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51

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 11:33:28 am »

We are comparing apples and oranges. To decide whether this mission is worthwhile or not, we have to see what other missions were being considered for whatever grants it might get. Manned mission to Mars isn't one of them, it's just on a completely different scale.

For the record, I think we should try to get a space elevator (or equivalent) done before we get people to Mars. No large-scale colonization of Mars is possible before that, and it would make all other missions considerably cheaper.

For those people in favour of this mission because of the research and science value....what if it could be done by a probe? At a fraction of the cost. I'd be in favour of that.

Hum, isn't the submergible a probe? What do you mean?

Completely happy with the Space Elevator idea, dont really understand the science there, but will take your word it makes things cheaper and better in the long run.


Hmm, yes, maybe wrong terminology for the word probe there, sort of meant to say something that either sits in the atmosphere and scans.
Sure, you wouldnt get the fluid dynamics, but is that really worth going all the way to Titan for?

52

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 11:22:07 am »

For the record, its this one mission I am currently talking about, I think its a waste of money that could be spent better elsewhere (Not limited to putting people on Mars)


For those people in favour of this mission because of the research and science value....what if it could be done by a probe? At a fraction of the cost. I'd be in favour of that.

53

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 11:19:12 am »

Maybe. For a sufficiently strong "only" and "low cost to benefit ratio", you're right. But there's no reason we can't pick values that rule out huge longshots like this Titan mission and still leave the a supermajority of more interesting research areas undisturbed.

I agree with the longshots that might actually deliver a big payload, but I have read what they are trying to do on Titan, and none of it is that worthwhile in my opinion.

54

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 11:17:14 am »

We seem to be misunderstanding each other. For the price of sending people to Mars, maybe you can pay a dozen space exploration programs (made up numbers, but I would be surprised if they turned out not to be very conservative). Maybe exploring Titan gives us more "tangible" reasons to keep doing so. Maybe the whole program will lead to scientific improvements, inventions or discoveries that can be used on Earth. We won't know until we do it.

I don't think that talking about "tangible successes" in such a speculative domain as space exploration is all that relevant. I mean, look at the justifications for sending people to the Moon back in the XXth century...

EDIT: and this thread should probably be moved at least to "General discussion".

No misunderstanding. You said I was implying something, I pointed out I wasn't.
You may have misunderstood me however, but hopefully I cleared that up for you.

And I'm happy with your 12x, in fact thats waaay less than I would have thought, Mars is expensive!

But working out the science to get people alive to other planets, its worth waaay more than 12x the amount of scientific discoveries I think we will find on studying fluid dynamics on Titan and anything that comes from that.

55

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 11:13:33 am »

On first read, Ozle is not so much implying that money should be routed from Titan to manned-Mars missions so much as explicitly stating so.

I'm confused by his later denial.  Maybe he was somehow being sarcastic, since a manned mission to Mars has a more ludicrous cost/benefit ratio than sending some submersible robot to Titan.

Read it again please.

I definately did advocate moving the money to such other scientific advances as putting humans into space, and ultimately living conditions.

The only thing I denied is that I said the Titan mission would cost the same as the Mars mission.

56

General Discussion / Re: Random Stuff Part II

« on: March 19, 2015, 10:40:44 am »

I dont hate it!

Although I have never read any of them, I gave up on childrens books ages ago

They were too tough?

Of course not, my mum would have explained all the big words.

No pictures though, thats the problem

57

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 10:39:56 am »

Of course its cheaper, no one is saying one is a replacement to the other.

Well, you were implying that:

Instead that money should be rerouted to space missions with tangible successes, like putting people on Mars.

Yes, it has the WoooooooW factor. But is that really worth the millions and millions that is going to be sent on it that could be of use to science elsewhere?

I believe that if there are researchers that are working on such a project, it's because there are things to be learned from Titan's seas. I am no astrophysicist myself, so I can't get into more detail than that.

No, I wasn't implying that at all I am afraid. You may have read it at that, but that would be a ludicrous assumption from my point of view.


And scientists don't just work on stuff because its the best thing to work on, the reasons they could have been working on it are for a variety of reasons. Not limited to betterment of mankind as a whole, but also things such as 'what they can get a research grant for'

As you have already pointed out, a submersible to Titan is coooool, thats going to sway people.

Also, scientists also do stuff like this...
http://www.improbable.com/ig/

And I'm not saying we are going to learn stuff form Titans seas, as Wereeoeoeo has already pointed out, we may learn stuff about fluid dynamics, but the cost to benefit ratio is waaaay out for me.

I feel its stuff like this that is the reason we are not far far more advanced in science than we are, its holding us back.

58

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 10:23:21 am »

Pretty sure that getting a submergible to Titan is way, waaaaaaaay cheaper than getting people to Mars.

I fail to see how "We want to send a submarine into a giant sea of liquid methane" is not getting you super-excited.

Of course its cheaper, no one is saying one is a replacement to the other.

Yes, it has the WoooooooW factor. But is that really worth the millions and millions that is going to be sent on it that could be of use to science elsewhere?

59

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 10:22:45 am »

Well an argument could be made to spend that money on Earth as well.

Of course it Can, and feel free to make such a case if you believe it.

60

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Card Sleeves

« on: March 19, 2015, 10:04:49 am »

I put every card through my home laminator.

61

General Discussion / Re: Random Stuff Part II

« on: March 19, 2015, 10:04:16 am »

Why does everyone hate the second book of Harry Potter? That's like my favorite one.

I know. They can't all be the best Harry Potter book ever!

Uh OH! Eeve's back....hide your valuables and your women! on second thought, probably just need to hide the valuables

62

General Discussion / Re: Random Stuff Part II

« on: March 19, 2015, 10:00:59 am »

I dont hate it!

