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Author Topic: The Necro Wars  (Read 348100 times)

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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1950 on: November 26, 2021, 11:39:40 pm »

Quick calculation on wages

I have 10 school-hours/week at school. This means roughly 40 school-hours/month = 30 hours/month

On average, I need to get there 3 times per week, which takes about 90 minutes of cycling for both directions (actually more but sometimes I can buy groceries on the way back). So that's 1.5*3*4=18 more hours.

Then comes preparation/inefficiencies, that might be 5 hours/week, which would be 20/month.

This totals just under 70 hours/month for about 1050€, which would be exactly 15€/hour. Although this calculation isn't very generous, counting cylcling as just when it's probably reasonable exercise.

Comparatively, I get 36.75€ for editing a 7000 word document. To be competitive, that should take no longer than 2.5 hours. But there's no way I can do it in 5 hours. This means I'm realistically working for at most half the pay when there's no real need to earn more money.

It may be time to politely inform this company that I am no longer interested in working for them. I will finish this job, though.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1951 on: November 26, 2021, 11:43:40 pm »

And like yes the totally flexible hours are nice, but school preparation also has flexible hours, and it's not enough

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1952 on: November 26, 2021, 11:50:53 pm »

And being forced to get out of bed early is probably a plus

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1953 on: November 27, 2021, 01:03:47 am »

arguably lowering the voting age to 0 is giving extra votes to parents
I don't think that's fair though. I think children are pretty likely to vote differently from their parents, though it's hard to find data either way. I have on cursory glance not found anything that distinguishes between younger and older children.

I think coercion to vote is already a crime, obviously that should extend to parents. If that's the case, then children make their vote freely. Obviously they are influenced by their surrounding (i.e. their parents), but who isn't? If that is a concern, then there's no reason for stopping at children; you might as well argue that there should be just 1 vote per household.
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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1954 on: November 27, 2021, 05:01:38 am »

I just supported whatever politicians my parents supported until I was like 12. And from what I could tell at school, so did everyone else. When you're that young, it's way easier to trust your parents than it is to try to understand politics yourself.
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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1955 on: November 27, 2021, 09:02:59 am »

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1956 on: November 27, 2021, 01:19:45 pm »

Re theories of consciousness, trying to get the names straight

Dualism: consciousness and matter aare different stuff...
- Interactionism: ... and both affect each other
- Epiphenomenalism/Materialism: ... and only matter affects consciousness
Panpsychism: all matter is a little conscious
Idealism: consciousness is real, matter is an illusion
Illusionism: matter is real, consciousness is an illusion
(not naming various "theories" that say "we can't know" because that is not, in fact, a theory)

Didn't find a name for the theory that immortal souls make someone conscious, which is odd because lots of people believe that, and it is, in fact, an answer. It would definitely be part of dualism, but it feels like it should have a name. maybe it's not respected enough in academia

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1958 on: November 28, 2021, 02:04:58 pm »

If you ever wanted to know the plot of starcraft I & II, you're in luck because I just decided to see if I can recite it from memory

Prehistory

At some point in a not too distant but counterfactual future where there is space travel but no AI, humanity exiles a bunch of criminals out to space as a punishment. They land on a planet cluster somewhere. They establish a civilization ruled by the confederacy, something like a big evil government.

The "Protoss" are an alien species with advanced tech (which does not translate into vastly superior military strength because then the story wouldn't work); they sometimes attack humans but there's no all-out war. No-one knows where they come from or what they want.

Campaign I

You're a low ranking officer in the confederacy in charge of some  unimportant exploratory mission. You team up with the local Marshal called Raynor. A couple of planets are attacked by a different alien race that is entirely biological and hostile, later called Zerg. The confederacy, evil as it is, quickly abandons lots of their colonies that don't have military importance. You decide to save some unimportant colony by destroying a zerg thing. The confederacy is pissed because they wanted to study it. You decide they suck and team up with the leader of the largest rebel group called Mengsk. Together you save a bunch more people from the Zerg. Some woman named Kerrigan works for Mengsk and Raynor falls in love with her.

