Dominion Strategy Forum
Dominion => Puzzles and Challenges => Topic started by: AJD on January 07, 2014, 10:15:43 pm
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With the famous University/Watchtower combo, you can gain a card and play it the same turn: gain with University, topdeck with Watchtower, play Watchtower and draw the gained card, play the gained card.
There are lots of other ways to gain a card and play it the same turn, but most of them involve having a deck-drawing engine.
However, there is at least one other two-card gain-and-play combo: two cards X and Y that are sufficient to guarantee your ability to gain a card and play it on the same turn.
(By "sufficient" I mean that no cards' abilities other than X and Y are used to execute the gain-and-play, and it can be done regardless of the condition of your deck and discard pile. There may still be edge cases that could prevent you—e.g., University/Watchtower fails if your handsize is larger than 7 or if there are no Actions costing up to $5 left in the supply—but I'll trust you to recognize such situations as mere edge cases that don't invalidate the premise.)
What are X and Y? There may be more than one valid answer, though I only have one in mind.
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Mine.
Similarly, Explorer, Ill-Gotten Gains, Trading Post, etc.
On your intended problem:
Can I use 2 X's and 1 Y? e.g. Village/Armory
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Mine.
Similarly, Explorer, Ill-Gotten Gains, Trading Post, etc.
Ah, whoops.
Okay, without gaining directly to hand.
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Armory or Taxman with Venture
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Ironworks on an Action - Victory card with no cards remaining in the draw or discard.
@Mic: Bureaucrat, too.
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with no cards remaining in the draw or discard.
(This stipulation is ruled out by the statement of the puzzle.)
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Armory or Taxman with Venture
That's what I had in mind! Well, Armory is, anyway. I meant to phrase the question to exclude Taxman—can't count on having a Treasure in hand—but I see I didn't do that.
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(This stipulation is ruled out by the statement of the puzzle.)
But I thought that having cards in your draw or discard counted as an edge case!
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province/Tournament - self explanatory
Develop/Village: Village -> Develop (gain crap to deck top) -> Village
Procession/Watchtower: Prssn -> Prssn -> Prssn -> Prssn (its a may card, don't play anything, trash this Prssn, gain a 5, reveal Wt) -> Wt (draw 5) -> play 5 twice.
Venture/Treasure Map
Venture/Bag of Gold
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Reveal fools gold on province buy and play village
Play village, Develop a estate and play village
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Just reveal Beggar to an attack and have Venture in hand, or a simple card that draws 1..
Any card that topdecks something can work this way.
Alternatively, you could have an all action deck, gain an action card and play a single Scrying Pool
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Reveal fools gold on province buy and play village
How do you do that in a single turn?
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You could Ambassador a Province, so that another player gains it during your turn. Of course, then you need four cards in the combo (Fools Gold, Village, Ambassador, Province).
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Sea Hag / Council Room / Possession
...yes I know. Don't worry about it.
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I don't really like Armory/Venture as a solution. Armory/Adventurer works just as well, as does nearly any nonterminal Treasure-gainer paired with Watchtower, such as Governor/Watchtower or Bandit Camp/Watchtower, and also Bag of Gold/"anything that draws a card".
Gaining and playing a Treasure card is just too easy since the Treasure card doesn't require an Action to play. Any solutions aside from University/Watchtower that can gain and play an Action card?
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Does proccession-watchtower w/nonterminal count?
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I don't really like Armory/Venture as a solution. Armory/Adventurer works just as well
…It does not; Armory/Adventurer requires a village. I take your general point though.
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I don't really like Armory/Venture as a solution. Armory/Adventurer works just as well
…It does not; Armory/Adventurer requires a village. I take your general point though.
fair enough.
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I like jomini's Tournament/Province solution, although it is unclear to me whether an opponent blocking with a Province is an edge case or not. I would say that "there are no prizes left" is an edge case, but "an opponent reveals a Province" is commonplace enough to not be an edge case.
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I don't really like Armory/Venture as a solution. Armory/Adventurer works just as well, as does nearly any nonterminal Treasure-gainer paired with Watchtower, such as Governor/Watchtower or Bandit Camp/Watchtower, and also Bag of Gold/"anything that draws a card".
Gaining and playing a Treasure card is just too easy since the Treasure card doesn't require an Action to play. Any solutions aside from University/Watchtower that can gain and play an Action card?
Well if you don't like Province/Tournament I stand by Procession/Watchtower and Village/Develop.
Take a simple hand of Prssn x3/Wt x2. Play Prssn -> Prssn -> Prssn -> Wt (draw to six, gain a $4 action on deck top, reveal other Wt) -> Wt (draw $4) -> play $4 twice. The $4 card can be Prssn if needed.
Likewise, there are a lot of viable $4 villages you can use with Develop. Take the hand Fortress x3/Develop. Play: Fort -> Dev (Fort to Dev/Duchy, Dev on top) -> Fort (draw Dev) -> Dev (Fort to Dev/Duchy). You could also do this setup with Native Village/Dev.
Another option is Rats/Wt. Hand is Rats x2/Wt x3. Play a Rats (trash a Wt, gain a Rats, reveal a Wt) -> Rats (trash a Wt, draw a Rats, gain a Rats, reveal a Wt) -> Rats (trash a Wt, draw a card, gain a Rats).
Another option would be Upgrade/Wt with either a $6 or a $4 action on the board. Either upgrade Upgrades or Wts respectively and top the inbound card.
Urchin/Wt also works. Urchin x3/Wt: Urchin -> Urchin (trash this, gain a Mercenary, reveal Wt) -> Urchin (draw Mercenary) -> Mercenary
Depending on how you count "gain a card" - Mining Village/Graverobber: Mv (trash it) -> Grvr (gain Mv to deck top) -> Mv (draw Mv) -> Mv. You can either gain back the Mv you trashed this turn or gain one previously seeded into the trash.
A bigger stretch is Prssn/Fort. Prssn -> Fort (trash Fort, "gain" Fort) -> Fort.
In general, you can use any cantrip gainer (e.g. Urchin, Rats, Upgrade, Gov) with Wt and play the gainer multiple times to gain and then draw the new card with an action left. You can use drawing villages with a lot of top decking gainers (e.g. Graverobber, Dev), but you may have restrictions on what you need to make the puzzle work - e.g. Grvr works with most villages if you can start with 6 card hands: Village -> Grvr (trash Grvr) -> Village -> Grvr (gain Grvr) -> Village (draw Grvr) -> Grvr (regained).
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Doesn't the puzzle stipulate that not just 2 types of cards are used, but only 2 card copies are played? All the examples mentioned above consist of multiple copies of the same card, but the valid solutions do not.
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Doesn't the puzzle stipulate that not just 2 types of cards are used, but only 2 card copies are played? All the examples mentioned above consist of multiple copies of the same card, but the valid solutions do not.
It was not phrased as such, just merely that you were only using the abilities of X and Y.
With the original puzzle allowing money you can do things like Venture/B-crat, anything that draws - Bag of Gold, Bandit camp/Wt, and I'd still vote for Tournament/Province.
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Doesn't the puzzle stipulate that not just 2 types of cards are used, but only 2 card copies are played? All the examples mentioned above consist of multiple copies of the same card, but the valid solutions do not.
It was not phrased as such, just merely that you were only using the abilities of X and Y.
Yeah, I originally thought of adding a stipulation along the lines of "you must be able to do it from a hand consisting of only one X and one Y", but decided to leave it out because I thought that made the puzzle too wordy.