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[The_Wine_Merchant]

Looking for input on two thoughts here:

1) II does this claim and then is "viewed as town" by majority. Does this make it in anyone's opinion more likely that Skum players would use this tactic because of the herd's original reaction to a claim? Or less likely because it would be suspicious?

What iguana and PPS did certainly impacted what I did in this game as town, but I think it would lessen the desire to repeat the scenario as scum.

[mcmcsalot]

faust (4): LaLight, pingpongsam, The_Wine_Merchant, iguanaiguana

I should note that everyone on this wagon except PPS was also on the Clemens lynch, yet somehow they fault me for that.

I agree with this sentiment, I don't find faust as scummy as lalight, pps, or twm.

Also I want to note you guys lynched with 30 min left. I was coming on, also all the I didn't want to lynch clem is scummy because none of those three people made a case on someone not galz/clem and none really helped me in my cases on pps or space.

[mcmcsalot]

So here is the thing about a scum!Faust

First of all, scum!Faust would defend town!Iguana as town, and stick to his read there. He'd see it as something he would do as town, and therefore do it even more stringently than he would as town. So Faust defending me does not give him town points. He's made a point of IC-ing me as scum before, even, in Rewind Mafia.

But here's the thing.

If Faust is scum, then he's being bossy in the scum!QT, and depending on his partners, his partners may just be like "Yeah, Faust, you do whatever and that's fine." So regardless, if he's scum he's going to have a lot of control of the kill.

So would have Faust chosen to kill Galzria?

Scum!Faust knows that he tunneled town!Galzria and town!Clemens yesterday. Why does he choose to kill Galzria and make himself look bad? Maybe just because he believes he can survive the scrutiny? Maybe he tunneled Galzria because he saw an opportunity to do so and he knows that town!Galz is a threat to him, and then at night he went for the kill because the lynch didn't work out for him? This assumes that scum!Faust's #1 priority in this game is getting Galzria dead. But actually in my experience of several games on scum!Faust's team, he usually doesn't have those kinds of priorities or worry too much about his opponents.

So then there's the other possibility: someone saw the opportunity to set up Faust.

If Faust is town, scum probably noticed that he spent all day tunneling town. Then they can notice also that if they kill Galzria, it would make Faust look bad and expose that he tunneled two towns. And they get to off a strong town player at the same time.

So this logic actually explains the Galzria kill much better, and it points to the person who had immediately had a thorough case on Faust at the start of the  day.

TLDR: If Faust is town, it points to scum!PPS, and possibly also a scum!Space partner.

So I guess I'll try this out and let's see what other people think:

Vote: PPS

This is an insanely smart post. No way scum!faust kills Galz. Obviously my conspiracy theorist brain wants to believe when both my scum reads turn up with a town pr/result and the two wagons I didn't like turned out to be town its all a scum ploy but it really does fit better than scum!faust. I could see a scum Lalight/Twm/Robz  team doing this kill/push which does still allow the pps/space result to be true though.

[mcmcsalot]

Well, that’s a bold analysis and vote, iguana. It definitely fits within my meta to try to IC my partner as scum by claiming a town investigative result on them. Do you think Space would go for such an outlandish plan or maybe I just popped a big surprise on them today? They certainly seemed a bit surprised.

If we kill one today scum surely NKs the other tonight as my flip confirms space 100%. We also remove any possibility of getting additional results from me. So the net effect is 2 dead townies and a loss of all investigative information. Leaving us both alive today puts scum in the tough position of having to leave us alive to avoid creating an IC.

Can anyone iterate why iguana must be town other than saying he sucks as scum? This looks a lot like sucking as scum to me.

Classic "leave me alive one more day and ill be dead" when he does't turn up dead and we are at 6/3 he pulls the obviously scum left me alive because they want us to mislynch me then we will be at 4/3.

Just a random thought as I was going through this scenario. Anyone think Iguana could totally be a traitor and that post would definitely signal to the mafia team that that's what they are...

[mcmcsalot]

Question: is it Datswan and Galz who're good friends IRL? Could that incentivise one of them to want to take the other out, if they're on opposite factions? And if so, would killing Galz be a good move for scum to frame Swan a bit, under the assumption that one of us will point that out eventually?

