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[faust]

Don't blink. Don't even blink. Blink and you're dead. They are fast, faster than you can believe. Don't turn your back, don't look away and don't blink!
Good luck.

Welcome to M59: Blink Mafia!

Mod: faust

This is a small, simple open setup I created base on the episode "Blink" from the third season of (new) Doctor Who. Setup details can be found in the second post.

Players:
1. Hydrad
2. chairs
3. EgorK
4. Joseph2302
5. Witherweaver
6. XerxesPraelor
7. Awaclus
8. Rubby
9. silverspawn

Spectators tagged: Teproc, scott_pilgrim, ashersky, A Drowned Kernel, 2.71828...

Day starts/ends:

Rules for this game

Changes to the usual rule sets are marked in olive.

The Golden Rule:

Please remember that this is a game and your main objective is to have fun!  Be considerate of each other, don’t get personal, and enjoy the game. Please read The Civility Pledge before signing up for any mafia game on this site.  If you have not /pledged there, you cannot play. Excessive personal attacks or uncivil behavior may be dealt with by modifiers or modkills.

1. General Gameplay and Etiquette:

1. You may not quote information (either real or fabricated) from any source other than the thread you are posting in. This means no quotes from PMs and no quotes from QTs in the main thread or in another QT. Paraphrasing is acceptable. If you are unsure whether a post is legal, please ask the moderator before posting.
2. There is to be NO personal communication outside of the forum postings.  This also means that out of context quotes are prohibited for all players who signed up for this game as long as it is running. Mafia members may communicate at night and during the confirmation stage.
3. If you have a role with a Night action your choices are due to all mods by the posted deadline.  If we do not receive your PM by the posted deadline you will forfeit your actions. In case of multiple submissions, the last valid one before the deadline will be used.
4. Roles with Night actions will not be able to submit an action on Night 0 (i.e. during the confirmation stage).
5. Any player with a Night action may instead submit a “No Action” PM to let the Mods know that you do not want to perform your expected action that Night phase.
6. Mafia members must choose their night kill target in their QT. It is possible for a member of the mafia to hand in orders for their partner. It is not possible for the Mafia to no kill two nights in a row. If this were to happen, the kill target and the kill executioner are decided randomly.
6. As a general rule you should aim for one post every 24 hours, minimum, to keep the game moving.

2. Voting, Deadlines, and Player Death:

1. In this game, the Day phase will last 7 days and the Night phase 24 hours.
3. A simple majority (rounded up) of all living members must agree on one person for a lynch to occur prior to deadline.
4. Once you have reached a simple majority no further unvoting will change someone’s fate.  Further votes will also be ignored.
5. Once a player is lynched the game enters twilight; all players including the one who was lynched may continue to post during twilight.
6. If the deadline is hit without a player reaching the majority of votes, there will be no lynch. It is not possible for a no lynch to occur two days in a row. If this were to happen, a random town player will be lynched instead.
7. Please submit votes as: Vote: PlayerName.  Votes will NOT be counted if they are not bold or do not follow this syntax! Obvious abbreviations or nicknames will be counted so long as they are unambiguous.
8. Please submit vote revocations as either Unvote: PlayerName or Unvote. Unvotes are not necessary before changing votes.
9. You may Vote: No Lynch - a simple majority of these vote types are required to send the game to Night phase without a lynch. It is not possible for a no lynch to occur two days in a row. If this were to happen, a random town player will be lynched instead.
10. Once you are killed (either via lynch or night kill) you may no longer post in the game or in Quicktopics. This means that you do not even get a “Bah” post. The dead in this game are silent.
11. If the thread is locked, you may not post.  Threads can be locked for various reasons, but no matter what the reason, you may not post.  The mod may forget to lock the thread, but if they say it is locked, it is still locked.
12. Do not edit or delete posts.  We don't want some players having more information than others.  If you want to clarify posts, feel free to double post. Mods will not edit posts for you.

3. Miscellaneous/Mechanics:

1. Bold, olive text is reserved for the mod.  No invisible/small text is allowed, nor is cryptography.
2. If you have an issue/problem with the game, please PM the mod privately.  Do not post issues/complaints in the game thread.
3. The Mods may make mistakes - please point out any mistakes gently.  Mistakes will be corrected where possible, but sometimes mistakes are made that cannot be reversed.  These will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. Please bold all requests to the Mods so that they don’t get missed.
5. Prods of missing players will be issued upon request after 24 hours of no activity.  A prodded player has 48 hours to respond or risks replacement.  A player who has been prodded 2 times is subject to replacement under rule 3.10 without further notice.
6. Please do not discuss ongoing games, it can unintentionally affect the other game.
7. Rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, which may include modkill(s) if needed.
8. If you anticipate being unavailable for more than a 48-hour period please post a notice to that effect in the thread.  Treat this game as a commitment.  Be considerate – don’t leave us hanging.
9. Players who discover they are too busy to play in a game or want to leave the game for civility issues are not allowed to officially /out in the thread.  A request to /out must only be done via a PM to the moderator.  Please do not use this as a manipulation technique.  (Note players may continue to threaten to /out or imply that they might as long as it does not include an official request). Requests to /out are final once submitted. There will be no /outing and then /inning back into the game so make sure that when you /out you have thought it through and really want to do it. Players that can't be replaced will simply be mod-killed. Whether your request to /out will lead to replacement or a modkill is up to the mod's discretion.

[faust]

Setup information

This a 9-player game. There are 7 Townies and 2 Weeping Angels (this is the alias for the Mafia in this game).

Every night, each Townie may look at any other player. If two Townies target one Weeping Angel, the Weeping Angel is roleblocked that night, and if that player would perform the night kill that night, there will be no kill.

At any time during the game, the Weeping Angel faction may choose to double kill. If they do, they may send in two night kill targets for that night. If none if the living Weeping Angels is looked at even by a single town player that night, both kills will be successful. If any of the Weeping Angels is looked at, both kills will fail.

PMs:

Welcome to Blink Mafia, [player name]!

You are a Townie! You win when all Weeping Angels have been eliminated.

Every night, you may send in an order parsed Look at: [player name]. If you do, and another player does, the player you're looking at will be stoped from performing the night kill that night.

Please confirm by responding to this PM.

Welcome to Blink Mafia, [player name]!

You are a Weeping Angel and by your special new technology, you have taken human form. You win when the Weeping Angels control the majority of town, or nothing can stop this from happening.

During the night and during confirmation stage, you may talk to your partner here: [QT link]

Please confirm by responding in your QT.

[Hydrad]

looks weird.

/in

[pacovf]

Do the weeping angels get to do a normal nightkill if they want to?

[Teproc]

*grumble grumble* When are doing Midnight mafia ?*grumble grumble*

Looks sweet, but I'm not sure I can /in yet.

/tag

[chairs]

Do the weeping angels get to do a normal nightkill if they want to?

It looks like they do - normal nightkill needs the 2-town-looking to be stopped, double nightkill just needs 1 town looking at 1 angel to be stopped.  Double kill is high-risk, high-reward play.

[chairs]

/in btw.

Game hasn't started and I already have a way to stop the double kill, at the cost of not being able to prevent the night kill.

[EgorK]

/in

[Joseph2302]

/in and +1 for the flavour.

[scott_pilgrim]

/tag

This looks like a really cool set-up.

[ashersky]

Neat setup.  I think TwistedArcher would love this.

Just /tag for now, I'm going to focus on modding Dune 2 and designing Mistborn for now.

[Twistedarcher]

/in Ash is correct!!

[XerxesPraelor]

/in

[Twistedarcher]

out, not sure if i will have the time

[faust]

Bump!

Is it really not possible to fill a 9 player game at the moment?

[Witherweaver]

I'll /in.

[Awaclus]

/in

[Joseph2302]

Can I be town this game, please?

[Rubby]

/in

Hope it's OK that I'm a newbie.

[silverspawn]

well, littleB seems to have given up on stalking me for now, so /in

[pacovf]

Can I be town this game, please?

No. And of course now everybody knows that you are scum.

Now reflect on what you've done and make sure it doesn't happen again.

[faust]

/in

Hope it's OK that I'm a newbie.

Hi! No problem, the setup should be perfect for newbies. Just make sure you don't send PMs with the names of your scum partners to everyone.

[Witherweaver]

/in

Hope it's OK that I'm a newbie.

Hi! No problem, the setup should be perfect for newbies. Just make sure you don't send PMs with the names of your scum partners to everyone.

+1

[Archetype]

/in

Hope it's OK that I'm a newbie.

Hi! No problem, the setup should be perfect for newbies. Just make sure you don't send PMs with the names of your scum partners to everyone.

+1

[faust]

We're full! Since I'm a bit busy right now, I'd like to start Day 1 next Monday. PMs would go out before the weekend. Is everyone okay with that?

[XerxesPraelor]

Great!

[silverspawn]

I am everyone, and I am okay with it.

[Joseph2302]

I am everyone

Yes because we are all WanderingWinder, therefore we are all everyone.

Also, I'm fine with whenever.

[A Drowned Kernel]

/tag

[Rubby]

/in

Hope it's OK that I'm a newbie.

Hi! No problem, the setup should be perfect for newbies. Just make sure you don't send PMs with the names of your scum partners to everyone.

I definitely will not pull a reinoe.

And yes, any time is fine with me.

[2.71828.....]

/tag

[chairs]

/in

Hope it's OK that I'm a newbie.

Hi! No problem, the setup should be perfect for newbies. Just make sure you don't send PMs with the names of your scum partners to everyone.

I definitely will not pull a reinoe.

And yes, any time is fine with me.

+1

[faust]

PMs are out! Please confirm your roles. Game start will be Monday before noon forum time.

Thread locked except for taggers!

[faust]

As silverspawn stepped out of his house that day, he couldn't possibly expect what was to come. He merely went out to get some food, when suddenly he heard a sort of whooshing, groaning sound, and for a moment, he started wondering if maybe he had played too much Dominion Online and started to go mad: Directly before his eyes, a blue box appeared out of nothing.

Was it real? He needed to find out, and so he approached the box, and tipped the door in front of him, which flung open in an instant. He entered the room behind the door – it was huge, much bigger than the box looked from the outside. Silverspawn felt an urge to run out of the box and walk around it, but the door slammed shut behind him.

He room he was in seemed to be some kind of control center. Everything seemed very futuristic, except for the nine angel statues made of stone that were placed around the circular room. Eight other people were already here, looking at him. Before any of them could utter a word, a hologram appeared in the middle of the room.

"This should be everyone, then?" The voice seemed not to come from speakers, but instead directly from the holgram itself. They were looking at a man in a sack coat, wearing a pair of braces and a bow tie. His head was topped by a red fez.

"I am very sorry to say I have run into some troubles, and I need your help to – well – to save the universe. I'm the Doctor, by the way.

"We do not have much time. Some very dangerous creatures have entered my ship. They are called 'Weeping Angels'. If you see some angel statues around here – that would be them. The Angels feed off potential time energy. This is... some wibbly-wobbly stuff, all you need to know is that if they touch you, they will send you back in time.

"The Angels cannot move when you look at them. So if you want no trouble, keep your eyes fixed on them. They are fast though, faster than you can believe. Blink, and you're dead. So you better don't.

"This ship - the TARDIS – is a time machine, see? It can create enough potential energy to keep the Angles going forever. Give them the TARDIS, and we Angels will overrun the universe. The caused paradoxes when every living being is sent back in time could easily rip apart the fabric of space and time.

"Now to you. I've managed to freeze seven of the nine Angels in this room. Unforunately, the Angels have manipulated the controls of the TARDIS, never allowing more living beings on board than there are Angels... luckily, the TARDIS does not recognize the frozen Angels as living beings. You can be here as long as they are.

"Two among them are still alive though. And they somehow managed to get past their quantum lock and can take human form – the form of their victims. Think about how long you have been in this room, and how long the others have. Some of you may already have been replaced by Angels.

"Here's what I need you to do. The TARDIS teleport device still has some charges. Beam the Angels out of the TARDIS. You need to get all the Angels into this room and hope you pick the right ones. The TARDIS does not have much energy left – you have to teleport one at a time, and there have to be short breaks between the teleports to recharge. I fear I won't be able to make it on my own, so I'm programming the TARDIS to collect qualified humans once I'm gone.

