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[MiX]

What else would I do?

Do you mean apologize?  If you want.

I mean eat a hat regardless. Idk you can choose.

[WestCoastDidds]

Ash, I hope you keep playing. I can see how entirely frustrating it must be to play with people less skilled than you are, but I like you and think you’re a good dude, and maybe it can be more fun than frustrating sometimes.

[ashersky]

Ash, I hope you keep playing. I can see how entirely frustrating it must be to play with people less skilled than you are, but I like you and think you’re a good dude, and maybe it can be more fun than frustrating sometimes.

I hope I didn't make it sound like I think players are less skilled than me.  I meant I think my skills must have diminished from what they once were.

I was comparing myself to my past self.  I definitely meant no offense toward anyone other than myself.

[WestCoastDidds]

Ash, I hope you keep playing. I can see how entirely frustrating it must be to play with people less skilled than you are, but I like you and think you’re a good dude, and maybe it can be more fun than frustrating sometimes.

I hope I didn't make it sound like I think players are less skilled than me.  I meant I think my skills must have diminished from what they once were.

I was comparing myself to my past self.  I definitely meant no offense toward anyone other than myself.

Oh! I didn’t think you were being insulting at all. Just frustrated.

[WestCoastDidds]

And at least for me, that frustration is genuine.

vote: MiX

[MiX]

And at least for me, that frustration is genuine.

vote: MiX

It ain't.

It literally is not genuine.

If you didn't know it by now from his cases, scum!ash AtEs forever and ever.

Not to mention he's the only alive player that wouldn't kill at 7 players alive.

[MiX]

Okay I have an ash-level case on why ash is 100% scum.

He said I was scum, and that he would do options a b or c if I was lynched and flipped town. He also said what he would do if he was lynched and I was scum. But he didn't say what would happen if I was town. This means he knows that if I'm town and he's lynched, the game is over. This can only happen if he's scum. Therefore he is scum.

There I have ascended as a Mafia player.

[scolapasta]

Meh. I never liked the Yuma lynch. that was a mistake.

Waiting to hear from Swan now.

[Swowl]

Or we could have won days ago by listening to me from the beginning.

Yes.

Also the ICs are terrible, sorry for saying that but I've had enough of Swan.

I submitted a kill for Swan yesterday. So I can't be super hidden scum.

Just lynch ash please I'm not even trying to push any mislynches I just knew yuma was a terrible lynch except no one fucking cares about what the 1v1 says.

LYNCH IN THE SCUMREADS AND NOT THE TOWNREADS TOWN.

Thank you and I'm tired of this game.

yes mix I am so sorry I started us off with 2 back to back correct skum finds and could not keep that pattern up.

secondly, your skum reams and your town reads... not "the skumreads" and "the townreads". I was following my skum reads.

and amazing... LL flips
Mix "omg that was a terrible lynch"
then Yuma flips
"omg that was a terrible lynch"


tldr; chill the eff out dude.

[Swowl]

Look, I'll make it easy for all the other town members of this game.

Trust me, lynch MiX.  We win.  If I'm wrong, I promise I wwill do the following:

--vote myself in my first post tomorrow (assuming I'm alive)
--eat a hat
--never play another game of forum mafia ever again

If you lynch me, only the third option is on the table.  Because there's nothing more frustrating than being right for so long, having no one believe you, and then losing to that player.

Is this an ATE?  Absolutely.  Is it because I'm so incredibly frustrated that I am unable to convince anyone of anything anymore, when at one point in the history of f.ds mafia I was one of the absolute best players on the site?  Yes.  Am I conceited and terrible for saying something like that?  I don't think so -- I think many players who were here during those times would say I am making a fair statement.

I feel like one of those very elite athletes who doesn't retired before they aren't the best anymore; or come back from retirement to play even though they aren't as good as they used to be.  It's a terrible feeling, really, and I am pretty sure I made a huge mistake coming back to play mafia at all.  But man it is fun.

I'm sorry.

in what world is the concept of you agreeing to vote yourself tomorrow beneficial to town?
That is just saying your essentially gonna go pout in the corner if you are incorrect. If it is town v town on you and MiX and we follow you and lynch mix... like I get the ATE part... but there is no incentive here - you made a case... you don't need to like "levy it" with additional stuff not related to this game.

[Swowl]

Meh. I never liked the Yuma lynch. that was a mistake.

Waiting to hear from Swan now.

yes well obv mb. However, dylan did their RR and came to literally the exact same conclusion for the exact same reasons I did on Yuma... and I can 100% trust their read to at least be true... so I kind of could not *not* run with that.

