Dominion Strategy Forum

Dominion => Game Reports => Topic started by: AndrewisFTTW on May 26, 2014, 07:40:04 pm

Title: Goons will see you through
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 26, 2014, 07:40:04 pm
(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/f/fc/Plaza.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Plaza) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/e/e2/Spice_Merchant.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Spice Merchant) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/c/c4/Tournament.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Tournament) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/3/35/Stables.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Stables) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/e/e2/Goons.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Goons)
(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/6/67/Native_Village.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Native Village) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/f/fc/Oasis.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Oasis) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/8/88/Steward.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Steward) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/a/a7/Armory.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Armory) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/6/63/Noble_Brigand.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Noble Brigand)
Code: [Select]
Native Village, Oasis, Steward, Armory, Noble Brigand, Plaza, Spice Merchant, Tournament, Stables, Goons
http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140526/log.516ddc20e4b082c74d7cbc04.1401116342886.txt

Down 6 provinces, 8 duchys, and 8 estates, I somehow pull through. However, this engine took forever to get going and I'm sure I could've played it better. I made a few really obvious mistakes but let me know if I could've had it up and running any sooner.
Title: Re: Goons will see you through
Post by: JacquesTheBard on May 26, 2014, 11:45:09 pm
Others will probably leave better comments. I see that you play a lot of Goons games! The most striking thing on this board in terms of Goons engine is draw. If your opponent mirrors (this one didn't, but don't count on that in the future) you will have to run solid turns off of a 3-card hand. There are really two ways to increase handsize here: Stables, and Native Village. Each has strengths and weaknesses. Stables will swap out unwanted treasure, but needs some treasure in order to take off, which is somewhat at odds with trashing. On the other hand, native village doesn't draw except in bursts, meaning that getting good draw out of native village means a few turns of just slowly building up the mat. That's probably not what you want here.

On turn 8, I'm certain you had a better option than trashing native village. There was already some stuff on the mat, so you could have put it in hand and used Steward, or simply used Steward for draw or $ rather than trashing. The other thing is ignoring tournament. Obviously a Goons strategy can usually ignore provinces, but Trusty Steed and Followers are both decent sources of draw, and with 2 village piles you should be able to exploit them both. Princess is also very helpful when building with Goons, although it is something of a rival given how tight handspace is. Tournament is also important as virtual $. Nonetheless, given that you worked with a 5/2 split, I suppose ignoring tournament is more understandable.

Do any of the more experienced engineers know about how to balance treasure in a Stables engine?
Title: Re: Goons will see you through
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 26, 2014, 11:51:01 pm
Thanks. Yeah T8 was one of those stupid mistakes I was referring to. I'd like to hear more opinions about tournament here. I didn't want to spend a lot of time building just to afford a province and since my opponent was going all green I didn't want a lot of dead tournaments clogging up the deck. But the prizes would've been nice and denying the prizes would've been even better.
Title: Re: Goons will see you through
Post by: DG on May 27, 2014, 07:33:05 am
I think you've got to skip the native village here. It's possible to get a flying start here for a quick, decisive, goons but native villages will just slow the start down. Plaza should be your village of choice and you were right to trash the native village in your game.
Title: Re: Goons will see you through
Post by: soulnet on May 27, 2014, 08:55:07 am
Steward is draw. Together with trashing, a Plaza/Steward/Goons deck should work, even against rival Goons. I would open double Steward, trash down, get a Plaza and hoard coin tokens for Goons. If you get an early 5, take a Stables to accelerate your early game.
Title: Re: Goons will see you through
Post by: Davio on May 27, 2014, 10:09:28 am
Quote from: DG on May 27, 2014, 07:33:05 am
I think you've got to skip the native village here. It's possible to get a flying start here for a quick, decisive, goons but native villages will just slow the start down. Plaza should be your village of choice and you were right to trash the native village in your game.
NV's do make for good cheap Goons buy targets though.
And Goons shine when you can play multiple and get like 4+ tokens per buy; NV could help you with such a megaturn.
Title: Re: Goons will see you through
Post by: soulnet on May 27, 2014, 10:14:52 am
Quote from: Davio on May 27, 2014, 10:09:28 am
Quote from: DG on May 27, 2014, 07:33:05 am
I think you've got to skip the native village here. It's possible to get a flying start here for a quick, decisive, goons but native villages will just slow the start down. Plaza should be your village of choice and you were right to trash the native village in your game.
NV's do make for good cheap Goons buy targets though.
And Goons shine when you can play multiple and get like 4+ tokens per buy; NV could help you with such a megaturn.

I would just buy a pair of SM+Copper instead of two NVs. Maybe Stables+Copper is even better. Mixing Stables and SMs should sustain Copper buying reasonably.
Title: Re: Goons will see you through
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 27, 2014, 11:22:51 am
I didn't think plaza + steward would be a good enough engine so I went for stables. But trashing down coppers and going for stables didn't seem to work so well. As soon as I started buying plazas and using stewards for draw, everything started coming together.