Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

501

Dominion Isotropic / Re: Dougz - I would like to send you money

« on: August 17, 2012, 08:34:49 am »

Ok, ok, I'll be as gracious as I can.  :-)  It's totally not necessary — the site was a labor of love, mostly — but dougz@isotropic.org is indeed my paypal account and I stopped turning down free money years ago.

The Palo Alto address is no longer good; I moved a couple of weeks ago (remember downtime followed by a week of frequent disconnects?).  It should still forward, actually, or you can email me for my address if you prefer avoiding paypal.

Thanks, Doug.

502

Dominion General Discussion / Re: No free promo cards at GenCon.

« on: August 16, 2012, 02:20:30 pm »

Catacombs seems like one of the better BM-enablers so far.

EDIT: It is also missing the attack portion; which is important for oracle.

I think Storeroom is an solid BM enabler, but I think it will be ever more amazing for Duchy/Duke and other Alt-VP rushes.

503

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Since the cat is out of the bag...Dominion Leaked Cards

« on: August 16, 2012, 02:02:13 pm »

I need to do the washing up but I REALLY don't want to leave the internet right now... HURRY UP PEOPLE.

For you Britons, what does "do the washing up" mean?  I can see this as either what I call "taking a shower" or "doing my laundry."  Is it either of those?  If so, which?  If not, then what?

Neither. Washing cutlery and other kitcheny stuff. I have done it now.

AKA "Doin' dishes"

Dang.  Missed that one.  Thanks for the clarification, tinas. 

504

General Discussion / Re: Music

« on: August 16, 2012, 02:00:28 pm »

I like a whole lot of music from the mainstream to the completely obscure. Actually there is very little music I find myself unable to derive any enjoyment from. My collection is outrageous in scope and size.

All that said, the band I most like that pretty much everyone recognizes and knows at least one song they dig is Modest Mouse.

I'm like a hermit when it comes to music.  I honestly do not know anything about a supposed band named Modest Mouse, nor any of its songs.

And I know, per xkcd 903 (and the alt-text on xkcd 333), that I could go find these things fairly easily.  I have very little motivation to do so, tbh.  Because in the end, I just don't find the discovery of music as compelling as the discovery of other things.

I do enjoy singing, though.  The right kinds of choral music is amazingly fun and fulfilling to sing.

505

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Since the cat is out of the bag...Dominion Leaked Cards

« on: August 16, 2012, 01:32:29 pm »

I need to do the washing up but I REALLY don't want to leave the internet right now... HURRY UP PEOPLE.

For you Britons, what does "do the washing up" mean?  I can see this as either what I call "taking a shower" or "doing my laundry."  Is it either of those?  If so, which?  If not, then what?

506

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 16, 2012, 11:19:35 am »

No. You can play BoM, and you do as much as you can, which.... in this case is nothing. So it stays in play, having done nothing.

If I have a Village and a BoM-as-Village in play, and then I play my HoP, it is worth 2.

If I have a Village and a BoM in play (due to the phenomenon described above), and then I play my HoP, it is worth 3.

Sound correct?

507

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?

« on: August 16, 2012, 11:15:45 am »

 

508

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 16, 2012, 11:15:11 am »

If this interpretation is correct, and it sounds like it is, then what happens if there are no action cards in the supply that cost less than $5? Does that mean that you can actually NOT play a Band of Misfits, making it essentially a dead $5 card in your deck?

(either the kingdom has only $5 or above cards in it, or the only cards costing less than $5 are treasure/victory cards, or all cards costing less than $5 have been emptied already)

Note that if you have Horn of Plenty, being allowed to play a Band of Misfits without having it imitate another card can make a difference in how much the HoP is worth. I'm sure there are other reasons people can come up with for wanting to play a Band of Misfits even if it's not possible to imitate another card.

Forced to play it (Throne Room, Golem).

509

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?

« on: August 16, 2012, 11:13:01 am »

.

510

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Since the cat is out of the bag...Dominion Leaked Cards

« on: August 16, 2012, 10:57:38 am »

.

511

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: The New Golden Deck

« on: August 15, 2012, 07:20:41 pm »

Well, at the very least, you can always buy more Fortresses if you're ahead to try to pile them out. You do end that turn having $4 to spend. So if theres two other cantrips costing $4 or less, then that'll do. And of course if you AND your opponent go for this, that's like... 8 bishops used up already between the two of you, maybe there'll be two more bishops which got bought earlier and got Bishopped or something. Or you can always buy and destroy them later, at the cost of a few VP.

I suspect that the situation came up rarely enough in playtesting (never?) that it turned out not to be a problem.

