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[LaLight]

like I don't feel like I'm going to change my mind about lalight. I'm pretty sure I'm voting him no matter what. should I wait or does it really matter.

So you don't vote to seem more townlike?

[iguanaiguana]

Mod Question: if a person puts up disguise and gets lunched, do we see a disguise or his/her actual role?

I can't answer questions about disguise mechanics in thread.

[iguanaiguana]

Quick thoughts. I'm interested in people's take on these, but not really in debating them.

First: My commute was, in fact, 1-shot. Used early, couldn't use again to save myself or Mcmc.

Second: I think two nights ago it wasn't worth risking the shot against me from scum's perspective not knowing the above to be true or not.

Third: I think that last night it was worth risking it because I was VLA and there was a solid chance (based on what I had stated) that even if it wasn't 1-shot, I wouldn't be able to get a night action in. This is mostly and inconsequentially true - I pre-submitted my night action to neighborize Mcmc again, but had absolutely no access until today.

Fourth: If you're risking that I'm not , or can't be, commuting, then why shoot Mcmc over me, when my death could enable a double kill? This leans pretty strongly towards Robz being scum, but I'll look at the other options here too:

Say LaLight is scum with Robz. He kills me, there's no chance Robz doesn't get lynched today. Zero. Same story for Hydrad as scum with Robz. So if Robz is scum, killing me is out of the question. That leaves Mcmc or Hydrad/LaLight. Not killing Mcmc here would almost certainly result in the instant lynch of the remaining player, yes? If LaLight had killed Hydrad or vice versa, then almost certainly it would've ended poorly for scum - Mcmc and I both would've voted for the remaining player (not Robz), and if the game still didn't end, then Robz on the final day. Does anybody disagree with this? Thus the only logical kill is Mcmc.

But that's all scum!Robz analysis though. Let's look at town!Robz. Here, the choice not to kill me last night is based entirely around framing Robz today. Had we both died last night, the game would now be Hydrad/LaLight/Mcmc - and this is fine for scum, unless they're certain that Mcmc gets it right. So instead, they kill Mcmc, try to frame Robz, hope we mislynch him, kill me at night, and end with LaLight/Hydrad.

Mod Question: In the instance of 1 Town Player, 1 Scum Player, and 1 Restless Spirit, would the game end?

If the game is over, then mis-lynching Robz is definitely the play for scum here - that's probably an easier sell than facing off against Mcmc.

Here's the catch:

If there are two scum left, Robz+X, and the answer to my question is that the game would be over, then we've already lost - lynch either scum today, the remaining scum kills me, and it's 1v1 tomorrow. Unless that scum can't kill. This is notable only because it's possible that scum!traitor!Robz doesn't have an inheritable kill once all remaining scum are dead. If the answer to my question is that the game would end then:

Either Robz can't be scum
Or
Robz can't kill as scum

And in either case lynching him is the wrong play

If the answer to my question is that the game would continue, then killing Robz is absolutely the correct play, as it would allow EFHW to have the final decision between Hydrad and LaLight on the final day.

I italicized the above because that was Mcmc's last suggestion to me in our QT. He also strongly believed LaLight to be the final scum, but thought it better to lynch Robz today.

I want to think on things some more. Like what if there's only one scum left, and it's Robz. Would he have killed Hydrad instead of Mcmc to frame LaLight? After lynching LaLight today he would've gone 1v1 against me or Mcmc with EFHW the deciding vote - which he loses. Although he probably loses all 1v1's with EFHW deciding to be fair.

I also want to consider LaLight's claim some more.

For now, shower, food, and bed.

EFHW is not alive. Any faction wins when their win condition is met.

[Hydrad]

like I don't feel like I'm going to change my mind about lalight. I'm pretty sure I'm voting him no matter what. should I wait or does it really matter.

So you don't vote to seem more townlike?

sure I guess you could say that. especially since I am town.

