I stand conflicted at mylo/lylo, but given the situation the game was in when the claimed, it makesmuch more sense to me for Doduo's claim to be an attempted scum gambit than for Dent's, especially given who's in charge of Dent's head.
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ashersky/Dent, why did you hammer Smeagol? You say it wasn't O/Dent, which would be in character for O. So why did you, ashersky/Dent, do it?
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Doduo, what was the result on Durden? The wording.
Wording discussion not allowed. Now that all this time passed, leave it as ashesrky, be sure to sign who it was actaully, though.
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Jekyll is seeing what I did last night, but choose not to post because I didn't want to lead without personal contributions from the innocent.
First:
Dent countered less than 10 minutes after Durden was fingered. This is so unnatural a play that my initial reaction is that Dent is telling the truth. He didn't even give Durden the time to fake it, or step up, etc. He simply stepped forward and counter-claimed.
I think this is eager scum (I'm assuming Ashersky). They probably had talked about whether to counterclaim in their QT and maybe they had decided that if the cop investigated town, they would not counterclaim and they'd let things play out, but if the cop investigated one of them, they'd counterclaim. I don't know if Durden would have counterclaimed if Dent hadn't, but both ways have their advantages for scum. This way reveals both scum (to me only) but pits both of their claims against mine. If Durden had counterclaimed, Dent would have had to choose between bussing his partner and lynching the cop (and I expect would have gone for me, but he would have had to be more subtle about it). They chose the all-or-nothing gambit. If we lynch Dent (or probably Durden), scum loses, but if they get town to mislynch me, scum wins.
I think that rookie scum Ashersky was excited to try something they'd talked about doing in their scum QT.
Second:
Scum intentionally no-killed last night. Dent (I believe?) Suggested they simply missed the deadline. While possible, it's very unlikely given all three of the heads in question were around before we unlocked. Scum wouldn't need to go through the hassle of switching accounts to post in their QT a night kill.
I don't understand this at all. I actually do believe it's possible that Dent's just fessing up to lurking through the deadline but this seems really improbable to me. More likely is that they thought they were being strategic and that they'd gain some sort of advantage from this, but I believe they're just mistaken. I don't see an advantage at all except for town. I guess just ask yourself if you really think that Insom and myself (Dsell) would really let it go to deadline without submitting a kill. There's no reason to do that.
Third:
Dent's arguments about "lynching the real cop first, then lynching the fake for sure D4" is ridiculous. My very opening post D3 explained that we were in MyLo. If we lynch the real cop today, it's game over. His missing this is a rather glaring oversight.
This is why I will be so frustrated if town winds up mislynching me. These arguments are so BAD. Ashersky is getting extremely zealous for the win here, to the point where O is stepping in and trying to take the reins. This is far from the only bad argument, Ashersky (and maybe O some, too, not sure) is trying to get me to say anything that he can use against me, and he's already trying to twist my words to make me look guilty. But he's failed to produce a single good argument. Dent is a mix of overzealous rookie scum and coaching today, and it's so obvious.
Fourth:
Dsell/Insomniac are Doduo. Certainly possible for them to be behind an elaborate no-kill, fake-claim plot. Ashersky/O are Dent. Given Asherky's oversight (intentional or not) above, I have a hard time seeing HIM being behind such an immediate counterclaim. O could handle it and the Gambit and WIFOM after, but it's not Ashersky's style. In the respect, I've got to believe that O was online, on Dent's account, AND active, AND cooked it all up, all in ~10 minute window. That's not impossible, but O is so rarely around (forums in general. He's busy irl, and he lurks his games because of that) that it's a stretch to think all that was true.
Look at it from my perspective. You are the cop, you've just gotten a scum investigation on Durden, would you do anything differently? I don't think you would. So the question comes down to what the scumpair would do in this situation. We don't know what scumAsher looks like so it's not possible to say for sure, but you know he's gotten some coaching from O and Shraeye and Munch (who's never been mafia, but has been scum) in the QT. I don't think he cooked it up in that 10 minute window though. I think he and Durden were trying to bait the cop a little and then see whether to counterclaim or not. When he saw I'd investigated scum he jumped in with the counter but from there he's been crazy and making bad arguments. I don't think it's fair to say it's not Ashersky's style when a) you've never seen scumAsher and b) he will almost surely have received coaching.
I don't know. I don't like that Doduo didn't wait for others to chime in or discuss the no-kill night. Additionally, the odds of an investigation hitting scum are less than one hitting town. Dent's immediate counter-claim didn't feel forced either. If he's scum, and Durden is scum, this wasn't a win/lose scenario for them - but he single handedly made it one. Additionally, common knowledge is to "lynch the counter-claim first" - this could explain scum!Doduo jumping the gun, since if we mislynch the Cop they win.
However, many, many of Dent's posts since then have felt a little "off", whereas Doduo has felt a little more "in the right".
I would probably lean towards lynching Doduo here. There's reasons for me to feel otherwise, and as always I stand conflicted at mylo/lylo, but given the situation the game was in when the claimed, it makesmuch more sense to me for Doduo's claim to be an attempted scum gambit than for Dent's, especially given who's in charge of Dent's head.
It seems silly to wait to claim. Maybe I'm wrong, I've never been cop before, but I don't see a reason to wait to reveal the scum investigation. If I had a town investigation I probably would have waited and talked about it but it wasn't. Your odds argument makes me cringe. There are 5 other people in the town, 2 are scum and 3 are town. Are our reads so bad that it's a straight-up 40% chance? Even 40% is hardly bad odds.
The posts you claim are "off" are, from my perspective, glaring scum attempts to get town lynched through any means possible. It doesn't hurt Asher that his meta excuses this action to some extent.
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I dont understand why this is even a question. There obviously is a very simple explaination for what is going on. Doduo is scum trying to paint two people as mafia at the same time. To doduo, it doesn't matter if Durden or Dent gets lynched; he wins either way. To buy his story we have to believe this crazy master scheme. Occam's Razor every time.
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i feel like, had we just had the initial claim/counterclaim, i'd be likely to vote doduo. but durden/dent keep posting things like
I dont understand why this is even a question. There obviously is a very simple explaination for what is going on. Doduo is scum trying to paint two people as mafia at the same time. To doduo, it doesn't matter if Durden or Dent gets lynched; he wins either way. To buy his story we have to believe this crazy master scheme. Occam's Razor every time.
doduo's actions had nothing to do with painting dent as mafia; dent's counterclaim did that
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I again realize that I'm very biased here because I know Dent is scum, but his reasons for "investigating" Zaphod feel thrown-together. He says it's "because of D1" where Zaphod reads as scum to him, but it doesn't make much sense to investigate someone on night 2 based on day 1 reads unless very little of note happened in the meantime, and I think quite a bit did. He makes a reference to Smeagol's reads but I don't understand the relevance. Perhaps I need to reread the end of D2 to see what he's talking about but I thought Smeagol was more suspicious of Durden and, at some junctures, myself.