Inevitably some high ranking officer of the confederacy called Duke gets attacked by the Zerg and Mengsk orders you to save him. Duke subsequently joins your team. You also find out that the confederacy has been studying Zerg for a while before the attacks and controls artifacts that lure them. You steal one and place it into the center of the confederacy (also at orders from Mengsk) which of course gets overrun by Zerg. That along with a bunch of colonies joining the rebellion and the help of Duke who knows the defenses officer is enough to win the rebellion. You and Raynor get increasingly disturbed by how little regard Mengsk shows for human life. Then Kerrigan leads some mission, which ends up with her position being overrun by Zerg. Mengsk decides not to evacuate her for personal reasons (she actually killed his family, but that was when she was essentially a puppet working for the Confederacy, drugged and unable to make autonomous decisions; she was loyal to him because he freed her). Raynor and you are mad and part ways with him. Duke has no such problems and remains loyal to Mengsk. Mengsk declares himself The One True Emperor of the human race and Duke becomes something like the second in command.

Campaign II

The zerg race is controlled by a giant organism called the Overmind and a few lesser Organisms called Cerebrates, who are like giant brains that can't themselves move or fight. The cerebrates can think but are incapable of disobeying commands from the Overmind. All of the remaining zerg are mindless animals. You're a cerebrate. You oversee some cocon with something "very powerful" inside. It turns out it's Kerrigan who's been caught and is now being infested and turned into a zerg. (Their entire thing is to steal DNA from other species and mutate it.) Infested Kerrigan can think-but-not-disobey like the Cerebrates.

Cerebrates are traditionally supposed to be immortal (if they're killed, the Overmind revives them) but some subspecies of Protoss called Dark Templars can kill them for real. They kill one of the important Cerebrates. Kerrigan is happy about this because she didn't like him. The overmind makes brief contact with the mind of one of the Dark Templars and reads the  location of the Protoss home world from his mind. The Zerg attack the home world and it devolves into war and chaos.

Campaign III

You're a high ranking protoss leader on their home world (currently at war). The protoss are ruled by the Conclave, who thinks the Dark Templars are outcasts and allying with them is forbidden. The Conclave thinks they can beat the Zerg conventionally but this is totally delusional because there are way way too many zerg. Your predecessor (who was believed dead) returns. He convinces you to side against the Conclave and ally with the Dark Templars because that is The Way to beat the Zerg. This involves protoss-on-protoss violence. In the end, you kill a bunch of Cerebrates and the Conclave admits its mistake. You attack the Overmind (with the help of Raynor) and your predecessor sacrifices his life to kill it. This works.

Campaign IV

You're still the same person, now again allied with what little is left of the Conclave. The Overmind is dead but you're still fucked because the zerg don't fall over dead; they're no longer strategic but still  attack everything; besides the Cerebrates can control them as well. You flee to the home world of the outcast Dark Templar through a WARP GATE. Millions of Zerg follow you. Kerrigan shows up, saying she's no longer evil because she's no longer controlled by the Overmind (who is now dead). The guy from the conclave is having none of it but he's no longer the authority; an ultra old ultra respected Dark Templar called The Matriarch believes her. There's this ancient temple from the Xel'Naga who created the protoss and Zerg that has the power to wipe the planet free of Zerg. Kerrigan helps you activate it. The guy from the conclave rebels against you but you beat him. When you talk it through afterward, Kerrigan shows up and kills him. She tells you that she was just BSing you about being decent, using you to help her fight the Cerebrates. You proceed to use the Temple and kill every zerg on the planet. Meanwhile a new Overmind is born on the zerg homeworld

Campaign V

The UNITED EARTH DIRECTORATE (UED) shows up out of literally nowhere. You're the highest officer after the the leader DuGalle and his vice admiral and childhood friend Stukov. DuGalle first wants to get rid of the "Emperor" Mengsk. Some guy called Duran from the remains of the  confederacy joins you. You successfully attack Mengsk's palace and cause him to flee (the UED has a lot of military strength and isn't incompetent), but Raynor shows up out of nowhere and saves him, then protoss show up and save both of them. Whatever, the UED still controls the human worlds now. You get hold of some important device that takes away the ability of Zerg leaders (New Overmind/Cerebrates/Kerrigan) to control the Zerg. You use it to attack the home world of the Zerg. You kill the relatively small group of zerg that they still control and enslave the Overmind using Drugs. The UED now controls most zerg forces (the rest are controlled by Kerrigan).

During this, Duran has done some clever manipulating to convince the DuGalle that Stukov was conspiring against him. DuGalle orders him to kill Stokuv, which he does. With his last words, Stukov convinces DuGalle of what really happened, but he can't get his hands on Duran who just fucked off. So DuGalle accidently killed his super loyal childhood friend (oops), and  Mengsks isn't dead, but otherwise the mission was a success.

