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[A Drowned Kernel]

ADK, you have me voting twice in that last vote count. I’m on EFHW, currently.

xoxo

Fixed

[Swowl]

Rae - Why did you claim? As in, what benefit did you see it serving claiming after MiX had died?

I didn't see any downside either so why not get some chatter about it?

I guess I just don't get why you claimed it outright without any pressure?

There was no push or reason for you to claim.
It is a weird non-verifiable claim.
And as we have KOd 2 aliens and 1 WW, with this many players alive Mafia is just as concerned with Town PRs as they are with other NK potentials. So by claiming you removed yourself from all the kill potential, while supposedly not having any abilities, yet still must of known that your claim would not bring you anywhere near an IC (or even MIC) status.

So yeah... actually there is a downside, and more importantly... there is just like NO upside.


Can you give us something better than "no downside" here? Chatter can be created by doing a ton of stuff, you attempting to eliminate yourself for the lynch pool is moderately suspicious given the lack of information the chatter could potentially create.

[raerae]

Rae - Why did you claim? As in, what benefit did you see it serving claiming after MiX had died?

I didn't see any downside either so why not get some chatter about it?

I guess I just don't get why you claimed it outright without any pressure?

There was no push or reason for you to claim.
It is a weird non-verifiable claim.
And as we have KOd 2 aliens and 1 WW, with this many players alive Mafia is just as concerned with Town PRs as they are with other NK potentials. So by claiming you removed yourself from all the kill potential, while supposedly not having any abilities, yet still must of known that your claim would not bring you anywhere near an IC (or even MIC) status.

So yeah... actually there is a downside, and more importantly... there is just like NO upside.


Can you give us something better than "no downside" here? Chatter can be created by doing a ton of stuff, you attempting to eliminate yourself for the lynch pool is moderately suspicious given the lack of information the chatter could potentially create.

So, I'm scummy for coming forward at all? If I wait, like you did, I'm scummy but if I just come forward, like I did, I'm also scummy?

[raerae]

And, no, I'm not giving you "something better," you get what you got. If you don't believe me then just vote for me already.

[Swowl]

Rae - Why did you claim? As in, what benefit did you see it serving claiming after MiX had died?

I didn't see any downside either so why not get some chatter about it?

I guess I just don't get why you claimed it outright without any pressure?

There was no push or reason for you to claim.
It is a weird non-verifiable claim.
And as we have KOd 2 aliens and 1 WW, with this many players alive Mafia is just as concerned with Town PRs as they are with other NK potentials. So by claiming you removed yourself from all the kill potential, while supposedly not having any abilities, yet still must of known that your claim would not bring you anywhere near an IC (or even MIC) status.

So yeah... actually there is a downside, and more importantly... there is just like NO upside.


Can you give us something better than "no downside" here? Chatter can be created by doing a ton of stuff, you attempting to eliminate yourself for the lynch pool is moderately suspicious given the lack of information the chatter could potentially create.

So, I'm scummy for coming forward at all? If I wait, like you did, I'm scummy but if I just come forward, like I did, I'm also scummy?

1) I am not voting you right this moment because if I did, my end goal would be to lynch you obviously. And as ridiculous as it is that you claim this in actuality, it is equally ridiculous that you would of just out and claimed this if you were skum. So I am confused. Which is why I asked for a further explanation.

2) I, myself, did not think, and continue to not think, that I was in any way skummy for how I handled my claim of being Vanillaised. Now... that is given most of it was due to a timeline thing, but still my initial standing was to withhold it for at least some period of time, and I would of done so for at least some portion of time even if faust did not claim out as they did.

3) Most importantly - I did not say you are ANYTHING for "coming forward at all". I specifically stated that it was confusing that you chose to divulge the info you did without any need to do so. If divulging said info could potentially help town in some way then I would of left it alone. But it can't. Albeit, it doesn't like necessarily make it skummy either... but as you were not forced into it... I just don't get it.

[mail-mi]

I didn't get very far with the wagons as far as LL goes, but I'm well aware of how lurky he can be these days, having had a hard time finding things to legitimately "townread" him for in our last game.

I did notice that I don't really like Mail-mi's voting pattern, though.

D1: he spent most of the day voting for people who've now flipped town. In particular, at one point he was on a 5-person Joth wagon, where he, Bright and Galz were the only unflipped people involved, and the other two were our flipped Aliens. So I think it's likely he's not an Alien.