I do think scum!datswan is likely to want to kill town!galz

[mcmcsalot]

Okay I am caught up. General thoughts:

Faust: seems townie to me. I honestly just don't feel at all like this is scum faust. Scum faust himself is pretty focused on PR stuff and this game he hasn't reacted to any of the claims in the way scum!faust would but rather in the way town!faust does which is why as scum faust tries to suss out safe and reasonable claim thoughts a whole whole lot. I don't think his pushing of twm is scummy and his votes on clem and galz like teprocs at least had reasons.

Lalight: I really feel like he is scum but I am absolutely horrible at reading him. I have no clue how he plays as either alignment, I constantly think he is lurking but he always has high posts counts, he is honestly just a poor read for me. That being said I think his defense of why he voted for clem was scummy. Lalight, TWM, and Iguana all easliy could have stayed on space with me and robz if they didn't like the clem lynch thats 5, people acting like they "can't get another lynch through" then joining a wagon of 4 because its "all that can happen" is pretty silly.

TWM: dunno doesn't feel like he has done any of the typical things I scumread him for but has done exhibited more generic scum traits this game. Wierd situation.

Robz: scummily lurking at this point literally doing nothing. Getting to the point where I want to lynch him and say if we lose its your fault play better as town.

Teproc: feels towny to me similar to the faust read but is lurking.

Cuzz: super town

Iguana: Is either town or a traitor.


PPS/Space, my case on them still stands, I still think they are both scummy, the claim puts me in a really weird spot. it totally kills my reads from yesterday. Which like i said earlier makes me feel like its scum orchestrated but I also just could have been wrong. But as some people pointed out what do we think the clem, galz, and space wagons were all town wagons, I know i'm town. I guess I need to go look at the wagons yesterday with town space and pps in mind and see what I see.

[mcmcsalot]

I missed datswan definitely could be scum. so I guess.

Scummy: Datswan, lalight, robz
case but pr ugh: PPS, space, twm
town reads: fausty, teproc, iguana(traitor?)
def town: cuzz

[LaLight]

I’m VLA till Monday

[mcmcsalot]

Post Count

119 - faust (2)
86 - The_Wine_Merchant (1)
85 - DatSwan (2)
84 - iguanaiguana (2)
75 - Cuzz (2)
56 - mcmcsalot (5)
55 - SpaceAnemone (1)
54 - LaLight (1)
44 - pingpongsam (2)
30 - Robz888 (2)
27 - Teproc (1)

[schadd]

https://youtu.be/ISs6tEltrXQ?t=1m22s

as fire to the sun, tell me what i have done
how? heart of a dragon
how? heart of a dragon

Vote count 2.3

faust (3): LaLight, pingpongsam, The_Wine_Merchant
The_Wine_Merchant (2): SpaceAnemone, Cuzz
iguanaiguana (1): DatSwan
pingpongsam (1): faust
LaLight (1): iguanaiguana

not voting (3): Robz888, mcmcsalot, Teproc

with 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. day 2 ends monday, february 26th at 22:00 forum time

mod notes

• Knarly
• robz and teproc are being prodded

[Swowl]

I missed datswan definitely could be scum. so I guess.

Scummy: Datswan, lalight, robz
case but pr ugh: PPS, space, twm
town reads: fausty, teproc, iguana(traitor?)
def town: cuzz

Thanks man... i hate to be left out. Noticed you didn’t include yourself

[Robz888]

Hi, prod acknowledged. Sorry, I've been extremely busy. I actually started a re-read yesterday, but didn't get through it. I will have more soon, I promise.

[Swowl]

I missed datswan definitely could be scum. so I guess.

Scummy: Datswan, lalight, robz
case but pr ugh: PPS, space, twm
town reads: fausty, teproc, iguana(traitor?)
def town: cuzz

why am I skummy?

[The_Wine_Merchant]

I missed datswan definitely could be scum. so I guess.

Scummy: Datswan, lalight, robz
case but pr ugh: PPS, space, twm
town reads: fausty, teproc, iguana(traitor?)
def town: cuzz

why am I skummy?

And why Cuzz def town?

[The_Wine_Merchant]

faust (4): LaLight, pingpongsam, The_Wine_Merchant, iguanaiguana

I should note that everyone on this wagon except PPS was also on the Clemens lynch, yet somehow they fault me for that.

I agree with this sentiment, I don't find faust as scummy as lalight, pps, or twm.

