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[Jimmmmm]

That's just what I could think of off the top of my head - just trying to be helpful! I can see that the Jim/Galz scenario makes some sense, but it also gives us another possibility for the raerae kill: to try to implicate me.

[theorel]

Thanks for clearing up the first bit, now for the second part are you saying that since it was galz teammates that killed raerae, and raerae pushed jimm, jimm is a potential scummate with galz. I can see this, I had suspicions of jimm for along time, though everything from yesterday is muddled and I remember I tunneled had on him and i think my case wasn't very good.

I was trying to say that if raerae was killed for suspecting Jimmmmm it only makes sense if galz was team-mates with jimmmmm.  If it seems unlikely that they were team-mates then it is unlikely raerae was killed for suspecting Jimmmmm.  Basically, Jimmmm-killed-raerae might have been disprovable, which would lend credence to other reasons to kill her.

Now, as it turns out (apparently, based on Jimmmmm's explanation of events), Galzria acted in a way towards Jimmmmm that can be attributed to a scum-mate.  So, we can't disprove it.  I'm not sure we should take the Galz-Jimmmm interaction as confirmation though.  I mean the behavior cited is in keeping with scum interacting with basically anyone in multi-ball right?  (I mean either Galz-Jimmmmm were team-mates or Galz didn't know Jimmmm's alignment.  So he might distance himself from that read if he worried Jimmmmm would flip scum the same as if he knew Jimmmmm would flip scum.)  I'm inclined to read it as slightly scummy, but given my former town-read of Jimmmmm overall, I'm going with a neutral read atm.

[Robz888]

I want to revisit my scumread on Eevee, in light of the fact that Eevee's principle defender--Galzria--flipped scum.

Of course there's two ways to see this.

1) Galzria's town read on Eevee, and adamant defense of him, was a lie, because Galz is scum, and he wasn't giving a real read. In this case, Eevee could be town or scum, but the case Galzria was presenting on Eevee being town was false.

2) Galzria's town read on Eevee was legitimate, and Galz was also buddying him. Something I know scum Galzria would do.

Also, if Galzria's read on Eevee was a lie and he did think Eevee was scum, there's some chance he would have shot him, probably.

So I guess this means I have to lessen my scumread of Eevee, since most of the evidence re: Eeve/Galz makes it LESS likely that Eevee is scum. Is there an error in my thinking?

[shraeye]

Hey, i'm pretty busy this week.  Gonna try to get to this during the weekend.  Don't go crazy and quicklynch people please.

[theorel]

shraeye is obviously lying....look how he hasn't posted in any of his other games (like Pandemic IV)...we should just quicklynch him so that we can get that started without having to wait for him to defend his scummy hide here.

[theorel]

In all seriousness.  I agree with you regarding Eevee Robz.  Galzria being scum re: Eevee makes him less likely to be scum.  His interaction seems unlikely to be partner interaction (though by all means not impossible), therefore Eevee is less likely to be scum overall (he only has one team he can be on instead of 2).  Also, Galz' read on him can be interpreted as a real read, thereby making him less likely to be on the opposing team (by the amount which you can trust Galz' read of Eevee).

All things considered, I'm leaning slight town on Eevee at this point.

[liopoil]

yay, things to analyze!

the scum-team with galz on it almost certainly killed raerae. The NK on raerae was most likely an attempt to get the other scum team. There were quite a few people who had a scum read on raerae, and ash was the one who pushed it the hardest. Ash has already addressed this, but I'm not sold on it. ash asked why he would push the lynch just to NK her later? well I'd assume that you would rater lynch her so you can NK someone else, plus if she's scum you get a little town cred. so FoS ash.

 did galz think raerae was scum?

I think ash is a good target for the mirror universe cop tonight; if we don't lynch him.

I will have  very limited access friday, Saturday, and sunday this week. sorry

who thought galz was scum? anyone? anyone who did should similarly have some suspicion.

[ashersky]

Dont have time to long post right now but I want to have a chat about Ashersky and mcmc.  They are two people that really stood out from me from yesterday (and I want to reread to make sure I'm remembering things correctly so if I say anything thats not correct please correct me).

Ashersky:  I really didn't like how he was moving about his vote at the end of the day yesterday.  It gave me an impression of "I want to maintain my reads but I want to kill who we can kill."

Mcmc: This is one I think I am missing details cause I definitely wasn't giving it 100% after page 40, but didn't mcmc say that he was going to hammer cuzz then never ended up on the lynch?

Munch, is it just me, or are you suspecting me hard in like every game we're in together right now?

[ashersky]

yay, things to analyze!

the scum-team with galz on it almost certainly killed raerae. The NK on raerae was most likely an attempt to get the other scum team. There were quite a few people who had a scum read on raerae, and ash was the one who pushed it the hardest. Ash has already addressed this, but I'm not sold on it. ash asked why he would push the lynch just to NK her later? well I'd assume that you would rater lynch her so you can NK someone else, plus if she's scum you get a little town cred. so FoS ash.

 did galz think raerae was scum?

