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Author Topic: Mustard's Bracket Week Three  (Read 32931 times)

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andwilk

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2012, 11:18:48 pm »
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andwilk defeats elahrairah13 4-2-1 (9 points - 5 points)

I will post links and comments when I have more time tomorrow.
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RisingJaguar

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #51 on: April 12, 2012, 12:10:36 am »
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...
Game 5:



I haven't watched all the commentary videoes (I actually only watched this one after reading the summary), but it is definitely worth your time.  WW makes a lot of good decisions (decisions surely I would struggle with). 

- Opting long-term benefit of putting schemes back instead of native villages (including when he takes back wharf). 
- Knowing what is needed to win (because he's REALLY behind). WW could have taken his native village pile to fight the greening till 3 pile battle, but he surely would have lost with half the economy without that bank.  He knows he needs a 'mega-turn'ish type thing (and has the tools to somewhat pull it off... schemes, NV pile, wharves). 
- Sacrificing native village store ups essentially for his 4 biggest purchases only (2 wharves, bank, last turn). 
- His general use of native village (I think personally I would opt to 'scheme' native villages more often, I was thinking to soft-counter the sea-hag but I think it would've been a bad idea as its like a guessing game.  Not great in the long-term). 

I am guessing his thoughts here but I'm confident these ideas were in his mind.  This is a pretty good game to show the steps to come back (as subtle as they are).  Essentially if you are behind, you cannot always continue with the same 'safe' (but overall optimal) play that your opponent is playing.  If they are ways ahead, playing the same will not surpass them. 

Most of the time, the logs are just as good as the video, but this really shows his thought process more.   Also, that last sea hag had a 50/50 shot of knocking off your bank.  That would have been devastating. 
« Last Edit: April 12, 2012, 12:13:43 am by RisingJaguar »
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Kirian

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #52 on: April 12, 2012, 02:04:32 am »
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Kirian falls 2-5 to jonts26

Kirian 21-43 jonts26 Ambassador double-hits twice FTL
Kirian 25-36 jonts26 T3 Tactician into T6 Maps
Kirian 39-31 jonts26 Sea Hag lucks out, Outpost strikes out
Kirian 11-15 jonts26 FV/Wharf/Mountebank --> Three-pile
Kirian 35-36 jonts26 Stables blunder loses a close game
Kirian 39-48 jonts26 Extra Lighthouses turn $5s into $6s
Kirian 27-24 jonts26 Remake's virtual +Buy saves the day

More analysis at a later time; I'm actually happy with a 5-2 loss to #5 on the leaderboard, especially when several of them were close.  I think jonts was recording these so you can all watch my mistakes on video! :)
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Geronimoo

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #53 on: April 12, 2012, 08:04:24 am »
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I haven't heard from my opponent Nucleus.
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andwilk

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #54 on: April 12, 2012, 08:14:33 am »
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andwilk defeats elahrairah13 4-2-1 (9 points - 5 points)

I will post links and comments when I have more time tomorrow.

Game 1: andwilk 44, elahrairah13 38 (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120411-160124-7b7b288f.html)
A suspiciously long game where I am able to buy out the last province for the win on turn 25.  I don't know why this game took so many turns.  Only attack was Cutpurse and Stables was in play.  Also, it seemed that my opponent was getting poor draws on Tacticians turns.  elahrairah13 was 3/6 converting Tactitian turns into a Province while I did not pick one up until right before my last reshuffle, was able to use it, and on my lone Tactician turn, buy the last Province.

Game 2: andwilk 36, elahrairah13 36 (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120411-161106-18af7e67.html)
We both open Lighthouse/Margrave eventually builing into BV/Margrave and adding a Salvager.  I tie the game on my final turn by buying a Province and an Estate.