"In the meantime, keep an eye on the statues! You don't want to be lost in the past. Good luck!"

The hologram appeared. "I don't under...", started Hydrad. Then there was a bump, and the lights went out for a split second. When they turned on again, nothing seemed to have changed. Or was that one statue just a little farther left than before?

Day 1 has begun! Thread unlocked!

Vote Count 1.0

Not Voting (9): Hydrad, chairs, EgorK, Joseph2302, Witherweaver, XerxesPraelor, Awaclus, Rubby, silverspawn

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends March 9 at 7 am forum time.

[Hydrad]

Wooo!

uh..... Vote: WW!

[faust]

Rule 1.2 has been changed. Please reread it.

[silverspawn]

if maybe he had played too much Dominion Online

unlikely

okay, so I've been thinking about this setup a little when I signed up, and unfortunately, I don't think there is a way to break it. The first idea I had was to assign players publicly to look at people in order to create IC's, but that has several problems

1) even if someone is successfully roleblocked, he might still be scum, and his partner performed the kill.
2) if we assign groups of 2 (3), it doesn't guarantee that the target is roleblocked if there is 1 (2) scum in the group
3) if everyone's night actions are public, it gives scum the opportunity to double kill freely.

Therefore, as long as both scum are still alive, I think we shouldn't make any night actions public, but instead let everyone decide on its own. In later days, we can figure something out with massclaims. I don't think we need to worry about the double kill if we do that, it seems crazy risky. To me, the double kill thing looks like a mechanic meant to specifically counter such a plan.

If one scum dies early though, then it might be worth to reconsider.

thoughts?

[Awaclus]

Vote: silverspawn because he was scum in Futuramafia.

[XerxesPraelor]

Good flavor explanation. Most of the time it's just "You're stuck in a room, find the bad guys"

[XerxesPraelor]

Antivote: silverspawn for doing something

[Hydrad]

I like the idea of everyone deciding who to target each night.

One thing I'm wondering though is if after each night we massclaim who targetted who.

The first night it probably won't do much. But if we get to the last few days there is a chance that gathering all that knowledge might be able to narrow down the pool of who is scum?

[Rubby]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

[Hydrad]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

Hurrah. Hopefully there will be many more to come!

Now important questions. Are you scum?

[Witherweaver]

Wooo!

uh..... Vote: WW!

*stares at Hydrad*

[Witherweaver]

if maybe he had played too much Dominion Online

unlikely

okay, so I've been thinking about this setup a little when I signed up, and unfortunately, I don't think there is a way to break it. The first idea I had was to assign players publicly to look at people in order to create IC's, but that has several problems

1) even if someone is successfully roleblocked, he might still be scum, and his partner performed the kill.
2) if we assign groups of 2 (3), it doesn't guarantee that the target is roleblocked if there is 1 (2) scum in the group
3) if everyone's night actions are public, it gives scum the opportunity to double kill freely.

Therefore, as long as both scum are still alive, I think we shouldn't make any night actions public, but instead let everyone decide on its own. In later days, we can figure something out with massclaims. I don't think we need to worry about the double kill if we do that, it seems crazy risky. To me, the double kill thing looks like a mechanic meant to specifically counter such a plan.

If one scum dies early though, then it might be worth to reconsider.

thoughts?

Funny, I remember you talking about how breaking setups was against the spirit of the game and shouldn't be attempted.

[Joseph2302]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

Welcome. Vote: Rubby.

[Rubby]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

Hurrah. Hopefully there will be many more to come!

Now important questions. Are you scum?

Nope, townie and glad to be so for my first game.

[Rubby]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

Welcome. Vote: Rubby.

Gaah! I claim doctor! Or maybe jester. How do you play this game?

[silverspawn]

Funny, I remember you talking about how breaking setups was against the spirit of the game and shouldn't be attempted.

and all truth lost inside
our subjective minds

[Joseph2302]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

Hurrah. Hopefully there will be many more to come!

Now important questions. Are you scum?

Nope, townie and glad to be so for my first game.

That's good, I'm town too.

[silverspawn]

I never said breaking a setup is against the spirit of the game. What you're probably referring to is how I said utilizing a mod mistake that was not part of the setup, like in holiday mafia, is against the spirit of the game. Obviously you can make the argument that a flawed setup is also a mod mistake, but I still see an essential difference there.

So, no, I'm perfectly fine with breaking this setup, if you know how. In fact, I think it would be awesome.

[silverspawn]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

Welcome. Vote: Rubby.

Gaah! I claim doctor! Or maybe jester. How do you play this game?

The first thing you should do is read the setup. There are no doctors, or jesters, or any conventional PR's in this game. There are just townies and weeping angels, and all townies have the same power, which is looking at someone during the night, as explained in the OP

oh, and welcome to mafia!

[Witherweaver]

I never said breaking a setup is against the spirit of the game. What you're probably referring to is how I said utilizing a mod mistake that was not part of the setup, like in holiday mafia, is against the spirit of the game. Obviously you can make the argument that a flawed setup is also a mod mistake, but I still see an essential difference there.

So, no, I'm perfectly fine with breaking this setup, if you know how. In fact, I think it would be awesome.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking of.  I guess I kind of consider it to be the same thing, or close enough, so I found your added sentiment ("unfortunately") to be odd.

[silverspawn]

Nope, townie and glad to be so for my first game.

why is that?

[Awaclus]

The first thing you should do is read the setup.

That's what scum does!

There are no doctors, or jesters, or any conventional PR's in this game. There are just townies and weeping angels, and all townies have the same power, which is looking at someone during the night, as explained in the OP

Therefore, silverspawn is scum!

[Witherweaver]

I need to find the perfect "Didn't read lol" gif for every Mafia game setup.

[Witherweaver]

if maybe he had played too much Dominion Online

unlikely

okay, so I've been thinking about this setup a little when I signed up, and unfortunately, I don't think there is a way to break it. The first idea I had was to assign players publicly to look at people in order to create IC's, but that has several problems

1) even if someone is successfully roleblocked, he might still be scum, and his partner performed the kill.
2) if we assign groups of 2 (3), it doesn't guarantee that the target is roleblocked if there is 1 (2) scum in the group
3) if everyone's night actions are public, it gives scum the opportunity to double kill freely.

Therefore, as long as both scum are still alive, I think we shouldn't make any night actions public, but instead let everyone decide on its own. In later days, we can figure something out with massclaims. I don't think we need to worry about the double kill if we do that, it seems crazy risky. To me, the double kill thing looks like a mechanic meant to specifically counter such a plan.

If one scum dies early though, then it might be worth to reconsider.

thoughts?

What about pairing off?  Isn't scum guaranteed to miss their nightkill unless they get selected together?

[Rubby]

Hello. This is my first mafia game post.

Welcome. Vote: Rubby.

Gaah! I claim doctor! Or maybe jester. How do you play this game?

The first thing you should do is read the setup. There are no doctors, or jesters, or any conventional PR's in this game. There are just townies and weeping angels, and all townies have the same power, which is looking at someone during the night, as explained in the OP

oh, and welcome to mafia!

Thanks. I do understand the setup; I was attempting to be hilarious.

[Witherweaver]

Well, I'm sure Faust thought about that.. but, if we ever lynch scum, they can never kill?    So we lynch today, down to 8.  Four groups of two.  If there is two kills, we know one of the group contains both scum, and we'll have six left.  So that's like 1/3 chance of finding scum.  Say groups A,B,C. Lynch again, say from group A,either town or scum.

If town: Scum is in B or C.  SWITCH pairs between those two groups to guarantee no night kill, right?  last member of A just chill.

If scum, everyone just look at other member of A, kill the next day.

What if there is no kill?  Then maybe we just scumhunt as normal?  Not sure what to do when there is an odd number of people. 

[silverspawn]

What about pairing off?  Isn't scum guaranteed to miss their nightkill unless they get selected together?

uhm... not sure I get what you mean. Do you mean creating groups of 2 and have them target each other? that doesn't do much, because you need to be locked at by 2 people to be roleblocked.

[Witherweaver]

Well, I'm sure Faust thought about that.. but, if we ever lynch scum, they can never kill?    So we lynch today, down to 8.  Four groups of two.  If there is two kills, we know one of the group contains both scum, and we'll have six left.  So that's like 1/3 chance of finding scum.  Say groups A,B,C. Lynch again, say from group A,either town or scum.

If town: Scum is in B or C.  SWITCH pairs between those two groups to guarantee no night kill, right?  last member of A just chill.

If scum, everyone just look at other member of A, kill the next day.

What if there is no kill?  Then maybe we just scumhunt as normal?  Not sure what to do when there is an odd number of people.

That sounds weird.  What I meant, was, if we ever lynch one scum, then we can prevent night kills by doing a cyclic look (p1->p2 -> ... pn ->p1) or pairing off if there is an even number.

[Witherweaver]

What about pairing off?  Isn't scum guaranteed to miss their nightkill unless they get selected together?

uhm... not sure I get what you mean. Do you mean creating groups of 2 and have them target each other? that doesn't do much, because you need to be locked at by 2 people to be roleblocked.

Okay, well, nevermind then.

[Rubby]

I agree with SS about the coordinated night action idea - there doesn't seem to be a viable strategy that's likely to benefit us more than it benefits scum.

Regarding this,

One thing I'm wondering though is if after each night we massclaim who targetted who.

I'm not sure how much a "massclaim after each night" system helps us. I tend to think that just like with roleclaims in more standard setups, claims are something to be considered/discussed as circumstances warrant. Although the difference here is that it's information we wouldn't otherwise get if the person gets nightkilled. Maybe people who are (or think they are) about to be killed should announce their past targets.

[Witherweaver]

I agree with SS about the coordinated night action idea - there doesn't seem to be a viable strategy that's likely to benefit us more than it benefits scum.

Regarding this,

One thing I'm wondering though is if after each night we massclaim who targetted who.

I'm not sure how much a "massclaim after each night" system helps us. I tend to think that just like with roleclaims in more standard setups, claims are something to be considered/discussed as circumstances warrant. Although the difference here is that it's information we wouldn't otherwise get if the person gets nightkilled. Maybe people who are (or think they are) about to be killed should announce their past targets.

Wait I don't get this.  We all have the same role, so this isn't like a massclaim at all.  It makes sense to me to announce who we targeted the previous night.  But we have to realize scum will lie.

[Rubby]

I agree with SS about the coordinated night action idea - there doesn't seem to be a viable strategy that's likely to benefit us more than it benefits scum.

Regarding this,

One thing I'm wondering though is if after each night we massclaim who targetted who.

I'm not sure how much a "massclaim after each night" system helps us. I tend to think that just like with roleclaims in more standard setups, claims are something to be considered/discussed as circumstances warrant. Although the difference here is that it's information we wouldn't otherwise get if the person gets nightkilled. Maybe people who are (or think they are) about to be killed should announce their past targets.

Wait I don't get this.  We all have the same role, so this isn't like a massclaim at all.  It makes sense to me to announce who we targeted the previous night.  But we have to realize scum will lie.

Yes, we all have the same role, but my point was that previous-target claiming is in some ways like PR claiming. I did note the key difference, but it's still giving information to scum as much as to us - arguably it's giving more information to scum, because they know who's lying and who's not. I don't dispute that there's a place for previous-target claiming - and we can probably be more liberal with it than we would with PR claiming in a standard setup - but we should maybe consider making it a strategic/tactical thing rather than an automatic mass thing.

[silverspawn]

So, let's break this down logically. Let's say I'm scum, and everyone claims whom he has targeted. Does this help me in any way?

... I don't see how. Unless someone can explain me how it does, I'd actually say let us claim every day. Of course the order is problematic, because scum wants to claim as late as possible. Maybe we should come up with a way to determine an order efficiently.

[Rubby]

Nope, townie and glad to be so for my first game.

why is that?

Just more straightforward and relaxed this way. I'm sure once I have some experience I'll be interested in playing the other side.

[Awaclus]

Yes, we all have the same role, but my point was that previous-target claiming is in some ways like PR claiming. I did note the key difference, but it's still giving information to scum as much as to us - arguably it's giving more information to scum, because they know who's lying and who's not. I don't dispute that there's a place for previous-target claiming - and we can probably be more liberal with it than we would with PR claiming in a standard setup - but we should maybe consider making it a strategic/tactical thing rather than an automatic mass thing.

