Dominion Strategy Forum
Miscellaneous => Forum Games => Mafia Game Threads => Topic started by: Haddock on January 18, 2016, 06:41:51 am
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Welcome to M75: Cupcake Mafia
This game is for 13-players. It uses a modification of the mafiascum standard semi-open setup, Matrix14.
Mods: Haddock and ashersky
Sign ups are open.
1. Awaclus - Lynched D6 - Double Espresso Cake (2-Shot Strongman)
2. faust - Died N3 - Vanilla Teacake
3. silverspawn - Lynched D5 - Vanilla Teacake
4. yuma --> 2.7
5. gkrieg13 - Died N1 - Sticky Toffee Drop (Town Jailkeeper)
6. Roadrunner7671 - Lynched D4 - Vanilla Teacake
7. A Drowned Kernel - Died N2 - Grandma's World-Famous Apple Cake (Fruit Vendor)
8. Hydrad - Lynched D1 - Avocado Teacake (Mafia Goon)
9. Lekkit - Lynched D3 - Vanilla Teacake
10. Witherweaver
11. Teproc --> Ampharos
12. chairs - Killed N4 - Choco-Vanilla Layer Cake (Even-Night Tracker)
13. EgorK - Lynched D2 - Vegan Brownie (Mafia Rolecop)
Game State Tracker:
D1 Start (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564611#msg564611) || D1 End (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg567089#msg567089)
D2 Start (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg567619#msg567619) || D2 End (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg569473#msg569473)
D3 Start (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg570042#msg570042) || D3 End (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg570896#msg570896)
D4 Start (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg571418#msg571418) || D4 End (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg572473#msg572473)
D5 Start (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg572649#msg572649) || D5 End (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg573169#msg573169)
D6 Start (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg573457#msg573457) || D6 End (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg574456#msg574456)
The Rules:
The Golden Rule:
This is a game. Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun. Once the game starts, having signed up is a commitment: inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments.
The Standard Rules:
1. No communication between players outside of the game thread or shared QTs at any time. This includes passing references, jokes, or cases in other games or threads, whether in context or not.
2. If the game thread is locked, do not post. If you are unsure if something is locked, ask the mod by PM.
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay.
3 a. Quoting from personal QTs is fine as long as all communication to or from the mods is excluded. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
4. Actions with instructions that do not specify a game state will be resolved in the order they are received.
5. All night actions must be submitted within 24 hours of day ending.
6. Players must post once every 24 hours.
7. Do not edit or delete posts, ever. If you need to clarify or correct something, post again.
8. Invisible text, font size less than 10, and spoiler tags are not allowed.
9. Cryptography is not allowed.
10. The time between a lynch being reached and a flip being provided is called twilight. All players may continue posting during this time, including the lynched player.
11. Dead players may not post in thread or QT, except their Role QT. A lynched player is not "dead" until a flip has been provided.
12. Personal multimedia, such as video or audio recordings, are not allowed in the game thread.
The Voting Rules:
1. Votes should be in this format: Vote: Playername. Unambigiuous nicknames are acceptable.
2. Unvotes should be in this format: unvote or Unvote: Playername.
3. Unvotes are not required if changing your vote from one player to another.
4. You may vote: no lynch.
5. Lynches occur when a simple majority (rounded up) of living players is reached. Once reached, a lynch cannot be undone.
6. Lynch rules vary by the number of players alive. With 10 or more players alive, the player with the most votes at the end of the day will be lynched. Ties are broken by coin flip. With nine or less players alive, if a majority lynch is not reached by the deadline, no lynch occurs.
The Rest:
1. Bold, teal text is reserved for the Mods. Players may not use it.
2. If you have an issue or problem with the game, please PM the Mods. Do not post complaints in the game thread.
3. Mods make mistakes - please point them out gently. If they can be corrected, they will. If irreversible, they will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. If a mod error disadvantages one faction greatly, the game may be called off.
5. Ask all questions and make all requests directly to the Mods via PM or in your QT. Questions deemed as "universal" (defined as questions for which the answers should be available to all players) will be requested to be re-posted in the Game Thread and answered there.
6. One prod will be issued after 48 hours without posting in the game thread. Players are subject to replacement or modkill after one prod.
7. All rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, as determined by the mods.
Deadlines:
1. Days will last 8 IRL days.
2. Nights will last two IRL days.
The Setup:
This game uses a variant of the Matrix14 setup.
The game will include:
- 6 VTs,
- 1 Mafia Goon
and
the entries from a randomly determined row, column or diagonal of the following table.
| Mafia JOAT | Vanilla Townie | Town Jailkeeper | Mafia Goon | Vanilla Townie | Town Tracker |
| Town Doctor | Town Odd-Night Watcher | Town 1-Shot Vigilante | Town 1-Shot Cop | Mafia JOAT | Mafia Rolecop |
| Town Even-Night Tracker | Vanilla Townie | Mafia Rolecop | Town Jailkeeper | Town Fruit Vendor | Mafia 2-Shot Strongman |
| Town 2-Shot Commuter | Mafia Roleblocker | Mafia Goon | Vanilla Townie | Town Watcher | Town Universal Backup |
| Wolf Goon / Mafia Goon | Town Bodyguard | Vanilla Townie | Mafia Godfather | Town Cop | Vanilla Townie |
| Wolf JOAT / SK | Wolf Goon / Mafia Goon | Town Neighbourizer | Town 1-Shot Cop | Mafia Roleblocker | Town Doctor |
For the diagonal containing just one Wolf player, that player is an SK instead.
For the row and column containing just one Wolf player, that player is another Mafia Goon instead.
All relevant Sample PMs (QTs) can be found at the Matrix14 mafiascum page, here:
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Matrix_14
DO NOT USE THE TABLE IN THE MAFIASCUM PAGE, IT DIFFERS FROM THE ACTUAL TABLE ABOVE.
All players (regardless of role) will have their own QTs. Players with roles can send orders either in the QT or by PM.
I have assigned flavour names to roles, but purely for flavour purposes - players will only know their role, not their flavour name. Flavour names will only be revealed when a player flips. See next post for flavour details.
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The Flavour:
Matt + Rick's 14th Birthday
Matt and Rick were twin brothers. It was their 14th birthday. After a boring day at school, they returned home to find that their parents are nowhere to be found.
"But it's our birthday!" exclaimed Matt despairingly, "We're supposed to have a party! Or at least a surprise, or something."
"Never mind," consoled Rick. "Mum and Dad aren't here, let's go loot the kitchen. I'm starving, and we deserve some chocolate." He led his brother through to the kitchen, where they found that their parents hadn't been quite as lax as they thought. On the table in the centre of the room were two brownies, as well as 13 cupcakes. All looked absolutely delicious. A note lay in front of the colourful selection:
"Kids,
HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!
Sorry we're not there, Mummy and Daddy had to work. We'll be back later and we can party then. Meantime, here's some cupcakes. We know you two love cupcakes and we know you love treasure hunts, so we've mixed up the two! Some of the cakes in front of you are lovely, Daddy's best variety cakes. Some of them are healthy and horrible, packed with things you don't like, like avocado and walnuts. (Bleugh!) So you'll have to figure out which is which. Sound like fun? Hope it keeps you entertained til we get back.
Lots of love,
Mum and Dad.
PS. Eat the brownies first, there's nothing in them but chocolate and goodness. Promise! ;)"
Matt and Rick were delighted. They loved stuff like this! Ever compliant, they chowed down quickly on a brownie each, which melted in their mouths. Even more excited, they started inspecting the 13 cupcakes to try to figure out which ones were the tasty ones.
All of a sudden, the boys started to feel funny, the room spinning slightly, colours distorting.
"Must have been something in those brownies," said Rick.
"Well, our parents have never been the responsible types," replied Matt.
"HEY! They made us for you didn't they?" Squeaked a loud voice.
With a comic double-take, Matt and Rick stared at the table. The cupcakes were alive! Running around the table, arguing with each other, pushing and shoving. All of them with high, squeaky voices, would occasionally stop bickering with the other cakes and instead turn to the twins and shout:
"Eat me!"
"No, eat ME!"
"No I'm the tastiest!"
"Alright, ALRIGHT!" yelled Matt. "We get it. You want us to eat you. So you're each going to have to convince us."
The cakes calmed down slightly and began to argue more constructively, back and forth about who should be eaten, and who pushed off the table to splat on the floor. The boys, oddly fascinated, simply sat back and watched as the great cake debate began.
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Note: I have a few more things to fix up and sort out before this can start, but I thought I'd get signups going. Should be ready to go in no more than a couple of days, anyway.
I welcome a co-mod if anyone wants to do that. This is my first game modding, so go easy on me!
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/in
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/tag
Can help with modding to allow for most to play.
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/in
The link to the setup could be a bit more prominent.
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/tag
Can help with modding to allow for most to play.
Awesome. :) I'll PM you the Mod QT when I get chance.
/in
The link to the setup could be a bit more prominent.
Good point. Teal was a bad choice. Will fix.
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/in
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/in
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/in
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/in But I'm scared of the flavor.
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/in But I'm scared of the flavor.
Why? Not ready to turn 14 yet?
You're all cupcakes!! It's a happy fun time! What's to fear? ;P
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/in But I'm scared of the flavor.
Why? Not ready to turn 14 yet?
You're all cupcakes!! It's a happy fun time! What's to fear? ;P
We're talking cupcakes about to be eaten by drug-filled juveniles.
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/in But I'm scared of the flavor.
Why? Not ready to turn 14 yet?
You're all cupcakes!! It's a happy fun time! What's to fear? ;P
We're talking cupcakes about to be eaten by drug-filled juveniles.
Don't ask me why. I'm in a slightly insane mood.
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I like slight insanity a lot.
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/in
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Don't want to be in more than two games, so /tag.
Setup looks sweet though, having the possibility of multiball is fun (a lot more than actually having multiball I must say).
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Out of curiosity, why don't people like multiball? I don't have a lot of experience with it.
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Out of curiosity, why don't people like multiball? I don't have a lot of experience with it.
Seems to me the main complaints come down to:
1) It's harder to win.
2) It's harder to scumhunt.
There are various reasons, but they come down to the fact that even the scum are scumhunting, so they're more likely to see towny. Ergo, town always feels like they are underpowered.
That's my take, anyway, after modding many of them.
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Also it encourages no lynching. I remember reading Fire and Ice Mafia : it was just a miserable few days at the end and no one was to blame for it, anything town did just didn't matter they had to no lynch and hope the night actions went their way.
I guess it goes along with RMM : it makes night more important than day, and I don't like that.
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The Flavour:ed, simply sat back and watched as the great cake debate began.[/color]
Nice to see the use of British English in these forums.
Also, /tag, since I don't want to be in more than 1 game at once.
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I think one of the biggest problems with forum mafia is that it is relatively easy to stay hidden as scum. It is also extremely safisfying to catch scum anyway, but if I had designed forum mafia, I'd surely have made it a bit harder for scum to fabricate everything.
So... a game mode which makes scum hunting even harder is, like, the worst idea ever. That's why I don't like multiball, anyway. Or SKs.
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/in
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I think one of the biggest problems with forum mafia is that it is relatively easy to stay hidden as scum. It is also extremely safisfying to catch scum anyway, but if I had designed forum mafia, I'd surely have made it a bit harder for scum to fabricate everything.
So... a game mode which makes scum hunting even harder is, like, the worst idea ever. That's why I don't like multiball, anyway. Or SKs.
Yes, I agree with this 100%. The most disappointing thing about mafia in my opinion is that I rarely feel like my reads are good enough that they're actually doing anything. Sometimes I'll think that they are, but then I'll end up being wrong, and that happens so often that I'm not sure I do much better than random when I just go with my reads. Other people probably aren't so bad at it, but I still feel like players' ability to read each other is an underwhelmingly unimportant part of the game, considering that it's supposed to be one of the main focuses of the game. So anything that reduces that further just seems like bad design to me, which is what multiball and SK's do. I also feel the same way about traitors.
What I think would really make games more interesting would be mechanics that make defending partners much better. I'm not sure what that would look like though.
(Also, /tag)
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I once tried to make scum play harder by having the threat of a town sensor, that way scum has to plan how many of their players are on or off wagon, and can't just go with what feels natural
I wouldn't say that it worked, though.
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/in
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I do have to say I would really not want to be on one of the two 10:2:1 mafia teams (2 and 12). That looks really rough from just a numbers point of view compared to the others.
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I do have to say I would really not want to be on one of the two 10:2:1 mafia teams (2 and 12). That looks really rough from just a numbers point of view compared to the others.
I was thinking that as well, I'm not sure these are all 100% balanced. I mean it's not terrible but that would be pretty harsh.
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I do have to say I would really not want to be on one of the two 10:2:1 mafia teams (2 and 12). That looks really rough from just a numbers point of view compared to the others.
I was thinking that as well, I'm not sure these are all 100% balanced. I mean it's not terrible but that would be pretty harsh.
One fix I can think of is to use a traitor instead of a SK. But maybe I am biased as I think traitor is the best role in all of mafia.
The only problem then is option 7. But I think in that case you just get rid of the additional Mafia Goon so it is a Goon/JOAT/Traitor team?
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^regardless I am still playing but I am trying to be more proactive i reading setups thoroughly a second time and bringing up concerns about setups before they start rather than waiting until after to complain... So I am not demanding changes/fixes but just pointing out concerns that may have been missed in a casual first glance
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^regardless I am still playing but I am trying to be more proactive i reading setups thoroughly a second time and bringing up concerns about setups before they start rather than waiting until after to complain... So I am not demanding changes/fixes but just pointing out concerns that may have been missed in a casual first glance
I'll be honest. I didn't look too hard at all of the rows and columns. It was a mafiascum approved setup and I like semi-open setups so I went with it.
I probably agree that not all of the possibilities are totally balanced. But I hope it'll be an enjoyable game anyway.
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Well mafia scum approved means different things to different people. I am starting to read the one iteration of this that has been played and noticed that pops is playing in it!
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/in
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/in
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Sorry, I'm not going to be able to put the appropriate amount of time to the game right now.
/out
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Any more for any more? I know the flavour is weird, but that shouldn't matter too much.
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/in
Time to lose again!
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/in
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I'm looking for word...
Screwdriver? No.
Drill? No, that's not it.
Chainsaw? No.
Hammer! That's the one. Somebody hammer!
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I'm looking for word...
Screwdriver? No.
Drill? No, that's not it.
Chainsaw? No.
Hammer! That's the one. Somebody hammer!
Where's Iguanaiguana?
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/tag
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Where's Iguanaiguana?
I think he's retired from forum mafia. :(
/tag
Gah. I really thought this was an in when I first read it. I was so excited!
Seriously, my life is incomplete without mafia now. I'm officially an addict.
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Hammer time. /in
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^regardless I am still playing but I am trying to be more proactive i reading setups thoroughly a second time and bringing up concerns about setups before they start rather than waiting until after to complain... So I am not demanding changes/fixes but just pointing out concerns that may have been missed in a casual first glance
I'll be honest. I didn't look too hard at all of the rows and columns. It was a mafiascum approved setup and I like semi-open setups so I went with it.
I probably agree that not all of the possibilities are totally balanced. But I hope it'll be an enjoyable game anyway.
So will the setup be played as described above?
I know I said above that I would be willing to play regardless, but I might go back on that. I really wouldn't want to be mafia in a 2 player team in a 13 player game. That doesn't sound fun.
So that is to say... that if run in the current iteration I think I would need to /out. But I am not demanding the setup be changed just for me, but simply that consideration be given to make some changes to prevent any 2-man mafia team setups from being possible and if a change is made I would likely reconsider joining this game.
Sorry if I sound like I am being pretentious and maybe in fact I am. But if I am going to play a game I would want it to be one in which I don't get stuck in a scenario that sounds miserable to play.
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yeah, c9++ is also mafiascum approved and pretty broken at times. I'd try to fix it, similar to how ashersky fixed c9++. A consistent number of scum is probably a good idea. (c9++ has 2-4, asher9++ has 3)
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OK I've had a bit of a think about this.
I'm not willing to remove the 9/2/2 multiball setups. Seems to me that that's how multiball should run.
I will however change the two 10/2/1 setups. A fairly simple brute force solution is to replace the SK in those setups with another Mafia Goon, to make them into (fairly vanillaish) 10/3 setups.
Would that do the trick for people?
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OK I've had a bit of a think about this.
I'm not willing to remove the 9/2/2 multiball setups. Seems to me that that's how multiball should run.
I will however change the two 10/2/1 setups. A fairly simple brute force solution is to replace the SK in those setups with another Mafia Goon, to make them into (fairly vanillaish) 10/3 setups.
Would that do the trick for people?
For the purposes of getting this game up and running, sounds good enough to me.
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OK I'm going to change the setup post appropriately.
Everyone please note that the table in the setup post is now the one to use, not the one on the mafiascum page.
I'm also going to do all the setting up now, and PMs will go out to everyone except yuma as soon as I can. Once yuma confirms that he's back in (or otherwise), I'll PM him (respectively we'll find a replacement) and the game will start.
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I think that works for me. And sorry that I wasn't clear above the 9-2-2 setups work just fine, it was the 10-2-1 set ups that were a concern.
Thanks for being willing to look at it. Back /in
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Hey no worries. :)
I think everything's set up, so PMs will go out any minute and thread will lock etc. then.
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Thread Locked.
PMs going out.
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Thread still locked.
PMs are all out and N0 begins.
Barring any issues, the game will start tomorrow, 1st February, at 12 noon forum time.
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Game will likely start a bit late. (Good start, right?) I'm still waiting on a confirmation and will miss the start deadline by about an hour anyway.
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Day 1 Start
In no time at all, the cupcakes had organised themselves, setting up tiny chairs and tables in the form of cutlery, crockery, and bits of old fruit. The stage was set for an epic debate.
Vote Count 1.0
Not Voting (13): Awaclus, A Drowned Kernel, chairs, EgorK, faust, gkrieg13, Hydrad, Lekkit, Roadrunner7671, silverspawn, Teproc, Witherweaver, yuma.
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
Thread unlocked.
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vote: Lekkit
Welcome back
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Vote: silverspawn
Obviously scum here.
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setting up tiny chairs
Also sounds like scum is trying to set chairs up for a mislynch so he's probably town.
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setting up tiny chairs
Also sounds like scum is trying to set chairs up for a mislynch so he's probably town.
vote: Awaclus I'm town but he's clearly buddying me early.
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A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
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A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
In that case I'll already point out that the only stuff I usually write in personal QTs is communication with the mods, so if it turns out that I don't have anything in there at a later time, it is not indicative of my alignment.
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I'm generally in that boat as well
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A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
In that case I'll already point out that the only stuff I usually write in personal QTs is communication with the mods, so if it turns out that I don't have anything in there at a later time, it is not indicative of my alignment.
What would people be quoting from their personal QTs anyway?
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A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
In that case I'll already point out that the only stuff I usually write in personal QTs is communication with the mods, so if it turns out that I don't have anything in there at a later time, it is not indicative of my alignment.
What would people be quoting from their personal QTs anyway?
Because delivering an exact version of the thoughts town!you had several weeks ago is incredibly hard to fabricate for scum. If you are someone who writes a lot in his QT's, like me, the only way to believably maintain a towny image when playing scum in a game with this ruling is to have 2 separate QT's running and fabricate town!me thoughts in one of them.
I just wrote a big post about this and that I should like it because it helps town but also don't like it because I think it's a stupid rule in my QT but it looks like my desire to win isn't strong enough. And it's still the start of the game, I'd rather play a balanced game than what I think would be a really unfair one.
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I don't think this is the time or place to have this debate. Haddock, I'm sure, is aware of the arguments for and against and he made his choice, so let's get on with the game.
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This is where I should have something relevant to the game to say, but I've got nothing right now, sorry.
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Even if you could fabricate it, it still means that you would have to do so once someone asks you to quote your entire QT. And if we are going to play this, I am absolutely going to demand that everyone does it at some point, seeing that it's a powerful weapon.
I don't think this is the time or place to have this debate. Haddock, I'm sure, is aware of the arguments for and against and he made his choice, so let's get on with the game.
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This is where I should have something relevant to the game to say, but I've got nothing right now, sorry.
but I want to debate now :(
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Then open up a thread dedicated to that.
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but yeah, okay, no more debating. vote: Awaclus
(since he doesn't write into his QT he's harder to catch as scum this game)
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Then open up a thread dedicated to that.
I think that'd violate the "don't reference ongoing games" rule
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Why ? You'd be discussing a rules question in mafia games in general... you don't have to reference this game in particular.
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I almost never write in my QT except for confirming at night or using actions, I don't know why giving QTs to all players has become the standard.
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Hi everyone.
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Hi everyone.
Do you use your personal QT for much Roadrunner?
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I almost never write in my QT except for confirming at night or using actions, I don't know why giving QTs to all players has become the standard.
The standard was made because in some games players have created their own--especially when they are PRs. Thus creating QTs for everyone to give them a platform was intended to even the playing field at the least. Plus I believe that as a mod they are easier to track and follow then the PM system that is used here. PMs are nice, but they are more difficult to track conversations/confirmations/etc.
I plan on giving out private QTs in my games from now on. It has been so much nicer this way from the last few games i have modded. It will also be nice to see how this rule version works out in this game.
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Hi everyone.
Do you use your personal QT for much Roadrunner?
I post dozens of times in my QT, even as a VT.
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Hi everyone.
Do you use your personal QT for much Roadrunner?
I post dozens of times in my QT, even as a VT.
But that is 100% confidential until the end of the game and I'm never ever sharing from my QT. Cause that's dumb. And you know me, I never do anything dumb.
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Oh and hi Lekkit! Have a day three pass.
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I mean if people are going to use "WHAT HAVE YOU POSTED IN YOUR QT HUH" as way to test people's towniness then I'm just going to start writing fanfiction in mine.
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I almost never write in my QT except for confirming at night or using actions, I don't know why giving QTs to all players has become the standard.
The standard was made because in some games players have created their own--especially when they are PRs. Thus creating QTs for everyone to give them a platform was intended to even the playing field at the least. Plus I believe that as a mod they are easier to track and follow then the PM system that is used here. PMs are nice, but they are more difficult to track conversations/confirmations/etc.
I plan on giving out private QTs in my games from now on. It has been so much nicer this way from the last few games i have modded. It will also be nice to see how this rule version works out in this game.
This is the same as it was in Marvel Heroes, unless I'm missing something, isn't it ?
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I almost never write in my QT except for confirming at night or using actions, I don't know why giving QTs to all players has become the standard.
The standard was made because in some games players have created their own--especially when they are PRs. Thus creating QTs for everyone to give them a platform was intended to even the playing field at the least. Plus I believe that as a mod they are easier to track and follow then the PM system that is used here. PMs are nice, but they are more difficult to track conversations/confirmations/etc.
I plan on giving out private QTs in my games from now on. It has been so much nicer this way from the last few games i have modded. It will also be nice to see how this rule version works out in this game.
This is the same as it was in Marvel Heroes, unless I'm missing something, isn't it ?
It is. I am saying that previously I only gave QTs to PRs, but that after seeing Marvel and then working with that way of modding I found that I liked this format better.
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I mean if people are going to use "WHAT HAVE YOU POSTED IN YOUR QT HUH" as way to test people's towniness then I'm just going to start writing fanfiction in mine.
And given your skills in that, you would never be lynched.
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I mean if people are going to use "WHAT HAVE YOU POSTED IN YOUR QT HUH" as way to test people's towniness then I'm just going to start writing fanfiction in mine.
I don't really get what you mean here. It obviously seems like a huge benefit to me, so I don't understand why you're framing it as a joke.
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I'm never going to post anything substantial in my QT, and I don't think that doing so or not is an alignment tell for any player.
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Let's talk about something more game-related, shall we?
Some possible roles in this setup seem not so great. It might be a worthwile discussion to decide whether these roles should claim today. I'm thinking specifically:
Neighbourizer
Fruit Vendor
Bodyguard
and maybe 2-shot Commuter.
The upside is that we get one semi-IC early on. Also we will have some additional setup knowledge. Neighborizer and Fruit Vendor are very weak, and a Bodyguard doesn't really profit from being hidden. 2-shot Commuter is stronger, but it only works if they can attract the night kill. Anyway, how IC-ish would such a claim make these roles?
Neighbourizer:
Mafia can fakeclaim this if they are not in a setup where they don't have Roleblocker/Goon or Rolecop/Goon. Possibilities:
JOAT/Goon: Then it could be row 1, which has a Tracker. Tracker does not appear together with Neighborizer, so they would out themselves.
JOAT/Rolecop: Row 2 has this and an Odd-Night Watcher, which can counterclaim Neighbourizer.
JOAT/Roleblocker: The column that gives this basically has only roles that could counter the claim.
2-shot Strongman/Rolecop: Appears with Fruit Vendor. Again nay.
Godfather/Goon: Can have a Bodyguard.
So fakeclaim potential here is very limited.
Fruit Vendor:
A quick search shows that the claim here also always has the option to be countered.
Bodyguard:
Same here.
So basically we can generate an IC I think. This works now,but may not work anymore once scum has more information.
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I've been thinking about this too. My main problem is that, in most if no all cases, it ust gives scum the whole setup, which they don't know yet (I think in most situations they're looking at two possible setups).
2-Shot Commuter is the main one I think, because making an IC with that particular role is pretty awesome.
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Fruit Vendor is my favorite role.
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Bodyguard is pretty good too, not as enthusiastic about the others.
Commuter has a bunch of setups where scum knows it's not there, which makes it less IC-fying, but that only lasts for so long, it's not a claim scum can ride all the way to the end, not easily at least.
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I'm never going to post anything substantial in my QT, and I don't think that doing so or not is an alignment tell for any player.
I don't agree. It's just like posting in here, but not visible until possibly some later time. I think it's useful.
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meep.
why is no-one doing RVS? How am I supposed to have stuff to say?
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I've been thinking about this too. My main problem is that, in most if no all cases, it ust gives scum the whole setup, which they don't know yet (I think in most situations they're looking at two possible setups).
2-Shot Commuter is the main one I think, because making an IC with that particular role is pretty awesome.
Well, yes, but the amount of information we get is bigger, no? Scum can narrow it down from 2-3 possibilities to 1, we get from 14 to 2-3.
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meep.
why is no-one doing RVS? How am I supposed to have stuff to say?
I will do theory over RVS every time.
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Vote: Faust
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When you say it like that it sounds like a bigger benefit for scum, but in reality I think going from very uncertain to slightly uncertain is less good than going from slightly uncertain to absolutely certain.
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I will do theory over RVS every time.
meh, but I don't have anything to add to your theory post.
PPE: ah, interesting.
Vote: Faust
why?
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
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In any case I think those PRs should consider it on their own, and decide what they want to do. It's certainly worth thinking about at the very least.
On the subject of the actual game...
vote: ADK
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
At a later point in the game, the mafia may know more about the setup, and may know that they can safely claim one of those roles, so it would no longer make an IC.
Also it can be countered for a 1-1 trade, which will not happen D1, but might happen later.
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Hello.
I don't see why it's much better to keep your thoughts in your QT than here. Unless you're some PR and have stuff you don't want to share with the rest of the town. Reads and cases are what we have to go on. This coming from someone who have a record of not writing that much in my QTs.
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
I'll go ahead and claim IC now.
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Hello.
I don't see why it's much better to keep your thoughts in your QT than here. Unless you're some PR and have stuff you don't want to share with the rest of the town. Reads and cases are what we have to go on. This coming from someone who have a record of not writing that much in my QTs.
Not all thoughts; but sometimes it can be helpful to withhold stuff.
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Hello.
I don't see why it's much better to keep your thoughts in your QT than here. Unless you're some PR and have stuff you don't want to share with the rest of the town. Reads and cases are what we have to go on. This coming from someone who have a record of not writing that much in my QTs.
I already have 15 or so posts in my QT. There is really no reason to spam the thread with them.
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Hello.
I don't see why it's much better to keep your thoughts in your QT than here. Unless you're some PR and have stuff you don't want to share with the rest of the town. Reads and cases are what we have to go on. This coming from someone who have a record of not writing that much in my QTs.
I already have 15 or so posts in my QT. There is really no reason to spam the thread with them.
Obvscum!
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
I'll go ahead and claim IC now.
Funny you should say that, I'm going to go ahead and claim Fruit Vendor.
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
I looked over some stuff and have some ideas but don't want to actually recommend anything until looking at it closer...
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
I'll go ahead and claim IC now.
Funny you should say that, I'm going to go ahead and claim Fruit Vendor.
Or claiming now works too...
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Well if true we know we are in setup 3 or 11. And mafia knows which setup that is.
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
I'll go ahead and claim IC now.
Funny you should say that, I'm going to go ahead and claim Fruit Vendor.
I'll have an avacado.
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
I'll go ahead and claim IC now.
Funny you should say that, I'm going to go ahead and claim Fruit Vendor.
Can I counterclaim?
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Just for the record, this is a list of PRs that should claim immediately to counter this claim:
Fruit Vendor (doh)
(full) Tracker
Doctor
Odd-Night Watcher
1-shot Vig
1-shot Cop
2-shot Commuter
Universal Backup
Bodyguard
Neighborizer
(please check for yourselves that I did not make any mistake)
But really I believe ADK's claim.
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I'll have an avacado.
What is that? Some sort of code?
Vote: WW
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I truly believe that ADK is joking.
PPE
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And I dont see a benefit of any of the other roles in those setups to claim.
If someone has a role that isn't in one of those two setups a claim today could be good... Or maybe even waiting until later if you feel you can get more benefit out of your role.
A nk flip of a role not in setup 3 or 11 would be enough to doom ADK if he is lying here. So I doubt he is lying.
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Shouldn't someone with an IC-ish role wait until later to claim? ICs are more useful later in the game.
I'll go ahead and claim IC now.
Funny you should say that, I'm going to go ahead and claim Fruit Vendor.
Can I counterclaim?
If you want to get lynched, be my guest.
PPE: I am not. I am a Fruit Vendor, I believe that claiming now is best.
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Just for the record, this is a list of PRs that should claim immediately to counter this claim:
Fruit Vendor (doh)
(full) Tracker
Doctor
Odd-Night Watcher
1-shot Vig
1-shot Cop
2-shot Commuter
Universal Backup
Bodyguard
Neighborizer
(please check for yourselves that I did not make any mistake)
But really I believe ADK's claim.
Why should they immediately claim?
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I'll have an avacado.
What is that? Some sort of code?
Vote: WW
ADK is a fruit vendor, and WW wants some? That doesn't seem like code to me.
I can't counterclaim
PPE
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I truly believe that ADK is joking.
PPE
I doubt that.
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Just for the record, this is a list of PRs that should claim immediately to counter this claim:
Fruit Vendor (doh)
(full) Tracker
Doctor
Odd-Night Watcher
1-shot Vig
1-shot Cop
2-shot Commuter
Universal Backup
Bodyguard
Neighborizer
(please check for yourselves that I did not make any mistake)
But really I believe ADK's claim.
Why should they immediately claim?
To out scum.
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I'll have an avacado.
What is that? Some sort of code?
Vote: WW
It's nutritious and delicious. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avocado
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I'll have an avacado.
What is that? Some sort of code?
Vote: WW
ADK is a fruit vendor, and WW wants some? That doesn't seem like code to me.
I can't counterclaim
PPE
But what is an avacado?
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ADK is certainly not going to fake claim without checking that he can't be counterclaimed.
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I'll have an avacado.
What is that? Some sort of code?
Vote: WW
ADK is a fruit vendor, and WW wants some? That doesn't seem like code to me.
I can't counterclaim
PPE
But what is an avacado?
Okay maybe I can't spell. But still.
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ADK is certainly not going to fake claim without checking that he can't be counterclaimed.
Likely not. Stranger things have happened. I just want to make sure noone comes out at like D4 and says "but I'm 1-shot Cop and didn't realize I could counterclaim!"
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So looking back at the matrix, We either just gave scum 0 information, in the case we are playing the straight up and down one, or we gave them information that confirms the setup for them, in the case we are playing the straight across one.
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Just for the record, this is a list of PRs that should claim immediately to counter this claim:
Fruit Vendor (doh)
(full) Tracker
Doctor
Odd-Night Watcher
1-shot Vig
1-shot Cop
2-shot Commuter
Universal Backup
Bodyguard
Neighborizer
(please check for yourselves that I did not make any mistake)
But really I believe ADK's claim.
Why should they immediately claim?
To out scum.
Thanks captain obvious. But why can't they out scum tomorrow after using their pr once during the night?
Or the next day after using it twice.
I realize this is an unlikely scenario as ADK is likely town or scum who somehow knows it is a safe claim (I think that isn't possible but should double check) but still... We are in day1. Waiting to claim is a feasible option.
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Thanks captain obvious. But why can't they out scum tomorrow after using their pr once during the night?
Or the next day after using it twice.
I realize this is an unlikely scenario as ADK is likely town or scum who somehow knows it is a safe claim (I think that isn't possible but should double check) but still... We are in day1. Waiting to claim is a feasible option.
Well yes. But it's all about timing. Claiming such a thing when you end up at L-1 is bad, and it is a situation I like to avoid.
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Plus, the later the claim, the more likely it is a decent fakeclaim for scum.
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Yeah, I'll put it out there now : if you've got a role countering ADK, claim now. I don't care that you're likely to die, lynching scum on day 1 is way too good to pass up, and I for one won't believe you on day 2.
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So, assuming no one counterclaims...
There are about a billion setups where this is a safe fakeclaim for scum. So... not much towncred for ADK there as long as there isn't another PR or scum flip.
If ADK is town, it means
- Fruit Vendor + Watcher + Cop + 7 VTs vs JOAT + Roleblocker + Goon
- Fruit Vendor + JK + Even-night Tracker + 7VTs vs Rolecop + 2-shot Strongman + Goon
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The nice thing about Fruit Vendor is that it's super easy to check right ? The difference with Visitor is that the player who gets targeted gets a fruit right ? So... I mean scum can roleblock ADK if that's what they have, but that means they let Watcher and Cop have their fun.
So actually it does give a lot of towncred to ADK here, since it's a pretty bad fakeclaim longterm.
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There are about a billion setups where this is a safe fakeclaim for scum. So... not much towncred for ADK there as long as there isn't another PR or scum flip.
This is wrong. Name one setup where this is a safe claim for scum.
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Vote: Teproc for now.
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Or actually no, I prefer voting someone else I think. Vote: RR?
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Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
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On that note, unvote
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Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
No. Take, for instance, a setup where scum has JOAT/Goon. One of those setups has a Tracker, and one has a Commuter, both roles that cannot appear together with Fruit Vendor. So if scum were to claim Fruit Vendor, they would immediately get countered. You can go through all scenarios and see that there will always be the chance of a counterclaim.
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Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
No. Take, for instance, a setup where scum has JOAT/Goon. One of those setups has a Tracker, and one has a Commuter, both roles that cannot appear together with Fruit Vendor. So if scum were to claim Fruit Vendor, they would immediately get countered. You can go through all scenarios and see that there will always be the chance of a counterclaim.
Right, I'm dumb.
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Well, the plus side is that in addition to an IC, we have a townslip now.
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Or actually no, I prefer voting someone else I think. Vote: RR?
Whyy?
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Thanks captain obvious. But why can't they out scum tomorrow after using their pr once during the night?
Or the next day after using it twice.
I realize this is an unlikely scenario as ADK is likely town or scum who somehow knows it is a safe claim (I think that isn't possible but should double check) but still... We are in day1. Waiting to claim is a feasible option.
Well yes. But it's all about timing. Claiming such a thing when you end up at L-1 is bad, and it is a situation I like to avoid.
Why would they wait til they are L-1?
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Yeah, I'll put it out there now : if you've got a role countering ADK, claim now. I don't care that you're likely to die, lynching scum on day 1 is way too good to pass up, and I for one won't believe you on day 2.
This is ridiculous and non-optimal.
Vote: teproc just cause I am annoyed.
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Yeah, I'll put it out there now : if you've got a role countering ADK, claim now. I don't care that you're likely to die, lynching scum on day 1 is way too good to pass up, and I for one won't believe you on day 2.
This is ridiculous and non-optimal.
Vote: teproc just cause I am annoyed.
How so ? How is lynching scum on day 1 suboptimal ?
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Not that it's going to happen anyway, but still.
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Well, the plus side is that in addition to an IC, we have a townslip now.
I missed it. Want to point it out for those of us with a subpar understanding of mafia dynamics?
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Yeah, I'll put it out there now : if you've got a role countering ADK, claim now. I don't care that you're likely to die, lynching scum on day 1 is way too good to pass up, and I for one won't believe you on day 2.
This is ridiculous and non-optimal.
Vote: teproc just cause I am annoyed.
How so ? How is lynching scum on day 1 suboptimal ?
Not what I said. Reading. Man. Reading.
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Thanks captain obvious. But why can't they out scum tomorrow after using their pr once during the night?
Or the next day after using it twice.
I realize this is an unlikely scenario as ADK is likely town or scum who somehow knows it is a safe claim (I think that isn't possible but should double check) but still... We are in day1. Waiting to claim is a feasible option.
Well yes. But it's all about timing. Claiming such a thing when you end up at L-1 is bad, and it is a situation I like to avoid.
Why would they wait til they are L-1?
You suggested they wait until D2 or D3. They might end up at L-1 (or in a similar pressured position) before that. If they do, it's bad news.
Also continuing this discussion is pretty useless given that ADK is like 99% town. Vote: yuma
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As always, the assumption is that if someone disagrees, it's because they didn't read your post or didn't understand it.
No. I just disagree. Waiting for day 2 makes the counterclaim more likely to be scum, becuase 1 for 1 trades get better for scum as the game progresses. A counterclaim should generally happen as fast as possible, because lynching scum on day 1 is better than lynching scum on day 3.
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Well, the plus side is that in addition to an IC, we have a townslip now.
I missed it. Want to point it out for those of us with a subpar understanding of mafia dynamics?
Scum is much more likely to think about which fakeclaim may or may not work. It's something I always do N0. Teproc however wasn't clear on that. So to me he is either town or it's faked. I don't take scum!Teproc as one to fake townslips.
Also I see no need for passive-aggressive posting.
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Well, the plus side is that in addition to an IC, we have a townslip now.
I missed it. Want to point it out for those of us with a subpar understanding of mafia dynamics?
Scum is much more likely to think about which fakeclaim may or may not work. It's something I always do N0. Teproc however wasn't clear on that. So to me he is either town or it's faked. I don't take scum!Teproc as one to fake townslips.
Also I see no need for passive-aggressive posting.
Fine.
Post.
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vote: yuma
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As tempting as it would be to do the post thing again or to do something even less anti-town, self vote, I won't.
Vote: Faust
I think one or both of he and teproc is scum. I get the vibe of them trying to push me out of being level headed and see if they can get me/town to self destruct for an easy day1 lynch where they can point the blame at me afterward. And as fun as that sounds, i always play toward my win con despite beliefs to the contary. Right now I think Faust is more likely. But I could go either way.
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If you are someone who writes a lot in his QT's, like me, the only way to believably maintain a towny image when playing scum in a game with this ruling is to have 2 separate QT's running and fabricate town!me thoughts in one of them.
Preferably more than 2, so that you can have one where you fabricate VT thoughts, another one where you fabricate PR thoughts, yet another one where you fabricate another PR thoughts, etc. And even if you aren't someone who writes a lot in QTs, you kind of have to do it anyway just because the townies who actually write in their QTs will still have an advantage over you unless you do. It just adds insane crap tons of work that scum has to put in in order to play optimally, and it's really just work you have to do, not an entertaining pastime.
As tempting as it would be to do the post thing again or to do something even less anti-town, self vote, I won't.
Vote: Faust
I think one or both of he and teproc is scum. I get the vibe of them trying to push me out of being level headed and see if they can get me/town to self destruct for an easy day1 lynch where they can point the blame at me afterward. And as fun as that sounds, i always play toward my win con despite beliefs to the contary. Right now I think Faust is more likely. But I could go either way.
What? ???
Vote: yuma
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Vote Count 1.1
Too many cooks spoil the broth.
yuma (3): Awaclus, faust, gkrieg13.
Awaclus (2): chairs, silverspawn.
faust (2): Roadrunner7671, yuma.
Not Voting (6): A Drowned Kernel, EgorK, Hydrad, Lekkit, Teproc, Witherweaver.
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
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oh hey this game started!
welp. I'm going to sleep now.
see you guys tomorrow.
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we have weird wagons, right now. None of them is really good.
How about vote: ADK?
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we have weird wagons, right now. None of them is really good.
How about vote: ADK?
Is it soft claim?
Vote: ADK then
I seriously think that we should forbid self-voting by the rules. Board game RMM was much more pleasant (though I understand that there this was required by setup)
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Is it soft claim?
no!!
I mean vote: Hydrad
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Just someone who isn't yuma or Awaclus or faust or ADK or Teproc
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Just someone who isn't yuma or Awaclus or faust or ADK or Teproc
What makes Hydrad a better choice than Awaclus ? Or anyone else who isn't ADK for that matter, why are these options bad ?
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Hm, ok
Vote: yuma
You said yourself in recent game that you was mislynched once. Now you say that you are easy to be manipulated into self destruction?
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
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Yuma being paranoid is townie if anything.
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Just someone who isn't yuma or Awaclus or faust or ADK or Teproc
What makes Hydrad a better choice than Awaclus ? Or anyone else who isn't ADK for that matter, why are these options bad ?
faust is obvious
I agree that yuma being paranoid makes him townie. In his last scum game he was just generally desinterested. Also I think the way he pulled this on an emotional level... was pretty unjustified. I don't think scum right now is likely to blatantly fake an emotional reaction like this (even though it would be good play), and I think they're less likely to really have it. This felt like town!yuma thinking he's being discredited. Also calling them scum is a bit extreme for a scum play.
Awaclus gets sympathy points for agreeing with me. Okay, this isn't a good reason. I could vote for him again.
And you had your town slip. Town slips are real.
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
I don't think this generally works out well, neither in theory nor historically. The common wisdom is actually the opposite: that town is more likely to do crazy things. Do you really disagree with that?
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I guess the "faust is obvious part" is that you don't lynch faust on day 1 ?
I have no such qualms, but I get that. Actually I think I agree... not about never lycnhing faust d1, but about this :
vote: Hydrad
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I don't think this generally works out well, neither in theory nor historically. The common wisdom is actually the opposite: that town is more likely to do crazy things. Do you really disagree with that?
Yes.
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I guess the "faust is obvious part" is that you don't lynch faust on day 1 ?
no, not radically. I could lynch him if I had a strong scum read. It just needs to be a bit stronger than maybe it does on average, and right now he's null to mild town, so it doesn't look likely.
vote: Hydrad
really? hasn't he only made one post?
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As tempting as it would be to do the post thing again or to do something even less anti-town, self vote, I won't.
Vote: Faust
I think one or both of he and teproc is scum. I get the vibe of them trying to push me out of being level headed and see if they can get me/town to self destruct for an easy day1 lynch where they can point the blame at me afterward. And as fun as that sounds, i always play toward my win con despite beliefs to the contary. Right now I think Faust is more likely. But I could go either way.
You seem to think that I am one big asshole. I don't know what made you feel this way, and if I acted towards you in a way that was rude or otherwise inappropriate, I am sorry.
I am sure we can discuss our recent differences in a couple of hours, if you feel that this is necessary.
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I don't think Yuma freaking out and omgus'ing is indicative of alignment either way.
On the other v hand I like vote: gkrieg for jumping on the Yuma wagon in a super scummy fashion.
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Vote: yuma
This going to be another one of those scenarios where you tunnel me to the point of doing nothing else and force me to hammer you...? yeah. I said it. That hammer in Marvel was intentional. I lied back there to stay alive. I am willing to do it again...
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Hm, ok
Vote: yuma
You said yourself in recent game that you was mislynched once. Now you say that you are easy to be manipulated into self destruction?
I have been mislynched once. This is true and I am proud of it. But I have also shown of late that I am easily manipulated to have emotional reactions and it has been shown of late that f.DS hates and finds emotional reactions scummy and easy to lynch. I don't know if that means I am easy to lynch, but I think that scum could see it as a viable strategy to take.
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I don't feel like I am being paranoid. I feel like I am calling it as I see it with the available information that is currently available.
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As tempting as it would be to do the post thing again or to do something even less anti-town, self vote, I won't.
Vote: Faust
I think one or both of he and teproc is scum. I get the vibe of them trying to push me out of being level headed and see if they can get me/town to self destruct for an easy day1 lynch where they can point the blame at me afterward. And as fun as that sounds, i always play toward my win con despite beliefs to the contary. Right now I think Faust is more likely. But I could go either way.
You seem to think that I am one big asshole. I don't know what made you feel this way, and if I acted towards you in a way that was rude or otherwise inappropriate, I am sorry.
I am sure we can discuss our recent differences in a couple of hours, if you feel that this is necessary.
I don't think you are anything and you certainly don't need to apologize. Someone can feel frustrated with another player for reasons that aren't rude/mean/whatever. But I do think you know that right now there are certain buttons that can be pushed (not in a mean way, just in general conversation) that are more likely to push me having a response that I could see being beneficial to scum!you.
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This going to be another one of those scenarios where you tunnel me to the point of doing nothing else and force me to hammer you...? yeah. I said it. That hammer in Marvel was intentional. I lied back there to stay alive. I am willing to do it again...
Well, it wasn't one of those scenarios when I voted for you, but it's slowly starting to become one.
But it's not too late. You have the power to change it.
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This going to be another one of those scenarios where you tunnel me to the point of doing nothing else and force me to hammer you...? yeah. I said it. That hammer in Marvel was intentional. I lied back there to stay alive. I am willing to do it again...
Well, it wasn't one of those scenarios when I voted for you, but it's slowly starting to become one.
But it's not too late. You have the power to change it.
I do? You mean, things I do change how you respond/react? Fascinating!
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I don't think Yuma freaking out and omgus'ing is indicative of alignment either way.
On the other v hand I like vote: gkrieg for jumping on the Yuma wagon in a super scummy fashion.
How was that a super scummy fashion?
yuma started doing his post thing, which he did last time as town IIRC, so it would be perfect for him to do it as scum this game
PPE
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Vote: gkrieg
I do not buy this. Now M74 is over, and we can talk about the speccy. Clearly what yuma did here was in reaction to something I said in that speccy. gkrieg was in that same speccy and should know this.
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Vote: gkrieg
I do not buy this. Now M74 is over, and we can talk about the speccy. Clearly what yuma did here was in reaction to something I said in that speccy. gkrieg was in that same speccy and should know this.
I think what gkrieg is saying is that he voted for me before my "paranoia" post about you and teproc. He voted for me because of my "post" post. So that doesn't include the M74 speccy stuff.
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It was all about the post post
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Hm, ok
Vote: yuma
You said yourself in recent game that you was mislynched once. Now you say that you are easy to be manipulated into self destruction?
I have been mislynched once. This is true and I am proud of it. But I have also shown of late that I am easily manipulated to have emotional reactions and it has been shown of late that f.DS hates and finds emotional reactions scummy and easy to lynch. I don't know if that means I am easy to lynch, but I think that scum could see it as a viable strategy to take.
When has that been proven ? If anything emotional reactions leads people to back off. The ash lynch in X-Shots wasn't because he had an emotional reaction...
I don't feel like I am being paranoid. I feel like I am calling it as I see it with the available information that is currently available.
In your experience, does scum really try to "wind up" town players ?
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Vote: gkrieg
I do not buy this. Now M74 is over, and we can talk about the speccy. Clearly what yuma did here was in reaction to something I said in that speccy. gkrieg was in that same speccy and should know this.
I think what gkrieg is saying is that he voted for me before my "paranoia" post about you and teproc. He voted for me because of my "post" post. So that doesn't include the M74 speccy stuff.
I thought the "post" post was related to the speccy discussion.
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Vote: gkrieg
I do not buy this. Now M74 is over, and we can talk about the speccy. Clearly what yuma did here was in reaction to something I said in that speccy. gkrieg was in that same speccy and should know this.
I think what gkrieg is saying is that he voted for me before my "paranoia" post about you and teproc. He voted for me because of my "post" post. So that doesn't include the M74 speccy stuff.
I thought the "post" post was related to the speccy discussion.
I stopped reading the speccy in M74 when you guys all started getting in an argument
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Hm, ok
Vote: yuma
You said yourself in recent game that you was mislynched once. Now you say that you are easy to be manipulated into self destruction?
I have been mislynched once. This is true and I am proud of it. But I have also shown of late that I am easily manipulated to have emotional reactions and it has been shown of late that f.DS hates and finds emotional reactions scummy and easy to lynch. I don't know if that means I am easy to lynch, but I think that scum could see it as a viable strategy to take.
When has that been proven ? If anything emotional reactions leads people to back off. The ash lynch in X-Shots wasn't because he had an emotional reaction...
I don't feel like I am being paranoid. I feel like I am calling it as I see it with the available information that is currently available.
In your experience, does scum really try to "wind up" town players ?
I think part of the ash lynch was in fact his emotional reaction. Not all of it, but certainly a part of it. I know that I got to something... L-2 in Marvel for my emotional reaction. So not lynched, but close. I can't think of others off hand, but I am sure they are out there.
And I don't know if scum tries to "wind up" town players. I know I have done it. I could see either of you trying to do it. Why wouldn't it be a valid strategy?
Let's say I didn't get my cool a little bit more together and came back today and just did a "post" post. Ya think people would be pushing for my lynch? So why not try to steer in that direction as scum?
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I don't know how much your read of your wagon in Marvel, but it was about your "I won't do anything more this game and will hammer anyone who gets at L-1", which didn't seem like it had a time limit on it, not about the emotional reaction. It was about purposefully taking a "I'm not playing the game anymore" line, not about any of the actual fight.
I'm not saying it wouldn't be a valid strategy (though I would never do it on purpose as I personally find it unpleasant to have these fights), I'm saying it's not something that scum actually does in practice, could be wrong though.
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I'm with Teproc on this. I don't remember a single game where scum pursued that strategy. Which isn't to say it's impossible, but I think the accusation gets thrown around way more than the thing actually happening.
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ok well. You guys are always going to win these conversations cause well, you are you. So kudos.
So imma gonna leave my vote where it is til I see a reason not to.
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ok well. You guys are always going to win these conversations cause well, you are you. So kudos.
So imma gonna leave my vote where it is til I see a reason not to.
I'm town! Is that reason enough? No? Awww.
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ok well. You guys are always going to win these conversations cause well, you are you. So kudos.
So imma gonna leave my vote where it is til I see a reason not to.
I'm town! Is that reason enough? No? Awww.
This would make me vote for you, but I already am.
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Vote: EgorK
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Vote: EgorK
Did not see that one coming.
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ok well. You guys are always going to win these conversations cause well, you are you. So kudos.
So imma gonna leave my vote where it is til I see a reason not to.
I'm town! Is that reason enough? No? Awww.
This would make me vote for you, but I already am.
Since you mention it, you never answered the question why you originally voted for me.
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ok well. You guys are always going to win these conversations cause well, you are you. So kudos.
So imma gonna leave my vote where it is til I see a reason not to.
I'm town! Is that reason enough? No? Awww.
This would make me vote for you, but I already am.
Since you mention it, you never answered the question why you originally voted for me.
RVS.
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vote: RR
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vote: RR
Why?
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vote: RR
Why?
Your faust tunneling is bad, and I'm not sure I believe that the first vote was RVS
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vote: RR
Why?
Your faust tunneling is bad, and I'm not sure I believe that the first vote was RVS
Okay.
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The "post" post?
faust/teproc/yuma scumteam calling it now.
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Vote Count 1.2
An apple a day keeps the doctor away.
yuma (3): Awaclus, gkrieg13, EgorK.