Does this sound to anyone else like Doduo thought the cop could investigate every night, which the true cop would never forget?
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I dont understand why this is even a question. There obviously is a very simple explaination for what is going on. Doduo is scum trying to paint two people as mafia at the same time. To doduo, it doesn't matter if Durden or Dent gets lynched; he wins either way. To buy his story we have to believe this crazy master scheme. Occam's Razor every time.
This is such a fallacy. At the very least, one of us is telling the truth. Why is it any less reasonable for it to be me? No, if you look at the big picture, me being cop makes a lot more sense. Even Dent's reason for investigating Zaphod is not very good. You'll never change your tune, of course, but calling Occam's Razor on this is so ridiculous. It's not some "crazy master scheme," I've just figured out the setup. This happens sometimes. Scum still has the advantage that I'm the only townie who knows the setup for sure.
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I again realize that I'm very biased here because I know Dent is scum, but his reasons for "investigating" Zaphod feel thrown-together. He says it's "because of D1" where Zaphod reads as scum to him, but it doesn't make much sense to investigate someone on night 2 based on day 1 reads unless very little of note happened in the meantime, and I think quite a bit did. He makes a reference to Smeagol's reads but I don't understand the relevance. Perhaps I need to reread the end of D2 to see what he's talking about but I thought Smeagol was more suspicious of Durden and, at some junctures, myself.
Does this sound to anyone else like Doduo thought the cop could investigate every night, which the true cop would never forget?
What? The basis for why they investigated Zaphod was day 1 activity plus a single comment from Smeagol. It seems so thin. Of course we took in our reads from day 1 as well, but day 1 reads are not usually great. Day 2 reads are a lot stronger. That's all I'm saying and your attempts to catch me in a scumslip are increasingly ridiculous.
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is doduo voltgloss?
doduo is voltgloss.
ok.
dammit.
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is doduo voltgloss?
doduo is voltgloss.
ok.
dammit.
Huh? No, doduo is Dsell/Insom. What difference would it make?
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question
why are you playing with invisible mode turned on?
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question
why are you playing with invisible mode turned on?
Insom didn't want mafia to look at who's online and figure out it was us, he has this thing about dying N1... It doesn't matter now since our heads are revealed.
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How do you even turn it off? I just checked and it wasn't where I would have expected it to be. Would people rather it be visible?
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How do you even turn it off? I just checked and it wasn't where I would have expected it to be. Would people rather it be visible?
Oh nvm I found it. Unchecked vs checked box confused me.
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is doduo voltgloss?
doduo is voltgloss.
ok.
dammit.
I'm still curious why us being voltgloss would be so bad? Doduo, Durden, and Dent all headclaimed a page or two ago. And then a couple people have accidentally posted from their regular accounts.
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2 quick things:
Was wrong on MYLO. Agreed that the game ends in a mafia win today if you yech us.
The "you've never seen scum!ashersky argument" is patently ridiculous, as you've all seen scum!ashersky in Sea Hags. So further scum points for Doduo for pushing a lie.
Go read my PR claim in MX. This is that, where I have to fight tooth and nail to prove myself.
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Durden, who do you think the scum are?
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Also, Doduo, go back and read ZM3, where I was the cop, for an example of how I would've handled my investigation. As Insomniac is one of your heads, FoS you for suggesting I would do things anything like you did.
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2 quick things:
Was wrong on MYLO. Agreed that the game ends in a mafia win today if you yech us.
The "you've never seen scum!ashersky argument" is patently ridiculous, as you've all seen scum!ashersky in Sea Hags. So further scum points for Doduo for pushing a lie.
Go read my PR claim in MX. This is that, where I have to fight tooth and nail to prove myself.
Oh. I (Dsell) didn't follow that game very closely, not closely enough to know that Ashersky was mafia. Sorry about that misstatement.
@Zaphod, that situation was different because you were confirmed cop. If I had come out with something similar, I don't think it would have flown as well because there was no guarantee that I was cop and I might be accused of waiting to accuse the weakest person or waiting to be counterclaimed or something. It's possible that would have worked though, I confess I wasn't thinking about ZM3 when I made the claim.
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i feel like, had we just had the initial claim/counterclaim, i'd be likely to vote doduo. but durden/dent keep posting things like
I dont understand why this is even a question. There obviously is a very simple explaination for what is going on. Doduo is scum trying to paint two people as mafia at the same time. To doduo, it doesn't matter if Durden or Dent gets lynched; he wins either way. To buy his story we have to believe this crazy master scheme. Occam's Razor every time.
doduo's actions had nothing to do with painting dent as mafia; dent's counterclaim did that
But when scumdoduo claimed cop, he knew he was going to be counterclaimed. Doduo has also claimed that we were his investigation (even though we were his second scumread) because he also "knew" Dent was mafia already.
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i feel like, had we just had the initial claim/counterclaim, i'd be likely to vote doduo. but durden/dent keep posting things like
I dont understand why this is even a question. There obviously is a very simple explaination for what is going on. Doduo is scum trying to paint two people as mafia at the same time. To doduo, it doesn't matter if Durden or Dent gets lynched; he wins either way. To buy his story we have to believe this crazy master scheme. Occam's Razor every time.
doduo's actions had nothing to do with painting dent as mafia; dent's counterclaim did that
But when scumdoduo claimed cop, he knew he was going to be counterclaimed. Doduo has also claimed that we were his investigation (even though we were his second scumread) because he also "knew" Dent was mafia already.
I didn't say I "knew" already, I said he was our biggest scumread and you were our biggest question mark. We had the most to gain from investigating you.
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Durden, who do you think the scum are?
Either S/U or Dr. Jekyll obviously. Right now I have no idea which way it falls. I'm going to do research on their interactions with Doduo throughout the game, and see if I can find out who it is.
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i feel like, had we just had the initial claim/counterclaim, i'd be likely to vote doduo. but durden/dent keep posting things like
doduo's actions had nothing to do with painting dent as mafia; dent's counterclaim did that
But when scumdoduo claimed cop, he knew he was going to be counterclaimed. Doduo has also claimed that we were his investigation (even though we were his second scumread) because he also "knew" Dent was mafia already.
but, tyler
if he's mafia, he didn't "know" you weren't the cop
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is doduo voltgloss?
doduo is voltgloss.
ok.
dammit.