Game 3: andwilk 36, elahrairah13 27 (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120411-161726-258ba190.html)
Interesting game.  My opponent held the momentum early on while I was able to come back in the mid-game.  I open Fishing Village/Steward for thinning my deck and extra actions to play multiple Witches while my opponent opens Silver/Silver for a quick jump to the $5+ cards.  On turn 3, elahrairah13 draws $7 and picks up an early KC.  This leads to an early KC/Witch on turn 7 to hand me the first 3 curses of the game.  I honestly thought it was over after that but I had mananged my deck well up to that point, combined with some good draws, and my extra Witch, I was able to split the Curses 5-5.  I was able to keep my deck cleaner with Steward which helped lead me to victory.

Game 4: andwilk 22, elahrairah13 16 (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120411-162408-6cfb9e19.html)
Minion was the key card here and I won the battle for them 6-4.  I ended the game by gaining the last 3 Islands (3rd pile) through University and buying a Province.

Game 5: andwilk 41, elahrairah13 37 (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120411-164748-fb342c4b.html)
A 36-turn Ambassador arms race where I end up with 6 of them eventually to make sure I don't lose the tennis match.  I made sure not to pass him too many Coppers since he added Apothecaries to his deck.  This one basically came down to who could buy out the last Island (3rd pile) or final Province and eke out a victory.

Game 6: elahrairah13 38, andwilk 27  (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120411-164748-fb342c4b.html)
elahrairah13's more straightforward use of JoaTs lead to a victory.  I try some shenanigans with Lookout & Haven with JoaTs and it didn't work out as well as I had planned.

Game 7: elahrairah13 41, andwilk 38 (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120411-165607-f3b3c2b2.html)
An early Goons for elahrairah13 prompts me to go Duchy/Duke since I didn't think I could win a Province race.  I wasn't able to get enough of a margin (4-3 on Duchies/4-4 on Dukes) for it to matter.

Great series... some interesting sets in there.  Of note is that Pirate Ship appeared on the board in 5 of the 7 games (2,3,4,6, and 7) and not a single copy of the card was ever bought throughout the series.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2012, 08:17:35 am by andwilk »
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DG

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #55 on: April 12, 2012, 10:02:30 am »
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Quote
So, can someone tell me how to play scheme/sea hag? Somehow I always seem to do better with just plain old sea hag. I definitely overbought schemes here, but should I get two before switching to silver, or wait for three? Or does it matter how many curses have been given out and stuff? It doesn't help how often I get exactly $2 (that's what all the NVs are about), that it takes me forever to reach $5, or that my sea hag precedes my scheme chain catching up to it. Which means even as first player with so many schemes, I don't win the cure war. Ick. Also don't get to sue the NV-is-soft-counter-to-Hag ability AT ALL.

Yeah that's an interesting one. Getting the economy for 5 coin hands with the sea hag is vital so early silvers are really important. I'd use the native villages here to primarily shrink the deck and keep as much on the mat as long as reasonably possible, especially with wharf + bank available mid/late game. The soft counter to the sea hag only works while the cards remain on the mat. I think you got far too many native villages in this game (although the 2 cost hands were themselves a problem), reducing spending unless you emptied the mat frequently. I'd actually have looked to schemes already in your deck for a transition with apprentice, driving the apprentice through the deck on one cycle trashing the rubbish then rebuilding with wharf, bank, and a power economy. I don't think this needs to be a three pile ending.
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jonts26

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #56 on: April 12, 2012, 10:31:22 am »
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Kirian 21-43 jonts26 Ambassador double-hits twice FTL
Kirian 25-36 jonts26 T3 Tactician into T6 Maps
Kirian 39-31 jonts26 Sea Hag lucks out, Outpost strikes out
Kirian 11-15 jonts26 FV/Wharf/Mountebank --> Three-pile
Kirian 35-36 jonts26 Stables blunder loses a close game
Kirian 39-48 jonts26 Extra Lighthouses turn $5s into $6s
Kirian 27-24 jonts26 Remake's virtual +Buy saves the day

A very fun match against Kirian. A few close games which could have gone either way. I did record the matches, but the audio got all messed up. I'm going to re-record the audio, probably sometime this weekend, and post them then. But for now, I'll use written words.