Awaclus (1): chairs.
faust (2): Roadrunner7671, yuma.
Roadrunner7671 (1): silverspawn.
EgorK (1): Witherweaver.
gkrieg13 (2): A Drowned Kernel, faust.
Hydrad (1): Teproc.
Not Voting (2): Hydrad, Lekkit.
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
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The "post" post?
faust/teproc/yuma scumteam calling it now.
phooey
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The "post" post?
faust/teproc/yuma scumteam calling it now.
That would be a scary scumteam.
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oh and we have an IC now?
awesome!
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Vote: awaclus
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Someone care to tell me what this yuma "post" post thing is?
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Someone care to tell me what this yuma "post" post thing is?
You're required to post every 24 hours, but the post doesn't necessarily need to contain anything other than "post". Yuma did this for a couple of days in a recent game.
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okay vote: hydrad may be good after all
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okay vote: hydrad may be good after all
Agreed. vote: Hydrad
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Can anyone provide case on him?
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Can anyone provide case on him?
Nope.
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Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
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Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
Well your profile picture is a Tactician, so we'll mine as while lynch you.
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I don't get it ?
If you mean to say the reasons for Hydrad are as consequential as "I don't live your avatar", I disagree... those aren't great by any stretch of imagination, but they're something.
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Just a heads up I'm sick as fuck right now so I'm not a good source of posting content. I'm at the doctor's now
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Hydrad/RR are scumbuddies, calling it right now.
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Hydrad/RR are scumbuddies, calling it right now.
Kewl. Which of teproc/Faust is the third?
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Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
I have a hard time ever criticizing a vote on awaclus. I mean it is a vote on awaclus.
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Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
I have a hard time ever criticizing a vote on awaclus. I mean it is a vote on awaclus.
Exactly.
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I don't get it ?
If you mean to say the reasons for Hydrad are as consequential as "I don't live your avatar", I disagree... those aren't great by any stretch of imagination, but they're something.
I dunno thats a pretty good defense of his. I like it. I'd unvote me if I was you.
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I would vote Hydrad twice now if I could.
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Hydrad/RR are scumbuddies, calling it right now.
Kewl. Which of teproc/Faust is the third?
I'm not particularly inclined to think either? I don't know yet, I'm null on a lot of people this game.
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Hydrad/RR are scumbuddies, calling it right now.
Nice meme.
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yuma's Awaclus bashing is getting annoying.
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And uh thinking more about it... vote: yuma again.
I don't know what this constant lashing out at people is supposed to contribute to the game. I definitely feel that it helps scum more than it helps town.
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It does not help town at all, I should say. It creates an unfriendly environment in which people are less likely to cooperate and have meaningful discussions and more likely to get and a fight or lurk because they don't want to get in a fight.
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I highly doubt it has anything to do with yuma's alignment. Also, Awaclus bashing has become somewhat of a local sport... and while I do think people (myself included) overdo it, I can't really fault anyone for it.
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The fact that nothing appears to be happening should indicate scum is lurking right ?
I wonder who that might point us towards...
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The fact that nothing appears to be happening should indicate scum is lurking right ?
I wonder who that might point us towards...
Hydrad and RR?
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The fact that nothing appears to be happening should indicate scum is lurking right ?
I wonder who that might point us towards...
... how does it indicate that scum is lurking and not that town is lurking? I don't follow.
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Also gkrieg, I was voting for him awhile back and would feel comfortable doing so again.
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I have nothing nice to say about faust's most recent posts. I have notice things to say though.
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I have notice things to say though.
What does this mean ?
@faust : You're right, actually. I guess it should probably indicate that scum is among people for whom lurking is unusual. So... WW ? Still like Hydrad though.
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Typo: not nice
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yeah vote: yuma makes even more sense than hydrad
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Is this the point where I am supposed to self vote because it is so pro-town? I can never remember...
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Is this the point where I am supposed to self vote because it is so pro-town? I can never remember...
Self-voting is anti-town. So is this.
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Is this the point where I am supposed to self vote because it is so pro-town? I can never remember...
Self-voting is anti-town. So is this.
Being annoyed. Yeah it probably is. But I am still learning to have perfect control over my emotions. So is poking and prodding me so I'll get annoyed.
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Hence my continued vote on Faust.
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I was more poking to get you to do something relevant to the game.
PPE : I guess that counts.
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Doing a quick yuma reread.
Post 1 - some discussion about private QTs
Post 2 - more of this
Post 3 - says he has some ideas about the setup. What where they, if I may ask?
Post 4 - sees ADKs claim
Post 5 - explains some obvious stuff about the claim
Post 6 - says noone else (in the same setup as Fruit Vendor) should claim, and think ADK is town
Post 7 - questions counterclaiming
Post 8 - more of this
Post 9 - even more of this
Post 10 - calls Teproc's opinion "ridiculous" and votes for him because he's "annoyed"
Post 11 - implying that I am arrogant
Post 12 - implying Teproc does not read properly
Post 13 - "post" post
Post 14 - votes me because Teproc and me are supposedly pushing his buttons
Post 15 - discrediting Awaclus as he votes for yuma
Post 16 - defends his Post 14 position
Post 17 - more of this
Post 18 - even more of this
Post 19 - making fun of Awaclus
Post 20 - arguing against my gkrieg vote
Post 21 - more defending his vote. Also says he tries to "wind up" town players as scum
Post 22 - subtly discrediting Teproc's and my position by implying we would win the discussion due to something other than having better arguments
Post 23 - phooey
Post 24 - more empty posting
Post 25 - more Awaclus bashing
Post 26 - he has "nothing nice" to say about my posts
Post 27 - typo fix
Post 28 - being annoying
Post 29 - says I am "poking and prodding" him so he will get upset
Post 30 - further defends his vote on me
So what I see is a giant OMGUS case on me and nothing else that moves the game forward. I think town!yuma is more productive than this.
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I think this is just annoyed!yuma. I'll reread later thoufh
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Post by post discussion of my posts coming up cause apparently I need to be more engaged in this game... Maybe for fun I'll then compare to others in this game and I am guessing that I will be on the more engaged side of the curve compared to the rest of town on average.
You will also see once I spell it out that faust is pushing a biased agenda with some of his descriptors. I am sure you are all on the edge of your seat, but this has to wait til I am on a laptop, and that means waiting until the little one is in bed...
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The fact that nothing appears to be happening should indicate scum is lurking right ?
I wonder who that might point us towards...
Hydrad and RR?
Yeah, I'm such a lurker.
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The fact that nothing appears to be happening should indicate scum is lurking right ?
I wonder who that might point us towards...
Hydrad and RR?
Yeah, I'm such a lurker.
I'm pretty much a lurker though. but ya interesting that he would say you.
If we really wanted a lurker team...
oh man actually theres a decent amount this game.
me/awaclus/chairs/lekkit and egork I guess?
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Also I like yuma right now. hes town to me.
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my comments in red
Doing a quick yuma reread.
Post 1 - some discussion about private QTs faust's first post is talking about ADK's fan fiction
Post 2 - more of this whoopie
Post 3 - says he has some ideas about the setup. What where they, if I may ask? I had some, but at that point ADK had already claimed
Post 4 - sees ADKs claim stating the above
Post 5 - explains some obvious stuff about the claim cause everyone reads the setup right... you are saying this like it is a bad thing to state obvious things. Is it?
Post 6 - says noone else (in the same setup as Fruit Vendor) should claim, and think ADK is town and I still stand by that idea. I think it checks out
Post 7 - questions counterclaiming a valid question
Post 8 - more of this still a valid question to your unnecessarily curt response to a question that was more nuanced
Post 9 - even more of this still valid because your response didn't respond to what I was actually talking about
Post 10 - calls Teproc's opinion "ridiculous" and votes for him because he's "annoyed" It was. "I don't care that you're likely to die" is ridiculous, but then we are getting into that conversation again
Post 11 - implying that I am arrogant You are, or at least your tone conveys a sense of arrogance that is grating (and not just here, but in practically all of the mafia threads/QT/ect) maybe that is personal, but if you can be annoyed with me I can be annoyed with you
Post 12 - implying Teproc does not read properly He didn't. Or at least he didn't respond to what I posted
Post 13 - "post" post post
Post 14 - votes me because Teproc and me are supposedly pushing his buttons still a valid concept
Post 15 - discrediting Awaclus as he votes for yuma discrediting? I don't know where that comes from. Below you ask why I give Awaclus crap. You remember that one time he refused to stop voting for me to his own detriment because of his stubborn nature. That is why. Maybe I should just let bygones be bygones, but man... that was annoying last game, so yeah...
Post 16 - defends his Post 14 position defending positions is good
Post 17 - more of this still good
Post 18 - even more of this even still good
Post 19 - making fun of Awaclus again making reference to last game where he refused to move despite anything that I did
Post 20 - arguing against my gkrieg vote arguing? Try clarifying what looked like a misunderstanding on your part.
Post 21 - more defending his vote. Also says he tries to "wind up" town players as scum I do. Remember Dune I. I don't want to get into that, but a small portion of that was certainly intentional at the beginning
Post 22 - subtly discrediting Teproc's and my position by implying we would win the discussion due to something other than having better arguments discrediting? I don't know if you have better arguments or not because you both fail to actually address the points that I bring up. So it is hard to tell. If you want to have an argument with imaginary yuma you are always going to win. I am sure your points are valid and have worth, but you aren't debating me, you are debating what you want to think I am saying or what you think I am saying, not what I am actually saying
Post 23 - phooey phooey still. Why is my phooey bad, but a lame team calling post is OK?
Post 24 - more empty posting same as above
Post 25 - more Awaclus bashing bashing? more to do with me thinking hydrad lynch is pretty meh at this point
Post 26 - he has "nothing nice" to say about my posts still have nothing nice to say, you want to hear my not nice stuff?
Post 27 - typo fix typos happen, at least they do to me.
Post 28 - being annoying annoying? ok, sure.
Post 29 - says I am "poking and prodding" him so he will get upset aren't you. What is the point of this then?
Post 30 - further defends his vote on me yep. plus think you missed a post. But it was just more empty posting...
So what I see is a giant OMGUS case on me and nothing else that moves the game forward. I think town!yuma is more productive than this.
Keep in mind that this isn't OMGUS at all. You certainly haven't done anything to make me think you are town. This feels a lot more like OMGUS from you. Actually it feels more like GUS. Or just US.
Note the red bold... bashing, arguing, annoying, discrediting. There is an agenda here. Either faust is at a point where he really doesn't have a very high opinion of me or he is doing what I am accusing him of doing. For the first... man I am trying to play nice and get along, but sometimes, I start to wonder why I play these games. As for the second, I think it a very valid tactic as mentioned before.
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Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
I have a hard time ever criticizing a vote on awaclus. I mean it is a vote on awaclus.
Well, given this ruling:
A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
I think it should be pretty obvious that I'm town since I'm still playing this game.
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Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
I have a hard time ever criticizing a vote on awaclus. I mean it is a vote on awaclus.
Well, given this ruling:
A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
I think it should be pretty obvious that I'm town since I'm still playing this game.
Please don't.
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yuma, if you're trying to play nice, you're not trying hard enough. Neither is faust. Neither am I probably, but still.
I agree this faust reread of yours is... I don't know what to call it really, but it's not good. Does lead credence to the "egging on" theory, but his ultimate point (that town!you is more productive) isn't entirely off-base, so I'mleaning town.
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Please don't.
Don't do what? It's true.
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I'd like to know which arguments of yours I haven't adressed by the way. That was about the "people should counterclaim ADK" thing right ? You seemto think a PR outing themselves is too big a cost (since you say it's "ridiculous" when i say I don't care if they're likely to die"), which I disagree with because it cathces scum. It's equivalent to a Cop claiming a result, and that's obviously good, so... really I don't get your position at all.
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dayvig: Awaclus
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I'm just adding more fuel to the fire, aren't I ?
Sorry about that. It'd be nice if the people lurking stopped doing so, because this is also playing a part in this whole thing. When the only people talking are getting progressively annoyed with each other and the only guy jumping in is Awaclus, it gets nasty. So please, Hydrad, RR, Lekkit... who else is in this game ?
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I'm here!
Lets all be friends!
Did I do it?
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but ya even SS and WW are posting less then they usually are I think.
Although I feel like ss just isn't having enough time lately or something as I've thought this for other games recently as well.
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That's the spirit.
Do you think any of this mess is indicative of anyone's alignment ?
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That's the spirit.
Do you think any of this mess is indicative of anyone's alignment ?
No. I don't feel like anyone is trying to purposly egg someone on either for a scum strat or anything either.
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Sorry I've had a really busy day. I will get to this more tomorrow.
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yuma, if you're trying to play nice, you're not trying hard enough. Neither is faust. Neither am I probably, but still.
I agree this faust reread of yours is... I don't know what to call it really, but it's not good. Does lead credence to the "egging on" theory, but his ultimate point (that town!you is more productive) isn't entirely off-base, so I'mleaning town.
I am probably not. And it isn't just this game and I don't necessarily want to get super into it, but I feel that any conversation with you/faust/others ultimately leads to a tone--not the words mind you--of 'Yuma is being an idiot' when what you think I am saying is pretty stupid and I can't seem to get you to understand what I am actually saying. And after trying a few times I just give up.
That is kinda where I am at. Certainly part of that is on me I will readily admit and I am trying. I don't know if I am not trying enough. I mean... Part of my trying is stopping the conversation before it completely derails the whole thread, cause that is what I used to do.
It feels like what you guys want me to do is state that you guys are right when in fact I disagree. And I guess I could do that but I would be lying through my teeth and I am not really inclined to do that.
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I'm here!
Lets all be friends!
Did I do it?
Sure, but who's scum?
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I'm here!
Lets all be friends!
Did I do it?
Sure, but who's scum?
I have no idea!
but I'm very slowly building a towny list. so progress!
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@yuma : When I'm arguing with you, my goal is not for you to say I'm right. If you feel like the conversation is going nowhere, just move on. I should probably do this more as well, let things lie. These things are subjective (well even more here where there's the issue of unknown alignments/sincerity, but this also goes for the other arguments we've been in recently), it's fine if we just disagree.
It should be obvious but : I don't think you're an idiot, and I hope you don't think I'm not giving weight to what you say. It's just that we disagree a lot, and I'm fine with that, it would be pretty boring if everyone always agreed on anything.
It had gone a bit too far lately though, and I think we're all tired of it. You, me, faust, everyone else in the game looking at this and apparently not really wanting to get involved (or just being busy I guess). It's obviously making this game less fun for both of us at the very least.
So... I think we should generally try to be less aggressive with each other, and try not to be snappy and use language we know will get others riled up.
Now that this is out of the way... let's lynch Hydrad. Always fun.
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I do think Hydrad not getting any reads of the whole faust/yuma/me thing is scummy, by the way.
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I do think Hydrad not getting any reads of the whole faust/yuma/me thing is scummy, by the way.
then did you get reads from it?
(other then me....)
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I think faust gets townier. I don't think he goes to all this trouble as scum. He might hope it gets the old "town v town, let's move on" treatment, but I don't know, I think his yuma reread was too aggressive to come from scum, as I don't buy the "riling up" argument.
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Vote Count 1.3
To eat is human; to digest, divine.
yuma (5): Awaclus, gkrieg13, EgorK, faust, silverspawn. (L-2)
Awaclus (2): chairs, Hydrad.
faust (2): Roadrunner7671, yuma.
EgorK (1): Witherweaver.
Hydrad (2): Teproc, A Drowned Kernel.
Not Voting (1): Lekkit.
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
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Hedging time: I can see yuma being both scum or town here. I think the frustration is real.
faust seems town to me. I don't think scum would try this hard to make a case out of something this loose this early.
Teproc just sitting back, enjoying the fireworks seemed really shady to me so I did a reread.
I've been thinking about this too. My main problem is that, in most if no all cases, it ust gives scum the whole setup, which they don't know yet (I think in most situations they're looking at two possible setups).
There are two things to note here. First, he's been thinking about this. Let's leave it at that for now. Second, he's clear on the fact that it gives scum the whole setup.
When you say it like that it sounds like a bigger benefit for scum, but in reality I think going from very uncertain to slightly uncertain is less good than going from slightly uncertain to absolutely certain.
This could be a language thing, he says that when it's put like that, it sounds like it's better for scum when it's actually better for scum. This to me looks very much like he was meaning to say something, then realized what it was supposed to say if he was town and changed it. But again. Language and also the fact that this is also something that's kind of opinion based makes me not want to put too much emphasis on this part. But also note that it sounds like he's still not sure on whether it's good or bad to claim.
So, assuming no one counterclaims...
There are about a billion setups where this is a safe fakeclaim for scum. So... not much towncred for ADK there as long as there isn't another PR or scum flip.
Here's a real nugget. Suddenly there's no credit to claiming? What happened to you thinking about this too? faust laid it out very well, but suddenly all it did was give scum the whole setup. Not creating an IC. This to me reads like you've been thinking about only needing to know of one role to figure out the whole setup.
If ADK is town, it means
- Fruit Vendor + Watcher + Cop + 7 VTs vs JOAT + Roleblocker + Goon
- Fruit Vendor + JK + Even-night Tracker + 7VTs vs Rolecop + 2-shot Strongman + Goon
Laying out the obvious in case anyone missed it. HOWEVER what he didn't remember was that if you're town and another PR you should counterclaim and we'll guaranteed lynch scum. This is obviously a total brain fart or a way to try to sound like you misunderstood something. Either way. It's REALLY weird for someone who "thought about it".
If he's a PR in the same row as ADK he should know ADK is telling the truth, and more importantly know why. If he's a PR from another row he should know ADK is fake-claiming.
If he's a VT him saying he thought about it and then getting his facts so messed up is simply... I dunno... I just don't see what he'd have thought about. Why even say it if it's not true. I think VT is not likely due to that.
My conclusion is that the only way Teproc makes sense is if he's scum. So I'll leave my vote on him. Vote: Teproc
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I like the Teproc case. Not sure if I like it more than yuma.
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So. Let me try one last time. This is me trying, okay? If it doesn't work out, I will just leave the game since I am not having fun. I hope it doesn't get to that, but we're pretty close.
So, first, yuma (and everyone else I guess), I would like for you to consider things the way the look from my point of view. The game is going pretty normally, then I vote for yuma. Directly after this vote, the yuma thing starts (I think that is what I will call it; feel free to call it the faust thing or whatever, I have no desire to get into a fight about how my wording of things pushes people in a certain direction or something).
Now I think people on this forum might have realized by now that I do not feel comfortable in emotional fights. I prefer to have productive discussions without getting personal. People might have seen that I am usually quicker to view the civility pledge as violated than others are. This is why, and for all I know, this is a known fact.
So what yuma's reaction achieves is waking a desire in me to stop voting for him because then we hopefully will not have this whole fight that I really don't want to have. Maybe you can see how to me, this felt like yuma trying to manipulate me into leaving him alone. yuma then makes this post:
I don't think you are anything and you certainly don't need to apologize. Someone can feel frustrated with another player for reasons that aren't rude/mean/whatever.
so I am relieved because apparently it is not personal. I continue to play the game normally, but yuma still seems annoyed. Then I have this feeling that yuma's posts are almost all not doing scumhunting stuff. I know that voting for yuma will re-trigger all this emotional stuff, but I also do not want to be in a game where I cannot vote for a player that I believe is scummy because that player might hold a grudge against me.
I try to back up my feeling about yuma's contributions, so I do a reread. Doig a post-by-post, I realize he indeed has not expressed any read other than the one on me/Teproc. Granted, it is early in the game, but given that it is yuma and given his activity level so far, I found this worth noticing and thus I posted a summary of all his posts. It is certainly not meant as a guide to show how every single one of yuma's posts is scummy, because that would be ridiculous. But I hoped it would back up my feeling that yuma seemed disinterested in doing actual scumhunting.
I call it OMGUS because obviously yuma has his reaction, and subsequent vote for me, after I vote for him, and at least in part because I am voting for him.
But now this catches me entirely off guard:
Post 11 - implying that I am arrogant You are
I have no idea how I should react to this. I thought you had nothing personally against me (see the earlier quoted post), now this. I of course cannot be the judge of whether or not I am arrogant, or whether or not my posts convey that I am. I know I am trying not to be, and if I am failing, I am deeply and truly sorry. I would love to know what I did to produce this image, but I see that this is not the time and place for this discussion. And I have to consider the option that this is fake because after all we are playing a game of mafia.
But know that if it is fake, while I see that one might debate this is within the rules and within the civility pledge, it is not the way I want to play this game. I understand that yuma, should he have faked this, can of course not back out now, so I am simply stating this for future games. But this is also why yuma's accusation of me pushing his buttons seems so off base for me: because that is absolutely not the way I want this game played, and I would never play that way, and I thought others knew this about me.
And if it is not fake, well obviously my continued presence in this game will make it unpleasant for both yuma and me, so unless we can settle this somehow, I would prefer to be replaced by somebody else.
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I'm here!
Lets all be friends!
Did I do it?
Sure, but who's scum?
Hydrad/RR of course!
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I'm going preliminary town on Lekkit.
Yuma seems like Yuma and not town! or scum! Yuma. I also have no experience catching scum!Yuma. Votes on him seem uninspired though.
Faust could go either way. Also, Faust you shouldn't leave this game.. emotions are going to come up as we're all basically arguing with each other, or at least on the verge of it. Some people's style (intentional or not) is to be more passionate, so these things happen.
I voted Egor because I thought this vote was bad:
Hm, ok
Vote: yuma
You said yourself in recent game that you was mislynched once. Now you say that you are easy to be manipulated into self destruction?
I still do. The question there was also serves as explanation for the vote, but why is Yuma scummy because of it? I had also originally thought it was odd that Egor suddenly changed votes (he doesn't often 'vote around' a lot), but looking back I see it was because he thought Silver was counterclaiming ADK. So, maybe not a lot there.
RR is a coin toss, as usual. Chairs I don't have anything from.
Hydrad seems like normal Hydrad, but that's become a non-alignment indicator.
ADK I don't want to lynch. I also still haven't looked up what Fruit Vendor does. Even in a case where scum knows its a safe claim (I haven't checked myself to see if that's possible), I'm not sure scum!ADK is the kind of player that does this. Though we've had a string of early town claims lately.
Gkrieg I don't remember much from.
I'm not sure about Lekkit's last point against Teproc (regarding counterclaiming).. at most I see that it implies Teproc does not have a PR that can counterclaim ADK; I don't see where the rest comes from. He also claims Teproc is kind of posting without contributing. I'm not really sure if this is true or not. Nothing Teproc has done so far has made me want to reaction-vote him.
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I'm pretty sure what that all boils down to is:
Town: ADK, Lekkit
Null: Everyone
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I think faust gets townier. I don't think he goes to all this trouble as scum. He might hope it gets the old "town v town, let's move on" treatment, but I don't know, I think his yuma reread was too aggressive to come from scum, as I don't buy the "riling up" argument.
I don't think this is true at all, regarding the 'goes through all this trouble' thing.
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
Ah, so you're explaining your vote. That solves it, Awaclus has to be scum.
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
Ah, so you're explaining your vote. That solves it, Awaclus has to be scum.
Really, I'm being dead serious here. If I was scum, I would have /outted immediately upon seeing the rule clarification.
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Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
No. Take, for instance, a setup where scum has JOAT/Goon. One of those setups has a Tracker, and one has a Commuter, both roles that cannot appear together with Fruit Vendor. So if scum were to claim Fruit Vendor, they would immediately get countered. You can go through all scenarios and see that there will always be the chance of a counterclaim.
Good thing Faust is here to do work so I don't have to.
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
Ah, so you're explaining your vote. That solves it, Awaclus has to be scum.
Really, I'm being dead serious here. If I was scum, I would have /outted immediately upon seeing the rule clarification.
As problematic as that is, I actually don't feel like lynching you this game.
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Looking back some, pretty sure Lekkit is wrong about Teproc.
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
Ah, so you're explaining your vote. That solves it, Awaclus has to be scum.
Really, I'm being dead serious here. If I was scum, I would have /outted immediately upon seeing the rule clarification.
But that would be not playing to your win condition.
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
Ah, so you're explaining your vote. That solves it, Awaclus has to be scum.
Really, I'm being dead serious here. If I was scum, I would have /outted immediately upon seeing the rule clarification.
And if you had you would have been forever banned from any game I would have hosted in the future.
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Sorry, have a huge headache for last couple of days, hopefully I'll be able to catch up and contribute over week end
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Sent a pm to the mod. Guess we will see what happens
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I like Lekkit's argument for scum!Teproc, but WW you say you don't. What makes you think he's wrong?
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What? ???
That's what I thought too, but does that really make yuma scummy?
Yes. Whenever I think "What? ???", it makes that person scummy.
Ah, so you're explaining your vote. That solves it, Awaclus has to be scum.
Really, I'm being dead serious here. If I was scum, I would have /outted immediately upon seeing the rule clarification.
But that would be not playing to your win condition.
That doesn't matter because I could possibly not play to my win condition as scum in this game, since I really need to study, sleep and produce music while this game is still ongoing and I'm not super inclined to throw all of that away just for a game of forum Mafia.
And if you had you would have been forever banned from any game I would have hosted in the future.
Why?
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And if you had you would have been forever banned from any game I would have hosted in the future.
Why?
Um, because you are pulling a reinoe on your scum partners? I would have done the same thing (banned you from my games).
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And if you had you would have been forever banned from any game I would have hosted in the future.
Why?
Um, because you are pulling a reinoe on your scum partners? I would have done the same thing (banned you from my games).
How is /outing from a game suddenly pulling a reinoe? If anything, not /outing when you can't play the game is pulling a reinoe.
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Re: The case on Teproc, well I have a town read on Teproc, but I can see the merit here. I think it would all be fine if there wasn't the post that he's been "thinking about it", because yes it is weird. However we all know weird != scummy, so maybe Lekkit (or anyone else buying the case), could you maybe explain why Teproc would do what he did as scum?
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And if you had you would have been forever banned from any game I would have hosted in the future.
Why?
Um, because you are pulling a reinoe on your scum partners? I would have done the same thing (banned you from my games).
How is /outing from a game suddenly pulling a reinoe? If anything, not /outing when you can't play the game is pulling a reinoe.
Only /outing if you are scum is, because you make it obvious that you are scum and thus harder for your partners to win.
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A few things
Um, because you are pulling a reinoe on your scum partners? I would have done the same thing (banned you from my games).
I don't think this is the same at all. I think he'd either be replaced or the game would be restarted. Since this is a game-deciding rule change that has been deployed right after the game started, it'd be annoying but fair.
The Lekkit case is... very inaccurate I think. I completely disagree with everything. I was going to say doing such a case is scummy, but other people agree, so I don't know what to think. They can't all be scum... or can they?
In yuma's reread of faust I think there was a point if misunderstanding. faust commented on every post - often it was just saying 'this is XX' without judging it, but yuma treated it as if every 'this is XX' comment also implied 'this is bad'.
I agree with the consent that faust is town based on all this. Teproc is also town for his slip and a bit because of Lekkit's case.
RR is being super anti town. vote: RR and stop joking about being scum. try to play for your win con please. Unless you are scum, then you should play against your win con.
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And if you had you would have been forever banned from any game I would have hosted in the future.
Why?
Um, because you are pulling a reinoe on your scum partners? I would have done the same thing (banned you from my games).
How is /outing from a game suddenly pulling a reinoe? If anything, not /outing when you can't play the game is pulling a reinoe.
Only /outing if you are scum is, because you make it obvious that you are scum and thus harder for your partners to win.
but if he /outs then he doesn't have scum partners anymore.
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Um, because you are pulling a reinoe on your scum partners? I would have done the same thing (banned you from my games).
I don't think this is the same at all. I think he'd either be replaced or the game would be restarted. Since this is a game-deciding rule change that has been deployed right after the game started, it'd be annoying but fair.
I could not disagree more. It is not a rule change at all because the thing was already allowed by the rules as posted originally, it was simply not stated directly. If you have a problem with that, you would have to voice that before the game starts, or not /in at all. Else you have to live with the consequences of your actions.
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Only /outing if you are scum is, because you make it obvious that you are scum and thus harder for your partners to win.
Well, obviously I wouldn't have told anyone that I'm /outing because I'm scum. Instead, I could have lied about having an off-game reason to cut down on the games of Mafia I'm playing or something.
I agree with the consent that faust is town based on all this. Teproc is also town for his slip and a bit because of Lekkit's case.
What was Teproc's town slip?
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but if he /outs then he doesn't have scum partners anymore.
If you really believe that /outing if and only if you get a scum role is okay, then I cannot help you.
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but if he /outs then he doesn't have scum partners anymore.
If you really believe that /outing if and only if you get a scum role is okay, then I cannot help you.
If no-one knows that's the reason, why not?
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What was Teproc's town slip?
Scum is much more likely to think about which fakeclaim may or may not work. It's something I always do N0. Teproc however wasn't clear on that. So to me he is either town or it's faked. I don't take scum!Teproc as one to fake townslips.
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I mean, obviously if he screws over his past scum partners, that's not okay.
I could not disagree more. It is not a rule change at all because the thing was already allowed by the rules as posted originally, it was simply not stated directly. If you have a problem with that, you would have to voice that before the game starts, or not /in at all. Else you have to live with the consequences of your actions.
If it really was in the rules already then that's a different story.
But I don't think it impacts the question of Awaclus' alignment in any way. Even if what he did was, well, immoral, that doesn't mean that he agrees with that i.e. wouldn't do it.
Which is what matters - do you believe that he would do it or not. If you do, and I think I tend towards doing that, then that should give him town cred.
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but if he /outs then he doesn't have scum partners anymore.
If you really believe that /outing if and only if you get a scum role is okay, then I cannot help you.
If no-one knows that's the reason, why not?
Well I guess it works once. Awaclus seems to want to make it a general rule, which does not work. If I misunderstood his intentions, then it is fine I guess. But people could still have found out that this is the reason by following other threads.
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Well I guess it works once. Awaclus seems to want to make it a general rule, which does not work. If I misunderstood his intentions, then it is fine I guess. But people could still have found out that this is the reason by following other threads.
I doubt he thought it through this far. I certainly didn't.
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What was Teproc's town slip?
Scum is much more likely to think about which fakeclaim may or may not work. It's something I always do N0. Teproc however wasn't clear on that. So to me he is either town or it's faked. I don't take scum!Teproc as one to fake townslips.
Oh right. That makes it clear I like the case on yuma more, then.
Well I guess it works once. Awaclus seems to want to make it a general rule, which does not work. If I misunderstood his intentions, then it is fine I guess. But people could still have found out that this is the reason by following other threads.
Oh, I don't intend to sign up for games where QT quoting is allowed in the future.
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scum!Awaclus is perfectly able to use ongoing rule debates to his benefit I believe. I would not give out town cred for this.
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I like Lekkit's argument for scum!Teproc, but WW you say you don't. What makes you think he's wrong?
Teproc has not been just "watching the fireworks". Aside from the theory/setup/debate talk, he has been actively looking at players. In particular, the move to Hydrad sounds more like town!Teproc than scum!Teproc.
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Well I guess it works once. Awaclus seems to want to make it a general rule, which does not work. If I misunderstood his intentions, then it is fine I guess. But people could still have found out that this is the reason by following other threads.
I doubt he thought it through this far. I certainly didn't.
Of course he did. I'd seriously support everyone (both alignments) agreeing not to use their night actions and us lynching Awaclus and doing day 1 again on day 2. Or simply finding a way to modkill him for it. But it's not technically against the rules so... we'll have to live with it this game.
As for the people actually playing the game : Lekkit is wrong but townie (and I really can't say more about his case, sorry).
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vote: Teproc
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Well I guess it works once. Awaclus seems to want to make it a general rule, which does not work. If I misunderstood his intentions, then it is fine I guess. But people could still have found out that this is the reason by following other threads.
I doubt he thought it through this far. I certainly didn't.
Of course he did.
Well, he's here, so no need to speculate. Did you?
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A few things
Um, because you are pulling a reinoe on your scum partners? I would have done the same thing (banned you from my games).
I don't think this is the same at all. I think he'd either be replaced or the game would be restarted. Since this is a game-deciding rule change that has been deployed right after the game started, it'd be annoying but fair.
The Lekkit case is... very inaccurate I think. I completely disagree with everything. I was going to say doing such a case is scummy, but other people agree, so I don't know what to think. They can't all be scum... or can they?
In yuma's reread of faust I think there was a point if misunderstanding. faust commented on every post - often it was just saying 'this is XX' without judging it, but yuma treated it as if every 'this is XX' comment also implied 'this is bad'.
I agree with the consent that faust is town based on all this. Teproc is also town for his slip and a bit because of Lekkit's case.
RR is being super anti town. vote: RR and stop joking about being scum. try to play for your win con please. Unless you are scum, then you should play against your win con.
I think very inaccurate cases are from town more often than scum. Also, bad cases are better than no cases.
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Vote: Gkrieg
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ADK I don't want to lynch. I also still haven't looked up what Fruit Vendor does. Even in a case where scum knows its a safe claim (I haven't checked myself to see if that's possible), I'm not sure scum!ADK is the kind of player that does this. Though we've had a string of early town claims lately.
In fact. Fruit Vendor is guaranteed to be counterclaimable.
I'm not sure about Lekkit's last point against Teproc (regarding counterclaiming).. at most I see that it implies Teproc does not have a PR that can counterclaim ADK; I don't see where the rest comes from. He also claims Teproc is kind of posting without contributing. I'm not really sure if this is true or not. Nothing Teproc has done so far has made me want to reaction-vote him.
Here's the thing. If Teproc is a PR, there are basically two possibilities.
1. He's a PR from another row. He'll by his own argument counterclaim.
2. He's a PR from the same rows as Fruit Vendor. That would be Even Night Tracker, Jailkeeper, Watcher or Cop. ANY other PR would be able to counterclaim Fruit Vendor. Since nobody did, we can assume that ADK is in fact Fruit Vendor. Yet, he's still hesitant.
If Teproc is VT, then saying he thought about the claiming thing and then getting things messed up seems unlikely to me. Why would he say that? He knew some of the results of someone claiming, namely that scum would know which setup was rolled. But the IC part that faust laid out for him he missed. Basically he knew what would happen if a PR became known for scum but not for town. Not even why town would want to claim. And saying he "thought about that as well" while seemingly only having thought about it from a scum perspective seems... Not like something a VT would really do.
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scum!Awaclus is perfectly able to use ongoing rule debates to his benefit I believe. I would not give out town cred for this.
That's irrelevant. University-student-who-actually-needs-to-get-studying-done-because-his-student-financial-aid-depends-on-him-studying-enough-and-he-spent-last-semester-not-studying-enough-so-at-this-point-he-can't-really-afford-to-fail-a-single-course-this-semester-unless-he-wants-to-get-into-pretty-serious-financial-problems!Awaclus is simply unable to play any game as scum as long as QT quoting is not forbidden in that game.
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ADK I don't want to lynch. I also still haven't looked up what Fruit Vendor does. Even in a case where scum knows its a safe claim (I haven't checked myself to see if that's possible), I'm not sure scum!ADK is the kind of player that does this. Though we've had a string of early town claims lately.
In fact. Fruit Vendor is guaranteed to be counterclaimable.
I'm not sure about Lekkit's last point against Teproc (regarding counterclaiming).. at most I see that it implies Teproc does not have a PR that can counterclaim ADK; I don't see where the rest comes from. He also claims Teproc is kind of posting without contributing. I'm not really sure if this is true or not. Nothing Teproc has done so far has made me want to reaction-vote him.
Here's the thing. If Teproc is a PR, there are basically two possibilities.
1. He's a PR from another row. He'll by his own argument counterclaim.
2. He's a PR from the same rows as Fruit Vendor. That would be Even Night Tracker, Jailkeeper, Watcher or Cop. ANY other PR would be able to counterclaim Fruit Vendor. Since nobody did, we can assume that ADK is in fact Fruit Vendor. Yet, he's still hesitant.
If Teproc is VT, then saying he thought about the claiming thing and then getting things messed up seems unlikely to me. Why would he say that? He knew some of the results of someone claiming, namely that scum would know which setup was rolled. But the IC part that faust laid out for him he missed. Basically he knew what would happen if a PR became known for scum but not for town. Not even why town would want to claim. And saying he "thought about that as well" while seemingly only having thought about it from a scum perspective seems... Not like something a VT would really do.
Oh, I see. That is a better point than I thought.
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Of course he did. I'd seriously support everyone (both alignments) agreeing not to use their night actions and us lynching Awaclus and doing day 1 again on day 2. Or simply finding a way to modkill him for it. But it's not technically against the rules so... we'll have to live with it this game.
That would be ridiculous. This is perfectly allowed by the rules and beneficial for town.
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Of course he did. I'd seriously support everyone (both alignments) agreeing not to use their night actions and us lynching Awaclus and doing day 1 again on day 2. Or simply finding a way to modkill him for it. But it's not technically against the rules so... we'll have to live with it this game.
That would be ridiculous. This is perfectly allowed by the rules and beneficial for town.
WHat reinoe did was beneficial for town. What you're doing is not quite as bad, but it's as close as you can get without getting banned for it. Congrats, you've managed to break the social contract of this game without actually breaking the rules, be proud.
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WHat reinoe did was beneficial for town. What you're doing is not quite as bad, but it's as close as you can get without getting banned for it. Congrats, you've managed to break the social contract of this game without actually breaking the rules, be proud.
The difference is that reinoe was scum, so it was not beneficial for his own alignment.
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ADK I don't want to lynch. I also still haven't looked up what Fruit Vendor does. Even in a case where scum knows its a safe claim (I haven't checked myself to see if that's possible), I'm not sure scum!ADK is the kind of player that does this. Though we've had a string of early town claims lately.
In fact. Fruit Vendor is guaranteed to be counterclaimable.
I'm not sure about Lekkit's last point against Teproc (regarding counterclaiming).. at most I see that it implies Teproc does not have a PR that can counterclaim ADK; I don't see where the rest comes from. He also claims Teproc is kind of posting without contributing. I'm not really sure if this is true or not. Nothing Teproc has done so far has made me want to reaction-vote him.
Here's the thing. If Teproc is a PR, there are basically two possibilities.
1. He's a PR from another row. He'll by his own argument counterclaim.
2. He's a PR from the same rows as Fruit Vendor. That would be Even Night Tracker, Jailkeeper, Watcher or Cop. ANY other PR would be able to counterclaim Fruit Vendor. Since nobody did, we can assume that ADK is in fact Fruit Vendor. Yet, he's still hesitant.
If Teproc is VT, then saying he thought about the claiming thing and then getting things messed up seems unlikely to me. Why would he say that? He knew some of the results of someone claiming, namely that scum would know which setup was rolled. But the IC part that faust laid out for him he missed. Basically he knew what would happen if a PR became known for scum but not for town. Not even why town would want to claim. And saying he "thought about that as well" while seemingly only having thought about it from a scum perspective seems... Not like something a VT would really do.
Oh, I see. That is a better point than I thought.
It is ?
Do I really have to explain what's wrong here ?
I guess I'll do : "I've thought about it", doesn't mean "I've thought about every possible angle and have made no mistake". It just means that I've thought about it.
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ADK I don't want to lynch. I also still haven't looked up what Fruit Vendor does. Even in a case where scum knows its a safe claim (I haven't checked myself to see if that's possible), I'm not sure scum!ADK is the kind of player that does this. Though we've had a string of early town claims lately.
In fact. Fruit Vendor is guaranteed to be counterclaimable.
I'm not sure about Lekkit's last point against Teproc (regarding counterclaiming).. at most I see that it implies Teproc does not have a PR that can counterclaim ADK; I don't see where the rest comes from. He also claims Teproc is kind of posting without contributing. I'm not really sure if this is true or not. Nothing Teproc has done so far has made me want to reaction-vote him.
Here's the thing. If Teproc is a PR, there are basically two possibilities.
1. He's a PR from another row. He'll by his own argument counterclaim.
2. He's a PR from the same rows as Fruit Vendor. That would be Even Night Tracker, Jailkeeper, Watcher or Cop. ANY other PR would be able to counterclaim Fruit Vendor. Since nobody did, we can assume that ADK is in fact Fruit Vendor. Yet, he's still hesitant.
If Teproc is VT, then saying he thought about the claiming thing and then getting things messed up seems unlikely to me. Why would he say that? He knew some of the results of someone claiming, namely that scum would know which setup was rolled. But the IC part that faust laid out for him he missed. Basically he knew what would happen if a PR became known for scum but not for town. Not even why town would want to claim. And saying he "thought about that as well" while seemingly only having thought about it from a scum perspective seems... Not like something a VT would really do.
Oh, I see. That is a better point than I thought.
It is ?
Do I really have to explain what's wrong here ?
I guess I'll do : "I've thought about it", doesn't mean "I've thought about every possible angle and have made no mistake". It just means that I've thought about it.
Well I didn't think it was a valid point at all before, and now it has some nonzero amount of validity, so yes, it is a better point than I thought.
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You had a "main downside" to it. But no upside.
After fausts initial post about creating a semi IC you said you also "thought about it". You mention the downside is that it gives scum information. But faust's proposal is clearly beneficial for town. And when it so happens that ADK claims fruit vendor you immediately come to the conclusion that it's just as likely to be a fake-claim. It's not about every possible angle. If you're a town PR you have one angle to consider. If you're VT you only thought about how scum would benefit from the claim, while completely disregarding the benefits for town.
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Yes, I was looking at how scum benefitted from it. This is wrong because ?
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scum!Awaclus is perfectly able to use ongoing rule debates to his benefit I believe. I would not give out town cred for this.
That's irrelevant. University-student-who-actually-needs-to-get-studying-done-because-his-student-financial-aid-depends-on-him-studying-enough-and-he-spent-last-semester-not-studying-enough-so-at-this-point-he-can't-really-afford-to-fail-a-single-course-this-semester-unless-he-wants-to-get-into-pretty-serious-financial-problems!Awaclus is simply unable to play any game as scum as long as QT quoting is not forbidden in that game.
No, THIS is irrelevant since you are still playing this game.
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Rather : this is scummy because ?
The benefits to such a claim were pretty obvious and laid out by faust. I then had a moment of doubt about those benefits, because I'm dumb. It's not that complicated.
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Lekkit, you still haven't answered the question why scum!Teproc would do what he did.
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That's irrelevant. University-student-who-actually-needs-to-get-studying-done-because-his-student-financial-aid-depends-on-him-studying-enough-and-he-spent-last-semester-not-studying-enough-so-at-this-point-he-can't-really-afford-to-fail-a-single-course-this-semester-unless-he-wants-to-get-into-pretty-serious-financial-problems!Awaclus is simply unable to play any game as scum as long as QT quoting is not forbidden in that game.
No, THIS is irrelevant since you are still playing this game.
[/quote]
No, it's relevant precisely because I'm still playing this game. If I had been scum, I wouldn't be.
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Quotefail.
That's irrelevant. University-student-who-actually-needs-to-get-studying-done-because-his-student-financial-aid-depends-on-him-studying-enough-and-he-spent-last-semester-not-studying-enough-so-at-this-point-he-can't-really-afford-to-fail-a-single-course-this-semester-unless-he-wants-to-get-into-pretty-serious-financial-problems!Awaclus is simply unable to play any game as scum as long as QT quoting is not forbidden in that game.
No, THIS is irrelevant since you are still playing this game.
No, it's relevant precisely because I'm still playing this game. If I had been scum, I wouldn't be.
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Quotefail.
That's irrelevant. University-student-who-actually-needs-to-get-studying-done-because-his-student-financial-aid-depends-on-him-studying-enough-and-he-spent-last-semester-not-studying-enough-so-at-this-point-he-can't-really-afford-to-fail-a-single-course-this-semester-unless-he-wants-to-get-into-pretty-serious-financial-problems!Awaclus is simply unable to play any game as scum as long as QT quoting is not forbidden in that game.
No, THIS is irrelevant since you are still playing this game.
No, it's relevant precisely because I'm still playing this game. If I had been scum, I wouldn't be.
And all we have for that is your word. So nothing.
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Quotefail.
That's irrelevant. University-student-who-actually-needs-to-get-studying-done-because-his-student-financial-aid-depends-on-him-studying-enough-and-he-spent-last-semester-not-studying-enough-so-at-this-point-he-can't-really-afford-to-fail-a-single-course-this-semester-unless-he-wants-to-get-into-pretty-serious-financial-problems!Awaclus is simply unable to play any game as scum as long as QT quoting is not forbidden in that game.
No, THIS is irrelevant since you are still playing this game.
No, it's relevant precisely because I'm still playing this game. If I had been scum, I wouldn't be.
And all we have for that is your word. So nothing.
I can copy paste my completed studies page here if you want since that's allowed in this game. Unfortunately, posting a screen shot is not.
Completed studies
Completed studies Total 8.0 Cp
Show language of completed studies Show credit units Show credit points Show both
If credit points are in parentheses they is not counted in Total
Extend all Codedescending Study unitdescending Cp Grading Dateascending Acceptor
3621217 Programming I 6 3/5 22.12.2015 Marja Kuittinen
3621115 Information Networks for CS students 1 Pass 22.10.2015 Pirkko Voutilainen
1131000 Starting academic studies 1 Pass 25.09.2015 Pirkko Voutilainen, Niina Räsänen
Completed studies Total 8.0 Cp
50 Cp (I'm guessing that stands for course points, they are called opintopisteet in Finnish) are required every year or I lose around 500€ per 5 Cp missing (which you can easily confirm on Google if you want). Although it's not quite as bad as it looks since there are a couple of courses I took last year that I just need to take the final tests for in order to complete them, but it's still bad enough that I can't just stop studying for however many weeks this game is going to take.
-
Why do you like wasting our time?
-
Why do you like wasting our time?
He realized he wasted too much of his time and now has to restore balance to the force.
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Lekkit, you still haven't answered the question why scum!Teproc would do what he did.
To go with what is best for town?
Rather : this is scummy because ?
The benefits to such a claim were pretty obvious and laid out by faust. I then had a moment of doubt about those benefits, because I'm dumb. It's not that complicated.
No. You didn't doubt the benefits. You forgot why town wanted someone to claim. To me, that's on par with lynching someone because you want to analyze the wagon.
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Lekkit, you still haven't answered the question why scum!Teproc would do what he did.
To go with what is best for town?
I don't know what you are trying to say.
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When playing as scum you want to seem towny. I don't really see any arguments why an IC is bad for town. Except scum knowing which one of two or three set ups they're playing in.
After the ADK claim Teproc still wanted to appear towny by not outing that he knew ADK was telling the truth. And that's where I believe he outmaneuvered himself. To not seem like he's scum who knew it was true, he doubted the claim a little, forgetting that the claim was guaranteed to be true for town as well, unless there was no counter-claim.
-
I have some time now so I'll do some short rereads with some post counts involved:
chairs - 4
EgorK - 4
Lekkit - 7
gkrieg13 - 10
Hydrad - 12
A Drowned Kernel - 16
Roadrunner7671 - 17
Awaclus - 22
Witherweaver - 22
silverspawn - 25
yuma - 34
Teproc - 43
faust - 46
Ok as always I'll reread from the top
-
EgorK: Not much from him. His posts don't look very good though. I would say null - scummy
chairs: Actually making sense even though he is sick. Get well soon! null - townie
Lekkit: I like the case and then defense of the case on Teproc. Seems very genuine and like scum hunting. townie
Hydrad: Most of his posts are fluff, but he has a couple posts in there that look like he is playing the game at least. null
ADK: IC, with no counterclaim, I totally believe this
RR: Being very weird this game. He is lurking much more than usual, he is not defending himself (I don't remember if this is normal for him), and he has voted once and left his vote on the same person this whole game. null -but I'll be keeping my eye on him
Awaclus - He's being anti-town, but in his townie way. I think people always get into arguments with him and he tends to hold his ground better as town. Anyway, I don't really believe that he would've /outted in any situation, so I don't let that play into my read of him. null - townie.
WW: He has votes that are kind of strange. This could be town trying to push people to think of different options than the current wagons, or scum doing the same thing. They are both on lurkers, which is a very safe vote D1. He defends Teproc, who I have a gut scum read on. null
silverspawn: ss's need to post in RVS seems strange to me. In his last few town games he was extremely absent, here he seems to be more active. He goes back and forth on yuma, saying that paranoid yuma is town!yuma, then voting him for that reason. Throws votes around a lot, but for good reasons. null - scummy (but only slightly)
yuma: I don't agree with his assesment of whether the counterclaim should occur today or not. I think a counterclaim should occur today because 1v1 D1 is definitely worth it. His being emotional is a null tell, but it feels different than in the game where he was scum and got emotional last (switch mafia I think). While I don't approve of his tunneling on Awaclus, I don't feel like he is overdoing it yet. I don't think that emotional!yuma is very productive at all, which means town members should give him a break for a little bit to let him simmer down. You should stay in the game if you can though. It's always fun playing with you for me!
Teproc: I will start out saying I have a gut scum read on Teproc. I actually agree with his theory posts. His post that nothing is happening means scum must be lurking seemed odd to me. I don't think that inactivity absolutely means inactive scum. I think it just means that there isn't anything to talk about. For me it was just that I wasn't really interested in the discussion you faust and yuma were having. I think my gut scum read on you comes from you sticking with the yuma argument for longer than I think was necessary. Your read of faust not going to all this trouble as scum is troubling to me. I don't buy it. I don't think Awaclus has been anti town enough to warrant us lynching him today and not using night actions. That seems like a horrible idea. I also don't really like your defense of yourself. scum
faust: has a lot of good theory talk. I like his claim/counterclaim scenarios. I don't like his argument with yuma. I don't agree so much with his reread of yuma. It seems very scum tainted, which I think is more likely to come from town!faust. He is very sure of himself as town and I have been caught on the bad end of his tunneling before. Out of all of this, I get a town read on faust, but I hope everyone stops arguing over the non-mafia related things.
-
So I guess the TL;DR of that is:
1. I hope we can all be friends and stop arguing not about mafia.
2. The scum team is clearly ss/Teproc/EgorK
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yuma has been replaced by 2.718281828.... (aka e). Welcome, e!
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@lekkit: I'm more inclined to think town! Teproc was just confused. Scum teproc is more on top of things than that.
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Let's start with vote: EgorK
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The whole fruit vendor is fun and everything, but really doesn't help town at all. As much of an advocate as I am off using prs, I really don't see where using fruit vendor would be beneficial.
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Other than for a tracker or someone to confirm you did what you said you did, which is a waste of an investigation in my opinion.
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Vote Count 1.4
One cannot think well, love well, sleep well, if one has not dined well.
2.7 (3): Awaclus, EgorK, faust
Awaclus (2): chairs, Hydrad
faust (1): Roadrunner7671
gkrieg13 (1): Witherweaver
Hydrad (2): Teproc, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (2): Lekkit, gkrieg13
RR (1): SS
EgorK (1): 2.7
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
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I think Awaclus is being counterproductive, but probably town.
I like lekkit as town right now
RR, chairs, hydrad, gkrieg, no real thoughts
ADK is town with his claim
Ww, teproc, faust, need more time to get an opinion
Same with silverspawn. I am leaning a but town on silverspawn though
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Eh, I don't want to vote Gkrieg any more.
Back to
Vote: Egor
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Another replacement: Ampharos replaces Teproc. Welcome, Ampharos!
Sorry for the repeated disruption.
Vote Count 1.4a
Laughter is brightest in the place where the food is.
2.7 (3): Awaclus, EgorK, faust
Awaclus (2): chairs, Hydrad
faust (1): Roadrunner7671
Hydrad (2): Ampharos, A Drowned Kernel
Ampharos (2): Lekkit, gkrieg13
RR (1): SS
EgorK (2): 2.7, Witherweaver.