Campaign VI

You're the same Cerebrate from Campaign II, now obeying Kerrigan, who controls a sizeable minority of Zerg (most are controlled by the UED). Duran is also there, now obeying Kerrigan. The UED's device that takes away ability to control zerg is causing problems for her. She rallies Raynor and Mengsk and some protoss guy to help are, arguing that she's the only one who has the slightest chance to oppose the UED, which seems obviously true. Together you manage to destroy the device. Guarding this by half their army was literally the only thing the UED needed to do not to lose control, but alas others tend to become less competent when you're not the one controlling them. As payback for his help, Kerrigan promised Mengsk to destroy the UED forces on the planet where he was once emperor. She does this, he goes back to calling himself Emperor.

Once this is done, she betrays her friends, killing (a) the protoss guy who helped her and (b) Duke. She lets Mengsk live out of a weird sort of sadistic pleasure, considering him to be no threat to her now that Duke is dead.. She also doesn't kill Raynor for reasons not made explicit, but mentions that he's much smarter than Mengsk. Duran was in on it.

You go to the planet-of-the-dark-templars-now-protoss-homeworld and kidnap the Matriarch. A couple of other Dark Templar lead buy a guy called Zeratul follow you to rescue her. Kerrigan says she wants them to kill the Overmind for her, and then she'll let the Matriarch go. The Matriarch tells Zeratul to accept this offer. Zeratul kills the Overmind, but the Matriarch says she doesn't want to go back... because she's already been infested by Kerrigan! (Actually since before the start of Campaign IV.) Zeratul tries to kidnap her and forcefully get her back to the homeworld. You prevent this. Zeratul kills the Matriarch because that's better than her being a slave to Kerrigan. Kerrigan is impressed by this and lets Zeratul live so he can agonize over what he's done forever.

On the way back home, Zeratul receives signals of protoss life on some unknown moon. He investigates and finds a lab experimenting with Protoss and Zerg DNA. At the very end is a protoss zerg Hybrid creature, still in a state of coma but presumably going to wake up one day. Duran shows up. Zeratul asks if this is Kerrigan's doing but Duran says it goes way beyond Kerrigan's limited abilities or something and that he's some kind of ancient creature who's repeatedly interferred with history over the millenia (probably a Xel'Naga?) and that he's already put the Hybrid on tons of worlds and Zeratul won't ever find them all. He also says that the hybrid, which looks like an "abomination" to Duran, represents the pinnacle of both races or something. Disturbed, Zeratul goes back.

With the death of the Overmind, the zerg run rogue and the forces of the UED on the zerg home planet die quickly. The remaining UED forces, Mengsk, and the remaining protoss forces launch a surprise attack against Kerrigan, now alone as Duran has disappeared. She beats them. DuGalle commits suicide and the remaining UED forces are wiped out by the Zerg. Mengsk and the protoss go back to their home worlds. Kerrigan is effectively the ruler of the universe.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1959 on: November 28, 2021, 02:12:56 pm »

Campaign VII

Raynor is now back on the planet where Mengsk rules and decides his biggest goal is to overthrow him, even though this was totally not expected at the end of Campaign VI. You are Raynor. Raynor also has a completely different personality, now being the totally stereotypical and boring hero. he also looks completely differently. He's also a former criminal now even though this doesn't make a lot of sense.

Some old other criminal friend shows up and tells him that some company will pay them a lot of money to retrieve "alien artifacts". You start doing this. Meanwhile zero attack everything. You simultaneously rebel against Mengsk (but this turns out totally inconsequential) and collect the artifact. Mengk's son who was never mentioned before shows up out of nowhere and tells you the artifact has the power to turn Kerrigan back to human. He orders the Empire's army to escort you to the home world of the zerg, which doesn't make a lot of sense given that the Zerg outnumber you 100:1 or something, and you successfully revive Kerrigan.

Campaign VIII

You are Kerrigan who is now human but can still control zerg. For inexplicable reasons, she at some point in the campaign goes back to infesting herself, but this is also totally unimportant because this time it doesn't affect her character, but the story is no longer sophisticated enough for anyone to acknowledge this difference. You help Raynor overthrow Mengsk, who for some reason has become the arch Villain. Raynor kills Mengsk.

Campaign IX

You play the protoss forces. You back to your old home world and kill a bunch of zerg. Then you start to fight the hybrids who are now all over the place. You win. The End.