There's the difference that PR claiming gives scum information that scum actually needs.

[Rubby]

So, let's break this down logically. Let's say I'm scum, and everyone claims whom he has targeted. Does this help me in any way?

... I don't see how. Unless someone can explain me how it does, I'd actually say let us claim every day.

Well, the good may well outweigh the bad, but yes, I can construct a scenario where massclaiming helps scum!you:
A double kill occurs. Everyone targetted Rubby. With the massclaim, silverspawn and his partner now know that Rubby is an IC. Without the massclaim, Rubby would still be an IC to every townie, but scum wouldn't know it.

Anyway, I'm open to the possibility that claiming each day turns out to be for the best. It just seems more natural to make that determination each day based on the circumstances, rather than making a decision now for all future days.

[Witherweaver]

Hm.. not true.  Each townie only knows he looked at Rubby, not that two people looked at him.  So the massclaim is needed to make an IC.

[silverspawn]

Hm.. not true.  Each townie only knows he looked at Rubby, not that two people looked at him.  So the massclaim is needed to make an IC.

++

[Rubby]

From the setup:

At any time during the game, the Weeping Angel faction may choose to double kill. If they do, they may send in two night kill targets for that night. If none if the living Weeping Angels is looked at even by a single town player that night, both kills will be successful. If any of the Weeping Angels is looked at, both kills will fail.

[Rubby]

Only one "look at" is needed to prevent the double kill, right?

[silverspawn]

oh, you're right of course.

so, yeah ,that's a scenario where claiming benefits scum. But obviously it's marginal. I still think we should claim every day.

But we can discuss that tomorrow. Let's start scumhunting for now. vote: Awaclus

[Awaclus]

oh, you're right of course.

so, yeah ,that's a scenario where claiming benefits scum. But obviously it's marginal. I still think we should claim every day.

But we can discuss that tomorrow. Let's start scumhunting for now. vote: Awaclus

I haven't been scummy this game. Unlike a certain someone who was scum in Futuramafia.

[faust]

Vote Count 1.1

Witherweaver (1): Hydrad
silverspawn (1): Awaclus
Rubby (1): Joseph2302
Awaclus (1): silverspawn

Not Voting (5): chairs, EgorK, Witherweaver, XerxesPraelor, Rubby

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends March 9 at 7 am forum time.

[silverspawn]

oh, you're right of course.

so, yeah ,that's a scenario where claiming benefits scum. But obviously it's marginal. I still think we should claim every day.

But we can discuss that tomorrow. Let's start scumhunting for now. vote: Awaclus

I haven't been scummy this game. Unlike a certain someone who was scum in Futuramafia.

maybe not, but you're annoying.

and how have I been scummy this game?

[Awaclus]

oh, you're right of course.

so, yeah ,that's a scenario where claiming benefits scum. But obviously it's marginal. I still think we should claim every day.

But we can discuss that tomorrow. Let's start scumhunting for now. vote: Awaclus

I haven't been scummy this game. Unlike a certain someone who was scum in Futuramafia.

maybe not, but you're annoying.

and how have I been scummy this game?

Like I said, because of Futuramafia. 

In all seriousness though, I think you're suspiciously active and overly towny compared to how you have been in previous games. It's not a strong scum tell, but it's something.

[silverspawn]

oh, you're right of course.

so, yeah ,that's a scenario where claiming benefits scum. But obviously it's marginal. I still think we should claim every day.

But we can discuss that tomorrow. Let's start scumhunting for now. vote: Awaclus

I haven't been scummy this game. Unlike a certain someone who was scum in Futuramafia.

maybe not, but you're annoying.

and how have I been scummy this game?

Like I said, because of Futuramafia. 

In all seriousness though, I think you're suspiciously active and overly towny compared to how you have been in previous games. It's not a strong scum tell, but it's something.

yeah, because I had my exams & applications about a week ago, and now they're finished, so life is better now and I'm not depressed and have more time.

[chairs]

Personally, I say we vote: silverspawn for stealing faust's role as planmaker.

[Witherweaver]

Only one "look at" is needed to prevent the double kill, right?

Oh, I see.. if there is a double kill, yes, you know the person you looked at is town.   If there is a single kill, then no.

But, uh.. I think it's better to share that information with everyone. 

[Hydrad]

If a double kill happens I think we want to claim even more.

There will be 2 situations.

Scum don't fake target each other.

We just lynch people that havn't been targetted and find scum Hurrah!

1 scum lies and targets his partner and other targets random towny.

Lynch people still out of pool find the scum realize he could of lied about his parter and can lynch him too! Hurrah.

oh and third situation. Scum say they target each other.

Lynch people that target each other! Hurrah.



If a double kill happens I think we will be in good shape.

[Rubby]

Yeah, I'm actually not sure I see why scum would ever go for a double kill. It's easy for it to get blocked, and even if it goes through it creates an IC for every townie.

[silverspawn]

I think double kill gets much more useful if only one scum is alive

[Hydrad]

I think double kill gets much more useful if only one scum is alive

I didn't even think if that would work. Thats really scary!

[Rubby]

I didn't even think if that would work. Thats really scary!

Well, it would still only take one person targeting him to stop it. And it would still create IC's for remaining townies if it succeeded.

[chairs]

You could prevent the double kill by doing a circle, but it guarantees you don't roleblock anyone.

That is to say, player 1 on player list targets 2, 2 targets 3, 3 targets 4, etc, wrapping around.

[EgorK]

You could prevent the double kill by doing a circle, but it guarantees you don't roleblock anyone.

That is to say, player 1 on player list targets 2, 2 targets 3, 3 targets 4, etc, wrapping around.

But then you can allow players to deviate to their top scum read at will. Scum is still unlikely to risk double kill while roleblock may occur

[silverspawn]

yeah, I thought of that too, and it's unnecessary and not a good idea.

[Rubby]

We really want our targets to be clustered. As I see it (assuming scum doesn't try a double kill, which it doesn't seem like they should), any night in which no one is looked at more than once is a night in which we get zero value from our power. Even multi-targetting on a townie has way more potential value than guaranteed full single coverage.

[Witherweaver]

Well, hey, we can try:

Pair off into groups of two, A, B, C, D

A -> B -> C -> D -> A,

where arrow implies look at one of the people in the group (decide individually based on your own criteria).  Does that provide us any benefit? 

Eh, my instinct is that it's better to not have an organized plan.. the more scum knows about who will look where the better they can decide their night actions. 

[Rubby]

Yeah, coordinating doesn't seem good. But even if we all go full random, the odds are strongly in favor of some clustering occurring.

[Awaclus]

I think rather than full random, we should just target whoever is the scummiest.

[Joseph2302]

I think rather than full random, we should just target whoever is the scummiest.

I agree. All the co-ordinated plans could get screwed up by scum.

[Witherweaver]

I think no random; I prefer to use reads.  My plan is reads-based, but each player has a restriction.  In the case when {Town,Town}->{Scum, Town} -> {Scum, Town}->{Town, Town}, which would not be that uncommon, scum can guarantee their kill by having the second scum do the kill, since only one town could look at him.

So, yeah, probably bad.

[Witherweaver]

Could try extending it to groups of three, but then what do you do with the 1 and 2 mod 3 cases? 

[Rubby]

I think rather than full random, we should just target whoever is the scummiest.

Maybe - and I wasn't saying that full random is the optimal strategy - but the "scummiest read" strategy could get dangerously close to giving our actions away, depending on how forthright we are in sharing our reads (and we don't want to discourage sharing our reads, do we?). Maybe some kind of hybrid.

[Witherweaver]

I think rather than full random, we should just target whoever is the scummiest.

Maybe - and I wasn't saying that full random is the optimal strategy - but the "scummiest read" strategy could get dangerously close to giving our actions away, depending on how forthright we are in sharing our reads (and we don't want to discourage sharing our reads, do we?). Maybe some kind of hybrid.

I mean that's not so different than regular Mafia... normally there is some kind of Doctor, Cop, whatever, and their actions will be influenced by their reads, and those reads may or may not be public information, and people may be aware of how public they're making them.

[Rubby]

Maybe - and I wasn't saying that full random is the optimal strategy - but the "scummiest read" strategy could get dangerously close to giving our actions away, depending on how forthright we are in sharing our reads (and we don't want to discourage sharing our reads, do we?). Maybe some kind of hybrid.

I mean that's not so different than regular Mafia... normally there is some kind of Doctor, Cop, whatever, and their actions will be influenced by their reads, and those reads may or may not be public information, and people may be aware of how public they're making them.

That's true. Though I wonder if the fact that in this case every single one of us is sort of the PR should change the approach. I mean, maybe we just each make our own decision - no coordinating on the identity of our targets, no coordinating on the method of choosing our targets.

[Joseph2302]

Maybe - and I wasn't saying that full random is the optimal strategy - but the "scummiest read" strategy could get dangerously close to giving our actions away, depending on how forthright we are in sharing our reads (and we don't want to discourage sharing our reads, do we?). Maybe some kind of hybrid.

I mean that's not so different than regular Mafia... normally there is some kind of Doctor, Cop, whatever, and their actions will be influenced by their reads, and those reads may or may not be public information, and people may be aware of how public they're making them.

That's true. Though I wonder if the fact that in this case every single one of us is sort of the PR should change the approach. I mean, maybe we just each make our own decision - no coordinating on the identity of our targets, no coordinating on the method of choosing our targets.

I agree.

[chairs]

Okay, so our plan is not to have a plan, because scum could caboose it.

Back to RVS.

vote: joseph2302

[Joseph2302]

Okay, so our plan is not to have a plan, because scum could caboose it.

Back to RVS.

vote: joseph2302

Not a proper vote, there's not a capital J.

[Joseph2302]

Vote: Everyone who's scum.

[Rubby]

Vote: silverspawn for quitting Dominion. Such a waste of talent! I was just watching Qvist's video of his League season 3 match against you. He built an uncontested Ironworks-Gardens deck that seemed totally unbeatable, and you exploded out of nowhere with an Throne Room - Menagerie engine (with no trashing!) for the win.

On the other hand, man, why did Qvist not take the last Gardens on his last turn? That cost him the game! Vote: Qvist

[Witherweaver]

Vote: Rubby just cause.

[Joseph2302]

Vote: WW.

[EgorK]

So, Joseph is not conceding that he is scum this game. This is totally outside his meta, hence Vote: Joseph

[Awaclus]

Back to RVS.

My vote is serious.

[Hydrad]

Vote: Egork

for trying to use logic.

[Hydrad]

Back to RVS.

My vote is serious.

interesting. Just because of futurama?

[Awaclus]

Back to RVS.

My vote is serious.

interesting. Just because of futurama?

Originally it was a joke vote, but like I explained here,

In all seriousness though, I think you're suspiciously active and overly towny compared to how you have been in previous games. It's not a strong scum tell, but it's something.

which is why it is now a serious vote, i.e. if we had to lynch someone right now, I would have a slight preference towards silverspawn over other people.

[Joseph2302]

So, Joseph is not conceding that he is scum this game. This is totally outside his meta, hence Vote: Joseph

People didn't like me claiming scum. Vote: EgorK for trying to restart stupid scum-claim thing.

[faust]

Vote Count 1.2

silverspawn (2): Awaclus, Rubby
Rubby (1): Witherweaver
Awaclus (1): silverspawn
Joseph2302 (2): chairs, EgorK
EgorK (2): Hydrad, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): XerxesPraelor

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends March 9 at 7 am forum time.

[XerxesPraelor]

vote: EgorK

If you've been lynched often, it makes sense to change your meta no matter your alignment.

[Witherweaver]

So, Joseph is not conceding that he is scum this game. This is totally outside his meta, hence Vote: Joseph

Muwahaha

[Witherweaver]

Silverspawn is usually active, though.  I'm not quite getting the argument. 

[Awaclus]

Silverspawn is usually active, though.  I'm not quite getting the argument.

But not this towny.

[EgorK]

vote: EgorK

If you've been lynched often, it makes sense to change your meta no matter your alignment.