I'm still curious why us being voltgloss would be so bad? Doduo, Durden, and Dent all headclaimed a page or two ago. And then a couple people have accidentally posted from their regular accounts.
it would be bad because you're playing very similarly to sk-volt at the end of MIX
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is doduo voltgloss?
doduo is voltgloss.
ok.
dammit.
I'm still curious why us being voltgloss would be so bad? Doduo, Durden, and Dent all headclaimed a page or two ago. And then a couple people have accidentally posted from their regular accounts.
it would be bad because you're playing very similarly to sk-volt at the end of MIX
Huh, I didn't follow most of that game very closely either.
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is doduo voltgloss?
doduo is voltgloss.
ok.
dammit.
I'm still curious why us being voltgloss would be so bad? Doduo, Durden, and Dent all headclaimed a page or two ago. And then a couple people have accidentally posted from their regular accounts.
it would be bad because you're playing very similarly to sk-volt at the end of MIX
Dr. Jekyll has Volt, if I'm not mistaken.
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Fourth:
Dsell/Insomniac are Doduo. Certainly possible for them to be behind an elaborate no-kill, fake-claim plot. Ashersky/O are Dent. Given Asherky's oversight (intentional or not) above, I have a hard time seeing HIM being behind such an immediate counterclaim. O could handle it and the Gambit and WIFOM after, but it's not Ashersky's style. In the respect, I've got to believe that O was online, on Dent's account, AND active, AND cooked it all up, all in ~10 minute window. That's not impossible, but O is so rarely around (forums in general. He's busy irl, and he lurks his games because of that) that it's a stretch to think all that was true.
Ashersky counterclaimed. I think I would have done it in the same timely manner.
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Wow. Absolutely insane that there was no night kill, that's an incredible lucky break that I don't quite understand.
But...we have good news! I am the cop. Tyler Durden is mafia.
I would tend to suspect Dent the most after that, but nothing like a modconfirmation.
Vote: Tyler Durden
O's arguments cont.
If Duduo was the real cop, the clearly best strategy here is to announce that you're the cop, WAIT FOR COUNTERCLAIMS, then announce your investigation. Why? Because it requires scum to choose whether to counterclaim based on incomplete information: they might not counterclaim hoping you investigated town, and then you reveal your scum-result as confirmed cop and there's no WIFOM.
But as Ashersky proves illogical play is not scum play (WE ARE AT MYLO ASHERSKY. THATS ONE MISSLYNCH TO LOSE. YOUR CONSPIRACIES MAKE NO SENSE.)
Awkward moment where I almost type ONE MISSLYNCH TO WIN... that would have been rather awful, though it would have proven to you guys that scumslips mean little.
Why Durden can still be scum:
Duduo fakes guilty result on townie: Townie knows he is fakeclaiming cop. When duduo is counterclaimed that leaves his scum partner whose going to go for the counterclaimant but forces a townie to go against him.
Duduo fakes guilty result on scum: scum can still switch over to hammer the counterclaimant at the end, but now there's no townies that are assured to vote Duduo.
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Well I've never been cop before. In this thread, scum lectures the cop on how best to claim cop. AT THE TIME it seemed like the best approach was to just come out with it. Maybe if I'd thought of doing it another way, I would have. That way of doing it seems vaguely unbelievable, but I'm not sure. (If scum does counterclaim in that situation, I may be accused of reporting my result based on who they claimed to have reported.) At this point, at mylo, it's imperative that the town doesn't lynch me so I just have wanted to be as forthright and transparent about everything as possible. I cannot prove my towniness any other way.
It's amusing that O is coming out to fight now after Ashersky bungled the attempts to make me look like scum.
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Well I've never been cop before. In this thread, scum lectures the cop on how best to claim cop. AT THE TIME it seemed like the best approach was to just come out with it. Maybe if I'd thought of doing it another way, I would have. That way of doing it seems vaguely unbelievable, but I'm not sure. (If scum does counterclaim in that situation, I may be accused of reporting my result based on who they claimed to have reported.) At this point, at mylo, it's imperative that the town doesn't lynch me so I just have wanted to be as forthright and transparent about everything as possible. I cannot prove my towniness any other way.
It's amusing that O is coming out to fight now after Ashersky bungled the attempts to make me look like scum.
I don't like being miss-lynched. It's a common theme throughout the games.
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AsherDent still hasn't answered (I don't believe) for why he quickhammered Smeagol yesterday. I honestly think it was a miscalculation and Asher thought he was quickhammering for the win.
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AsherDent still hasn't answered (I don't believe) for why he quickhammered Smeagol yesterday. I honestly think it was a miscalculation and Asher thought he was quickhammering for the win.
I did answer, insofar as to say it was definitely not quickhammer for the win. If there was a miscalculation there (no idea how that would happen), explain the NK? I still thought I had won so I didn't need to? Insane.
Smeagol was scummy, the wagon say for awhile, and wagons that get going but never seem to finish do turn out to be scumwagons often enough. Smeagol wasn't townish, enough folks had a scumread, the flip was informative, AND it got this game moving to a place where now we (the town) can win this.
"Thought he quickhammered for the win" is a ridiculous argument.
On a side note, can someone tell me what the Y and the O in MYLO stand for? I get "mislynch" for M and "lose" for L.
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I'm not suggesting that you thought you had won and were celebrating in the QT instead of sending a kill order or something. But you've demonstrated that you don't have a strong concept of how many players are in the game/at what point teams win or lose. If you did think you were quickhammering for the win, obviously you would have figured out your mistake pretty quickly and at the latest when Grujah gave the flip.
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Jekyll is seeing what I did last night, but choose not to post because I didn't want to lead without personal contributions from the innocent.
First:
Dent countered less than 10 minutes after Durden was fingered. This is so unnatural a play that my initial reaction is that Dent is telling the truth. He didn't even give Durden the time to fake it, or step up, etc. He simply stepped forward and counter-claimed.
I think this is eager scum (I'm assuming Ashersky). They probably had talked about whether to counterclaim in their QT and maybe they had decided that if the cop investigated town, they would not counterclaim and they'd let things play out, but if the cop investigated one of them, they'd counterclaim. I don't know if Durden would have counterclaimed if Dent hadn't, but both ways have their advantages for scum. This way reveals both scum (to me only) but pits both of their claims against mine. If Durden had counterclaimed, Dent would have had to choose between bussing his partner and lynching the cop (and I expect would have gone for me, but he would have had to be more subtle about it). They chose the all-or-nothing gambit. If we lynch Dent (or probably Durden), scum loses, but if they get town to mislynch me, scum wins.
I think that rookie scum Ashersky was excited to try something they'd talked about doing in their scum QT.
This reads to me more like doduo is the one that has spent a long time in quick topic fleshing this argument out. If Doduo is actually the real cop, it strikes me as very odd if he had spent the night thinking through all of the ways and reasons for scum to counterclaim cop
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Jekyll is seeing what I did last night, but choose not to post because I didn't want to lead without personal contributions from the innocent.
