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[2.71828.....]

Vote Count 4.e

RR (3): Awaclus, SS, chairs
SS (2): RR, 2.7
Awaclus (1): Ampharos

Not Voting (1): WW

Takes 4 to lynch

[silverspawn]

I mean, I had Hydrad as my second favorite lynch the whole time. The quote where I asked 'what? Why Hydrad' was because it came out of nowhere - you had not expressed suspicion on him before.

Your case basically comes down to me pushing Hydrad but not being on his lynch, but wouldn't scum be more likely to make sure to actually be on the wagon, not less? I pushed Hydrad, which is bad for him, without being off wagon, which is bad for me. And do you think I expected the quick lynch? I would have gone back to him in order to get the lynch through hadn't you done it without me.

And I don't even like bussing as scum.

[silverspawn]

you had not expressed suspicion on him before.

or - maybe you did, but I thought you hadn't at that point.

[silverspawn]

I really thought you'd have another reason, because what you're summarizing there is what I used to defend myself before. faust initially did the same, but came to his senses.

[2.71828.....]

I mean, I had Hydrad as my second favorite lynch the whole time. The quote where I asked 'what? Why Hydrad' was because it came out of nowhere - you had not expressed suspicion on him before.

Your case basically comes down to me pushing Hydrad but not being on his lynch, but wouldn't scum be more likely to make sure to actually be on the wagon, not less? I pushed Hydrad, which is bad for him, without being off wagon, which is bad for me. And do you think I expected the quick lynch? I would have gone back to him in order to get the lynch through hadn't you done it without me.

And I don't even like bussing as scum.

Scum doesn't lynch their partner D1.  Well, not entirely true.  But, like, a D1 scum lynch is SO bad for scum.  And yeah, obviously you would go back to someone to get a lynch in.  I would have voted RR D1 to get a lynch in.  That is what town does.  No-lynches are terrible D1.

And as I hope I demonstrated (please, everyone go back and reread for yourselves), you talked a lot about Hydrad and you 'pushed' him, sure, but never to the point where he was a real lynch candidate.  When that happened you were nowhere to be seen

And you don't like bussing.  Great.  That doesn't mean you didn't do it this game.

[2.71828.....]

I really thought you'd have another reason, because what you're summarizing there is what I used to defend myself before. faust initially did the same, but came to his senses.

I know, it was a masterful bus.  Great town-cred for you. 

[silverspawn]

I really don't think I would try the 'vote but do it in such a way that he won't be lynched' thing. I've never done that. I always do the 'do what's natural thing' when I'm scum.

[silverspawn]

and Idk why you're calling it masterful. Given that the whole point of that plan would be to bus hydrad without getting him lynched, but he ended up getting lynched - wouldn't it be rather poor play, or at least unsuccessful?

[2.71828.....]

But I mean, take a serious look at RR.  Does this really happen?

Vote: Hydrad

Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?

no.

Just no.

Sure my case on silverspawn isn't the most amazing case you have ever seen.  But it beats the "RR has acted scummy all game" case.

[silverspawn]

what about Awaclus?

[Awaclus]

Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?

Yes.

[2.71828.....]

and Idk why you're calling it masterful. Given that the whole point of that plan would be to bus hydrad without getting him lynched, but he ended up getting lynched - wouldn't it be rather poor play, or at least unsuccessful?

Yeah, obviously it was unsuccessful from your perspective.  But it did accomplish its purpose.  Plus, you were never really voting Hydrad when it mattered.

And Hydrad is a common D1 mislynch, so some people are motivated to look elsewhere.

I will say that this is a bad argument. One could also say that I am a "safe bus" because I never get lynched D1. So then everyone is a safe bus, the people who are often lynched and those whose a rarely lynched. Except... a bus is not safe.

Thing is it's safe when it's the beginning of Day 1.

The biggest wagon on Hydrad that you were on had 4 people.  Still super safe for D1.  Then you got off that wagon and Hydrad went back down to two people before spiking back up for the lynch.

Hydrad was never in any trouble until the very end.  And at the end, you were having fun on your little RR diversion.

[silverspawn]

I don't know how self-aware Awaclus is, but it's a safe play for him to blindly push RR the entire game. Everyone just gives him Awaclus points for it, and even if RR gets mislynched, he wouldn't get too much scrunity.

Or it could also just be RR and Awaclus is right. I'm not sure if the L-2 is unreasonable as a scum play.

[2.71828.....]

Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?

Yes.

No evidence of that.

First scum game: nowhere to be seen on the lynch D1, then got himself lynched D2.

Second scum game: No bussing on either of his partners' lynches (first one, second one)

So yeah.  I don't think RR busses there.  Not on D1.

[Awaclus]

I don't know how self-aware Awaclus is

Pretty self-aware.

Does scum!RR seriously put his partner to L-2 on D1?

Yes.

No evidence of that.

First scum game: nowhere to be seen on the lynch D1, then got himself lynched D2.

Second scum game: No bussing on either of his partners' lynches (first one, second one)

So yeah.  I don't think RR busses there.  Not on D1.

RR does crazy stuff as both alignments, and he's self-aware enough to start bussing now that he hasn't done it in the past.

[2.71828.....]

yeah, but I don't think that is him this game

[silverspawn]

what about Awaclus?

@e

[silverspawn]

there's also the thing that even town!Awaclus might explain his reasons at this point. There is only one scum left; if he's right, then all that matters is convincing us that RR is in fact scum. RR knowing his reasons wouldn't help him one bit.

[2.71828.....]

I think you mean scum!awaclus in that last post.  But I think Awaclus has been more annoying than scummy this game.

I would totally lynch him though.

I think I am at:

silverspawn > Awaclus > Ampharos > RR > WW > chairs > 2.7

[2.71828.....]

well, maybe you did mean, town!awaclus.  Because you were just not including yourself in the count and with ICs he only has RR as an option to vote for.

Which makes sense.

[Awaclus]

there's also the thing that even town!Awaclus might explain his reasons at this point. There is only one scum left; if he's right, then all that matters is convincing us that RR is in fact scum. RR knowing his reasons wouldn't help him one bit.

The main point about this is to make the suspected scum not change his behavior because of my reasons. It makes it easier for me to continue reading them.

[2.71828.....]

there's also the thing that even town!Awaclus might explain his reasons at this point. There is only one scum left; if he's right, then all that matters is convincing us that RR is in fact scum. RR knowing his reasons wouldn't help him one bit.

The main point about this is to make the suspected scum not change his behavior because of my reasons. It makes it easier for me to continue reading them.

but harder for the rest of us....?  This post makes no sense.  Your opinion by itself is pointless unless you convince others to your side. 

We have no reason to believe your opinion unless you share your reasons.  And also, a change in scum behavior would implicate them, so that also makes no sense that you wouldn't share since you could find scum because they changed behavior

[2.71828.....]

Where is the rest of town?  chairs, you should totally switch to silverspawn.  WW also.

Then we can go ahead and lynch RR tomorrow if I am wrong.

[2.71828.....]

And Awaclus at lylo

[2.71828.....]

Actually, who am I kidding.  I probably won't vote RR tomorrow even if I am wrong about silverspawn