I think ash is a good target for the mirror universe cop tonight; if we don't lynch him.

I will have  very limited access friday, Saturday, and sunday this week. sorry

who thought galz was scum? anyone? anyone who did should similarly have some suspicion.

lio, I don't understand your bolded statment above.  I made a statement: "why would I publicly push so hard to lynch raerae just to NK her that night" and you make a disconnected argument: "ash tried to lynch her but since it didn't work, he killed her at night instead."

MY point was that, why would I make such a public show of finding raerae scummy to the point of voting her for like 85% of D1 and THEN decide to kill her on N1, since I know that will make me highly suspicious the next day?  (The answer here could be "if ash was a town vig, shooting raerae makes a lot of sense, given she was his top scumread")

Besides, I think multiple team mafia games, the incorrect assumption is to gun for the other team at night.  Scum should try to kill town PRs, actually, or strong townies, so that the scum teams can try to lead town to lynch the other scum team, because lynching scum is a good thing, and a towny thing, so its in scums' best interest.

[ashersky]

I think ash is a good target for the mirror universe cop tonight; if we don't lynch him.

I am fine with this, btw, personally, since I am town.  But I am not okay with this as a town member, because I want the MU Cop to find the other(s) MU member.

[liopoil]

sorry, I wasn't very clear.

let's assume you are scum.  you want raerae dead because you think she is the other scum. You would like town to lynch her. If town lynches her you can NK someone else and so get two people you want to die dead. If town lynches her you get town cred if she flips scum which you think she will. You are going to insure raerae dies, but you would rather not have to do I yourself, so you try to get town to lynch her. This is why you would push raerae  just to NK her. Also if she flipped scum you might get some town cred for having pushed her the day before. However, I guess you might not push her because if you push her lynch and then she dies at night you are suspected... which is exactly what happened. the benefits to you if she gets lynched are much greater than the suspicion you get if town doesn't.

My arguement is not terribly strong, and is  and not reason enough alone to vote for ash, just something which makes me a little suspicious.

[Robz888]

I really think Ash is town. His antics at the end of yesterday put a huge onus on him to be right, he was so insistent. The fact that neither Cuzz nor raerae panned out as scum for him... well, I just think he was misguided townie. That's pretty dangerous play if he's scum. He's no IC, but my townread on him is as strong as it was yesterday.

[Glooble]

Robz, I wonder if you feel the same about shraeye.

[Robz888]

Robz, I wonder if you feel the same about shraeye.

I do NOT feel the same about shraeye.

He was largely absent from the end-of-day shenanigans (all things being equal, this is a scumtell). Now, I know he was busy, that's fine. But I really did expect him to express at least some skepticism that Cuzz was the right direction after the cop claim. He did not; his case that he thought was so full-proof remained so, to him.

Additionally, I've said this before, but I can't believe there isn't scum somewhere in the Munschraerae trifecta. We know it's not raerae. Munch is another person I'm watching especially closely. It would surprise me if all three of those people, so in sync, were town.

So if we're looking on wagon, I'm looking at shraeye and Munch. Off-wagon might be a BETTER place to look, but I'm not sure who is quite as scummy as shraeye and Munch there.

[Robz888]

Just went back to check who voted for who. Yuma is really the only person off-wagon I have much suspicion of.

[Robz888]

And I guess Jimm, if these assumptions about him and Galz are worthwhile.

[ashersky]

On wagon: Galzria, TheMunch, shraeye, Glooble, liopoil, raerae, Robz888, ashersky
Off wagon: mcmcsalot, Jimmmmm, Eevee, yuma, Cuzz, Dsell, theorel



Above is what we know.  I'd add Glooble to the list of on-wagon folks that bear looking at.  Off wagon is harder, actually. 

[Robz888]

On wagon: Galzria, TheMunch, shraeye, Glooble, liopoil, raerae, Robz888, ashersky
Off wagon: mcmcsalot, Jimmmmm, Eevee, yuma, Cuzz, Dsell, theorel



Above is what we know.  I'd add Glooble to the list of on-wagon folks that bear looking at.  Off wagon is harder, actually.

Just feeling this out... It seems reasonable that Galzria's partner (partners?) are off-wagon. Or one of them is. Or there's only one. Who of mcmc, Jimm, Eevee, yuma, Dsell, or theorel are likely to be his partner?

Let's say I cross off Dsell, theorel, and mcmc there, the people that read town to me. That leaves yuma, Jimm, and Eevee. But like theorel and I discussed, Eevee is actually less likely to be Galz's buddy. Okay. So we are looking Jimm and yuma then. I should look back and see if anything fits a yuma-Galz scum team.

[ashersky]

On wagon: Galzria, TheMunch, shraeye, Glooble, liopoil, raerae, Robz888, ashersky
Off wagon: mcmcsalot, Jimmmmm, Eevee, yuma, Cuzz, Dsell, theorel



Above is what we know.  I'd add Glooble to the list of on-wagon folks that bear looking at.  Off wagon is harder, actually.

