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[faust]

That means I’m just a VT now so I guess if you all want to lynch me not too much is lost. Other than a chance to hit scum.

So you decided it's a good idea to let scum know that they can safely kill Raptor now?

[raerae]

Also, Joth, you should probably offer some explanation of why the IC didn't survive a single night when we have an alleged doctor in the game.

I doctored raptor. I’m a 2-shot Doctor. That made me think that perhaps raptor’s a 2-shot cop and lied about being 1-shot. It’s an old trick to keep scum from NKing you. But I also figured scum would see through it. If I’m scum I shoot cop over IC every time.

Who did you doctor night one?

[Joseph2302]

That means I’m just a VT now so I guess if you all want to lynch me not too much is lost. Other than a chance to hit scum.

So you decided it's a good idea to let scum know that they can safely kill Raptor now?

Well he could be a 3 shot doctor, or just a full doctor. As per the reasoning they applied above for raptor being 1 or 2 shot

[Joseph2302]

Also if joth is scum, they have had ample time to think of fake doctor targets

[Joseph2302]

Because cop is better kill than IC, but scum could decide to WIFOM instead to make the fake doctor claiming easier than killing cop and "doctoring" IC

[SpaceAnemone]

Raptor can’t pull that off as scum, as there was no reasonable way for him to know MiX was Traitor if he himself is scum, and it’s a dumb 1-1 trade if he’s wrong and MiX flips town.

Sure, I agree with reasonably high confidence that Raptor wouldn't have done that as scum.

However, I think we need to consider the possibility that the scum team could work out that MiX was one of theirs. This is especially true by D2, when they'd have had time to talk about it with each other during N1 and combine observations.

[SpaceAnemone]

As before, I think there's a good chance that Joth is scum, but it's especially backed up by the way MiX behaved on the Joth wagon at the end of D1.

You're going to have to explain that some more.

I think I already put forward a case on Joth, stated a bunch of suspicion around his oh-so-convenient claim, and pointed out that MiX's illogical and unhelpful behaviour on that wagon -- which he himself admitted later was anti-town -- looked a lot like trying to move the lynch towards Shraeye and away from Joth.

Now I'm pointing out that we know for sure that MiX knew exactly who all the scum are, so his behaviour on the Joth wagon looks even more suspicious, meaning my suspicion on Joth is strong coming into D3.

Is there anything here you feel doesn't follow logically?

[jotheonah]

That means I’m just a VT now so I guess if you all want to lynch me not too much is lost. Other than a chance to hit scum.

So you decided it's a good idea to let scum know that they can safely kill Raptor now?

Sure. Or I have a third shot and I’m baiting them into targeting raptor so I can use it and prevent a nightkill. See the WIFOM MerryGoRound goes round and round no matter what I say. That’s the beauty of it.

[Eevee]

I (somewhat weirdly) now think that joth is townier than I thought he was yesterday.

[faust]

I think I already put forward a case on Joth, stated a bunch of suspicion around his oh-so-convenient claim, and pointed out that MiX's illogical and unhelpful behaviour on that wagon -- which he himself admitted later was anti-town -- looked a lot like trying to move the lynch towards Shraeye and away from Joth.

I just went through all your posts and couldn't find where you explained how MiX behaved illogically and unhelpful and how that connects him to joth, so I would really like if you could go into more detail.

[SpaceAnemone]

I (somewhat weirdly) now think that joth is townier than I thought he was yesterday.

How do you feel about the extent to which Joth is avoiding Raerae's question?

For that matter, how do you feel about Raerae's persistence in re-asking?

[SpaceAnemone]

I think I already put forward a case on Joth, stated a bunch of suspicion around his oh-so-convenient claim, and pointed out that MiX's illogical and unhelpful behaviour on that wagon -- which he himself admitted later was anti-town -- looked a lot like trying to move the lynch towards Shraeye and away from Joth.

I just went through all your posts and couldn't find where you explained how MiX behaved illogically and unhelpful and how that connects him to joth, so I would really like if you could go into more detail.

Oh, sorry! I recall having called MiX on his jumpiness during the D1 deadline and then him admitting in D2 that he had been playing in an anti-town way. I thought I'd mentioned that in my justification for voting him D2, but perhaps I didn't. Anyway, the combination of him flipping scum and having apparently protected Joth means my suspicion level on Joth is undwindled. If you'd like even more detail, I'll have to look out some relevant post numbers when I'm home late tonight.

[faust]

I think I already put forward a case on Joth, stated a bunch of suspicion around his oh-so-convenient claim, and pointed out that MiX's illogical and unhelpful behaviour on that wagon -- which he himself admitted later was anti-town -- looked a lot like trying to move the lynch towards Shraeye and away from Joth.

I just went through all your posts and couldn't find where you explained how MiX behaved illogically and unhelpful and how that connects him to joth, so I would really like if you could go into more detail.

Oh, sorry! I recall having called MiX on his jumpiness during the D1 deadline and then him admitting in D2 that he had been playing in an anti-town way. I thought I'd mentioned that in my justification for voting him D2, but perhaps I didn't. Anyway, the combination of him flipping scum and having apparently protected Joth means my suspicion level on Joth is undwindled. If you'd like even more detail, I'll have to look out some relevant post numbers when I'm home late tonight.