First:
Dent countered less than 10 minutes after Durden was fingered. This is so unnatural a play that my initial reaction is that Dent is telling the truth. He didn't even give Durden the time to fake it, or step up, etc. He simply stepped forward and counter-claimed.
I think this is eager scum (I'm assuming Ashersky). They probably had talked about whether to counterclaim in their QT and maybe they had decided that if the cop investigated town, they would not counterclaim and they'd let things play out, but if the cop investigated one of them, they'd counterclaim. I don't know if Durden would have counterclaimed if Dent hadn't, but both ways have their advantages for scum. This way reveals both scum (to me only) but pits both of their claims against mine. If Durden had counterclaimed, Dent would have had to choose between bussing his partner and lynching the cop (and I expect would have gone for me, but he would have had to be more subtle about it). They chose the all-or-nothing gambit. If we lynch Dent (or probably Durden), scum loses, but if they get town to mislynch me, scum wins.
I think that rookie scum Ashersky was excited to try something they'd talked about doing in their scum QT.
This reads to me more like doduo is the one that has spent a long time in quick topic fleshing this argument out. If Doduo is actually the real cop, it strikes me as very odd if he had spent the night thinking through all of the ways and reasons for scum to counterclaim cop
This doesn't take a whooole lot of thinking. There are only so many options. One of you virtually has to counterclaim if I investigated one of you, but if I investigated town it would be reasonable to hold off and let things play out. There's no way to know now, but it would make sense that you two would try to feel out cop conversation without actually claiming if that were the case.
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Sakon has strongly read Dent to be scum the entire game. While this cop claim business confuses the issue I'd like to hear Dent's explanation of appearing scumball all game.
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Sakon has strongly read Dent to be scum the entire game. While this cop claim business confuses the issue I'd like to hear Dent's explanation of appearing scumball all game.
That's just me, it seems. See: every other game ever. I'm not mafia.
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AsherDent still hasn't answered (I don't believe) for why he quickhammered Smeagol yesterday. I honestly think it was a miscalculation and Asher thought he was quickhammering for the win.
I did answer, insofar as to say it was definitely not quickhammer for the win. If there was a miscalculation there (no idea how that would happen), explain the NK? I still thought I had won so I didn't need to? Insane.
Smeagol was scummy, the wagon say for awhile, and wagons that get going but never seem to finish do turn out to be scumwagons often enough. Smeagol wasn't townish, enough folks had a scumread, the flip was informative, AND it got this game moving to a place where now we (the town) can win this.
"Thought he quickhammered for the win" is a ridiculous argument.
This answer is missing something very important.
The reason why the quickhammer on Smeagol was problematic was that it was delivered before Smeagol had a chance to claim.
Dent claims he's the Cop. That means he has a ready-made explanation for why he wasn't worried about quickhammering: "I, being the only other town power role, knew with absolute certainty that Smeagol was either a VT or scum."
That's an argument that would occur only to the Cop, of course.
Dent hasn't made that argument.
This leads me to conclude that Dent is, more likely than not, not the Cop.
What is the votecount?
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What is the votecount?
I believe:
Doduo - 2 - Harvey Dent, Tyler Durden
Harvey Dent - 1 - Doduo
Not voting - Everyone else.
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AsherDent still hasn't answered (I don't believe) for why he quickhammered Smeagol yesterday. I honestly think it was a miscalculation and Asher thought he was quickhammering for the win.
I did answer, insofar as to say it was definitely not quickhammer for the win. If there was a miscalculation there (no idea how that would happen), explain the NK? I still thought I had won so I didn't need to? Insane.
Smeagol was scummy, the wagon say for awhile, and wagons that get going but never seem to finish do turn out to be scumwagons often enough. Smeagol wasn't townish, enough folks had a scumread, the flip was informative, AND it got this game moving to a place where now we (the town) can win this.
"Thought he quickhammered for the win" is a ridiculous argument.
This answer is missing something very important.
The reason why the quickhammer on Smeagol was problematic was that it was delivered before Smeagol had a chance to claim.
Dent claims he's the Cop. That means he has a ready-made explanation for why he wasn't worried about quickhammering: "I, being the only other town power role, knew with absolute certainty that Smeagol was either a VT or scum."
That's an argument that would occur only to the Cop, of course.
Dent hasn't made that argument.
This leads me to conclude that Dent is, more likely than not, not the Cop.
What is the votecount?
Your basically saying "eh, he's at worst a VT" is a good reason for hammering. I disagree. Scum points for you.
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AsherDent still hasn't answered (I don't believe) for why he quickhammered Smeagol yesterday. I honestly think it was a miscalculation and Asher thought he was quickhammering for the win.
I did answer, insofar as to say it was definitely not quickhammer for the win. If there was a miscalculation there (no idea how that would happen), explain the NK? I still thought I had won so I didn't need to? Insane.
Smeagol was scummy, the wagon say for awhile, and wagons that get going but never seem to finish do turn out to be scumwagons often enough. Smeagol wasn't townish, enough folks had a scumread, the flip was informative, AND it got this game moving to a place where now we (the town) can win this.
"Thought he quickhammered for the win" is a ridiculous argument.
This answer is missing something very important.
The reason why the quickhammer on Smeagol was problematic was that it was delivered before Smeagol had a chance to claim.
Dent claims he's the Cop. That means he has a ready-made explanation for why he wasn't worried about quickhammering: "I, being the only other town power role, knew with absolute certainty that Smeagol was either a VT or scum."
That's an argument that would occur only to the Cop, of course.
Dent hasn't made that argument.
This leads me to conclude that Dent is, more likely than not, not the Cop.
What is the votecount?
Your basically saying "eh, he's at worst a VT" is a good reason for hammering. I disagree. Scum points for you.
No, that's not what I'm saying at all. How about you quote me where I supposedly say that, as opposed to making up your own version of what I'm saying.
You have completely ignored the argument. Why did you ignore it? I think I know: Because you have no answer to it.
My doubts are gone.
Vote: Harvey Dent
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AsherDent still hasn't answered (I don't believe) for why he quickhammered Smeagol yesterday. I honestly think it was a miscalculation and Asher thought he was quickhammering for the win.
I did answer, insofar as to say it was definitely not quickhammer for the win. If there was a miscalculation there (no idea how that would happen), explain the NK? I still thought I had won so I didn't need to? Insane.
Smeagol was scummy, the wagon say for awhile, and wagons that get going but never seem to finish do turn out to be scumwagons often enough. Smeagol wasn't townish, enough folks had a scumread, the flip was informative, AND it got this game moving to a place where now we (the town) can win this.