[Swowl]

These are gonna be super short - I am incredibly hung over.

I apologize to anyone that shares MiX's mentality about my efforts, but it's not gonna stop... so...here is some stuff...

[MiX]

Or we could have won days ago by listening to me from the beginning.

Yes.

Also the ICs are terrible, sorry for saying that but I've had enough of Swan.

I submitted a kill for Swan yesterday. So I can't be super hidden scum.

Just lynch ash please I'm not even trying to push any mislynches I just knew yuma was a terrible lynch except no one fucking cares about what the 1v1 says.

LYNCH IN THE SCUMREADS AND NOT THE TOWNREADS TOWN.

Thank you and I'm tired of this game.

yes mix I am so sorry I started us off with 2 back to back correct skum finds and could not keep that pattern up.

secondly, your skum reams and your town reads... not "the skumreads" and "the townreads". I was following my skum reads.

and amazing... LL flips
Mix "omg that was a terrible lynch"
then Yuma flips
"omg that was a terrible lynch"


tldr; chill the eff out dude.

and I am not hiding information. I have a thought process leading to an idea. I am hiding the idea. and I am hiding it because it is equally valueless rn as it would be if it never got said, but after today, it could have value.

Yeah well whatever that thought process says you should lynch ash. The fact that Raptor had to save Joseph probably means the other scum was away, which is literally just cayvie in D1.

counter argument.

Vote: Yuma

Good argument. This time I can say I was right before the flip.

and I am not hiding information. I have a thought process leading to an idea. I am hiding the idea. and I am hiding it because it is equally valueless rn as it would be if it never got said, but after today, it could have value.

What was the idea?

Meh. I never liked the Yuma lynch. that was a mistake.

Waiting to hear from Swan now.

yes well obv mb. However, dylan did their RR and came to literally the exact same conclusion for the exact same reasons I did on Yuma... and I can 100% trust their read to at least be true... so I kind of could not *not* run with that.

One of me/ash is town, and we have a scumread on the other one. Also, by "true" you mean "not lying", ash went through this a couple days back. Just because town has a read doesn't mean they're right.

These are gonna be super short - I am incredibly hung over.

I apologize to anyone that shares MiX's mentality about my efforts, but it's not gonna stop... so...here is some stuff...

I think they're a waste of time. You can't vote ash out of VCA because cayvie didn't exist D1.

[scolapasta]

Meh. I never liked the Yuma lynch. that was a mistake.

Waiting to hear from Swan now.

yes well obv mb. However, dylan did their RR and came to literally the exact same conclusion for the exact same reasons I did on Yuma... and I can 100% trust their read to at least be true... so I kind of could not *not* run with that.

But was was your idea? of why we shoud definitely trust you and not lynch mix or ash?

[Swowl]

MiX starts Day 3 (like 3rd total post of the day) with this:

Massclaim, UB says nothing.

I am VT I already softclaimed this anyway. Whoever posts without claiming from now is the same as claiming VT, for obvious reasons.

Dylan and Swan are town. No idea why faust died. Raptor is easily scum, and so is yuma. More thoughts after massclaim.

Kind of a strange play for skum to take there right? Like, assuming mix is skum for this hypothetical... the plan would of been "Raptor you so screwed bro, I am gonna set up the Massclaim, hopefully we can out a PR or two, maybe you somehow even win the flip..." but end all raptor is lynched and Mix is left alone as the final and only skum.

There are two very interesting pieces of information we can look at there:

1) Why the eff would MiX, knowing they would be down to the wire if they were lukcy, get rid of their only potential remaining CC-out? They outright claimed VT. And then re stated it many times in the last few days here. Weird to get rid of your last ditch effort like that if skum.

2) Why say no UB claim? It ain't because MiX is gonna fake claim UB... they gave that out away. Also, if skum was gonna push the case on a mass claim... why put that in. Doesn't make sense.

Then follow all that up with Raptor then snap claims 1-shot doc... which... dumb if the plan was to set up the UB claim (even though that was thrown out right away). And thennnn... Mix sat on raptor all day... which again.. would be weird for the plan to be "let me set you up in a way that we get no information, incriminate no one in any way, and give you literally a 0% chance of not being the lynch."

That is all just one thing I know... but it has been sitting with me for a few days. Hard for me to paint a scenario with that info where mix is skum.


ppe: waste of time my foot. You should be defending yourself better not having me do it for you.

[MiX]

I will defend myself. The fact that I said to massclaim, and precisely how I said it, is completely NAI: town and scum me do this play. I claim VT as either alignment because I either know raptor will, or because I'm actually VT.