Game 1 - Ambassador, Caravan, Treasury, Expand
Ambassador makes an early appearance. We both open Amb/Caravan. Treasury is a very strong card with ambassador so I actually forgo a second Amb for silver, hoping to stock up on  couple treasuries. I even prefer the first one to Gold, trying to keep as many cantrips in my deck so as not to get too clogged too early. Kirian gets a second amb early, and has it collide several times, with predictable results. I use Expand to speed up the end game.

Game 2 - Tactician, Treasure Map, Salvager, Pawn
We open 5/2 with Tactician. I opt for Pawn, he goes Native Village. I think Pawn has to be the right opening here. It brings me up to $8, which is what I need to get two Maps. I do pull my Tactician turn 3, which is huge, and perhaps a little fortunate (~50%). Kirian does not draw Tact until turn 4, which puts him a turn behind. However, it should be noted that if he did get tact turn 3, he couldn't have afforded double maps because of his opening. Turn 5 I get a little more fortunate to draw tactician again, setting up a Map collision for turn 6. Kirian doesn't get his maps off until turn 8, so I buy a salvager to speed up the game and press my advantage.

Game 3 - Tactician, Sea Hag, Outpost, Lookout
Another 5/2 split with tactician. I consider opening Sea Hag, but figure if I can get one early enough the tactician is more useful as an open. Well I get some unfortunate early luck. Kirian draws 4 for a sea hag, I settle for a lookout which gets flipped by his hag before I can play it. Once I do get a hag, it gets flipped before I can play it. Now being at a severe disadvantage, I need to switch up my plan. Tactician/Outpost is a bit unreliable, but potentially powerful. With curses, it's even more unreliable, but I was hoping the havens I had would help me line things up, which they really didn't that much. That said, this game came down to the final turn anyway. 2 Provinces left, tie score, Kirian had just played a tactician and was likely to get at least a province. I was looking at $8, 3 buys and an outpost. My only hope is to be able to run piles. 3 Tunnels and a Haven left. I play outpost, buying 2 tunnels and a haven and then draw ... $2. Kirian double provinces to win.

Game 4 - Mountebank, Wharf, Fishing Village, Warehouse, Salvager
Guess what? We open 5/2. And while Mr. tactician is back, we both opt to open Mountebank. I focus hard on the wharves and fishing villages. Kirian spreads himself out a bit more getting a bit of everything. I think in the end my more focused wharf/FV engine let me better control the end game and ultimately 3 pile it with the lead. I actually never got around to buying any treasures.

Game 5 - Witch, Smugglers, Trade Route
In a stunning turn of events, we both open 5/2. Witch is the clear open. He opts for a moat and I pass my $2. I play pretty much Witch/Big Money. I do get an early smugglers, thinking with the curses and being second player, I'd get some decent use out of it. Despite his moat and first position, we split the curses evenly, which is really what you have to hope for as 2P. The game is decently uninteresting, though the end game has some good aspects. With 2 provinces and no duchies left, I have a decent lead. Kirian needs either both provinces or one provinces and about half of the estates. Once I hit my final reshuffle, I start hitting the estates hard. Kirian has an interesting choice of whether to not fall behind on them, or let me drain them by myself hoping to get 2 province hands. At this point, with all the junk, provinces are not too likely. He opts to fight on the estates. He does get his 1 province but I eek out just enough estates for a 1 point win.

Game 6 - Ambassador, Lighthouse, Haggler
Ambassadors and Sea Hags and a lighthouse. We both open amb/lighthouse. I miss my amb in the first shuffle, but my more steady dedication to getting lighthouses helps me not worry about his attacks. I was planning on getting a Haggler at some point, but I wasn't going to prefer it to Gold and it was a long while before I drew exactly $5. He buys spies, which I think is probably a mistake, as the attack is unlikely to hit anyway and he needs to build his economy more. Still, a close game which I close out buying the last province.