Just feeling this out... It seems reasonable that Galzria's partner (partners?) are off-wagon. Or one of them is. Or there's only one. Who of mcmc, Jimm, Eevee, yuma, Dsell, or theorel are likely to be his partner?

Let's say I cross off Dsell, theorel, and mcmc there, the people that read town to me. That leaves yuma, Jimm, and Eevee. But like theorel and I discussed, Eevee is actually less likely to be Galz's buddy. Okay. So we are looking Jimm and yuma then. I should look back and see if anything fits a yuma-Galz scum team.

Further to this, it's reasonable to assume that the other scum team is easier found on-wagon.  If I cross off myself and Robz (townread), that leaves Munch, shraeye, Glooble, Lio.

I actually disagree with Robz that Munchraeye would take out raerae, if either one of them is scum.  Having her seem scummy, especially after the Cuzz flip, would actually help them, since a few of us at least felt that at least one of the three was scum.  That would have bought him/them a day as we lynched raerae out of the three of them.

Clearly shraeye takes a cred hit with his vocal stance on the Cuzz lynch.  He's probably the best bet for hitting scum on the wagon at this point.  But then again, why be so vocal about a town lynch if you know he's town?

Glooble got a pass on D1 after a wagon formed...Lio keeps getting the newbie pass, but is making a ton of bad arguments (which sounds like newbie town, actually)...

[ashersky]

On wagon: Galzria, TheMunch, shraeye, Glooble, liopoil, raerae, Robz888, ashersky
Off wagon: mcmcsalot, Jimmmmm, Eevee, yuma, Cuzz, Dsell, theorel



Above is what we know.  I'd add Glooble to the list of on-wagon folks that bear looking at.  Off wagon is harder, actually.

Just feeling this out... It seems reasonable that Galzria's partner (partners?) are off-wagon. Or one of them is. Or there's only one. Who of mcmc, Jimm, Eevee, yuma, Dsell, or theorel are likely to be his partner?

Let's say I cross off Dsell, theorel, and mcmc there, the people that read town to me. That leaves yuma, Jimm, and Eevee. But like theorel and I discussed, Eevee is actually less likely to be Galz's buddy. Okay. So we are looking Jimm and yuma then. I should look back and see if anything fits a yuma-Galz scum team.

Further to this, it's reasonable to assume that the other scum team is easier found on-wagon.  If I cross off myself and Robz (townread), that leaves Munch, shraeye, Glooble, Lio.

I actually disagree with Robz that Munchraeye would take out raerae, if either one of them is scum.  Having her seem scummy, especially after the Cuzz flip, would actually help them, since a few of us at least felt that at least one of the three was scum.  That would have bought him/them a day as we lynched raerae out of the three of them.

Clearly shraeye takes a cred hit with his vocal stance on the Cuzz lynch.  He's probably the best bet for hitting scum on the wagon at this point. But then again, why be so vocal about a town lynch if you know he's town?

Glooble got a pass on D1 after a wagon formed...Lio keeps getting the newbie pass, but is making a ton of bad arguments (which sounds like newbie town, actually)...

I keep forgetting the multi-ball (who coined this anyway, it's a terrible name) aspect.  Shraeye could have felt Cuzz was on the other scum team.

[shraeye]

I strongly felt Cuzz was scum; his flip surprised me.

[shraeye]

I actually disagree with Robz that Munchraeye would take out raerae, if either one of them is scum.  Having her seem scummy, especially after the Cuzz flip, would actually help them, since a few of us at least felt that at least one of the three was scum.  That would have bought him/them a day as we lynched raerae out of the three of them.

I didn't see where Robz said this; please direct me.

[TheMunch]

Dont have time to long post right now but I want to have a chat about Ashersky and mcmc.  They are two people that really stood out from me from yesterday (and I want to reread to make sure I'm remembering things correctly so if I say anything thats not correct please correct me).

Ashersky:  I really didn't like how he was moving about his vote at the end of the day yesterday.  It gave me an impression of "I want to maintain my reads but I want to kill who we can kill."

Mcmc: This is one I think I am missing details cause I definitely wasn't giving it 100% after page 40, but didn't mcmc say that he was going to hammer cuzz then never ended up on the lynch?

Munch, is it just me, or are you suspecting me hard in like every game we're in together right now?

To be fair, I have been scum quite often so I have "suspected" you quite a bit, yes.  That said I have always been 100% truthful when I said that you are wrong.  This time I actually think you are both wrong AND scum.  .

[TheMunch]

I disagree with everything Robz is saying (namely in 1314-1317).  I will temper that statement with ZX threw me off a lot about Robz.  I cant help but read a lot of his arguments as manipulative...

[Robz888]

I disagree with everything Robz is saying (namely in 1314-1317).  I will temper that statement with ZX threw me off a lot about Robz.  I cant help but read a lot of his arguments as manipulative...

I understand that, and won't fault you for that. Just keep in mind that just because I was scum in one game does not make me scum in another.