That would be sufficient answer if coming from Joseph.

[Awaclus]

vote: EgorK

If you've been lynched often, it makes sense to change your meta no matter your alignment.

That would be sufficient answer if coming from Joseph.

I don't see why an answer should have to be sufficient at this point. Vote: EgorK (I think this is L-1)

[chairs]

aaand must resist urge to quickhammer.

With no PR to claim, I'm not really sure what our L-1 policy ought to be.  Maybe provide (at minimum) a reads list?

I feel like we're still too early in the Day to have many reads, but that's D1 anyway...

[Witherweaver]

Why do we want to hammer EgorK?

[chairs]

[Witherweaver]

Because we have almost no information so far.

Why not just flip a coin at the beginning of the game?

[chairs]

Because we have almost no information so far.

Why not just flip a coin at the beginning of the game?

aaand must resist urge to quickhammer.

With no PR to claim, I'm not really sure what our L-1 policy ought to be.  Maybe provide (at minimum) a reads list?

I feel like we're still too early in the Day to have many reads, but that's D1 anyway...

Conveniently, I did actually address this, after my quickhammer statement.  Emphasis in quote.

[Witherweaver]

So, like, you agree with me?

But also, why EgorK in particular, other than that he's the person that's at L-1.

[Joseph2302]

Unvote. Not sure about quickhammer, want more thinking time.

[Hydrad]

Whoa I started action! see how townie that was?

but ya that raises a good point. In this game if someone gets to L-1 (outside of RVSish stage) its going to be really hard to push it somewhere else as usually a claim or something is how we switch. I'm interested in how this game will work for the voting.

[Awaclus]

Unvote. Not sure about quickhammer, want more thinking time.

vote: Joseph

[silverspawn]

someone should act scummy please, otherwise I have no-one to vote for

[chairs]

So, like, you agree with me?

But also, why EgorK in particular, other than that he's the person that's at L-1.

Sorry, I don't mean to be vague.  I agree that it's too early in the Day to be lynching anybody.  I was cracking a joke about quickhammering Egork in part because quickhammers are generally scummy (and I was waiting to see if anybody called me out for suggesting it) and because he's the poor sap at L-1.

It also gave a good opportunity to discuss things we might consider for L-1 time - do we want people who are at L-1 to claim who they've stared at, for example?

[Witherweaver]

I still don't buy the downside in not claiming who we stared of right away during each day.  Maybe we can choose an order and make the scummiest-seeming people claim first, or something, or have a mostly consensus townread decide, or something, but that leads to arguing and waiting. 

[Hydrad]

I still don't buy the downside in not claiming who we stared of right away during each day.  Maybe we can choose an order and make the scummiest-seeming people claim first, or something, or have a mostly consensus townread decide, or something, but that leads to arguing and waiting.

I'm with you.

We could do something like day1 we go in order of who signed up first.

day 2 we do opposite order?

Something like that?

[Hydrad]

or even do a roll like this

'9' is not a valid dice string!

[Hydrad]

Hmm well I forget how to roll here... but then whatever number that is we use the signup list and start from there?

That is as long as we don't have a super townie person yet.

[Awaclus]

I still don't buy the downside in not claiming who we stared of right away during each day.  Maybe we can choose an order and make the scummiest-seeming people claim first, or something, or have a mostly consensus townread decide, or something, but that leads to arguing and waiting.

I'm with you.

We could do something like day1 we go in order of who signed up first.

day 2 we do opposite order?

Something like that?

Regards, guy who wants to claim last day 2.

[silverspawn]

how about we vote for the towniest person and that person compiles the list? and if it's a tie, I decide who does it.

[Witherweaver]

I still don't buy the downside in not claiming who we stared of right away during each day.  Maybe we can choose an order and make the scummiest-seeming people claim first, or something, or have a mostly consensus townread decide, or something, but that leads to arguing and waiting.

I'm with you.

We could do something like day1 we go in order of who signed up first.

day 2 we do opposite order?

Something like that?

Regards, guy who wants to claim last day 2.

Haha, pwned.

[Hydrad]

I still don't buy the downside in not claiming who we stared of right away during each day.  Maybe we can choose an order and make the scummiest-seeming people claim first, or something, or have a mostly consensus townread decide, or something, but that leads to arguing and waiting.

I'm with you.

We could do something like day1 we go in order of who signed up first.

day 2 we do opposite order?

Something like that?

Regards, guy who wants to claim last day 2.

I have to claim first for day 1 though!

I didn't actually even check where I was on the list actually. I knew I would be near the beginning but didn't remember I was first.

[Witherweaver]

I mean, how about we don't start claiming until Day 2.

Or I can claim first Day 1: I didn't look at anyone~

[Joseph2302]

I mean, how about we don't start claiming until Day 2.

Or I can claim first Day 1: I didn't look at anyone~

Me neither.

[Rubby]

If not for the "no cryptography" rule, we could totally use something like this

http://www.xorbin.com/tools/sha256-hash-calculator

to effectively get everyone's claim simultaneously. That would be cool.

[XerxesPraelor]

And that's why it is against the rules.

[chairs]

I mean, I'm a blind monk.

[Hydrad]

I mean, I'm a blind monk.

I feel like I'm missing something. Why has lee sin invaded us.

[chairs]

(I didn't look at anyone).

[Hydrad]

(I didn't look at anyone).

ahha... I'm so smart.

[faust]

Vote Count 1.3

silverspawn (1): Rubby
Rubby (1): Witherweaver
Awaclus (1): silverspawn
Joseph2302 (3): chairs, EgorK, Awaclus
EgorK (2): Hydrad, XerxesPraelor

Not Voting (1): Joseph2302

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends March 9 at 7 am forum time.

[Hydrad]

soooo whats up?

[Rubby]

soooo whats up?

Not much, man. How you doin'?

[Hydrad]

soooo whats up?

Not much, man. How you doin'?

Pretty good!

who do you think is scum?

[Joseph2302]

soooo whats up?

Not much, man. How you doin'?

Pretty good!

who do you think is scum?

You.

[silverspawn]

soooo whats up?

Not much, man. How you doin'?

Pretty good!

who do you think is scum?

You.

yay, vote: Hydrad

[chairs]

<b>scumslip: bold</b>

 

vote: hydrad I'll sheep that!

[Hydrad]

oh so this is how you repay my friendship?

[Rubby]

These guys don't speak for me; I was enjoying our friendly exchange, and I think there is only about a 25% chance that you are scum.
Vote: Joseph2302

[Joseph2302]

Vote: Hydrubby. Clear scum team.

[faust]

Vote Count 1.4

Rubby (1): Witherweaver
Joseph2302 (3): EgorK, Awaclus, Rubby
EgorK (2): Hydrad, XerxesPraelor
Hydrad (2): silverspawn, chairs

Not Voting (1): Joseph2302

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends March 9 at 7 am forum time.

[chairs]

vote: Joseph L-1 Hydrubby isn't even IN this game, man, he only plays Dominion!

[silverspawn]

ohh that L-1 Josephythingy... like old times

[Joseph2302]

oh good, L-1.

[chairs]

realtalk though I don't want to get into that again, at least not D1.  I'm giving Joseph a D1 pass.

vote: rubby

[silverspawn]

realtalk though I don't want to get into that again, at least not D1.  I'm giving Joseph a D1 pass.

vote: rubby

"I don't want to lynch my partner this early"

[chairs]

realtalk though I don't want to get into that again, at least not D1.  I'm giving Joseph a D1 pass.

vote: rubby

"I don't want to lynch my partner this early"

Yes, because I would clearly purposefully line my partner up to L-1 during RVS, then unvote afterwards, particularly one that I personally feel is a prime lynch target regardless and whom I have a history of pushing lynches on.

[Joseph2302]

I'm scum.

[Joseph2302]

Is what everyone assumes. They're wrong.

[Witherweaver]

...

[silverspawn]

...

[chairs]

...

[Joseph2302]

...

[Hydrad]

C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER

[EgorK]

I'm scum.

Not again. Why do you do this each game?

[Awaclus]

I'm scum.

Not again. Why do you do this each game?

Because he's scum each game.

[Joseph2302]

I'm scum.

Not again. Why do you do this each game?

I didn't. Read the next post, which says everyone is wrong for thinking I'm scum.

[silverspawn]

I'm scum.

Not again. Why do you do this each game?

I didn't. Read the next post, which says everyone is wrong for thinking I'm scum.

are they though?

[Joseph2302]

I'm scum.

Not again. Why do you do this each game?

I didn't. Read the next post, which says everyone is wrong for thinking I'm scum.

Yes. Like all the other times (except the ones where I was scum).

are they though?

[Joseph2302]

I'm scum.

Not again. Why do you do this each game?

I didn't. Read the next post, which says everyone is wrong for thinking I'm scum.

are they though?

Yes. Like all the other times (except the ones where I was scum).

[silverspawn]

which was pretty often

[Awaclus]

which was pretty often

More often than not.

[XerxesPraelor]

This is really not taking off.

vote: rubby

[Joseph2302]

This is really not taking off.

Need a better engine for your aeroplane then.

[Hydrad]

Vote: XP

Just like the good old days. I miss how I used to find you scummy everygame.

[Hydrad]

Hmmm just thinking about it what is our "role"? we arn't VT's. But we don't really have a role name. What do I call myself?

[Joseph2302]

Hmmm just thinking about it what is our "role"? we arn't VT's. But we don't really have a role name. What do I call myself?

Scum?

[Hydrad]

Hmmm just thinking about it what is our "role"? we arn't VT's. But we don't really have a role name. What do I call myself?

Scum?

Hmm that would be confusing. Then we would have to scums. Me as the town scum and then the scum scum team.

Lets find a different name.

[XerxesPraelor]

Serial Killer?

[chairs]

Art Appreciation Society Member?

[Rubby]

Lookers?
Lookies?
The Lookingtons?
Mike Lookinland?

[faust]

Vote Count 1.5

Rubby (3): Witherweaver, chairs, XerxesPraelor
Joseph2302 (3): EgorK, Awaclus, Rubby
Hydrad (1): silverspawn
XerxesPraelor (1): Hydrad

Not Voting (1): Joseph2302

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends March 9 at 7 am forum time. That's in 42 hours.

[Hydrad]

I'm tempted to just hammer someone if I get the chance to keep this game movin.

[Joseph2302]

I'm tempted to just hammer someone if I get the chance to keep this game movin.

Vote: Hydrad. Like this lynch?

[Awaclus]

This game is a mess.

[Hydrad]

I'm tempted to just hammer someone if I get the chance to keep this game movin.

Vote: Hydrad. Like this lynch?

Better than nothing!

[XerxesPraelor]

vote: awalcus for noticing the problem but not doing anything about it.

I'm busy having fun in other places that it's hard for me to concentrate here.

[Awaclus]

vote: awalcus for noticing the problem but not doing anything about it.

What can I do about it other than point it out? I don't think I've been largely contributing towards it, as the problem is that we're still pretty much in RVS even though it's this late, and my own votes have been serious for ages.

[XerxesPraelor]

unvote

Do you think we should just quicklynch?

[Rubby]

How do we get out of RVS?
I won't be awake at the deadline time, by the way.

[silverspawn]

dunno. vote: chairs?

[Rubby]

So, my vote is on Joseph because reading through his posts I see the most noticeable combination of scumminess (or at least non-townishness) and lack of substance. Obviously it's very little to go on - there hasn't been a large amount of substance from any of us - but that's what I've got.

[Joseph2302]

Wow, 36 hours til deadline. That's gone fast.
PPE: 1

[Joseph2302]

So, my vote is on Joseph because reading through his posts I see the most noticeable combination of scumminess (or at least non-townishness) and lack of substance. Obviously it's very little to go on - there hasn't been a large amount of substance from any of us - but that's what I've got.

I've got nothing to mention, nothing has happened.

[silverspawn]

well, my only read so far is a town read on rubby because I get a genuine vibe

[Joseph2302]

well, my only read so far is a town read on rubby because I get a genuine vibe

Kind of agree. But I don't like lynching newbies D1.

[Awaclus]

well, my only read so far is a town read on rubby because I get a genuine vibe

Kind of agree. But I don't like lynching newbies D1.