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
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What's up guys, here but need to read the thread.
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I could get behind a EgorK lynch is the Ampharos lynch isn't going anywhere
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The whole fruit vendor is fun and everything, but really doesn't help town at all. As much of an advocate as I am off using prs, I really don't see where using fruit vendor would be beneficial.
Fruit Vendor is a pseudo-IC in this setup. as the matrix doesn't make it a safe claim at any point, so basically unless we get a flip or counterclaim that invalidates fruit vendor we must assume the fruit vendor claim is accurate.
unvote until I can reread now that yuma and teproc have been replaced. Honestly feeling a bit Town on Awaclus right now anyhow, because this is just Awaclus!Awaclus and not indicative of alignment.
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Wow I could feel my brain cells screaming out in pain and slowly dying while reading that, but at least I've read it. RIP brave cells, you shall be missed.
If this is town Awaclus, he's helping scum by talking about stupid stuff. If he's scum Awaclus, he's scum.
Vote: Awaclus
Sorry Teproc, my vote now :P
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Man, people need to stop leaving.
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Well good news: Iam staying. I don't get uh everything that's happening, but I guess it will have to wait until after the game.
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It's great though that you guys were able to jump in that quickly. Cheers to you!
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I don't get it, I really don't. It's just Awaclus's playstyle. If you don't like that, either adapt or don't play with him. But no policy lynches and no trying to get him to change.
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Oh hey, ampharos. Are you town again this game?
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We lost the two most talkative people this game. People need to step up now!
Ampharos seems scummy to me still
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We lost the two most talkative people this game. People need to step up now!
Ampharos seems scummy to me still
Actually, I was more talkative than both of them, going by the above statistic.... lynch all liars!
Also e likes to talk, so I think we are fine.
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:( Teproc
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well, I'm still saying Hydrad or RR
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well, I'm still saying Hydrad or RR
Why Hydrad, Why RR?
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We lost the two most talkative people this game. People need to step up now!
Ampharos seems scummy to me still
Actually, I was more talkative than both of them, going by the above statistic.... lynch all liars!
Also e likes to talk, so I think we are fine.
Don't do it! I meant to say two of the most talkative ::)
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well, I'm still saying Hydrad or RR
Why Hydrad, Why RR?
RR is being ultra stubborn and anti town, and Hydrad is.... non-present as of now.
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well, I'm still saying Hydrad or RR
Why Hydrad, Why RR?
RR is being ultra stubborn and anti town, and Hydrad is.... non-present as of now.
What?? How am I being 'ultra stubborn?' And how have I been anti-town?
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This doesn't seem like RR from the last game to me. It's weird that he isn't really present
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This doesn't seem like RR from the last game to me. It's weird that he isn't really present
I didn't lurk in X-Shot or Harry Potter.
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This doesn't seem like RR from the last game to me. It's weird that he isn't really present
I didn't lurk in X-Shot or Harry Potter.
And you got lynched.
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This doesn't seem like RR from the last game to me. It's weird that he isn't really present
I didn't lurk in X-Shot or Harry Potter.
And you got lynched.
Because I was scum.
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I totally buy scum RR here. This sarcastic attitude doesn't seem like him at all, and his only pposts have been defending himself (sarcastically) and unsupported defense of people like hydrad. I want to Lynch RR or gkrieg or hydrad, I am almost certain there is scum in there.
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I'm back again!
and people have been replaced. Well thats unfortunate but now we get the privileged of playing with other people aswell!
welcome e/amp!
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Ah I don't really want to choose on RR.
I felt like he was an easy read when he first started playing the game. But hes much better at playing scum then I thought.
Hes in my null category with awaclus where I'm ok with lynching because I don't think I can read them.
(and I already realize this is probably a scummy post but its what I'm thinking so what else am I supposed to do!)
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vote: Hydrad
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vote: Hydrad
I knew it!
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I totally buy scum RR here. This sarcastic attitude doesn't seem like him at all, and his only pposts have been defending himself (sarcastically) and unsupported defense of people like hydrad. I want to Lynch RR or gkrieg or hydrad, I am almost certain there is scum in there.
[serious]
Am I being sarcastic? How? Could you point me to those posts so that I could correct you/admit that I was sarcastic?
PPE
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This doesn't seem like RR from the last game to me. It's weird that he isn't really present
I didn't lurk in X-Shot or Harry Potter.
And you got lynched.
Because I was scum.
Point being, motivation for you to change.
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should I give hydrad a day 1 pass for being funny?
probably not
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If I get lynched I will be sad.
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So lurkers, huh? I guess that's fine. They don't usually get lots of presure early these days, only at LyLo or such. One thing putting me off is that silver is pushing for that, and silver hasn't exactly been a beacon of townieness this game himself.
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I totally buy scum RR here. This sarcastic attitude doesn't seem like him at all, and his only pposts have been defending himself (sarcastically) and unsupported defense of people like hydrad. I want to Lynch RR or gkrieg or hydrad, I am almost certain there is scum in there.
I'm okay with this, but I'm more town on Gkrieg now.
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So lurkers, huh? I guess that's fine. They don't usually get lots of presure early these days, only at LyLo or such. One thing putting me off is that silver is pushing for that, and silver hasn't exactly been a beacon of townieness this game himself.
I haven't? :(
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I totally buy scum RR here. This sarcastic attitude doesn't seem like him at all, and his only pposts have been defending himself (sarcastically) and unsupported defense of people like hydrad. I want to Lynch RR or gkrieg or hydrad, I am almost certain there is scum in there.
[serious]
Am I being sarcastic? How? Could you point me to those posts so that I could correct you/admit that I was sarcastic?
PPE
Hydrad/RR are scumbuddies, calling it right now.
Nice meme.
The fact that nothing appears to be happening should indicate scum is lurking right ?
I wonder who that might point us towards...
Hydrad and RR?
Yeah, I'm such a lurker.
I'm here!
Lets all be friends!
Did I do it?
Sure, but who's scum?
Hydrad/RR of course!
These are pretty much all your posts for the past three pages.
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Oh. Right. Sorry! I blame the general attitude of the town, even though I should blame myself. Okay, I'll blame myself.
But sarcasm may be annoying, but it's not a scum!tell.
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If this is town Awaclus, he's helping scum by talking about stupid stuff.
What? I am helping town by creating an IC, which I am because it is impossible for me to play a scum game with these rules because every day, I need to sleep for at least a couple of hours and study for another couple of hours and even if I could have something like 15 hours left for writing fake QT posts, it wouldn't be enough because way more than that is required of scum.
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Apart from people that are completely absent, WW and silver are the guys I have the least of a read on, so let's check out what they did so far.
silver:
QT talk early, then a vote for Awalcus ::) Complains about noone doing RVS. Well he isn't doing RVS. That's a tad weird. Then he says he has 15 posts in his QT, "no reason to spam the thread with them". Huh. What are these posts about one wonders, considering silver has not yet added something substantial to the game. Now substantial stuff happens: he defends yuma and thinks all the wagons we have are bad (including the Awaclus wagon, which he is a part of). Votes for Hydrad. Believes in Teproc's town slip. Immediately afterwards he questions Teproc's Hydrad vote... what? He votes RR because he does not believe RR's early vote on me was RVS (Like what? Why lie about that?), and because of "tunneling" me (he has made exactly one post stating that he thinks I'm scum). Then switches to Hydrad again, for what reason I cannot fathom. Then joins on the yuma wagon, which was supposed to be bad earlier. Thinks Lekkit is scummy because of the Teproc case. But why? Because he disagrees. Bad. Continues to read me as town, how convenient.
WW:
Also starts with QT talk. Joke. Theory. Joke. Joke. He believes ADK's claim quickly. Votes Egor out of the blue. Boom! Suddenly a long post. Gives reads and such. Makes a lot of sense actually. Does not feel like lynching Awaclus, good. Disagrees with Lekkit's Teproc case, but still finds him townie - also good. Votes for gkrieg, I don't know about that, maybe.
Sorry about the style, I just watched a Sherlock episode, it gets to you.
Anyway, I think after the reread that WW is quite townie and silver is quite scummy. silver's play is just so all over the place and it doesn't feel natural. It feels like bad reasoning and inconsistency for the sake of it.
Vote: silver
PPE: 5
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Oh. Right. Sorry! I blame the general attitude of the town, even though I should blame myself. Okay, I'll blame myself.
But sarcasm may be annoying, but it's not a scum!tell.
IT IS - - not - a scum!tell. it's a scumtell. there is no ! !
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Vote: silver
WHAT? :( :( :(
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If this is town Awaclus, he's helping scum by talking about stupid stuff.
What? I am helping town by creating an IC, which I am because it is impossible for me to play a scum game with these rules because every day, I need to sleep for at least a couple of hours and study for another couple of hours and even if I could have something like 15 hours left for writing fake QT posts, it wouldn't be enough because way more than that is required of scum.
*yawn*
-
@RR because of PPE's
It's a scumtell when it strongly goes against a player's meta. It's also scummy when it's solely in reaction to your own wagon. Trying to treat your wagon like a joke is a pretty common scum tactic to try and get pressure of you, especially when it's still only one or two players voting for you. All that coupled with your lack of other content makes me think that you're extremely likely to be scum here.
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@RR because of PPE's
It's a scumtell when it strongly goes against a player's meta. It's also scummy when it's solely in reaction to your own wagon. Trying to treat your wagon like a joke is a pretty common scum tactic to try and get pressure of you, especially when it's still only one or two players voting for you. All that coupled with your lack of other content makes me think that you're extremely likely to be scum here.
<Insert reference to current game(s)>
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Vote: silver
WHAT? :( :( :(
Smileys are scummy too.
-
@RR because of PPE's
It's a scumtell when it strongly goes against a player's meta. It's also scummy when it's solely in reaction to your own wagon. Trying to treat your wagon like a joke is a pretty common scum tactic to try and get pressure of you, especially when it's still only one or two players voting for you. All that coupled with your lack of other content makes me think that you're extremely likely to be scum here.
<Insert reference to current game(s)>
Don't live in the past, there's always a new game to be played.
-
Rr is being weird here, but I don't think he is necessarily scummy. He just played a good game where he lost at lylo, which is pretty good for any player
-
Okay I'll actually read the case, too.
Well he isn't doing RVS.
well, this (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564672#msg564672) was 90% RVS. but usually RVS is seen as negative not positive, so why would I try to force it on town?
Then he says he has 15 posts in his QT, "no reason to spam the thread with them". Huh. What are these posts about one wonders, considering silver has not yet added something substantial to the game.
Well let's see
2-4 me trying to be funny to impress the QT
5-8 setup talk
9-16 me having a mental breakdown because of the QT issue and because I have to act against my wincon
17+ fluff
Now substantial stuff happens: he defends yuma and thinks all the wagons we have are bad (including the Awaclus wagon, which he is a part of). Votes for Hydrad. Believes in Teproc's town slip. Immediately afterwards he questions Teproc's Hydrad vote... what?
What is strange about that? Just because I'm townslipreading teproc doesn't mean I have to like a vote on someone with just one post.
He votes RR because he does not believe RR's early vote on me was RVS (Like what? Why lie about that?)
He doesn't want to admit that he did it for a poor reason - a sign of paranoia.
and because of "tunneling" me (he has made exactly one post stating that he thinks I'm scum).
Well he has said this
This would make me vote for you, but I already am.
I'll remind you that it's super early day one, which I think means you can be generous with your accusations. One recent post and a vote before that when there are only like seven or so posts total is tunneling enough.
Then switches to Hydrad again, for what reason I cannot fathom.
RVS
no I'm joking. I don't put that much thought into these early votes. But Hydrad certainly isn't a bad vote at that point.
Then joins on the yuma wagon, which was supposed to be bad earlier.
That's probably me forgetting about that
Thinks Lekkit is scummy because of the Teproc case. But why? Because he disagrees.
Well - yeah. Elaborating on this would feel a bit offensive so I didn't do it, but if I really feel that a case is super bad, then that is a reason to suspect someone. It felt artificial, and it also came out of nowhere - isn't that the main difference between a read from scum and a read from town?
Bad. Continues to read me as town, how convenient.
I don't think that townreading you is convenient for scum!me - provided you are town. Scumreading you would give me an excellent excuse to disagree with your reads, townreading does the opposite.
PPE 5
-
Vote: silver
WHAT? :( :( :(
Smileys are scummy too.
Now I know that's not true.
-
vote: rr
-
vote: rr
vote: gkrieg
-
vote: rr
You just said I wasn't scummy!
-
Apart from people that are completely absent, WW and silver are the guys I have the least of a read on, so let's check out what they did so far.
silver:
QT talk early, then a vote for Awalcus ::) Complains about noone doing RVS. Well he isn't doing RVS. That's a tad weird. Then he says he has 15 posts in his QT, "no reason to spam the thread with them". Huh. What are these posts about one wonders, considering silver has not yet added something substantial to the game. Now substantial stuff happens: he defends yuma and thinks all the wagons we have are bad (including the Awaclus wagon, which he is a part of). Votes for Hydrad. Believes in Teproc's town slip. Immediately afterwards he questions Teproc's Hydrad vote... what? He votes RR because he does not believe RR's early vote on me was RVS (Like what? Why lie about that?), and because of "tunneling" me (he has made exactly one post stating that he thinks I'm scum). Then switches to Hydrad again, for what reason I cannot fathom. Then joins on the yuma wagon, which was supposed to be bad earlier. Thinks Lekkit is scummy because of the Teproc case. But why? Because he disagrees. Bad. Continues to read me as town, how convenient.
WW:
Also starts with QT talk. Joke. Theory. Joke. Joke. He believes ADK's claim quickly. Votes Egor out of the blue. Boom! Suddenly a long post. Gives reads and such. Makes a lot of sense actually. Does not feel like lynching Awaclus, good. Disagrees with Lekkit's Teproc case, but still finds him townie - also good. Votes for gkrieg, I don't know about that, maybe.
Sorry about the style, I just watched a Sherlock episode, it gets to you.
Anyway, I think after the reread that WW is quite townie and silver is quite scummy. silver's play is just so all over the place and it doesn't feel natural. It feels like bad reasoning and inconsistency for the sake of it.
Vote: silver
PPE: 5
Huh, I actually expected you to come out scummy on me. Maybe you're learning!
-
I'm not learning cause I think you're scummy. Well... I also think you're townie so I'm just confused now :(
And yes e, I'm town.
If you don't believe me go look at the Teproc slip or whatever you guys decided that was. *shrugs*
-
I'm about to go to sleep, hopefully I don't get lynched for that.
-
I'm about to go to sleep, hopefully I don't get lynched for that.
Well, sleeping is actually a town tell because scum doesn't have the time for that in this game.
-
I'm about to go to sleep, hopefully I don't get lynched for that.
Well, sleeping is actually a town tell because scum doesn't have the time for that in this game.
You could just not post at all. Seems to solve everyone's problems.
-
I am extremly sorry, but I am VLA till Sunday evening. Unexpected business trip. I'd request sub, but it is unlikely there are volunteers left
-
I am extremly sorry, but I am VLA till Sunday evening. Unexpected business trip. I'd request sub, but it is unlikely there are volunteers left
Well, deadline is Tuesday, so hopefully there will still be a bit of time for you to contribute.
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I like my silver vote even more now. What do others think about him?
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Very well
Vote: Silverspawn
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I can dig it.
vote: silverspawn
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Vote Count 1.5
There is no sincerer love than the love of food.
2.7 (2): Awaclus, EgorK
Awaclus (2): Hydrad, Ampharos
faust (1): Roadrunner7671
gkrieg13 (1): A Drowned Kernel
Ampharos (1): Lekkit
RR (2): SS, gkrieg
EgorK (1): 2.7
silverspawn (3): faust, Witherweaver, chairs
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
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Oh, he's voting for me? Vote: SS
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I like my silver vote even more now.
why?
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you all suck at reading me. I was scum recently, and no-one was interested in voting for me there. now I'm town again and you're after me.
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I like my silver vote even more now.
And I don't like just glossing over my defense without giving a reason
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If ash was here, he'd tell all of you to vote for me.
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vote: ss
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faust, this is your fault.
well, primarily.
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That is L-2
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I think Vote: Roadrunner is better.
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I'd be fine lynching either of them
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faust, this is your fault.
well, primarily.
I would say it is primarily your fault.
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Look, I can go into detail about why I did not like your defense if that's what you want.
well, this (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564672#msg564672) was 90% RVS. but usually RVS is seen as negative not positive, so why would I try to force it on town?
Well uh you were complaining about not having RVS. Why would you do that if you think it's negative?
Now substantial stuff happens: he defends yuma and thinks all the wagons we have are bad (including the Awaclus wagon, which he is a part of). Votes for Hydrad. Believes in Teproc's town slip. Immediately afterwards he questions Teproc's Hydrad vote... what?
What is strange about that? Just because I'm townslipreading teproc doesn't mean I have to like a vote on someone with just one post.
What's strange is how critical you are of a player voting for the very guy you voted for you a couple of posts ago.
He votes RR because he does not believe RR's early vote on me was RVS (Like what? Why lie about that?)
He doesn't want to admit that he did it for a poor reason - a sign of paranoia.
And what reason would that be, according to you?
no I'm joking. I don't put that much thought into these early votes. But Hydrad certainly isn't a bad vote at that point.
But why are you so eager to leave your more substantial scum reads alone?
Thinks Lekkit is scummy because of the Teproc case. But why? Because he disagrees.
Well - yeah. Elaborating on this would feel a bit offensive so I didn't do it, but if I really feel that a case is super bad, then that is a reason to suspect someone. It felt artificial, and it also came out of nowhere - isn't that the main difference between a read from scum and a read from town?
Well, you did not say it felt artificial, you said you disagreed. I don't know about "it came out of nowhere"; Teproc what one of the active players, it is only natural to try and get a read on him. I also don't think the case was bad, so I don't know how you're getting there.
I don't think that townreading you is convenient for scum!me - provided you are town. Scumreading you would give me an excellent excuse to disagree with your reads, townreading does the opposite.
Having a town read on me is convenient because i am certainly going to get killed along the road, so for the time being you have an easy read and don't have to worry about having to turn it around once PoE hits because I will be dead by then.
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That was a sudden wagon. Also a lot of shelling Faust. I think I agree with WW that RR is a better vote, but the way he keeps jumping around puts me on edge.
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Awaclus is probably town cause he's so impossibly scummy.
I'm going to put this on the record now so you can point to it later: Gkrieg is scum.
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Well uh you were complaining about not having RVS. Why would you do that if you think it's negative?
I don't think it's negative.
Look. It's a joke. I'm making fun of myself for needing RVS while everyone else thinks RVS is bad. Is that really hard to see? For better judgment, here is my full post:
meep.
why is no-one doing RVS? How am I supposed to have stuff to say?
But doing a joke is one thing - actually trying to force RVS onto the game is another, when everyone thinks RVS is bad. That would be stubborn and not helpful.
What's strange is how critical you are of a player voting for the very guy you voted for you a couple of posts ago.
If questioning a vote was strange just because you had a town read on someone, then everyone would have to sheep the IC in every game.
And that is all that happened. Here are the relevant quotes:
oh hey this game started!
welp. I'm going to sleep now.
see you guys tomorrow.
[...]Actually I think I agree... not about never lynching faust d1, but about this :
vote: Hydrad
[...]
vote: Hydrad
really? hasn't he only made one post?
And what reason would that be, according to you?
I don't know the reason, but-- the post does not seem RVS-y to me.
I made it here, (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564741#msg564741) and it was right after you posted something. That makes it have an aggressive tone, and makes his 'It was RVS' post later feel like back-pedaling.
But why are you so eager to leave your more substantial scum reads alone?
I really don't have any substantial scum reads. Not now, and much less then.
Well, you did not say it felt artificial, you said you disagreed. I don't know about "it came out of nowhere"; Teproc what one of the active players, it is only natural to try and get a read on him. I also don't think the case was bad, so I don't know how you're getting there.
Hmm... can't argue with that.
Having a town read on me is convenient because i am certainly going to get killed along the road, so for the time being you have an easy read and don't have to worry about having to turn it around once PoE hits because I will be dead by then.
ehh... sure. I see the logic. Not sure if I would really do that, though.
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faust, this is your fault.
well, primarily.
I would say it is primarily your fault.
Shouldn't you rather point out that it's not necessarily a bad thing because I could be scum?
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Awaclus is probably town cause he's so impossibly scummy.
I'm going to put this on the record now so you can point to it later: Gkrieg is scum.
Man, I agree about gkrieg, want to Lynch him with me?
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I also agree. vote: gkrieg
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RR jumping on the silverspawn wagon feels like town to me. I still like egork as scum, but we can lynch him later. I an not convinced about gkrieg. What is the case on him?
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I am also leaning toward town on silverspawn
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Vote: Hydrad
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Awaclus is probably town cause he's so impossibly scummy.
I'm going to put this on the record now so you can point to it later: Gkrieg is scum.
Man, I agree about gkrieg, want to Lynch him with me?
Maybe. I just like my vote on Awaclus so much even though he's probably town.
RR jumping on the silverspawn wagon feels like town to me. I still like egork as scum, but we can lynch him later. I an not convinced about gkrieg. What is the case on him?
I think it's that I said he was town. Bulletproof argument, I tell you.
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Ok. Because I was getting townie vibes from gkrieg's big long post that he did
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I mean to say "because I said he was scum".
Yikes. Proofreading.
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So, I have time for a short post. Getting scummy vibes from ADK, meaning if we get indication that there is no Fruit Vendor in setup I'm taking him down.
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So, I have time for a short post. Getting scummy vibes from ADK, meaning if we get indication that there is no Fruit Vendor in setup I'm taking him down.
That is what everyone would be doing, and what will not be happening. ADK is town, you're gonna have to live with that.
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I'd be fine lynching either of them
I don't think gkrieg is scummy, I don't think scum really posts this.
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I'd be fine lynching either of them
I don't think gkrieg is scummy, I don't think scum really posts this.
Why? I've said that as scum before.
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I'm mostly thinking scum!gkrieg because of this post
vote: ss
I considered voting for him immediately but that would've come across as OMGUS
Sheeping there just seemed really easy. I have an emotional response - we have no go-to way of interpreting those. They're either scummy or towny, so the vote justifies itself
I could be persuaded if you (gkrieg) explain me why you supposedly found my response scummy.
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I'd be fine lynching either of them
I don't think gkrieg is scummy, I don't think scum really posts this.
Why? I've said that as scum before.
I agree with Ampharos. This forum has a thing with the whole "too scummy to be scum" thing. Voicing the opinion that you are willing to lynch whoever might be the popular lynch is sounds pretty scummy, and forum meta says scum doesn't do this. Which is exactly why scum might feel comfortable doing it
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But really guys, let's lynch hydrad. He is totally scum this game. I will figure out why later
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But really guys, let's lynch hydrad. He is totally scum this game. I will figure out why later
If Hydrad is town can we lynch you?
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But really guys, let's lynch hydrad. He is totally scum this game. I will figure out why later
If Hydrad is town can we lynch you?
for the love of... at least try not to be scummy
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But really guys, let's lynch hydrad. He is totally scum this game. I will figure out why later
If Hydrad is town can we lynch you?
You can lynch me whenever you want to. Well, you can try...
(Wouldn't be a good choice though)
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But really guys, let's lynch hydrad. He is totally scum this game. I will figure out why later
If Hydrad is town can we lynch you?
for the love of... at least try not to be scummy
I'm obviously too scummy to be scum.
But what I have to say to you is that if you haven't differentiated between scummy and Roadrunner by now, you might not be the 'RR expert' you claim to be.
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I'm mostly thinking scum!gkrieg because of this post
vote: ss
I considered voting for him immediately but that would've come across as OMGUS
Sheeping there just seemed really easy. I have an emotional response - we have no go-to way of interpreting those. They're either scummy or towny, so the vote justifies itself
I could be persuaded if you (gkrieg) explain me why you supposedly found my response scummy.
So is WW scummy too?
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I'd be fine lynching either of them
I don't think gkrieg is scummy, I don't think scum really posts this.
Why? I've said that as scum before.
I agree with Ampharos. This forum has a thing with the whole "too scummy to be scum" thing. Voicing the opinion that you are willing to lynch whoever might be the popular lynch is sounds pretty scummy, and forum meta says scum doesn't do this. Which is exactly why scum might feel comfortable doing it
Apparently I have to change my name from faust to forum meta.
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Wait, e is yuma and Amph is Teproc right? I thought it was the other way around...
In this case I could also lynch e I guess.
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Wait, e is yuma and Amph is Teproc right? I thought it was the other way around...
In this case I could also lynch e I guess.
Yes. I am yuma. My job on this forum. Replace yuma whenever necessary (unless I am already in that game)
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But no to lynching me
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Also, faust, it is not just you and not just this game where I have seen the "too scummy to be scum" argument
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So is WW scummy too?
No. He jumped onto me before my reaction, and then he jumped off me when he could have hoped to get a mislynch through.
Maybe I was being paranoid, but the wagon actually seemed to have a lot of momentum to me.
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Also, faust, it is not just you and not just this game where I have seen the "too scummy to be scum" argument
Well it is not exactly a too scummy to be scum argument because I don't think what he posted is scummy at all... it is just perceived that way.
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RR is a good choice I think.
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Maybe I was being paranoid, but the wagon actually seemed to have a lot of momentum to me.
It's like Marco Rubio.
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In a vacuum, very few things are more scummy than asking 'if you are wrong, can we lynch you next'
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I would be glad to summarize my reasons why I voted ss:
There are exactly two reasons.
First reason is that ss was not very active in his last couple of town games. He is being much more active here, like he was in tree mafia.
The second reason is the emotional reaction.
you all suck at reading me. I was scum recently, and no-one was interested in voting for me there. now I'm town again and you're after me.
I thought about saying this before, and have said it before, but only as scum.
I like my silver vote even more now.
And I don't like just glossing over my defense without giving a reason
This post is justified. As either alignment it is annoying when people don't respond to defenses, because it give you no way to know how to change their mind.
If ash was here, he'd tell all of you to vote for me.
This is another post that I would only post as scum. I've thought the same thing about faust when there were 2 games where he tunneled me hard.
faust, this is your fault.
well, primarily.
This is the last one. I'm not sheeping people at this point. It isn't faust's fault that you have so many votes. You have so many votes because you are scummy.
PPE4
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I will just resort to rating all wagons in terms of presidential candidates I think. For example, RR is Donald Trump: Always very popular, but in the end he's pretty unlikely to be the lynch.
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But surely you would like to lynch Donald Trump?
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That was a good post man. I don't think gkrieg is scummy here at all.
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A real case by gkrieg. Not lynching him today
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In a vacuum, very few things are more scummy than asking 'if you are wrong, can we lynch you next'
Why?
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In a vacuum, very few things are more scummy than asking 'if you are wrong, can we lynch you next'
Why?
Setting up people to be mislynched is scummy
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good enough for me to vote: RR over you
but that said
I thought about saying this before, and have said it before, but only as scum.
I'm not you.
This is another post that I would only post as scum. I've thought the same thing about faust when there were 2 games where he tunneled me hard.
That doesn't explain why I am more likely to say it as scum than town
eh... I don't like this post. But I - sigh - do think it's a towny post.
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How would you like a post that is a case against you?
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I'm not scum. I think the Trump reference is very appropriate.
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In a vacuum, very few things are more scummy than asking 'if you are wrong, can we lynch you next'
Why?
Setting up people to be mislynched is scummy
But this does not work, does it? If the player who says this is lynched, and is scum, then obviously the other guy wasn't wrong so the setup doesn't work. Maybe I have the wrong context here... I guess if it means "if you are wrong [about other player]" rather than "if you are wrong [about me]" it makes more sense. For some reason I thought it meant the latter.
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How would you like a post that is a case against you?
I think I'd appreciate (probably not like) it if it had only points that I think are fair, which isn't the case here because it's not fair to say 'I do this as scum, you did it, therefore you're scum'. And it's also unfair in a way that I can't immediately disprove, which fuels the dislike.
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In a vacuum, very few things are more scummy than asking 'if you are wrong, can we lynch you next'
Why?
Setting up people to be mislynched is scummy
But this does not work, does it? If the player who says this is lynched, and is scum, then obviously the other guy wasn't wrong so the setup doesn't work. Maybe I have the wrong context here... I guess if it means "if you are wrong [about other player]" rather than "if you are wrong [about me]" it makes more sense. For some reason I thought it meant the latter.
This was the source:
But really guys, let's lynch hydrad. He is totally scum this game. I will figure out why later
If Hydrad is town can we lynch you?
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How would you like a post that is a case against you?
I think I'd appreciate (probably not like) it if it had only points that I think are fair, which isn't the case here because it's not fair to say 'I do this as scum, you did it, therefore you're scum'. And it's also unfair in a way that I can't immediately disprove, which fuels the dislike.
Every case ever made is biased by your own point of view. At least gkrieg is honest enough to admit that. Saying that it is "unfair" is rubbish.
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How would you like a post that is a case against you?
I think I'd appreciate (probably not like) it if it had only points that I think are fair, which isn't the case here because it's not fair to say 'I do this as scum, you did it, therefore you're scum'. And it's also unfair in a way that I can't immediately disprove, which fuels the dislike.
Every case ever made is biased by your own point of view. At least gkrieg is honest enough to admit that. Saying that it is "unfair" is rubbish.
No, what you are saying here is rubbish. Having your own point of view is not the same as projecting your own behavior on someone else. gkrieg said (again): 'I do this as scum, you did it, therefore you're scum'. He could have also said: 'You did this as scum here and here and never did this as town'. The first is unfair. The second is not.
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Kind of busy as it's friday night.
I'm not really a fan of the silverspawn lynch.
I think RR looks pretty bad, but I want to do a reread, which I won't have time for tonight. So if anyone else is able to, have we had anything else than defense and jokes from him?
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Kind of busy as it's friday night.
I'm not really a fan of the silverspawn lynch.
I think RR looks pretty bad, but I want to do a reread, which I won't have time for tonight. So if anyone else is able to, have we had anything else than defense and jokes from him?
Hi Lekkit!
I've never played with you before, but I hope you could find the time to read a game that I was in where I was town. Possibly Forest Fire Mafia, possibly Board Game mafia, possibly Marval Heros mafia. I hope this will aid you in making your decesion as to whether or not you want to you really want to lynch me.
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I love when people make cases against me. That gives me a chance to methodically destroy aforementioned "case" with irrefutable arguments proving my innocence.
I mean, I especially love when the cases have weak points (like gkrieg's). Makes it even easier to point out the flaws and get town cred. I am pretty sure I have made cases against scum partners before that are mostly legit but still easy enough to fight off (maybe not. I should really do this next time I am scum though). Town points all around.
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Kind of busy as it's friday night.
I'm not really a fan of the silverspawn lynch.
I think RR looks pretty bad, but I want to do a reread, which I won't have time for tonight. So if anyone else is able to, have we had anything else than defense and jokes from him?
No, but RR does love to play defense all game.
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But yeah, you know me. Always down for a good old fashioned RR lynch. Although I don't think he is the best option today
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But yeah, you know me. Always down for a good old fashioned RR lynch. Although I don't think he is the best option today
Come onnnnnn.
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Gkreig scum confirmed.
But we can pursue that at a later date if you are so inclined.
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Gkreig scum confirmed.
But we can pursue that at a later date if you are so inclined.
I don't get it.
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Just make note of it so when he's scum you can be like "oh yeah Amph said that". That's all :P
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The thing about gkrieg is that in Board Game, which just finished, I was his scum partner and I specifically coached him to make long reread posts when he was getting lynched, and that helped get the pressure off of him, and that looks like exactly what's happening here. I don't buy that long posts=town!gkrieg.
Ampharos... I don't know, my town read on Teproc is fading in the light of some of Amph's posts. I don't think I want to lynch him today but it warrants a reread of Teproc methinks.
At this point RR is playing to his meta so hard it seems like self-parody. I would lynch RR for sure.
So I guess my lynch pool is still Hydrad, RR, gkrieg.
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I love when people make cases against me. That gives me a chance to methodically destroy aforementioned "case" with irrefutable arguments proving my innocence.
I mean, I especially love when the cases have weak points (like gkrieg's). Makes it even easier to point out the flaws and get town cred. I am pretty sure I have made cases against scum partners before that are mostly legit but still easy enough to fight off (maybe not. I should really do this next time I am scum though). Town points all around.
But this also makes me want to lynch e, reminds of that Blitz game where we were scum together and he got caught by being super-jokey about being scum. It's the same self-awareness and bravado. So I guess throw e in the lynch pool too.
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The thing about gkrieg is that in Board Game, which just finished, I was his scum partner and I specifically coached him to make long reread posts when he was getting lynched, and that helped get the pressure off of him, and that looks like exactly what's happening here. I don't buy that long posts=town!gkrieg.
Interesting. I assume that is recorded in the scum qt. Might have to go back and look at that
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O NOES QT QUOTING
Making a strong case on someone else can help, it doesn't necessarily have to be anyone on your wagon. Or give detailed reads of everyone, with the sentiment "if I'm going to be lynched, I'm going to help town as much as I can before I go."
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I love when people make cases against me. That gives me a chance to methodically destroy aforementioned "case" with irrefutable arguments proving my innocence.
I mean, I especially love when the cases have weak points (like gkrieg's). Makes it even easier to point out the flaws and get town cred. I am pretty sure I have made cases against scum partners before that are mostly legit but still easy enough to fight off (maybe not. I should really do this next time I am scum though). Town points all around.
But this also makes me want to lynch e, reminds of that Blitz game where we were scum together and he got caught by being super-jokey about being scum. It's the same self-awareness and bravado. So I guess throw e in the lynch pool too.
You used this exact same argument in another normal game after that blitz game, I forget which one. I was town there too
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Then he started making the posts starting here. (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14208.msg559695#msg559695)
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I love when people make cases against me. That gives me a chance to methodically destroy aforementioned "case" with irrefutable arguments proving my innocence.
I mean, I especially love when the cases have weak points (like gkrieg's). Makes it even easier to point out the flaws and get town cred. I am pretty sure I have made cases against scum partners before that are mostly legit but still easy enough to fight off (maybe not. I should really do this next time I am scum though). Town points all around.
But this also makes me want to lynch e, reminds of that Blitz game where we were scum together and he got caught by being super-jokey about being scum. It's the same self-awareness and bravado. So I guess throw e in the lynch pool too.
You used this exact same argument in another normal game after that blitz game, I forget which one. I was town there too
It'll be right one of these days. And that post is scummy in a vacuum anyway.
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You call it scummy, I call it honest.....potāto, potäto....
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The problem is that I actually do the long reread posts when I'm town as well, like I did in the recently finished x-shots.
After I did it as scum, I realized it was actually a great way to get into a game that I was otherwise not very invested in.
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It's a good thing we're playing in a vacuum.
(http://www.averagemarrieddad.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/life-in-a-vacuum.jpg)
Dang, I'm coming across so passive-aggressive. Sorry about that, I'm just trying to have fun and ending up sounding like a massive jerk :P Ignore me if I make you mad.
(I'm legit reading everything and stuff, I'm not just trolling I promise)
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Just make note of it so when he's scum you can be like "oh yeah Amph said that". That's all :P
You're gonna feel real foolish at the end of this game then.
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Just make note of it so when he's scum you can be like "oh yeah Amph said that". That's all :P
You're gonna feel real foolish at the end of this game then.
k
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So now I'm a parody of myself. Great.
Let's talk about Amaphoros: Something seems off.
I'm not sure exactly what it is, but it's something.
His hedging is scummy, but his meme posts gets him a vote because he had to remind us he wasn't scummy as he doesn't want to get lynched in the same fashion I am about to. He also seems too relaxed, there's been virtually no scum hunting from him (hypocritical, I know) and he's been using a lot of short posts, memes, emoticons, and *asterisk thingies*
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Why does everyone forget about Teproc? Seriously, he's my better half. He deserves more credit :P
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But yeah, you know me. Always down for a good old fashioned RR lynch. Although I don't think he is the best option today
Come onnnnnn.
You're an easy lynch because you don't really contribute to the discussion. Your last three pages have been one liners
PPE: That is much better
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I don't know what everyone's talking about with Ampharos being scummy. He seems very much like his usual town self.
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Why does everyone forget about Teproc? Seriously, he's my better half. He deserves more credit :P
Vote: Ampharos
You're looking at a guy who just said your toungy face emojis were scummy. Typical scum reaction.
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vote: RR
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I don't know what everyone's talking about with Ampharos being scummy. He seems very much like his usual town self.
I've only ever modded games with Ampharos in them I think. So I've never really experienced town!Ampharos
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I'm probably at like L-2. But I need to talk to you guys about something. If, by some miracle, we lynch Amapharos, I go down either way.
If he's scum, it looks like I'm bussing, seeing as that was my first post with content abd it was after I was under extreme pressure.
If he's town, this lines up a lot like a less-clean version of what I did to Hydrad in X-Shot.
So I, personally can't win here. But we, as a town, can.
PPE
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I don't like Amph leaning on Teproc so much. But I don't agree with RR that he's not scumhunting, he's just doing so in a flippant fashion, which, eh, we've all been there.
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The problem is that I actually do the long reread posts when I'm town as well, like I did in the recently finished x-shots.
After I did it as scum, I realized it was actually a great way to get into a game that I was otherwise not very invested in.
And a great way to get pressure off you when you're getting lynched.
I'm not saying you're scummy for making long reread posts, I'm just saying you're not getting town points from me. I think you're scummy for independent reasons.
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I don't like Amph leaning on Teproc so much. But I don't agree with RR that he's not scumhunting, he's just doing so in a flippant fashion, which, eh, we've all been there.
Um...before page 20, how was I scumhunting?
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Lol RR you go after me every day of every game we're in. Props for consistency I guess.
ADK, keep in mind I've only had a little time in this game as a player so I'm still feeling out interactions :P
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Lol RR you go after me every day of every game we're in. Props for consistency I guess.
ADK, keep in mind I've only had a little time in this game as a player so I'm still feeling out interactions :P
Looks at these toungy faces! He's doung this on purpose just to get my goat.
And he's laughing out loud at the prospect of being lynched. Someone needs to help me get him. Six more people need to help me, actually.
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I don't like Amph leaning on Teproc so much. But I don't agree with RR that he's not scumhunting, he's just doing so in a flippant fashion, which, eh, we've all been there.
Um...before page 20, how was I scumhunting?
I don't agree with your statement that Ampharos is not scumhunting.
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When did F.DS mafia become such a soap opera?
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When did F.DS mafia become such a soap opera?
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14691.0
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When did F.DS mafia become such a soap opera?
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14691.0
lol
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Vote Count 1.6
Don't eat yellow snow.
2.7 (2): Awaclus, EgorK
Awaclus (2): Hydrad, Ampharos
gkrieg13 (1): A Drowned Kernel
Ampharos (2): Lekkit, RR.
RR (2): WW, SS.
Hydrad (1): 2.7
silverspawn (3): faust, chairs, gkrieg.
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
-
I'm probably at like L-2.
::)
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I'm probably at like L-2.
::)
We can change that for you if you want your prediction to be more accurate
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Don't eat yellow snow.
sage advice. Now let's lynch Hydrad. Fabricating Making a case right now
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Don't eat yellow snow.
sage advice. Now let's lynch Hydrad. Fabricating Making a case right now
I think someone said something about jokes that you are scum.
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Well, not much to make a case on.
15 posts. No content. Well, not no content. He does have a vote (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565277#msg565277) (to keep him off that nasty "not voting" section). He also talks a lot about people lurking (here (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565710#msg565710)and here (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565750#msg565750). 2 posts is a lot for hydrad right now). He gives an accurate read (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565711#msg565711) (important for town cred later). And then gives a ho-hum self-confessed scummy hedgy post (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566062#msg566062) about RR.
He also has a couple classic friendly hydrad posts. But all in all, this has been a game he has had trouble getting into. Possibly because there was a bunch of random weird stuff that went on before I got subbed in. Possibly not. But anyway, my gut tells me that this Hydrad is scum!Hydrad. He is not that different than when he is town. Actually, he looks very much like town. I don't know. I just think that he is scum here until he proves otherwise.
-
Don't eat yellow snow.
sage advice. Now let's lynch Hydrad. Fabricating Making a case right now
I think someone said something about jokes that you are scum.
That has been said of me
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So where are we?
Awaclus
I officially suck at reading Awaclus I believe. I get a feeling that he's town though.
silverspawn
Still scummy. Well I've been all over this, right?
yuma --> 2.7
e has not done anything to make him seem more townie. He's apparently taking a lighthearted approach towards this game, I remember him being a lot more analytical. Could lynch.
gkrieg13
Seems very much like town. Won't lynch.
Roadrunner7671
The other guy I cannot read? I mean he's a decently good scum player, and a relatively bad town player, so lynching him would not be the worst. But that's really the only thing this lynch has going for it, and it's not enough.
A Drowned Kernel
Mostly IC.
Hydrad
Uh Hydrad. Dunno. Not townie the way he is sometimes. But he can also be town and not be like that. He's voting for Awaclus I see. Meh. Could lynch.
Lekkit
Day 1 pass because he rarely plays. Also his Teproc case seemed genuine.
Witherweaver
Gives me townie vibes. Won't lynch.
Teproc --> Ampharos
Teproc was townie, and Ampharos is his usual self... I don't think we've seen him as scum yet, so who knows? But I would prefer not to lynch.
chairs
No idea. Hopefully able to contribute more before the day ends.
EgorK
Same as above.
PPE 2
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yeah, Hydrad or RR are the to-go lynches today. e is towny for this case.
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Well, not much to make a case on.
15 posts. No content. Well, not no content. He does have a vote (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565277#msg565277) (to keep him off that nasty "not voting" section). He also talks a lot about people lurking (here (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565710#msg565710)and here (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565750#msg565750). 2 posts is a lot for hydrad right now). He gives an accurate read (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565711#msg565711) (important for town cred later). And then gives a ho-hum self-confessed scummy hedgy post (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566062#msg566062) about RR.
He also has a couple classic friendly hydrad posts. But all in all, this has been a game he has had trouble getting into. Possibly because there was a bunch of random weird stuff that went on before I got subbed in. Possibly not. But anyway, my gut tells me that this Hydrad is scum!Hydrad. He is not that different than when he is town. Actually, he looks very much like town. I don't know. I just think that he is scum here until he proves otherwise.
So you go into a reread with a gut scum read, and look for ways to validate that?
Much to learn you still have.
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yeah, Hydrad or RR are the to-go lynches today. e is towny for this case.
Vote: silverspawn
Oh, I'm doing that already? Dang.
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I'd be okay lynching e or Faust. RR is still preferable; I'd get behind Hydrad too.
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I'd be okay lynching e or Faust. RR is still preferable; I'd get behind Hydrad too.
Me? This should be interesting.
Is there anyone you do not want to lynch?
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Well, not much to make a case on.
15 posts. No content. Well, not no content. He does have a vote (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565277#msg565277) (to keep him off that nasty "not voting" section). He also talks a lot about people lurking (here (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565710#msg565710)and here (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565750#msg565750). 2 posts is a lot for hydrad right now). He gives an accurate read (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565711#msg565711) (important for town cred later). And then gives a ho-hum self-confessed scummy hedgy post (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566062#msg566062) about RR.
He also has a couple classic friendly hydrad posts. But all in all, this has been a game he has had trouble getting into. Possibly because there was a bunch of random weird stuff that went on before I got subbed in. Possibly not. But anyway, my gut tells me that this Hydrad is scum!Hydrad. He is not that different than when he is town. Actually, he looks very much like town. I don't know. I just think that he is scum here until he proves otherwise.
So you go into a reread with a gut scum read, and look for ways to validate that?
Much to learn you still have.
Eh, I wouldn't necessarily say that. More of a "I wasn't getting the townie vibe from Hydrad that I usually get, my next post will show you why"
Granted, I didn't frame it quite like what I just said. But I like to actually take sides rather than be wishy washy hedgemaster
Hydrad
Uh Hydrad. Dunno. Not townie the way he is sometimes. But he can also be town and not be like that. He's voting for Awaclus I see. Meh. Could lynch.
-
faust's tunelling of me is scummy, but not overly so. I think it makes him a null read again, maybe slightly scummy, but not enough to lynch him.
-
so yeah, this is not a good pool
I'd be okay lynching e or Faust.
e is even worse.
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Granted, I didn't frame it quite like what I just said. But I like to actually take sides rather than be wishy washy hedgemaster
Hydrad
Uh Hydrad. Dunno. Not townie the way he is sometimes. But he can also be town and not be like that. He's voting for Awaclus I see. Meh. Could lynch.
Yes you're so cool because you're taking sides. Wait you're not. You're taking one side on one single player and are mostly ignoring the rest of the game. And that side is not even supported by evidence. Not that I have anything against gut reads, but then I'd at least like some more of them.
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I'd be okay lynching e or Faust. RR is still preferable; I'd get behind Hydrad too.
Me? This should be interesting.
Is there anyone you do not want to lynch?
ADK.. I don't feel Gkrieg and Silver, and though it pains me to say it, I don't want to lynch Awaclus.
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won't lynch: WW, faust, ADK, e
want to lynch: RR, ss, Ampharos
would lynch: all the rest
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Actually I probably wouldn't lynch Awaclus or Lekkit unless the case was particularly strong
-
What's the case against RR?
I think Gkreig has ulterior motives.
-
What's the case against RR?
unhelpful, semi-lurkiness, no town vibes, talks about himself in the third person
-
And scummy voting.
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I like e. e's on my towny list also!
hmmmmmm.
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I'd be okay lynching e or Faust. RR is still preferable; I'd get behind Hydrad too.
O_O thats an interesting pool. But your definitely different from others reads from what I can see...
Now does that make you scum or town. It gives me a weird feeling from at least thats at least what I'm getting.
I'm actually going to go with scummy.
Vote: WW
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oh huh. gkrieg and faust have him as town reads?
I don't think I missed something. maybe we just got different vibes?
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oh huh. gkrieg and faust have him as town reads?
I don't think I missed something. maybe we just got different vibes?
Well, I for one would call forming a read upon a single post "missing something", yes.
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oh huh. gkrieg and faust have him as town reads?
I don't think I missed something. maybe we just got different vibes?
Well, I for one would call forming a read upon a single post "missing something", yes.
it wasn't just that post. I've been feeling weird about him for a bit and that post was the one that pushed it over the edge a bit for me if that makes sense.
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Makes sense indeed.
Vote: Hydrad
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Makes sense indeed.
Vote: Hydrad
:(
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I still want to lynch e the most, also fine with Hydrad. I'm cautiously townreading silver here.
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vote: hydrad let's do this.
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Busy day, won't be around much tomorrow either with the super bowl and everything
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Hydrad still mad about WW ousting him on the final day of Marvel mafia ;)
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Hydrad still mad about WW ousting him on the final day of Marvel mafia ;)
ah thats happened a bunch. I've never won as scum at lylo. actually I think WW has already done that before to me as well.
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I could go for a Hydrad lynch.
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So we have a little over 2 days to the deadline. I won't really be around today at all until very late, but will be around all day Monday.
I like the bit of momentum we have with the hydrad lynch, but we need more input and activity to keep it alive and well
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I'm probably going to be mostly V/LA for an indefinite amount of time, I'm sicker than I've been in years.
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So we have a little over 2 days to the deadline. I won't really be around today at all until very late, but will be around all day Monday.
I like the bit of momentum we have with the hydrad lynch, but we need more input and activity to keep it alive and well
I agree with this.
Vote Count 1.gkrieg
Don't eat yellow snow.
2.7 (2): Awaclus, EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (2): Lekkit, RR.
RR (2): WW, SS.
Hydrad (3): 2.7, faust, ADK
silverspawn (2): chairs, gkrieg.
Witherweaver (1): Hydrad
Not Voting (0):
Well I was thinking anyone on a wagon that is smaller than 3 should pick a different wagon, but that means pretty much anybody. Ampharos and Hydrad should probably move their votes seeing as WW and Awaclus are probably not happening today.
Seeing as it has been 48 hours now:
request prod on EgorK
request prod on Lekkit
request prod on chairs
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well, Hydrad is good. Even though the lack of motivation for an RR lynch makes me want to do him more
still vote: Hydrad
I think Hydrad is like hillary here. Not great, but popular, and probably the second best option.
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What, am I the best option?
Amaphoros is trying t hard to recreate his meta here. I like my vote where it is.
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So now WW should probably move his vote as well
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What, am I the best option?
Amaphoros is trying t hard to recreate his meta here. I like my vote where it is.
Can you substantiate this?
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So now WW should probably move his vote as well
(http://i.imgur.com/as5HjpJ.gif)
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Time for an EPIC TOAST
(http://orig10.deviantart.net/c435/f/2014/028/2/4/toast_s_epic_face_by_thedrksiren-d745pb2.png)
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But seriously, why Hydrad?
-
But seriously, why Hydrad?
a wise man once said day 1 is about figuring out who is town, not scum.
hydrad doesn't seem to be town, so . . .
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Busy weekend. Have been reading from my phone.
In 8 hours or so I'll be back at work and ready to do a full thorogh read of this.
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So now WW should probably move his vote as well
(http://i.imgur.com/as5HjpJ.gif)
If you're the reason we no lynch I will auto lynch you for this attitude mister
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Wow all the proddees showed up quickly
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If you're the reason we no lynch I will auto lynch you for this attitude mister
I want to auto-lynch you for wanting to auto-lynch someone...
But seriously, calm down... it's been the weekend, we still have almost 2 days left. No need yet for hasty vote switching. Anyway it's been a long time since we had a good old-fashioned last minute lynch.
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The auto lynch thing was a joke. I just think the actual activity level has been down and I've been bored so I wanted something to spike activity level. At least a last minute lynch would be on a Tuesday at a time that many people will be available hopefully
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The auto lynch thing was a joke. I just think the actual activity level has been down and I've been bored so I wanted something to spike activity level. At least a last minute lynch would be on a Tuesday at a time that many people will be available hopefully
I just realized I probably won't be. Well I might pop in. But don't count on it. I will be around Monday though, and early Tuesday if that helps anyone.
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request prod on EgorK
request prod on Lekkit
request prod on chairs
Egor prodded, but gently since he did announce vla til tonight.
The others have arrived.
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How does one get gently prodded?
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Vote Count 1.7
To gently prod is divine.
2.7 (2): Awaclus, EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (2): Lekkit, RR.
RR (1): WW
Hydrad (4): 2.7, faust, ADK, SS
silverspawn (2): chairs, gkrieg.
WW (1): Hydrad
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
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Reread time!
Starting with Awaclus.
I really don't want to put too much emphasis on the whole QT discussion, because I don't think discussing what's real or not outside of the game is really a good way to play. However, I do think this is a thing to at least note.
In that case I'll already point out that the only stuff I usually write in personal QTs is communication with the mods, so if it turns out that I don't have anything in there at a later time, it is not indicative of my alignment.
Since this seems to contradict the whole, "I'm still in the game, so I must be town". I guess he could've realized as time went on just how much importance he thought it had to have QTs filled with content as scum.
Either way, moving on.
Pretty early he votes for yuma for not making sense to him.
Says he likes my case on Teproc but after finding out about his "townslip" says he likes the yuma vote better.
LOTS of discussion on the QT issue.
Says he still wants to lynch e (former yuma) but could go for Hydrad as well. Cautiously townreading silverspawn.
That is... Not much actual content. I know I'm not really one to talk. But all of his stated opinions are: silverspawn is maybe town, would be willing to lynch Hydrad but likes e better.
My sentence: would be willing to lynch.
