Dominion Strategy Forum

Dominion => Game Reports => Help! => Topic started by: AndrewisFTTW on May 18, 2014, 02:53:32 am

Title: Big Monies
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 18, 2014, 02:53:32 am
(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/5/5e/Marauder.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Marauder) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/c/cf/Talisman.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Talisman) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/1/12/Trader.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Trader) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/3/37/Mystic.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Mystic) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/6/62/Vault.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Vault)
(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/8/8d/Scheme.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Scheme) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/0/05/Smugglers.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Smugglers) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/b/b4/Bishop.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Bishop) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/c/c8/Caravan.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Caravan) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/8/8a/Fortress.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Fortress)
Code: [Select]
Scheme, Smugglers, Bishop, Caravan, Fortress, Marauder, Talisman, Trader, Mystic, Vault


http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140517/log.516ddc20e4b082c74d7cbc04.1400394494736.txt

First of all, I'm curious about our openings. I went trader/scheme thinking that trader is good defense against a possible marauder and maybe I can pick up a few silvers early on, and I can use scheme to put my vaults back on top of the deck. He went smugglers/talisman. I was jealous of his smugglers a little bit but I'm not sure about the talisman or really if just silver/silver is best here.

The other thing I'm curious about is his bishop/fortress strategy. I don't think he utilized this strategy as well as he could've but I think if he did it could've been viable given that there's no +buy. What do you think?

And lastly, how did I lose this game? I got two platinums before he got one, I got a couple vaults before he did and I thought my deck was thinner or at least I was buying more money instead of marauder, talisman, fortress, etc. My attitude towards caravan is that it's just a good card that fits anywhere. Is this wrong or does it really have a place here?

Yes, I'm aware it's 2:53am while I'm posting this. Shutup. And thank you.
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: SCSN on May 18, 2014, 03:26:52 am
Bishop-Fortress is very strong on its own and here it has great support in the form of Scheme, Caravan and Talisman. I'd open Talisman/Silver and get 2 Bishops and maybe some Caravans before switching to Fortresses. If my opponent mirrors I'd wait with Caravans until the Fortresses are gone, as with it being the only Village the split is going to be important. As P2 I'd open Talisman/Smugglers against a Talisman/Silver open.
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: liopoil on May 18, 2014, 08:38:10 am
I like bishop/fortress too, but how are you going to get enough trashing, especially with marauder on the board?
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: SCSN on May 18, 2014, 08:58:21 am
You just get multiple Bishops. Marauder is awful here and not a problem for the Bishop player at all as it junks very slowly.
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: KingZog3 on May 18, 2014, 11:43:38 am
You can play 4 Bishops a turn with just Bishop+Fortress. Because there is Caravan for cantrip draw, you can probably do more than that. SCSN explained it well, and I have no doubt that Bishop-Fortress will win here.
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 18, 2014, 12:03:58 pm
So bishop, caravan, and fortress are the three piles?
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: KingZog3 on May 18, 2014, 12:12:44 pm
Quote from: AndrewisFTTW on May 18, 2014, 12:03:58 pm
So bishop, caravan, and fortress are the three piles?

Yeah, or never end. You have infinite points if your opponent doesn't go for Bishop Fortress. Otherwise yeah, those are the three piles.
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: GeoLib on May 19, 2014, 01:54:25 am
Quote from: KingZog3 on May 18, 2014, 12:12:44 pm
Quote from: AndrewisFTTW on May 18, 2014, 12:03:58 pm
So bishop, caravan, and fortress are the three piles?

Yeah, or never end. You have infinite points if your opponent doesn't go for Bishop Fortress. Otherwise yeah, those are the three piles.

inb4 SirPeebles complains about the use of infinite here :P

To add something on topic. Bishop/Fortress is great here and looks winning to me. Now you've heard it from me and not just SCSN.
Title: Re: Big Monies
Post by: qmech on May 19, 2014, 03:41:22 am
Quote from: GeoLib on May 19, 2014, 01:54:25 am
inb4 SirPeebles complains about the use of infinite here :P

There's a sense in which it's reasonable to use "infinite" to mean arbitrarily large.  Imagine a typical file system that contains any finite number of folders, each of which contains any finite number of files.  If you want to give labels to the individual files in a way that behaves nicely when you add more files and folders, then one natural approach is list the number of the folder, then the number of the file within its folder.  The order type of the set of possible labels is omega^2.

You can also find examples in chess played on a infinite board.  A mate in omega is a position where the first player can guarantee a win, but the second player can ensure that the game lasts longer than any fixed number of turns that they choose.  (One way this can happen is to have the white King and a black Rook in a large clear area.  The black player then has one chance to more the Rook arbitrarily far out, where it can proceed to harass the white King with checks until it waddles out to meet him.)  The game will always only have finite length, but there is a precise sense in which it will last longer than any specified finite length, so it's sensible to say that the game has length omega.  (You can also build games of some higher ordinal lengths in a similar way.)