Why would you lynch a newbie anyway just because Rubby happens to be towny?

[Joseph2302]

well, my only read so far is a town read on rubby because I get a genuine vibe

Kind of agree. But I don't like lynching newbies D1.

Why would you lynch a newbie anyway just because Rubby happens to be towny?

Definitely misread silverspawn's post. I have a small scum vibe on Rubby, probably nothing though.

[Witherweaver]

Rubby sounds somewhat townie to me.

I like Vote: XP. That Awaclus thing was a bit weak.

[silverspawn]

Rubby sounds somewhat townie to me.

I like Vote: XP. That Awaclus thing was a bit weak.

that's actually true. vote: XP

[Joseph2302]

Rubby sounds somewhat townie to me.

I like Vote: XP. That Awaclus thing was a bit weak.

I also agree it's weak. Awaclus actually wanted something to happen. Not convinced enough for L-1 though.

[Rubby]

I could definitely be open to hopping on the XP wagon. The Awaclus thing wasn't the scummiest thing ever, but his body of work in this game has been on the weak side.

[Hydrad]

Yes things are happening!

[silverspawn]

One more thing about the setup.

If we hit scum today - whoever it will be - this is how I think we should do our night Actions:

#1 + #2 -> #8
#3 + #4 -> #2
#5 + #6 -> #3
#7 + #8 -> #4

where as -> means "looks at", and #n is the n'th person in this list after you take out the one we lynch today (without changing the order):

Hydrad
chairs
EgorK
Joseph2302
Witherweaver
XerxesPraelor
Awaclus
Rubby
silverspawn

That is only if we hit scum today. If we hit town, everyone decides individually, as discussed previously.

I don't see any scenario in which this plan is not pro town. If scum is among the 4 targeted players, we enter day 2 without losses. If he's not, he can either double kill and remove 2 of the targeted players, allowing us to enter day 2 with 6 players and 2 ICs, or he can no-kill to trick us, in which case we still enter day 2 without losses.

Does anyone have any objections?

[silverspawn]

oh and with "hit scum today" i mean "lynch scum today".

[Rubby]

Interesting. I kind of like it, but I wonder how you came up with the targets. You're basically volunteering yourself, EgorK, and Joseph to be targeted, and Hydrad, XP and Awaclus not to be targeted. And Chairs to be probably targeted, and me to be probably not targeted.

[chairs]

it's a reasonable plan, i suppose.

vote: XP

[Rubby]

That's a fast L-1, especially considering there's been no time for responses/discussion on silverspawn's plan.

[Awaclus]

I don't have any objections to silverspawn's plan. I'm also fine with lynching XP, although I'd prefer Joseph.

[faust]

Vote Count 1.6

Joseph2302 (3): EgorK, Awaclus, Rubby
Hydrad (1): Joseph2302
XerxesPraelor (4): Hydrad, Witherweaver, silverspawn, chairs

Not Voting (1): XerxesPraelor

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends March 9 at 7 am forum time. That's in 26 hours.

[EgorK]

You want to lynch XP over one vote? Is there anything else scummy from him?

[silverspawn]

Interesting. I kind of like it, but I wonder how you came up with the targets. You're basically volunteering yourself, EgorK, and Joseph to be targeted, and Hydrad, XP and Awaclus not to be targeted. And Chairs to be probably targeted, and me to be probably not targeted.

just the first 3 players who signed up + me, to make it so the plan is not doing anything for scum!me

[XerxesPraelor]

Yeah, I'm not going to be much use here.

vote: XP

See if you can do better tomorrow.

[silverspawn]

... huh??

I was totally willing to switch to someone else. If you're town, you really didn't have to selfhammer.

[silverspawn]

well, this kinda sucks. not a very informative wagon

[Joseph2302]

Possible scum who's trying to deny us information? If not, hammer with 24ish hours to go seems weird.

[Joseph2302]

Also, ss plan seems okay I guess, if XP is scum.

[silverspawn]

yeah, but I'm pretty sure he's town. If you're scum, you have a partner who relies on you and so you feel more responsibility, and are more likely to fight harder.

[Joseph2302]

yeah, but I'm pretty sure he's town. If you're scum, you have a partner who relies on you and so you feel more responsibility, and are more likely to fight harder.

I agree. I might have hammered later today, but still think it was too early.

[faust]

THREAD LOCKED!

[faust]

Day 1 Final Vote Count

Joseph2302 (3): EgorK, Awaclus, Rubby
Hydrad (1): Joseph2302
XerxesPraelor (5): Hydrad, Witherweaver, silverspawn, chairs, XerxesPraelor

Not Voting (0)

With 9 alive, it took 5 to lynch.

[faust]

"What should we do now?", asked Rubby.

"I guess we zap a statue off the ship. How about the one behind XerxesPraelor?", suggested Hydrad.

"Hey that's a great idea!", said XerxesPraelor, grabbing for the button.

"Wait, shouldn't we..." As silverspawn started with his objection, it was already too late. The statue was transported off the TARDIS. Around XerxesPraelor, the interior of the TARDIS suddenly started vanishing. He found himself suddenly standing in the middle of the desert, no sign of civilization to see as far as the eye could see.

XerxesPraelor, the Townie has been lynched.

Night 1 begins now and lasts 24 hours. Day 2 will begin tomorrow at 10 am forum time. Please get your night action in until then.

[faust]

"It worked!", screamed Joseph. "He's gone!"

"Just concentrate on the statues", responded silverspawn. His felt his lids move. No, he mustn't...

When silverspawn opened his eyes again, the TARDIS was gone, and he stood in the middle of what appeared to be a Roman camp. Some guy in armor yelled as he saw him. "We have a Germanic spy!"

silverspawn stood there, wondering how it came to pass that he understood this ancient Latin so perfectly well, when something hit him on the back of his head, and he blacked out.

silverspawn, the Townie, has been killed.

THREAD UNLOCKED!

Vote Count 2.0

Not Voting (7): Hydrad, chairs, EgorK, Joseph2302, Witherweaver, Awaclus, Rubby

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 2 ends March 16 at 10 am forum time.

[Witherweaver]

Hm.. claim targets?

[Witherweaver]

Maybe we can coordinate claiming by reverse post count or something?  That would actually give some motivation to be more active.

[Witherweaver]

I don't really have any town reads, other than a hesitant town read on Rubby.

[Hydrad]

Sliver noooooo.

Also I think claiming is good

[Awaclus]

Yeah, claiming is definitely good.

Maybe we can coordinate claiming by reverse post count or something?  That would actually give some motivation to be more active.

I don't think this is good, because it sounds like scum could easily manipulate their positions that way. I think a random order is the best.

[Joseph2302]

Yeah, claiming is definitely good.

Maybe we can coordinate claiming by reverse post count or something?  That would actually give some motivation to be more active.

I don't think this is good, because it sounds like scum could easily manipulate their positions that way. I think a random order is the best.

Agree with both. Would be happy to post first, if people wanted.

[Hydrad]

ok order version Hydrad.

53478261

How did I do this?

I mashed my hand on the numbers.

[Hydrad]

Oh wait I'm last. uh lets reverse it then

16287435

[Hydrad]

I know noones going to use this order. I just felt like posting one though.

[chairs]

I followed SS's plan and targeted him.

[Joseph2302]

I also looked at silverspawn. He was the main person content-wise D1, so I wanted to check he wasn't scum manipulating us.

[Joseph2302]

I also looked at silverspawn. He was the main person content-wise D1, so I wanted to check he wasn't scum manipulating us.

I ignored the plan, as we didn't hit scum, and I thought this was better than checking chairs, on whom I had no read.

[Awaclus]

I looked at Witherweaver. I forgot to send the night action when I would have had enough time to think about it more carefully, so I just arbitrarily chose someone on wagon.

[Witherweaver]

I looked at Chairs.

[Hydrad]

Egork was my choice

[Hydrad]

So far we know SS did do that shot.

Perfect!

[Joseph2302]

So far we know SS did do that shot.

Perfect!

We also know that scum didn't try double kill.

[EgorK]

Maybe we can coordinate claiming by reverse post count or something?  That would actually give some motivation to be more active.

Well, it would give intiative to post more only for scum as as townie you do not care about order that much

Also I looked at Hydrad as he was first on the wagon

[Witherweaver]

Maybe we can coordinate claiming by reverse post count or something?  That would actually give some motivation to be more active.

Well, it would give intiative to post more only for scum as as townie you do not care about order that much

Also I looked at Hydrad as he was first on the wagon

I mean, that's good, we like scum to have to post, and especially to feel the pressure to need to post.

[Rubby]

So this is not going well. I looked at Joseph.

[Rubby]

I followed SS's plan and targeted him.

The plan was only supposed to be in effect if we lynched scum.

[chairs]

I followed SS's plan and targeted him.

The plan was only supposed to be in effect if we lynched scum.

I missed that part.

[Joseph2302]

So, summary of claims of who people looked at:

Hydrad: EgorK
chairs: silverspawn
EgorK: Hydrad
Joseph2302: silverspawn
Witherweaver: chairs
Awaclus: WW
Rubby: Joseph

Not a lot we can deduce from this IMO. Only people who followed the plan action were chairs and Rubby.

[Witherweaver]

I wouldn't say that was following the plan...

[Joseph2302]

I wouldn't say that was following the plan...

If we hit scum today - whoever it will be - this is how I think we should do our night Actions:

That plan was for if we hit scum, but we didn't. 2 people took the actions that silverspawn had suggested on it, the rest didn't, according to the claims made. It's probably not that important though.

Important thing is we have no ICs.

[Witherweaver]

Right, hence it wasn't following the plan.

I don't particularly like the looking choices.  To wit:

I also looked at silverspawn. He was the main person content-wise D1, so I wanted to check he wasn't scum manipulating us.

The only thing that makes me hesitant about voting, is why claim to look at Silverspawn?  It's not like anyone can Track.  Actually I was going to vote Joseph and changed my mind.

So what goes through scum's head when deciding who to claim you looked at?  Well if you claim your partner and someone else claimed/claims your partner, we have a "pseudo half IC".  However, if you flip scum then everyone can go back and look and see if you'd claim your partner or not.  On the other hand, you may want to use that and claim to have a Town member doubled so that if/when you do flip scum, you can get that guy mislynched.  I'm not so sure about the utility of the last point. 

I'm thinking if you claim early (Chairs, Joseph, Awaclus) as scum, you say anyone, probably not your partner.  The downside of a Town to claim after you having looked at that target is not too great.  If you're a later claiming (me, Hydrad, EgorK, Rubby) scum, you get to choose whether you'd repeat a target or claim someone new.  I'm thinking you'd simply do the latter: claim someone no one else has looked at.  That gives the least amount of information for everyone. 

Not much to go on.

[Witherweaver]

So this is not going well. I looked at Joseph.

Why did you choose Joseph?

[Witherweaver]

Egork was my choice

Why Egor?

[Witherweaver]

Since I'm asking others for explanation, I looked at Chairs because he's lurky and hard to read.  My thought was "if I had to choose someone to lynch, who would I choose?" And then look at that person. 

[Hydrad]

I picked Egork for because I was worried that we would all stack on 1 or two people so I picked someone that I felt like not many people would pick thinking that at most one other person would pick them.

I guess I was more worried then needed that there would be like 3 or 4 people on one person.

[Witherweaver]

I picked Egork for because I was worried that we would all stack on 1 or two people so I picked someone that I felt like not many people would pick thinking that at most one other person would pick them.

I guess I was more worried then needed that there would be like 3 or 4 people on one person.

Why would not many people pick Egor?

[Hydrad]

I picked Egork for because I was worried that we would all stack on 1 or two people so I picked someone that I felt like not many people would pick thinking that at most one other person would pick them.

I guess I was more worried then needed that there would be like 3 or 4 people on one person.

Why would not many people pick Egor?

I dunno. When I looked at the list of people Egork just felt like someone not many would pick.

Me personally I think this game WW/SS/Joesph felt like high pick targets in my mind.

[Rubby]

So this is not going well. I looked at Joseph.

Why did you choose Joseph?

It was semi-random, but he was a candidate because I had a scum read on him.

[Rubby]

I picked Egork for because I was worried that we would all stack on 1 or two people so I picked someone that I felt like not many people would pick thinking that at most one other person would pick them.