Scum!raptor already had the plan to claim 1-shot doctor, what I said publicly changed nothing for scum.

I said no UB claim because that's the town play, regardless of what I am.

I vote raptor because he's the one with the most heat. The only reason scum!raptor claims there is if he wants to be lynched while making it easy for scum to hide, as he had so much heat he was the only viable lynch that day. Me voting him is NAI. My interactions with him, however, are not.

This "analysis" is completely wrong and baseless, and the conclusion is that I'm town(y). Now you tell me why I'm wrong.

[Swowl]

I will defend myself. The fact that I said to massclaim, and precisely how I said it, is completely NAI: town and scum me do this play. I claim VT as either alignment because I either know raptor will, or because I'm actually VT.

Scum!raptor already had the plan to claim 1-shot doctor, what I said publicly changed nothing for scum.

I said no UB claim because that's the town play, regardless of what I am.

I vote raptor because he's the one with the most heat. The only reason scum!raptor claims there is if he wants to be lynched while making it easy for scum to hide, as he had so much heat he was the only viable lynch that day. Me voting him is NAI. My interactions with him, however, are not.

This "analysis" is completely wrong and baseless, and the conclusion is that I'm town(y). Now you tell me why I'm wrong.

because you're wrong?
My finding you towny for adding in something "completely good for town"... makes me lean town.
You getting rid of your only late claim block as VT is not NAI... skum!mix would absolutely of thought that through... makes me lean town...
The fact that if you were in cahoots with raptor there was no reason for you to do any of the above for a bus, you could of just... bussed... that makes me lean town.....

I don't get what you are not "getting" here.

[WestCoastDidds]

Okay, Swan. If MiX is town, who do you want to lynch?

[MiX]

I will defend myself. The fact that I said to massclaim, and precisely how I said it, is completely NAI: town and scum me do this play. I claim VT as either alignment because I either know raptor will, or because I'm actually VT.

Scum!raptor already had the plan to claim 1-shot doctor, what I said publicly changed nothing for scum.

I said no UB claim because that's the town play, regardless of what I am.

I vote raptor because he's the one with the most heat. The only reason scum!raptor claims there is if he wants to be lynched while making it easy for scum to hide, as he had so much heat he was the only viable lynch that day. Me voting him is NAI. My interactions with him, however, are not.

This "analysis" is completely wrong and baseless, and the conclusion is that I'm town(y). Now you tell me why I'm wrong.

because you're wrong?
My finding you towny for adding in something "completely good for town"... makes me lean town.
You getting rid of your only late claim block as VT is not NAI... skum!mix would absolutely of thought that through... makes me lean town...
The fact that if you were in cahoots with raptor there was no reason for you to do any of the above for a bus, you could of just... bussed... that makes me lean town.....

I don't get what you are not "getting" here.

It's just something that I also do as scum. It's mechanical play, going through the motions sort of stuff. It's clear that scum was thinking about claiming, as raptor claimed, which means they were thinking about a massclaim...which means I can easily say that as scum.

I didn't mean to claim not UB that day, which lets me backpedal if I need to. But seriously, at that point scum can't really claim UB, and it's towny to claim VT D4 (as I did) so I would do it as scum as well. Sure, I could keep the option until LyLo, but then I can't self-pres on LL or something. Also I might randomly kill UB or they claim before LyLo and then it's all for nothing.

I could have just bussed, or I could have said "let's massclaim" and then bus. There's nothing stopping scum from doing either. In fact, scum!me would only do this path, as it's the path that looks towniest to me, and I always do the thing that looks towniest to me as scum.

You can say that those actions make me less likely to be scum, but I'm here to say, not really.

PPE: Asking the right questions, love it.

[Swowl]

I will defend myself. The fact that I said to massclaim, and precisely how I said it, is completely NAI: town and scum me do this play. I claim VT as either alignment because I either know raptor will, or because I'm actually VT.

Scum!raptor already had the plan to claim 1-shot doctor, what I said publicly changed nothing for scum.

I said no UB claim because that's the town play, regardless of what I am.

I vote raptor because he's the one with the most heat. The only reason scum!raptor claims there is if he wants to be lynched while making it easy for scum to hide, as he had so much heat he was the only viable lynch that day. Me voting him is NAI. My interactions with him, however, are not.

This "analysis" is completely wrong and baseless, and the conclusion is that I'm town(y). Now you tell me why I'm wrong.

because you're wrong?
My finding you towny for adding in something "completely good for town"... makes me lean town.
You getting rid of your only late claim block as VT is not NAI... skum!mix would absolutely of thought that through... makes me lean town...
The fact that if you were in cahoots with raptor there was no reason for you to do any of the above for a bus, you could of just... bussed... that makes me lean town.....