Epilogue

Didn't have the patience to play through it, so idk what happens.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1960 on: November 28, 2021, 02:16:24 pm »

I just decided to see if I can recite it from memory

Epilogue

Didn't have the patience to play through it, so idk what happens.

You would have saved a lot of effort if you had started the experiment from the epilogue.
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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1961 on: November 28, 2021, 02:18:10 pm »

I think the difference in quality between the story of SCI and SCII may be even larger than I realized before writing this, which says a lot.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1962 on: November 28, 2021, 02:22:08 pm »

You would have saved a lot of effort if you had started the experiment from the epilogue.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1963 on: November 28, 2021, 02:29:15 pm »

I think the difference in quality between the story of SCI and SCII may be even larger than I realized before writing this, which says a lot.

I presume the last 3 campaigns are from SC2 then?
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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1964 on: November 28, 2021, 02:36:23 pm »

I think the difference in quality between the story of SCI and SCII may be even larger than I realized before writing this, which says a lot.

I presume the last 3 campaigns are from SC2 then?

yup

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1965 on: November 28, 2021, 02:39:32 pm »

So like, SC1 actually begins with a rebellion story. But instead of it ending with the heroic rebels overthrowing the evil government, it ends with the ruthless rebels overthrowing the evil government and replacing it with something arguably worse, which is a very plausible outcome, historically speaking. So the story already did the rebel thing, and it did it pretty well.

Clearly, thinks the script writer, what we need to do now is tell another rebel story, only this time, we will take a gigantic step backward and make it as generic as possible.

This reminds me of something else. The most critically acclaimed album of the band Dream Theater was a concept album. It told a really out there story involving past lives and hypnosis. Then 17 years later, they decide to write another concept album. This time, they tell the story of a group of heroic rebels who overthrow the evil government with the unifying powers of MUSIC. It's got deep and thought-provoking lyrics like

[Arhys:]
We are living day to day
Forced to bear the lion's share
People just don't have the time for music anymore
And no one seems to care

(first song)

[Gabriel:]
I always had the answer
All this time I held the key
And now that I see
The reason to believe
I can be the man who I am meant to be

(last song)

Alas, it's one of the worst albums I've ever heard, with every song being soulless and boring. But more importantly, everyone hated it. I've never seen anyone rite a positive word about the story and it seems to be their most poorly received album to date.

And I don't recall a lot of people liking the story of SC2, either. It doesn't actually seem like these ultra generic things are successful as rigorously proven by my 2 datapoints. So why do them?

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1966 on: November 28, 2021, 03:10:37 pm »

To tie this into a more General Thesis About The Nature Of Art, it seems to me like a lot of creative people have a discography where they create things that are really good, and then far later attempt to replicate that and make something which on the surface looks similar, is far more hyped, anticipated & packaged, far more technically sophisticated if we're talking about a game or movie, but is far less complex and far less good. It often feels like they didn't even understand what made the original thing good in the first place, even though they were the ones who created it.

My general explanation for this is basically what Hemingway said in his speech:

Writing, at its best, is a lonely life. Organizations for writers palliate the writer’s loneliness but I doubt if they improve his writing. He grows in public stature as he sheds his loneliness and often his work deteriorates.

Only also applied to game design and composition, and with a more general mechanism of shedding loneliness.

If good art requires being lonely -- or being unhappy, or angry, or anything along those lines -- then that kind of explains things. A band used to be a group of young people passionate about their work, but over time degenerates into a bunch of normal people who do music because that's their profession. They then try to replicate their critically acclaimed work but without the emotion, and this does not work at all.

Although with SC2, I suspect that the person who wrote I-VI wasn't even the same who wrote VII-IX. In between SC1 and II, Blizzard has transformed from a small to a highly successful and much larger company, primarily because of World of Warcraft. Who knows under what conditions SC2 was even written, and how much artistic freedom was granted.

There are examples of people who retain the ability to create great art over more than a decade, but it is rare.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1967 on: November 28, 2021, 03:32:42 pm »

To tie this into a more General Thesis About The Nature Of Art, it seems to me like a lot of creative people have a discography where they create things that are really good, and then far later attempt to replicate that and make something which on the surface looks similar, is far more hyped, anticipated & packaged, far more technically sophisticated if we're talking about a game or movie, but is far less complex and far less good. It often feels like they didn't even understand what made the original thing good in the first place, even though they were the ones who created it.