"Thought he quickhammered for the win" is a ridiculous argument.
This answer is missing something very important.
The reason why the quickhammer on Smeagol was problematic was that it was delivered before Smeagol had a chance to claim.
Dent claims he's the Cop. That means he has a ready-made explanation for why he wasn't worried about quickhammering: "I, being the only other town power role, knew with absolute certainty that Smeagol was either a VT or scum."
That's an argument that would occur only to the Cop, of course.
Dent hasn't made that argument.
This leads me to conclude that Dent is, more likely than not, not the Cop.
What is the votecount?
Your basically saying "eh, he's at worst a VT" is a good reason for hammering. I disagree. Scum points for you.
No, that's not what I'm saying at all. How about you quote me where I supposedly say that, as opposed to making up your own version of what I'm saying.
You have completely ignored the argument. Why did you ignore it? I think I know: Because you have no answer to it.
My doubts are gone.
Vote: Harvey Dent
Enjoy being wrong. I'll refer back to my argument in RMM3--I should try to lynch myself on D1 of every game, because if town CAN lose by lynching me, town will.
Amazing.
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Enjoy being wrong. I'll refer back to my argument in RMM3--I should try to lynch myself on D1 of every game, because if town CAN lose by lynching me, town will.
Amazing.
Unless you're Doduo's partner. Then enjoy the win.
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How many votes to lynch?
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How many votes to lynch?
There are 6 alive, so 4. Currently I believe the votes are:
Doduo (2): Durden, Dent
Dent (2): Doduo, Jekyll
Not Voting: SU, Zaphod
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Durden is individually the scummiest person here. Not a single one of his arguments D3 have been completely accurate. But I don't see lynching him as the best play right now.
If we lynch Dent and he's scum, then Durden is 100% of the time as well.
If we lynch Doduo and he's scum, then Durden is only scum ~75% of the time.
If we lynch Durden and he's scum, then we still have to choose between Dent/Doduo tomorrow.
Regarding Dent/Doduo - Dent's play was much townier in my eyes out of the gate, but his posts since then have been terribly scummy. Doduo's play out of the gates read like opportunistic, eager scum - but he's actually sounded a lot more confident in what his claimed role is than Dent since then.
I could honestly go either way. S&U, what do you think?
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Sakon suspects Dent the most. The progression of wagon formatipn appears carefully planned and the WIFOM runs deep. That Dent considers Zaphod IC makes me question every angle and unsure throughout.
Sakon feels like there is a 50/50 tossup if Zaphod is town otherwise this is an ingenius trap. Sakon intends to reread Zaphod and consult with Ukon before taking a position.
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I think you've misunderstood why I MUST be town:
Doduo claimed Cop.
Doduo claimed Durden is scum.
Dent counterclaimed Cop.
If Doduo is town, then Dent/Durden ARE both Mafia.
If Doduo is scum, then Dent is the Cop.
Dent claimed Cop.
Dent claimed to investigate me and found I'm town.
So:
If Doduo is the Cop, I'm town.
If Dent is the Cop, I'm town.
There is no scenario where I could be anything else.
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Sakon suspects Dent the most. The progression of wagon formatipn appears carefully planned and the WIFOM runs deep. That Dent considers Zaphod IC makes me question every angle and unsure throughout.
Sakon feels like there is a 50/50 tossup if Zaphod is town otherwise this is an ingenius trap. Sakon intends to reread Zaphod and consult with Ukon before taking a position.
Sakon, there is no possible way Zaphod can be scum. Not from reads, but from logic. Consider:
1. Both Dent and Doduo have claimed Cop, and no third party has counterclaimed them. This means exactly one of them is telling the truth (town Cop) and the other is lying (scum).
2. If Dent is telling the truth, then he is the town Cop with a town-investigation read on Zaphod. That means Zaphod is town.
3. If Doduo is telling the truth, then he is the town Cop with a scum-investigation read on Durden. That means Durden and Dent are scum, which means everyone else (including Zaphod) is town.
So Zaphod is, by virtue of Dent/Doduo's competing claims, an IC now.
PPE: ninja'd by the man himself.
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Zaphod: why do you think the mafia no-killed?
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It's really weird.
I think it was an intentional play. All 3 heads in question (Durden/Dent/Doduo - henceforth Dł) were online at the time Grujah unlocked. None of Dł heads would've needed to change accounts to perform the kill - that can be entered in the Mafia QT, so it's not like it's some huge hassle.
Here's why I see Doduo doing it: He's planning on opening the day with a fakeclaim. He knows he'll be counterclaimed. He knows this will result in his lynch, or the Cop's. The more town that are alive, the harder it is to reach a consensus and the more people he has the opportunity to try and convince. If his partner (who is an unknown) doesn't bus him it takes all 4 townies to choose the right claim. If they NK, the situation is the same but it only takes 3 voices to stand together.
From Dent's perspective: He and Durden decide to go the fakeclaim route. They know Dent derphammered yesterday and they know Dent will be on the chopping block over it today. So by planning to claim they can at least force a 50/50 chance to win outright. If they NK and kill the cop, they lose this opportunity and it likely goes to Lylo with Durden and two town. So the question then was, if this is the route they wanted to go, what should they claim? Claiming a town result on a scum partner is dangerous, since if you get lynched anyway it results in a possible 1-2 lynch. Claiming a town result on a town though works well though since it gains you town cred with said townie, and even if you're lynched, it then casts suspicion on that townie, still allowing your scumbuddy the chance to win. There's also the scum result on scum claim (which is what I think Doduo would be doing here if he's the liar), or scum result on town (good way to make an enemy).
In both cases, the scum team would be planning on forcing a lynch today by fake claiming. This makes having more people alive advantageous since it's harder to lynch correctly.
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Personally, I think I want to lynch Dent. It's really close though. But every time I go back and read the events, I see this:
Durden/Dent thought that Dent was the obvious choice for Investigation last night after that hammer. They decide he's going to claim Cop,
They opened the day asking if the Cop should claim.
Before anybody could reasons, Doduo claimed Durden was scum.
Ashersky went "Oh shit, I need to claim"
Ashersky made some pretty bad arguments about mislynching.
O took over and started admonishing Ashersky for being hotheaded, since the whole point to the fake claim was to hide the second scum AND give scum a way to win straight out. Now if they failed to win today, they failed to win period..
The internal struggle between heads on Dent is what really tips it for me. It sounded like they planned to claim first, forcing the real Cop to counter - but when Doduo jumped out and claimed, Ashersky made a snap decision without thinking about the consequences. O got angry at him (probably rightfully so if this is indeed an accurate storyline).