I don't get what you are not "getting" here.

also, I am just gonna dial it back. That is something that has been bugging me for a bit, so I wanted it typed. You want ash lynched, ash wants you lynched.
Either you are both town and genuinely frustrated, or only one of you is genuine and the other is ATEing the shit out of it.

Because of that, and the fact that I do not know which it is, if that last part came off as snaky, thats mb. Whether you are genuinely frustrated or faking it, either way I should not play into like that. So, sorry about that.

[MiX]

It's fine Swan, it's clear that I'm the one on the offensive. I just wish you didn't do whatever you wanted without consulting the thread. I understand that one of us is scum, but that means any townreads we give are genuine.

I'm just upset you completely ignored me yesterday, and now we're still doing this. I think you should be more open about your agenda. We're all town here! Scum doesn't care who's lynched as long as it's not them. So you should listen to everyone for their reads.

[Dylan32]

The first time I saw someone argue against someone trying to give them towncred, they were scum. It was me, and I rode that all the way to my only MVP and first scum win.  Since then, I don't recall ever seeing anyone other than scum do that unless it was to point out a logical flaw that was messing up other reads beyond just that person.

[Swowl]

I will defend myself. The fact that I said to massclaim, and precisely how I said it, is completely NAI: town and scum me do this play. I claim VT as either alignment because I either know raptor will, or because I'm actually VT.

Scum!raptor already had the plan to claim 1-shot doctor, what I said publicly changed nothing for scum.

I said no UB claim because that's the town play, regardless of what I am.

I vote raptor because he's the one with the most heat. The only reason scum!raptor claims there is if he wants to be lynched while making it easy for scum to hide, as he had so much heat he was the only viable lynch that day. Me voting him is NAI. My interactions with him, however, are not.

This "analysis" is completely wrong and baseless, and the conclusion is that I'm town(y). Now you tell me why I'm wrong.

because you're wrong?
My finding you towny for adding in something "completely good for town"... makes me lean town.
You getting rid of your only late claim block as VT is not NAI... skum!mix would absolutely of thought that through... makes me lean town...
The fact that if you were in cahoots with raptor there was no reason for you to do any of the above for a bus, you could of just... bussed... that makes me lean town.....

I don't get what you are not "getting" here.

It's just something that I also do as scum. It's mechanical play, going through the motions sort of stuff. It's clear that scum was thinking about claiming, as raptor claimed, which means they were thinking about a massclaim...which means I can easily say that as scum.

I didn't mean to claim not UB that day, which lets me backpedal if I need to. But seriously, at that point scum can't really claim UB, and it's towny to claim VT D4 (as I did) so I would do it as scum as well. Sure, I could keep the option until LyLo, but then I can't self-pres on LL or something. Also I might randomly kill UB or they claim before LyLo and then it's all for nothing.

I could have just bussed, or I could have said "let's massclaim" and then bus. There's nothing stopping scum from doing either. In fact, scum!me would only do this path, as it's the path that looks towniest to me, and I always do the thing that looks towniest to me as scum.

You can say that those actions make me less likely to be scum, but I'm here to say, not really.

PPE: Asking the right questions, love it.

I am not you. They are my perceptions of you. I have no way of knowing what you say you would do to be true or not, I have to work with the info I have.

and yes, understood about the "one of us have to be skum" which, and don't take this the wrong way, but because I don't know your alignment, it makes it hard for me to utilize your opinion of anyone at this point. hope that makes sense.

[MiX]

The first time I saw someone argue against someone trying to give them towncred, they were scum. It was me, and I rode that all the way to my only MVP and first scum win.  Since then, I don't recall ever seeing anyone other than scum do that unless it was to point out a logical flaw that was messing up other reads beyond just that person.

Welcome to MiX, please enjoy your stay. I will argue for the truth regardless, for I know that the truth is above all. Only scum would hide in fake towncred.

[Swowl]

Meh. I never liked the Yuma lynch. that was a mistake.

Waiting to hear from Swan now.

yes well obv mb. However, dylan did their RR and came to literally the exact same conclusion for the exact same reasons I did on Yuma... and I can 100% trust their read to at least be true... so I kind of could not *not* run with that.

But was was your idea? of why we shoud definitely trust you and not lynch mix or ash?

Oh you do not have to trust me on anything - I openly admit I am officially frustrated with this game. I am trying best I can, but you can absolutely do you, i am not Teproc or something (I am not gonna sheriff about).

and hold on next part is coming in a sec.

ppe 3-4 something