I guess I was more worried then needed that there would be like 3 or 4 people on one person.

Stacking on 1 or 2 people would have been good. We would have either blocked the kill or gotten a strong indication of who was not the killer.

[Joseph2302]

I think scum might be near the end of the declaring, but it's just a hunch. Think no ICs is what scum would want.

[Witherweaver]

I think scum might be near the end of the declaring, but it's just a hunch. Think no ICs is what scum would want.

You realize it, like, wouldn't create ICs, right?

[Awaclus]

I'm thinking if you claim early (Chairs, Joseph, Awaclus) as scum, you say anyone, probably not your partner.  The downside of a Town to claim after you having looked at that target is not too great.  If you're a later claiming (me, Hydrad, EgorK, Rubby) scum, you get to choose whether you'd repeat a target or claim someone new.  I'm thinking you'd simply do the latter: claim someone no one else has looked at.  That gives the least amount of information for everyone. 

I think if you claim early, you say silverspawn.

[Witherweaver]

I'm thinking if you claim early (Chairs, Joseph, Awaclus) as scum, you say anyone, probably not your partner.  The downside of a Town to claim after you having looked at that target is not too great.  If you're a later claiming (me, Hydrad, EgorK, Rubby) scum, you get to choose whether you'd repeat a target or claim someone new.  I'm thinking you'd simply do the latter: claim someone no one else has looked at.  That gives the least amount of information for everyone. 

I think if you claim early, you say silverspawn.

Yeah, but like I mentioned before, there isn't a huge problem if someone watched the guy you claimed.  He's not an IC because (1) He could be scum that didn't perform the kill, and (2) one of the people claiming to Look at him could have lied.  And if you get lynched and flip scum, people then have to look back and wonder if you'd claim your partner. 

[Awaclus]

I'm thinking if you claim early (Chairs, Joseph, Awaclus) as scum, you say anyone, probably not your partner.  The downside of a Town to claim after you having looked at that target is not too great.  If you're a later claiming (me, Hydrad, EgorK, Rubby) scum, you get to choose whether you'd repeat a target or claim someone new.  I'm thinking you'd simply do the latter: claim someone no one else has looked at.  That gives the least amount of information for everyone. 

I think if you claim early, you say silverspawn.

Yeah, but like I mentioned before, there isn't a huge problem if someone watched the guy you claimed.  He's not an IC because (1) He could be scum that didn't perform the kill, and (2) one of the people claiming to Look at him could have lied.  And if you get lynched and flip scum, people then have to look back and wonder if you'd claim your partner. 

But by saying someone other than silverspawn, you're giving town more information. In order for that to be a good idea, you would have to be confident that the information is going to mislead town rather than help them, and it sounds like a high-risk, low-reward gamble to me.


I just re-read silverspawn and the XP wagon and based on silver's reads, the wagon, and the massclaim today, I like vote: chairs a lot.

[Witherweaver]

Yeah, that's right.

And I'm down with

Vote: Chairs

[chairs]

I think you definitely don't kill SS if you plan on claiming him early as scum - personally, I'd NK the unknown (Rubby) since I don't have any idea how to work with his meta.

I think a kill of SS feels like someone who wants to make sure no solid plans come up, since SS was making a good plan.  Probably a newer player.  I'm thinking maybe a Rubby/Awaclus scumteam, and I'll vote: Awaclus

[Rubby]

For reference, here's a chronologized version of the claims summary.

chairs -> silverspawn
Joseph -> silverspawn
Awaclus -> Witherweaver
Witherweaver -> chairs
Hydrad -> EgorK
EgorK -> Hydrad
Rubby -> Joseph

[Rubby]

So how much do we read into the claim order? My immediate thought was (big coincidence!) the opposite of Joseph's "hunch". Not sure how much stock to put in it, and it might be prejudiced by my overall reads, but as town why would you want to claim first? Gives scum more of a chance to lie with more information. It might or might not be a scum play trying to appear town-friendly, but it's not pro-town.

For the record, Joseph and Chairs both volunteered to claim first. I don't know if I believe that the scum team would go first and second and both claim silverspawn, though.

[faust]

Vote Count 2.1

chairs (2): Awaclus, Witherweaver
Awaclus (1): chairs

Not Voting (4): Hydrad, EgorK, Joseph2302, Rubby

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 2 ends March 16 at 10 am forum time.

[Joseph2302]

For the record, Joseph and Chairs both volunteered to claim first. I don't know if I believe that the scum team would go first and second and both claim silverspawn, though.

I don't. I wanted to go first to get bad information out early. chairs seems to be same reason, unless chairs is scum and anticipated that I'd looked at silverspawn, and said it as well.

[Awaclus]

For the record, Joseph and Chairs both volunteered to claim first. I don't know if I believe that the scum team would go first and second and both claim silverspawn, though.

I don't. I wanted to go first to get bad information out early. chairs seems to be same reason, unless chairs is scum and anticipated that I'd looked at silverspawn, and said it as well.

Huh? Why would chairs have to anticipate anything about your plays in particular?

[Awaclus]

Sorry, I'm a bit tired right now, what I was trying to say is: Why wouldn't scum-who-didn't-anticipate!chairs claim to have looked at silverspawn?

[chairs]

I think joseph is heading to the "well, scum!chairs wants to make sure he claims SS before anybody else so he comes off not-as-scummy for it".  That's an argument I simply don't agree with, as I think scum!anybody really ought to be claiming someone else - maybe their partner, but probably just some random townie that isn't SS (because since they killed SS, it seems reasonable to believe that the folks who claim watching SS will come under unusually high suspicion).

[Hydrad]

Hmm I could see chairs?

Actually I wonder if its WW...

ok so thought process time.

Lets say chairs is town and WW is scum. How willing would WW be to jump on chairs there? I think its a slightly higher chance that scum WW jumps on chairs like that then town.

sure lets try itVote: WW!

[Witherweaver]

Hmm I could see chairs?

Actually I wonder if its WW...

ok so thought process time.

Lets say chairs is town and WW is scum. How willing would WW be to jump on chairs there? I think its a slightly higher chance that scum WW jumps on chairs like that then town.

sure lets try itVote: WW!

Huh?  What if Chairs is scum?

[Hydrad]

Hmm I could see chairs?

Actually I wonder if its WW...

ok so thought process time.

Lets say chairs is town and WW is scum. How willing would WW be to jump on chairs there? I think its a slightly higher chance that scum WW jumps on chairs like that then town.

sure lets try itVote: WW!

Huh?  What if Chairs is scum?

Then your probably town. I just have a slight thought that chairs might be town though.

Also I know that post doesn't really make sense but sometimes that how I try to figure out who scum is and this time I posted a bit of my thought process.

[Witherweaver]

I'm probably settled on one of Joseph or Chairs for today.

Though honestly I don't really remember what my reads were .. hm, I had thought Rubby was town.

I probably need to go reread.

[Rubby]

For now I will again vote: Joseph, although I'm feeling odder about Chairs' posts today, and as I said it would seem bizarre for both scum to claim first and say silverspawn. Don't want to put anyone at L-1 yet. And let's please not self hammer if we are town at L-1.

[Awaclus]

But if you're scum at L-1, then please self hammer.

[chairs]

Ooo, so we can just put everybody at L-1, and if they're scum they'll self-hammer, so guaranteed scum lynch!

[chairs]

(/s)

[Witherweaver]

Ooo, so we can just put everybody at L-1, and if they're scum they'll self-hammer, so guaranteed scum lynch!

I think if you vote for yourself, you'll be at L-1.  Go for it!

[chairs]

Ooo, so we can just put everybody at L-1, and if they're scum they'll self-hammer, so guaranteed scum lynch!

I think if you vote for yourself, you'll be at L-1.  Go for it!

That won't work, how would I show whether I'm self-hammering or not!

[Joseph2302]

Been busy all day, phone post here. Will reread when I get home (2-3 hours).

[Joseph2302]

I think joseph is heading to the "well, scum!chairs wants to make sure he claims SS before anybody else so he comes off not-as-scummy for it".  That's an argument I simply don't agree with, as I think scum!anybody really ought to be claiming someone else - maybe their partner, but probably just some random townie that isn't SS (because since they killed SS, it seems reasonable to believe that the folks who claim watching SS will come under unusually high suspicion).

This was the way I was going, I agree it isn't actually a good argument. I think early claims were towny.

I'm probably settled on one of Joseph or Chairs for today.

Really, because I'm not convinced either of us is. I know for sure I'm not.

[faust]

Vote Count 2.2

chairs (2): Awaclus, Witherweaver
Awaclus (1): chairs
Witherweaver (1): Hydrad
Joseph2302 (1): Rubby

Not Voting (2): EgorK, Joseph2302

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 2 ends March 16 at 10 am forum time.

[chairs]

vote: WW.

I think "settling on" Joseph or myself is the kind of easy out scum wants to suggest to Town.  Still mostly neutral on Joseph.

[Rubby]

I think "settling on" Joseph or myself is the kind of easy out scum wants to suggest to Town.

What do you mean? What makes it an "easy out"?

[chairs]

Well, let's assume for the moment that Joseph is Town (and for the rest of you, since you don't get to see my PM, that I am as well).  There's at least one potential easy mislynch there based on "one of them HAS to be lying!" and possibly two if you can keep that ball rolling into the next Day.  It's a lynch that people could sheep on based on a surface-sensible argument, one that goes just deep enough for lazy Town (of which I have been guilty in prior games myself) to just vote it and move on.  If I were scum, and I thought I'd get a shot to easy-mode two mislynches, I'd run with it.

[Awaclus]

Well, let's assume for the moment that Joseph is Town (and for the rest of you, since you don't get to see my PM, that I am as well).  There's at least one potential easy mislynch there based on "one of them HAS to be lying!" and possibly two if you can keep that ball rolling into the next Day.  It's a lynch that people could sheep on based on a surface-sensible argument, one that goes just deep enough for lazy Town (of which I have been guilty in prior games myself) to just vote it and move on.  If I were scum, and I thought I'd get a shot to easy-mode two mislynches, I'd run with it.

Well, that's only if both of you are town. I very much doubt that it is the case.

[chairs]

Well, let's assume for the moment that Joseph is Town (and for the rest of you, since you don't get to see my PM, that I am as well).  There's at least one potential easy mislynch there based on "one of them HAS to be lying!" and possibly two if you can keep that ball rolling into the next Day.  It's a lynch that people could sheep on based on a surface-sensible argument, one that goes just deep enough for lazy Town (of which I have been guilty in prior games myself) to just vote it and move on.  If I were scum, and I thought I'd get a shot to easy-mode two mislynches, I'd run with it.

Well, that's only if both of you are town. I very much doubt that it is the case.

Why? Statistically, we're more likely to be Town than scum (I bet I can worfram alpha the numbers on this, given enough patience to figure out the proper context).

[Witherweaver]

You're not more likely to both be town than for one of you to not be town.

[Awaclus]

Well, let's assume for the moment that Joseph is Town (and for the rest of you, since you don't get to see my PM, that I am as well).  There's at least one potential easy mislynch there based on "one of them HAS to be lying!" and possibly two if you can keep that ball rolling into the next Day.  It's a lynch that people could sheep on based on a surface-sensible argument, one that goes just deep enough for lazy Town (of which I have been guilty in prior games myself) to just vote it and move on.  If I were scum, and I thought I'd get a shot to easy-mode two mislynches, I'd run with it.

Well, that's only if both of you are town. I very much doubt that it is the case.

Why? Statistically, we're more likely to be Town than scum (I bet I can worfram alpha the numbers on this, given enough patience to figure out the proper context).

Because you're super scummy.

[chairs]

Well, let's assume for the moment that Joseph is Town (and for the rest of you, since you don't get to see my PM, that I am as well).  There's at least one potential easy mislynch there based on "one of them HAS to be lying!" and possibly two if you can keep that ball rolling into the next Day.  It's a lynch that people could sheep on based on a surface-sensible argument, one that goes just deep enough for lazy Town (of which I have been guilty in prior games myself) to just vote it and move on.  If I were scum, and I thought I'd get a shot to easy-mode two mislynches, I'd run with it.