Yeah, I'm sure it was play-tested (since probably Fortress got play-tested with every notable TfB card). It still seems pretty awkward to 3-pile if ahead, because if you deviate at the cost of points, you are risking a loss if your opponent doesn't deviate.

I'm pretty sure as far as game theory is concerned, if you're ahead, you don't deviate, accept to match a potential increase (i.e. more than you) of per-turn-VP-chips of the losing player.  The onus is on the losing player to find something to overcome you.  If that's not possible given the cards available and the per-turn point potential of the other player, then you have a de facto victory that might nevertheless result in a "never ending" game.

I, of course, recognize the ultimate game ender: death of one of the players.

512

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 07:10:45 pm »

Is that consistent with how Throne Room interacts with Conspirator?

I think so. Why not? "Play that card twice" sets everything up for executing the card, then does that two times, each time increasing the number of actions played by one.

I find Crossroads a bit more problematic for my view, because that means that the whole card should be "copied" (or at least the name as well, and not only the play instructions).

I don't know... if Conspirator fits, then Crossroads fits.

Conspirator fits because it is counting actions played.  TR+Consp. yields +2 coin, then +1 card +1 action +2 coin.

Crossroads fits because it, too, is counting actions played (just the one kind of action "Crossroads" actually).  TR+Crossroads yields 3 actions and +[V₀] cards, then +[V₁] cards.

513

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Homage to the Best Card

« on: August 15, 2012, 06:37:18 pm »

Any baseball fans out there know what I'm referring to?

I'm going to guess Rats.

514

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 06:30:54 pm »

How about this:

You play TR-BoM, choosing to make BoM a Feast.

TR plays it the first time.  It sees BoM as a Feast.  It is trashed and you gain some card, doesn't matter what it is.  BoM goes into the trash, losing its Feast identity.

TR now has to play "it" a second time, where "it" is a Feast that has become a BoM in the trash.  The thing is, TR doesn't know what's happening in the trash.  It doesn't know that Feast changed; it lost track of it.  As far as it knows, it is still a Feast.  So TR plays Feast a second time.

That seems to me to be what DXV is saying.

515

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 06:29:57 pm »

Analogy: "Pick someone you know. Visit him at home today and ten years from now." If this person changes houses 5 years from now, would you in 10 years go to his old home to visit him?

I don't think that analogy helps you.

No, you visit the same person you visited 10 years ago.

Decoding the analogy, I see same person = same action being played, thus Feast again.

516

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?

« on: August 15, 2012, 06:26:43 pm »

.

517

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Since the cat is out of the bag...Dominion Leaked Cards

« on: August 15, 2012, 06:19:16 pm »

Just making sure I have two things right.

Fortress can't really ever end up in the trash, because once you trash it, it would just end up back in your hand... Correct?

Count, the two options, the first set of actions (the discard 2...) needs to be done before the second set of actions (+$3....)

Yes, Fortress cannot end up in the trash. You would need a way to put cards in the trash without trashing them, and that card only survives in the secret history.

You completely resolve the first choice for Count before the second choice, yes.

Or by having an impersonal (non-player) trasher.  Like the game is trashing your cards instead of you or your opponent(s) or something, thus not having a hand to go into.

518

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 06:13:14 pm »

I think TR selected an action card from your hand, which was most definitely BoM at that step, since it hasn't been (about to be) played yet.  At any rate, regardless of whether it selected BoM-as-Feast, that card is no longer BoM-as-Feast by the time TR2 rolls around.

(Obviously, Donald has prerogative to issue clarifications or errata whenever he feels, but I don't think the cards as written suggest the ruling as given for TR-BoM-Feast.)

Yes, but you're Throne Rooming a BoM-as-Feast, not a BoM simply.  To "Throne Room" something is not simply to choose it with Throne Room, but to also play it with Throne Room.  To be "activated" by Throne Room means both chosen AND put in play, and as soon as you say "play," BoM is a Feast (or whatever).  You don't stop saying "play" until the Throne Room has run it's course.

====

Essentially:

Play Throne Room.
Choose a card.  (What card?  BoM.)
Play that card twice.  (What card? BoM-as-Feast.)

vs.

Play Throne Room.
Choose a card.  (What card?  BoM.)
Play that card twice.  (What card? BoM-as-Feast.)
Play the chosen card. (BoM-as-Feast)
Reevaluate the status of the chosen card.
Play the chosen card. (BoM)

====

Scenario 1 looks like Throne Room... simple and direct.
Scenario 2 adds in a lot more that isn't simply or directly on Throne Room.

519

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 05:54:43 pm »

I sort of feel like BoM throne rooms itself.  When you play it, the instruction is to play it (again) as a different card.  It stays in play, turns into a different card, and I play it again (from in play).