For me personally, the biggest thing I don't like about Dent's posts overall was his lack of offering up his role as a reason to hammer Smeagol. I'm not saying lynching town is ever good - but when asked "Why didn't you wait for him to claim", as the Cop your answer should be pretty straight forward "Because I knew he couldn't be the only PR left, so there was nothing for him to claim". Dent never offered that, and that, to me, would've been the only acceptable town reason to "derphammer".
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All of this is assuming Town has a cop and Dent/Doduo are not a scum pair.
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Durden is individually the scummiest person here. Not a single one of his arguments D3 have been completely accurate. But I don't see lynching him as the best play right now.
If we lynch Dent and he's scum, then Durden is 100% of the time as well.
If we lynch Doduo and he's scum, then Durden is only scum ~75% of the time.
If we lynch Durden and he's scum, then we still have to choose between Dent/Doduo tomorrow.
Regarding Dent/Doduo - Dent's play was much townier in my eyes out of the gate, but his posts since then have been terribly scummy. Doduo's play out of the gates read like opportunistic, eager scum - but he's actually sounded a lot more confident in what his claimed role is than Dent since then.
I could honestly go either way. S&U, what do you think?
zaphod, i'm pretty much in agreement with everything you're saying here.
it's mostly that dent and durden keep making arguments that make no sense.
there's no point in no lynching with a confirmed townie around, i suppose.
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http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alternating_9P
read the setup dude :D
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Setup is Alternating 9P. (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alternating_9P)
We knew when the game began that there was a cop. What ARE you talking about S&U?
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Setup is Alternating 9P. (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alternating_9P)
We knew when the game began that there was a cop. What ARE you talking about S&U?
Directed at S&U #530
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i don't think my other head realized this was an open setup game :o
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There is no conclusive mod post outlining the roles that I could find. I did find the A9 post but no consensus it would be used.
Vote: Dent
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Based on S&U's last 10 posts or so, scum is either Doduo/S&U, in which case Doduo gets MVP for sounding so damn townie, or scum is Dent/Durden, in which case Doduo is MVP for sounding so damn townie.
Vote: Dent
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Thread Locked.
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Harvey Dent has been lynched. He is a Town Cop.
Doduo and Tyler Durden, both Mafia, win the game, flawlessly.
48 hours for final shot at mini-game (you need to guess all the rest) before posting final head/minigame details.
Thread Unlocked.
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;D
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BTW. Mafia forgot to submit last night, and they were pretty pissed at me for not reminding them.
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wd
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BTW. Mafia forgot to submit last night, and they were pretty pissed at me for not reminding them.
Yeah deadline caught up to us in the middle of strategy discussion. When there was no kill we ended up pulling a completely different gambit than planned. (I hope it's ok to be posting on my regular account?)
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man, i was useless
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From our QT: "What do you think of a Durden/Doduo scumteam?"
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The MVP of this head was DSell, I had trouble logging onto the account and driving conversation in a game there wasn't a bunch going on in.
Dsell primarily posted days 1 and 3 and I primarily posted day 2.
Grujah while we were discussing strategy locked the thread after no notice , we DID intend to kill
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Well done mafia, deserved.
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I should just quit forum mafia now, because nobody is ever going to believe anything I say ever again.
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Doduo looks scummy.
Listen to dead town reads! ;)
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trying to compile votes and such for the stats:
Who voted Smeagol and who voted Durden at the end?
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But that was really well played, mafia!
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Well done Mafia!
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Blah. And my 8? 9? 10,000? Game losing streak continues.
Man, and I really was feeling that the Doduo claim was crap out the gates. Disappointing.
Well done Insomniac/Dsell definitely the MVP head no matter how it was going to come down. I didn't so much think that O/Ash were the most scummy things ever, but rather was more won over to your towniness. Durden was scum all the way (until S&U went and started acting all weird), but lynching him would've served no purpose. It didn't help choose the real cop from the fake.
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But that was really well played, mafia!
Thank you! I couldn't believe that things were coming together. My heart started racing so hard when I came home to a locked QT and no kill submitted.
Also it was a terrible choice for me to put invisible mode on (had nothing to do with Insom not wanting to die), and I kept thinking that I needed to change it back but not wanting to change it for fear of someone calling me out.
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But that was really well played, mafia!
Thank you! I couldn't believe that things were coming together. My heart started racing so hard when I came home to a locked QT and no kill submitted.
Also it was a terrible choice for me to put invisible mode on (had nothing to do with Insom not wanting to die), and I kept thinking that I needed to change it back but not wanting to change it for fear of someone calling me out.
It was clever of you to turn it off.
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Gah.
Oh well. Nicely played, scums!
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Munch/Shraeye (If that's who they REALLY ARE for all you minigamers) were actually really pro today. I don't know if it was intentional but their play was so scummy that it was undermining Dent more than Doduo, I think.
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Doduo looks scummy.
Listen to dead town reads! ;)
Shraeye was definitely MVP from our heads. There were 2 main times when I knew for sure that I would have lost this game if it was played in real life. First was when smeagol called the Doduo/Durden scum pair day 2. The second was after thread unlocked with no kill at night and Doduo going off book. Shraeye kept telling me: "Look, we are town. We got called scum falsely by Doduo because we are town. We do nothing but get Doduo lynched because we are town."
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Doduo looks scummy.
Listen to dead town reads! ;)
Shraeye was definitely MVP from our heads. There were 2 main times when I knew for sure that I would have lost this game if it was played in real life. First was when smeagol called the Doduo/Durden scum pair day 2. The second was after thread unlocked with no kill at night and Doduo going off book. Shraeye kept telling me: "Look, we are town. We got called scum falsely by Doduo because we are town. We do nothing but get Doduo lynched because we are town."
Awesome. Yeah going off-book freaked me out too, but you guys reacted perfectly. And you "supported" Dent all day but like I said, I think a lot of what you said helped Doduo's claim as much or more than Dent's.
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Why was Prof Q the Night 1 kill choice?
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Munch/Shraeye (If that's who they REALLY ARE for all you minigamers) were actually really pro today. I don't know if it was intentional but their play was so scummy that it was undermining Dent more than Doduo, I think.
Actually it was moderately intentional to not stop people from going down the line of a dent/durden scumteam. If people thought we were scummy and by association that made dent more scummy we weren't going to try to prove them wrong.
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Why was Prof Q the Night 1 kill choice?
Is the quick topic available to everyone to read? If it is I'll just post the relevant argument.
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And I really thought I had something there with the whole "Dent didn't properly explain why he quickhammered" thing.
Can we add this to the record books as another example of quickhammering NOT being a fine and useful tool for town? ;D
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Smeagol (myself and Axxle) played a thoroughly terrible VT game. I don't even remember if our lynch was scum driven or not, but damn did we deserve it. Lurked ourselves to death. Bad Smeagol.