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I really don't want to put too much emphasis on the whole QT discussion, because I don't think discussing what's real or not outside of the game is really a good way to play.
Well, you don't even need to take my word for the studying related stuff. Simply the fact that all humans need to sleep proves beyond any doubt that I'm town.
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I really don't want to put too much emphasis on the whole QT discussion, because I don't think discussing what's real or not outside of the game is really a good way to play.
Well, you don't even need to take my word for the studying related stuff. Simply the fact that all humans need to sleep proves beyond any doubt that I'm town.
By the same logic, everyone in this game is town. Hooray!
-
faust
Proposed the whole claim a PR that's not as important-plan. Which while somewhat beneficial to scum, creates an IC for town, which I think is worth more. After ADK claimed he still want to make sure that whoever can counterclaim will. Meaning he's either scum playing it well, or town that actually want to make sure the plan worked out as planned.
Ask people a lot of follow up questions to get to know what they are thinking.
Bickers with yuma.
Makes a case on yuma based on him not being as productive as faust thinks he would be if he was town.
Goes into the QT discussion with Awaclus.
Says he's willing to pressure the lurkers more.
Apart from people that are completely absent, WW and silver are the guys I have the least of a read on, so let's check out what they did so far.
Reads scummy on silverspawn and towny on WW.
So what are your other reads?
Breaks down the responses from silverspawn on the case on him. I think that the case was pretty weak to begin with, and silverspawns response is overall solid. Continues to pressure silverspawn, which I think looks more like tunneling than actual scumhunting.
Defends gkrieg saying he's not scummy.
Ah. Reads.
So where are we?
Awaclus
I officially suck at reading Awaclus I believe. I get a feeling that he's town though.
silverspawn
Still scummy. Well I've been all over this, right?
yuma --> 2.7
e has not done anything to make him seem more townie. He's apparently taking a lighthearted approach towards this game, I remember him being a lot more analytical. Could lynch.
gkrieg13
Seems very much like town. Won't lynch.
Roadrunner7671
The other guy I cannot read? I mean he's a decently good scum player, and a relatively bad town player, so lynching him would not be the worst. But that's really the only thing this lynch has going for it, and it's not enough.
A Drowned Kernel
Mostly IC.
Hydrad
Uh Hydrad. Dunno. Not townie the way he is sometimes. But he can also be town and not be like that. He's voting for Awaclus I see. Meh. Could lynch.
Lekkit
Day 1 pass because he rarely plays. Also his Teproc case seemed genuine.
Witherweaver
Gives me townie vibes. Won't lynch.
Teproc --> Ampharos
Teproc was townie, and Ampharos is his usual self... I don't think we've seen him as scum yet, so who knows? But I would prefer not to lynch.
chairs
No idea. Hopefully able to contribute more before the day ends.
EgorK
Same as above.
Things that stand out to me:
Implies that yuma was scummy and e should try to change that if he's town.
RR is a null-read, but he thinks it might be fine for town to lynch him.
Hydrad is a null-read.
I get a day 1 pass. For future reference, I don't like those. This is a game with player elimination. If I'm in it I'm aware of that.
So. Out of the 4 (?) people he didn't have a good read on, he chose to only reread two of them?
Changes his vote ty Hydrad.
Overall, he's been trying to get others to express their thoughts. Something I feel benefits town more than scum, which makes it more towny. Also is very active, so I'd rather have him around than not.
My sentence: Would not lynch.
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By the same logic, everyone in this game is town. Hooray!
Some people don't spend as much time thinking hard about the exact wording of their posts in an effort to make them as short as possible as I do.
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silverspawn
Early stuff is mostly about the QT-thing and some fluffy banter.
Votes for ADK but quickly changes it to Hydrad. I can see both town and scum making this mistake. But if silverspawn flips scum before Hydrad is lynched I think this is likely to give Hydrad some town points, since I'm guessing he'd vote for a random townie.
Changes his vote to RR for tunneling faust.
Changes back to Hydrad.
Switches to yuma without any real reasoning. Earlier he said he thought yuma's emotional reactions were towny.
Says Teproc is town because of his townslip and my case. I guess it has to do with him thinking I'm scum, so a case on someone must mean they're town? Also switches back to RR.
Says he still perfers to lynch RR or Hydrad. RR because he's anti-town and stubborn. Hydrad because he's non-present. Which I assume means either because he's lurking or not contributing. There were a bunch of other people at the time that were not really present. So I don't see why Hydrad should be singled out.
Joins the Grkrieg wagon from the rock solid case from Ampharos: "Gkrieg is scum".
Clarifies that the vote was because of an earlier post from Gkrieg that was just a vote on silverspawn.
Switches back to RR due to a post from Gkrieg that he didn't like.
Explains that he didn't like the post because he thought the points made were projecting Gkrieg's scum plays on silverspawn. A fair point.
Revotes RR. Takes an entire post.
Refers to the RR- and Hydrad lynch as go-to lynches for the day.
Switches back to Hydrad. The Hillary of the two.
After rereading. I guess I'm not so opposed to the lynch after all.
My sentence: Would lynch.
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heh. that reread sounds so much like town!me, you would convince me if I didn't already know.
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heh. that reread sounds so much like town!me, you would convince me if I didn't already know.
Why did I even stop? Vote: silverspawn
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heh. that reread sounds so much like town!me, you would convince me if I didn't already know.
Why did I even stop? Vote: silverspawn
It's either because you realized that it wasn't a good option, or, if you're scum, because you concluded that a different mislynch was more worth pursuing.
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I have trouble seeing scum!you switch from scum to town here, though. That just makes you look super bad once gkrieg gets lynched.
Can't we do sanders RR after all? For a better america lynch!
vote: RR
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I post dozens of times in my QT, even as a VT.
But that is 100% confidential until the end of the game and I'm never ever sharing from my QT. Cause that's dumb. And you know me, I never do anything dumb.
you know what?
RR needs to share his QT, now. That's so much evidence and you want me to believe that he just blatantly refuses to use it? It can't get much more anti town than that.
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yeah, forget the gkrieg lynch. We need to make RR share his QT or otherwise lynch him.
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Hi everyone.
Also you can't get a more scummy OP
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I have trouble seeing scum!you switch from scum to town here, though. That just makes you look super bad once gkrieg gets lynched.
If you're convinced enough that faust is scum that you'd give a town read on the person you're currently voting for (who, btw, was not gkrieg, it was Hydrad) based on the fact that faust unvoted him, why do you want to lynch RR over faust?
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Although I do agree with RR sharing his QT.
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Oh, he's voting for me? Vote: SS
note that this put me on L-3! it's an L-3 disguised as an OMGUS vote.
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fake fake fake
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I have trouble seeing scum!you switch from scum to town here, though. That just makes you look super bad once gkrieg gets lynched.
If you're convinced enough that faust is scum that you'd give a town read on the person you're currently voting for (who, btw, was not gkrieg, it was Hydrad) based on the fact that faust unvoted him, why do you want to lynch RR over faust?
I don't need to be convinced to make this argument. If I quarter the town cred I would give gkrieg if faust was scum, there's still enough of it left to make gkrieg meh.
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fake fake fake
tunnel tunnel tunnel
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Okay faust. Explain to me how it's not pro town for RR to share his QT. I'm curious.
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Okay faust. Explain to me how it's not pro town for RR to share his QT. I'm curious.
I'm not saying it's not. But noone should be required to share this information, that's just rude. If you say you have been posting less because you were sick, I don't require you to post a scan of your medical prescription even though it may be pro-town.
Luckily, you pretty much laid out your strategy to get a mislynch in here:
Here is why that will get you lynched
[...]
- Refuse - will get you lynched
- Claim you happen to not have posted anything in your QT this game - will probably get you lynched, because players will know it's probably a lie
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And together with this:
I'm doing this anyway, regardless of rules.
You're doing what?
If I ever mod a game I'm implementing this rule, and I already refuse to quote from a QT.
your mislynch agenda gets pretty clear.
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yuma/2.7
Some QT-talk.
Disagrees that someone should counterclaim ADK. This doesn't seem like a scum move to me. At all.
Gets emotional and votes for faust.
Responds to faust's reread with very defensive comments. Defensive in a defend his person, not his role.
Tells us he sent a PM to the mod. Is then replaced by 2.7/e.
Votes for EgorK due to some fruit vendor related stuff I'll have to look up.
READS!
I think Awaclus is being counterproductive, but probably town.
I like lekkit as town right now
RR, chairs, hydrad, gkrieg, no real thoughts
ADK is town with his claim
Ww, teproc, faust, need more time to get an opinion
Same with silverspawn. I am leaning a but town on silverspawn though
This post...
Leanst town on Awaclus, me and a bit on silverspawn. No real opinion on anyone else. What's really weird is that he doesn't have an opinion on faust, Teproc/Ampharos or RR who actually have been posting a bit. Maybe WW fits in there as well. Can't really remember much of what he said so far, though. This reread is going to be interesting. :D
Switches vote to Hydrad. With only a double post to go on where Hydrad says he doesn't have a read on RR.
Encourages other to vote for Hydrad. Says he'll figure out why he's scum later. (Joke?)
Lays out his case against Hydrad, which is basically saying there's not enough to go on. I think that's a case against a lot of players so far. Also says he got a gut feeling Hydrad is scum.
And that's basically it.
I hope we'll see some less lazy stuff soon. Currently his two scumreads are very inactive people. You know the people who have said a lot? What are your thoughts about them? Maybe it's time to actually form the opinions you said you needed more time to form. Overall, seems like he was hastily thrown in the game and didn't really bother to reread properly. I guess that gives him some town points, though.
My sentence: I'm leaning slightly more town than scum. But could still be convinced to lynch.
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I'm not saying it's not.
Except you are. You are saying it in your following posts. Which means you just lied.
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I'm not saying it's not. But noone should be required to share this information, that's just rude.
Noone should vote for me because that's rude. And when we're playing Dominion, you shouldn't buy Goons because that's rude.
It's a game and we're trying to win it. We shouldn't avoid making the correct play just because it's "rude".
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Luckily, you pretty much laid out your strategy to get a mislynch in here: [...]
No I did not. The crucial piece of context that you just chipped from the post you quoted is this here:
Suppose you are someone who posts a lot in QTs. Now let's suppose you start a game and roll scum.
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What you are really doing here is arguing why we should not use this weapon that makes the game unfair for scum. Guess who has an incentive to make that argument? Scum.
I tried my hardest to talk sense into everyone while the game was still early enough for a rulestart. I tried to convince you that we should keep the game fair.
But now it started and we didn't do that, and now you are telling me we're supposed not to use our advantage? that's crazy!
I do not have a mislynch agenda. If RR is town, it might clear him. If RR is scum, it might reveal him. That's called a pro town thing.
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I'm legit not sure what to do with ss. I kind of read him as scummy but am afraid it's just ss being ss.
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I'll just post this now, lynch me if you want, but if you do, please let me finish my rereads first. :P I have exactly 3 posts in my QT. Two of which I'm not allowed to repost. And here's my third:
I'm ready.
I'm pretty sure that I'm not going to write anything else here. Just as I haven't been keeping notes during other games. Or have been devoting all my time to the game. Something that's required in order for me to play "optimally".
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I'll just post this now, lynch me if you want, but if you do, please let me finish my rereads first. :P I have exactly 3 posts in my QT. Two of which I'm not allowed to repost. And here's my third:
No-one is trying to lynch you
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I'm legit not sure what to do with ss. I kind of read him as scummy but am afraid it's just ss being ss.
I'm less interested in how you read me and more in what excuse you have for not agreeing with what is obviously the best play, unless you do agree.
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Sorry, I don't like bird meat flavored girl scout cookies :(
If you're talking about your whole RR thing.
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Luckily, you pretty much laid out your strategy to get a mislynch in here: [...]
No I did not. The crucial piece of context that you just chipped from the post you quoted is this here:
Suppose you are someone who posts a lot in QTs. Now let's suppose you start a game and roll scum.
But... that is my argument. You're trying to frame RR as scum, so of course you would refer to something that is a scum narrative to get him lynched.
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I'm legit not sure what to do with ss. I kind of read him as scummy but am afraid it's just ss being ss.
I'm less interested in how you read me and more in what excuse you have for not agreeing with what is obviously the best play, unless you do agree.
One Awaclus is frankly enough for me, thank you.
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I'm not saying it's not. But noone should be required to share this information, that's just rude.
Noone should vote for me because that's rude. And when we're playing Dominion, you shouldn't buy Goons because that's rude.
It's a game and we're trying to win it. We shouldn't avoid making the correct play just because it's "rude".
Well, in that case I suppose best play for us is to bully you out of the game.
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But... that is my argument. You're trying to frame RR as scum, so of course you would refer to something that is a scum narrative to get him lynched.
the whole point of the QT thing is that, for people who post a lot in them, it reveals their alignment, no matter which alignment they have.
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A... well, someone once said that mafia is but a neverending struggle against a continuous onslaught of cognitive biases
I don't even know what to make of this
Sorry, I don't like bird meat flavored girl scout cookies :(
hey I'm out of arguments!
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Well, in that case I suppose best play for us is to bully you out of the game.
I don't think that would be allowed by the rules, and it also wouldn't be the best play because it wouldn't work.
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But... that is my argument. You're trying to frame RR as scum, so of course you would refer to something that is a scum narrative to get him lynched.
the whole point of the QT thing is that, for people who post a lot in them, it reveals their alignment, no matter which alignment they have.
And the point of my accusation is that you already know RR will not quote his QT and you're using your known position on the QT issue as a way to easily frame him because in your simplistic world, only scum ever not quotes their QT.
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But... that is my argument. You're trying to frame RR as scum, so of course you would refer to something that is a scum narrative to get him lynched.
the whole point of the QT thing is that, for people who post a lot in them, it reveals their alignment, no matter which alignment they have.
And the point of my accusation is that you already know RR will not quote his QT and you're using your known position on the QT issue as a way to easily frame him because in your simplistic world, only scum ever not quotes their QT.
er, well, no. I assume RR will quote his QT.
I still believe that RR is town with more than 50%, and that town!RR almost certainly does quote his QT.
I guess you're trying to imply that this isn't true, and town!RR would refuse to do that. But why would he do that.
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Because he said he wouldn't?
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Because he said he wouldn't?
do I really have to spell this out? How often do 13 year olds announce they will never do something, and how often do they stick to it?
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not even mentioning that refusing to do so would be horrifically anti town...
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Same as refusing to claim your role or even having this discussion.
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Here. Finished goong throuh thread, would post what I take from it later. What caught my eye on last couple of pages is how Awaclus hypocritically requires RR to share his QT
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fake fake fake
I don't think this is how scum!Silver acts.
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gkrieg13
So looking back at the matrix, We either just gave scum 0 information, in the case we are playing the straight up and down one, or we gave them information that confirms the setup for them, in the case we are playing the straight across one.
This is worth noting. Townslip.
Votes for yuma.
Later says it's probably just annoyed yuma.
Changes vote to Teproc.
Does a reread and actually posts something with a bit of substance. With null-scummy reads on EgorK and silverspawn and a scumread on Teproc (later Ampharos).
Says Ampharos is scummy after only two posts. I guess for thinking Awaclus is the scummiest?
Wonders why people are voting for RR and Hydrad, then goes on and says RR is acting weird.
Votes for Hydrad after he posted a brief post with a vote for RR.
Says RR is weird, but not necessarily scummy. Soon thereafter he votes for RR himself.
Changes his vote to silverspawn without anything else in the post. Putting him at L-2 which he soon after points out.
Explains why he think silverspawn is scummy. For playing like gkrieg does as scum.
won't lynch: WW, faust, ADK, e
want to lynch: RR, ss, Ampharos
would lynch: all the rest
Suddenly strong town reads on WW, faust and e. Unless there's some other reason for not wanting to lynch them. Still finds the same three people scummy.
Well I was thinking anyone on a wagon that is smaller than 3 should pick a different wagon, but that means pretty much anybody. Ampharos and Hydrad should probably move their votes seeing as WW and Awaclus are probably not happening today.
Basically encourage eveyone to vote for Hydrad. Keeps his own vote on a 2 person wagon, which seems like it could possibly happen seeing as it gained traction earlier.
Overall, I think he's a bit all over the place. Seems a bit stubborn on his scum reads, tries to get stuff happening, stays inactive, making votes-only posts. I do get a towny vibe from him and paired with the townslip early, I think he's likely to be town.
My sentence: Would not lynch.
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Here. Finished goong throuh thread, would post what I take from it later. What caught my eye on last couple of pages is how Awaclus hypocritically requires RR to share his QT
How is it hypocritical? I have already shared that my QT doesn't have anything in it (and never will).
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Here. Finished goong throuh thread, would post what I take from it later. What caught my eye on last couple of pages is how Awaclus hypocritically requires RR to share his QT
How is it hypocritical? I have already shared that my QT doesn't have anything in it (and never will).
Then I do not see why you need to fabricate one if you are scum
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Here. Finished goong throuh thread, would post what I take from it later. What caught my eye on last couple of pages is how Awaclus hypocritically requires RR to share his QT
How is it hypocritical? I have already shared that my QT doesn't have anything in it (and never will).
Then I do not see why you need to fabricate one if you are scum
Let's not try to bring logic into this.
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Same as refusing to claim your role or even having this discussion.
+1
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Because he said he wouldn't?
do I really have to spell this out? How often do 13 year olds announce they will never do something, and how often do they stick to it?
This post is discriminating I believe.
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So looking back at the matrix, We either just gave scum 0 information, in the case we are playing the straight up and down one, or we gave them information that confirms the setup for them, in the case we are playing the straight across one.
This is worth noting. Townslip.
How is that a townslip? It's true if you look at the setup and believe that I'm telling the truth. It actually makes gkrieg scummier in my mind.
Also, I have zero interest in asking people to quote their QTs, because I'm 100% sure that scum!RR has a fake QT ready. I don't believe that it's as hard as people are making it out to be.
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Thanks for posting these lekkit! My scum read on ss is growing stronger
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This post is discriminating I believe.
exceedingly helpful comment
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This post is discriminating I believe.
exceedingly helpful comment
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it is. unhelpful!faust is more likely scum!faust
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Then I do not see why you need to fabricate one if you are scum
Because if it comes down to scum!me fakeclaiming, say, Doctor, vs. a townie counterclaiming me, people are going to believe the townie with a QT.
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Well, I am helping you be a better person.
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Because he said he wouldn't?
do I really have to spell this out? How often do 13 year olds announce they will never do something, and how often do they stick to it?
I'd like to point out that I was going to post my QT until this post. Figures.
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And SS's tunneling of me is ultra-scummy. He's probably going to try to lynch me for refusing to post my QT, which I am not okay with. So I think a Vote: SS is warranted.
I'm looking at him the way you guys are looking at me. If he's scum, great! If he's town, oh well, he wasn't doing anything helpful.
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And SS's tunneling of me is ultra-scummy. He's probably going to try to lynch me for refusing to post my QT, which I am not okay with. So I think a Vote: SS is warranted.
I'm looking at him the way you guys are looking at me. If he's scum, great! If he's town, oh well, he wasn't doing anything helpful.
He's doing something extremely helpful. Vote: RR
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Because he said he wouldn't?
do I really have to spell this out? How often do 13 year olds announce they will never do something, and how often do they stick to it?
I'd like to point out that I was going to post my QT until this post. Figures.
this does not surprise me, which is why I tried to maneuver around saying it, but Lekkit forced me to.
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And SS's tunneling of me is ultra-scummy. He's probably going to try to lynch me for refusing to post my QT, which I am not okay with. So I think a Vote: SS is warranted.
I'm looking at him the way you guys are looking at me. If he's scum, great! If he's town, oh well, he wasn't doing anything helpful.
He's doing something extremely helpful. Vote: RR
You don't want me to share my QT, right?
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no one forced you into anything. You said what you thought was best to say to get a lynch through. I won't fault you for that. I will say I don't like the method
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And SS's tunneling of me is ultra-scummy. He's probably going to try to lynch me for refusing to post my QT, which I am not okay with. So I think a Vote: SS is warranted.
I'm looking at him the way you guys are looking at me. If he's scum, great! If he's town, oh well, he wasn't doing anything helpful.
He's doing something extremely helpful. Vote: RR
You don't want me to share my QT, right?
I absolutely do. It's super pro-town to do so.
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Because he said he wouldn't?
do I really have to spell this out? How often do 13 year olds announce they will never do something, and how often do they stick to it?
I'd like to point out that I was going to post my QT until this post. Figures.
I actually think you're smarter than that and are doing this to get town cred. I'm watching you RR :o
PPEs
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no one forced you into anything. You said what you thought was best to say to get a lynch through. I won't fault you for that. I will say I don't like the method
Are you talking to SS or RR?
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no one forced you into anything. You said what you thought was best to say to get a lynch through. I won't fault you for that. I will say I don't like the method
Are you talking to SS or RR?
SS. sorry, I should have quoted
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at this point, it's probably too late to fix things, though. after being 'provoked' in this way, I would suspect RR not sharing his QT no matter what, which is unfortunately not indicative of his alignment, merely of him putting a certain sense of stubbornness over his wincon
he was my preferred lynch anyway, though, so...
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At L-1 I will share my QT.
PPE
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At L-1 I will share my QT.
PPE
oh, nevermind then.
let's see if this town wants to win the game or not.
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I post dozens of times in my QT, even as a VT.
But that is 100% confidential until the end of the game and I'm never ever sharing from my QT. Cause that's dumb. And you know me, I never do anything dumb.
you know what?
RR needs to share his QT, now. That's so much evidence and you want me to believe that he just blatantly refuses to use it? It can't get much more anti town than that.
Lekkit has just posted his reads. Just posted a ton of stuff to comment on. And you switch the conversation back over to a bottomless black hole that you know will result in meaningless discussion. Sure you get your interactions. But I say these interactions are not worth very much to the game at all.
vote: ss
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So for some more analysis of the silverspawn situation, I want to look at how he reacts to pressure as scum and as town. The only game on record where scum!silver was lynched is M50, so beware, it may be a little outdated. M62 is a game where he was mislynched as town.
Well M62 is pretty much rubbish because the lynch was a last-minute thing and silverspawn never really got a chance to react. Meh. No other mislynch except the recent one in M74, and that one had math, PRs and a self-hammer involved.
Anyway, how does M50 look? Not good, there's lots of things going on and silver was half-outed and anyway it was like his second game.
silver, if you could provide examples that you remember of games in which you were close to being lynched as either alignment, that would be helpful.
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At L-1 I will share my QT.
PPE
oh, nevermind then.
let's see if this town wants to win the game or not.
meh. good point.
vote: hydrad
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vote: hydrad
err what? why hydrad?
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vote: hydrad
err what? why hydrad?
I made my little case against him. Get the ball rolling. Do something. Gauge reactions. How did he react?
Buddying (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566503#msg566503)
A vote for WW (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566504#msg566504)
frowny face that you are voting me (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566516#msg566516)
None of these reactions are how I think town!hydrad reacts. But I totally see scum!hydrad doing each of these things.
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why aren't you voting to get RR to L-1
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why aren't you voting to get RR to L-1
Why do you want to force a D1 claim?
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silver, if you could provide examples that you remember of games in which you were close to being lynched as either alignment, that would be helpful.
siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiighhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ... sure.
I was pretty close in sss mafia here (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13975.400), and in College town (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13475.msg512974#msg512974).
Both were day 1, and I was town in both of them.
There aren't any scum examples, I believe. In Forest fire I wasn't under a lot of pressure I believe (for whatever reason), and my latest scum game previous to that is a long time ago
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why aren't you voting to get RR to L-1
Why do you want to force a D1 claim?
what kind of question is that????
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why aren't you voting to get RR to L-1
Why do you want to force a D1 claim?
what kind of question is that????
What kind of answer is that?
I can do this all day.
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why aren't you voting to get RR to L-1
Why do you want to force a D1 claim?
what kind of question is that????
forcing D1 claims is bad for town. Especially if it is a PR
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You usually want to get votes on people that are good scum candidates anyway. Now here we have the same with the added bonus of RR also probably confirming his alignment if he's at L-1. So it's like normal but better
I also cannot imagine anyone telling me that RR is towny if you reread him.
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forcing D1 claims is bad for town. Especially if it is a PR
day 1 claims are exceptionally good for town, because they're always the alternative of a lynch. You never lynch someone without giving him the opportunity to claim. Talking about the claim in a vacuum doesn't make sense.
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forcing D1 claims is bad for town. Especially if it is a PR
day 1 claims are exceptionally good for town, because they're always the alternative of a lynch. You never lynch someone without giving him the opportunity to claim. Talking about the claim in a vacuum doesn't make sense.
Well, but if I don't want to lynch RR, then I have no reason to put him to L-1, have I?
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forcing D1 claims is bad for town. Especially if it is a PR
day 1 claims are exceptionally good for town, because they're always the alternative of a lynch. You never lynch someone without giving him the opportunity to claim. Talking about the claim in a vacuum doesn't make sense.
Well, but if I don't want to lynch RR, then I have no reason to put him to L-1, have I?
Unless you're super desperate to see my QT.
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forcing D1 claims is bad for town. Especially if it is a PR
day 1 claims are exceptionally good for town, because they're always the alternative of a lynch. You never lynch someone without giving him the opportunity to claim. Talking about the claim in a vacuum doesn't make sense.
Well, but if I don't want to lynch RR, then I have no reason to put him to L-1, have I?
well... that depends how much credit you give the QT issue. If it is little, then yes. If it is a lot, then you do have the reason of creating an IC or catching scum, even if you don't have a scum read on him yet.
But really, why would you not want to lynch RR
The other guy I cannot read? I mean he's a decently good scum player, and a relatively bad town player, so lynching him would not be the worst. But that's really the only thing this lynch has going for it, and it's not enough.
The other thing he has going for him is that he is not towny. town!RR is towny.
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I was about to vote for Hydrad, then looked at the vote count and realized I was already voting for him. More people need to be on this lynch.
Silverspawn being super tunnel-y and stubborn doesn't look too much like scum!SS to me. Silverspawn, if you're town, just switch to Hydrad, it's a good lynch.
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Okay, so looking at silver's performance in M65.
The wagon on silver there really gets going as Teproc makes a case on him, just like I made a case on him here. He does a point-by-point response to this, similar to what he does here. Well I think he arguments he makes in M65 are a lot better, and more rational, than they are here. That alone does not have to mean he's scum though.
Quoting for hilarity:
@faust: you're good at reading me
Oh look, I found Teproc's case bad. I thought I did. Well I was scum, so it's an easy thing to say.
And I see it's the fakehammer game. Well after that things are probably not worth analyzing anymore.
Overall the focus of town!silver in that game seems to lie more on convincing people he's town and less on pushing another lynch through. I would not call the evidence decisive though. It's just too short a time span where he is actually under pressure. So I guess it does not do a lot to change my stance on silver. Meh. I hoped this would be better.
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forcing D1 claims is bad for town. Especially if it is a PR
day 1 claims are exceptionally good for town, because they're always the alternative of a lynch. You never lynch someone without giving him the opportunity to claim. Talking about the claim in a vacuum doesn't make sense.
Well, but if I don't want to lynch RR, then I have no reason to put him to L-1, have I?
Is there something holding you back from RR other than Silver being for him and your general feeling of Trumpishness?
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The other thing he has going for him is that he is not towny. town!RR is towny.
No. Well, not to me. If you can explain to me how to read RR though, I will be ever thankful.
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Is there something holding you back from RR other than Silver being for him and your general feeling of Trumpishness?
I think Hydrad and silver are both better lynches in terms of information and likelihood that they are scum.
By the way: silver, do you want to quote your QT?
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Silverspawn being super tunnel-y and stubborn doesn't look too much like scum!SS to me. Silverspawn, if you're town, just switch to Hydrad, it's a good lynch.
What does scum!silver look like?
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I had more patience that game, and I played more solid.. that made it easier to make good points against the teproc case.
By the way: silver, do you want to quote your QT?
uh :( no
I'll do it if necessary, but it's more about the QT issue and less about the game...
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I had more patience that game, and I played more solid.. that made it easier to make good points against the teproc case.
By the way: silver, do you want to quote your QT?
uh :( no
I'll do it if necessary, but it's more about the QT issue and less about the game...
I'm no longer sharing my QT.
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I had more patience that game, and I played more solid.. that made it easier to make good points against the teproc case.
By the way: silver, do you want to quote your QT?
uh :( no
I'll do it if necessary, but it's more about the QT issue and less about the game...
Take care not to be "horrifically anti town"...
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Does anyone think Faust is scummy?
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Silverspawn being super tunnel-y and stubborn doesn't look too much like scum!SS to me. Silverspawn, if you're town, just switch to Hydrad, it's a good lynch.
What does scum!silver look like?
I'll admit that I'm not very up on people's metas, but I don't imagine scum!silver would be pushing this hard on a lynch, he'd be more opportunistic (unless the other major wagon was his partner). This is more of a generic read on him I guess but I'm not super hot on meta-based reads anyway. The way people say things is going to be pretty consistent between scum and town, it's who and how and when they vote that's the real info. silverspawn is being himself personality-wise, whatever. He's also pushing a wagon super hard, against various resistances, attracting (and responding to) negative attention, and not switching to a more convenient and more popular wagon. I think a Hydrad lynch would be very informative at this point, regardless of whether or not silver is on it.
PPE: I would like to reiterate that I am against making reads on QTs. If scum!RR is 100% likely to have a fake QT ready scum!SS is like 110% likely.
PPE 2: Not particularly.
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Take care not to be "horrifically anti town"...
once again we have a matter of reading something into something that's not there.
You asked me if I like to share my QT. I don't like to, it's honestly a bit shameful. It's not as if I asked RR if he liked to share his QT and he said no and I called him anti town.
I said I will share it if it's necessary (which includes if people request it) so where is the problem? no-one requested it.
you're implying that there is a double standard, when that's absolutely not the case.
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I'm no longer sharing my QT.
Please note that you called me discriminating for implying that RR changes his mind a lot
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Vote Count 1.8
All you need is love. But a little chocolate now and then doesn't hurt.
2.7 (1): EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (1): Lekkit.
RR (3): WW, SS, Awaclus
Hydrad (2): ADK, 2.7
silverspawn (4): chairs, gkrieg, faust, RR.
WW (1): Hydrad
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 will end on Tuesday, February 9, at 1 pm forum time.
That's in ~24 hours - note Voting Rule 6.
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Oh, yes. Someone's getting lynched today probably.
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Take care not to be "horrifically anti town"...
once again we have a matter of reading something into something that's not there.
You asked me if I like to share my QT. I don't like to, it's honestly a bit shameful. It's not as if I asked RR if he liked to share his QT and he said no and I called him anti town.
I said I will share it if it's necessary (which includes if people request it) so where is the problem? no-one requested it.
you're implying that there is a double standard, when that's absolutely not the case.
::)
I request that you share your QT.
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I'm no longer sharing my QT.
Please note that you called me discriminating for implying that RR changes his mind a lot
No, I called you discriminating for implying that all 13-year olds change their mind a lot.
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No, I called you discriminating for implying that all 13-year olds change their mind a lot.
okay, true.
yeah, I think most of them do. I certainly did. I don't think that's discriminating, but whatever.
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So are most people voting silverspawn because he is being mildly irritating right now or because they think he is scum? I still like my Hydrad case. Plenty of time to go. Will obviously switch for a lynch though
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So are most people voting silverspawn because he is being mildly irritating right now or because they think he is scum? I still like my Hydrad case. Plenty of time to go. Will obviously switch for a lynch though
What kind of answer do you expect to get here?
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So are most people voting silverspawn because he is being mildly irritating right now or because they think he is scum?
No, most people are not voting silverspawn. :P
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So are most people voting silverspawn because he is being mildly irritating right now or because they think he is scum?
No, most people are not voting silverspawn. :P
Would be pretty hard to get 3.5 billion people to vote silverspawn.
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So are most people voting silverspawn because he is being mildly irritating right now or because they think he is scum?
No, most people are not voting silverspawn. :P
Would be pretty hard to get 3.5 billion people to vote silverspawn.
I'm itching to vote faust now, this really seems blatantly unhelpful and not faust-like.
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I request that you share your QT.
*sad sigh*... fine
I see fit
But what if I don't have any thoughts?
Post 4: well, here we already see how stupid this rule is. I made a joke that quotes a part of my role PM. if I explained what that joke was, that would probably make me an IC immediately, but that would most likely be violating the rules... although why would it? It isn't communication with the mod. Taking the rules literally, it should be allowed. ehhhh.
okay let's get serious (us = the QT & me). time to read the setup.
Matrix setup. I see. well, let's see what I need to know.
It can be multibball and it can have SK. I don't like either of those things. Meh.
Okay that's enough, I have stuff to do. Bye QT ♥
Post 8: here I am confirming my role, that's certainly illegal to quote
Uh. Look.
There is a reason why I disallowed this in my games.
And it puts me in an odd spot. On the one hand, I know that this is an enormous advantage for town which you probably underestimate greatly. On the other hand, the knowledge that everything I write into this QT will eventually be relevant for determining my alignment and will be judged is, well, dumb. It should theoretically make me post more, since the most I post, the harder would it be for hypothetical!scum!me to replicate all that, but then again, hypothetical!scum!me would probably right now start a separate QT for replicating that exact process, and now I am thinking about how, if this gets quoted sometime at the end of the game, people are going to think about whether or not this is ALREADY that fake QT and everyone will have to have 2 QTs if he wants to play this properly and can't you see how much this shifts the game into a direction that has nothing to do with mafia?
Please rethink that rule decision. If nothing else, it will make your game unbalanced. This is a huge deal.
Post 10/11: probably disallowed
QTQTQTTQTTQTEREdingdingdingding
I'm currently debating whether or not I should make a joke about involving the QT into this discussion when it had nothing to do with it
well now that I said that I can't make it anymore.
post 15 is Haddock's response. Should not be legal
post 16 is my response to haddock's response. Also not legal.
well then. now that the issue is settled, what are my thoughts about the game? ... I don't have any. er... yeah, I don't.
Oh, but now stuff is happening. "can I counterclaim?" that's a cute question. I'm pretty sure he does have a PR.
Okay, he thought it was a joke. I see. Meh. Nothing exciting, then. Except now ADK is an IC.
NOOOO FAUST IS VOTING FOR ME!!!
:c
So much for not thinking and everything works out by itself
this response has to be a beacon of towniness.
I think I dislike the QT thing even more than initially. I like to let my silly side dictate my personality when being in QT's but still the constant thought of this actually having any sort of purpose seems to ruin the point :/
Let's not quote the rest.
god I hate this rule more with every passing day.
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M75: Cupcake
Mafia Discussion of Quick Topics
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Well if anything this makes me more okay with lynching Silverspawn.
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For the record, that was 16 minutes and 22 seconds while he was online the whole time.
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For the record, that was 16 minutes and 22 seconds while he was online the whole time.
yea, it's even worse than just being unbalanced and inherently causing rule edge cases, it's also a pain to copy all quotes over and make sure the numbering is accurate.
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not to mention that it takes all the fun out of using QTs
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it's also a pain to change all quotes over and make sure the numbering is accurate.
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unvote
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vote: Hydrad
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it's also a pain to change all quotes over and make sure the numbering is accurate.
I'm not sure what you're saying. If you think that I wrote this in 15 minutes (which is insane, but not required because like ADK said, scum!me would have prepared something), then why aren't you voting for me?
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vote: Hydrad.
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You guys are all way overblowing this QT thing.
In other news,
Vote: Faust
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Vote: Faust
but why?
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He hasn't posted a QT, so obvscum.
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Strong townread of me seems arbitrary and buddying. Town!Faust hardly ever thinks I'm town, and what have I done this game? Well, no one particularly wants to lynch me, but no one has expressed much of a non-null read on me anyway. Feels forced.
His commenting thus far has seemed more reactive and argumentative than normal. It's not very substance heavy. His fervor to lynch Silver feels a bit more extreme than it needs to be.
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it's also a pain to change all quotes over and make sure the numbering is accurate.
I'm not sure what you're saying. If you think that I wrote this in 15 minutes (which is insane, but not required because like ADK said, scum!me would have prepared something), then why aren't you voting for me?
I don't think you wrote all of it in 15 minutes, some of it can definitely be pre-written regardless of your alignment, PR and intended fake claims. I'm not voting for you because I don't have a particular reason to think you're scum, I just don't think we can really give you any town cred for that QT given how long it took you.
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You have to manually copy each post from one window and paste it into the forum message window, and surround it with quotes. And as you can see he added a tag to each quote. It takes time to do that.
Now you're just being Awaclusy for the sake of being Awaclusy.
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Not that I don't think that Silverspawn could have faked that, but I don't want to lynch Silverspawn right now. I do want to lynch Hydrad.
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Sure, but if he faked it, he probably faked it ahead of time.
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Unvote
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I too hate this QT rule. It takes away pretty much all game related discussion.
I'll try to continue my reading tonight and tomorrow.
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I too hate this QT rule. It takes away pretty much all game related discussion.
I'll try to continue my reading tonight and tomorrow.
Exactly.
One of the tried and true mafia tactics is to get people to talk about anything except stuff that actually matters. I.E. QTs.
Thus why I'm voting for Awaclus. He basically started this whole thing.
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Exactly.
One of the tried and true mafia tactics is to get people to talk about anything except stuff that actually matters. I.E. QTs.
Thus why I'm voting for Awaclus. He basically started this whole thing.
QTs are not "anything except stuff that actually matters". I'm an IC because of QTs, that's pretty relevant.
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Exactly.
One of the tried and true mafia tactics is to get people to talk about anything except stuff that actually matters. I.E. QTs.
Thus why I'm voting for Awaclus. He basically started this whole thing.
QTs are not "anything except stuff that actually matters". I'm an IC because of QTs, that's pretty relevant.
Thanks for furthering my point <3
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I'm happy to lynch Awaclus to reduce clutter.
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I'm happy to post incredibly antitown posts to produce clutter.
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Dickhead Awaclus is scum!Awaclus.
Oh, wait, it's just Awaclus.
Oh, wait, I don't care.
Vote: Awaclus
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honestly, my senses all scream vote: Ampharos because of this, but he replaced teproc, so...
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I'm happy to lynch Awaclus to reduce clutter.
Yet when I reduce clutter, I get voted for because I'm 'lurking.'
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I'm happy to lynch Awaclus to reduce clutter.
Yet when I reduce clutter, I get voted for because I'm 'lurking.'
Who voted you because you were lurking? I don't remember that.
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So looking back at the matrix, We either just gave scum 0 information, in the case we are playing the straight up and down one, or we gave them information that confirms the setup for them, in the case we are playing the straight across one.
This is worth noting. Townslip.
How is that a townslip? It's true if you look at the setup and believe that I'm telling the truth. It actually makes gkrieg scummier in my mind.
I'm stupid and can't tell the difference between a roleblocker and a rolecop.
You're absolutely right.
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I'm happy to lynch Awaclus to reduce clutter.
Yet when I reduce clutter, I get voted for because I'm 'lurking.'
Who voted you because you were lurking? I don't remember that.
That was part of SS's bad case against me.
-
ss's bad case
that's a paradox.
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Well knowing it is plurality lynch makes me feel better about the day
-
Well knowing it is plurality lynch makes me feel better about the day
oh yeah. Look what reading the rules does. Isn't that nice.
-
So this is what I am tracking.
2.7 (1): EgorK
Awaclus (2): Ampharos, WW
Ampharos (1): Lekkit.
RR (2): SS, Awaclus
Hydrad (4): ADK, 2.7, gkrieg, chairs
silverspawn (2): faust, RR.
WW (1): Hydrad
Anyone is an option.
I will go back over Awaclus, RR, and SS as they are the other 'leading' lynch candidates
-
Has Hydrad said anything regarding everyone wanting to lynch him?
-
I think not.
-
I just woke up again!
I guess I have 2 pages or so to catch up on. one moment!
-
oh basically all I missed seems to be QT discussions. Well hopefully its over with for now.
-
Anyways we have a day till lynch and i'm the leading wagon... That doesn't sound to good.
So I think ss is town with his QT thing. Awaclus or RR it seems? gah. I'm fine with lynching either honestly.
Vote: RR
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Huh? How does that QT thing influence anything?
-
I thought the QT thing made ss look townier. And if he is scum, this will further the point that QTs shouldn't be viewed as an alignment tell and the whole conversation will be over.
Hydrad's vote looks scummy here.
-
oh basically all I missed seems to be QT discussions. Well hopefully its over with for now.
That reminds me - you could post your QT!
-
finished rereading silverspawn. I think he is being slightly annoying with the whole qt thing, but overall.....town.
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I could go into more detail, but with his 100+ posts.....I will let it slide for the moment. Also, the whole qt thing making him more townie....not buying it.
I think he is town regardless of the whole qt thing
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oh basically all I missed seems to be QT discussions. Well hopefully its over with for now.
That reminds me - you could post your QT!
well I could. but unfortuantly if you look through my other games you will see I usually don't post anything in my QT. so its just a conformation right now.
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I thought the QT thing made ss look townier. And if he is scum, this will further the point that QTs shouldn't be viewed as an alignment tell and the whole conversation will be over.
Hydrad's vote looks scummy here.
well today I'm going to be just trying to stay alive at this point it seems. so I'm basically going to jump on anyone.
but it just so happens that both RR and awaclus are people i'm fine with lynching anyways!
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Vote: Hydrad
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Ok, I think RR is town. His stance on the fruit vendor is just something that I do not see scum doing at all. I mean, way after ADK was basically confirmed by lack of a counter, RR was still insisting that ADK's claim was fishy. I don't think scum does that.
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L-2 right? Come on people, this is the lynch to be on!
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I don't get why so many people seem to think silver is town. Eh well. Hydrad is an okay lynch too. I mean, I will probably still push silver tomorrow if I'm alive. I think scum!Hydrad makes it a bit more likely I will and town!Hydrad a bit less.
Oh and WW is voting for me. Well someone has to maintain the balance. Granted, the last game I townread you I was your traitorous partner. But hey, that means we played together. Thus, we are also playing together now. The logic is infallible.
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Ok, I think RR is town. His stance on the fruit vendor is just something that I do not see scum doing at all. I mean, way after ADK was basically confirmed by lack of a counter, RR was still insisting that ADK's claim was fishy. I don't think scum does that.
This is a good post.
-
Well uh. Let's make the stuff happen as long as I am actually around to react to it.
Vote: Hydrad L-1
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Don't be an idiot and state intent to hammer before hammering, please. Otherwise I will just vote for you for the rest of the game, as long as you are still alive.
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This is where I claim that I'm a fruit vendor and ADK is scum right?
huehuehuehue
No but I'm guessing I should claim now right?
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This is where I claim that I'm a fruit vendor and ADK is scum right?
huehuehuehue
No but I'm guessing I should claim now right?
Do what you think is best with your role. You do not need our advice; you know your role and know whether to claim or not.
-
Actually forget what I just said. You need to claim.
-
Well I don't really see myself living for another day otherwise. So I guess I will claim.
I'm the JK. Sorry guys. I played this pretty badly it looks like.
-
Unvote
No derphammers.
-
Can anyone counterclaim anything?
-
Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
-
Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
Unvote
We absolutely want the counterclaim if there is one. No PR is as good as catching scum.
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Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
Unvote
We absolutely want the counterclaim if there is one. No PR is as good as catching scum.
No, I mean would we rather counterclaim or lynch Hydrad without a counterclaim?
-
hmmmmm
unvote
I guess scum!hydrad and PR!hydrad look similar to me
-
Also: I don't lynch claimed PRs D1. I just don't do that.
-
Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
Unvote
We absolutely want the counterclaim if there is one. No PR is as good as catching scum.
No, I mean would we rather counterclaim or lynch Hydrad without a counterclaim?
You are all about disbelieving claims this game, aren't you? I'm okay with waiting for a counterclaim, lynching our JK is worse than having our JK night killed in order to catch scum.
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Town Even-Night Tracker
Vanilla Townie
Mafia Rolecop
Town Jailkeeper
Town Fruit Vendor
Mafia 2-Shot Strongman
So with that claim this is what we have. So scum has a role-cop and 2 shot strongman. We have a even-night tracker.
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Not lynching:
ADK, Hydrad, 2.7
Don't really want to lynch:
Ampharos, silverspawn, gkrieg
Wouldn't mind lynching:
faust, EgorK
They are playing, right?
chairs, Lekkit
Totally OK with lynching:
WW, Awaclus
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I'm the real jk. I'm eating at my grandmas so I was just checking in and saw this
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Sweet, vote: Hydrad, L-whatever
-
ok then.
vote: hydrad
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Not lynching:
ADK, Hydrad, 2.7
Don't really want to lynch:
Ampharos, silverspawn, gkrieg
Wouldn't mind lynching:
faust, EgorK
They are playing, right?
chairs, Lekkit
Totally OK with lynching:
WW, Awaclus
Forgetting something?
Vote: Hydrad
Bye bye!
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oh yeah, RR. "don't really want to lynch"
Not quite the all out "won't lynch" because, you know, its RR ;)
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I'm the real jk. I'm eating at my grandmas so I was just checking in and saw this
huh. well I guess if you want to trade 1 for 1 thats ok.
Vote: gkrieg
although I realize I'm getting lynched today.
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I'm the real jk. I'm eating at my grandmas so I was just checking in and saw this
huh. well I guess if you want to trade 1 for 1 thats ok.
Vote: gkrieg
although I realize I'm getting lynched today.
You're already lynched.
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I'm the real jk. I'm eating at my grandmas so I was just checking in and saw this
huh. well I guess if you want to trade 1 for 1 thats ok.
Vote: gkrieg
although I realize I'm getting lynched today.
You're already lynched.
oh lol.
well ya i'm still the JK. good luck guys!
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I'm the real jk. I'm eating at my grandmas so I was just checking in and saw this
huh. well I guess if you want to trade 1 for 1 thats ok.
Vote: gkrieg
although I realize I'm getting lynched today.
You're already lynched.
oh lol.
well ya i'm still the JK. good luck guys!
[] Not doubtful
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Also he's not lynched yet, that's l-1. He should still be lynched though.
-
He also knew he wasn't so no fakehammer bullshit.
-
I'm okay with hammering. Any reason not to?
-
I'm okay with hammering. Any reason not to?
because I would die...
-
I'm okay with hammering. Any reason not to?
No. Do it!
-
Just end the day already please.
-
Vote: Hydrad
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So Hydrad, were you really the JK?
-
So Hydrad, were you really the JK?
No :(
you got me
-
But I was pretty sure I was dead anyways.
-
But I was pretty sure I was dead anyways.
Sorry I guess. But yay! Lynching scum on D1 is a huge deal.
-
If only I hadn't already been on the wagon, I could've hammered you and maybe stayed hidden
-
If only I hadn't already been on the wagon, I could've hammered you and maybe stayed hidden
huehuehue
-
If only I hadn't already been on the wagon, I could've hammered you and maybe stayed hidden
That's why you always gotta hold back for the hammer.
-
I'm excited for the lynch flavor.
-
I guess I'll have to fill my QT now.
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Final Day 1 Vote Count
Do you think because you are virtuous, that there shall be no more cakes and ale?
2.7 (1): EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (1): Lekkit
RR (2): SS, Awaclus
Hydrad (7): gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it took 7 to lynch.
-
Note: it's still twilight.
-
Nicely done. This should be good.
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If only I hadn't already been on the wagon, I could've hammered you and maybe stayed hidden
Eh, hammering just outs you as JK to the mafia. Also people were pretty quick to unvote Hydrad.
-
Oh yeah, that was super good.
-
Well, let's look at the wagon. I think thewagon at the point Hydrad claims is more informative than the post-counterclaim wagon. It is:
ADK, 2.7, gkrieg, chairs, RR, faust
So two conf!town people, me, RR (who is tentatively towny due to being presented as an alternative to Hydrad), chairs (duh), e (still probably the most scummy on here). But I think tomorrow's lynch should be off-wagon.
silver looks bad, I already said this. Egor needs to be present. His non-presentness today is a bit scummy, as we are more likely to successfully lynch scum if one scum does not participate in the discussion.
-
Roadrunner
Votes for faust after he propose the claiming idea.
Asks if he can counterclaim ADK. Says it's because he believes ADK is joking.
Says the faust vote was RVS and that he likes the vote where it is.
Implies that he's not lurking.
Says that a policy lynch of Awaclus is bad, because he's just being himself.
What?? How am I being 'ultra stubborn?' And how have I been anti-town?
I guess it's true he hasn't been stubborn, but not really adding anything of value is not really pro-town.
This doesn't seem like RR from the last game to me. It's weird that he isn't really present
I didn't lurk in X-Shot or Harry Potter.
Implies that he is lurking now.
Votes for silverspawn, since silverspawn is voting for him.
Doesn't trust ADK's claim.
Wants to lynch e if Hydrad is town.
Says he's too scummy to be scum.
Asks me to read a game where he was town to be able to meta-judge him. I'm not a fan of meta arguments like that. And I also don't really have the time to read a whole game to come to the conclusion that not helping town is not really good for town.
Goes after Ampharos for making short, jokey memey posts.
Votes for Ampharos.
Votes for silverspawn due to QT issues.
Implies that we don't think he's useful (as far as I'm concerned, he hasn't really been).
Unvotes silverspawn.
Votes for Hydrad.
Unvotes after Hydrad's claim.
Votes Hydrad again.
Tries trick Hydrad into thinking he's allready lynched.
Celebrates the actual lynch.
My sentence: Actilurked through the whole day. Avoided the Hydrad lynch until very late in the day. Looks like scum to me. Would definately lynch.
-
Thread Locked! (Long twilight, sorry.)
Flip coming.
-
Day 1 End
Final Vote Count:
2.7 (1): EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (1): Lekkit
RR (2): SS, Awaclus
Hydrad (7): gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it took 7 to lynch.
The debate raged for several hours - never before have such deep branches of philosophy, statistics and game theory been so explored by confectionery. At times so much was going on that it was hard for Matt and Rick to focus - at one point Matt swore he saw two of the cakes run out the door, only to be replaced by two similar-looking ones. Rick told him he was imagining things.
Gradually, though, a consensus was reached. One of the cakes had been acting oddly; long stretches of silence interspersed with bouts of almost hyperactive cheeriness. The others thought this would not do, and began to turn against him. As the mob formed, the lone teacake began to panic.
"Eat me quick," it squeaked to the young men, "I have special powers!"
This caused a brief pause and some consternation, before a bold bit of bakery stepped forth:
"No you don't! What nonsense!"
With that, he unceremoniously shoved the desperate cake off the edge of the table.
SPLAT!
Sickly green ooze emanated from the remains. Matt, always the bold one, tentatively tested it with his pinky finger - and immediately ran to the bathroom, retching. Disgusting! Rick followed to see if he could help, conscientiously turning the lights off as he did so.
Hydrad has been lynched! He was an Avocado Teacake (Mafia Goon).
Night 1 begins now and will last 48 hours. Night actions due in 36 hours.
-
FYI: Thanks to trouble with the QT site, we may well have to extend night by some amount of time. Watch this space.
-
Night action deadline in ~2 hours.
-
Sorry for the delay. Everything's good to go, day will start as soon as I get a few minutes.
-
Day 2 Start
After a few minutes in the bathroom (avocado - bleh!), Matt recovered his composure and was ready to return to the bakery battle. Still slightly jelly-legged, he allowed Rick to help him back into the room. As the lights came back on, they were met by an awful scene - in the absence of their supervising humans, some of the cakes must have turned violent!