This is incorrect though.  As discussed earlier in the thread, BoM's mimicry is not an on-play effect.  That is, you don't play BoM and then subsequently play it as something else.  Rather, it's very first play is already as something else -- it mimics another card before being played.

Therefore, when you play TR-BoM, TR has no idea that the card being throned was, is, or will be a BoM.  It just sees it as a Feast (or whatever you choose).  You don't actually play TR-BoM, you play TR-Feast, with the peculiarity that the Feast you are playing is really a BoM in disguise.

Even if that's the case, there's not really, I don't think, such a thing as TR-Feast.  There's TR-Card.  If it transforms just before you play it (because it says play this as) then it becomes feast for TR to play it the first time.  As part of becoming another card, it loses its transforming text until it leaves play, so Smithy wouldn't allow you to pick twice.

But if it becomes feast, gets played as feast by TR, leaves play, becomes BoM again, then the TR plays "it" again and a new selection needs to be made so that TR can play it as some other card.

Not sure what you mean there.  TR-Card is a general case, but what is that Card?  In this case, it is Feast.  And the second time, when TR plays "it", "it" still refers to Feast.

What he is saying is that the first time TR plays the BoM-as-Feast, the card is removed from play (because of its Feastiness).  At that time, BoM is no longer Feast, so it should be BoM-as-something-else for round 2 of the TR.

Unfortunately, I don't think it holds water.  Good observation, but the problem is that Round 2 of the TR does not specify that the card has to remain in play, just that the card had to have been the one selected for play.  In this case, TR selected a BoM-as-Feast, not just a BoM simply, and thus the effects of its Feastiness must be what happens during TR2.

520

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?

« on: August 15, 2012, 05:37:15 pm »

.

521

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 04:10:11 pm »

Right?

Seems right.  Throne room is telling you to play it... "Play it" in the same sense that you would if you were playing it as an action-consuming event in your action phase.  When you play BoM (for whatever reason) it is something else until it leaves play.

522

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 03:59:32 pm »

But Throne Room doesn't see Feast. When you play the Throne Room, the BoM is still in your hand, so it's not a Feast yet. All Throne Room sees at this point is a Band of Misfits.

I am not so clear on this. I played BoM as Feast. So I Throned a Feast. That seems like a reasonable way to look at it.

But the evaluation of Throne Room is prior to the determination of BoM.

Throne Room: play an action from your hand twice
>> Which action?
BoM
>> Okay!  So I'm playing BoM twice.  Go ahead with BoM 1.
BoM: I'm a Feast
... resolution of BoM as Feast (gaining 1 thing).
>> Okay! BoM 1 is done.  Go ahead with BoM 2.
BoM: I'm a Pearl Diver
... resolution of BoM as Pearl Diver.


I probably didn't need all of that.  Feel free to forget everything except the argument in the first line.

Actually I disagree with my argument here.  Pardon me all.

The text of BoM is key.  Essentially: play as X; until the card leaves play it is X.

Throne Room: play a card.
Card?
BoM.
BoM?
I'm a Village from the time I enter play until the time I leave play.
Okay... entering play... village 1
(resolve)
Still in play, village 2
(resolve)
End of Throne Room.

523

Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Band of Misfits rules questions

« on: August 15, 2012, 03:55:22 pm »

But Throne Room doesn't see Feast. When you play the Throne Room, the BoM is still in your hand, so it's not a Feast yet. All Throne Room sees at this point is a Band of Misfits.

I am not so clear on this. I played BoM as Feast. So I Throned a Feast. That seems like a reasonable way to look at it.

But the evaluation of Throne Room is prior to the determination of BoM.

Throne Room: play an action from your hand twice
>> Which action?
BoM
>> Okay!  So I'm playing BoM twice.  Go ahead with BoM 1.
BoM: I'm a Feast
... resolution of BoM as Feast (gaining 1 thing).
>> Okay! BoM 1 is done.  Go ahead with BoM 2.
BoM: I'm a Pearl Diver
... resolution of BoM as Pearl Diver.


I probably didn't need all of that.  Feel free to forget everything except the argument in the first line.

524

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Dominion uh...misconceptions

« on: August 15, 2012, 12:36:18 pm »

@rinkworks: Link please!

found it: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/485103/card-idea-super-remodel

Love this gem from rinkworks: "Oh forgive me this horrible abuse of this sacred public forum!"

The sarcasm, dripping so thickly and yet with a steady flow, was exceedingly sweet to imbibe.

525

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Dominion uh...misconceptions

« on: August 15, 2012, 12:21:02 pm »

.