Either way I'm going to sleep.

[LaLight]

What if we already lynched one of the scums disguised by town and only Robz is left

[Hydrad]

Well one last thing before I sleep then. I myself am disguised and it just mentions that if an investigation is used on me I will show up as scum. It says nothing about the flip.

[LaLight]

Well one last thing before I sleep then. I myself am disguised and it just mentions that if an investigation is used on me I will show up as scum. It says nothing about the flip.

Given that there is no town/scum investigation that seems weird.

[EFHW]

unvote: Lalight

[Galzria]

Alright, Iguana's response means there can't be two scum left.

Robz, Hydrad, please vote LaLight. Let's find out the truth.

[LaLight]

Alright, Iguana's response means there can't be two scum left.

Robz, Hydrad, please vote LaLight. Let's find out the truth.

You’ll find out the truth alright

[LaLight]

But we won’t win

[Robz888]

Alright, Iguana's response means there can't be two scum left.

Robz, Hydrad, please vote LaLight. Let's find out the truth.

I think it's possible for there to be two scum left, but that we will have lost if there is.

If there's only one scum left, I'm not totally sure it's LaLight instead of hydrad.

[Robz888]

Like, I presume the scum wincon is to eliminate all the town, so even though EFHW doesn't count, her vote can still prevent them from having lynch majority.

The problem, which I have now realized, is that if hydrad and LL are both scum, and we lynch hydrad, then LL kills you tonight (since you can't commute), I die as well, and then that's it, game over.

Iguana would not call the came here in this scenario, because technically LL could shoot me instead of you, and then there would be another day where you and EFHW could outvote him. This would be stupid and wrong but it's not like totally confirmed objectivly that killing you is a double kill, so I believe iguana would not end the game here.

So we've lost in that scenario. Trouble is I am having trouble understanding how there were only two scum in this game.

[Galzria]

I mapped out the way the scum count made sense this game:

2 in 9 is standard
3 in 13 is standard
2 1/2 with you as a Traitor is pretty reasonable. Especially given your increased strength due to your PR.

From a 2 1/2 base, we can look at how alignment changes could alter the game:

Assume Hydrad changed from town to scum. The new game state is:
3 1/2 scum out of 12. This is slightly favored towards scum (4 of 12 actual players), but with good use of town PR's (Haddok & Swan were both strong, as was IDPTG's one shot when used correctly) town isn't completely outmatched.

Assume you change from scum to town. The new game state is 2 scum out of 12. This is favored towards town - but with Gkrieg being 1 shot death proof, it's not completely unbalanced. It definitely gives scum a 1-up mushroom here.

Assume you and Hydrad both switch alignment. The new gamestate is 3 scum out of 12. This is pretty close to balanced evenly for both factions.

So in all, the game started balanced, with the potential to swing both ways slightly, or remain pretty balanced if everything flipped.

[Robz888]

I guess there's the gkrieg thing.

[Hydrad]

Vote: Lalight

EFHW. I'm so sorry if we are wrong lol since you have been against us almost the whole time.

[Galzria]

Robz, hammer away.

Did you Modern Community me again?

[Robz888]

Robz, hammer away.

Did you Modern Community me again?

Nope!

[Robz888]

Deliberately not hammering here.

[Robz888]

You're really sure it's LL and not hydrad?

[Galzria]

You're really sure it's LL and not hydrad?

Obviously not! Haha. I was more sure about faust. But faust and Mcmc both thought so, and I do as well. And... Yeah.

[Robz888]

You're really sure it's LL and not hydrad?

Obviously not! Haha. I was more sure about faust. But faust and Mcmc both thought so, and I do as well. And... Yeah.

Okay, well, I trust what they thought more than I trust myself trying to figure it out now, I guess.

Vote: LL

[LaLight]

just... awesome

[Galzria]

just... awesome

Well?

[Robz888]

just... awesome

Ack you got me GG? Is that what you meant?