A brown, sticky substance coated half the floor, dotted with what looked like a heavy sponge. One of the cakes had been bodily torn apart and scattered across the room! The thick treacle stuck like glue to everything; Matt and Rick tiptoed carefully around it, eyeing the cakes with a newfound respect. They resumed their seats, slightly further away from the table this time, and watched as the various baked goods started throwing accusations left, right and centre, not knowing quite who was the culprit of the awful murder.
gkrieg13 died during the night. He was a Sticky Toffee Drop (Town Jailkeeper).
-
Vote Count 2.0
Not Voting (11): 2.7, ADK, Ampharos, Awaclus, chairs, EgorK, faust, Lekkit, RR, SS, WW
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day 2 begins now and will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
Thread unlocked!
-
Well, that's not a surprise. In other news. I have foolproof evidence that WW is scum:
I'll have an avacado.
Hydrad has been lynched! He was an Avocado Teacake (Mafia Goon).
-
Ha, it's a fair cop.
-
But let's lynch silver first.
Vote: silverspawn
-
So.
I ended up not filling my QT with reread posts. I'll hopefully have some time to continue with that tomorrow.
-
Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
Unvote
We absolutely want the counterclaim if there is one. No PR is as good as catching scum.
No, I mean would we rather counterclaim or lynch Hydrad without a counterclaim?
This is highly suspicious.
-
But sure, let's do Faust's thing.
Vote: Silverspawn
-
Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
Unvote
We absolutely want the counterclaim if there is one. No PR is as good as catching scum.
No, I mean would we rather counterclaim or lynch Hydrad without a counterclaim?
This is highly suspicious.
It is certainly weird, and I would think it suspicious had Hydrad flipped town. But as it is, I don't see why scum posts that.
-
Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
Unvote
We absolutely want the counterclaim if there is one. No PR is as good as catching scum.
No, I mean would we rather counterclaim or lynch Hydrad without a counterclaim?
This is highly suspicious.
It is certainly weird, and I would think it suspicious had Hydrad flipped town. But as it is, I don't see why scum posts that.
I don't see why town posts that. It sounds like he knows there is a counterclaim.
-
I'm with WW on this one.
-
I think it's possible for scum to say that. It's certainly not very good, though. But imagine this: You know Hydrad is lying. You know he'll get lynched after a counterclaim that you know will end up happening. You try to get town points from trying to make the PR stay hidden.
PPE: Yeah...
-
Actually. Vote: Roadrunner7671
-
I think it's possible for scum to say that. It's certainly not very good, though. But imagine this: You know Hydrad is lying. You know he'll get lynched after a counterclaim that you know will end up happening. You try to get town points from trying to make the PR stay hidden.
PPE: Yeah...
Yeah, this was my thought.
-
The Roadrunner point is a very good one. Vote: RR
-
yay I'm alive
now vote: faust
this is completely and uttrerly ridiculous and I refuse to believe that it comes from town!faust.
I was advocating a hydrad lynch THE ENTIRE DAY. The only reason I was not voting for him is because I liked the RR lynch a bit more. I would have lynched him without hesitation had you not done it before I came back.
Now, while I was pursuing the lynch of SCUM the entire time, FAUST was pursuing a MISYLNCH the entire time - me.
It is absolutely out of character for faust to ignore all that and simply call my positino bad because I wasn't on the final wagon. town!faust doesn't do that.
-
what kind of game is this were a person who was pursuing a mislynch is telling town that a person who was advocating one of the two scum lynches is looking bad? ridiculous.
-
Hydrad
Uh Hydrad. Dunno. Not townie the way he is sometimes. But he can also be town and not be like that. He's voting for Awaclus I see. Meh. Could lynch.
-
Wait I thought you weren't pushing Hydrad.
-
yeah, Hydrad or RR are the to-go lynches today. e is towny for this case.
Vote: silverspawn
Oh, I'm doing that already? Dang.
-
I'll have to reread.
-
well, Hydrad is good. Even though the lack of motivation for an RR lynch makes me want to do him more
still vote: Hydrad
I think Hydrad is like hillary here. Not great, but popular, and probably the second best option.
-
upon rereading a bit I'll admit that I didn't push Hydrad consistently, but that was only because I was pushing RR over him. At no point did I suggest that I preferred anyone other than RR over Hydrad. And then not pushing him - what kind of partner play is that?
-
Let's not lynch RR today.
-
Some of faust's posts mid-early about hydrad yesterday does have me agreeing with silverspawn some.
But.....
I would be very suspicious of faust had he unvoted and been off wagon before the fake claim. As it is, sticking to hydrad is pretty strong town!faust evidence. Votes don't lie, and I am probably going to look much more off-wagon today (pre fake claim) than on wagon
-
I think I come off as towny because of the Hydrad thing, honestly.
Lekkit and SS and Awaclus just have it out for me.
-
I think I come off as towny because of the Hydrad thing, honestly.
Lekkit and SS and Awaclus just have it out for me.
Wow. A read. Oh, wait, you had a read on yourself...
-
yay I'm alive
now vote: faust
this is completely and uttrerly ridiculous and I refuse to believe that it comes from town!faust.
I was advocating a hydrad lynch THE ENTIRE DAY. The only reason I was not voting for him is because I liked the RR lynch a bit more. I would have lynched him without hesitation had you not done it before I came back.
Now, while I was pursuing the lynch of SCUM the entire time, FAUST was pursuing a MISYLNCH the entire time - me.
It is absolutely out of character for faust to ignore all that and simply call my positino bad because I wasn't on the final wagon. town!faust doesn't do that.
Haha. You were not pushing a Hydrad lynch. You were hedging on Hydrad while pushing an RR lynch. If you look for a player who pushed Hydrad hard, that would be e.
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Here is silverspawn's vote history:
1 Feb Awaclus
2 Feb ADK
2 Feb Hydrad
These were all mostly RVS.
2 Feb RR
3 Feb Hydrad
4 Feb yuma
4 Feb RR
5 Feb gkrieg
5 Feb RR
7 Feb Hydrad
8 Feb RR
9 Feb day ends
This is not "pushing Hydrad all day".
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Was anybody defensive of Hydrad early?
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Hydrad (7): gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
Aside from ww, I don't want to lynch anyone on this list. WW just cast the final vote when it was already decided so he doesn't get town points for that.
Chairs' vote for hydrad helped pick the wagon up at a time where it was still kind of just me hanging out with my fun little case in the midst of all that weird qt talk. ADK is fruit vendor+on wagon almost as long as I was, RR I explained my town read yesterday plus being on wagon. Faust was the one who put hydrad at L-1, and I don't know. I really don't think faust is the guy who puts his partner at L-1 on D1.
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So this is my lynch pool for today
Ampharos, Awaclus, EgorK, Lekkit, SS, WW
I will try to get a reread of these people done with respect to the flip while I am hanging out at the airport/on the plane
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Egor, are you around? It would be very important for you to start commenting on stuff.
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I recieved an avocado last night.
Fruit Vendor=Confirmed.
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Like I said
upon rereading a bit I'll admit that I didn't push Hydrad consistently, but that was only because I was pushing RR over him. At no point did I suggest that I preferred anyone other than RR over Hydrad. And then not pushing him - what kind of partner play is that?
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Hi everyone!
I was utterly shocked to find Hydrad being scum. Hydrad was just his usual self, just like in X-Shots.
Well, at least this gives something to reread - what Hydrad said and what people said about Hydrad. Will do it shortly
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Vote Count 2.1
I always cook with wine. Sometimes I even put some in the food.
RR (2): Lekkit, Awaclus
SS (2): faust, WW
faust(1): SS
Not Voting (6): 2.7, ADK, Ampharos, chairs, EgorK, RR
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
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I don't think Silver is scum
Unvote
Let's do
Vote: Roadrunner
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L-3. Should I claim?
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Nobody should claim today.
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Except scum. Go ahead if you like.
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Hi I'm here, I probably won't be useful until this weekend though, I'll try to some big reread thing then. I'm a little suspicious of RR and WW obviously doesn't get townpoints for hammering but I'm more interesting in examining people who were off-wagon, especially Amph but that's a lingering gut thing.
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Hi I'm here, I probably won't be useful until this weekend though, I'll try to some big reread thing then. I'm a little suspicious of Faust and WW obviously doesn't get townpoints for hammering but I'm more interesting in examining people who were off-wagon, especially Amph but that's a lingering gut thing.
Thanks for the fruit basket and thanks for agreeing with my about Amph. I edited your post a tad so that I can say I fully agree with it.
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What, RR is suspicious of of, when I'm the only one not yelling "lynch RR"? That is... out of character.
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I'm not yelling lynch RR anymore. I'm yelling lynch faust.
who, by the way, is still alive. living faust = scum faust.
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What, RR is suspicious of of, when I'm the only one not yelling "lynch RR"? That is... out of character.
I'm agreeing with SS, in case you can't tell. The post right above mine is something decent.
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I'm not yelling lynch RR anymore. I'm yelling lynch faust.
who, by the way, is still alive. living faust = scum faust.
yeah, you seem to have a lot of ideas on who scum should have killed, when they had a claimed JK to kill....
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Rereading for Hydrad interactions.
Well Hydrad doesn't show up for quite some time. silverspawn randomly votes for him. Teproc (Amph) votes for Hydrad. silver questions that vote. Hydrad votes for Awaclus, which apparently makes silver vote for Hydrad again. ADK joins in. Egor asks for a case on Hydrad. Teproc (Amph) provides a mini-case, and pushes that a bit more. silver switches votes to yuma. Hydrad thinks yuma (e) is town. Hydrad implies that silver and WW are scummy because they are inactive. Teproc (Amph) argues for Hydrad some more. WW says Hydrad seems like "normal Hydrad". e has a null read on Hydrad. silver argues for "Hydrad or RR". Hydrad does not want to take a stance on RR. e votes for Hydrad. Later he writes up some sort of case. Hydrad votes for WW. silver puts Hydrad to L-3. chairs asks "why Hydrad?" Late on, e revotes Hydrad and silver asks "why Hydrad?" Now chairs votes Hydrad - unexplained. RR puts Hydrad to L-2. After the claim, e instantly goes to trusting Hydrad.
Okay, so takeaways:
- Teproc and e are the people who pushed for Hydrad the most. They are towny, thus Ampharos is also towny, even though he did not push for the lynch. e's reaction to the claim does not seem like scum reacting. Also Hydrad reads yuma as town early on, which makes me think yuma (=e) is town also.
- chairs is arguably the scummiest on-wagon player, going from "why Hydrad?" to voting Hydrad without any explanation.
- the only thing Egor has to say about Hydrad is pretty scummy
- I find it hard to evaluate RR/Hydrad
- WW/Hydrad interaction seems reasonable for partners
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What, RR is suspicious of of, when I'm the only one not yelling "lynch RR"? That is... out of character.
I'm agreeing with SS, in case you can't tell. The post right above mine is something decent.
You mean instead of OMGUSing someone yourself, you are going to sheep some other player's OMGUS? Seems legit.
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I realize Awaclus has no interaction whatsoever with Hydrad except one RVS vote. Interesting. I think scum!Awaclus is more likely to feel compelled to take some kind of stance in the matter.
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I'm glad you brought up the Chairs thing faust, it reminded me that something about him tickled me the wrong way.
Me not chasing Hydrad is largely from my inability to read him whatsoever. I have the same problem with SS. And kind of RR. I usually just let other people take them out.
Faust is town though. So is Lekkit. I think.
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I'm not yelling lynch RR anymore. I'm yelling lynch faust.
who, by the way, is still alive. living faust = scum faust.
What, on day two? When we had a claimed PR (who scum fakeclaimed in order to out) and an effective IC? Calm down.
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... I think I missed something
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I scrolled forward as the lynch happened to see if I was the one being lynched and never went back to actually read everything. apologies, I'll do it now.
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Huh?
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This interaction is weird to me:
But seriously, why Hydrad?
a wise man once said day 1 is about figuring out who is town, not scum.
hydrad doesn't seem to be town, so . . .
And not too much later:
vote: hydrad
err what? why hydrad?
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I've basically been up for 30 hours but it's not unusual for me to change my mind about someone and not post reads, especially D1 which is my least favorite of all Days.
More to come when the world isn't spinning faster than my avatar.
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Reread. I like egork or WW right now.
Vote: EgorK
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It was an odd thing for e to post, because he had expressed suspicion at all. That doesn't mean I didn't like it, although I guess I see why it might look like that.
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Okay. I see.
Mh. I don't like RR anymore as a lynch. I think faust or anyone off wagon is prob okay.
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#152 Hydrad post with no content
#155 silver votes Hydrad to get off ADK after I assume he soft counterclaims
#156 silver elaborates that Hydrad is just someone who is not yuma (e), Awaclus, ADK, faust or Teproc (Amph) There is unvote after all. Why silver feels so compelled to vote right away?
Some discussion between silver and Teproc (Amph)
#163 Teproc (Amph) agrees with silver and votes Hydrad
#165 Silver question Teproc (Amph) vote because Hydrad only made one post
#198-200 Hydrad comments that yuma(e)/faust/Teproc(Amph) would be scary scum team, thinks that IC is awesome and votes Awaclus
#203-204 Silver revotes Hydrad, ADK follows suit
#205 I ask for a case on Hydrad
#206 RR says there is none
#207 Teproc(Amph) says everyone else is towny (POE at this stage? Nice) and contends that Hydrad's Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential
#208 RR make ridicule of this case
#209 Teproc(Amph) says that although case on Hydrad is not great, it is best town have atm
#211 ADK says that RR/Hydrad are scumbuddies
#213-214 yuma(e) and Teproc(Amph) bashing Awaclus in reference to Hydrad vote
#215 Hydrad colors RR "defense" of him as compelling (WTF?)
#216 ADK would vote twice for Hydrad if possible
#218 RR thinks ADK/RR as scumbuddies is nice meme
#224 ADK thinks that nothing happening points to Hydrad/RR
#228 Teproc(Amph) thinks that someone for whom lurking is unusual may be scum. but still likes his vote on Hydrad
#230 Silver switches to yuma(e)
#240-241 Hydrad provides lurker list, also gives town read to yuma(e)
#250-251, 253 Hydrad plays his "let's be friends everyone" card, thinks that ss and WW lurking is unusual, but not so unusual for ss lately, do not think yuma(e), Teproc (Amph) and faust interaction is indicative of anyone's alignment
#257 Hydrad has no scum reads, has some town though
Let's stop here for a moment, I need to do lunch
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Checking in. I see no one has anything to say? The one thing about hydrad is when I reread he really is not brought up much or has too many interactions. Which is unfortunate to some extent when looking back at him.
I did find egork scummy for the same stuff that made me want to open voting with him (after subbing in). And he hasn't done anything to change that
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I did find egork scummy for the same stuff that made me want to open voting with him (after subbing in). And he hasn't done anything to change that
Could you maybe eh spell this "stuff" out for us? Because I looked at your opening post and there you give no reason:
Let's start with vote: EgorK
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My lynch priorities right now are something like
silver > Egor > RR > chairs = WW
I don't want to lynch anyone else I think.
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I think I'm town on Faust.
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/tag
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I could go for EgorK or silver I guess. What's the vote count?
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Vote Count 2.2
Avoid fruits and nuts. You are what you eat.
RR (3): Lekkit, Awaclus, WW
SS (1): faust
faust (1): SS
EgorK (1): 2.7
Not Voting (5): ADK, Ampharos, chairs, EgorK, RR
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
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#258 Teproc(Amph) does big analysis post and concludes that with let's lunch Hydrad
#259 Teproc(Amph) thinks that Hydrad not getting any reads out of yuma(e)/faust/Teproc interaction is scummy
#260 Hydrad asks what Teproc get out of that
#266 RR replies to ADK question of who's scum with RR/Hydrad of course
#267 WW says Hydrad is normal Hydrad
#297 WW finds Teproc towny for moving to Hydrad
#326 gkrieg read list. Hydrad is null
#349 silver: Hydrad or RR
#350 gkrieg questions silver post
#352 silver: Hydrad is not present Why single out Hydrad?
#358 ADK: prefers gkrieg, Hydrad or RR
#359-360 Hydrad welcomes replacements. Put RR and Awaclus in null category
#361-362 Hydrad-gkrieg interaction which no longer of interest
#365 silver contemplates to give Hydrad D1 pass for being funny, decides against that
#418 e votes Hydrad
#428 e: Hydrad scum this game, I'll figure out later why
#468 ADK: lynch pool Hydrad, RR, gkrieg
#500 e pushes Hydrad again
One more break
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first you say I didn't push Hydrad, and now I pushed him too much?
I didn't have any particular reason to single out Hydrad. I think he was the least present.
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Vote Count 2.2
Avoid fruits and nuts. You are what you eat.
RR (3): Lekkit, Awaclus, WW
SS (1): faust
faust (1): SS
EgorK (1): 2.7
Not Voting (5): ADK, Ampharos, chairs, EgorK, RR
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
Well I'm not going to go for EgorK or silver in that case.
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Vote Count 2.2
Avoid fruits and nuts. You are what you eat.
RR (3): Lekkit, Awaclus, WW
SS (1): faust
faust (1): SS
EgorK (1): 2.7
Not Voting (5): ADK, Ampharos, chairs, EgorK, RR
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
Well I'm not going to go for EgorK or silver in that case.
I don't get it.
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Vote Count 2.2
Avoid fruits and nuts. You are what you eat.
RR (3): Lekkit, Awaclus, WW
SS (1): faust
faust (1): SS
EgorK (1): 2.7
Not Voting (5): ADK, Ampharos, chairs, EgorK, RR
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
Well I'm not going to go for EgorK or silver in that case.
I don't get it.
My favorite lynch is already the biggest wagon, so there's no need to move.
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I'm going to be pretty busy this weekend. Will be back in full force on monday.
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Boring day, let's do some stuff.
Vote: Chairs
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Boring day, let's do some stuff.
Vote: Chairs
Well, that's not a lot of stuff you've been doing there. How about you do some more stuff?
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It feels strange that I have to do this, but request prod on RR.
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biep. bieppppp
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biep. bieppppp
What do you make of RR lurking? He has certainly posted on the forums, it seems very out of character.
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good question. It could be him thinking "I always ride myself into trouble when I post, I'll just sit it out". Although I think, in the past, when he posted a lot upon receiving pressure, it often gave him town points.
It could also be a brief disinterest for mafia that's not related to this game. That's the boring explanation, but probably more likely.
If it's the former, I'd say it's more likely coming from town!RR
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It's not a brief disinterest, I've actually been designing a setup and reading articles on MafiaScum.
But I have nothing to say to any of you. I've made peace with the fact that I cannot dig myself out of any holes that I get pushed into.
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It's not a brief disinterest, I've actually been designing a setup and reading articles on MafiaScum.
But I have nothing to say to any of you. I've made peace with the fact that I cannot dig myself out of any holes that I get pushed into.
So you've decided to be a bad mafia player?
Vote: Roadrunner
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It's not a brief disinterest, I've actually been designing a setup and reading articles on MafiaScum.
But I have nothing to say to any of you. I've made peace with the fact that I cannot dig myself out of any holes that I get pushed into.
So you've decided to be a bad mafia player?
Vote: Roadrunner
I'm already a bad Mafia player. But now I'm at L-2. So I'm about to be a dead bad Mafia player.
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This is very un-Roadrunner of me, but I don't feel compelled to claim. Two more people need to think I'm Mafia-aligned before I get lynched, and I don't think that'll happen.
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Sorry I'm not as involved as an IC should be but could we wait on lynching RR? This is probably my last day alive and I want to do a reread before I die.
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yeah, I don't like RR nearly as much anymore as I did yesterday.
I like faust. We could do faust!
Or, again, someone off wagon.
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yeah, I don't like RR nearly as much anymore as I did yesterday.
I like faust. We could do faust!
Or, again, someone off wagon.
Or you.
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you do realize that tunneling someone who could vote for you out of self-preservation is tactically not smart when you're at L-2?
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you do realize that tunneling someone who could vote for you out of self-preservation is tactically not smart when you're at L-2?
Have I ever been tactically smart?
Please note that I didn't vote for you, and also note that self-preservation votes are scummy. You're not a Survivor, it might be better for a VT to die for an Inventor and such.
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also note that self-preservation votes are scummy
that's not true, and I know that you aren't voting for me. It was still just such an ugggg comment in a lot of ways. Don't do that!
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It's not a brief disinterest, I've actually been designing a setup and reading articles on MafiaScum.
But I have nothing to say to any of you. I've made peace with the fact that I cannot dig myself out of any holes that I get pushed into.
So you've decided to be a bad mafia player?
Vote: Roadrunner
I'm already a bad Mafia player. But now I'm at L-2. So I'm about to be a dead bad Mafia player.
You know, you could give reads or your thoughts on the game or do wagon analysis or really do anything but whine about how bad a player you are.
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vote: rr
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vote: rr
Doesn't everyone love a good unannounced L-1?
No.
Vote: chairs
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The RR wagon has no towny people on it and some scummy ones (WW, chairs). It seems likely that scum hides on the wagon.
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The RR wagon has no towny people on it and some scummy ones (WW, chairs). It seems likely that scum hides on the wagon.
If someone else had said that, then I'd agree.
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It feels like Faust was just waiting for someone to join the wagon for him to call it scummy.
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Wow yeah vote: chairs that is for sure better than RR.
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Vote Count 2.3
A party without cake is just a meeting.
RR (4): Lekkit, Awaclus, WW, chairs
faust (1): SS
EgorK (1): 2.7
chairs (3): Ampharos, faust, ADK
Not Voting (2): EgorK, RR
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
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But what's the reason to do this for chairs as scum? To induce derphammer?
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But what's the reason to do this for chairs as scum? To induce derphammer?
Yes. Well, there is certainly more of a reason of scum!chairs to do this than there is for town!chairs.
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But what's the reason to do this for chairs as scum? To induce derphammer?
It's a scummy vote and he's lurky and that's good enough for me
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It feels like Faust was just waiting for someone to join the wagon for him to call it scummy.
Who are your town reads?
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silver: Do you even have a reason to find me scummy besides OMGUS? Like, have you checked my Hydrad interaction and found it scummy? Or any other things from D1 that make you think I'm scum?
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silver: Do you even have a reason to find me scummy besides OMGUS? Like, have you checked my Hydrad interaction and found it scummy? Or any other things from D1 that make you think I'm scum?
Every reason I have to suspect you is not OMGUS. OMGUS means suspecting you because you suspected me. You did that the entire first day and I didn't suspect you. The reason why I do now is because you're pretending as if the flip makes me scummy, when it should make me towny. That's the reason.
Aside from that? well maybe the fact that you've never really pushed someone else as far as I remember.
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But what's the reason to do this for chairs as scum? To induce derphammer?
Yes. Well, there is certainly more of a reason of scum!chairs to do this than there is for town!chairs.
I can't just want to lynch RR?
Jesus, I just wanted to get my vote in and get back to valentine's day.
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OMGUS means suspecting you because you suspected me.
The reason why I do now is because you're pretending as if the flip makes me scummy
::)
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But what's the reason to do this for chairs as scum? To induce derphammer?
Yes. Well, there is certainly more of a reason of scum!chairs to do this than there is for town!chairs.
I can't just want to lynch RR?
Jesus, I just wanted to get my vote in and get back to valentine's day.
Well, you can, but then you would announce an L-1 vote (if you're town).
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Oh, and by the way:
You did that the entire first day and I didn't suspect you.
faust's tunelling of me is scummy, but not overly so. I think it makes him a null read again, maybe slightly scummy, but not enough to lynch him.
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That just seems disingenious. Yes I suspected you a little because you suspected me - and, and this is something I can only say now as your game is over - because I knew you modded that game. I was so much less active there than I was in this game. You know I prefer being town. so why do you think that was? I think that's a pretty good reason to suspect that you aren't being honest, i.e. aren't town.
so that wasn't OMGUS, and even if it was, the reason after day 1 isn't OMGUS.
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Is there a case against me?
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Is there a case against me?
Yes.
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Is there a case against me?
Yes.
What is it today?
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Is there a case against me?
Yes.
What is it today?
It's that you're scum.
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Is there a case against me?
Yes.
What is it today?
It's that you're scum.
So I'm at L-2 with no case? Awesome.
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And I'm itching to vote RR again.
Coud you do anything but talk about yourself? Please.
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And I'm itching to vote RR again.
Coud you do anything but talk about yourself? Please.
I can try.
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Alrighty, I think I have time to make a post with some content that everyone can discuss. Maybe I can have like a reads list then a rant? That seems okay.
For reference, let's get a list of all the pastries in this game.
Awaclus
Faust
Silverspawn
2.7
Roadrunner7671
A Drowned Kernal
Lekkit
Witherweaver
Ampharos
chairs
EgorK
Now let's make a list of people on wagon:
Lekkit
Awaclus
Witherweaver
Chairs (counting him because he wants to see me lynched but doesn't want an unannounced L-1)
Faust (counting him because if I get lynched today, I see Faust on my wagon without a doubt)
You guys have to understand that from my eyes I'm an IC and from scums' eyes I'm an IC. I think at least one scum is on my wagon, maybe two. In order to catch them, we need to split the people on my wagon into two groups: people who genuinely think I'm scum and people who are scum and want to see me get lynched so that they're one step closer to victory.
I'm going to take a bold step and call Awaclus town. I'm going to take a second bold step and say that there is one scum on my wagon right here, right now. So we can easily break the town into two lists.
Lynch candidates:
Lekkit
Chairs
Faust
Witherweaver
Not lynch candidates:
Everyone else
This is a decent list. There is one scum in the four people that I just named. That's a guarantee. But I think we can do better than one in four. So let's try to narrow this down even further.
Why are these four scummy, besides the fact that there are on my wagon?
Chairs- This is an easy one. He put me at an unannounced L-1. Not trying to prevent derp/quickhammers is scummy and anti-town.
Faust- He's supposed to be really deductive, but he seems tunnely and off somehow. SS has made a case, it's pretty decent.
Well, let's look at the wagon. I think thewagon at the point Hydrad claims is more informative than the post-counterclaim wagon. It is:
ADK, 2.7, gkrieg, chairs, RR, faust
So two conf!town people, me, RR (who is tentatively towny due to being presented as an alternative to Hydrad), chairs (duh), e (still probably the most scummy on here). But I think tomorrow's lynch should be off-wagon.
silver looks bad, I already said this. Egor needs to be present. His non-presentness today is a bit scummy, as we are more likely to successfully lynch scum if one scum does not participate in the discussion.
This is interesting to me. I was confirmed town. What happened to that, Faust?
Witherweaver- He hasn't been very active, has he? But he starts this thing on post #776. My wagon picks up remarkably quickly and by post #784 I have two votes on me and another person agreeing with him. WW certainly could've had partner interactions going on. If WW is scum, it's more likely that his buddy is on my wagon as well. And it would probably be Lekkit.
Lekkit- Lekkit has wanted to basically policy lynch me. We all know policy lynches are bad, so Lekkit or not, it probably won't happen. He makes this reread post a little ways back:
Roadrunner
Votes for faust after he propose the claiming idea.
Asks if he can counterclaim ADK. Says it's because he believes ADK is joking.
Says the faust vote was RVS and that he likes the vote where it is.
Implies that he's not lurking.
Says that a policy lynch of Awaclus is bad, because he's just being himself.
What?? How am I being 'ultra stubborn?' And how have I been anti-town?
I guess it's true he hasn't been stubborn, but not really adding anything of value is not really pro-town.
This doesn't seem like RR from the last game to me. It's weird that he isn't really present
I didn't lurk in X-Shot or Harry Potter.
Implies that he is lurking now.
Votes for silverspawn, since silverspawn is voting for him.
Doesn't trust ADK's claim.
Wants to lynch e if Hydrad is town.
Says he's too scummy to be scum.
Asks me to read a game where he was town to be able to meta-judge him. I'm not a fan of meta arguments like that. And I also don't really have the time to read a whole game to come to the conclusion that not helping town is not really good for town.
Goes after Ampharos for making short, jokey memey posts.
Votes for Ampharos.
Votes for silverspawn due to QT issues.
Implies that we don't think he's useful (as far as I'm concerned, he hasn't really been).
Unvotes silverspawn.
Votes for Hydrad.
Unvotes after Hydrad's claim.
Votes Hydrad again.
Tries trick Hydrad into thinking he's allready lynched.
Celebrates the actual lynch.
My sentence: Actilurked through the whole day. Avoided the Hydrad lynch until very late in the day. Looks like scum to me. Would definately lynch.
This is weird, as he bases it solely off the Hydrad lynch. Actilurking, I assume is making posts that don't help so you're active but you're not putting forth any content. Lekkit is mostly scummy because he doesn't seem genuine, he wants a RR lynch because I'm easy.
So, once again, our lynch pool is still: Lekkit, WW, Faust, and Chairs.
I think we can knock chairs off that list. I'll show empathy and give him the benefit of the doubt: He's been busy, he wants to have a nice Valentine's day, he has a lifestyle that isn't really suited for playing forum games, but he does his best to keep up anyway.
So now we have a nice, small pool of Lekkit, Faust and WW.
I think WW could easily remove himself from the pool if he comes online and gives his reasoning for being on this wagon. Let's assume he does this.
So now we have a lynch pool of Lekkit and Faust.
This is very nice. I say lynch them both and then we'll be at seven players alive with one scum in them. This is amazing and very worthwhile.
Seeing as the Faust wagon is the most likely to take off today, let's Vote: Faust.
We'll lynch Lekkit tomorrow.
This has been a good post.
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I misquoted everything :'(
Vote: Faust
Hopefully you guys can still understand that post.
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I think that RR is doing good work and will have more to say when I do a big reread tomorrow but I think it's important to for people to note that chairs did not actually put RR at L-1:
Vote Count 2.3
A party without cake is just a meeting.
RR (4): Lekkit, Awaclus, WW, chairs
faust (1): SS
EgorK (1): 2.7
chairs (3): Ampharos, faust, ADK
Not Voting (2): EgorK, RR
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
Granted, I still find chairs's vote scummy, but let's get the facts straight here.
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I'm dumb, faust changed his vote, don't mind me.
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Faust (counting him because if I get lynched today, I see Faust on my wagon without a doubt)
It will help any case you make if you don't make completely unjustified assumptions.
You guys have to understand that from my eyes I'm an IC and from scums' eyes I'm an IC.
Everyone can make that argument for themselves. I see how it may sound reasonable to you, but it is pure WIFOM for the rest of us.
I'm going to take a bold step and call Awaclus town.
Why?
There is one scum in the four people that I just named. That's a guarantee.
No. That is an assumption you make. An assumption that may sound very reasonable to you, but an assumption nonetheless.
Faust- He's supposed to be really deductive, but he seems tunnely and off somehow. SS has made a case, it's pretty decent.
silver's case is OMGUS, which make ony sense to support if you think silver is town. Why do you think silver is town?
Well, let's look at the wagon. I think thewagon at the point Hydrad claims is more informative than the post-counterclaim wagon. It is:
ADK, 2.7, gkrieg, chairs, RR, faust
So two conf!town people, me, RR (who is tentatively towny due to being presented as an alternative to Hydrad), chairs (duh), e (still probably the most scummy on here). But I think tomorrow's lynch should be off-wagon.
silver looks bad, I already said this. Egor needs to be present. His non-presentness today is a bit scummy, as we are more likely to successfully lynch scum if one scum does not participate in the discussion.
This is interesting to me. I was confirmed town. What happened to that, Faust?
Sorry for maybe confusing wording. "two conf!town people" of course refers to ADK and gkrieg.
Lekkit- Lekkit has wanted to basically policy lynch me
This is what Lekkit posted:
My sentence: Actilurked through the whole day. Avoided the Hydrad lynch until very late in the day. Looks like scum to me. Would definately lynch.
That is not a policy lynch, he has a scumread on you. You may think it is unjustified, but it is still a scumread.
I think we can knock chairs off that list. I'll show empathy and give him the benefit of the doubt: He's been busy, he wants to have a nice Valentine's day, he has a lifestyle that isn't really suited for playing forum games, but he does his best to keep up anyway.
...even if true, none of this points towards chairs being town in this game.
We'll lynch Lekkit tomorrow.
Yay for setting up mislynches!
This has been a good post.
No.
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Maybe chairs wants to join my wagon to make the OMGUS trinity complete?
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So now we have a lynch pool of Lekkit and Faust.
This is very nice. I say lynch them both and then we'll be at seven players alive with one scum in them. This is amazing and very worthwhile.
Seeing as the Faust wagon is the most likely to take off today, let's Vote: Faust.
We'll lynch Lekkit tomorrow.
This has been a good post.
Oh, wow... Do you even see how this is insanely scummy?
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That just seems disingenious. Yes I suspected you a little because you suspected me - and, and this is something I can only say now as your game is over - because I knew you modded that game. I was so much less active there than I was in this game. You know I prefer being town. so why do you think that was? I think that's a pretty good reason to suspect that you aren't being honest, i.e. aren't town.
so that wasn't OMGUS, and even if it was, the reason after day 1 isn't OMGUS.
Let me make sure I understand correctly: Your argument is that you were more active here than in the other game, I knew that you were scum in the other game, I knew that you preferred being town, so I should have come to the conclusion that you are town here?
Well, first it certainly wasn't on my mind that you preferred being town. Now that you say that I think I already read that somewhere. So I guess you could assume that I know.
It doesn't feel appropriate however to compare your activity level here to that in RMM30 without context. I mean look at that thread. It went on for 5 days and is shorter than this thread is now. To quote from some popular signature, "posting begets posting". Your activity level may be higher here simply because the general activity level is higher.
There is a point in this aspect however, so thanks for bringing it to my attention.
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I'll try to contribute more this week.
Silver I think is town because of the way he's defending himself. There was something he did earlier back when Faust made a case against him, and the kind of arguments like " I was so much less active there than I was in this game. You know I prefer being town. " are not particularly convincing, and scum tends to think twice about arguing in such way. Town knows that they're town even if what they say isn't convincing, so they say it anyway.
Faust I did think is town because of the way he was approaching the day.. sounds like standard 'okay, we lynched scum, let's find his partner' Faust play. Up until the vote on Chairs, which seemed suspicious. On the other hand, there is zero reason to think Chairs is town.
I think e is probably town based on Hydrad.. was Ampharos in that category too? I don't remember, really.
I have to go back and look at Day 1, but I have not had time.
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Checking in. Airport. Flying home.
I really don't get the people that want to lynch RR. It makes no sense to me. Granted, my read on him is based (mostly) on his questioning of the fruit vendor thing, but still. He hasn't given off the scummy vibe this game.
I will look more closely at EgorK. The one thing that stood out to me is his vote on ADK after WW (I think-didn't bother to go back and check) mistakenly voted for ADK. His rereads have been great and all, but it just seems like an over the top method of trying to stay in the game without too much real contribution. He can then ride a lynch out and survive.
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Faust I did think is town because of the way he was approaching the day.. sounds like standard 'okay, we lynched scum, let's find his partner' Faust play. Up until the vote on Chairs, which seemed suspicious. On the other hand, there is zero reason to think Chairs is town.
Okay. Let's not lynch faust today.
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vote: Ampharos
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why Ampharos?
I really don't see what he has done to make him scum. Or is it what he has not done? Because he isn't acting the same as in M72? He isn't getting "Teh feelz (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14237.msg546480#msg546480)" or acting pretty strange (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14237.msg546691#msg546691) (at least for this forum).
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why Ampharos?
I really don't see what he has done to make him scum. Or is it what he has not done? Because he isn't acting the same as in M72? He isn't getting "Teh feelz (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14237.msg546480#msg546480)" or acting pretty strange (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14237.msg546691#msg546691) (at least for this forum).
flying under the radar, PoE, and I think he wasn't very useful this game.
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Teproc on Hydrad, which may be relevant:
Just someone who isn't yuma or Awaclus or faust or ADK or Teproc
What makes Hydrad a better choice than Awaclus ? Or anyone else who isn't ADK for that matter, why are these options bad ?
I guess the "faust is obvious part" is that you don't lynch faust on day 1 ?
I have no such qualms, but I get that. Actually I think I agree... not about never lycnhing faust d1, but about this :
vote: Hydrad
Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
I have notice things to say though.
What does this mean ?
@faust : You're right, actually. I guess it should probably indicate that scum is among people for whom lurking is unusual. So... WW ? Still like Hydrad though.
@yuma : When I'm arguing with you, my goal is not for you to say I'm right. If you feel like the conversation is going nowhere, just move on. I should probably do this more as well, let things lie. These things are subjective (well even more here where there's the issue of unknown alignments/sincerity, but this also goes for the other arguments we've been in recently), it's fine if we just disagree.
It should be obvious but : I don't think you're an idiot, and I hope you don't think I'm not giving weight to what you say. It's just that we disagree a lot, and I'm fine with that, it would be pretty boring if everyone always agreed on anything.
It had gone a bit too far lately though, and I think we're all tired of it. You, me, faust, everyone else in the game looking at this and apparently not really wanting to get involved (or just being busy I guess). It's obviously making this game less fun for both of us at the very least.
So... I think we should generally try to be less aggressive with each other, and try not to be snappy and use language we know will get others riled up.
Now that this is out of the way... let's lynch Hydrad. Always fun.
I do think Hydrad not getting any reads of the whole faust/yuma/me thing is scummy, by the way.
Well, Hydrad is at at most 2 votes through all of this, so scum!Teproc could think it's never going to take off. It's a possible bus but probably not likely.
Ampharos ended up on Hydrad too, right?
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Awaclus is probably town cause he's so impossibly scummy.
I'm going to put this on the record now so you can point to it later: Gkrieg is scum.
Haha, good call.
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No, Ampharos was off wagon.
Final Day 1 Vote Count
Do you think because you are virtuous, that there shall be no more cakes and ale?
2.7 (1): EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (1): Lekkit
RR (2): SS, Awaclus
Hydrad (7): gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Not Voting (0):
With 13 players alive, it took 7 to lynch.
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Actually I was wrong. First thing Ampharos does is gets off Hydrad and onto Awaclus. Then a lot of nothing, says almost nothing about Hydrad.
It seems much more plausible than how I remembered it.
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In other news, this:
Well uh. Let's make the stuff happen as long as I am actually around to react to it.
Vote: Hydrad L-1
does not garner as many town points as people would say. It betrays some willingness to get off of the wagon at some point, as if he's expecting the need to.
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Also, at one point RR says "If Hydrad is town, can we lynch you?" While a scummy thing to say, it's not quite so scummy when the subject there is scum himself. So a little less on scum!RR.
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I did a sort of skimmy reread. RR does come off looking super scummy, and I'm definitely buying into the Amph lynch.
Howzabout vote: Ampharos
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I did a sort of skimmy reread. RR does come off looking super scummy, and I'm definitely buying into the Amph lynch.
Howzabout vote: Ampharos
'RR is scummy, so let me vote for the guy he's been tunneling forever!'
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I did a sort of skimmy reread. RR does come off looking super scummy, and I'm definitely buying into the Amph lynch.
Howzabout vote: Ampharos
'RR is scummy, so let me vote for the guy he's been tunneling forever!'
I think if you were scum, that might actually make Amph more likely to also be scum. You're not generally good at persuading people, so you can push your partner really hard, most people will probably not follow you, and when he does get lynched anyway, you get a ton of town cred.
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You could easily be partners. And amph was off-wagon, so I like that better.
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I can buy that.
vote: ampharos
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Vote: Ampharos
This is a good thing.
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I'll bite
Vote: Ampharos
That is 5 votes, so L-1.
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wow. interesting.
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Unvote
Let's hear from him!
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Unvote
Let's hear from him!
Why unvote?
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Yeah, that'll pressure him into talking.
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Unvote
Let's hear from him!
...........................................
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hey don't quicklynch my partner!
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hey don't quicklynch my partner!
Fine, let's quicklynch him. Just like I did to Yuma in Making Fun: then he quite Mafia for a while. Let's do that.
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hey don't quicklynch my partner!
Fine, let's quicklynch him. Just like I did to Yuma in Making Fun: then he quite Mafia for a while. Let's do that.
You mean when we hit scum?
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hey don't quicklynch my partner!
Fine, let's quicklynch him. Just like I did to Yuma in Making Fun: then he quite Mafia for a while. Let's do that.
You mean when we hit scum?
Doesn't mean it wasn't still a bad play. But whatever, guys. I want what's best for the town.
Vote: Amaphoros
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So WW made post that shows good evidence that teproc (ampharos) is not hydrad's partner. He then proceeds to vote ampharos when it gets more momentum.
Scum is desperate
Vote: WW
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ohhhh right. I didn't want to vote for Amph because he replaced Teproc. I forgot that.
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So WW made post that shows good evidence that teproc (ampharos) is not hydrad's partner. He then proceeds to vote ampharos when it gets more momentum.
Scum is desperate
Vote: WW
Dd you read what I said?
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Actually I was wrong. First thing Ampharos does is gets off Hydrad and onto Awaclus. Then a lot of nothing, says almost nothing about Hydrad.
It seems much more plausible than how I remembered it.
This is your "retraction" from using teproc as a case for why ampharos is town. I just don't buy it. I know as soon as I took over from Yuma I opened with a vote, then settled on hydrad. Distancing myself from yuma's reads and everything he was involved in.
I could see the same thing from ampharos. And who changes reads more than town? It's not like teproc was bussing a partner then ampharos decided not to.
No ampharos is town the same as teproc was town
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It's not like teproc was bussing a partner then ampharos decided not to.
Why not?
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It's not like teproc was bussing a partner then ampharos decided not to.
Why not?
When I went back rereading after the hydrad flip, I looked for posts by/about hydrad by anyone. And there weren't any. Well, obviously not, but there were not many. Most were concerned with qts and other such nonsense.
That being said, what is easier: ignore the partner or actually bring him up as someone to lynch. No one was a lynch candidate at that point. Teproc was bringing hydrad into that discussion. I don't see that as D1 bussing style
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It's not like teproc was bussing a partner then ampharos decided not to.
Why not?
When I went back rereading after the hydrad flip, I looked for posts by/about hydrad by anyone. And there weren't any. Well, obviously not, but there were not many. Most were concerned with qts and other such nonsense.
That being said, what is easier: ignore the partner or actually bring him up as someone to lynch. No one was a lynch candidate at that point. Teproc was bringing hydrad into that discussion. I don't see that as D1 bussing style
I'm not sure I agree about Teproc. It's a fairly safe thing to do, there is still a ton of day left and no real wagon, so Hydrad was in little danger of getting lynched. And Hydrad is a common D1 mislynch, so some people are motivated to look elsewhere. It's fairly safe bus.
It didn't really seem too suspicious to me until I read Ampharos (after reading Teproc). Ampharos doesn't do a lot of note and doesn't do anything regarding Hydrad.
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Vote Count 2.4
Custard: A detestable substance produced by a malevolent conspiracy of the hen, the cow, and the cook.
RR (2): Lekkit, Awaclus
WW (1): 2.7
chairs (2): Ampharos, faust
Ampharos (5): SS, ADK, chairs, RR, WW (L-1)
Not Voting (1): EgorK
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
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ohhhh right. I didn't want to vote for Amph because he replaced Teproc. I forgot that.
But now, you'll just keep him at L-1? :o
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The Ampharos wagon is truly awful. ADK is confirmed town, okay. Literally everyone else on the wagon is a scumread.
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So WW made post that shows good evidence that teproc (ampharos) is not hydrad's partner. He then proceeds to vote ampharos when it gets more momentum.
Scum is desperate
Vote: WW
Word.
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I can probably compose at longish case as to why Ampharos is town. Just not now, I'm going to sleep. Don't do the stupid thing.
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And Hydrad is a common D1 mislynch, so some people are motivated to look elsewhere.
I will say that this is a bad argument. One could also say that I am a "safe bus" because I never get lynched D1. So then everyone is a safe bus, the people who are often lynched and those whose a rarely lynched. Except... a bus is not safe.
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It didn't really seem too suspicious to me until I read Ampharos (after reading Teproc). Ampharos doesn't do a lot of note and doesn't do anything regarding Hydrad.
If "not doing anything of note" is your metirc for finding scum, you should be voting for Egor.
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ohhhh right. I didn't want to vote for Amph because he replaced Teproc. I forgot that.
But now, you'll just keep him at L-1? :o
yeah.
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Vote: Egor
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Vote: RR
Oh wait, I already am.
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Vote: RR
Oh wait, I already am.
This is excellent.
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The Ampharos wagon is truly awful. ADK is confirmed town, okay. Literally everyone else on the wagon is a scumread.
I think you should reconsider. What has Amph done that's so towny?
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It didn't really seem too suspicious to me until I read Ampharos (after reading Teproc). Ampharos doesn't do a lot of note and doesn't do anything regarding Hydrad.
If "not doing anything of note" is your metirc for finding scum, you should be voting for Egor.
I'm pretty sure I wanted to lynch him on Day 1, and no one else did~
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And Hydrad is a common D1 mislynch, so some people are motivated to look elsewhere.
I will say that this is a bad argument. One could also say that I am a "safe bus" because I never get lynched D1. So then everyone is a safe bus, the people who are often lynched and those whose a rarely lynched. Except... a bus is not safe.
Thing is it's safe when it's the beginning of Day 1.
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So this is why Ampharos is town.
1. Teproc had a little townslip thing going on. See here:
Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
No. Take, for instance, a setup where scum has JOAT/Goon. One of those setups has a Tracker, and one has a Commuter, both roles that cannot appear together with Fruit Vendor. So if scum were to claim Fruit Vendor, they would immediately get countered. You can go through all scenarios and see that there will always be the chance of a counterclaim.
Right, I'm dumb.
So scum certainly thinks about which fakeclaims are safe on N0. I guess not all scum do, but I'm confident that Teproc does. I just finished modding a game with Teproc, and we both thought scum should analyze the setup more. So assuming Teproc is scum, I am pretty sure that he knows that no fakeclaim is safe. Which means the above post can only be fabricated or come from town!Teproc. Teproc just doesn't seem like the guy that fabricates townslips.
2. Teproc is pushing for Hydrad pretty hard. So if he's scum, that would be a bus. I don't think it's "easy" or "early D1"; scum!Teproc is talking himself into a position from which it will be hard to argue against a Hydrad lynch when it happens. It's not out of the question that scum busses Hydrad - after all, he only was a Goon and thus the least important member of the team - but if that's your plan, you certainly talked about it in the mafia QT. Now let's assume this talk happened. Mafia agrees to bus Hydrad. Once Ampharos takes over, for sure he reads the QT. Would he just ignore the plan there and start voting for someone else, never returning to Hydrad? I don't think so. Ampharos' switch is actually evidence that he is town.
3. The wagon. I mean, seriously. silverspawn starts it for really weak reasoning that applies to at least 2 other players in this game. (that vote is sill fine mind you, it's the first vote on Amph after all) The IC joins in. Ony then do people start to sheep - and who? chairs, who is just as guilty of the things Ampharos is accused of, and who needs to divert attention from the wagon that is forming on himself, RR who also is a major lynch candidate today, Ww who just quoted evidence that Teproc is town. That is not a wagon I want to be on even without the above points.
So I believe all of this should maybe not convince you that Ampharos is town, but at least give solid reasons why Ampharos is a bad lynch for today.
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Woah dudes I legit forgot I was playing yesterday (could be to do with the cold I was in bed most of the day with :P ). Maybe I should go away more often; things get fun!
Thanks faust for spelling it all out and saving me the trouble :)
And yes, Chairs is "teh feelz".
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You know, I agree. Like I said, I had forgotten that he replaced Teproc.
But... ah, yeez. None of what amph has done all game is even remotely towny (note that neither of your points is about his own play). nonetheless, unvote, vote: chairs
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can't believe I'm actually sheeping faust.
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But... ah, yeez. None of what amph has done all game is even remotely towny (note that neither of your points is about his own play). nonetheless, unvote, vote: chairs
Yes.If it weren't for Teproc, my read on Ampharos would be different for sure. But then again, Ampharos has a relatively scummy meta.
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So this is why Ampharos is town.
1. Teproc had a little townslip thing going on. See here:
Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
No. Take, for instance, a setup where scum has JOAT/Goon. One of those setups has a Tracker, and one has a Commuter, both roles that cannot appear together with Fruit Vendor. So if scum were to claim Fruit Vendor, they would immediately get countered. You can go through all scenarios and see that there will always be the chance of a counterclaim.
Right, I'm dumb.
So scum certainly thinks about which fakeclaims are safe on N0. I guess not all scum do, but I'm confident that Teproc does. I just finished modding a game with Teproc, and we both thought scum should analyze the setup more. So assuming Teproc is scum, I am pretty sure that he knows that no fakeclaim is safe. Which means the above post can only be fabricated or come from town!Teproc. Teproc just doesn't seem like the guy that fabricates townslips.
You don't think it's possible that Teproc analyzed the setup, and then got it wrong?
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You don't think it's possible that Teproc analyzed the setup, and then got it wrong?
I don't think scum would come to the conclusion that Fruit Vendor would be a safe fakeclaim, especially given the additional setup information that they have. Also,if Teproc was scum, he would not do this on his own, but instead he would be peer-reviewed by two scum partners.
I guess it's possible, but not likely. Which is all that matters right now.
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So this is why Ampharos is town.
1. Teproc had a little townslip thing going on. See here:
Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
No. Take, for instance, a setup where scum has JOAT/Goon. One of those setups has a Tracker, and one has a Commuter, both roles that cannot appear together with Fruit Vendor. So if scum were to claim Fruit Vendor, they would immediately get countered. You can go through all scenarios and see that there will always be the chance of a counterclaim.
Right, I'm dumb.
So scum certainly thinks about which fakeclaims are safe on N0. I guess not all scum do, but I'm confident that Teproc does. I just finished modding a game with Teproc, and we both thought scum should analyze the setup more. So assuming Teproc is scum, I am pretty sure that he knows that no fakeclaim is safe. Which means the above post can only be fabricated or come from town!Teproc. Teproc just doesn't seem like the guy that fabricates townslips.
2. Teproc is pushing for Hydrad pretty hard. So if he's scum, that would be a bus. I don't think it's "easy" or "early D1"; scum!Teproc is talking himself into a position from which it will be hard to argue against a Hydrad lynch when it happens. It's not out of the question that scum busses Hydrad - after all, he only was a Goon and thus the least important member of the team - but if that's your plan, you certainly talked about it in the mafia QT. Now let's assume this talk happened. Mafia agrees to bus Hydrad. Once Ampharos takes over, for sure he reads the QT. Would he just ignore the plan there and start voting for someone else, never returning to Hydrad? I don't think so. Ampharos' switch is actually evidence that he is town.
3. The wagon. I mean, seriously. silverspawn starts it for really weak reasoning that applies to at least 2 other players in this game. (that vote is sill fine mind you, it's the first vote on Amph after all) The IC joins in. Ony then do people start to sheep - and who? chairs, who is just as guilty of the things Ampharos is accused of, and who needs to divert attention from the wagon that is forming on himself, RR who also is a major lynch candidate today, Ww who just quoted evidence that Teproc is town. That is not a wagon I want to be on even without the above points.
So I believe all of this should maybe not convince you that Ampharos is town, but at least give solid reasons why Ampharos is a bad lynch for today.
Okay, I buy it.
Unvote
I still don't like Silverspawn.. that puts as at (of people I could lynch):
Off-wagon: Egor, Lekkit, Awaclus
On-Wagon: Roadrunner, Chairs, Faust
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Vote: Egor
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unvote.
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You don't think it's possible that Teproc analyzed the setup, and then got it wrong?
I don't think scum would come to the conclusion that Fruit Vendor would be a safe fakeclaim, especially given the additional setup information that they have. Also,if Teproc was scum, he would not do this on his own, but instead he would be peer-reviewed by two scum partners.
I guess it's possible, but not likely. Which is all that matters right now.
Depends on who his partners were.
But I have to say that I'm not fond of WW and chairs backing off so easily.