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Why was Prof Q the Night 1 kill choice?
We actually really didn't discuss the kill much that night. There weren't any PRs that would be active that night anyway. I think we wanted to take out one of the talkier players but maybe not the talkiest.
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Smeagol (myself and Axxle) played a thoroughly terrible VT game. I don't even remember if our lynch was scum driven or not, but damn did we deserve it. Lurked ourselves to death. Bad Smeagol.
Think you had one scum on, one scum off? Classic apportionment? (he said without bothering to check)
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Damn, I was certain Dent was scum.
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Smeagol (myself and Axxle) played a thoroughly terrible VT game. I don't even remember if our lynch was scum driven or not, but damn did we deserve it. Lurked ourselves to death. Bad Smeagol.
I was surprised at how much suspicion picked up on you guys. It's all because you said you had a town read on a town player!
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And I really thought I had something there with the whole "Dent didn't properly explain why he quickhammered" thing.
Can we add this to the record books as another example of quickhammering NOT being a fine and useful tool for town? ;D
That was the tipping point. I knew you had made that case, I knew you were town, and I knew it looked legitimately put together. Not blaming you at all, but I trusted your line of reasoning with this argument.
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And I really thought I had something there with the whole "Dent didn't properly explain why he quickhammered" thing.
Can we add this to the record books as another example of quickhammering NOT being a fine and useful tool for town? ;D
That was the tipping point. I knew you had made that case, I knew you were town, and I knew it looked legitimately put together. Not blaming you at all, but I trusted your line of reasoning with this argument.
Yeah.
It WAS logical, and reasonable, and everything else that comes with that.
It was also, unfortunately, wrong!
So it goes.
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Smeagol (myself and Axxle) played a thoroughly terrible VT game. I don't even remember if our lynch was scum driven or not, but damn did we deserve it. Lurked ourselves to death. Bad Smeagol.
Aggron Stonebreaker (Glooble and I) think so too (I'm assuming Glooble agrees too). We should have posted a lot more, but there just wasn't much to post about.
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And I really thought I had something there with the whole "Dent didn't properly explain why he quickhammered" thing.
Can we add this to the record books as another example of quickhammering NOT being a fine and useful tool for town? ;D
Again, I am a town PR and no one believes me. I think next time I roll a town PR, I will self-vote immediately on D1 to save town the trouble of waiting to MYLO or LYLO to kill me.
The quickhammer put town in a good position info-wise, and allowed me to survived to do an investigation, since you all were thinking I was scummy anyway. The, scum failed to NK and fake claimed, to help us put them on the ropes. But you all killed me instead.
I firmly stand by the fact that I was telling the truth the entire time, and town chose to go with the lying scum instead.
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And I really thought I had something there with the whole "Dent didn't properly explain why he quickhammered" thing.
Can we add this to the record books as another example of quickhammering NOT being a fine and useful tool for town? ;D
That was the tipping point. I knew you had made that case, I knew you were town, and I knew it looked legitimately put together. Not blaming you at all, but I trusted your line of reasoning with this argument.
Yeah.
It WAS logical, and reasonable, and everything else that comes with that.
It was also, unfortunately, wrong!
So it goes.
Yeah that was a really good argument! I felt in-game that that might be the tipping point too.
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The MVP of this head was DSell, I had trouble logging onto the account and driving conversation in a game there wasn't a bunch going on in.
Dsell primarily posted days 1 and 3 and I primarily posted day 2.
Grujah while we were discussing strategy locked the thread after no notice , we DID intend to kill
Ironically enough, I was convinced that killing Dent at night was the best. So we wouldn't have had to play with fishy cop stuff at all. Yeah, we went totally off book, but like I was telling Munch, from our perspective, the game is easy. "All we know for sure is that Doduo is scum, and he must be lynched." No point in trying to set up lynches for the next day, or secretly protecting him, or worrying about getting all endgamy. I'm kind of baffled that things worked out this way, I was certain we'd be going another day.
When we saw today that people were giving serious credit to Dent being the fakeclaim, things looked much better. We were on all day hoping to hammer Dent, and when S/U voted for Dent, my heart went up into my chest. Then I got all super paranoid that S/U was waiting to see who would log on and take the bait. So ended up not being the hammer.
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The quickhammer put town in a good position info-wise
But it didn't! It made you look scummy! That is not a good position info-wise!
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Based on S&U's last 10 posts or so, scum is either Doduo/S&U, in which case Doduo gets MVP for sounding so damn townie, or scum is Dent/Durden, in which case Doduo is MVP for sounding so damn townie.
Vote: Dent
This post makes me so happy. :')
Finally breaking the meta of looking a little scummy always no matter what.
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@Volt: I maintain my quickhammering in MXIV was a solid play because I did it to try to save Eevee.
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@Volt: I maintain my quickhammering in MXIV was a solid play because I did it to try to save Eevee.
seconded
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@Volt: I maintain my quickhammering in MXIV was a solid play because I did it to try to save Eevee.
Yeah, you had clear, setup-driven reasons for that quickhammer AND you made concerted effort to explain yourself afterwards. That was definitely a different situation.
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@Volt: I maintain my quickhammering in MXIV was a solid play because I did it to try to save Eevee.
i don't think i could have not-hidden the previous night in the fear of getting cursed that day though. but yeah, if i didn't realize that.
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@Volt: I maintain my quickhammering in MXIV was a solid play because I did it to try to save Eevee.
i don't think i could have not-hidden the previous night in the fear of getting cursed that day though. but yeah, if i didn't realize that.
Shrug no way of knowing that and you saying whether you did or not would be bad. But yea the mafia only get to curse once so you can always hammer with an uncursed hider.
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I'm really looking forward to reading all the QTs. All you mini-gamers, hurry and make your guesses! (I guessed Aggron right but haven't guessed at all since then.)
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Didn't guess on Aggron, Guessed 100% wrong on Smeagol. Don't really care to guess the rest as most of it is in the open now.
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@Volt: I maintain my quickhammering in MXIV was a solid play because I did it to try to save Eevee.
i don't think i could have not-hidden the previous night in the fear of getting cursed that day though. but yeah, if i didn't realize that.
Shrug no way of knowing that and you saying whether you did or not would be bad. But yea the mafia only get to curse once so you can always hammer with an uncursed hider.
I know. :) But I thought I had to, because I would be auto-cursed the next day by scum jsut in case I messed up... I wasnt though, which I found weird.
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Eevee, mind if I post our QT? To show everyone how not to hydra? ;D
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Eevee, mind if I post our QT? To show everyone how not to hydra? ;D
Go for it. :D
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Oh, so you guys blew it, huh?
I was shot Night 1, go figure.
