Dominion Strategy Forum
Dominion => Dominion General Discussion => Topic started by: Qvist on July 25, 2014, 09:13:01 am
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I had this now a couple of times. Imagine there is a board where you want to open Doctor. But you have $3/$4 and not $4/$3. Do you in general overpay on $4 or not? You let it miss the shuffle, but can trash a card. Is that worth it?
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I think opening silver/x is usually better (adjust for the board obviously), and then hope to get a good overpay on t3 or t4 (or later)
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I think opening silver/x is usually better (adjust for the board obviously), and then hope to get a good overpay on t3 or t4 (or later)
Hm. That is also an option I haven't thought of. But it is in general wise to overpay on 3/4 when you open Silver/Doctor?
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I think opening silver/x is usually better (adjust for the board obviously), and then hope to get a good overpay on t3 or t4 (or later)
Hm. That is also an option I haven't thought of. But it is in general wise to overpay on 3/4 when you open Silver/Doctor?
You will leave 5 out of 6 cards on deck: 3 Coppers, 2 Estates and the $3 you bought. If the $3 is Ambassador, that may be a good idea, because you have almost ensured returning two Estates (only bad case is Amb on top and Estate on the bottom). You are always ensuring no collision with Amb and Doctor and given your opening, even returning one Estate and buying Silver is not such a bad deal.
However, with other $3s, that may be a bad deal. Especially with Silver, the chances to get to $5 in T3 are not great, and not so great for T4 either. Moreover, T4 gets you the $5 half a shuffle later due to the early shuffling Doctor provoked. I think if your $3 is a power card you want to be playing more (I can only think of Ambassador here, possibly Swindler?), triggering a shuffle on T2 may be a good idea, but it does not look smart otherwise.
If there is some cheap draw (Smithy, Oracle, Envoy), you are probably best getting money and trying to get a good overpay during the second shuffle to compensate the delayed Doctor buy.
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i rather buy doctor with 3$ instead of 4$ in a 3/4 opening because i don't want it to miss the reshuffle
waiting for a t3/4 buy is probably a bad idea. my op has done it once, and he was very fortunate, colliding baron with estate and 3 coppers in turn 3, and he lost anyway vs my simple 4/3 doctor opening. maybe if you have 3/4 and there's baron it's a good idea, because 4/3 >> 3/4, but otherwise, just buy it in t1.
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I'd generally do so; 50% chance of trashing an Estate is pretty sweet and I'm totally unconcerned about a "reshuffle" that consists of 5 cards only. It's still a lot worse than 4/3 obviously, but not enough so to start doing wild things like waiting for a larger overpay, which on average will be $5 or so, thus trashing only one card more in exchange for delaying actually playing it even further, a delay that is especially harmful because by the point you get to play it you have ~3 cards in your deck you don't want to trash.
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It's not really a whole shuffle. It's exactly 1 turn. The doctor shows up on average 1 turn later and the turn 3 buy 1 turn earlier. There is a 1/3 chance you hit an estate and that turn 3 buy is a $5 card (assuming turn 1 silver).
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mh yea you proabably don't trash 1 more card average if you play it one turn faster. so it's probably better to buy him with 4$ afterall, even with a 3/4 opening.
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There's also the possibility of hitting your Silver and having the Estate miss the reshuffle to hit $5 in t3. (http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140716/log.50745d1a0cf28ed55d9d6498.1405516624662.txt)
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Doctor is probably my worst card - either I buy it in an opening when I shouldn't have, or I forget to overpay for it later.
I think not opening Doctor and hoping for overpay isn't that bad, but that could be because Obi Wan thrashed me with it once.
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aiming for later overpay is workable. I'm thinking of it in comparison to how most strong trashers require you to give up a few turns to trashing. I mean, there are differences, but the point is that giving up a turn to trashing is usually worth it.
This kind of play really rewards deck tracking, naturally.
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Thanks for your input. So, everyone was doing it differently I suppose. But I see the point that missing the shuffle with 5 cards isn't that bad.