Well, that's only if both of you are town. I very much doubt that it is the case.

Why? Statistically, we're more likely to be Town than scum (I bet I can worfram alpha the numbers on this, given enough patience to figure out the proper context).

Because you're super scummy.

Why?

[Awaclus]

Well, let's assume for the moment that Joseph is Town (and for the rest of you, since you don't get to see my PM, that I am as well).  There's at least one potential easy mislynch there based on "one of them HAS to be lying!" and possibly two if you can keep that ball rolling into the next Day.  It's a lynch that people could sheep on based on a surface-sensible argument, one that goes just deep enough for lazy Town (of which I have been guilty in prior games myself) to just vote it and move on.  If I were scum, and I thought I'd get a shot to easy-mode two mislynches, I'd run with it.

Well, that's only if both of you are town. I very much doubt that it is the case.

Why? Statistically, we're more likely to be Town than scum (I bet I can worfram alpha the numbers on this, given enough patience to figure out the proper context).

Because you're super scummy.

Why?

Probably because you're scum.

[chairs]

Well, you've certainly convinced me. /s

[chairs]

FYI this could be LyLo, if scum feels they're unlikely to be targetted tonight.

[chairs]

Err, MiLo, rather.

[Witherweaver]

Day ends on Monday morning.  I will try to do something productive tomorrow, and if not that then on Sunday night.

[Hydrad]

AND ACTION.

Also 2 ish days left I think.

I suggest people start putting votes on someone if you havn't already.

[Joseph2302]

AND ACTION.

Also 2 ish days left I think.

I suggest people start putting votes on someone if you havn't already.

Just under 2 days, 42 hours I believe. Vote: Rubby. Just a gut.

[Witherweaver]

Unvote

I'm not all that thrilled with Chairs

[Hydrad]

Unvote

I'm not all that thrilled with Chairs

Your doing the opposite of what I told you!

[Witherweaver]

Wait let me find my cares... what's this?  I can't find any.  Oh, right, that's because I don't care!

[Hydrad]

Wait let me find my cares... what's this?  I can't find any.  Oh, right, that's because I don't care!

Oh thats very dangerous. I will try and help you locate your cares.

[Awaclus]

Unvote

I'm not all that thrilled with Chairs

Why not?

[Rubby]

Well, let's assume for the moment that Joseph is Town (and for the rest of you, since you don't get to see my PM, that I am as well).  There's at least one potential easy mislynch there based on "one of them HAS to be lying!" and possibly two if you can keep that ball rolling into the next Day.  It's a lynch that people could sheep on based on a surface-sensible argument, one that goes just deep enough for lazy Town (of which I have been guilty in prior games myself) to just vote it and move on.  If I were scum, and I thought I'd get a shot to easy-mode two mislynches, I'd run with it.

So who is a better lynch target? What would be less "lazy"? Obviously scum would be thrilled to get any two townies lynched, but why should we think that both of you are probably town? From my or any townie's perspective, ignoring reads and claims, any given pair of other players at this point is mathematically more likely than not to contain at least one scum. Is claiming early and saying silverspawn more likely to come from a both-town pair than a contains-at-least-one-scum pair? I welcome everyone else's thoughts on this too.

[faust]

Vote Count 2.3

chairs (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (2): Hydrad, chairs
Joseph2302 (1): Rubby
Rubby (1): Joseph2302

Not Voting (2): EgorK, Witherweaver

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 2 ends March 16 at 10 am forum time. That's in about 24 hours.

[Witherweaver]

Unvote

I'm not all that thrilled with Chairs

Why not?

Mostly because he's been one of the involved people doing stuff, I think. 

[Hydrad]

Hmm we havn't heard from Egork for a while.

[Witherweaver]

Rereading some of Day 1.. it's hard to figure things out this game.  Most of my reads are just feeling.

Right now I think Awaclus and Hydrad are town.

EgorK and Chairs are questionable.. that's mostly just from that "hmm should I quickhammer?" thing Charis did with EgorK.  He said he wanted to see how people would react, but I don't know.

Joseph still looks usually scummy, which is just as much of a town tell for him as it is a scum tell, so I'm not sure though.  He or EgorK would be good lynches today.

Rubby I'm pretty null on.. still leaning a bit town.

[Witherweaver]

well, my only read so far is a town read on rubby because I get a genuine vibe

Kind of agree. But I don't like lynching newbies D1.

well, my only read so far is a town read on rubby because I get a genuine vibe

Kind of agree. But I don't like lynching newbies D1.

Why would you lynch a newbie anyway just because Rubby happens to be towny?

Definitely misread silverspawn's post. I have a small scum vibe on Rubby, probably nothing though.

So Joseph meant to say something really hedgy and scummy about willing to lynch Rubby but not really liking it.

Vote: Joseph

[Rubby]

Running out of time to get something done. EgorK, where are you?

[Hydrad]

I think we are at under 10 hours? I should hopefully be around at deadline... I hope. but ya we need to at least get a lynch through guys. The Joesph vote I might be willing to go to. I'll wait on WW a bit longer to see if anyone else wants to join.

[Hydrad]

Going to sleep and setting an alarm so hopefully I'll be here for deadline.

Vote: Joseph in case I dont

[faust]

Vote Count 2.4

chairs (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (1): chairs
Joseph2302 (3): Rubby, Witherweaver, Hydrad
Rubby (1): Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): EgorK

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 2 ends March 16 at 10 am forum time. That's in about 6 hours.

[EgorK]

I'm here and I am extremely sorry. That new project at work takes most of my time. I'll try to do some rereads, but generally speaking chairs seems scummy so far. On the other hand, he always seems scummy to me

[Joseph2302]

I don't want to be lynched because of a mistake I made posting when tired. I think Vote:  WW seem okay right now. I still think chairs is town.

[Awaclus]

Meh, looks like chairs won't happen. Joseph isn't a bad lynch, but the Joseph wagon sort of feels like someone (WW?) is trying to deflect from the chairs lynch.

I intend to hammer later if I'm around though.

[Rubby]

I don't want to be lynched because of a mistake I made posting when tired. I think Vote:  WW seem okay right now. I still think chairs is town.

What mistake are you referring to? Implying Chairs might be scum?

[Joseph2302]

I don't want to be lynched because of a mistake I made posting when tired. I think Vote:  WW seem okay right now. I still think chairs is town.

What mistake are you referring to? Implying Chairs might be scum?

I'm referring to this:

well, my only read so far is a town read on rubby because I get a genuine vibe

Kind of agree. But I don't like lynching newbies D1.

Why would you lynch a newbie anyway just because Rubby happens to be towny?

Definitely misread silverspawn's post. I have a small scum vibe on Rubby, probably nothing though.

[Witherweaver]

I don't want to be lynched because of a mistake I made posting when tired. I think Vote:  WW seem okay right now. I still think chairs is town.

Pretty sure you're missing the point of what I said.... the scummy part is not your mistake; it's what you meant to say.

[Witherweaver]

Meh, looks like chairs won't happen. Joseph isn't a bad lynch, but the Joseph wagon sort of feels like someone (WW?) is trying to deflect from the chairs lynch.

I intend to hammer later if I'm around though.

Nah.. I'm not against Chairs.  Really the worst thing is that explanation for looking at Silverspawn.. it's kind of.. convenient.  Do you think Chairs is better than Joseph?

[Joseph2302]

I don't want to be lynched because of a mistake I made posting when tired. I think Vote:  WW seem okay right now. I still think chairs is town.

Pretty sure you're missing the point of what I said.... the scummy part is not your mistake; it's what you meant to say.

"I have a small scum read, but don't want to lynch a newbie" seems perfectly fine to me. It's only a weak read, and lots of people don't like lynching newbies unless they seem like obvious scum.

Meh, looks like chairs won't happen. Joseph isn't a bad lynch, but the Joseph wagon sort of feels like someone (WW?) is trying to deflect from the chairs lynch.

I intend to hammer later if I'm around though.

Nah.. I'm not against Chairs.  Really the worst thing is that explanation for looking at Silverspawn.. it's kind of.. convenient.  Do you think Chairs is better than Joseph?

I think chairs is better than Joseph, although I don't think either is very good.

[Witherweaver]

"I have a scum read on this new player but I don't want to lynch him" is not the towniest thing to be said.. generally that's a template reason to take any stance you want.

But okay, I'll engage.  Why did you have a scum read on Rubby?

[Witherweaver]

So we only have 30 minutes.  I will do Chairs, Egor, or Joseph.

Who else is around?

[Rubby]

Meh, looks like chairs won't happen. Joseph isn't a bad lynch, but the Joseph wagon sort of feels like someone (WW?) is trying to deflect from the chairs lynch.

I intend to hammer later if I'm around though.

You think someone on the Joseph wagon is Chairs' partner? WW went after Chairs quickly on Day 2, and I have found Chairs' Day 2 posts suspicious. And, where is Chairs?

Anyway, my reads are not super strong. I'm not dead set on staying on Joseph. But we need to lynch someone, like, immediately.

[Witherweaver]

Egor is still not voting..

[Awaclus]

Meh, looks like chairs won't happen. Joseph isn't a bad lynch, but the Joseph wagon sort of feels like someone (WW?) is trying to deflect from the chairs lynch.

I intend to hammer later if I'm around though.

You think someone on the Joseph wagon is Chairs' partner? WW went after Chairs quickly on Day 2, and I have found Chairs' Day 2 posts suspicious. And, where is Chairs?

Anyway, my reads are not super strong. I'm not dead set on staying on Joseph. But we need to lynch someone, like, immediately.

I think WW could definitely go after chairs as his partner here. But yeah, I'll just hammer and hope that you guys are right.

Vote: Joseph

[Witherweaver]

I could go after Chairs.. I mean, I get your point, and I can see how it could look like I'm deflecting from Chairs.. but I'm not all too convinced about Chairs, and he didn't seem all that scummy today.  On my reread I didn't get a strong scum feeling towards him.

[Witherweaver]

I'm just trying to pick correctly here, and there's really not a whole lot to go by.

[Witherweaver]

Deadline has passed, right?  Joseph was hammered?

[Joseph2302]

Deadline was 1 hour from now, I think. But I'm hammered anyway. I'm town

[Joseph2302]

Oh wait, timezones changed in US, so 10am forum=1400UTC, not 1500UTC. Either way, I was hammered before the deadline.

[faust]

THREAD LOCKED!

[faust]

Day 2 Final Vote Count

Witherweaver (2): chairs, Joseph2302
Joseph2302 (4): Rubby, Witherweaver, Hydrad, Awaclus

Not Voting (1): EgorK

With 7 alive, it took 4 to lynch.

[faust]

"Crap", exclaimed Egor. "It looks as though we always lose the person standing closest to the statue we teleport.

"So who do you think we should pop?", asked Witherweaver.

"chairs", yelled Awaclus. "Really?", responded Witherweaver. "I don't think that's such a good idea."

"Okay then", said Awaclus. "I'll just do Joseph. I hope you're right." And with this, he reached for the button.

Joseph and the statue vanished, and a small monitor in the center of the control room flipped on. It showed Joseph on an alien planet, standing in a weird sort of royal palace. Lots of folks were gathered in the court, all of them wearing masks. When someone noticed Joseph's sudden appearance, some rough-looking goons made his way through the crowd, towards him.

"Man, it sure looks as though he's going to get pinned to the wall", observed Rubby.

Joseph2302, the Townie, has been lynched.

Night 2 starts now and lasts 24 hours. Please get your night actions in in time.

[faust]

Not all players have checked in yet. The thread remains locked until this happens.

[faust]

"Don't stare at the screen, stare at the statues!", exclaimed Hydrad, but it was already too late. Awaclus had disappeared into thin air.

Awaclus suddenly found himself in the middle of a medieval market square. Lots of people were gathered round him and glared at him with both amazement and fear.

"Witchcraft!", yelled a voice. "Take this ungodly man and give him what he deserves!"

Awaclus, the Townie, has been killed in the night.

Day 2 has begun! Thread unlocked!

Vote Count 3.0

Not Voting (5): Hydrad, chairs, EgorK, Witherweaver, Rubby

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch. Day 3 ends March 24 at noon forum time.

[Witherweaver]

I give up!

Chairs and Egor?  That's my best guess.