Game 7 - Remake, Caravan, Menagerie, Warehouse, Haven, Merchant Ship, Scheme
This is my favorite game of the set. Just a beautiful example of dominion at its most elegant. It's not often 4 provinces in 12 turns isn't enough. I open remake/scheme to his remake/warehouse. We both get perfect turn 3's, though the ceiling on scheme/remake is higher. This sets us both up for very fast engines. I opt for a menagerie, warehouse deal, using scheme and haven to keep it triggering every turn. I buy provinces from turns 9-12 and could have kept going at least a couple more before I had the chance of missing. Kirian starts with a menagerie but transitions to caravan for his main draw. He buys provinces starting turn 10. I do think he got a little fortunate to not miss a province turn as he was only drawing 2/3 to 4/5 of his deck the last couple turns and if he misses his lone Gold even once, I win. However, I should have noted his 3 caravans and 2 havens in play on turn 12 and figured he stood a good shot of grabbing province/duchy to close it out. I should have bought duchy, and forced the draw on turn 13.


All in all, a great series. Thanks for the games!
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Geronimoo

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #57 on: April 12, 2012, 05:40:49 pm »
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Geronimoo wins 4 and ties once (9 points), Nucleus wins 2 and ties once (5 points)

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-122816-495b7a29.html
Geronimoo 35 - Nucleus 22
Salvager, Fool's Gold, Alchemist
Seaside, hmmm, I don't expect many good things, because Ambassador is not my greatest card. But I'm happy to go first against my lower level opponent (lvl 18). Alchemist is probably not horrible here, but I still prefer a Fool's Gold big money strategy. Salvager is a decent addition. Nucleus builds a nice Alchemist stack and starts buying Provinces and Alchemist in the same turn, but in the end the big money's tempo is too high to overcome.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-124433-4890da07.html
Geronimoo 49 - Nucleus 21
Tournament, Chapel (with Haven, Peddler)
We both open Tournament/Chapel, but I trash a little less aggressively to buy Haven to enable Peddler buys and have a little more deck control. I also make sure I get a Gold as fast as possible by not trashing too many Coppers. This gives me the first Province and that's pretty much game over.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-125620-e00f3bfa.html
Geronimoo 31- Nucleus 24
Treasure Map, King's Court, Merchant Ship, Jester
My opponent opens Treasure Map, clearly hoping to get lucky. I definitely don't want to follow his lead because there's a King's Court on the board which is quite strong with Merchant Ship. I open Salvager/Woodcutter because I hope the extra action for KC will make up for a possible collision in the early game. Nucleus makes a mistake buying a Jester turn 3 over a second Treasure Map and I get a Jester hoping to expand his deck a little with junk so his TM's don't collide. Turn 6 I hit his TM with my Jester and since I sure don't want TM, I have to give it to him (is this awful??). TM collision happens turn 10 which is very late and I like my chances. His second TM collision is turn 13, but by then I already had a double Province turn thanks to KC'd Merchant Ships. It's still pretty close in the end, but I eke out a win thx to KC.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-130542-3c2d567d.html
Nucleus 35 - Geronimoo 32
Smithy, Ambassador
The board looks very much like a Big Money game, so I hope my opponent will open Ambassador. Unfortunately he opens Smithy. If I just follow his lead, I don't like my chances much, because he can't make many mistakes using this strategy. So I open Ambassador, hope he chokes on Provinces while I get the Fairgrounds to 6VP and catch up. I feel pretty good when he buys an Ambassador as well, which is clearly a mistake, but unfortunately he gets an Embassy a while later and I know he won't be choking anytime soon, so I start greening aggressively and pray for lucky draws. His final turn features an Embassy for a close win!

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-131814-abf11161.html
Nucleus 38 - Geronimoo 27
Ambassador, Pirate Ship
I open Ambassador/Pirate Ship and Nucleus opens Ambassador/Mining Village. I figured the Ambassador can keep feeding him Coppers to Pirate Ship. Unfortunately my Pirate Ships Copper trashing accelerate his deck trimming and the tempo swings in his favor. Quite sure I made a few mistakes here like buying a second Ambassador, not enough Pirate Ships and buying Haven over Silver.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-132517-3e5dfa11.html
Geronimoo 25 - Nucleus 25
Tactician, Lighthouse, Mint, Salvager
I consider the Ligthouse/Mint opening that Nucleus goes for, but I decide against it. It's probably not as bad on this board because of Salvager to trash the Mint/Estates. I have a pretty big tempo advantage early on, but Nucleus catches up which I didn't really expect and we tie!