Yea vote: chairs
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Vote Count 2.5
If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
RR (2): Lekkit, Awaclus
WW (1): 2.7
chairs (4): Ampharos, faust, SS, ADK
Egor (2): RR, WW
Not Voting (2): EgorK, chairs
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
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I reviewed Hydrad D1 interactions, and sat down to really think about who I think is scum, and I'm going to vote: egork.
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I reviewed Hydrad D1 interactions, and sat down to really think about who I think is scum, and I'm going to vote: egork.
Do you have anything to say about your wagon, or about why you think the player with the least amount of posts comes out as the scummiest in your review?
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Chairs is at L-2. I don't want to put him at L-1 and force a claim, but I also want to lynch him.
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I reviewed Hydrad D1 interactions, and sat down to really think about who I think is scum, and I'm going to vote: egork.
Do you have anything to say about your wagon, or about why you think the player with the least amount of posts comes out as the scummiest in your review?
My wagon is basically you shoving hard.
As far as egorK being my scum read, there's a specific line where hydrad makes a list of scummy players and calls egorK out on it as a separate item from the rest.
-
Chairs is at L-2. I don't want to put him at L-1 and force a claim, but I also want to lynch him.
Well, Ampharos was at L-1 and did not claim. it's no guarantee. There was a time back in the old days when you could rely on town to not derphammer.
-
Chairs is at L-2. I don't want to put him at L-1 and force a claim, but I also want to lynch him.
Well, Ampharos was at L-1 and did not claim. it's no guarantee. There was a time back in the old days when you could rely on town to not derphammer.
I think what he's trying to get at here is that he wants to hammer chairs without giving him the chance to claim as soon as he's at L-1.
-
Chairs is at L-2. I don't want to put him at L-1 and force a claim, but I also want to lynch him.
Well, Ampharos was at L-1 and did not claim. it's no guarantee. There was a time back in the old days when you could rely on town to not derphammer.
I think what he's trying to get at here is that he wants to hammer chairs without giving him the chance to claim as soon as he's at L-1.
I don't know, I'm reading it now as signaling his scum partner that he thinks I'm a power role in case he ends up lynched.
-
Chairs is at L-2. I don't want to put him at L-1 and force a claim, but I also want to lynch him.
Well, Ampharos was at L-1 and did not claim. it's no guarantee. There was a time back in the old days when you could rely on town to not derphammer.
I think what he's trying to get at here is that he wants to hammer chairs without giving him the chance to claim as soon as he's at L-1.
I don't know, I'm reading it now as signaling his scum partner that he thinks I'm a power role in case he ends up lynched.
Then why aren't you voting for him?
-
I reviewed Hydrad D1 interactions, and sat down to really think about who I think is scum, and I'm going to vote: egork.
Do you have anything to say about your wagon, or about why you think the player with the least amount of posts comes out as the scummiest in your review?
My wagon is basically you shoving hard.
As far as egorK being my scum read, there's a specific line where hydrad makes a list of scummy players and calls egorK out on it as a separate item from the rest.
Just for your information, it usually helps other players if you actually provide the post you are talking about, be it via link or quote.
There are 4 players on your wagon you know. That is not "me shoving hard". And even if it is, apparently I shove hard enough for you to get close to being lynched, so you should probably do something about it.
As for the Hydrad thing, I suppose this is the post you're talking about:
I'm pretty much a lurker though. but ya interesting that he would say you.
If we really wanted a lurker team...
oh man actually theres a decent amount this game.
me/awaclus/chairs/lekkit and egork I guess?
...and this is your reason to think Egor is scum? First of all, this is not a "list of scummy players" as you said it was. It's a list of lurkers, as you can clearly see. Second, uh why would scum single out a partner exactly? Not that it's even singling out, I read it more like a simple listing: There's this guy, that guy and the other guy.
In other words, your "case" is nonexistent.
-
Chairs is at L-2. I don't want to put him at L-1 and force a claim, but I also want to lynch him.
Well, Ampharos was at L-1 and did not claim. it's no guarantee. There was a time back in the old days when you could rely on town to not derphammer.
I think what he's trying to get at here is that he wants to hammer chairs without giving him the chance to claim as soon as he's at L-1.
I don't know, I'm reading it now as signaling his scum partner that he thinks I'm a power role in case he ends up lynched.
::)
-
There is just no popular wagon that chairs does not want to be on, except his own.
-
Chairs is at L-2. I don't want to put him at L-1 and force a claim, but I also want to lynch him.
Well, Ampharos was at L-1 and did not claim. it's no guarantee. There was a time back in the old days when you could rely on town to not derphammer.
I like to think that we've evolved from those archaic times.
-
There is just no popular wagon that chairs does not want to be on, except his own.
That isn't necessarily scummy. Wagons are fun, and productive.
-
There is just no popular wagon that chairs does not want to be on, except his own.
That isn't necessarily scummy. Wagons are fun, and productive.
Yeah... but it's scummy when it's the only thing you do.
-
Okay, so,
I don't like faust's "don't vote for amph" post at all. His reasoning is surprisingly weak for faust, he admits that amph has been scummy since replacing in, and he says that it's not a good lynch "for today." If a lynch is good for later, it's good for today, IMO.
But chairs is ultimately scummier. He's been lurky, even for chairs, and has been doing pretty much nothing but voting on wagons as soon as they form. I know he has a quiet meta but I think that in this case if it looks like scum and quacks like scum then it's probably scum.
-
Sorry, my fiancee has been in town so I'm not even doing work stuff basically as much as I can.
This never happens where she stays more than a night or two and it's blowing my mind
-
I'd call the chairs wagon pretty lame. I don't think his flip gives us any information, so we're basibg this solely on the guess that he's scum. Has anyone even looked at his interactions with Hydrad? I think that'll be my job. I'll do that right now!
-
Sorry, I don't like bird meat flavored girl scout cookies :(
During my reread of chairs I stumbled across this. It's worth noting. I don't like bird flavored Girl Scout cookies, either. Or, I assume I wouldn't like them. I can't say for sure though.
-
Anyways we have a day till lynch and i'm the leading wagon... That doesn't sound to good.
So I think ss is town with his QT thing. Awaclus or RR it seems? gah. I'm fine with lynching either honestly.
Vote: RR
This points to town Awaclus and town RR.
-
Okay, here's what I got: Chairs has been sneakily sneaking onto almost every wagon. He has also been posting almost no content, most of his posts are posts saying he's busy. So that's scummy.
On the other hand, I also did a reread of myself and SS. And let me tell you, boy do I sound stupid! Doing a reread of myself was depressing, and it got me thinking: why would my wagon possibly dissolve?
I think my wagon went away because Amapharos became an easier lynch than me for scum, then chairs became an easier mislynch for scum.
In other news, Faust is towny and SS is scummy.
So my town reads now extend to RR, Faust, Awaclus, chairs, Ampharos, and ADK.
-
I'd call the chairs wagon pretty lame. I don't think his flip gives us any information, so we're basibg this solely on the guess that he's scum. Has anyone even looked at his interactions with Hydrad? I think that'll be my job. I'll do that right now!
Lynching someone because you think they're scum is much better than lynching for interactions.
-
Oh yeah, let's talk about ADK and how he's a 'Fruit Vendor.'
Three questions for you ADK:
1. Who did you send fruit to last night?
2. Why did you send it to them?
3. What type of fruit was it?
-
RR, fruit being received has already been claimed. We know the setup.
-
I recieved an avocado last night.
Fruit Vendor=Confirmed.
Ok. I knew someone had claimed. But I forgot it was RR. What is the purpose of those questions, RR? Like, you are not making any sense to me right now
-
Also, we can lynch WW later.
Vote: EgorK
-
I recieved an avocado last night.
Fruit Vendor=Confirmed.
Ok. I knew someone had claimed. But I forgot it was RR. What is the purpose of those questions, RR? Like, you are not making any sense to me right now
Do I ever make any sense to you ever, 2.7?
-
Chairs is behaving exactly like lurker!busy!town!chairs behaves. I could go look for old games, but am being lazy and am on my phone
-
So ADK's an IC? He's pretty scummy for an IC.
PPE
-
I recieved an avocado last night.
Fruit Vendor=Confirmed.
Ok. I knew someone had claimed. But I forgot it was RR. What is the purpose of those questions, RR? Like, you are not making any sense to me right now
Do I ever make any sense to you ever, 2.7?
You make sense as town this game. But try hard enough and you might convince me otherwise. Probably not today, but you never know
-
So ADK's an IC? He's pretty scummy for an IC.
PPE
I am an IC. You can ignore IC!ADK and just follow my lead and lynch egork
-
Oh yeah, let's talk about ADK and how he's a 'Fruit Vendor.'
Three questions for you ADK:
1. Who did you send fruit to last night?
2. Why did you send it to them?
3. What type of fruit was it?
To you, because you seem skeptical of my claim for god knows what reason, I don't get to pick the type but apparently it was avocado.
And yeah, I'm an IC, deal with it. I'm not even claiming you're scum right now (although super cranky!RR is enough outside your normal meta that I'm suspicious), I'm just saying that you should vote for chairs.
PPE: er, what?
-
So ADK's an IC? He's pretty scummy for an IC.
PPE
I am an IC. You can ignore IC!ADK and just follow my lead and lynch egork
Vote: Egor
Forum Mafia=solved
PPE
-
Oh yeah, let's talk about ADK and how he's a 'Fruit Vendor.'
Three questions for you ADK:
1. Who did you send fruit to last night?
2. Why did you send it to them?
3. What type of fruit was it?
To you, because you seem skeptical of my claim for god knows what reason, I don't get to pick the type but apparently it was avocado.
And yeah, I'm an IC, deal with it. I'm not even claiming you're scum right now (although super cranky!RR is enough outside your normal meta that I'm suspicious), I'm just saying that you should vote for chairs.
PPE: er, what?
Cranky?
-
Oh yeah, you were already voting egork. See, you do make sense this game!
-
Oh yeah, you were already voting egork. See, you do make sense this game!
I wasn't voting Egor before the post I just made, was I?
-
Oh yeah, you were already voting egork. See, you do make sense this game!
I wasn't voting Egor before the post I just made, was I?
Hey, look at that!
Unassertive RR=town RR
-
Vote Count 2.5
If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
RR (2): Lekkit, Awaclus
WW (1): 2.7
chairs (4): Ampharos, faust, SS, ADK
Egor (2): RR, WW
Not Voting (2): EgorK, chairs
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
According to this you were
-
Oh yeah, you were already voting egork. See, you do make sense this game!
I wasn't voting Egor before the post I just made, was I?
Hey, look at that!
Unassertive RR=town RR
But maybe I faked pretending that I didn't know I was already voting for Egor so that I would get town cred for being unassertive.
But maybe I'm making this post and undermining my last post for town cred for pointing out the WIFOM!
Oh, boy!
-
Oh yeah, you were already voting egork. See, you do make sense this game!
I wasn't voting Egor before the post I just made, was I?
Hey, look at that!
Unassertive RR=town RR
But maybe I faked pretending that I didn't know I was already voting for Egor so that I would get town cred for being unassertive.
But maybe I'm making this post and undermining my last post for town cred for pointing out the WIFOM!
Oh, boy!
Maybe it's not the crankiness, it's the sarcasm.
-
Ok, RR, you were making a lot of sense just a little bit ago. Don't throw it all away
-
Oh yeah, you were already voting egork. See, you do make sense this game!
I wasn't voting Egor before the post I just made, was I?
Hey, look at that!
Unassertive RR=town RR
But maybe I faked pretending that I didn't know I was already voting for Egor so that I would get town cred for being unassertive.
But maybe I'm making this post and undermining my last post for town cred for pointing out the WIFOM!
Oh, boy!
Maybe it's not the crankiness, it's the sarcasm.
This isn't sarcasm! This is me gettibg town cred (but by making this post I lose all that town cred).
-
But ok, e, why don't you like a chairs lynch?
-
Chairs is behaving exactly like lurker!busy!town!chairs behaves. I could go look for old games, but am being lazy and am on my phone
-
Eh, but he's also acting like lurker!scum!chairs behaves, and is throwing votes around in a pretty cavalier fashion. I think lurker!town!chairs is at least more thoughtful.
And what's the case on Egork? That he's lurking? Why one lurker over the other?
-
EgorK:
My first impression of EgorK was his ADK vote:
we have weird wagons, right now. None of them is really good.
How about vote: ADK?
Is it soft claim?
Vote: ADK then
I seriously think that we should forbid self-voting by the rules. Board game RMM was much more pleasant (though I understand that there this was required by setup)
The vote by silverspawn was a mistake, one that he corrected very quickly. But this EgorK vote is interesting. His first post of the game, fully believing the fruit vendor (as he should) and quickly picking up on any sort of counterclaim (which, if he is scum, he knows isn't true). That vote just gave me bad vibes.
Then a post voting yuma before this:
Can anyone provide case on him [hydrad]?
Then he gets sick and has an unexpected business trip which causes all sorts of v/la, which I don't count against him at all. However, coming out into D2 we get this:
Hi everyone!
I was utterly shocked to find Hydrad being scum. Hydrad was just his usual self, just like in X-Shots.
Well, at least this gives something to reread - what Hydrad said and what people said about Hydrad. Will do it shortly
Followed by detailed post (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg568140#msg568140)-by-post (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg568185#msg568185)rereads of Hydrad that tell us....well...nothing.
Seems like pretty standard modus operandi for scum. And better than anything you have on chairs.
-
On the other hand, we have this from chairs:
An early vote on Awaclus (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564637#msg564637) with as good a first post case as there can be.
calling scumteams (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565089#msg565089)
good discussion (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566000#msg566000) on the fruit vendor claim
joining faust/WW in voting for silverspawn. (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566152#msg566152)
Questioning Hydrad votes (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566612#msg566612), but then after seeing my amazing case (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566816#msg566816) (the followup one, not that flimsly original case) (I can only assume) he decides to vote for Hydrad (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566890#msg566890).
And I mean, that is how he ends D1. He is on-wagon. He stayed true to voting Hydrad even after the claim. (ok, that was probably just because he wasn't online). But still, you guys seriously want to lynch on-wagon? Seriously?
Continuing on to D2, we get more of the same.
voting on a wagon, going for RR (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg568322#msg568322).
switching to Ampharos (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg568663#msg568663) when he sees a case he likes better.
Then switching again to EgorK (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg569055#msg569055). Call it survival voting. Call it whatever you want. He defended himself excellently by calling it "faust shoving hard. (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg569180#msg569180)" Splendid defense in my opinion. Not that it is necessarily accurate, but I just like the fight in it.
so yeah. I really don't buy the votes on chairs. I totally think he is town. He doesn't create cases, he finds the ones he likes and sticks to them. Like, you know, Hydrad. Who was scum. Who he voted against. Man, going into this reread of chairs I wasn't expecting to so thoroughly convince myself that he is town, but I think I have.
-
I think Faust is scum.
-
Vote Count 2.6
Eat celsiums.
RR (2): Lekkit, Awaclus
chairs (4): Ampharos, faust, SS, ADK
Egor (4): RR, WW, chairs, 2.7
Not Voting (1): EgorK
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
-
Why aren't we lynching RR?
-
On the other hand, we have this from chairs:
An early vote on Awaclus (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564637#msg564637) with as good a first post case as there can be.
calling scumteams (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565089#msg565089)
good discussion (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566000#msg566000) on the fruit vendor claim
joining faust/WW in voting for silverspawn. (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566152#msg566152)
Questioning Hydrad votes (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566612#msg566612), but then after seeing my amazing case (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566816#msg566816) (the followup one, not that flimsly original case) (I can only assume) he decides to vote for Hydrad (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566890#msg566890).
And I mean, that is how he ends D1. He is on-wagon. He stayed true to voting Hydrad even after the claim. (ok, that was probably just because he wasn't online). But still, you guys seriously want to lynch on-wagon? Seriously?
Continuing on to D2, we get more of the same.
voting on a wagon, going for RR (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg568322#msg568322).
switching to Ampharos (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg568663#msg568663) when he sees a case he likes better.
Then switching again to EgorK (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg569055#msg569055). Call it survival voting. Call it whatever you want. He defended himself excellently by calling it "faust shoving hard. (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg569180#msg569180)" Splendid defense in my opinion. Not that it is necessarily accurate, but I just like the fight in it.
so yeah. I really don't buy the votes on chairs. I totally think he is town. He doesn't create cases, he finds the ones he likes and sticks to them. Like, you know, Hydrad. Who was scum. Who he voted against. Man, going into this reread of chairs I wasn't expecting to so thoroughly convince myself that he is town, but I think I have.
I havehonestly no idea how thismakesyou think chairs is town. It sure buys some towncred that he was on-wagon, but the rest...?
-
My space bar is not working the way it should.
-
I think Faust is scum.
I don't.
-
EgorK:
On the other hand, this Egor reread. I mean, that vote for thinking we have a counterclaim - when I read your post here, itmade me think Egor is more likely town, yet you come out as scum from this somehow? Scum is more likely to accept claims that they know are true.
The "utterly shocked" part actually also doesn't read scummy to me.
So I find these pretty weird.
-
Okay, so,
I don't like faust's "don't vote for amph" post at all. His reasoning is surprisingly weak for faust, he admits that amph has been scummy since replacing in, and he says that it's not a good lynch "for today." If a lynch is good for later, it's good for today, IMO.
But chairs is ultimately scummier. He's been lurky, even for chairs, and has been doing pretty much nothing but voting on wagons as soon as they form. I know he has a quiet meta but I think that in this case if it looks like scum and quacks like scum then it's probably scum.
Man, here I was thinking my reasoning on that one was pretty good. And I don't get "if a lynch is good later, it's good today"... that's uh I can't think of a nice way to put it. If we're at 3-player LyLo with me, you and player X surviving (newsflash: this won't happen), then of course I will vote for X. That does not mean I should vote for any player except me and you today, which your statement would imply.
-
Why aren't we lynching RR?
I'd ask, "why should we", but then again I already know your answer to that.
-
e, I do such rereads to get in game in which I have trouble getting into. Then I got lynched for it usually (at least I remember at least 2 times that was the case). Unfortunately this time it seems it hadn't helped. I still need to finish it though
Oh, wagons. Won't vote for me, I am not ash and do not have some kind of result. RR I had exactly one time correctly voted for - in 3 ppl LyLo where he voted me first, so not exactly good record (and I vigged town him). Chairs I can vote for, especially for self-preservation. But I based on my reread ss comes more scummy. He does not make sense like at all with most of his actions. He did same in XShots and was town, but my WIFOM-o-meter says that if anyone good at manipulating his meta that is silver.
So at the very least I want to see if there are any interest - Vote: silver
-
These are the kinds of moments where I'm reminded how insanely hard this game is.
I tentatively like Lekkit for having gone completely unnoticed so far.
Let's put up a totally uninformed reads list that will be completely terrible. Or maybe it will be great?
2,71...
Ampharos
RR
chairs
WW
faust
ADK
Egork
Awaclus
Lekkit
-
PPE okay you can put Egork below Awaclus for this vote.
-
At this point into fds meta, I think you can start giving scum points for throwing votes at completely random people when you're a big wagon, rather than supporting another big wagon yourself.
-
I think I didn't even include dead people this time.
-
vote: egork
L-1
-
this wagon is also pretty townie
-
@faust. Looks like we are reading the same things and coming to different conclusions. I am ok with that.
-
These are the kinds of moments where I'm reminded how insanely hard this game is.
I tentatively like Lekkit for having gone completely unnoticed so far.
Let's put up a totally uninformed reads list that will be completely terrible. Or maybe it will be great?
2,71...
Ampharos
RR
chairs
WW
faust
ADK
Egork
Awaclus
Lekkit
The IC sure looks plenty scummy in your list.
-
I'm not taking any blame for that. If we have an IC, he clearly doesn't have enough presence, so it's his fault. :P
-
Request prod on Lekkit
It's been more than 48 hours.
-
At this point into fds meta, I think you can start giving scum points for throwing votes at completely random people when you're a big wagon, rather than supporting another big wagon yourself.
I tentatively agree on this.
-
Okay, that moves ADK to the top. Below me, though. I'm at the very top in such a bright green that you can't tell it apart from the background.
Anyway, out of the existing wagons, Egork is much preferable to chairs. And really, one of them was on wagon and one was off. Not just on, he was second. That wagon is scummy business, even if the IC is on it.
-
Request prod on Lekkit
Sent.
-
Vote Count 2.7
Beans, beans, good for the heart.
RR (2): Lekkit, Awaclus
chairs (3): Ampharos, faust, ADK
Egor (5): RR, WW, chairs, 2.7, SS (L-1)
SS (1): EgorK
Not Voting (0):
With 11 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Day will end at 9am on the 19th of February, forum time.
-
Anyway, out of the existing wagons, Egork is much preferable to chairs. And really, one of them was on wagon and one was off. Not just on, he was second. That wagon is scummy business, even if the IC is on it.
Uh... no, he was the fourth vote on the wagon.
Anyway that post inspiredme to go back and look at the timing of chairs' vote, thanks for that. chairs switches vote from silver to Hydrad when silver is at 4 votes (including chairs) and Hydrad at 3. The switch here really shifts the attention towards Hydrad, and the vote is much townier than I thought. I am kinda confused that none of the chairs defenders brought this up.
-
Anyway that makes me like the chairs wagon less, and in turn the Egor wagon more. So tentative intent to hammer. It won't happen before Lekkit had a chance to post though.
-
I'm here. Been much more swamped with work than I thought I was going to be. Will try to reread the day soon.
I think regardless of how ADK has played this game. Suggesting he's playing scummy is very much not helping town.
-
I would rather lynch RR than Egor right now. Will reread Egor now.
-
Allright. That was quick. I can't really say I think the case on Egor is any good. Pretty much the only thing he's done this game is being away, starting a reread where he paints silverspawn as super scummy and... That's pretty much it.
-
I reviewed Hydrad D1 interactions, and sat down to really think about who I think is scum, and I'm going to vote: egork.
This... Seems... Weird. Out of "all" the Hydrad interactions. He chose one of the guys who pretty much ignored Hydrad throughout the day. He was interacting with Hydrad in actually exactly the same way until the end of the day where Egor wasn't present. I din't interact much with Hydrad either. It seems very much like a not very thought through artificial reason to join the wagon.
Reading a bit further, he actually explains that he thought Hydrad singled out Egor in a post. Well! That's a rock solid case right there! Pair it with the vibe we got from e and I don't see why we shouldn't lynch anyone else!
Seriously, though. What's the case against Egor?
-
Well, as there is intent to hammer it is time to claim. Nothing exciting here though, just your resident VT
-
Unvote
L-1 came too quickly.
-
this wagon is also pretty townie
No. It's not.
I just skimmed through the day to try and find a reason for the Egor votes. There was like... e who said some stuff that I don't really agree with. Hunches and vibes. And chairs. And suddenly. Everyone and their mothers are voting for him. FOR NO REASON. Then silverspawn pops up and says the wagon is towny. How is it towny? The only thing that makes is even sligtly towny is that scum might be hesitant to switch votes so close to a large wagon forming. But seriously. His lynch would give us nothing unless he's scum, which I think there's very little reason to believe.
-
Vote: Egor
-
Unvote
L-1 came too quickly.
Vote: EgorK
-
...
-
No wait, I didn't think that through. Chairs could also be RR's last partner. :-\
-
Expressing strong dislike of this wagon.
-
Final Day 2 Vote Count
Beans, beans, good for the heart.
RR (1): Lekkit
chairs (2): Ampharos, ADK
Egor (6): WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
SS (1): EgorK
Not Voting (1): RR
With 11 players alive, it took 6 to lynch.
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Hm, that hammer... I'm not sure I buy it.
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Eh, it could be worse.
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Thread Locked!
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Day 2 End
Final Vote Count:
RR (1): Lekkit
chairs (2): Ampharos, ADK
Egor (6): WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
SS (1): EgorK
Not Voting (1): RR
With 11 players alive, it took 6 to lynch.
One of the cakes had been sitting on a plate and spinning it like a top, singing as he did so - apparently not paying much attention. Nobody thought this was appropriate behaviour for a cake at all, but being British they did the proper thing and ignored him, hoping he would go away. Eventually, though, the spinning cake decided to get involved. He stopped whirling and took a seat on the table instead, then declared:
"You, the quiet one! You look awfully disgusting! Why would anyone want to eat YOU?"
Indeed, one of the baked goods had spent a while sitting quietly in the corner, not doing much. Most of the cakes hadn't even noticed him. The sudden accusation triggered some consternation in the group, and several of the cakes stepped in to the quiet guy's aid.
"What did he ever do to you, eh? Hell, he's not done anything at all!"
"You're the one who's been pretending to be a vinyl record or something for the last 2 hours!"
Matt and Rick watched enthralled as the two singled-out sweets had their characters attacked. Groups formed hating quiet-guy, groups formed hating spinny-guy, they merged and reformed, merged and reformed. It was very clear that one or other of them would end up on the floor sooner or later.
And suddenly, so it was! The group of cakes, always bolshy, got more and more pushy until a well-timed shove sent the quiet brown cake to his doom!
This time Rick tasted the mess.
"What's it like?" asked Matt.
"Well... eh. It's OK, I guess. Not really rich enough, though. It's like someone's tried to make brownies without butter! It's just crumbling in my hands, look! Not the best thing ever, to be honest. Must be one of mum's attempts to turn us vegan..."
The boys still hadn't eaten anything substantial, and night was drawing in, now. They felt their blood sugar dropping, and so Rick decided the two of them should have a doze.
"We're just gonna nod off here - don't do anything without us!" he told the cakes sternly - or at least as sternly as he could manage.
As their heads drooped, Rick could have sworn he heard one of the cakes mutter softly:
"Don't do anything without them - yeah, right!"
EgorK has been lynched! He was a Vegan Brownie (Mafia Rolecop).
Night 2 begins now and will last 48 hours. Night actions due in 36 hours.
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Day 3 Start
Rick was dozing peacefully next to his brother for an hour or so, before suddenly he woke, with a start!
A soft, wet squishy shape had hit him directly in the face - thrown, (as he saw as he recovered) by a particularly angry-looking cupcake.
"OI! WAKE UP, YOU! YOU CAN'T JUST SLEEP FOR EVER, YOU HAVE TO LOOK AFTER US!"
The incensed pastry threw another chunk of the unknown stuff at Matt's face, waking him just as rudely.
"Look what happens when you leave us alone!" Exclaimed the cake, practically hopping with frustration as he stepped aside to reveal the source of the gooey yellow substance - it was the remains of a cake!
It had been horribly butchered, and pieces of fruit oozed slowly from what remained of its baked outer shell. An awful sight. Oddly enough, though, while Matt had previously failed to recognise this particular cake, now he thought he did:
"Isn't that... isn't that a bit of Nana's apple cake? You know, the one that won her that World Bakery-and-Storytelling Championship in 2015?"
"D'you know, Matt, I think it might be," replied Rick, picking up the chunk of apple that had so violently awoken him from its resting place on the floor. He took a bite, then almost instantly:
"Awww...mmmm...MAN that's good! Yep, that's Nana's apple cake alright!"
There was a brief pause - then the two brothers each pounced on what remained of the apple cake, fighting each other tooth and claw for every mouthful. In no time at all, nothing whatsoever remained, barring a lonely chunk on the floor, lying forgotten where it had fallen from Matt's face.
The display of violence meant that this time it was the cakes looking at the humans with a newfound respect and fear. Still, their goal in life was to be eaten, so after a brief silence the conversation began slowly to pick back up again.
A Drowned Kernel died during the night. He was Grandma's World-Famous Apple Cake (Fruit Vendor).
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Vote Count 3.0
Not Voting (9): 2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus, chairs, faust, Lekkit, RR, SS, WW
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Day 3 begins now and will end at 10am on the 27th of February, forum time.
Thread unlocked!
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So I guess the natural thing is to go back and look at who went after those two kinda hard. Should clear up some people.
Can't do it right now since I'm at work and busy, but I'll try to do it later. Unless someone else wants to, then I'd be all <3
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So this is super super good. Now we just lynch RR and win.
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RR is probably a good choice. Lekkit's reaction sounded honest, but I guess could have been faked. Possible someone went on Egor for bussing cred.
Ampharos was also off wagon, and he was the alternate wagon to Egor. Not sure what that says about him.
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GOOD NEWS EVERYBODY!
I am the Even-Night Tracker and I can give us another IC - one that, frankly, surprised me a little.
(I wouldn't claim, but I don't think I'll make it to D5).
faust is Town.
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GOOD NEWS EVERYBODY!
I am the Even-Night Tracker and I can give us another IC - one that, frankly, surprised me a little.
(I wouldn't claim, but I don't think I'll make it to D5).
faust is Town.
Didn't you think the Egor thing made Faust unlikely?
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We know the only remaining Mafia member is the 2-shot Strongman. If Mafia did bus, I'd have guessed the bus would be L-1 or even the hammer for D2, because you don't want to drop to a one-man team if you can help it. D1 is a bit iffier, you maybe bus Hydrad a little early since A) he's the Goon, and B) D1 scum lynch on-wagon? Looking super Town.
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GOOD NEWS EVERYBODY!
I am the Even-Night Tracker and I can give us another IC - one that, frankly, surprised me a little.
(I wouldn't claim, but I don't think I'll make it to D5).
faust is Town.
Didn't you think the Egor thing made Faust unlikely?
Personally I felt like faust was trying hard to push people off EgorK onto me. Biased a little, maybe, but that's how I felt.
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Alright. Well at any rate scum!Chairs claiming this is 100% losing, so I guess we have two IC's.
Only scum on wagon could be Awaclus or Silverspawn. Still probably better to look off.
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vote: RR. We ended the Day with RR not voting for anybody. That seems... odd.
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Awaclus On wagon (also hammered), not lynching today.
faust Town
silverspawn On wagon - Probably the only one on wagon I'd be willing to lynch
yuma --> 2.7 On wagon, don't want to lynch
Roadrunner7671 Off wagon, definately willing to lynch
Lekkit Off wagon
Witherweaver On wagon, don't want to lynch
Teproc --> Ampharos Off wagon, definately willing to lynch. I still don't agree Teproc was very towny.
chairs Town
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Ha ha, I'm dead now. Oh well. I'm town though.
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That result is good for me. I was definitely thinking faust as possible scum
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
I like this. Thanks!
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Voting rr was just my default, I'm definitely going to do a long read soon. I just think it's generally good to have a vote down even if it's a really minor gut vote.
Also I'm going to be so smug at faust
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
What about his reaction after the lynch, though? Looks forced to you?
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Day 1 wagon: gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
Day 2 wagon: WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
Based on that we have (of the players remaining in our lynchpool):
chairs, 2.7, WW
RR, silver, Awaclus
Lekkit, Ampharos
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
What about his reaction after the lynch, though? Looks forced to you?
This?
...
Expressing strong dislike of this wagon.
No, I don't think that makes him townie. It'd have been suicide to handwave his dislike for the wagon. He clearly didn't like it.
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Maybe I'm remembering wrong. Though, generally as a partner you don't fight your partner's lynch after it already happened.
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So this is super super good. Now we just lynch RR and win.
Vote: Awaclus
Do you have anything besides frequent tunneling of Roadrunner for this town? Anything?
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So this is super super good. Now we just lynch RR and win.
Vote: Awaclus
Do you have anything besides frequent tunneling of Roadrunner for this town? Anything?
Sometimes the frequent tunneling of Roadrunner is all that town needs.
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
What about his reaction after the lynch, though? Looks forced to you?
This?
...
Expressing strong dislike of this wagon.
No, I don't think that makes him townie. It'd have been suicide to handwave his dislike for the wagon. He clearly didn't like it.
I didn't like it. There was no real case on him. People just voted. I mean. Try to find interactions with him. Imagine he had flipped town. The wagon was bad. The outcome was great. But that came down to almost pure luck.
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this wagon is also pretty townie
I would also like to know why you said this. Because as you probably can guess by now, I disagree.
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
What about his reaction after the lynch, though? Looks forced to you?
This?
...
Expressing strong dislike of this wagon.
No, I don't think that makes him townie. It'd have been suicide to handwave his dislike for the wagon. He clearly didn't like it.
I didn't like it. There was no real case on him. People just voted. I mean. Try to find interactions with him. Imagine he had flipped town. The wagon was bad. The outcome was great. But that came down to almost pure luck.
Then why doesn't it make me townie that I was off it?
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this wagon is also pretty townie
I would also like to know why you said this. Because as you probably can guess by now, I disagree.
That statement was a conclusion from the people to the wagon, not about how the wagon came to be. As in, the wagon is driven by my townreads - which it was, you can compare the reads list I posted right before that - therefore it's a towny wagon.
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But the case was also far from random. There was a strong PoE and Egork was not on the day 1 wagon.
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
What about his reaction after the lynch, though? Looks forced to you?
This?
...
Expressing strong dislike of this wagon.
No, I don't think that makes him townie. It'd have been suicide to handwave his dislike for the wagon. He clearly didn't like it.
I didn't like it. There was no real case on him. People just voted. I mean. Try to find interactions with him. Imagine he had flipped town. The wagon was bad. The outcome was great. But that came down to almost pure luck.
Then why doesn't it make me townie that I was off it?
Because he turned out to be scum. Being a part of making it so you are the only one in your team left day 3 seems like a pretty bad plan.
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really? RR?
I would much rather vote: Lekkit. He was my top choice for yesterday, and then he defended Egork pretty heavily.
What about his reaction after the lynch, though? Looks forced to you?
This?
...
Expressing strong dislike of this wagon.
No, I don't think that makes him townie. It'd have been suicide to handwave his dislike for the wagon. He clearly didn't like it.
I didn't like it. There was no real case on him. People just voted. I mean. Try to find interactions with him. Imagine he had flipped town. The wagon was bad. The outcome was great. But that came down to almost pure luck.
Then why doesn't it make me townie that I was off it?
Because he turned out to be scum. Being a part of making it so you are the only one in your team left day 3 seems like a pretty bad plan.
RR and bad plans go hand in hand.
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Well, here I was thinking that my switch to Egor was a really obvtown move. I guess that's bias.
I received a fruit from ADK by the way, which I don't think matters at all, but there it is.
It's interesting that scum decided not to PR hunt tonight. I think that's a mistake. Having the Even-Night Tracker dead before he can IC another player or out scum would really have been important. This makes me lean RR over Lekkit (I agree that these are our best shots at finding scum today).
I guess I will reread for Egor interactions. Shouldn't take too long.
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Actually the Fruit may matter... but I doubt it. RR claimed D2 that he got an Avocado. My note does not specify which fruit it is. One mafia player's role name had avocado in it. Maybe he got confused? It's a kinda long shot though.
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Actually the Fruit may matter... but I doubt it. RR claimed D2 that he got an Avocado. My note does not specify which fruit it is. One mafia player's role name had avocado in it. Maybe he got confused? It's a kinda long shot though.
I asked in my QT what type of fruit it was. Apparently Haddock has a good sense of humor. But you've seen how he's written the flavor, he likes to include things from the game in it (which is awesome).
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This is actually strange. In your shoes, I'd be killing RR to death. Why is no one killing RR?
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This is actually strange. In your shoes, I'd be killing RR to death. Why is no one killing RR?
because he is town, silly. Like I have always said.
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This is actually strange. In your shoes, I'd be killing RR to death. Why is no one killing RR?
because he is town, silly. Like I have always said.
I know, but there's a stupendous case against him.
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So, let's see Egor interactions.
D1
- he votes for yuma (e) early D1.
- WW votes for Egor because he doesn't like his vote
- e starts out voting for Egor
- e says "I still like Egor as scum, but we can lynch him later"
- Egor calls Awaclus "hypocritical"
D2
- e votes for Egor
- Awaclus "could go for silver or Egor"
- Egor posts rereads in which he seems to imply silver as scum
- RR wants to lynch people on his wagon, thereby excluding Egor
- RR leaves the Ampharos wagon at L-1 and votes for Egor instead
- WW votes for Egor
- e: "we can lynch WW later" (deja-vu), votes for Egor
- e posts a case on Egor
- Egor votes for silver. So there is some buildup to this
- silver puts Egor to L-1
- RR unvotes after I state intent to hammer
- Awaclus hammers
- Lekkit does not like the wagon
What does it mean for the non-IC players alive?
Awaclus: Seeing as Egor was scum, the hammer was townish. I don't think the Egor lynch was settled upon at this point. There were still 2 days left to the deadline. So won't lynch.
silver: Egor builds p towards an silver lynch basically all of D2. silver puts Egor to L-1. Won't lynch.
e: On both scum wagons, consistently pushed Egor as scum. Ignoring crazy double-bussing scenarios for now, he should be town fr sure.
RR: Started the Egor wagon. The timing of his vote switch is pretty towny. Egor did not jump on his wagon however, when that might have been a reasonable play for scum. I'm torn, but think there may be better candidates.
Lekkit: Did some reread posts, but never of Egor. Opposed the Egor wagon. No Egor interactions. Scummiest player so far.
WW: Early Egor vote,then votes Egor again on D2. Leaves that wagon for Ampharos and never comes back. Lynchable.
Ampharos: No Egor interactions. Was off-wagon, and Egor was off the Ampharos wagon. The Teproc thing only buys so much town cred. Scummy.
So my lynchpool for today is Lekkit, WW, Ampharos I think. I might be swayed on RR, but I think these three are scummier.
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I Voted Egor Day 1 and day 2, and was on the wagon when he got lynched.
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I Voted Egor Day 1 and day 2, and was on the wagon when he got lynched.
You're right. Somehow I missed your final Egor vote I think. Anyway, that makes me more comfortable with one of Lekkit/Ampharos. Leaning Lekkit.
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Vote: Lekkit
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Vote Count 3.1
It's difficult to think anything but pleasant thoughts while eating a homegrown tomato.
RR (1): chairs
Lekkit (2): SS, faust
Awaclus (1): RR
Not Voting (5): 2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus, Lekkit, WW
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Day 3 will end at 10am on the 27th of February, forum time.
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Vote: RR
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I'm not sure I buy RR being townie for Egor treatment. He unvotes Ampharos at L-1, moves to Egor, unvotes Egor at L-1. It's not as if he starts and pushes the Egor wagon and sticks with it.
I don't know though, his behavior in general is odd enough to make him not tractable.
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That was also a pretty elaborate explanation for Faust to come to, basically, "let's lynch off wagon".
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Vote: RR
OMGWS
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That was also a pretty elaborate explanation for Faust to come to, basically, "let's lynch off wagon".
For the record, I think off wagon is the way to go.
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That was also a pretty elaborate explanation for Faust to come to, basically, "let's lynch off wagon".
For the record, I think off wagon is the way to go.
Well then you don't have many options.
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I haven't reread yet, but we have plenty of time. I should be able to get something down tomorrow
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Oh and hi Lekkit! Have a day three pass.
Ha ha, this came back to bite me.
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I'm not sure I buy RR being townie for Egor treatment. He unvotes Ampharos at L-1, moves to Egor, unvotes Egor at L-1. It's not as if he starts and pushes the Egor wagon and sticks with it.
I don't know though, his behavior in general is odd enough to make him not tractable.
Yeah... but he started the wagon. It seems strange to leave a wagon on town at L-1 (a wagon that, mind you, your partner isn't even on) and instead start a new one on your partner. If there's a player at L-1, you want him to claim before you unvote.
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So there have been a few people who haven't posted in the last 24 hours, but I'm not going to request prods.
I think Lekkit is the way to go today.
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I think Lekkit is the way to go today.
A good thing you're voting for him in that case.
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Oh and hi Lekkit! Have a day three pass.
Ha ha, this came back to bite me.
I think Lekkit is the way to go today.
A good thing you're voting for him in that case.
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Quote fail.
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I can go for vote: lekkit.
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I would obviously be sad if I'm lynched, but I can totally see why I'm up for consideration. Either way, don't lynch me until I've been able to post some proper reads. Or like wednesday If I haven't gotten to it by then.
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Dang, sorry, busy weekend :(
I'll do some more reading and stuff tomorrow when I've got some time.
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Reading is hard. Anyway, vote: Lekkit
PoE case is strong with this one.
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That's L-1.
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Vote Count 3.2
The cake is a lie.
RR (1): Awaclus
Lekkit (4): SS, faust, chairs, 2.7 (L-1)
Awaclus (1): RR
Not Voting (3): Ampharos, Lekkit, WW
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Day 3 will end at 10am on the 27th of February, forum time.
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I can smell a flawless victory!
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I can smell a flawless victory!
Sure, we just need to lynch RR.
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I can smell a flawless victory!
I guess you're sure enough to keep me at L-1 while I do my reread for final thoughts.
Let me give you a hint. Lynching me won't make a flawless victory. Hopefully it will still give us a victory in the future.
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I can smell a flawless victory!
Sure, we just need to lynch RR.
Remind me what it was, again, that gave RR away in your eyes.
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I can smell a flawless victory!
Sure, we just need to lynch RR.
Remind me what it was, again, that gave RR away in your eyes.
The fact that he's scum.
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vote: Awaclus
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(http://i.imgur.com/i9Z4egW.gif)
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So, here's the thing.
It's one thing to say 'because he's scum' at the question 'why do you think he's scum?' It is another thing to answer the same thing at 'what gave him away'. His alignment can't give him away, because his alignment is hidden.
Plus-- what Awaclus does here makes so much sense for scum!him. Refuse the Lekkit lynch - he'll get lynched anyway - that buys him towncred. And I don't feel so fuzzy anymore about the Lekkit thing.
I think I could lynch Awaclus instead.
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So, here's the thing.
It's one thing to say 'because he's scum' at the question 'why do you think he's scum?' It is another thing to answer the same thing at 'what gave him away'. His alignment can't give him away, because his alignment is hidden.
Plus-- what Awaclus does here makes so much sense for scum!him. Refuse the Lekkit lynch - he'll get lynched anyway - that buys him towncred. And I don't feel so fuzzy anymore about the Lekkit thing.
I think I could lynch Awaclus instead.
Awaclus is not too suspect based on his voting history. RR, Lekkit, even Amapharos are better lynches today, I think.
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but it'll feel better!
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and Ampharos isn't good because Teproc had this town slip.
and RR's play gives me towny vibes. Too self-destructive for scum!RR.
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I'm torn on Awaclus.
I instinctually want to lynch him since he plays so scummy, but there's also the "well he can't possibly be scum playing like that" but then of course he could be because it's all WIFOM. So then I want to lynch him because it's so confusing, but that seems like voting for someone just because of their playstyle which is lazy.
Oh well.
Vote: Awaclus
As for Lekkit, I wrote 18 days ago in my QT that he seems town. I'm trusting the me of 18 days ago.
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scum!Awaclus does play horrendously anti-town. I think more so than town!Awaclus.
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and Ampharos isn't good because Teproc had this town slip.
and RR's play gives me towny vibes. Too self-destructive for scum!RR.
Self-destructive play can also be resigned!scum!RR.
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It's one thing to say 'because he's scum' at the question 'why do you think he's scum?' It is another thing to answer the same thing at 'what gave him away'. His alignment can't give him away, because his alignment is hidden.
By now, you should know that I don't share the reasoning behind my reads because I don't think it's pro-town to do so. If you don't want "because he's scum" as the answer, don't ask the question because that's the only answer you'll ever get in any game regardless of my alignment.
Plus-- what Awaclus does here makes so much sense for scum!him. Refuse the Lekkit lynch - he'll get lynched anyway - that buys him towncred. And I don't feel so fuzzy anymore about the Lekkit thing.
It's an exercise in futility to discuss what makes sense for scum!me because you know with 100% certainty that I'm town.
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and Ampharos isn't good because Teproc had this town slip.
and RR's play gives me towny vibes. Too self-destructive for scum!RR.
Self-destructive play can also be resigned!scum!RR.
is it really? I remember him giving grand speeches about his towniness as scum.
It's an exercise in futility to discuss what makes sense for scum!me because you know with 100% certainty that I'm town.
I do not.
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ADK is certainly not going to fake claim without checking that he can't be counterclaimed.
I don't see how this is going unnoticed while Teproc (Ampharos) was apparently town for his euqally towny slip.
What makes Hydrad a better choice than Awaclus ? Or anyone else who isn't ADK for that matter, why are these options bad ?
A hydrad interaction worth mentioning.
Hm, ok
Vote: yuma
You said yourself in recent game that you was mislynched once. Now you say that you are easy to be manipulated into self destruction?
This was when yuma (e) was taking a lot of heat. This doesn't look like a bus to me.
RR jumping on the silverspawn wagon feels like town to me. I still like egork as scum, but we can lynch him later. I an not convinced about gkrieg. What is the case on him?
This paired with:
Vote: Hydrad
Followed by the Egor lynch makes me think it's so unlikely he's scum that I think you shouldn't like ever lynch him this game.
Unvote
No derphammers.
Can anyone counterclaim anything?
Or do we not want to counterclaim, as that gives scum more info?
This is right after Hydrad's claim. Seems towny and and all.
No, I mean would we rather counterclaim or lynch Hydrad without a counterclaim?
Then this happens. I don't know if this makes him confused town or cautios scum. Had it not been for his continued suspicion of ADK, I think this would definately come across as scummy.
Not lynching:
ADK, Hydrad, 2.7
This is another weird one. This is two hours after Hydrad's claim. And he seems certain there will be no counterclaim. Maybe he was just excited? The thing is. Him pushing both the Hydrad and Egor wagons... That's some ballsy move for scum. And it makes me really think he's town. But something that should be noted, should this game go much further and he's still in it.
I have to take a break for now as I'm off work. I'm honestly a bit disappointed that it's not more that's standing out to me, but whatever. For my own reference or anyone interested: I'm at post #812.
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It's an exercise in futility to discuss what makes sense for scum!me because you know with 100% certainty that I'm town.
I do not.
You do, my alignment was confirmed by the mod here:
A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
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It's an exercise in futility to discuss what makes sense for scum!me because you know with 100% certainty that I'm town.
I do not.
You do, my alignment was confirmed by the mod here:
A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
Seriously stop it.
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In other news, I'm happy to lynch Awaclus.
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In other news, I'm happy to lynch an IC.
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ah, that thing. I forgot that was this game.
hm... uhm, huh, hum...
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In other news, I'm happy to lynch an annoying troll
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It's an exercise in futility to discuss what makes sense for scum!me because you know with 100% certainty that I'm town.
I do not.
You do, my alignment was confirmed by the mod here:
A rule clarification I forgot to include in the original ruleset: quoting (or fake quoting) from personal QTs is fine as long as any and all communication to or from the mods is removed. Run anything you're not sure about past the mods first.
Posting from any shared QTs is obviously forbidden.
Seriously stop it.
I will stop it as soon as you stop wasting time on obvtown lynches when we can just lynch RR and win immediately.
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In other news, I'm happy to lynch an annoying troll
Oh yeah let's lynch people WW doesn't personally like because that's more important than winning the game!
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I wonder how personally offensive I have to get to get modkilled.
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I give Awaclus a bit of town cred for that, but not that much and I'm okay with lynching him based on principle, too.
or, how about this. Quote your QT, since that makes you IC'ish.
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I wonder how personally offensive I have to get to get modkilled.
you could start by actually voting for Awaclus.
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I wonder how personally offensive I have to get to get modkilled.
you could start by actually voting for Awaclus.
I doubt he'll be lynched today. But standing promise, if you can get him to L-1 I'll instahammer.
-
I give Awaclus a bit of town cred for that, but not that much and I'm okay with lynching him based on principle, too.
or, how about this. Quote your QT, since that makes you IC'ish.
This is the entirety of my QT, excluding posts by the mod:
/confirm
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I give Awaclus a bit of town cred for that, but not that much and I'm okay with lynching him based on principle, too.
or, how about this. Quote your QT, since that makes you IC'ish.
This is the entirety of my QT, excluding posts by the mod:
/confirm
can you see how that makes things problematic?
-
Of course he does.
He's just trolling and being massively anti-town.
-
I really think he's not trolling. If it's scum, he's being manipulative, and if he's town, then he's misguided.
-
can you see how that makes things problematic?
I think it's a pretty towny QT coming from me. For reference, here's my RMM30 QT where I was a strong PR: http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/znPBywwACWwft
Of course he does.
He's just trolling and being massively anti-town.
How is this anti-town? In case you haven't noticed, it's in town's best interests to win the game.
I really think he's not trolling. If it's scum, he's being manipulative, and if he's town, then he's misguided.
About what? I think Haddock makes it pretty clear that direct quoting of QTs is allowed in this game.
-
You can't tell me he's not trolling after that post.
"In case you haven't noticed, it's in town's best interest to win the game."
My vote will be on Awaclus and will stay there every day until he's lynched until further notice.
-
You can't tell me he's not trolling after that post.
"In case you haven't noticed, it's in town's best interest to win the game."
My vote will be on Awaclus and will stay there every day until he's lynched until further notice.
He can tell you he's not, because he's a troll.
-
since you don't even post in the QT, obtiously scum!you has no problems playing this game. Hence your big defense is null. You don't have to put several hours of effort into it, you have to put zero effort into it.
-
and also you lied. lynch all liars.
-
Seriously guys... I even liked it better when you were lynching me. Stop bickering and try something productive!
-
I don't think Awaclus is scum.
I do think he's treading the edge of playing against what I consider the "spirit of the rules" here.
-
Specifically I think he's treading the edge of the golden rule: "Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun"
-
Specifically I think he's treading the edge of the golden rule: "Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun"
And of course it's me who's getting personal when everyone else is calling me a troll.
since you don't even post in the QT, obtiously scum!you has no problems playing this game. Hence your big defense is null. You don't have to put several hours of effort into it, you have to put zero effort into it.
See, now you're lynching me because of the contents of my QT (or lack of thereof). Hence my big defense is exactly valid.
and also you lied. lynch all liars.
When?
-
I was thinking of the focus on fun.
-
I was thinking of the focus on fun.
I can't have fun unless I can focus on winning at all costs.
-
Seriously guys... I even liked it better when you were lynching me. Stop bickering and try something productive!
Okay, vote: Lekkit
I think town!Lekkit supports the Awaclus lynch more likely than scum!Lekkit.
-
So back to L-1. Let's lynch lekkit real quick then after we are all sad when he flips town or happy when he flips scum we can learn more stuff.
-
Vote: Lekkit
-
So back to L-1. Let's lynch lekkit real quick then after we are all sad when he flips town or happy when he flips scum we can learn more stuff.
I'd love to but I can't.
-
okay, that was a hammer. I'm fine with it.
-
Final Day 3 Vote Count
Confucious say: When one does not have time to find a decent proverb about food, simply come up with a random sentence and prefix it with "Confucious say".
RR (1): Awaclus
Lekkit (5): faust, chairs, 2.7, SS, WW
Awaclus (2): RR, Ampharos
Not Voting (1): Lekkit
With 9 players alive, it took 5 to lynch.
It is still twilight.
-
So, Lekkit, are you scum?
-
dot dot dot
-
dot dot dot dot dottie?
I think yes, that's because the final posts is taking so long?
-
It is still twilight.[/color]
That's so nice.
-
Thread Locked!
-
Day 3 End
Final Vote Count:
RR (1): Awaclus
Lekkit (5): faust, chairs, 2.7, SS, WW
Awaclus (2): RR, Ampharos
Not Voting (1): Lekkit
With 9 players alive, it took 5 to lynch.
As their numbers dwindled, the sentient sweets were becoming increasingly volatile and violent. Perhaps the gory pieces of sponge and chocolatey ooze everywhere were inspiring their inner demons - it didn't take long after the destruction of the delicious apple cake for a mob to form.