[Witherweaver]

Maybe Rubby.

Hydrad still doesn't seem scummy.

[Rubby]

Chairs and Egor?  That's my best guess.

That was my thought too.

We should probably say who we looked at.

[Witherweaver]

I looked at Chairs again.

[Rubby]

Plenty of people not hesitant to claim early, huh? All right, whatever.

I looked at Egor. Really, really don't like his lack of participation in Day 2.

[Hydrad]

Sooooo I still think its WW and am actually starting to think rubby also. I don't know most time when its someones first game they seem really towny. Rubby has just kinda felt in the middle for me.

I feel like egork doesn't lurk this much if scum.

[Witherweaver]

Sooooo I still think its WW and am actually starting to think rubby also. I don't know most time when its someones first game they seem really towny. Rubby has just kinda felt in the middle for me.

I feel like egork doesn't lurk this much if scum.

Not a bad point about Rubby, but I'm not scum.  And egor does lurk as everything.

[Witherweaver]

I'm willing to entertain ideas of anyone being scum that doesn't include me.

[chairs]

I targeted ww, and vote: ww

[Hydrad]

oh my goodness we are the worst team at targetting people.

I looked at rubby.

[EgorK]

I looked at chairs, so at least we have this

[Rubby]

So Chairs can only be the killer if WW or Egor is his partner.
Not sure how much this fact helps us.

[Hydrad]

also we are at lylo right now.

[Witherweaver]

Yeah, I don't think we really have much info here.

I guess.. I don't know.  I don't have any good ideas.

[Hydrad]

Yeah, I don't think we really have much info here.

I guess.. I don't know.  I don't have any good ideas.

I got an idea. Lets lynch you! woooo.

but ya we are in a  dangerous spot.

[Witherweaver]

Eh,

Vote: Chairs

or Egor.

[Rubby]

I don't see anything pro-town from Egor. Vote: EgorK

[Witherweaver]

Sure

Vote: Egor

[Rubby]

L-1 already?
Vote: chairs

[chairs]

vote: egork

[Rubby]

OK, what just happened?

[Rubby]

chairs quickhammering? Missed by 12 seconds?

[Witherweaver]

Dunno.

Unvote

[Witherweaver]

It's 3 to lynch?

[Witherweaver]

He would have seen PPE though, right?

If Chairs was scum trying to quickhammer Egor, then Rubby is an unlikely partner and it has to be Hydrad...

[Hydrad]

wow chairs WW team? thats what I see here.

[Witherweaver]

It's not though.

But I can understand thinking that.

[Witherweaver]

I'm thinking Rubby is town though, right?  Is there a scum narrative there?

[chairs]

It's very simple - I know I'm Town.  I don't know Egork is Town.  It's Lylo and I wanted to make sure we at least had a chance at not lynching Town, which means not lynching me.

[Hydrad]

It's very simple - I know I'm Town.  I don't know Egork is Town.  It's Lylo and I wanted to make sure we at least had a chance at not lynching Town, which means not lynching me.

Sorry but I don't buy it.

[Hydrad]

Vote: chairs

also I think the best play for tonights powers is.

Hydrad and Egork target WW. Rubby targets either me or egork. WW targets rubby.

This was if chairs is scum we have a super high chance I think of stopping the kill. If there is a kill we know WW is safe. If not we can lynch WW and still have a chance of winning if town targets scum again at night.

[Hydrad]

I'm thinking Rubby is town though, right?  Is there a scum narrative there?

in the super low chance egork is rubbys partner.

[Hydrad]

really though if chairs gets hammered here I really hope you guys follow this plan. I don't see a better way to use our powers.

[Witherweaver]

Hmm...

[Witherweaver]

Vote: chairs

also I think the best play for tonights powers is.

Hydrad and Egork target WW. Rubby targets either me or egork. WW targets rubby.

This was if chairs is scum we have a super high chance I think of stopping the kill. If there is a kill we know WW is safe. If not we can lynch WW and still have a chance of winning if town targets scum again at night.

But if Chairs is scum you, like, have to be the partner.  I can't see Egor or Rubby.

[Hydrad]

Vote: chairs

also I think the best play for tonights powers is.

Hydrad and Egork target WW. Rubby targets either me or egork. WW targets rubby.

This was if chairs is scum we have a super high chance I think of stopping the kill. If there is a kill we know WW is safe. If not we can lynch WW and still have a chance of winning if town targets scum again at night.

But if Chairs is scum you, like, have to be the partner.  I can't see Egor or Rubby.

ok well feel free to target me instead of rubby or something if your worried of me double killing. Either way I think we should discuss the possibility of me being scum after tonight if there is a kill.

[Hydrad]

egork should also be considered a IC here I think if chairs is scum. If we are wrong here that sucks. But i think Rubby/egork is pretty much IC to me.

[Rubby]

I propose Hydrad and Egor target WW, and WW and Rubby target Hydrad.

[Witherweaver]

I propose Hydrad and Egor target WW, and WW and Rubby target Hydrad.

This kind of makes sense.

[Hydrad]

I propose Hydrad and Egor target WW, and WW and Rubby target Hydrad.

I'm disagree with this. This means there is either a no kill or scum wins if its egork or rubby with the double kill. if there is a no kill we still have to pick between me or WW.

The other way if there is a kill WW is now a IC. plus it stops the odd chance that you or egork are scum and double kill and win.

[Witherweaver]

Well I guess that makes sense, too.  But we should have two people watch you instead of me

[Rubby]

I propose Hydrad and Egor target WW, and WW and Rubby target Hydrad.

I'm disagree with this. This means there is either a no kill or scum wins if its egork or rubby with the double kill. if there is a no kill we still have to pick between me or WW.

The other way if there is a kill WW is now a IC. plus it stops the odd chance that you or egork are scum and double kill and win.

Huh? I don't see how Egor can be chairs' partner. And I don't see any remotely possible narrative for me being chairs' partner.

[Hydrad]

Actually I don't care to much. It pretty much has to be WW and i'll almost accept a loss if its you or egork.

I still like my plan better but I won't fight it to much.

Actually rubby you should at least leave it up to wifom. If you like your plan then do it. But don't 100% it incase egork is scum.

[Hydrad]

I propose Hydrad and Egor target WW, and WW and Rubby target Hydrad.

I'm disagree with this. This means there is either a no kill or scum wins if its egork or rubby with the double kill. if there is a no kill we still have to pick between me or WW.

The other way if there is a kill WW is now a IC. plus it stops the odd chance that you or egork are scum and double kill and win.

Huh? I don't see how Egor can be chairs' partner. And I don't see any remotely possible narrative for me being chairs' partner.

ya i know. there is like a 2% chance egork is scum. but its still there so thats why I'm still slightly worried.

[Witherweaver]

Well if it's Hydrad/Egor then we're in trouble because Egor can hammer for the win~

[Witherweaver]

Also if Chairs is town then he knows I must be town, else I would have hammered.

I'm thinking the more likely scenario is he's scum, though.

[Rubby]

Actually rubby you should at least leave it up to wifom. If you like your plan then do it. But don't 100% it incase egork is scum.

Got it - I'll give myself a non-zero probability of looking at Egor. But WW should definitely look at Hydrad.

[EgorK]

Vote: chairs

[faust]

THREAD LOCKED!

[faust]

Day 3 Final Vote Count

chairs (3): Rubby, Hydrad, EgorK
EgorK (1): chairs

Not Voting (1): Witherweaver

With 5 alive, it took 3 to lynch.

[faust]

"I know! We zap Egor next!", cried chairs, reaching for the teleport button.

"Hey... wait a second", responded Rubby, pulling chairs' hand away. "Are you willing to kill us all? Because I think you are."

"Yes, he's definitely one of the Angels", agreed Hydrad. "Let's throw him and the statue out."

"As you wish", said Egor, smiling, and his finger pressed down the button for one final time.

chairs found himself in the middle of a big factory, apparently for building furniture. The automated chainsaw directly in front of him was the last thing he saw.

When Witherweaver and Hydrad opened their eyes again, they found themselves in a great jungle. "Boy, have we been wrong", said Witherweaver. "Yeah", agreed Hydrad. "But where are we now?"

"Can't say. Though I don't recognize all of these plants... the Angels must have had enough energy already to send us really far back."

Suddenly, they heard a great a great roar., and looked in the direction it came from. "Oh crap", Witherweaver remarked stoically. "It's a T-Rex."

chairs, the Townie, has been lynched.

Witherweaver and Hydrad have been endgamed.

The scum team of EgorK and Rubby wins flawlessly!

MVP goes to Rubby for an outstanding mafia debut overall and in particular wrapping up the game with his great D3 play.

[faust]

Weeping Angels: http://www.quicktopic.com/51/H/4G59c9Xu9jTk
Mod: http://www.quicktopic.com/51/H/p6Qe3eKVbyDe
Speccy: http://www.quicktopic.com/51/H/dZBkYuCdXS6

[silverspawn]

 ugh.

well done rubby though.

[Awaclus]

That was brutal. Well played, scum.

[Rubby]

Yay!

[Rubby]

I'm thinking Rubby is town though, right?  Is there a scum narrative there?

So the answer to this is:
Newbie scum goes into Day 3 planning to bus his partner, who the scum team thought would be in trouble for his lurkiness. Is somewhat surprised by the relative lack of interest in an Egor wagon, still decides to put initial vote on Egor because he doesn't want to look scummy by L-1ing chairs so early (and can't count on his partner being there to hammer). Is genuinely surprised by WW's quick L-1ing of Egor and gets jumpy. And gets an amazingly fluky stroke of luck.

[Rubby]

Anyway, it was fun. Thanks faust and everyone.

[Witherweaver]

This game sucked!  And by that, I mean, I sucked this game.  I kind of gave up, sorry.

I think the setup is pretty high skill.. I was at a bit of a loss for what to do. 

At any rate, I believe I'm policylynching Egor on Day 1 from now on~

[Witherweaver]

I'm thinking Rubby is town though, right?  Is there a scum narrative there?

So the answer to this is:
Newbie scum goes into Day 3 planning to bus his partner, who the scum team thought would be in trouble for his lurkiness. Is somewhat surprised by the relative lack of interest in an Egor wagon, still decides to put initial vote on Egor because he doesn't want to look scummy by L-1ing chairs so early (and can't count on his partner being there to hammer). Is genuinely surprised by WW's quick L-1ing of Egor and gets jumpy. And gets an amazingly fluky stroke of luck.

Yeah that Chairs thing coming, like, immediately after your vote was weird.  But, then again, if he was trying to quickhammer as scum he should have seen a PPE.

[Awaclus]

I'm thinking Rubby is town though, right?  Is there a scum narrative there?

So the answer to this is:
Newbie scum goes into Day 3 planning to bus his partner, who the scum team thought would be in trouble for his lurkiness. Is somewhat surprised by the relative lack of interest in an Egor wagon, still decides to put initial vote on Egor because he doesn't want to look scummy by L-1ing chairs so early (and can't count on his partner being there to hammer). Is genuinely surprised by WW's quick L-1ing of Egor and gets jumpy. And gets an amazingly fluky stroke of luck.

Yeah that Chairs thing coming, like, immediately after your vote was weird.  But, then again, if he was trying to quickhammer as scum he should have seen a PPE.

Not necessarily. When you send a post, there's a small period of time during which the forum has already checked that there were no new posts, but hasn't finished sending your post yet. Normally it's so short that it's not really noticeable, but if your connection is slow (or the problem is on the forum's end), it's possible that your post appears after a post that you haven't read. And in this case, the posting times are close enough to each other that this might have actually happened here. It happened to me in one mafia game, but luckily it didn't change anything.

[Joseph2302]

So I was right about Rubby then? Damn it, well played though.

[EgorK]

At any rate, I believe I'm policylynching Egor on Day 1 from now on~

I hope only if I'm lurking?

[Witherweaver]

At any rate, I believe I'm policylynching Egor on Day 1 from now on~

I hope only if I'm lurking?

If you're not lurking, I will die of shock

[Hydrad]

dang it the super low chance of egork rubby wasn't as low as I thought.

[chairs]

I was sold on Rubby when I read this morning but didn't have time to post and I'm pretty sure I'd been hammered anyway.