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-133403-a5cd44a3.html
Geronimo 27 - Nucleus resigned
Caravan, Hoard, Vault
I open Caravan/Silver which I don't like on most boards because of the possible string of $4 buys in the following turns, but here the Caravan is very good with Vault so I take the risk. My opponent opens the even slower Caravan/Fishing Village. In the long game his opening leaves more options, but unfortunately this board is not likely to produce long games. I manage to get 4 Provinces in 10 turns and then Nucleus stops playing and eventually resigns. I bet he was confused how he got crushed so hard...

I'm not too unhappy about my playing except the Pirate Ship fiasco. Nucleus didn't really chat during the game, but the games were good! Thx for playing and gl in the next rounds!
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #58 on: April 12, 2012, 11:34:42 pm »
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Geronimoo wins 4 and ties once (9 points), Nucleus wins 2 and ties once (5 points)

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-122816-495b7a29.html
Geronimoo 35 - Nucleus 22
Salvager, Fool's Gold, Alchemist
Seaside, hmmm, I don't expect many good things, because Ambassador is not my greatest card. But I'm happy to go first against my lower level opponent (lvl 18). Alchemist is probably not horrible here, but I still prefer a Fool's Gold big money strategy. Salvager is a decent addition. Nucleus builds a nice Alchemist stack and starts buying Provinces and Alchemist in the same turn, but in the end the big money's tempo is too high to overcome.
I expect salvager is actually pretty good for this. Alchemist is weak against regular BM, this goodness, especially with salvager to speed the game even further, I would expect to just stomp.
But I'm interested in your assessment of seaside. You should only expect to see ambassador like one-and-a-half times. Although I guess the set probably offers combo more goodies than it does BM? I mean, let's see, it gives BM Wharf, merchant ship, generally sea hag, and... that's about it, no? Whereas it gives combo Ambassador, FV, Wharf, Tactician... by the way, isn't this the strongest set overall, at least of the large sets? Even over Prosperity, which has a better top end but falls off more?

Quote
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-124433-4890da07.html
Geronimoo 49 - Nucleus 21
Tournament, Chapel (with Haven, Peddler)
We both open Tournament/Chapel, but I trash a little less aggressively to buy Haven to enable Peddler buys and have a little more deck control. I also make sure I get a Gold as fast as possible by not trashing too many Coppers. This gives me the first Province and that's pretty much game over.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-125620-e00f3bfa.html
Geronimoo 31- Nucleus 24
Treasure Map, King's Court, Merchant Ship, Jester
My opponent opens Treasure Map, clearly hoping to get lucky. I definitely don't want to follow his lead because there's a King's Court on the board which is quite strong with Merchant Ship. I open Salvager/Woodcutter because I hope the extra action for KC will make up for a possible collision in the early game. Nucleus makes a mistake buying a Jester turn 3 over a second Treasure Map and I get a Jester hoping to expand his deck a little with junk so his TM's don't collide. Turn 6 I hit his TM with my Jester and since I sure don't want TM, I have to give it to him (is this awful??). TM collision happens turn 10 which is very late and I like my chances. His second TM collision is turn 13, but by then I already had a double Province turn thanks to KC'd Merchant Ships. It's still pretty close in the end, but I eke out a win thx to KC.

Is the risk of collision actually that bad a thing anyway? Like, often you'll be able to salvage the woodcutter profitably, no? Anyway, a treasure mapping opponent seems to be not the time you want Jester (actually, this is generally going to be true when your strategies diverge, similarly to tribute actually), but not a lot to say here.
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-130542-3c2d567d.html

