Oh, I figured out the scum-read on shraeye.
He's voting Jimmmmm without a case. He's posted basically 3 things about Jimmmmm (he's posted some of them multiple times):
1. The Eevee contradiction problem. Shraeye seems to believe "If you don't clip the statement, there is no contradiction."
Now, I'm willing to admit that Eevee's wording was clumsy and the contradiction could come from that. Here are the two statements unclipped:
Kind of meh Dsell became almost obvtown because of something like this, but could be worse - I could have had time to answer and clear myself before Joth stepped in (well handled btw).
Fwiw, even if I got here before Joth, I wouldnt have answered because it would have felt like a very unfair way to gain a lot of town cred.
Well, IMO there is a clear implication in the first statement that he could have cleared himself. If he wouldn't have answered then he couldn't have cleared himself, so it could not have been worse in the way which he described. If he had said, "it could be worse - I could have gotten here before joth and been unable to answer without gaining the same towncred", then that would have created NO contradiction.
I'll agree that the intent is consistent...but to act like "there's no way anyone could get a contradiction out of those statements in context" is silly.
2. Jimmmmm's 180 on Eevee, which Cuzz called out and Robz called out. He agrees that this is more likely to be scum wanting to escape a bad argument than town wanting to escape a bad argument. I felt a need to talk about point 1, because part of that is inherent in thinking that it was a totally contrived argument to begin with.
Now at this point, this could read like a legitimate case to me, except one niggling thing:
Jimm is now my top scum read, with the amount of analysis he has had I read him as a very smart player who know what hes doing.
...
Jimm taking this out of context is ridiculous, I guess its my mistake for not going over it enough myself, but really I had strong scum feeling toward someone because of an out of context exaggeration. This just seems like a very anti town play, there is no reason for town!jimm to start a scumhunt by tricking people.
But I'm really not sold that Jimmm was trying to trick people. I think he was just a little careless, which is not something I expect of Jimmmm, who's usually a very solid rational person. So I have a very slight scumread from this, that increased to slight because of how hard it seemed he was pushing it. But I'm not at all close to wanting to vote for him yet.
(Note: I'm grouping this with 1 as it was a discussion about the contradiction argument)
The growth of this scum-read seems forced to me.
And, 3. Jimmmmm just commented on...
Okay well to be clear, I won't be supporting a Galz lynch today (unless something drastically changes), but he'll be fair game tomorrow.
This post is the tipping point for me between the Cuzz/Jimmmm vote. This looks a lot like the springboard to a day2 lynch, already in place. When I get a townread on somebody and don't want to lynch them (Eevee, Robz, raerae, liopoil, Dsell thus far--and not in that order, I haven't thought about order yet), I would NEVER say "but they're fair game tomorrow". Why are you afraid to let your current townreads bleed over? A logical reason (and the one I reach in my head) is that you don't want to box yourself in as scum and get to a situation where you're left either lynching a townread, or doing another 180 flip on somebody.
I don't have a townread on Galz. Please read the reasons I gave for not wanting to lynch Galz today:
You know what I'm happy to give Galz a pass for today, for a couple of reasons:
I totally get that he's overloaded.
If he's Town, we want him alive.
If he's scum, word on the street is he's easy to catch out, so hopefully we should be able to do that on a later day.
Of course, his analysis is still appreciated.
Oh, one other relevant comment (IMO) from shraeye:
...it never feels like a good case when people simply say "this person feels different". Now if we talk about HOW they are playing differently, then that's a little more substance.
...
in context he's criticizing Robz for using a meta-argument against Eevee while using a straight-forward argument against Jimmmmm (the 180 thing).
The whole start of shraeye's suspicion of Jimmmmm was "he was just a little careless, which is not something I expect of Jimmmm, who's usually a very solid rational person". (see quote above)
Anyways, I'm pretty sure those are the dots my mind connected to conjure a scum-read on shraeye. It
could be a natural growth of a scum-read, but it just feels wrong. It feels wrong that shraeye has posted several points of argument against Cuzz, with little against Jimmmmm.
Note: I'm not 100% sure how I feel about Jimmmmm, he seems vaguely townie to me, but really this has more to do with shraeye's argument than Jimmmmm's alignment.
For the time being, I will
vote: shraeye.
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Topic: Mafia XIX: Deep Space Nine Mafia (Day 7) (Read 268044 times)