That would be nice. I only got to skim D1 so far and it seemed like MiX voted for joth a bunch of times, so it confused me to hear that he defended joth.

[jotheonah]

I (somewhat weirdly) now think that joth is townier than I thought he was yesterday.

How do you feel about the extent to which Joth is avoiding Raerae's question?

For that matter, how do you feel about Raerae's persistence in re-asking?

sorry, what question am I avoiding?

[jotheonah]

Also, Joth, you should probably offer some explanation of why the IC didn't survive a single night when we have an alleged doctor in the game.

I doctored raptor. I’m a 2-shot Doctor. That made me think that perhaps raptor’s a 2-shot cop and lied about being 1-shot. It’s an old trick to keep scum from NKing you. But I also figured scum would see through it. If I’m scum I shoot cop over IC every time.

Who did you doctor night one?

MiX. I thought I already shared that.

[jotheonah]

I can't super remember why. I thought he came off pretty towny at the end of the day. I had no idea who scum would target -- in fact I wouldn't have used my shot at all except I figured they were probably going to target me, so I might as well.

Although in retrospect that makes no sense, since there's no universe in which both I die and my shot does anything.

So probably should have saved it.

[faust]

Although in retrospect that makes no sense, since there's no universe in which both I die and my shot does anything.

So probably should have saved it.

I mean, I can think of a universe, but yes, it's very unlikely.

[jotheonah]

Although in retrospect that makes no sense, since there's no universe in which both I die and my shot does anything.

So probably should have saved it.

I mean, I can think of a universe, but yes, it's very unlikely.

I mean, imagine if there was a vig who targeted MiX and I actually saved him! That would suck.
This is clearly not going to go down in history as my best game. But I'm not scum! Just incompetent town.

[Maxford]

It's official: LaLight and Eevee are one and the same to me. I hadn't even noticed LL only had 3 posts!

Vote: LaLight

What do people usually do when they "breadcrumb"? Is the thing I'm quoting the type of things to look for? It's so arbitrary though, Mix has loads of posts!

Also, how hard do you think Mix wanted his scumbuddies to know he was the traitor?

[Maxford]

As before, I think there's a good chance that Joth is scum, but it's especially backed up by the way MiX behaved on the Joth wagon at the end of D1.

You're going to have to explain that some more.

I think I already put forward a case on Joth, stated a bunch of suspicion around his oh-so-convenient claim, and pointed out that MiX's illogical and unhelpful behaviour on that wagon -- which he himself admitted later was anti-town -- looked a lot like trying to move the lynch towards Shraeye and away from Joth.

Now I'm pointing out that we know for sure that MiX knew exactly who all the scum are, so his behaviour on the Joth wagon looks even more suspicious, meaning my suspicion on Joth is strong coming into D3.

Is there anything here you feel doesn't follow logically?

Why are you not voting for him then?

[Maxford]

Although in retrospect that makes no sense, since there's no universe in which both I die and my shot does anything.

So probably should have saved it.

I mean, I can think of a universe, but yes, it's very unlikely.

I mean, imagine if there was a vig who targeted MiX and I actually saved him! That would suck.
This is clearly not going to go down in history as my best game. But I'm not scum! Just incompetent town.

faust is not taking into account that the universe he's thinking about would be a bad universe for town, weird... unless you have another scenario in mind, faust?

[faust]

Although in retrospect that makes no sense, since there's no universe in which both I die and my shot does anything.

So probably should have saved it.

I mean, I can think of a universe, but yes, it's very unlikely.

I mean, imagine if there was a vig who targeted MiX and I actually saved him! That would suck.
This is clearly not going to go down in history as my best game. But I'm not scum! Just incompetent town.

faust is not taking into account that the universe he's thinking about would be a bad universe for town, weird... unless you have another scenario in mind, faust?

I was mostly just nitpicky. But I was entertaining an idea were scum had a 1-shot Paranoid Gun Owner (a role that kill a player wo targets them) and joth could save a player who targeted them.

[raerae]

I'm buying nothing that joth is selling. MiX was dynamite fishing for PRs here and joth called him out on it.

am I at L-1? do I need to claim?

You're at L-2 and you needed to claim like 3 days ago.

Somebody really wants to know what the PRs are, huh?

Then says,

I was planning not to protect anyone tonight, tbh, since no one itt is towny enough to be an obvious nightkill.

I guess now I'm an obvious nightkill. Maybe I can self-target.

Indicating he knows he shouldn't use his power N1.  So tell me, what self-respecting doctor uses their power when they're likely to be the NK on the guy they think is trying to force claims?

Vote: joth

[Joseph2302]

I'm buying nothing that joth is selling. MiX was dynamite fishing for PRs here and joth called him out on it.

am I at L-1? do I need to claim?

You're at L-2 and you needed to claim like 3 days ago.

Somebody really wants to know what the PRs are, huh?

Then says,

I was planning not to protect anyone tonight, tbh, since no one itt is towny enough to be an obvious nightkill.

I guess now I'm an obvious nightkill. Maybe I can self-target.

Indicating he knows he shouldn't use his power N1.  So tell me, what self-respecting doctor uses their power when they're likely to be the NK on the guy they think is trying to force claims?

Vote: joth

I agree, this seems like bullshit- well spotted raerae
Vote: joth

[Maxford]

I (somewhat weirdly) now think that joth is townier than I thought he was yesterday.

Why?