My general explanation for this is basically what Hemingway said in his speech:

Writing, at its best, is a lonely life. Organizations for writers palliate the writer’s loneliness but I doubt if they improve his writing. He grows in public stature as he sheds his loneliness and often his work deteriorates.

Only also applied to game design and composition, and with a more general mechanism of shedding loneliness.

If good art requires being lonely -- or being unhappy, or angry, or anything along those lines -- then that kind of explains things. A band used to be a group of young people passionate about their work, but over time degenerates into a bunch of normal people who do music because that's their profession. They then try to replicate their critically acclaimed work but without the emotion, and this does not work at all.

Although with SC2, I suspect that the person who wrote I-VI wasn't even the same who wrote VII-IX. In between SC1 and II, Blizzard has transformed from a small to a highly successful and much larger company, primarily because of World of Warcraft. Who knows under what conditions SC2 was even written, and how much artistic freedom was granted.

There are examples of people who retain the ability to create great art over more than a decade, but it is rare.

I think there is a much more boring explanation for all of this: when an unestablished artist releases their first work, they have probably waited for a chance to get something released forever and when they do finally release something, that's usually the best idea they ever had while dozens of others got discarded. Then that best idea they ever had gets released and all of a sudden they're an established artist and they're expected to pull off another amazing job even though they already spent the best idea they had.

The people who retain the ability to create great art over more than a decade simply work so fast that in the time it takes a normal person to come up with something, they've already come up with several things and can choose the best one and discard the rest.
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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1968 on: November 28, 2021, 03:57:22 pm »

But the best album of most bands isn't their first album. I mean sometimes it is, but it's also often their second, third, or forth.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1969 on: November 28, 2021, 03:58:06 pm »

And also, the good albums don't tend to take longer than the bad ones, quite the opposite.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1970 on: November 28, 2021, 04:54:50 pm »

But the best album of most bands isn't their first album. I mean sometimes it is, but it's also often their second, third, or forth.

That's true. Some bands have enough ideas at the start that they're able to save the best for a bit later, perhaps hoping that they'll have a better budget or more experience or a larger fanbase or something by then. We pretty much did that with Birds of Necama, it's been a while so I don't remember the official reason anymore but I feel like it had to do with the fact that the better albums would have been bigger projects, and getting the 4-song EP done with no experience was already challenging enough.

That being said, I can't really think of any bands that had a substantial drop in quality after an album that wasn't either their first or their second, unless they underwent lineup changes. I even skimmed through my music library and didn't find any examples; either they sucked by their third album, or their newest was still great.

And also, the good albums don't tend to take longer than the bad ones, quite the opposite.

That's consistent with my hypothesis that they're using ideas they already had, as opposed to coming up with new ones.
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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1971 on: November 28, 2021, 05:29:28 pm »

That being said, I can't really think of any bands that had a substantial drop in quality after an album that wasn't either their first or their second

woah. Agalloch? Opeth? Dream Theater? Yes? Godspeed you! Black Emperor? (admittedly only if you count the EP, but it's 30 minutes so you should.) Even Nightwish?

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1972 on: November 28, 2021, 05:30:02 pm »

I'm also curious what you think is your best album.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1973 on: November 28, 2021, 06:45:36 pm »

That being said, I can't really think of any bands that had a substantial drop in quality after an album that wasn't either their first or their second

woah. Agalloch? Opeth? Dream Theater? Yes? Godspeed you! Black Emperor? (admittedly only if you count the EP, but it's 30 minutes so you should.) Even Nightwish?

Well, I think Dream Theater and Nightwish had drops in quality after Mike Portnoy and Tarja Turunen departed, respectively. I haven't listened enough to the other bands to have an opinion on them.

I'm also curious what you think is your best album.

At the moment I'm less excited about Essence because I have recently heard the songs a gorillion times, but if I'm picking an example song for someone who has never heard any of our music, I pretty much don't even consider picking a song from one of the older albums. So I guess that on some more objective level, I trust Essence to be the best even though I might pick Flock if you asked for my favorite right now.
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Awaclus

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1974 on: November 28, 2021, 06:58:49 pm »

Speaking of Nightwish, it's a shame Tuomas Holopainen didn't ever produce more albums for Indica. I mean, Indica sounds absolutely fine without him, but Valoissa is probably their best album and it's definitely Holopainen's best album since Once.
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Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free
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