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[Eevee]

the problem with discussing a mass claim is that if you discuss it too much, you might as well go through with it because the damage is already done.

[Eevee]

if the day sways that way, I think some town roles should seriously consider their words and probably omit some information or even straight up lie.

[ashersky]

in fact I probably think you should have just not used the
role without claiming, but what's done is done.

I thought about it.  But I think my claim actually gets the game started on the right foot (real discussion vs. RVS) and is pertinent to the game.

Plus, all the WIFOM in the world for scum now.

[ashersky]

if the day sways that way, I think some town roles should seriously consider their words and probably omit some information or even straight up lie.

I mean, I think people should say "yes mass claim" or "no mass claim" and be done with it.

If we DO mass claim, then we figure things out.

I'm torn on town lying, because man that back fires so badly.

[Eevee]

So does the cop claiming day 1..

I think I'd like to see what others think about the massclaim issue before
commenting (or not commenting) on it myself.

Should we consider having you fullclaim? If you don't plan on using the role anyways, seems it
wouldn't hurt much but your role might have surprisingly effective interactions with other roles we could find out and possibly use if you claimed.

I actually don't think we should discuss you claiming, you are plenty capable of making that decision yourself and if you were faking having a useless role, I wouldn't want to put you on the spot where you'd be forced to invent a fake claim.

[Voltaire]

No to mass claim. But not a crazy strong opinion.

vote: ashersky btw. Because of the nature of the claim.

[ashersky]

No to mass claim. But not a crazy strong opinion.

vote: ashersky btw. Because of the nature of the claim.

You mean how it is exactly like my claim in your RMM game?

[Voltaire]

No, not at all, actually.

[ashersky]

So does the cop claiming day 1..

I think I'd like to see what others think about the massclaim issue before
commenting (or not commenting) on it myself.

Should we consider having you fullclaim? If you don't plan on using the role anyways, seems it
wouldn't hurt much but your role might have surprisingly effective interactions with other roles we could find out and possibly use if you claimed.

I actually don't think we should discuss you claiming, you are plenty capable of making that decision yourself and if you were faking having a useless role, I wouldn't want to put you on the spot where you'd be forced to invent a fake claim.

I'm sure if I needed a fake role, I could invent one just fine.

[ashersky]

No, not at all, actually.

Oh.  Then vote: voltaire until you explain.  This is OMGUS and a policy vote for voting without a well-explained reason.

[Eevee]

I mean, your claim is super convenient for say a serial killer (or a mafia member bit wanting to get shot by one).

I still don't view it as scummy, because it also makes you a great settling lynch if we can't find anything better in our 8 days.

[Eevee]

your point about wanting to kickstart the game with real discussion also really hits home with me, I agree with it, appreciate it and associate it with town ashersky.

[Voltaire]

No, not at all, actually.

Oh.  Then vote: voltaire until you explain.  This is OMGUS and a policy vote for voting without a well-explained reason.

All in due time.

[ashersky]

I mean, your claim is super convenient for say a serial killer (or a mafia member bit wanting to get shot by one).

I still don't view it as scummy, because it also makes you a great settling lynch if we can't find anything better in our 8 days.

This is definitely a fake (or real) claim I make as scum.  I point to myself in the last RMM game, Dr. Who, where I was an enabler and claimed right off the bat.  I was scum there, and had a good reason to claim.

I think you'd have a harder time figuring out a compelling scum narrative for a scum-held misdirection role to claim right off the bat.  A straight up fake claim?  Sure, I guess.  As an SK maybe, to try to survive as long as possible.

I see it this way -- 9-player games are hard to both 1) make last and 2) make balanced, when there are a lot of roles.  Either the two scum are too strong (and you can't really have more than 2 scum) or the three scum are too weak (because 6 v 3 is just crazy, so you can't really have more than 2 scum).  So maybe yuma includes an SK, so it's 2 + 1 scum vs. 6 town.  But probably it's 2 v 7.

If town has strong roles, and I mean simple strong like cop/doc, with such a small pool to choose from, the likelihood of catching scum goes up, and that's just tough.  How to diffuse that?  Misdirection.  So, I expect scum has a bus driver or something similar, possibly ninja.  SK would need to be BP, maybe investigation-proof.

But RMM is about roles, so town needs roles.  If there are cop/tracker/watcher type roles, you mess with them by including misdirection roles (like mine).  I'm negating that by deciding NOT to use my power, and therefore I am strengthening the more important town PRs.

I feel a lot like I did in Dynasty Warriors I, where I claimed 1-shot doc right off the bat to help town POE.  I have a weak role that is actually negative utility here, so I'm canceling myself out.  I get the added benefit of possibly freaking out scum, because what if I have no role at all, or what if I do have a strong role.  So they need to decide what to do about me.

[ashersky]

Also, huge FOS for:

faust, jotheonah, Walrus, xeiron, EFHW, Archetype


The game has been going for an hour, and still no posts.  Terrible.

[Archetype]

Vote: ashersky. I think he's bluffing.

No to massclaim, but yes to ash claim.

[Eevee]

vote: archetype

better than ashersky. this is a wagon scum might want to get on early.

[yuma]

Vote Count 1.1

ashersky (2): Voltaire, Archetype
Voltaire (1): ashersky
Archetype (1: Eevee

Not Voting (5): faust, jotheonah, Walrus, xeiron, EFHW

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.

The deadline for Day1 is 8 days. Day1 will end on Tuesday February 4 at 7:30 pm forum time.

[Archetype]

vote: archetype

better than ashersky. this is a wagon scum might want to get on early.

Why? If he's a negative utility, why wouldn't we want to lynch him?

No; If I had a negative utility, I would keep it hidden and not use it. I see no reason why he said that he's a negative utility.

[EFHW]

Hi everyone.

Always with the claiming, ashersky!  Eevee has a point that you could have just not used it and not said anything, but I guess that's not your way of doing things. 

I don't like Eevee's other idea, about you full-claiming so we can see how our own roles interact.  I very much do not like that idea.  Maybe later, but definitely not now.

[Voltaire]

vote: archetype

better than ashersky. this is a wagon scum might want to get on early.

Why? If he's a negative utility, why wouldn't we want to lynch him?

No; If I had a negative utility, I would keep it hidden and not use it. I see no reason why he said that he's a negative utility.

We wouldn't want to lynch him if he's town. Town read on Archetype, btw, even though this isn't thought through.

[ashersky]

So far:

Town reads on Eevee and Arch
Scum read on Voltaire
Null read on EFHW

Indigestion reads on the rest of the group, as they haven't posted.

[jotheonah]

Not sure what to make of this at all. My gut reaction is to not believe ashersky, but I'm not all about gut reactions. Nonetheless, my conclusion about early ash semi-claims is not to act on them one way or another. No town cred, etc. Whatever scum!ash might have hoped to gain from the claim, we should be careful not to offer. If ash does anything to earn town cred down the line, maybe we give some more weight to the claim.

Not a fan of the day 1 mass claim, as per usual.

[EFHW]

vote: archetype

better than ashersky. this is a wagon scum might want to get on early.

This logic only works if you know Archetype is town.

[Eevee]

vote: archetype

better than ashersky. this is a wagon scum might want to get on early.

This logic only works if you know Archetype is town.

I assume you meant ashersky? Him being town is the strongest read I have.