Although I have never read any of them, I gave up on childrens books ages ago

63

General Discussion / Re: Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 09:59:40 am »

In general, though, exploration is about finding out what you don't know; we won't know why we should have gone to Titan until we've actually been there.

Except that money could have actual scientific benefits rather than guess work.

The absolute minuscule chance of finding life is not worth the millions that will be spent.

With an infinite budget of course I would say go for it, but in the real world and the actual chance to advance science is available, this sort of thing is taking much needed resources away from the useful space exploration.

64

General Discussion / Science Exploration

« on: March 19, 2015, 09:30:46 am »

I'm a massive fan of science, and of space. But some of these proposed exbitions are getting silly now.

Take this one, about putting a submersible on Titan!
http://www.space.com/28589-titan-submarine-robotic-saturn-ship.html
What is that actually going to learn that will be useful?

Instead that money should be rerouted to space missions with tangible successes, like putting people on Mars.

65

Dominion General Discussion / Re: List of card art avatars

« on: March 19, 2015, 09:28:48 am »

All of you are being so silly. Who is actually getting upset about taking avatars? I protest this protesting by taking an avatar someone already has.

No one was getting upset though, that's the funny thing. Its people getting upset on behalf of other people might get upset.

66

General Discussion / Re: Poll inspired by Adam H's stream: Do you smoke?

« on: March 19, 2015, 09:27:48 am »

As opposed to this disgraceful old lady

http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/news/10406686.Gran_shocked_as_council_patrol_officers_fine_her___75_for_putting_cigarette_stub_down_a_GRID/

67

General Discussion / Re: Poll inspired by Adam H's stream: Do you smoke?

« on: March 19, 2015, 09:20:07 am »

So on my way into the train station today, I witnessed a man stop by a trashcan and rub his cigarette out on the side of the bin, and then put his extinguished cigarette in the trash.  He da real MVP.

Of course, he should stop smoking; it's bad for his health.

Glowing embers in a bin full of paper? Great idea!

68

Feedback / Re: Bot trap

« on: March 19, 2015, 09:19:35 am »

But then where would I sell my penis enlargers?

69

Introductions / Re: A little late to the party

« on: March 19, 2015, 08:56:04 am »

Dude, the partys just getting started!

Make sure to drink all flipsides beer while waiting for Adventures!

70

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Interview with Donald X.

« on: March 18, 2015, 07:20:50 pm »

Will this sets art also have the tiny meeple silhouettes in the background of some of them the same you told me about in Dark Ages?

71

General Discussion / Re: Best 80's Power Ballard?

« on: March 18, 2015, 07:12:00 pm »

Man... I couldn't even pick out a top 10, much less a top 5 or even a "best"...

I mean, I've always been partial to Meatloaf and "I'd do anything for love (but I won't do that)"... but can you argue with a Poison pick? Queen? REO Speedwagon? Whitesnake? Styx?

I mean, the list, it just goes on and on...

No, you HAVE to pick one!.
Do it
DO IT NOW!!!!

Oh fine!

http://video.naij.com/view=6qgucczw

There, I hope you feel a bit better now

Although well done for being the only person to find a site that doesn't let you embed videos in forum posts automatically!

72

General Discussion / Re: New TV shows (American edition)

« on: March 18, 2015, 07:11:12 pm »

None of my IRL friends watch it, so I have to just say it here. HOLY CRAP DID ANYONE SEE THE FLASH TONIGHT!?

#

I gave up after 4 or 5 episodes. Rather boring and predictable and quite childlike I found.

Did it get better then?

73

General Discussion / Re: Best 80's Power Ballard?

« on: March 18, 2015, 03:53:55 am »

Man... I couldn't even pick out a top 10, much less a top 5 or even a "best"...

I mean, I've always been partial to Meatloaf and "I'd do anything for love (but I won't do that)"... but can you argue with a Poison pick? Queen? REO Speedwagon? Whitesnake? Styx?

I mean, the list, it just goes on and on...

No, you HAVE to pick one!.
Do it
DO IT NOW!!!!

74

General Discussion / Re: Random Stuff Part II

« on: March 17, 2015, 06:02:59 pm »

Some editing for you:

In the dark, dark wilds of East Sussex there stood an untamed Beast., A a fearsome creature that went by the name of the Hastings Half Marathon. Its back was full of ridges and impossible scaled heights, its tail a never ending ribbon of tarmac that brushed against the sea.  Its mighty strength had conquered many a poor soul as they tried in vain to slay it.

The people of Hastings cried out for a hero (or Hheroine, its a very PC town) and each year the masses assembled ready to do battle with this behemoth of races.  Who would save these poor fisher-folk from another year of torment.? As the crowds huddled together, ready for the gun to sound that would start their journey into the unknown., Tthe clouds parted, and for one brief moment a shaft of light broke through, casting a heavenly spotlight on one of the athletes awaiting their fate.

The mob parted, and there in their midst stood a vision in pink, a beauty from afar,; this was no ordinary woman, this was the might Asia and she stood unbowed before the Jabberwocky of the South.  She would defeat this monster, not only with speed and stamina, but also with style and she would look good doing it!

As a reward the people of the land showered her with riches, but being the giving and just person she was, she turned down their offer of fame and fortune and instead told them that the money would be spent on the poor and homeless who need it most. For that was her cause.

Some of that may be stylistic choice on your part though.

(Cheers. but pretty much all of it is stilistic on my part; I like like short snapy sentances on dramatics statements.]

75

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Team Dominion

« on: March 17, 2015, 05:57:54 pm »

I disagree with this because I dont have any friends to be in my team