Quote
Nucleus 35 - Geronimoo 32
Smithy, Ambassador
The board looks very much like a Big Money game, so I hope my opponent will open Ambassador. Unfortunately he opens Smithy. If I just follow his lead, I don't like my chances much, because he can't make many mistakes using this strategy. So I open Ambassador, hope he chokes on Provinces while I get the Fairgrounds to 6VP and catch up. I feel pretty good when he buys an Ambassador as well, which is clearly a mistake, but unfortunately he gets an Embassy a while later and I know he won't be choking anytime soon, so I start greening aggressively and pray for lucky draws. His final turn features an Embassy for a close win!
Now, this seems the most interesting board by far! Fairgrounds , well, I guess they help you long-term with your ambassador. But somehow, that just seems so weak here. I mean there's no support at all. And actually, I think it's quite possible to misplay the Smithy/BM. People do it all the time. Also, the fairgrounds wrinkle is going to throw that off a bit anyway. But I'm surprised you don't mention anything else as important cards. Because Merchant Ship and Embassy also seem important to me. And they're pretty darn close to each other straight-up in terms of BM power. My guess is that, on 4/3, opening smithy and then getting embassy as a second terminal later is probably the way to go here. Probably pick up something else at some point to get 4 point fairgrounds if the game goes long enough... but it likely won't.

Quote
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-131814-abf11161.html
Nucleus 38 - Geronimoo 27
Ambassador, Pirate Ship
I open Ambassador/Pirate Ship and Nucleus opens Ambassador/Mining Village. I figured the Ambassador can keep feeding him Coppers to Pirate Ship. Unfortunately my Pirate Ships Copper trashing accelerate his deck trimming and the tempo swings in his favor. Quite sure I made a few mistakes here like buying a second Ambassador, not enough Pirate Ships and buying Haven over Silver.
Hmmph. Pirate ship needs more than just a village (particularly one that fights with PS itself at a price point) to be successful, and I'm not sure that ambassador helps you more than him. Eh, maybe it can work, but it just seems like so much trouble to get what a more straightforward strategy can get you, and probably slower. Big point being that there's no +buy, so even if you do get up to you're grand plan, with mega-ships and his deck sorta in tatters, it might be too late. But I dunno, maybe it can work.


Quote
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-132517-3e5dfa11.html
Geronimoo 25 - Nucleus 25
Tactician, Lighthouse, Mint, Salvager
I consider the Ligthouse/Mint opening that Nucleus goes for, but I decide against it. It's probably not as bad on this board because of Salvager to trash the Mint/Estates. I have a pretty big tempo advantage early on, but Nucleus catches up which I didn't really expect and we tie!

I think I'd go for the lighthouse/mint without much hesitation. Salvager is going to be big goodies for it. You have to be FAST if you want to beat it out, and well, I guess you are sorta, but I'd have put my money on his strategy here, at least generally.

Quote
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/12/game-20120412-133403-a5cd44a3.html
Geronimo 27 - Nucleus resigned
Caravan, Hoard, Vault
I open Caravan/Silver which I don't like on most boards because of the possible string of $4 buys in the following turns, but here the Caravan is very good with Vault so I take the risk. My opponent opens the even slower Caravan/Fishing Village. In the long game his opening leaves more options, but unfortunately this board is not likely to produce long games. I manage to get 4 Provinces in 10 turns and then Nucleus stops playing and eventually resigns. I bet he was confused how he got crushed so hard...

I'm not too unhappy about my playing except the Pirate Ship fiasco. Nucleus didn't really chat during the game, but the games were good! Thx for playing and gl in the next rounds!
Well, I still don't think you actually want to open caravan here, even with the vault present. A quick sim shows them basically tied, though with optimization, not to mention that the sim misplays vault rather notably, who knows? And my gut tells me that the later benefits of the caravans are slight enough over silver to not justify the early hit you're taking. But then, I guess that maybe the 5 for vault is the key price-point you want to make sure you hit here, and caravan does that like almost as much as silver? Eh, maybe. I'm not sure. What I do know is that if for whatever reason, caravans aren't being contested, opening silver over caravan starts to look like a no-brainer. Not that you can really count on that...