Also I want to note you guys lynched with 30 min left. I was coming on, also all the I didn't want to lynch clem is scummy because none of those three people made a case on someone not galz/clem and none really helped me in my cases on pps or space.

You say you guys. But galz hammered and i had no idea that you were showing up or if Robz was coming back. Go yell at galz or show up earlier next time.

And we weren't moving to space. That was off the table. And I agreed with them about PPS revealing true colors later in game. Clem's was a fine lynch. Don't get all high horsey.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

I kind of want to vote for datswan or mcmc right now.

[SpaceAnemone]

faust (4): LaLight, pingpongsam, The_Wine_Merchant, iguanaiguana

I should note that everyone on this wagon except PPS was also on the Clemens lynch, yet somehow they fault me for that.

I agree with this sentiment, I don't find faust as scummy as lalight, pps, or twm.

Also I want to note you guys lynched with 30 min left. I was coming on, also all the I didn't want to lynch clem is scummy because none of those three people made a case on someone not galz/clem and none really helped me in my cases on pps or space.

You say you guys. But galz hammered and i had no idea that you were showing up or if Robz was coming back. Go yell at galz or show up earlier next time.

And we weren't moving to space. That was off the table. And I agreed with them about PPS revealing true colors later in game. Clem's was a fine lynch. Don't get all high horsey.

Yeah, I was all for lynching Robz, but nobody else believed in my wagon.

I'm kind of amused that mcmc mooted a possibel scum-team containing Robz a little while ago.

[SpaceAnemone]

Question: is it Datswan and Galz who're good friends IRL? Could that incentivise one of them to want to take the other out, if they're on opposite factions? And if so, would killing Galz be a good move for scum to frame Swan a bit, under the assumption that one of us will point that out eventually?

I do think scum!datswan is likely to want to kill town!galz

Wants to, yes, but would actually kill? I think I'd expect it to feel way too obvious a kill when you're actually in scum's shoes there, and also scum!swan would have to have teammates to help talk him out of it, wouldn't he? That's why framing felt at least likely enough as a motive to be worth mentioning.

[SpaceAnemone]

I kind of want to vote for datswan or mcmc right now.

What about waiting to hear what Robz says when he's done with his re-read, and then maybe considering a Robz wagon?

Not that I hate either of those proposed votes.. I just want to make sure all scummy options get considered :-)

[SpaceAnemone]

I kind of want to vote for datswan or mcmc right now.

What happened to the Cuzz thing, anyway?

[iguanaiguana]

I missed datswan definitely could be scum. so I guess.

Scummy: Datswan, lalight, robz
case but pr ugh: PPS, space, twm
town reads: fausty, teproc, iguana(traitor?)
def town: cuzz

schadd thinks that traitors are yucky, so they aren't likely to be in the game.

[iguanaiguana]

McMc, I agree with almost all your reads. TWM is towny though I think.

McMc is super towny.

[iguanaiguana]

LaLight was hard to lynch yesterday, and the people who went for it were not scummy. Every town player in this game needs to go look at how my push on ALL went compares to Galz/Clem yesterday and TWM / Faust today.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

I kind of want to vote for datswan or mcmc right now.

What happened to the Cuzz thing, anyway?

No one agrees. Maybe I am wrong? Other options.

[mcmcsalot]

faust (4): LaLight, pingpongsam, The_Wine_Merchant, iguanaiguana

I should note that everyone on this wagon except PPS was also on the Clemens lynch, yet somehow they fault me for that.

I agree with this sentiment, I don't find faust as scummy as lalight, pps, or twm.

Also I want to note you guys lynched with 30 min left. I was coming on, also all the I didn't want to lynch clem is scummy because none of those three people made a case on someone not galz/clem and none really helped me in my cases on pps or space.

You say you guys. But galz hammered and i had no idea that you were showing up or if Robz was coming back. Go yell at galz or show up earlier next time.

And we weren't moving to space. That was off the table. And I agreed with them about PPS revealing true colors later in game. Clem's was a fine lynch. Don't get all high horsey.

Woah 39cmin is plenty of time, why was space off the table??? Now they are but then there was no reason you who supported it thought it was off he table, I actively argued against galz and clemcas garbage lynches so I’ll be as high horsey as I god damn want. Dama and upset irl so y’all get that.

You now saying that space was off the table and you were all hood waiting for pps to scumslip is super scummy, you really only voted wmcbecause you had to?