This time the victim was a simple soul, who had been getting on fairly nicely with everyone up until then. He did, however, have a blue star etched onto his surface, which all of the cakes found highly suspicious. In their paranoid state, that was more than enough to get the cakes riled up - before long the poor innocent teacake found himself joining the evergrowing pile of squished-up crumbs on the floor.
Matt simply commented on the pleasant smell emanating from the corpse, but Rick, being an innocent 14 year old and never having seen such a mob mentality before, blacked out immediately. Matt, usually of a strong constitution, hated seeing people falling over - he blacked out too.
Lekkit has been lynched! He was a Vanilla Teacake.
Night 3 begins now and will last 48 hours. Night actions due in 36 hours.
-
I apologise wholeheartedly for the delay. I will start it as soon as I can get to a computer. Unless ash wants to do the honours, and I'll flavour later?
-
Day 4 Start
They came to slowly, taking absolutely FOREVER to get their act together and get moving again. By the time they were EVENTUALLY fully conscious again, it became clear that in their absence, once again, something terrible had happened. Another of the delicious cakes was gone! Torn apart on the floor next to his brother-in-flavour, lay yet another vanilla-smelling treat.
Any of the joviality that had remained between the boys and the cakes was gone. A tense silence dominated the room, as the seven remaining cakes spread as far apart from one another as possible, staring across the now-seemingly vast wooden table.
Who would be next?
faust died during the night. He was a Vanilla Teacake.
-
Vote Count 4.0
Not Voting (7): 2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus, chairs, RR, SS, WW
With 7 players alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
Day 4 begins now and will end at 6pm on the 4th of March, forum time.
Thread unlocked!
-
finally!
-
Fooey. I wanted a cheap win.
-
so faust is dead. mh, i guess that was to be expected.
Now we have three tries, I think, to find the last scum? That almost means that finding town is more important than finding scum.
-
So chairs is our IC, that means scum is one of {2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus, RR, WW}
I'd say RR > 2.7 = Awaclus > Ampharos > WW for now
vote: RR
although RR was not on the mislynch. 2.7 was. vote: e
-
Doot doot I'm still alive. But who shouldn't be?
Oh yeah, SS is scummy.
Vote: SS
When you stop pushing mislynches you'll get town points back.
-
Um... I don't think e can reasonably be scum here.. he pushed Hydrad and Egor, right?
-
I say drop SS and go from there. Eh?
-
Um... I don't think e can reasonably be scum here.. he pushed Hydrad and Egor, right?
oh, did he? Vote: RR
-
Yeah. I am totally an IC based on D1/D2. D3 want my best ever, but take a serious look at the first two days and tell me that I am scum
-
okay more seriously, the Egork wagon is probably a more solid piece of evidence than the Lekkit wagon. Scum could easily have stayed off that. Egork though, that's bussing your last partner. Pretty harsh.
Egor (6): WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
So, who is off that? Ampharos and RR. Ampharos would be the scummier one of the two, but he had that townslip...
-
Ampharos has notably been on none of the three wagons so far.
-
okay more seriously, the Egork wagon is probably a more solid piece of evidence than the Lekkit wagon. Scum could easily have stayed off that. Egork though, that's bussing your last partner. Pretty harsh.
Egor (6): WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
So, who is off that? Ampharos and RR. Ampharos would be the scummier one of the two, but he had that townslip...
What was his townslip?
And I'd like to point out that I was only off-wagon because I gave Lekkit a Day Three pass.
-
...
-
vote: ampharos
Can a town slip be faked? I think so.
-
vote: ampharos
Can a town slip be faked? I think so.
What even was his town slip?
-
Vote: RR
Yeah, it's very hard to see e as scum here.
-
Vote Count 4.1
You can tell a lot about a fellow’s character by his way of eating jelly beans.
RR (2): Awaclus, SS
Ampharos (1): chairs
SS (1): RR
Not Voting (7): 2.7, Ampharos, WW
With 7 players alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
Day 4 will end at 6pm on the 4th of March, forum time.
-
Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
This comment from D1 is the townslip in question for Teprocpharos.
-
I still don't buy this is a townslip.
-
Sorry, I am being extremely lazy about this game after lynching scum D1/D2.
And scum loves it. They will let this game lurk into an abyss where we just randomly lynch people like we did yesterday. Granted, we still have a pretty decent shot of winning (scum still needs 3 mislynches), but lets put some effort in and lynch scum and win
-
/Unlurk
We need to realize that RR is at L-2 and derphammers are bad. Actually, hammering RR in general would be bad. I have my fake claim claim lined up and everything.
-
I'm being lazy too, so I apologize for that. Let's not rush today.
-
I kind of wanted to get lucky and finish this game without doing work, which is why I hammered Lekkit. That and I felt we'd have to consider him pretty hard anyway, so it's good to know.
-
I honestly think a mass claim would kick start this game again nicely.
Wait, I should probably look to see if we have already done this and/or what the setup is
-
Haha, that's right. We know the setup. Nevermind
-
mhhh still like RR better than Amph
-
I remember reading RR and thinking he was town. I think based on his reaction to the whole fruit vendor thing.
But like I said back then, lynching RR is always good fun
-
I think I may prefer Awaclus right now. But I would have to reread to confirm that
-
Oh hey, the day started. That means
Vote: Awaclus
-
Everyone else is townie, so why not. Also his Awaclus vote is lazy and unconsequential.
Of note: I originaly took this to be a reason for Teproc voting for Hydrad, but actually this came after the vote:
I guess the "faust is obvious part" is that you don't lynch faust on day 1 ?
I have no such qualms, but I get that. Actually I think I agree... not about never lycnhing faust d1, but about this :
vote: Hydrad
Later:
Vote: awaclus
Then Teproc is responding to this:
Can anyone provide case on him?
-
I just thought of this... Ampharos, did you get access to Teproc's QT when he subbed in?
-
Hydrad/RR are scumbuddies, calling it right now.
RR's response:
Hydrad/RR are scumbuddies, calling it right now.
Nice meme.
Otherwise ignored by Egor/Hydrad.
-
Also:
The fact that nothing appears to be happening should indicate scum is lurking right ?
I wonder who that might point us towards...
Hydrad and RR?
Yeah, I'm such a lurker.
I'm pretty much a lurker though. but ya interesting that he would say you.
If we really wanted a lurker team...
oh man actually theres a decent amount this game.
me/awaclus/chairs/lekkit and egork I guess?
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I just thought of this... Ampharos, did you get access to Teproc's QT when he subbed in?
Yeppers
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He only talks about Yuma, Awaclus, and Faust, sorry.
-
Oh, and mentions Hydrad once.
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My reads are awesome:
I'm pretty sure what that all boils down to is:
Town: ADK, Lekkit
Null: Everyone
-
Oh, and mentions Hydrad once.
So you can just quote it, right? Like everything (non-mod-directed) that he said. Might as well do yours too.
-
Notes:
It's backwards. Whatever. Read it backwards.
It has sucky formatting. Whatever. You're all smart chaps, you can read it.
I post as Mychael for a while. Sorry about that - multiple sites using QT.
I removed some stuff Teproc says about other players. That's up to him to share and is between him and them. I don't think anything in there is game related though.
I think I got everything cleaned up so hopefully I don't get modkilled for this. Whatevs.
Ampharos
02-09-2016
08:26 AM ET (US)
Edit
Delete
Why is Hydrad always scum -.-
I can't read that dude haha. I suppose I should be happy about this haha.
Now I'm writing this with this like "zomg people are going to want me to post this later" feeling and it feels so fake. Whatevs.
HI MOM
30
Ampharos
02-08-2016
02:21 PM ET (US)
Ohhhh man ADK feels weird.
SS is still???? Is it bad that I don't even bother reading him?
29
Ampharos
02-04-2016
02:35 PM ET (US)
Caught up.
28
Ampharos
02-04-2016
02:35 PM ET (US)
gk scum calling it now
27
Ampharos
02-04-2016
02:33 PM ET (US)
Beautiful job by Awaclus talking about rules and distracting everyone. Very very scummy.
26
Ampharos
02-04-2016
02:31 PM ET (US)
Lekkit dude seems town.
25
Ampharos
02-04-2016
02:29 PM ET (US)
AAAaaaand posted all those as Mychael. Man. Two different sites using QTs makes for funsies.
24
Mychael
02-04-2016
02:29 PM ET (US)
And then he immediately spams... lol.
23
Mychael
02-04-2016
02:28 PM ET (US)
Town WW doesn't really make long posts like 267
22
Mychael
02-04-2016
02:17 PM ET (US)
Odd feeling about Chairs. Gotta watch him.
21
Mychael
02-04-2016
02:15 PM ET (US)
I just did that whole emotional rant thing in an off site game. Tempted to buy it for now, but really don't want to.
20
Mychael
02-04-2016
02:13 PM ET (US)
Yuma is hyper aggressive. Kind of hard seeing scum playing like that, but it's a bit different than last game.
19
Mychael
02-04-2016
02:11 PM ET (US)
Noticing huge difference in Faust's flavor. Read him successfully last game - feeling town here.
-------------
15-18 Talking to mod/mod talking
-------------
-------------
14 Redacted for Teproc's sake
-------------
13
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-03-2016
08:37 PM ET (US)
I mean I can't blame faust for what he's doing. Just because yuma is going to react very badly to it, doesn't mean that it isn't valid.
-------------
Part of 13 redacted for Teproc's sake
-------------
I see how yuma can (and will) perceive this as purposefuly trying to push his buttons. And hey, maybe that's what faust's doing, if he's scum. But the problem is : he would do this as town too, because it's not that unreasonable a case...
12
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-03-2016
08:33 PM ET (US)
This is going to be a fun day 1...
11
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-03-2016
08:11 PM ET (US)
yuma might /out. I don't know what it is, but he seems really frustrated with mafia and f.ds in general recently.
10
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-03-2016
07:19 PM ET (US)
Not sure what's going on in this game. Nothing is happening, basically. I guess it makes Hydrad more likely to be scum.
9
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-03-2016
07:18 PM ET (US)
faust's comments on yuma are going to go over great I'm sure.
...
8
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-02-2016
07:28 AM ET (US)
For the record I think faust was referring to me with the "passive-agressiveness" comment, or both of us, but not specifically yuma.
-------------
Part of 8 redacted for Teproc's sake
-------------
I'm not actually convinced this is town!yuma... The thing is, town!yuma suspects me. I'm sure there's an exception, but I have a hard time thinking of a game where yuma was town and didn't suspect me more than the rest of town did (regardless of my alignment). scum!yuma is, I think, slightly more likely to get into big arguments though, so I don't know. Slightly leaning town, but not as much as it might appear from the thread.
7
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-01-2016
07:34 PM ET (US)
Yeah, I've basically claimed VT at this point. People sometimes overestimate my ability to WIFOM, so a scum team that does not have faust or WW might think I'm WIFOMing, but that's not my strong suit and those guys know it. ADK too, though he could be paranoid about me because of Pony-Pony Mafia.
6
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-01-2016
07:29 PM ET (US)
Aaaand this is why we have QTs. That was not great, and I get why faust suspects me for it, I really shouldn't be doing dumb stuff like that.
5
TeprocPerson was signed in when posted
02-01-2016
07:23 PM ET (US)
Slightly scared I got the setup wrong which would be kind of a VT-slip.
But I don't think I did ? I think faust is being non-literal about the "safe claim" thing.
---------
1-4 Talking to mod/mod talking
---------
-
And yes, I haven't posted anything in there since the 9th.
-
vote:rr
-
Was Ampharos online February 26, 2016, 02:31:21 pm?
-
Yes - I spent the time between then and my post making sure the QT was clean of mod interactions and removing some stuff of Teprocs for reasons already stated.
Oh and answering the phone a couple times at work.
-
Hmm, I guess that's pretty reasonable.
-
I'm still slightly suspicious of Teproc's comments, moreso than Ampharos'. But on the other hand, Teproc isn't a huge fabrication guy.
RR seems pretty reasonable.
-
That vote I made is probably l1
-
vote:rr
Wrong format! Doesn't count!
-
vote:rr
Wrong format! Doesn't count!
Hammer: RR
-
yeah, amph is town.
-
Amph is town, RR is town, I am town, chairs is town....
That leaves WW, silverspawn, and Awaclus
Didn't I do this earlier some day?
vote: WW
I will more thoroughly defend RR later today, thus proving by irrefutable PoE that WW is scum
-
It's not me.. look at my Egor votes all game. It is not a bus.
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Yeah, out of WW, silverspawn and Awaclus, I'm inclined to believe the last scum is RR.
-
It's not me.. look at my Egor votes all game. It is not a bus.
ok, yeah. You were voting EgorK D1, then hammered Hydrad (after claim, no town points given), but then you were on EgorK D2, so fine. You can be town.
Although I was going to do this super awesome quote thing had you not been voting EgorK D2. It would have been fabulous. I guess I will still do it.
It didn't really seem too suspicious to me until I read Ampharos (after reading Teproc). Ampharos doesn't do a lot of note and doesn't do anything regarding Hydrad.
If "not doing anything of note" is your metirc for finding scum, you should be voting for Egor.
I'm pretty sure I wanted to lynch him on Day 1, and no one else did~
And Hydrad is a common D1 mislynch, so some people are motivated to look elsewhere.
I will say that this is a bad argument. One could also say that I am a "safe bus" because I never get lynched D1. So then everyone is a safe bus, the people who are often lynched and those whose a rarely lynched. Except... a bus is not safe.
Thing is it's safe when it's the beginning of Day 1.
Which is the argument I would have used....except it is invalid since you were part of EgorK's lynch D2. Oh well, on to my next lynch candidate
unvote
-
You know what? After rereading silverspawn, I am inclined to go vote: silverspawn
And, ok. I will now go back and reread RR to see if I think he could be scum (doubt it).
-
You know what? After rereading silverspawn, I am inclined to go vote: silverspawn
And, ok. I will now go back and reread RR to see if I think he could be scum (doubt it).
didn't you do that before and then you realized that you were wrong ?
I would be happy to tell you why you're wrong, but I can't seem to respond to all the reasons you gave me.
-
no, no, no. I realized I was wrong about WW, not about you.
Anyway, I will go back and post an actual case about silverspawn here shortly, but I reread RR and he seems very consistently town to me. Granted, he unvoted both Hydrad and EgorK when they got to L-1....
But consistency, man. He is town. I feel it in my gut. Same way silverspawn is scum. Trust me on this one.
-
(and don't look up my stats for correct lynches. Numbers lie! Just because I lynch town way more frequently than I lynch scum doesn't mean anything!)
-
Trust me on this one.
But you're wrong.
-
If it's not RR, it has to be Awaclus.
-
Numbers lie!
You are a number. Does that mean you're lying?
-
Trust me on this one.
But you're wrong.
But I am right. Observe:
silverspawn had a very exciting D1. So exciting that he voted for Hydrad 3 times.
First Hydrad Vote (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564933#msg564933): He accidentally votes ADK (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564930#msg564930) after the fruit vendor claim. EgorK follows him on it, then he realizes his mistake and is uncomfortable with his partner voting the same as him so he swiftly votes for for his other partner, Hydrad (who EgorK does not follow onto). But, things get a bit too exciting when Teproc votes for Hydrad, so he quickly defends Hydrad and shortly thereafter votes for RR (observe the time stamps):
vote: Hydrad
really? hasn't he only made one post?
vote: RR
In the middle of all that (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg564939#msg564939) he gives huge town points to Teproc/Ampharos for the 'town slip' and then some sympathy town points to Awaclus. It is good to have a few accurate reads as scum.
Second Hydrad Vote (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565323#msg565323): Hydrad then makes a few bland posts (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565274#msg565274) all in a row ending in an Awaclus vote (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565277#msg565277), which silverspawn deems enough to revote back onto Hydrad. Again, another person (ADK) (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565359#msg565359) joins him voting for Hydrad, and all of a sudden Yuma makes more sense (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg565680#msg565680) than a Hydrad vote.
silverspawn then spends a lot of time focusing on RR (so at least he is consistent) and putting up Hydrad/RR (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566045#msg566045) as possibilities.
well, I'm still saying Hydrad or RR
Why Hydrad, Why RR?
RR is being ultra stubborn and anti town, and Hydrad is.... non-present as of now.
yeah, Hydrad or RR are the to-go lynches today. e is towny for this case.
Then we finally get:
Third Hydrad Vote: (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566591#msg566591) well, Hydrad is good. Even though the lack of motivation for an RR lynch makes me want to do him more
still vote: Hydrad
I think Hydrad is like hillary here. Not great, but popular, and probably the second best option.
But have no fear, it doesn't take him long to go back to who he really wants to vote.
I have trouble seeing scum!you switch from scum to town here, though. That just makes you look super bad once gkrieg gets lynched.
Can't we do sanders RR after all? For a better america lynch!
vote: RR
And then, he shows his true colors (that he has no interest whatsoever in lynching Hydrad):
vote: hydrad
err what? why hydrad?
He ignores my case on Hydrad, he also talks about getting RR to L-1 to force a claim out of him, as well as his previously being enamored with RR sharing or not sharing his QT.
Then we have this gem from the start of D2:
yay I'm alive
now vote: faust
this is completely and uttrerly ridiculous and I refuse to believe that it comes from town!faust.
I was advocating a hydrad lynch THE ENTIRE DAY. The only reason I was not voting for him is because I liked the RR lynch a bit more. I would have lynched him without hesitation had you not done it before I came back.
Now, while I was pursuing the lynch of SCUM the entire time, FAUST was pursuing a MISYLNCH the entire time - me.
It is absolutely out of character for faust to ignore all that and simply call my positino bad because I wasn't on the final wagon. town!faust doesn't do that.
So yes, you were advocating Hydrad's lynch all day....as long as it didn't get him lynched. I think a lot of the early votes were pressure votes to get him more involved, then the later votes were for consistency. Also, the whole "yay I'm alive" routine is hilarious considering the ICs that existed (myself and ADK).
Had silverspawn REALLY been for a Hydrad lynch he would have at least given some thought to my case or something, but instead he doubles down on his RR tunnel.
I mean, sure, D2 silverspawn was on the EgorK wagon. He even put it at L-1. Good for him. Guess what that did? It set him up to make this post and keep him out of the red:
Day 1 wagon: gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
Day 2 wagon: WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
Based on that we have (of the players remaining in our lynchpool):
chairs, 2.7, WW
RR, silver, Awaclus
Lekkit, Ampharos
Which, I love that post. I think it sheds some great light on who could be scum. I also think silverspawn did a masterful D1 bussing of Hydrad, then when he despaired of EgorK he ended up putting him at L-1. He also was very quick to accept Teproc's townslip, and just other random little things.
Anyway, I like my silverspawn vote.
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and just other random little things.
Like being on-wagon with Lekkit
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Vote Count 4.e
RR (3): Awaclus, SS, chairs
SS (2): RR, 2.7
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Not Voting (1): WW
Takes 4 to lynch
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I mean, I had Hydrad as my second favorite lynch the whole time. The quote where I asked 'what? Why Hydrad' was because it came out of nowhere - you had not expressed suspicion on him before.
Your case basically comes down to me pushing Hydrad but not being on his lynch, but wouldn't scum be more likely to make sure to actually be on the wagon, not less? I pushed Hydrad, which is bad for him, without being off wagon, which is bad for me. And do you think I expected the quick lynch? I would have gone back to him in order to get the lynch through hadn't you done it without me.
And I don't even like bussing as scum.
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you had not expressed suspicion on him before.
or - maybe you did, but I thought you hadn't at that point.
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I really thought you'd have another reason, because what you're summarizing there is what I used to defend myself before. faust initially did the same, but came to his senses.
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I mean, I had Hydrad as my second favorite lynch the whole time. The quote where I asked 'what? Why Hydrad' was because it came out of nowhere - you had not expressed suspicion on him before.
Your case basically comes down to me pushing Hydrad but not being on his lynch, but wouldn't scum be more likely to make sure to actually be on the wagon, not less? I pushed Hydrad, which is bad for him, without being off wagon, which is bad for me. And do you think I expected the quick lynch? I would have gone back to him in order to get the lynch through hadn't you done it without me.
And I don't even like bussing as scum.
Scum doesn't lynch their partner D1. Well, not entirely true. But, like, a D1 scum lynch is SO bad for scum. And yeah, obviously you would go back to someone to get a lynch in. I would have voted RR D1 to get a lynch in. That is what town does. No-lynches are terrible D1.
And as I hope I demonstrated (please, everyone go back and reread for yourselves), you talked a lot about Hydrad and you 'pushed' him, sure, but never to the point where he was a real lynch candidate. When that happened you were nowhere to be seen
And you don't like bussing. Great. That doesn't mean you didn't do it this game.
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I really thought you'd have another reason, because what you're summarizing there is what I used to defend myself before. faust initially did the same, but came to his senses.
I know, it was a masterful bus. Great town-cred for you.
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I really don't think I would try the 'vote but do it in such a way that he won't be lynched' thing. I've never done that. I always do the 'do what's natural thing' when I'm scum.
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and Idk why you're calling it masterful. Given that the whole point of that plan would be to bus hydrad without getting him lynched, but he ended up getting lynched - wouldn't it be rather poor play, or at least unsuccessful?
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But I mean, take a serious look at RR. Does this really happen?
Vote: Hydrad
Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?
no.
Just no.
Sure my case on silverspawn isn't the most amazing case you have ever seen. But it beats the "RR has acted scummy all game" case.
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what about Awaclus?
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Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?
Yes.
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and Idk why you're calling it masterful. Given that the whole point of that plan would be to bus hydrad without getting him lynched, but he ended up getting lynched - wouldn't it be rather poor play, or at least unsuccessful?
Yeah, obviously it was unsuccessful from your perspective. But it did accomplish its purpose. Plus, you were never really voting Hydrad when it mattered.
And Hydrad is a common D1 mislynch, so some people are motivated to look elsewhere.
I will say that this is a bad argument. One could also say that I am a "safe bus" because I never get lynched D1. So then everyone is a safe bus, the people who are often lynched and those whose a rarely lynched. Except... a bus is not safe.
Thing is it's safe when it's the beginning of Day 1.
The biggest wagon on Hydrad that you were on had 4 people. Still super safe for D1. Then you got off that wagon and Hydrad went back down to two people before spiking back up for the lynch.
Hydrad was never in any trouble until the very end. And at the end, you were having fun on your little RR diversion.
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I don't know how self-aware Awaclus is, but it's a safe play for him to blindly push RR the entire game. Everyone just gives him Awaclus points for it, and even if RR gets mislynched, he wouldn't get too much scrunity.
Or it could also just be RR and Awaclus is right. I'm not sure if the L-2 is unreasonable as a scum play.
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Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?
Yes.
No evidence of that.
First scum game: nowhere to be seen on the lynch (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14209.msg542020#msg542020) D1, then got himself lynched D2.
Second scum game: No bussing on either of his partners' lynches (first one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14493.msg560601#msg560601), second one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14493.msg562183#msg562183))
So yeah. I don't think RR busses there. Not on D1.
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I don't know how self-aware Awaclus is
Pretty self-aware.
Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?
Yes.
No evidence of that.
First scum game: nowhere to be seen on the lynch (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14209.msg542020#msg542020) D1, then got himself lynched D2.
Second scum game: No bussing on either of his partners' lynches (first one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14493.msg560601#msg560601), second one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14493.msg562183#msg562183))
So yeah. I don't think RR busses there. Not on D1.
RR does crazy stuff as both alignments, and he's self-aware enough to start bussing now that he hasn't done it in the past.
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yeah, but I don't think that is him this game
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what about Awaclus?
@e
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there's also the thing that even town!Awaclus might explain his reasons at this point. There is only one scum left; if he's right, then all that matters is convincing us that RR is in fact scum. RR knowing his reasons wouldn't help him one bit.
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I think you mean scum!awaclus in that last post. But I think Awaclus has been more annoying than scummy this game.
I would totally lynch him though.
I think I am at:
silverspawn > Awaclus > Ampharos > RR > WW > chairs > 2.7
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well, maybe you did mean, town!awaclus. Because you were just not including yourself in the count and with ICs he only has RR as an option to vote for.
Which makes sense.
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there's also the thing that even town!Awaclus might explain his reasons at this point. There is only one scum left; if he's right, then all that matters is convincing us that RR is in fact scum. RR knowing his reasons wouldn't help him one bit.
The main point about this is to make the suspected scum not change his behavior because of my reasons. It makes it easier for me to continue reading them.
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there's also the thing that even town!Awaclus might explain his reasons at this point. There is only one scum left; if he's right, then all that matters is convincing us that RR is in fact scum. RR knowing his reasons wouldn't help him one bit.
The main point about this is to make the suspected scum not change his behavior because of my reasons. It makes it easier for me to continue reading them.
but harder for the rest of us....? This post makes no sense. Your opinion by itself is pointless unless you convince others to your side.
We have no reason to believe your opinion unless you share your reasons. And also, a change in scum behavior would implicate them, so that also makes no sense that you wouldn't share since you could find scum because they changed behavior
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Where is the rest of town? chairs, you should totally switch to silverspawn. WW also.
Then we can go ahead and lynch RR tomorrow if I am wrong.
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And Awaclus at lylo
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Actually, who am I kidding. I probably won't vote RR tomorrow even if I am wrong about silverspawn
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but harder for the rest of us....?
No, easier for the rest of you as well.
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but harder for the rest of us....?
No, easier for the rest of you as well.
Because we should all innately trust you because your reads are flawless because you have the perfect system. Got it.
Personally, I find it easier to convince myself someone is scum when I see some good reasons as to why that person is scum
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Personally, I find it easier to convince myself someone is scum when I see some good reasons as to why that person is scum
Which is why I'm letting RR himself present them.
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I did mean town!Awaclus - the point was that I think town!Awaclus would probably, or at least possibly, have explained reasons already.
His latest post doesn't make sense. you are already convinced that he's scum. It doesn't matter if he changes his behavior. What matters is that you convince us
(not that mention that putting your future reads above the current lynch would be tremendously arrogant)
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you are already convinced that he's scum.
How do you know that?
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gaah vote: Awaclus
you're being purposefully stubborn. last time I thought that you were scum.
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gaah vote: Awaclus
you're being purposefully stubborn. last time I thought that you were scum.
>start a discussion, knowing well how the other party is going to reply
>he replies exactly how you expected
>that's suddenly a reason to vote for him
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yeah, silverspawn needs 3 mislynches to win.
Awaclus, RR, and....yeah, its going to be tough. Totally gets MVP if he wins as scum
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Ampharos. That's who his third mislynch target will be.
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yeah, silverspawn needs 3 mislynches to win.
Awaclus, RR, and....yeah, its going to be tough. Totally gets MVP if he wins as scum
do I also get MVP if I win as town?
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You know what? After rereading silverspawn, I am inclined to go vote: silverspawn
And, ok. I will now go back and reread RR to see if I think he could be scum (doubt it).
Problem is SS's Hydrad treatment doesn't seem like a bus to me.
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Okay, I guess you guys talked about it. I had trouble seeing scum! SS from Day 1
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@WW, so who do you think is scum from today's candidates (Roadrunner, silverspawn, Awaclus)
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@WW, so who do you think is scum from today's candidates (Roadrunner, silverspawn, Awaclus)
I'm going
RR > Awaclus > Silver
My confidence is not strong.
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I'm kind of at RR > Silver > Awaclus... but again, confidence levels are not terribly high.
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Awaclus = RR > Ampharos > e
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Can someone please write up a post as to why Roadrunner is such a great lynch?
Or at least describe why my reasons behind thinking RR is town are flawed.
I just don't see why there is so much momentum in the RR lynch.
Also, lurkers (I know I was one of them) need to post more
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Day 1 End
Final Vote Count:
2.7 (1): EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (1): Lekkit
RR (2): SS, Awaclus
Hydrad (7): gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Day 2 End
Final Vote Count:
RR (1): Lekkit
chairs (2): Ampharos, ADK
Egor (6): WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
SS (1): EgorK
Not Voting (1): RR
Day 3 End
Final Vote Count:
RR (1): Awaclus
Lekkit (5): faust, chairs, 2.7, SS, WW
Awaclus (2): RR, Ampharos
Not Voting (1): Lekkit
I went ahead and highlighted WW and myself green because we are IC!buddies because of our voting record.
In my opinion, the entirety of a 'good' case on RR is that he was off-wagon D2. I mean, sure, that is enough reason at this point to vote someone, but there is so much more that points to him not being scum. RR was also not on that Lekkit wagon, so sure, Lekkit was a super easy mislynch and he could have easily stayed off intentionally and the lynch still goes through, but I think not.
Then we have the positives for silverspawn and Awaclus that they are not bold enough to bus their final partner. I say that they are. Other than that, both silverspawn and Awaclus were voting RR D1. silverspawn was on the Lekkit wagon where Awaclus was not.
Ampharos is kind of just there, we need more action from him, but he seems like town to me.
I mean, voting records aren't conclusive, but I tend toward silverspawn as scummier than Awaclus. Roadrunner does have a pretty scummy voting record, but yeah. I still think RR is town. You guys can lynch him without me, cool. I just find silverspawn scummier overall.
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case against RR?
- hasn't shared his QT yet. Even though he posts a lot there.
- not on the day 2 wagon
- doesn't give me town vibes. town!RR does give me town vies. Not as much as he used to, but he still does
- all over the place in a style that's easy to fake
you know those points are actually better than those against Awaclus. back to vote: RR
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After the review e just gave, I'm feeling pretty vote: ampharos.
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After the review e just gave, I'm feeling pretty vote: ampharos.
?
why is that?
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That's the hammer.
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That's the hammer.
Lies.
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Is that all you have to say for yourself?
Maybe I can vote for you after all.....
Anyway, sleep time.
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Vote Count 4.2
Time is an illusion. Lunchtime, doubly so.
RR (2): Awaclus, SS
Ampharos (1): chairs
SS (2): RR, 2.7
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Not Voting (1): WW
With 7 players alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
CORRECTION: Day 4 will end at 6pm on the 3rd of March, forum time. (Because leap years are hard.)
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some people *cough*Ampharos*cough* have not posted in a very long while and should really think about voting for silverspawn
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I can't disagree with that - thinking about it is good. It should help you reach the only sensible conclusion.
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I could actually almost go for SS here, I just don't like how much RR is not doing anything.
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well, if you lynch me, you have a 4/1 scenario tomorrow, which isn't that bad. if you don't, we might win today, though, which is better
and - look. I was pushing Hydrad day 1, no matter what e says, that's a towny thing. I wouldn't do that as scum. I was pushing err who was it whoever was the other scum on day 2. I was behind both scum lynches. This is silly.
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and the QT - notice that town!RR could probably clear himself rather easily if he wanted to - except he prob can't because he is not town!RR. It's just not good play to simply ignore that and pursue someone else.
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Vote: Roadrunner
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and the QT - notice that town!RR could probably clear himself rather easily if he wanted to - except he prob can't because he is not town!RR. It's just not good play to simply ignore that and pursue someone else.
Fine man, I got you.
But if I quote something I shouldn't, I blame you.
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and the QT - notice that town!RR could probably clear himself rather easily if he wanted to - except he prob can't because he is not town!RR. It's just not good play to simply ignore that and pursue someone else.
Fine man, I got you.
But if I quote something I shouldn't, I blame you.
Well, you don't have to bother posting it now that you've been editing it for 2 hours.
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and the QT - notice that town!RR could probably clear himself rather easily if he wanted to - except he prob can't because he is not town!RR. It's just not good play to simply ignore that and pursue someone else.
Fine man, I got you.
But if I quote something I shouldn't, I blame you.
Well, you don't have to bother posting it now that you've been editing it for 2 hours.
Fair enough.
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Well, RR, sounds like you have no hope of winning left.
Which means you are in fact, despite my defense, scum.
I mean, had you tried just a little today it would have helped your case. But, that was no the case
Vote: RR
#hammerstats
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Okay. I guess I thought if I didn't defend myself I would get town points because it would be different and something I wouldn't do as scum.
But I was, in fact, town.
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SS, 2.7 and Ampahoros are my top scum reads in no particular order.
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Well, RR, sounds like you have no hope of winning left.
Which means you are in fact, despite my defense, scum.
I mean, had you tried just a little today it would have helped your case. But, that was no the case
Vote: RR
#hammerstats
See, even without me explaining my reasons, you could eventually convince yourself.
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But I was, in fact, town.
Damn, I guess he doesn't have much of a reason to lie here. Unless he's just trolling.
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SS, 2.7 and Ampahoros are my top scum reads in no particular order.
Could you explain the scum read on e? If not, I'm not really very inclined to take it into account tomorrow.
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Okay. I guess I thought if I didn't defend myself I would get town points because it would be different and something I wouldn't do as scum.
Well, as you can see, that failed. I would strongly advise against it in the future as well.
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SS, 2.7 and Ampahoros are my top scum reads in no particular order.
Could you explain the scum read on e? If not, I'm not really very inclined to take it into account tomorrow.
If not or if so?
But I will try to explain it. I really feel white-knighted, and despite his 'case for town RR' he still hammers me. I guess there's not an excellent case, but I'm feeling it.
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Town should just lynch Amaphoros and SS then go from there.
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It is more of the fact that even after I tried helping, even after I defended you AND made a case against someone else that you were also voting for, you totally flopped and quit on the game. Well, I know that isn't true, but the effort level was just not there.
Now I see that it was a different tactic that you were pursuing, so cool. But I just felt like scum!RR would feel like there was absolutely zero chance he survives today, let alone tomorrow, and might as well "fall on my own sword" type of thing.
So I went ahead and ended it. We weren't going anywhere without you putting up any fight at all.
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Town should just lynch Amaphoros and SS then go from there.
two more mislynches and we lose.....
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Town should just lynch Amaphoros and SS then go from there.
two more mislynches and we lose.....
Okay, nevermind. But lynch one of them!
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Day 4 Final Vote Count
Eats!
RR (4): Awaclus, SS, Witherweaver, 2.7
Ampharos (1): chairs
SS (1): RR
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Not Voting (0):
With 7 players alive, it took 4 to lynch.
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Bye, have a good time!
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Is it still twilight? The thread doesn't seem to be locked.
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My dying wish is that I get the speccy.
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Is it still twilight? The thread doesn't seem to be locked.
Yep.
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yeah, it is still twilight. Ash just posted the vote count to make it mod-official that the lynch happened. Probably letting Haddock do the flip and everything.
-
So let's think about how this game will impact future RR games. I won't try to do this again, but hopefully you guys will accept that RR isn't readable.
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So let's think about how this game will impact future RR games. I won't try to do this again, but hopefully you guys will accept that RR isn't readable.
yes, you are. I read you accurately this game up until the very end, when you changed up your play style significantly (the quiet RR).
But that is all meta that I don't care about for now. I am just concerned about lynching silverspawn tomorrow for the win.
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Being unreadable is not particularly great when you're town, because then we have to lynch you to figure out your alignment.
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if you are really town, then you should have posted your QT. Like, srsly.
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and I don't buy it until I see it. You have lied to being scum before when you were town, for which there was no reason at all, and which was even hurting your own faction.
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and I don't buy it until I see it. You have lied to being scum before when you were town, for which there was no reason at all, and which was even hurting your own faction.
Oh, well. Believe what you will, but that doesn't change the fact that you're scum.
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if I was scum, wouldn't I know that you're town?
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Thread Locked!
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Day 4 End
Final Vote Count:
RR (4): Awaclus, SS, Witherweaver, 2.7
Ampharos (1): chairs
SS (1): RR
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Not Voting (0):
With 7 players alive, it took 4 to lynch.
One of the cakes discovered he'd been sitting on something. He shifted, looked at it briefly, then picked it up.
"Look at this! It's some sort of card! Must be important. Look it even has a number in a gold circle in the bottom left! Says '4'. Cool. This is exciting!"
"Nah, that can't be important, observe the terrible art in the picture," replied another cake. "Can we get back to talking now?"
"Hey, I discovered the value of this card thing, don't you take that away from me!"
"Well, if you love it so much, go get it!"
With that, the naysayer grabbed the card thing, and threw it off the table. Without a second thought, the original speaker leapt after it and regathered it, letting out a triumphant yell before plummeting floorwards.
SPLODGE.
And that was that.
Matt stepped carefully forwards, and with thumb and forefinger extracted the Scout card from the wreckage. He wiped it briefly, then beckoned to his brother.
"We'd better put this back. It never does get used, being so terrible and all, but Mum would be furious if we didn't make sure the Dominion cards stayed properly organised."
And so once again the boys left the cakes to their plotting.
Roadrunner7671 has been lynched! He was a Vanilla Teacake.
Night 4 begins now and will last 48 hours. Night actions due in 36 hours.
-
I am considering shortening the night to 24 hours, 48 hours is ages. Any objections to this, PM me or put it in your QT and we will stick with the original schedule.
-
There being no objections...
-
Day 5 Start
Matt and Rick returned as quickly as they could from replacing the card; but hurry as they might, they were not fast enough to prevent another disaster. As they reentered the room, they discovered once again that a cake was gone from the table - torn apart and thrown around the room. Rick observed astutely that the new colors were speckled brown in some places, white in others, as if the murdered cake had had alternating layers of chocolate and vanilla flavours.
"I guess we shouldn't be surprised by this point," said Matt. "Come on then you lot, let's get this over with."
chairs died during the night. He was a Choco-Vanilla Layer Cake (Even-Night Tracker).
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Vote Count 5.0
Not Voting (5): 2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus, SS, WW
With 5 players alive, it takes 3 to lynch.
Day 5 begins now and will end at 6pm on the 8th of March, forum time.
Thread unlocked!
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For the record, I'm actually writing a QT now. It contains the explanations for things that I wouldn't otherwise explain, so I don't want to share it unless it comes down to that.
-
I was hoping scum would forget about chairs
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So, as I am sure everyone expects, I am all about silverspawn.
Not voting yet, going to reread some more and all. Ampharos really needs to provide some input today
-
Also to note: with chairs and RR dead, scum is almost definitely on wagon. Unless scum is ampharos
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as I am sure everyone expects, I'm all about not silverspawn.
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I think interactions with RR will be telling. I need to look back to see how faust/ampharos interacted. I don't really remember
-
So, silverspawn, who is scum today? Awaclus or ampharos?
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So, silverspawn, who is scum today? Awaclus or ampharos?
Awaclus >> Amph = you
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So, silverspawn, who is scum today? Awaclus or ampharos?
Awaclus >> Amph = you
What about WW?
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Oh there is WW in this game?
yeesh. Okay, put him after yourself.
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Yo yo I forgot about the game over the weekend and then it was night O_o
I'm here. I'm can see why you think I might be, but just go look at my play - I think it's not scummy as a whole. Add Teproc's stuff to it. Idk. Just go look.
Oh, also
Vote: Awaclus
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There is a me this game. I'm not really sure what's best here.
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I am really thinking silverspawn or Awaclus
Ampharos, why Awaclus?
meh, vote: silverspawn
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There is a me this game. I'm not really sure what's best here.
Witherweaver, lost in a sea of words, unable to find the answers he seeks.
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You know who faust consistently thought was scum? silverspawn
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didn't he realize he was wrong near the end?
-
Here is silverspawn's vote history:
1 Feb Awaclus
2 Feb ADK
2 Feb Hydrad
These were all mostly RVS.
2 Feb RR
3 Feb Hydrad
4 Feb yuma
4 Feb RR
5 Feb gkrieg
5 Feb RR
7 Feb Hydrad
8 Feb RR
9 Feb day ends
This is not "pushing Hydrad all day".
Hey, this is kind of like what I was saying yesterday.
-
So this is why Ampharos is town.
1. Teproc had a little townslip thing going on. See here:
Well Fruit Vendor only occurs if they have JOAT/Roleblocker or Rolecop/2-Shot Strongman...
So ... all the other ones. Right ?
I don't think it's likely to be a fakeclaim for reasons outlined above, but it's a "safe fakeclaim" in most setups.
No. Take, for instance, a setup where scum has JOAT/Goon. One of those setups has a Tracker, and one has a Commuter, both roles that cannot appear together with Fruit Vendor. So if scum were to claim Fruit Vendor, they would immediately get countered. You can go through all scenarios and see that there will always be the chance of a counterclaim.
Right, I'm dumb.
So scum certainly thinks about which fakeclaims are safe on N0. I guess not all scum do, but I'm confident that Teproc does. I just finished modding a game with Teproc, and we both thought scum should analyze the setup more. So assuming Teproc is scum, I am pretty sure that he knows that no fakeclaim is safe. Which means the above post can only be fabricated or come from town!Teproc. Teproc just doesn't seem like the guy that fabricates townslips.
2. Teproc is pushing for Hydrad pretty hard. So if he's scum, that would be a bus. I don't think it's "easy" or "early D1"; scum!Teproc is talking himself into a position from which it will be hard to argue against a Hydrad lynch when it happens. It's not out of the question that scum busses Hydrad - after all, he only was a Goon and thus the least important member of the team - but if that's your plan, you certainly talked about it in the mafia QT. Now let's assume this talk happened. Mafia agrees to bus Hydrad. Once Ampharos takes over, for sure he reads the QT. Would he just ignore the plan there and start voting for someone else, never returning to Hydrad? I don't think so. Ampharos' switch is actually evidence that he is town.
3. The wagon. I mean, seriously. silverspawn starts it for really weak reasoning that applies to at least 2 other players in this game. (that vote is sill fine mind you, it's the first vote on Amph after all) The IC joins in. Ony then do people start to sheep - and who? chairs, who is just as guilty of the things Ampharos is accused of, and who needs to divert attention from the wagon that is forming on himself, RR who also is a major lynch candidate today, Ww who just quoted evidence that Teproc is town. That is not a wagon I want to be on even without the above points.
So I believe all of this should maybe not convince you that Ampharos is town, but at least give solid reasons why Ampharos is a bad lynch for today.
more good stuff from faust. Like, really, WW, if you need direction, just do a reread of faust. He has some good stuff to say
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didn't he realize he was wrong near the end?
Haven't got there yet. Give me time
-
let's say you lynch me and... well I guess you would probably die in the next night, so it's pointless to ask what you'd do from there.
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LOOOOK I'M TOWN! someone else out there is not town. Go push him instead!
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No, but seriously. You are totally scum. Like, you killed faust before you killed the chairs. Sure, it didn't matter the order, chairs was only even-night tracker. Except....faust contributes more. And faust was gunning for silverspawn like every day except D3 (which was a pretty lame day) (and yeah, it was mostly D1).
So, if I am WW, or Ampharos, or Awaclus.....I leave faust alive. He will totally help you get that silverspawn lynch that you need to win the game.
Sure, reading into the thoughts of scum is always dangerous business and total speculation with a lot of WIFOM. But you have to wonder....
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but I'm not... :'(
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I'M NOOOOOOOOT SCUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUM
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mh. wouldn't I have killed faust day 1?
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let's say you lynch me and... well I guess you would probably die in the next night, so it's pointless to ask what you'd do from there.
What, you really think you'd be the most likely night kill?
mh. wouldn't I have killed faust day 1?
This is a bad argument to make :(
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mh. wouldn't I have killed faust day 1?
uh, no. gkrieg was a claimed JK.
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let's say you lynch me and... well I guess you would probably die in the next night, so it's pointless to ask what you'd do from there.
What, you really think you'd be the most likely night kill?
He was referring to me
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let's say you lynch me and... well I guess you would probably die in the next night, so it's pointless to ask what you'd do from there.
What, you really think you'd be the most likely night kill?
He was referring to me
Oh, I can't read. I thought he said he'd probably die.
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These posts occurred back-to-back
vote: hydrad
err what? why hydrad?
I made my little case against him. Get the ball rolling. Do something. Gauge reactions. How did he react?
Buddying (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566503#msg566503)
A vote for WW (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566504#msg566504)
frowny face that you are voting me (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=14607.msg566516#msg566516)
None of these reactions are how I think town!hydrad reacts. But I totally see scum!hydrad doing each of these things.
why aren't you voting to get RR to L-1
Previously (as can be seen in the voting record that faust posted that I quoted), silverspawn had flirted with Hydrad. But after my case, completely gone from sight (except for one mention asking him to quote his qt, which was ignored)
Instead, silverspawn goes after RR
Talks about claiming
creates a hulabaloo about QTs
Quotes his QT
Sees two people (gkrieg and chairs) vote Hydrad, WW votes faust, and silverspawn ignores the Hydrad votes and questions the faust vote.
I mean, full on ignore, talk about other things, hope people forget about Hydrad mode.
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I mean, it really doesn't matter who we lynch today, but if it is not silverspawn please lynch him tomorrow.
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Like, you don't want that awful feeling I felt after reading a post like this one:
Like, what the fuck guys?
Actually, I'm reasonably enough convinced that its Teproc and Voltaire that I wouldn't mind being lynched today, PROVIDED ALL OUR PR PEOPLE LISTEN TO ME ONCE I'M DEAD. I will be very cross if you follow up my mislynch with manda's and mcmc's.
It makes perfect sense, I don't NEED to live, I need to be listened to. Obviously I'd prefer not to be lynched, but I'm most concerned about how you will control the game when I'm dead. So I'm posting that warning.
Well, but it's more important to convince you that I am town, because then you'll be more likely to defer to my case. I can make a case on anybody, you have to be able to believe me...
It IS sort of based on feeling, which is why knowing you can trust me (if you are town) is so important.
The problem with lynching me is, okay, you'll get Voltaire tomorrow, but then what will you do? You better lynch Teproc. It's Voltaire/Teproc. Voltaire's recent comment sealed the deal. He said if I'm scum it probably means Teproc is. He said this because knows I will flip town, and then you will lynch him (Voltaire), and so he wants to do a light bus on his partner, to disassociate.
It's them. It's them. It's them.
Okay, well kill me, this day can be over whenever you all wish.
Tomorrow, LYNCH VOLTAIRE. Next day, LYNCH TEPROC.
You should absolutely lynch. I will vote for myself if that's what it takes. Better for me to be lynched and have you figure out that you can trust me and should listen to me, than No Lynch. Better still just to lynch Voltaire.
Because I was town there. I had the power to lynch scum. And I lynched town. And it was awful.
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Anyone else around?
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Yes.
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for as much as I keep voting awaclus, i wouldn't be surprised to see the last scum either ww or ss
can someone update me on our ICs / probable ICs? I'm being super lazy this game.
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can someone update me on our ICs / probable ICs? I'm being super lazy this game.
Nobody is a confirmed IC, Awaclus and e are highly probable ICs and nobody else is an IC at all.
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Why is e a probable? I must have missed this.
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Why is e a probable? I must have missed this.
He was on towny positions on both scum wagons.
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Okay, thanks
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Vote Count 5.1
Something something food quote something.
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
silverspawn (1): 2.7
Not Voting (3): Awaclus, SS, WW
With 5 players alive, it takes 3 to lynch.
Day 5 ends at 6 p.m. on the 8th of March, forum time.
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Unvote
I'll try to do a reread here shortly.
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My skimming reread took me to #664.
1) all our town roles are dead, right?
2) SS talks about post 8 confirming his role
3) e is pretty townie
4) awaclus doesn't have me convinced but
5) ww and ss seem very likely to contain the last scum
6) faust thought ss was scum a lot and I trust him
7) ss does an awful lot of talking and it feels kind of different than the last game I played with him where he was town
I think I want to vote ss but I'm going to read a little bit more.
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Points 1 and 2 pertain to post #664.
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The rest are whatever thoughts
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ww with a late hammer on hydrad... hmm
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ss does kind of kick that hydrad wagon into motion though when it's sitting at 3 votes. ug
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My skimming reread took me to #664.
1) all our town roles are dead, right?
2) SS talks about post 8 confirming his role
Well, there are VTs left. It's arguably a "role".
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Faust 817 says a lot about the hydrad thing, involving several people still alive. Go back and read it.
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My skimming reread took me to #664.
1) all our town roles are dead, right?
2) SS talks about post 8 confirming his role
Well, there are VTs left. It's arguably a "role".
I don't really consider myself to have a role. I'm just here as some random town person. Plus, why in the world would you need to talk about being a VT and why isn't that something you can't post? I don't think there are rules about that.
But technically you're right.
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My skimming reread took me to #664.
1) all our town roles are dead, right?
2) SS talks about post 8 confirming his role
Well, there are VTs left. It's arguably a "role".
I don't really consider myself to have a role. I'm just here as some random town person. Plus, why in the world would you need to talk about being a VT and why isn't that something you can't post? I don't think there are rules about that.
But technically you're right.
Well, in the games that silver mods, all players are required to explicitly state their alignments and sometimes roles when they /confirm, so he was probably doing that, and it's interaction with the mod so it's disallowed.
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Whatevs.
922-928 are fun to read and very relevant.
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Okay, finished my reread.
I'm pretty convinced our best course of action is to lynch both ww and ss in either order. Starting with ss I think.
If he's not scum, then we have to consider awaclus as a possible scum, but I don't think that's something to do unless we have to.
e has to be cleared - if he's scum we've lost already.
I'm town - too many people cleared me as town and Teproc had the VT slip thing.
Vote: silverspawn
(Also, I just actually read all of e's stuff from the last page for the first time and that confirms for me that this is the right step for this day.)
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Vote Count 5.2
Snickers: Get Some Nuts.
silverspawn (2): 2.7, Ampharos (L-1)
Not Voting (3): Awaclus, SS, WW
With 5 players alive, it takes 3 to lynch.
Day 5 ends at 6 p.m. on the 8th of March, forum time.
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I actually like Vote: Ampharos here the most.
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I actually like Vote: Ampharos here the most.
Man, go for it. I don't care.
It'll be an awfully difficult final day, what with you, WW, and SS alive.
e probably isn't long for this world regardless of who gets lynched.
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I actually like Vote: Ampharos here the most.
Man, go for it. I don't care.
It'll be an awfully difficult final day, what with you, WW, and SS alive.
e probably isn't long for this world regardless of who gets lynched.
Nice ad passiones.
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Thanks
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Thanks
You're welcome.
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I'm not scum. I'm not sure what else to tell you. If I was scum, I'd be much more okay with this possibility.
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I honestly think it's not that hard to tell scum!me from town!me, and that you're not doing it right. scum!me is less comfortable and more afraid, also he tries to have firm and consistent opinions. The whole hydrad treatment is a town tell.
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unfortunately, Ampharos has gotten scummier with this most recent exchange. Now my reads are basically Awaclus > Amph > WW > e, but all is possible. Day 6 will be hard.
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And I do have to give scum points for being on this wagon, too.
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Awaclus looks worse for avoiding the Silverspawn wagon.
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I'm not scum. I'm not sure what else to tell you.
Try telling us why you're not scum.
If I was scum, I'd be much more okay with this possibility.
With what possibility?
I honestly think it's not that hard to tell scum!me from town!me, and that you're not doing it right. scum!me is less comfortable and more afraid, also he tries to have firm and consistent opinions. The whole hydrad treatment is a town tell.
The fact that you're aware of this makes it pointless.
unfortunately, Ampharos has gotten scummier with this most recent exchange. Now my reads are basically Awaclus > Amph > WW > e, but all is possible. Day 6 will be hard.
Why is it so unfortunate?
>Day 6 will be hard
Come on, if this doesn't work when Ampharos uses it, it's not going to work when you're using it, either.
PPE:
Awaclus looks worse for avoiding the Silverspawn wagon.
Why would scum!me want to enter D6 with me, you and silverspawn alive, given that both you and ss want to lynch me?
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I'm not scum. I'm not sure what else to tell you.
Try telling us why you're not scum.
I did. scum!me would have treated the Hyrad wagon differently. I don't subtly hedge people as scum. I take clear stances. Now as town, I plan less, so everything is possible.
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I'm not scum. I'm not sure what else to tell you.
Try telling us why you're not scum.
I did. scum!me would have treated the Hyrad wagon differently. I don't subtly hedge people as scum. I take clear stances. Now as town, I plan less, so everything is possible.