Geronimoo

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #59 on: April 13, 2012, 04:08:14 am »
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I wonder how other high level players handle playing a lower level when the dominant strategy is Big Money. The lower level has fewer opportunities to make mistakes so your edge is going to be smaller. I will sometimes deviate from optimal strategy and hope I can get my opponent to make mistakes if he tries to copy me.
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blueblimp

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #60 on: April 13, 2012, 05:52:13 pm »
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I'm not so high level, but in my experience playing auto-matched opponents, lower level players will often get too fancy in BM games. (Conversely, sometimes they won't play fancy enough in engine games.) So it can work to just play normally and wait for mistakes.

On the other hand, I imagine most of my wins against 40+ players might come from BM games, so that's not good advice for a 40+ playing a 30+.
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Young Nick

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #61 on: April 14, 2012, 01:32:33 am »
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DG 4 : 3 Young Nick


Just some fun notes from our series: In our first game, I was merely $1 short of winning on 1-2 turns, if I remember correctly. It happens, but it certainly was frustrating nonetheless.

In game 3, I got my butt kicked by not buying Transmute! A shocking concept in itself, more interestingly he used it to trash 4 curses on 6 plays, meaning it was primarily used to trash a card for no benefit.

In game 4, with just one Province in deck, DG takes three prizes on Turn 13. Needless to say, this game was not close.

Game 6 certainly took me by surprise. Without mass trashing (only Ambassador, Lookout), I thought I had an easy W when DG opened with Potion. No strong trashing, no +buy, and me opening Ambassador/Ambassador. Any SP engine seemed all but impossible. I'm still miffed by this one, but man, did I get destroyed. I would love for someone better than me to tell me what was the proper way to play this match. Also worth noting that DG could have easily won much sooner had he gone for Vineyards. I'm not sure why he chose not to.
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/10/game-20120410-181135-206ba50c.html

A general trend was that the more interesting the game was, the more likely I was to lose. My wins were either standard engine or something slightly simpler. I never had seen myself as that type of player, but the games speak for themselves.
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paddyodoors

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #62 on: April 14, 2012, 08:36:44 am »
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Game 6 certainly took me by surprise. Without mass trashing (only Ambassador, Lookout), I thought I had an easy W when DG opened with Potion. No strong trashing, no +buy, and me opening Ambassador/Ambassador. Any SP engine seemed all but impossible. I'm still miffed by this one, but man, did I get destroyed. I would love for someone better than me to tell me what was the proper way to play this match. Also worth noting that DG could have easily won much sooner had he gone for Vineyards. I'm not sure why he chose not to.
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/10/game-20120410-181135-206ba50c.html

Well, it looks like his first three SP plays hit (& discard) Ambassador, Ambassador, and Sea Hag.  Making you miss those key cards so early in the 27-turn game has a huge effect.
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JanErik

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #63 on: April 14, 2012, 09:45:40 am »
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angrybirds

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #64 on: April 14, 2012, 02:40:00 pm »
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Masticore defeats angrybirds 4-2-1

4 of our games featured Ambassador pretty heavily... especially the last 3.

Game 1: angrybirds 42 masticore 39 http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-102534-98325c3c.html  Ambassador war. Amb/Amb vs Amb/Lighthouse.  I ended up getting 6 lighthouses and only won the game on the last turn with some Farmland trashing

Game 2: tie 30 each  http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-103118-1801f56c.html  I went T Maps of a 5/2 opening with Herbalist. Masticore went Fool's Gold both with Warehouse complementing.  Masticore broke pentultimate province rule despite fearing a Province/Estate buy for me. I had to end it with a tie to get a point.

Game 3: Masticore 31 angrybirds 30 http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-103549-f7b5a2ee.html  Bishop beats DoubleJack with lighthouse. I end it because of bad math to lose by one... But if I had bought a Duchy, Masticore would have ended it the next turn.

Game 4: Masticore 34 angrybirds 25 http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-104258-89ad78b8.html  Tactician/Salvager beats Tactician messy deck. Go figure.  The salvager made the game go really fast and I couldn't quite get all my cards to work in cooperation with each other. Kind of lame for the only game that featured Tactician

Game 5: Masticore 62, angrybirds 38 http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-105713-8d8de1f3.html Fishing Villages with Ambassador early. This game was extremely close midgame as I had realized that he was ahead and tried to backdoor into Silk Roads. We ended up splitting them, neither then had enough steam to get to provinces and he rolled to victory late.