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Oh, so you guys blew it, huh?
I was shot Night 1, go figure.
;D
You can update your tag now. Two more games to add.
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Oh, so you guys blew it, huh?
I was shot Night 1, go figure.
What you don't know is that Night 1 in the Mafia QT we went Robz Hunting because we HAD to shoot you night 1 for lolz. (just kidding)
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Oh, so you guys blew it, huh?
Harsh! (if accurate)
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How not to hydra: http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/NQxNqv3xSpx
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How not to hydra: http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/NQxNqv3xSpx
My favorite moment was when Axxle felt the need to post the password to our account because I was lurking so bad he thought I didn't know how to get in.
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The quickhammer put town in a good position info-wise
But it didn't! It made you look scummy! That is not a good position info-wise!
But I was the cop, so not scum. And looking sort of scummy while a PR is a thing, and my thing for sure, to keep from being the NK target.
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So I lost ANOTHER game?
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The quickhammer put town in a good position info-wise
But it didn't! It made you look scummy! That is not a good position info-wise!
But I was the cop, so not scum. And looking sort of scummy while a PR is a thing, and my thing for sure, to keep from being the NK target.
This is a really hard balancing act to get right. You are not the first to go too far in the "looking sort of scummy" direction, and I am sure you won't be the last.
And ironically, according to shraeye you WERE probably going to be the NK target!
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How not to hydra: http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/NQxNqv3xSpx
My favorite moment was when Axxle felt the need to post the password to our account because I was lurking so bad he thought I didn't know how to get in.
Haha, no. That was so then I could copy at paste it without having to log back into Axxle.
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The quickhammer put town in a good position info-wise
But it didn't! It made you look scummy! That is not a good position info-wise!
But I was the cop, so not scum. And looking sort of scummy while a PR is a thing, and my thing for sure, to keep from being the NK target.
Protown play > PR in most cases.
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Personally, I think I want to lynch Dent. It's really close though. But every time I go back and read the events, I see this:
Durden/Dent thought that Dent was the obvious choice for Investigation last night after that hammer. They decide he's going to claim Cop,
They opened the day asking if the Cop should claim.
Before anybody could reasons, Doduo claimed Durden was scum.
Ashersky went "Oh shit, I need to claim"
Ashersky made some pretty bad arguments about mislynching.
O took over and started admonishing Ashersky for being hotheaded, since the whole point to the fake claim was to hide the second scum AND give scum a way to win straight out. Now if they failed to win today, they failed to win period..
The internal struggle between heads on Dent is what really tips it for me. It sounded like they planned to claim first, forcing the real Cop to counter - but when Doduo jumped out and claimed, Ashersky made a snap decision without thinking about the consequences. O got angry at him (probably rightfully so if this is indeed an accurate storyline).
For me personally, the biggest thing I don't like about Dent's posts overall was his lack of offering up his role as a reason to hammer Smeagol. I'm not saying lynching town is ever good - but when asked "Why didn't you wait for him to claim", as the Cop your answer should be pretty straight forward "Because I knew he couldn't be the only PR left, so there was nothing for him to claim". Dent never offered that, and that, to me, would've been the only acceptable town reason to "derphammer".
This is soooooooooooooooo bad. "They didn't think of this one niche reasoning that I had thought of, so they must be scum".
No. Hammering a townie at that point is also pretty goddamn bad. And Ashersky could have still waited and had the advantage of KNOWING he was scum if he claimed a PR.
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It was all worth it to see O lecture us about quickhammering.
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It was all worth it to see O lecture us about quickhammering.
+100
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It was all worth it to see O lecture us about quickhammering.
+12
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It was all worth it to see O lecture us about quickhammering.
I was trying to be as unlike O as possible :P.
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Oh wow. Town really f**ked this one up. Durden didn't even need to switch to quickhammer like i said he might.
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could someone post all in one place which heads were which?
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oh nevermind, contest is still on per grujah, sorry.
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could someone post all in one place which heads were which?
I think Grujah is holding off doing this until everyone gets their shot at guessing for the minigame. But I say the sooner the better. Some heads were already public. Doduo was Dsell/Insom, Durden was TheMunch/Shraeye, Zaphod was Galzria/???, S/U was cayvie/???, Jekyll was Voltgloss/???.
PPE: yeah
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Dr Jekyll (Frisk and Volt)
Doduo (Ins and Dsell)
Sakon and Ukon (pps and cayvie)
Tyler Durden (shra and Munch)
Harvey Dent (asher and O)
Professor Quirrell (jo and Robz)
Smeagol (Axxle and Eevee)
Aggron Stonebreaker (arch and Gloob)
Zaphod Beeblebrox (SFS and Galz)
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Dr Jekyll (Frisk and Volt)
Doduo (Ins and Dsell)
Sakon and Ukon (pps and cayvie)
Tyler Durden (shra and Munch)
Harvey Dent (asher and O)
Professor Quirrell (jo and Robz)
Smeagol (Axxle and Eevee)
Aggron Stonebreaker (arch and Gloob)
Zaphod Beeblebrox (SFS and Galz)
And Zaphod was 99% Galz. I only sat around talking to the bablefish. Thanks for taking it on, Galz.
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Hey Grujah who are you MVPing for this game
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Who won the minigame and can we get QTs?
Mafia QT: http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/32gbbn6dUes
Doduo QT: http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/g53hSKHnNqWdB
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Aggron Stonebreaker: http://quicktopic.com/48/H/ZnnN7kZZDWV
The password is in there if anyone wants to go troll Morgrim's game with the account.
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Anybody? More QTs?
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Tyler Durden. http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/uWP5W3vrtL2n
of course, me and Munch mostly just discussed in person.
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" Am I allowed to make breakfast at any time of the day? Multiple times in one day? "
+1
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Here's all 12 posts from the Harvey Dent thread: http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/rQWKRVPv9drbb
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We are all bad hydralisks.
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This game seems to be a prime example of More quicktopics = less thread posting
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Except nobody posted in their QT either.
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a little confusing that the thread title still says "Day 1 started"
Also, not that we have these accounts, I think if a pair of people wants to /in to a normal game as a Hydra, that should be allowed, maybe? thoughts?
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Maybe. But they shouldn't be allowed to /in with the Hydra if at least one of them are already playing.
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Sigh, this needs conclusion (mini-game result and MVP). I'm pretty sure yuma won the mini-game, and not sure about MVP.. Doduo for crazy claim that actually worked? I kinda lost track of who did what with all those heads :D
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Sigh, this needs conclusion (mini-game result and MVP). I'm pretty sure yuma won the mini-game, and not sure about MVP.. Doduo for crazy claim that actually worked? I kinda lost track of who did what with all those heads :D
I didn't think it was that crazy. ::)