The fact that you're aware of this makes it pointless.
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Awaclus looks worse for avoiding the silverspawn wagon.
he looks worse for avoiding a mislynch?
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I'm not scum. I'm not sure what else to tell you.
Try telling us why you're not scum.
I did. scum!me would have treated the Hyrad wagon differently. I don't subtly hedge people as scum. I take clear stances. Now as town, I plan less, so everything is possible.
The fact that you're aware of this makes it pointless.
... have you followed that thought to its conclusion? everything I tell you is something I am inevitably aware of.
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I'm not scum. I'm not sure what else to tell you.
Try telling us why you're not scum.
I did. scum!me would have treated the Hyrad wagon differently. I don't subtly hedge people as scum. I take clear stances. Now as town, I plan less, so everything is possible.
The fact that you're aware of this makes it pointless.
... have you followed that thought to its conclusion? everything I tell you is something I am inevitably aware of.
It only applies here because you're relying on your own personal meta. If you tell me something more objective, it doesn't matter if you're aware of it or not.
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well, objectively I pushed scum day 1 and day 2. Day 2 I was even on the wagon. What's the 'objective' case against me?
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well, objectively I pushed scum day 1 and day 2. Day 2 I was even on the wagon.
Well, that applies to me as much as it applies to you.
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Huh?
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so, why does town not want to hammer scum?
Anything else I can say to convince you?
Any arguments from silverspawn as to why he says he is scum that I can debunk for you?
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so, why does town not want to hammer scum?
Anything else I can say to convince you?
Any arguments from silverspawn as to why he says he is scum that I can debunk for you?
what?? come on, now you're being ridiculous. The fact that I'm not hammered is obviously indicative of me being town. I'm not saying you have to believe I'm town, I'm not saying it's a firm proof, but it's obviously an argument AGAINST me being scum, not for it. really. come on.
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If you lynch me here, let me just say this. Being inconsistent about a vote is NOT a scum tell. That is a town tell. I want to be able to point to this in the future so that I won't be mislynched for this reason again.
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so, why does town not want to hammer scum?
Anything else I can say to convince you?
Any arguments from silverspawn as to why he says he is scum that I can debunk for you?
I want to hammer scum, I'm just not sure if the last scum is silver or Amp and I'm not confident enough that it's not WW to just go with lynching both silver and Amp in some order.
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If you lynch me here, let me just say this. Being inconsistent about a vote is NOT a scum tell. That is a town tell. I want to be able to point to this in the future so that I won't be mislynched for this reason again.
If you know that it's a town tell, you can easily fabricate it as scum. There is nothing inherently pro-town about being inconsistent about a vote.
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Again, you can use that argument for almost everything. And it still doesn't explain why you think I'm scum. If anything it's null.
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Again, you can use that argument for almost everything. And it still doesn't explain why you think I'm scum. If anything it's null.
You can't use that argument for doing things that actually hurt the scum team.
Why do you need to know why I think you're scum?
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Actually you know what, let's just do this. If you can't explain why you're town, you probably aren't.
Vote: silverspawn
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Please tell me we got him
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well, good luck tomorrow.
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Ug.
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Well, in that case, I'm certainly going to vote for Ampharos tomorrow.
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And here I have no idea who I'm voting for.
It really could be either you or WW. At least I'll have quite some time to look things over.
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I really don't know if it's Amph. I guess e is still the least likely, but if he doesn't die, then it might also be him. Amph still has the QT thing and the Teproc thing, both makes him towny.
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Final Day 5 Vote Count
Oh, hi! How are you holding up? Because I'm a potato.
SS (3): 2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus
Not Voting (2): WW, SS
With 5 players alive, it took 3 to lynch.
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Thread Locked!
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Day 5 End
Final Vote Count:
SS (3): 2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus
Not Voting (2): WW, SS
With 5 players alive, it took 3 to lynch.
"GIVE ME ONE REASON WHY I SHOULDN'T JUST PUSH YOU OFF THIS HERE TABLE!" bawled two of the cakes simultaneously. Matt and Rick recoiled, covering their ears, at the shrill shrieking. Things had escalated quickly.
The confectionery in question stammered something, quietly enough to be completely incomprehensible:
"... yummy ... happiness ... ponies ... "
"Well, if that's the best you can do," said a third cake, joining in the fun, "have this!"
He picked up a camping mallet from the table ("Where did that come from?" sputtered Rick.) and brought it bodily down onto the poor pastry.
The walls were splattered with vanilla-y goodness, and a delicious aroma filled the room.
Whoops!
silverspawn has been lynched! He was a Vanilla Teacake.
Night 5 begins now and will last 24 hours. Night actions due in 12 hours. (Night will be extended to 48 hours upon the PM'd/QT'd request of any player.)
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Day 6 Start
Matt and Rick had both turned away for a few moments, towards the sink, trying to clean off the ever-increasing encrustment of vanilla/chocolate/spongey goo that coated them. It seemed that they had only been looking the other way for a second when they heard an ominous SQUISH.
Turning quickly back to the table, still dripping, they saw that yet another of the cakes had been brutally murdered. The remaining cakes looked like butter wouldn't melt in their mouths, each standing some distance away from the tasty-looking corpse. One was even whistling nonchalantly.
The brothers couldn't quite believe it. All those delicious looking cakes, gone! Now there were only three left! Were they ever going to get something tasty to eat?
2.7 died during the night. He was a Vanilla Teacake.
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Vote Count 6.0
Not Voting (3): Ampharos, Awaclus, WW
With 3 players alive, it takes 2 to lynch.
Day 6 begins now and will end at 8am on the 11th of March, forum time.
Thread unlocked!
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My gut says WW, but I have to do a comprehensive reread of both of you before I'm doing any voting.
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Here's my QT (in reverse order, obviously) in case anyone wants to see it:
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
03-02-2016
07:57 AM ET (US)
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By saying that I'll certainly vote for Ampharos, I'm trying to bait scum!Ampharos into killing me and scum!WW into keeping me alive. I don't know if it's going to work, but it's more data and I think we might need any extra data we can possibly have tomorrow. Depending on how things play out, I might or might not actually want to vote for Ampharos tomorrow.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
03-02-2016
07:37 AM ET (US)
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Man, both of them (silver and Amp) are so scummy. But they can't all be the last scum ever.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
03-01-2016
10:53 AM ET (US)
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Also it's nice that he stopped tunneling me, but I think I have to give him scum points for that as well.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
03-01-2016
10:53 AM ET (US)
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More scum points for Amp for trying to read way too much into silver talking about confirming his "role". Silver is scummy for legit reasons, but trying to paint an even scummier picture of him is pretty bad.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
03-01-2016
10:24 AM ET (US)
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Scum points to Ampharos for not following the game.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-29-2016
05:45 PM ET (US)
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>inb4 people put me to L-1 just to force me to share said explanations
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:53 PM ET (US)
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I don't remember if there's a reason to find WW particularly scummy or towny.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:52 PM ET (US)
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I conducted an experiment. I went on the forums, opened a thread, started a timer, read the newest post (in such a way that I actually understood what it was saying too), opened this personal QT, clicked on Print and selected all messages (which was unnecessary because this QT right now is short enough that you can see all the posts on a single page, but the point was to simulate having to open a separate page to show all the posts), copied its contents to my clipboard, opened Notepad because I didn't accidentally want to post this on the forum, pasted it into the Notepad, skimmed over the text to see that everything was there the way it was supposed to be, and stopped the timer at 33 seconds. Now, if you actually have to delete mod interactions and whatnot, it's obviously going to take a little bit longer, but no way I'm giving town cred for anything that takes longer than a few minutes to post.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:42 PM ET (US)
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As for my thoughts at this very moment, I think that silver or Ampharos is certainly very likely to be the last scum. They both posted their QTs after a significant delay even though they were online the entire time, and I think they really did have QTs of some kind at hand, but they super could have been edited. This reminds me of visual novels with multiple different routes — when you read a scene for the first time, it makes perfect sense in the context of that route, but that exact same scene might appear again on a different route and even though the context for that scene is now wildly different, it still makes perfect sense in the new context as well, and it oftentimes (especially back when I was just starting out) really surprises and amazes me how much they can actually just reuse the exact same scenes in different routes. The same thing applies here — 15 minutes is probably enough to turn a general fake QT into a VT QT. It's also a pretty likely hypothesis that scum has such general fake QTs that they're planning to turn into the appropriate PR or VT ones on the fly when necessary; maybe they overestimated how long it would take or maybe they thought that getting it done in 15 minutes for a VT QT (probably a little more for a PR QT) is still fast enough to get you town cred, and they probably really wouldn't want to manage multiple different QTs.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:25 PM ET (US)
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So, I think that does it for old post explanations.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:19 PM ET (US)
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No wait, I already explained that in the main thread.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:18 PM ET (US)
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http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.ph...msg572271#msg572271
With this, I was referring to that I was actually starting to like the silverspawn lynch, if only RR had showed up and done something useful.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:13 PM ET (US)
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http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.ph...msg569456#msg569456
Here, I was thinking that RR unvoted with the purpose of trying to prevent his partner's lynch, and I was confident enough in my scum read on RR to hammer EgorK for that, since RR didn't seem to be a viable lynch that day. Interestingly, it ended up being the correct play for entirely wrong reasons.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:10 PM ET (US)
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http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.ph...msg567661#msg567661
And yes, that point was actually a pretty good one. For me, it was not a reason to vote for RR though, it was simply a reason to not give RR enough town cred for being on the lynch to make up for the scum cred he got from refusing to share the QT.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:05 PM ET (US)
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http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.ph...msg566758#msg566758
Oh shit, now it does have something in it.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
07:01 PM ET (US)
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As for the case against RR, it stemmed entirely from his refusal to share his QT, even though he probably posted in it. If he had managed to actually post the QT in a reasonably short amount of time after it was requested, I would have changed to silverspawn immediately. Actually, if he had managed to post anything at all to successfully defend himself, I would have changed to silverspawn because earlier today I was posting from a bus and focusing on a bunch of different things at the same time so I didn't remember that the QT thing was the reason why I had decided that RR was confirmed scum (that's a convenient thing about not sharing your reasons; you can just abstract them away because they don't matter).
The reason for finding him confirmed scum originally was that there was no town motivation for refusing to do the obviously pro-town thing, therefore RR had to be scum. Turns out he wasn't. I still can't figure out what the town motivation could possibly have been.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
06:58 PM ET (US)
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Firstly, I'm obviously town given that I haven't quit this game since the rules clarification, and anyone who approaches the question rationally should arrive to the same conclusion, given my posts in other threads discussing the QT issue. I have a tendency to assume that people play rationally, or rather, I think that the assumption that people play rationally is the very essence of all multiplayer game strategy, be it Mafia, Dominion, Hanabi or Cards Against Humanity. Given that and my personal dislike for winning more/Still Had All Deez, I saw no need for any extra town cred, but as it turns out, some people will apparently just have to go to however extreme extents it takes to refuse to be rational under any and all circumstances, and now that RR also flipped town, the best lead we have is the case against silverspawn and while it's a pretty good case, I'm nowhere near confident enough to count on him being scum and if he's not, I don't want to take any chances of getting mislynched no matter how much those chances are supposed to be 0%.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
06:40 PM ET (US)
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For now, I think the major things I have to explain are
1) Why didn't I write a QT until now
and
2) Why did I press the case against RR so hard
In addition, I will go over my posts after that and see if there's anything that comes to mind.
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
02-28-2016
06:39 PM ET (US)
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Meh, I guess I should start writing a QT. Be it known that while I am kind of posting my actual thoughts here to the extent that I think it's likely to turn out to be more useful than detrimental, I still have to force myself to do so, since I usually just remember everything and so this QT doesn't serve any practical purpose to actually help me play better or anything, it's purely for the town cred. In other words, the target audience of my QT is not myself, but anyone who might still be alive when/if I might have to share it, and therefore, it's going to be more about explaining my reasons and thought processes to other people.
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Obviously the fact that I'm still alive means town points for Amp and scum points for WW.
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I don't know how I feel about that.
A few points of concern:
1) You post it at the beginning of the final day, without provocation.
2) You wrote it up late in the game, giving nothing early that could be incriminating. This could be very easily fabricated.
3) You are clearly trying to get me killed, which reads a lot like scum who has picked their final mislynch target.
But then you post that other post and maybe 3 is not so valid.
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That last sentance should have had PPE, sorry.
Going to do rereads later today, and am waiting for WW to show up.
Even with the above concerns, I still think he's the primary suspect going into this day before my reread.
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I don't know how I feel about that.
A few points of concern:
1) You post it at the beginning of the final day, without provocation.
2) You wrote it up late in the game, giving nothing early that could be incriminating. This could be very easily fabricated.
3) You are clearly trying to get me killed, which reads a lot like scum who has picked their final mislynch target.
But then you post that other post and maybe 3 is not so valid.
Well, yeah. I intended to use it to gain town cred for having written a QT, but then it started to feel like it's more useful for explaining things that I didn't want to explain in the main thread at that time, so that's what I mostly used it for and I think it serves that purpose well. I also don't see a need to wait for provocation; it's just generally good that it's available for everyone now that it's the final day.
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So I'm town. And I don't know which one of you is scum.
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So I'm town. And I don't know which one of you is scum.
This is a lot different than the last game we were in the final 3 together.
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"This" being your initial approach to the day.
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So I'm town. And I don't know which one of you is scum.
This is a lot different than the last game we were in the final 3 together.
I didn't realize I wouldn't be considered town here.
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"This" being your initial approach to the day.
Lats time I did a lot of rereading and writing during the night.
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Just don't vote me if you are town, because I'm going to be super pissed if scum!Awaclus wins this. I won't feel as bad if you're scum.
Actually I just realized that I'm going to be biased going into this.
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Fair enough. I can't call you out for that without being hypocritical :P
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Here's my QT (in reverse order, obviously) in case anyone wants to see it:
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
03-02-2016
07:57 AM ET (US)
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By saying that I'll certainly vote for Ampharos, I'm trying to bait scum!Ampharos into killing me and scum!WW into keeping me alive. I don't know if it's going to work, but it's more data and I think we might need any extra data we can possibly have tomorrow. Depending on how things play out, I might or might not actually want to vote for Ampharos tomorrow.
Doesn't make a lot of sense when you were convinced e would be the night kill yesterday.
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Here's my QT (in reverse order, obviously) in case anyone wants to see it:
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AwaclusPerson was signed in when posted
03-02-2016
07:57 AM ET (US)
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By saying that I'll certainly vote for Ampharos, I'm trying to bait scum!Ampharos into killing me and scum!WW into keeping me alive. I don't know if it's going to work, but it's more data and I think we might need any extra data we can possibly have tomorrow. Depending on how things play out, I might or might not actually want to vote for Ampharos tomorrow.
Doesn't make a lot of sense when you were convinced e would be the night kill yesterday.
I tried to change that. It didn't work. Ampharos was the one with the biggest incentive to react to me saying that I'll vote for him for sure.
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Besides, where did I even say that I was convinced that e would be the NK? I just stated that he was very likely to be an IC.
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Just don't vote me if you are town, because I'm going to be super pissed if scum!Awaclus wins this.
Well, he needs to vote for you if he's town because that means you're scum, and if town!Ampharos doesn't vote for scum!WW, town can't win.
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I shouldn't have to say this, but the important thing is that nobody vote for anybody until we are verbally in agreement about what we want to do.
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I shouldn't have to say this, but the important thing is that nobody vote for anybody until we are verbally in agreement about what we want to do.
Well, there's certainly no need to hurry with voting (I still want to reread before making a decision too, and I won't have time before Sunday or something like that), but what's the purpose of the verbal agreement before voting?
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Eh I guess nothing. Unification or something.
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Here. Finished goong throuh thread, would post what I take from it later. What caught my eye on last couple of pages is how Awaclus hypocritically requires RR to share his QT
How is it hypocritical? I have already shared that my QT doesn't have anything in it (and never will).
lol
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So on the Egor lynch, WW is 2nd, awaclus hammers.
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For the record, I'm actually writing a QT now. It contains the explanations for things that I wouldn't otherwise explain, so I don't want to share it unless it comes down to that.
Must have missed this before.
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So on the Egor lynch, WW is 2nd, awaclus hammers.
I wanted Egor Day 1, no one else did. I was on him pretty much all of Day 2. I hope that it's clear I'm not partners with him.
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Awaclus looks worse for avoiding the Silverspawn wagon.
This is a pretty critical post, methinks.
Why does town!WW say this? If he thinks SS is scum, he wouldn't say this, so he must think Awaclus is scum. Why does scum!Awaclus avoid a mislynch wagon? Maybe so that he gains some town cred?
Why does scum!WW say this? That one's easy - to try to get either one of them bumped off by making them both look bad.
Hmm. Nothing conclusive here but it's definitely something that is easier to lean scum.
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Awaclus looks worse for avoiding the Silverspawn wagon.
This is a pretty critical post, methinks.
Why does town!WW say this? If he thinks SS is scum, he wouldn't say this, so he must think Awaclus is scum. Why does scum!Awaclus avoid a mislynch wagon? Maybe so that he gains some town cred?
Why does scum!WW say this? That one's easy - to try to get either one of them bumped off by making them both look bad.
Hmm. Nothing conclusive here but it's definitely something that is easier to lean scum.
I didn't think that SS was necessarily town when I said that. I can explain this now, I suppose.
Silverspawn is at L-1. Silverspawn lynched is obviously good for scum!Awaclus. Scum!Awaclus appearing eager for the lynch makes him look bad the next day, and scum needs to survive two days here. However, you can't just ignore it.. as scum you feel pressure to weigh in on critical situations.. so basically your choice is hammer or find a reasonable way not to hammer. Not hammering also makes you look better because you can use the "why wouldn't I want to kill him as scum?" argument (which Awaclus did). Starting an alternate wagon is the best-looking thing to do here. It shows (for today) that you weren't eager for the SS lynch. If town!Ampharos ends up getting lynched instead of Silverspawn, then SS is an obvious target for the day.
Basically, scum!Awaclus going after a non-SS target (me or you) is the best scum play there, so he looks scummier for doing it.
Notably, Awaclus goes ahead and hammers SS later anyway:
Actually you know what, let's just do this. If you can't explain why you're town, you probably aren't.
Vote: silverspawn
I'm inclined to think (actually, very strongly inclined) that town!Awaclus would have simply voted without adding that extra explanation.
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FRICK this is hard.
And yes, that makes sense.
You also get town points because e clears you on Day 5.
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I just thought of this... Ampharos, did you get access to Teproc's QT when he subbed in?
I think scum would rather not bring this up.
Speaking of that, WW have you posted yours?
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Besides, where did I even say that I was convinced that e would be the NK? I just stated that he was very likely to be an IC.
Aside from the obvious, there is this:
Why would scum!me want to enter D6 with me, you and silverspawn alive, given that both you and ss want to lynch me?
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I just thought of this... Ampharos, did you get access to Teproc's QT when he subbed in?
I think scum would rather not bring this up.
Speaking of that, WW have you posted yours?
No, I can.
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Only four posts:
Hoorah
After Day 2:
Huh, I actually thought Egor was town after Faust's treatment. Good thing I didn't unvote. I was about to make a case against Faust too.
RR of course looks bad.. he always does, no matter what his alignment is.
Earlier today:
Yeah I think it's Awaclus.
That QT looks extensively fabricated. What's the point of the "I suspect Amph" setup if e was assumed to be the kill? It seems all kinds of fake.
Awaclus SS hammer is really bad. Especially with the excuse for voting.
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FRICK this is hard.
And yes, that makes sense.
You also get town points because e clears you on Day 5.
Wait no, day 4.
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Can you just straightup copy/paste it and delete Haddock's posts? So it looks all ugly and what not.
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Like this?
WitherweaverPerson was signed in when posted
03-03-2016
08:35 AM ET (US)
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Awaclus SS hammer is really bad. Especially with the excuse for voting.
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WitherweaverPerson was signed in when posted
03-03-2016
08:33 AM ET (US)
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Yeah I think it's Awaclus.
That QT looks extensively fabricated. What's the point of the "I suspect Amph" setup if e was assumed to be the kill? It seems all kinds of fake.
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WitherweaverPerson was signed in when posted
02-17-2016
10:07 AM ET (US)
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Huh, I actually thought Egor was town after Faust's treatment. Good thing I didn't unvote. I was about to make a case against Faust too.
RR of course looks bad.. he always does, no matter what his alignment is.
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WitherweaverPerson was signed in when posted
01-31-2016
01:08 PM ET (US)
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Hoorah
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Okay, I guess you guys talked about it. I had trouble seeing scum! SS from Day 1
Ooo this is townie. SS is a major suspect here and throwing weight off the wagon here is a bad play for scum.
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For clarity, the post regarding Egor and Faust was after the lynch, which I wasn't online for. I specifically remembering thinking that I was wrong because of something Faust did. I remember thinking up a case against Faust, and I think I was going to make it the next day or something, but when I woke up Egor had been hammered. At least that's how I think it went down.
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I'm inclined to think (actually, very strongly inclined) that town!Awaclus would have simply voted without adding that extra explanation.
Well, you think wrong. I didn't add the explanation to explain why I hammered him, I did it to emphasize my belief that it's your own responsibility to prove that you're town (as opposed to it being the responsibility of the people on your wagon to prove that you're scum), because that was a very clear example of a situation where I didn't have to prove anyone why I thought silverspawn was scum and I could still hammer him regardless, whereas the only way for him to prevent it from happening would have been convincing me otherwise.
Besides, where did I even say that I was convinced that e would be the NK? I just stated that he was very likely to be an IC.
Aside from the obvious, there is this:
Why would scum!me want to enter D6 with me, you and silverspawn alive, given that both you and ss want to lynch me?
That's a hypothetical situation where I'm scum. I'm not actually scum, so whatever I said regarding that hypothetical situation obviously doesn't apply to the actual game.
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Anyway that makes me like the chairs wagon less, and in turn the Egor wagon more. So tentative intent to hammer. It won't happen before Lekkit had a chance to post though.
Ohh, I think this was the post. It gave me a scum feeling and made me want to switch from Egor to Faust.
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I'm pretty sure it's Awaclus at this point.
1) He distracts everyone with talk about QTs.
2) He tunnels RR most of the game. Super easy tunnel target cause RR is always someone people talk about a lot.
3) WW goes after Egork a lot over multiple days. He also hammers Hydrad D1.
4) Does scum Awaclus hammer Egork? I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility.
5) Awaclus says he will never write a QT - is very adamant about this - then writes one late in the game.
6) WW is believed to be town by e.
I'm going back to do a little more reading.
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Let's look at final votes:
Day 1 End
Final Vote Count:
2.7 (1): EgorK
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Ampharos (1): Lekkit
RR (2): SS, Awaclus
Hydrad (7): gkrieg13, chairs, faust, ADK, 2.7, RR, WW
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Not Voting (0):
Both Amph and Awaclus off scum lynch.
RR (1): Lekkit
chairs (2): Ampharos, ADK
Egor (6): WW, chairs, 2.7, SS, faust, Awaclus
SS (1): EgorK
Not Voting (1): RR
Awaclus on scum lynch, Amph off
RR (1): Awaclus
Lekkit (5): faust, chairs, 2.7, SS, WW
Awaclus (2): RR, Ampharos
Not Voting (1): Lekkit
Both Awaclus and Ampharos off mislynch
RR (4): Awaclus, SS, Witherweaver, 2.7
Ampharos (1): chairs
SS (1): RR
Awaclus (1): Ampharos
Awaclus on mislynch, Amph off
SS (3): 2.7, Ampharos, Awaclus
Not Voting (2): WW, SS
Both Awaclus and Amph on mislynch.
So Awaclus is on one mislynch that Amph isn't, and on one scum lynch that Amph isn't. Awaclus on RR almost every day. Ampharos ended up on Awaclus multiple days.
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THIS IS HARD.
I went into the reread leaning scum!WW, but after it, I'm leaning scum!awaclus. I think that's a good sign, but I need to clear my head.
I'm going to leave for a while, do some work, listen to some LCS, and come back later.
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1) He distracts everyone with talk about QTs.
2) He tunnels RR most of the game. Super easy tunnel target cause RR is always someone people talk about a lot.
3) WW goes after Egork a lot over multiple days. He also hammers Hydrad D1.
4) Does scum Awaclus hammer Egork? I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility.
5) Awaclus says he will never write a QT - is very adamant about this - then writes one late in the game.
6) WW is believed to be town by e.
1) Can you give me a rational explanation how me "talking about QTs" distracted anyone? You might want to take into account that two thirds of the scum team was successfully lynched during the first two days while doing so.
It's trivial to tell that I'm town just from the fact that I'm still playing this game given these rules. I am extremely adamant and elitist about always playing for the win, which you can easily confirm if you look up any of my forum posts regarding playing for the win. I would not be able to forgive myself for the rest of my life if I ever played a game with any intentions other than winning it at all costs. I was able to play for the win in this game because I happened to be town, which is why I didn't quit when the rules clarification was announced.
2) Can you give me a rational explanation how RR refusing to share his QT was a pro-town play? If someone refuses to make a play which is obviously pro-town, that person is confirmed scum and there's no need to look any further until that person is lynched.
3) 4) Finding me scummy for hammering EgorK while finding WW towny for hammering Hydrad is confirmation bias.
5) Writing one improved town's chances of winning and apparently we really needed those chances, given that it doesn't even look like it's going to be enough.
6) And so was I.
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THIS IS HARD.
I went into the reread leaning scum!WW, but after it, I'm leaning scum!awaclus.
You mean after WW started liking my lynch more than I'm liking his lynch?
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Me hammering Hydrad is basically null, as he was counterclaimed.
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Awaclus Egor hammer, on the other hand, tries to set up RR:
Unvote
L-1 came too quickly.
Vote: EgorK
No wait, I didn't think that through. Chairs could also be RR's last partner. :-\
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Awaclus, you should make some effort to convince me Amph is scum.
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No LCS today. Sad times.
What do both of you think about me?
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Awaclus, you should make some effort to convince me Amph is scum.
I'm making a lot of effort to convince you that I'm town. If you are town, then by extension, I'm also making a lot of effort to convince you that Amp is scum because then that's the only other possibility.
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No LCS today. Sad times.
What do both of you think about me?
Same as I've said before. Teproc is one to suspect and even push his partners (he's done it to me), so the Hydrad voting doesn't clear him. You didn't really bring up Hyrdad at all, which is suspicious. Also off Egor wagon.
Those are the worst points against you.
Points for you is that you look like you're trying to figure things out today, and that's hard to do as scum.
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Awaclus, you should make some effort to convince me Amph is scum.
I'm making a lot of effort to convince you that I'm town. If you are town, then by extension, I'm also making a lot of effort to convince you that Amp is scum because then that's the only other possibility.
I'm not going to respond to stuff like this to avoid derailment.
Who do you think is scum?
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Awaclus, you should make some effort to convince me Amph is scum.
I'm making a lot of effort to convince you that I'm town. If you are town, then by extension, I'm also making a lot of effort to convince you that Amp is scum because then that's the only other possibility.
I'm not going to respond to stuff like this to avoid derailment.
Who do you think is scum?
(I still want to reread before making a decision too, and I won't have time before Sunday or something like that)
I think Ampharos only slightly more likely than you at the moment.
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I think Ampharos only slightly more likely than you at the moment.
Why?
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I think Ampharos only slightly more likely than you at the moment.
Why?
Why Ampharos or why you're almost as likely?
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I think Ampharos only slightly more likely than you at the moment.
Why?
Why Ampharos or why you're almost as likely?
Why Ampharos.
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I think Ampharos only slightly more likely than you at the moment.
Why?
Why Ampharos or why you're almost as likely?
Why Ampharos.
Ampharos because until D5, he was tunneling me, and then out of nowhere he joined the much easier silverspawn mislynch for awful reasons.
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Okay, that's a good point.
Here is the SS vote:
Okay, finished my reread.
I'm pretty convinced our best course of action is to lynch both ww and ss in either order. Starting with ss I think.
If he's not scum, then we have to consider awaclus as a possible scum, but I don't think that's something to do unless we have to.
e has to be cleared - if he's scum we've lost already.
I'm town - too many people cleared me as town and Teproc had the VT slip thing.
Vote: silverspawn
(Also, I just actually read all of e's stuff from the last page for the first time and that confirms for me that this is the right step for this day.)
Why did you back off of Awaclus?
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No one seriously investigated Awaclus all game, and thus no one really said he was scum, so I wasn't thinking he really was.
I was tunneling Awaclus not because I thought he was scum, but because he was basically trolling all game and I wanted to get rid of a troll. SS was my first serious vote since Chairs. I think (going off memory).
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I'm not sure SS was really much easier than you, though. e was pushing SS, but you were his second choice. I had put you above SS after RR, and SS would obviously go for you as he's the alternative.
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No one seriously investigated Awaclus all game, and thus no one really said he was scum, so I wasn't thinking he really was.
I was tunneling Awaclus not because I thought he was scum, but because he was basically trolling all game and I wanted to get rid of a troll. SS was my first serious vote since Chairs. I think (going off memory).
... you sounded like you thought he was scum
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No one seriously investigated Awaclus all game, and thus no one really said he was scum, so I wasn't thinking he really was.
I was tunneling Awaclus not because I thought he was scum, but because he was basically trolling all game and I wanted to get rid of a troll. SS was my first serious vote since Chairs. I think (going off memory).
... you sounded like you thought he was scum
At least I had thought so.
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let me rephrase that sentence, then:
"I didn't necessarily think Awaclus was scum; I was tunneling him because I thought he was trolling"
His alignment was largely irrelevant to me once we lynched scum D1 and 2.
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let me rephrase that sentence, then:
"I didn't necessarily think Awaclus was scum; I was tunneling him because I thought he was trolling"
His alignment was largely irrelevant to me once we lynched scum D1 and 2.
So basically we're supposed to believe that for two days, your main objective was not winning the game, but getting rid of a person you didn't like?
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Well I wouldn't say I don't like YOU, just the trolly stuff. I much more enjoy playing with this new Awaclus that has appeared recently in the game.
Now, some trolly stuff is fun, don't get me wrong. But I felt it wasn't very helpful early on and was just making people frustrated more than anything.
So to get to the gist of your question - pretty much, just minus the not liking you part.
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So to get to the gist of your question - pretty much
Wow.
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So to get to the gist of your question - pretty much
Wow.
To be fair, I did remark as soon as I entered the game in my QT how scummy I viewed your discussion of QTs to be.
So I have some justification.
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To be fair, I did remark as soon as I entered the game in my QT how scummy I viewed your discussion of QTs to be.
So I have some justification.
You've never been able to point out how it was scummy, though.
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To be fair, I did remark as soon as I entered the game in my QT how scummy I viewed your discussion of QTs to be.
So I have some justification.
You've never been able to point out how it was scummy, though.
Distracts town by talking about irrelevant things.
I think this is where you say it is relevant, so now we've found our point of difference and can get past this :P
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Distracts town by talking about irrelevant things.
I think this is where you say it is relevant, so now we've found our point of difference and can get past this :P
1) Do you have any evidence that it distracted town?
2) How was me being an IC irrelevant?
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I'm not talking about this with you, sorry.
I'll discuss other things.
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I'm not talking about this with you, sorry.
Right, because you know you're wrong.
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I think I'm going to try to come to a decision today.
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I think I'm going to try to come to a decision today.
I want to reread everything one more time but I think I could do this too.
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If one of you ends up voting for the other, I'll try to come to a decision on Sunday.
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Although, I'm fairly inclined to think that it's Amp now.
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Silence is scummy.
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Vote Count 6.1
Vegetarians! Stop eating my food's food!
Not Voting (3): Ampharos, Awaclus, WW
With 3 players alive, it takes 2 to lynch.
Day 6 will end at 8am on the 11th of March, forum time.
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Vote Count 6.1
Vegetarians! Stop eating my food's food!
There's been a mistake. You've accidentally given me the food my food eats.
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Gone all day, but looks like I didn't miss anything.
Any decision, WW?
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I believe I have. Have you?
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I think so.
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I haven't.
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I finished rereading.
Vote: Ampharos
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Vote Count 6.2
Vegetarians! Stop eating my food's food!
Ampharos (1): Awaclus
Not Voting (2): Ampharos, WW
With 3 players alive, it takes 2 to lynch.
Day 6 will end at 8am on the 11th of March, forum time.
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Cool. I love confirming not scum
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I'll post my QT later which has some final thoughts, but I can't not
Vote: Awaclus
Sorry if I'm wrong, but there is zero town play from Awaclus this game.
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I'll post my QT later which has some final thoughts, but I can't not
Vote: Awaclus
Sorry if I'm wrong, but there is zero town play from Awaclus this game.
How is there zero town play from me?
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I've been doing my best to prove that I'm town and voting for people who haven't been able to do that. You can't get more pro-town than that.
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Vote Count 6.3
BEAUTIFUL COWS!
Ampharos (1): Awaclus
Awaclus (1): WW
Not Voting (1): Ampharos
With 3 players alive, it takes 2 to lynch.
Day 6 will end at 8am on the 11th of March, forum time.
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Wow ookay!
Vote: Awaclus
*fistbump WW*
gg to all, fun game :)
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So you mean we won? Or was that a troll fist bump?
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Game Over!
Day 6 Final Vote Count
Ampharos (1): Awaclus
Awaclus (2): Ampharos, WW
Not Voting (0):
With 3 players alive, it took 2 to lynch.
The final reckoning was fraught with tension and suspense. The last three cakes, in a dreadful face-off, all pushed their acting skills to the limit, doing their utmost to avoid being horribly butchered like so many before them.
The cake who made the first move had a small yin-yang symbol etched into his surface. He stepped forth and said:
"That guy is one of the ones who came and replaced the weirdos that left. If that doesn't make him the murdering scum I don't know what does."
The accused cake looked affronted, but couldn't think of anything to say. Meanwhile, the third cake stood back and looked at the other two.
"You are all, secretly, versions of me," he announced, cryptically, a thoughtful frown on his little cake face.
Matt and Rick didn't know what to make of that.
"Thus," continued the speaker, "the essence of evil must be the cake whose very symbol indicates the existence of more than one being. I am the one, the only, and I shall smite the unbeliever."
In two strides, the size of which belied his tiny stature, the philosophising cake stepped across the table and gave yin-yang a shove. Yin-yang staggered, stumbled, and teetered at the edge.
"No! Not me! I must survive!" he yelled desperately. "I'm innocent, everyone should believe me!"
But the original accusee, the supposed 'replacement', was having none of it. His eyes met those of the self-proclaimed god-cake, and they exchanged a brief nod. Without a word, he walked over to the desperately hanging on yin-yang cake, and gave the smallest of shoves.
SCHWUMF.
Brown fumes rose from the corpse, and a hideous stench filled the air.
"Who puts coffee in cakes?", asked Rick. "That's just disgusting."
"Who knows?" said Matt, "But it doesn't matter. We can finally eat!"
"Hold yourself! How do we know that's all the nasty ones?"
"I speak for both of us," said a voice, "for we are one and the same. And both of us taste of excellent and beautiful vanilla. Take us to our reward in bakery heaven, so that I may be one once again with all of my passed-away selves."
"Oh, just eat him so that he'll shut up," said the other surviving cake. "I promise I'm just vanilla-flavoured, at least. Can't speak for that dude."
Matt and Rick took a cake each. They bumped them against each other as if toasting.
"Down the hatch."
"Here's to you."
They chewed and swallowed, chewed and swallowed, feeling the sugar rush to their veins. Every bite was a dream. It was glorious.
"Best."
"Birthday."
"Ever!"
They could only hope that next year's would be just as eventful.
Awaclus has been lynched! He was a Double Espresso Cake (2-shot Strongman).
GAME OVER - TOWN WINS!
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Yay!
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Three correct MyLo's in a row for me. Just saying ~
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Well done. Tight game all the way.
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Well done town (special thanks to Ampharos for replacing me and going all the way).
And yeah, that's an impressive trio of wins for WW. I don't think I've ever gotten it right at lylo.
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Three correct MyLo's in a row for me. Just saying ~
I'm glad for it!
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And I think you probably deserve the MVP here, too.
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I'm relieved. I have a pretty big bias against Awaclus, so it's hard to tell if I'm being objective.
Ampharos seemed pretty townie today, especially with the genuine-seeming change of read on me.
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Woohoo
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I want to record my special thanks to Ampharos and e for stepping in. Huge thanks to both of you. :)
QTs:
Speccy: http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/DiysCbpZJiVSc
Mod: http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/PDBJm6QjThT
Mafia: http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/69T5d5WVgLuiM
WW (VT): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/mNPE6ehfxKd23
SS (VT): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/aMU4h7gHL39Y
yuma->2.7 (VT): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/cMPejaDUWnEe
RR (VT): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/SEkUZEyUd4q6
faust (VT): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/54T79LEZqSeN
Lekkit (VT): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/m5PBrzvtaUjMc
Teproc -> Ampharos (VT): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/9DGxvp94DQFd
ADK (Fruit Vendor): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/v9SDndeqH2S3
chairs (Tracker): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/g9Rs56Df9yw
gkrieg (JK): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/jRuyT27vTak5T
Hydrad (Goon): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/gV9rLWZa3SXB
Awaclus (Strongman): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/gga8R9qeEwfc
EgorK (Rolecop): http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/BFHp77w5iP6
I haven't picked an MVP yet, I need to reread. WW is obviously a contender, as is Awaclus, and I remember thinking of a particular person having reliably good reads. Might be a day or two before I get a chance to have a proper look.
A couple of things.
The QT issue is obviously a massive deal. As I said to SS, it wasn't an arbitrary choice and I thought it through quite a bit and then consulted with ashersky. That said, I obviously should have put it in the rules right from the start.
I still think that QT quoting needn't be a problem, and I actually don't think that it was a huge issue in this game, all considered. However, I'm very aware that there are plenty of people who are very strongly against it indeed, and while I disagree with them, I'm not so passionately for it that I want to alienate them from my games in future. So I will almost certainly be disallowing QT quoting in my future games. (Thought not going so far as to ban all mention of QTs at all.)
The setup was interesting. Faust mentioned that he thinks it makes fakeclaims impossible. I tend to agree that that happened in this particular roll. I don't think the matrix setup in general has that problem - in fact I'd say it's largely Fruit Vendor that hit pretty hard. Fruit Vendor has a huge incentive to claim early and once that happens fakeclaims are impossible. On other rows and columns that wouldn't necessarily be so much the case. Anyway. I think it would be OK.
Funny story, yuma might appreciate. By the time all the issues pregame regarding changing the 10-2-1 setups had come up, the setup had already been rolled and was ready to go. So pretending to change the setup was kinda fun. I think if I ran it again I would nonetheless stick with the modified version though. So not a total waste.
Finally, the flavour. It got kinda out of my control. Mostly it was written on the spot, totally just train-of-thought writing. I think you can probably tell. I was aware of it getting pretty surreal, but I hope people enjoyed it.
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Very happy that we were able to win this game after the mid-game debacle. Good job WW and Ampharos taking the time and getting it right.
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Very happy that we were able to win this game after the mid-game debacle. Good job WW and Ampharos taking the time and getting it right.
Still don't understand where your confidence came from.
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I kind of think I should get the MVP here.. I didn't have the Hydrad read, but I was on Egor early, and I chose correctly in the end. I was on the RR and Lekkit mislynches, but I think those were pretty hard to read as town, given how the game went.
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Also, did Avocados come up because I brought it up, or was that a weird coincidence?
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I also basically decided two days ago, but I wanted to hold off and see how Amph and Awaclus behaved. I was about to jump come and vote Awaclus, but he had already voted when I checked in. Not sure if it would have made a difference, but then the decision would have been up to Amph. I suppose he was going to go for Awaclus regardless.
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For the record, I would most likely have lynched me when you guys did.
In other news, I actually won a game!
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I'm glad we won! I was a little sad to be outed D1, because it meant that I didn't really get to play, but it was a good 1v1 trade
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I'm glad we won! I was a little sad to be outed D1, because it meant that I didn't really get to play, but it was a good 1v1 trade
I still don't think we should've outed you.
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I kind of think I should get the MVP here.. I didn't have the Hydrad read, but I was on Egor early, and I chose correctly in the end. I was on the RR and Lekkit mislynches, but I think those were pretty hard to read as town, given how the game went.
And you also didn't help with my lynch.
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Very happy that we were able to win this game after the mid-game debacle. Good job WW and Ampharos taking the time and getting it right.
Still don't understand where your confidence came from.
I portrayed a lot of confidence, but I honestly had no clue. I think taking strong stances is good for town. And I honestly thought that there was a strong possibility that you were scum. So I went all in for it. Awaclus was my second choice, but in other games (chocolate factory reference) where I went for my second choice it ended poorly. So I just went for you.
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Also, did Avocados come up because I brought it up, or was that a weird coincidence?
Coincidence. If you look at the Mod QT you'll see I had flavour names down right at the start. The only thing I changed was "Coffee Cake" became "Double Espresso Cake" cos I realised that was just a perfect fit.
I'm rereading for MVP now, screw errands.
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I kind of think I should get the MVP here.. I didn't have the Hydrad read, but I was on Egor early, and I chose correctly in the end. I was on the RR and Lekkit mislynches, but I think those were pretty hard to read as town, given how the game went.
And you also didn't help with my lynch.
Yeah, as it got later into that day I started thinking that it wasn't you. But I also didn't do a whole lot that day; that lynch went through basically without my input.
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My least favorite lynch was the RR one, but I mean, even then, I was the hammer....
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Yeah, no reason not to go:
Witherweaver is MVP. Well played, sir.
Shouts to Teproc (who had scary good reads while he was around), and also to e, who for about 70% of the game had absolutely godlike reads.
Also (much as it pains me) to Awaclus, who in spite of everything came spectacularly close to saving the game from scum.
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Yeah, no reason not to go:
Witherweaver is MVP. Well played, sir.
Shouts to Teproc (who had scary good reads while he was around), and also to e, who for about 70% of the game had absolutely godlike reads.
Also (much as it pains me) to Awaclus, who in spite of everything came spectacularly close to saving the game from scum.
I think that is a great MVP nod
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I'm super confused. I thought Awaclus was a confirmed IC here, because if he had been scum in this game, he would have had to get a sub becasue he doesn't have enough time to make six different false quicktopics.
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Yeah, no reason not to go:
Witherweaver is MVP. Well played, sir.
Shouts to Teproc (who had scary good reads while he was around), and also to e, who for about 70% of the game had absolutely godlike reads.
Also (much as it pains me) to Awaclus, who in spite of everything came spectacularly close to saving the game from scum.
Yay, thanks.
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I'm super confused. I thought Awaclus was a confirmed IC here, because if he had been scum in this game, he would have had to get a sub becasue he doesn't have enough time to make six different false quicktopics.
Turns out he had enough time to make one false quicktopic.
Also, notice:
http://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/mNPE6ehfxKd23
7 posts total, only two of which were before the final day, and one of those was the confirmation post. QTs are far more skippable than people think.
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I think everyone did a good job here during the last day.
I want to say however that I think it's debatable to give MVPs to players who "figure it out" at LyLo. It's the thing that is most present in the mod's mind of course, and in the end WW did make a decision that could have won or lost the game. However, the scum lynches D1 and D2 were at least as important, and e was the driving force behind those. Also if you're alive until LyLo as a VT, that is usually a sign that you did something wrong. You did not play townie enough to tempt mafia to nightkill you, and VTs want to be nightkilled to protect PRs. That is of course less of an issue in this game, when the first 4 kills were all ICs. Still e got killed over WW, meaning he played more townie. Ww just didn't do much until the very end, and that is why scum (i.e. Awaclus) felt comfortable leaving him alive.
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I don't really disagree, but it was the third successful LyLo for me, so it's nice to get a nod for one of them :)
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I think everyone did a good job here during the last day.
I want to say however that I think it's debatable to give MVPs to players who "figure it out" at LyLo. It's the thing that is most present in the mod's mind of course, and in the end WW did make a decision that could have won or lost the game. However, the scum lynches D1 and D2 were at least as important, and e was the driving force behind those. Also if you're alive until LyLo as a VT, that is usually a sign that you did something wrong. You did not play townie enough to tempt mafia to nightkill you, and VTs want to be nightkilled to protect PRs. That is of course less of an issue in this game, when the first 4 kills were all ICs. Still e got killed over WW, meaning he played more townie. Ww just didn't do much until the very end, and that is why scum (i.e. Awaclus) felt comfortable leaving him alive.
Dude, I just reread the whole game.
WW's reads were stone-cold incredible all the way through the game. e was close behind for the reasons you mentioned, but every time e had a good read, so did WW. And WW got it right at LyLo on top of that.
Forgive me if this comes off as defensive. But after this game of all games, I'd react defensively to anything.
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I agree e had a really great game.
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I think everyone did a good job here during the last day.
I want to say however that I think it's debatable to give MVPs to players who "figure it out" at LyLo. It's the thing that is most present in the mod's mind of course, and in the end WW did make a decision that could have won or lost the game. However, the scum lynches D1 and D2 were at least as important, and e was the driving force behind those. Also if you're alive until LyLo as a VT, that is usually a sign that you did something wrong. You did not play townie enough to tempt mafia to nightkill you, and VTs want to be nightkilled to protect PRs. That is of course less of an issue in this game, when the first 4 kills were all ICs. Still e got killed over WW, meaning he played more townie. Ww just didn't do much until the very end, and that is why scum (i.e. Awaclus) felt comfortable leaving him alive.
Dude, I just reread the whole game.
WW's reads were stone-cold incredible all the way through the game. e was close behind for the reasons you mentioned, but every time e had a good read, so did WW. And WW got it right at LyLo on top of that.
Forgive me if this comes off as defensive. But after this game of all games, I'd react defensively to anything.
Maybe WW's reads just didn't stick out to me as much. Anyway I'm not so much trying to argue that WW doesn't deserve the title - he does - but instead point to a larger issue that I have seen in various games.
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I feel like Awaclus has been scum in more games than town in the games I've been in
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Just wanted to put out a thanks to ashersky for comodding. I definitely needed someone to lend a hand, particularly since I always ended up not being about for crucial things.
I leant pretty hard, so thanks ash. :)
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Thanks for the comments about my play. I have to admit one reason I tunneled silverspawn was because I knew if he was scum I would get mvp if he were scum. I really did think he could have been the last scum, and I wanted to make sure if I lost I didn't lose to scum!silverspawn (or had I been alive the next day scum!awaclus).
WW did have a good game though. He was correctly on all 3 scum lynches. I always say the vote record is the one thing that doesn't lie, and he lynched all the scum and helped town win, so a good MVP nod.
I feel like I was close here in M75, closer in M76, but watch out. I will get that MVP eventually.
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I think being NK early and being NK'd late or not being NK'd at all are all about equal
If you get NK'd one day later, it means you weren't as towny.
If you get NK'd one day later, it means you avoided mislynch one more day.
So-- since e pushed my lynch, I'd say WW deserves it a bit more. Otherwise, probably e.
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Thanks for the comments about my play. I have to admit one reason I tunneled silverspawn was because I knew if he was scum I would get mvp if he were scum. I really did think he could have been the last scum, and I wanted to make sure if I lost I didn't lose to scum!silverspawn (or had I been alive the next day scum!awaclus).
WW did have a good game though. He was correctly on all 3 scum lynches. I always say the vote record is the one thing that doesn't lie, and he lynched all the scum and helped town win, so a good MVP nod.
I feel like I was close here in M75, closer in M76, but watch out. I will get that MVP eventually.
If I could give 2...
You both had great games.
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I also basically decided two days ago, but I wanted to hold off and see how Amph and Awaclus behaved. I was about to jump come and vote Awaclus, but he had already voted when I checked in. Not sure if it would have made a difference, but then the decision would have been up to Amph. I suppose he was going to go for Awaclus regardless.
I was pretty much set on Awaclus shortly after I started re-reading. I felt I was in the position of being slightly more towny than either of you, and was hoping that I wouldn't have had to start the vote. If you went for Awaclus, I was going to follow it right away though.
Great game to all, special thanks to Awaclus for humoring me all game :)
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And yes, I put big stock on Faust and e's comments this game - the two of you were very helpful in my rereads - thanks!
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Ampharos plays a scummy town game up until the end, and then delivers when it counts. I like his style.
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I think being NK early and being NK'd late or not being NK'd at all are all about equal
If you get NK'd one day later, it means you weren't as towny.
If you get NK'd one day later, it means you avoided mislynch one more day.
So-- since e pushed my lynch, I'd say WW deserves it a bit more. Otherwise, probably e.
I'm just bitter because I never make it to LyLo as town.
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I'm super confused. I thought Awaclus was a confirmed IC here, because if he had been scum in this game, he would have had to get a sub becasue he doesn't have enough time to make six different false quicktopics.
Well, I thought that counting on that making me an IC had at least the potential of being a good play. As it turns out, I really should just have /outed.
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I'm super confused. I thought Awaclus was a confirmed IC here, because if he had been scum in this game, he would have had to get a sub becasue he doesn't have enough time to make six different false quicktopics.
Well, I thought that counting on that making me an IC had at least the potential of being a good play. As it turns out, I really should just have /outed.
I think if you didn't tall about the QT stuff at all, and didn't try to make one, it may have made the difference.
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WW is like Leo. He had to get it at some point right (I'm sure WW's got plenty of MVPs before but you know what I mean).
Now, I do feel a bit queasy about... something related to QT quoting, yay. Sorry about that, though it's not about the main issue, it's about Ampharos quoting me specifically. It feels wrong to me ? Mainly because someone who knows me well could recognize my style and figure that those quotes were definitely not fabricated, especially by someone like Ampharos who hasn't played that much with me. Now, the quotes being true don't mean they come from town I suppose, but it still seems a bit problematic.
Oh, and I do want to apologize to Haddock for having the start of the game get so... dramatic. I would not have liked to have to deal with all that crap as a first-time mod, and it's worth pointing out that Haddock handled it as well as could be, so thanks for that.
e, have you never gotten an MVP ? Maybe you're the real Leo in this situation. Gotta start doing memes about it.
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My writing of the Teproc rule (see my latest set of rules) covers this completely.
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I just read the speccy.
I feel the urge to allow QT quoting in all my future games just to make a statement for Awaclus. I guess that's not the best reason to do so.
Well, if you don't want me to play your games, then simply add the rule "you can't sign up for this game if your name Awaclus". It's a far simpler and better way to do it than breaking the game to the point where you can be sure I won't want to play it.
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WW is like Leo. He had to get it at some point right (I'm sure WW's got plenty of MVPs before but you know what I mean).
Now, I do feel a bit queasy about... something related to QT quoting, yay. Sorry about that, though it's not about the main issue, it's about Ampharos quoting me specifically. It feels wrong to me ? Mainly because someone who knows me well could recognize my style and figure that those quotes were definitely not fabricated, especially by someone like Ampharos who hasn't played that much with me. Now, the quotes being true don't mean they come from town I suppose, but it still seems a bit problematic.
Oh, and I do want to apologize to Haddock for having the start of the game get so... dramatic. I would not have liked to have to deal with all that crap as a first-time mod, and it's worth pointing out that Haddock handled it as well as could be, so thanks for that.
e, have you never gotten an MVP ? Maybe you're the real Leo in this situation. Gotta start doing memes about it.
Actually, I had only gotten MVP once before, but I didn't remember that I had, so it did feel like Leo to me~
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Axxle had been prodded for the second time.
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Axxle had been prodded for the second time.
Lol
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Axxle had been prodded for the second time.
I just realized I posted this in the wrong thread
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Sorry for taking about ongoing games in the wrong thread. I will mod kill myself now