Game 6: angrybirds 26, Masticore 25 http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-110631-3de8866f.html Another Ambassador war, this time with both Witch and Ghost Ship around. I go Ghost Ship, he adds Witch. Neither buy anything else but money and ends up being a fast game despite the attacks. Masticore breaks PPR again, but this time I am able to win instead of tie.

Game 7: Masticore 32, angrybirds 14 http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-112058-b8cfe92e.html Masticore played well here, but I really lost this game because I didn't want to have another Ambassador slog so tried something new. On the board was SeaHag, Ambassador, Ghost Ship, Markets, Havens and Universities. I decide to open University and get a bunch of Ghost Ships, Ambassadors and Markets. At the end we both thought just spamming markets might have been a good idea.  Well my deck turns into a mess and Masticore is able to 3 pile end it with Havens and markets out along with enough Duchies for him to win despite the ugliness.

These games showed I am very weak at Ambassador and Seaside in general.  Thanks for the games... They were a blast.
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jonts26

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #65 on: April 14, 2012, 05:38:54 pm »
+3

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Geronimoo

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #66 on: April 14, 2012, 07:11:57 pm »
+1

Round 3 videos are up.

Game 1
Game 2
Game 3
Game 4
Game 5
Game 6
Game 7
Very well played, jonts! Game 7 was nice. These vids along with WW's should be mandatory study material!
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ugasoft

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #67 on: April 15, 2012, 10:48:12 am »
+1

Lekkit and I finally played our games.
I was able to take 5 games, so the final score is JanErik 10 - 4 Lekkit.

This should be current classification of our division:

24 Fabian
24 JanErik
23 ugasoft
23 StickaRicka
22 Lekkit
21 Tonks77
17 angboy
14 ArjanB

6 players in 3 points... good luck to everyone :)
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jonts26

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #68 on: April 15, 2012, 02:11:14 pm »
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Eastern Group

NameRecordPoints
Young Nick11-10-0   22
DG11-6-022
Kirian9-12-018
jonts2616-5-032
greystripe77   7-10-014
Fit1one8-13-016
elahrairah137-13-115
andwilk10-10-121

Still waiting on the 4 final Round 2 games between DG and greystripe.

And Round 4 matchups for my group:
jonts26 vs young nick
fit1one vs DG
andwilk vs Kirian
greystripe vs elarairah
« Last Edit: April 15, 2012, 02:36:37 pm by jonts26 »
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Lekkit

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #69 on: April 15, 2012, 03:04:02 pm »
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This should be current classification of our division:

24 Fabian
24 JanErik
23 ugasoft
23 StickaRicka
22 Lekkit
21 Tonks77
17 angboy
14 ArjanB

6 players in 3 points... good luck to everyone :)

It's intense!
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Eevee

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #70 on: April 15, 2012, 03:11:27 pm »
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Round 3 videos are up.

Game 1
Game 2
Game 3
Game 4
Game 5
Game 6
Game 7
Very well played, jonts! Game 7 was nice. These vids along with WW's should be mandatory study material!
Yeah its awesome you take the time to make these. Thanks a lot!
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Rabid

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #71 on: April 15, 2012, 05:12:39 pm »
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Round 3 videos are up.

Game 1
Game 2
Game 3
Game 4
Game 5
Game 6
Game 7

Excellent videos thanks.

Game 2, jonts turn 6, did you consider playing treasure map before pawn?
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jonts26

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #72 on: April 15, 2012, 06:11:37 pm »
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Round 3 videos are up.

Game 1
Game 2
Game 3
Game 4
Game 5
Game 6
Game 7

Excellent videos thanks.

Game 2, jonts turn 6, did you consider playing treasure map before pawn?

Nope, but that would have been the smart play.
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Geronimoo

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Re: Mustard's Bracket Week Three
« Reply #74 on: May 08, 2012, 04:47:48 pm »
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Loes is really destroying us lvl 40s :)
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