D2: he voted Bright for most of the day, before jumping over to the faust wagon for the lynch. That would be consistent with being a faction that wants the aliens gone, especially since he was a vocal supporter of the plan to lynch off claimed scum, without engaging witht he question of whether we definitely want to go after aliens over other factions that have regular NKs.

D3: he voted for me in 3rd place behind LL and Swan, so there's clearly a bit of omgus from me, but also he's clearly wrong. He switched to EFHW at #928.. She didn't have a wagon at all at that point, though it's grown to four people in 30 posts, which is pretty quick. So maybe he's in a scum faction who're afraid of EFHW for some reason and trying to make a push?

I think I like Vote: Mail-mi more than the current wagon options.

Flagging this to respond to it later

Voting: D1: Everyone was on the joth/sudgy wagon train that day, I'm not the only one to single out there.

D2: I originally was going along MiX's line of thinking that "we should kill scum who can kill us" but then figured that scum (hopefully) will start to do the killing for us so I switched to the claimed scum.

D3: I am voting for EFHW for my own reasons but they're not scum reasons.

[LaLight]

Do you have a result of some sorts?

[LaLight]

Any result would be awesome to kickstart the conversation and go away from no Lynch

[WestCoastDidds]

So I don’t forget....

Deadline is 1:00 forum time on Friday morning. That’s the night of Thanksgiving for US folks.

[Eevee]

Vote: Swan

[WestCoastDidds]

Good morning, Eevee! Why are you feeling Swan today?

[Eevee]

Admittedly it has more to do with my shock about not being voting right now, but I think raerae is coming off townier from their exchange.

Despite my terrible post count, I've been reading along and I'll try to help us get a lynch through. You'd think that tomorrow we'd start to get some conflicting claims flying and lynching scum should get easier for us, so I'm not feeling so terrible about a no lynch though.

I think the game is too big and the factions are too multiple for wagon analysis or really reading of any kind. I'm just trying to not have the players I find towny lynched, and wait for the field clear a bit and the night actions starting to emerge so the picture becomes a little less murky. If we are not endgamed before that.

[Joseph2302]

So I don’t forget....

Deadline is 1:00 forum time on Friday morning. That’s the night of Thanksgiving for US folks.

I won't be up for deadline. My last availability will be about 7pm forum time on Thursday

[EFHW]

Admittedly it has more to do with my shock about not being voting right now, but I think raerae is coming off townier from their exchange.

Despite my terrible post count, I've been reading along and I'll try to help us get a lynch through. You'd think that tomorrow we'd start to get some conflicting claims flying and lynching scum should get easier for us, so I'm not feeling so terrible about a no lynch though.

I think the game is too big and the factions are too multiple for wagon analysis or really reading of any kind. I'm just trying to not have the players I find towny lynched, and wait for the field clear a bit and the night actions starting to emerge so the picture becomes a little less murky. If we are not endgamed before that.

Same

[Joseph2302]

Admittedly it has more to do with my shock about not being voting right now, but I think raerae is coming off townier from their exchange.

Despite my terrible post count, I've been reading along and I'll try to help us get a lynch through. You'd think that tomorrow we'd start to get some conflicting claims flying and lynching scum should get easier for us, so I'm not feeling so terrible about a no lynch though.

I think the game is too big and the factions are too multiple for wagon analysis or really reading of any kind. I'm just trying to not have the players I find towny lynched, and wait for the field clear a bit and the night actions starting to emerge so the picture becomes a little less murky. If we are not endgamed before that.

Same here. Although I am finding most people somewhat scummy right now

[EFHW]

We don't have to wait for Friday. vote: No Lynch

[Joseph2302]

We don't have to wait for Friday. vote: No Lynch

No lynch is no information though?

[EFHW]

We don't have to wait for Friday. vote: No Lynch

No lynch is no information though?

I know, but I'm bored!

[Joseph2302]

We don't have to wait for Friday. vote: No Lynch

No lynch is no information though?

I know, but I'm bored!

Vote: EFHW
I find no lynch scummy, just wanted to see if you'd have a non scummy justification for wanting it

[Uncleeurope]

Vote: Joseph

[raerae]

We don't have to wait for Friday. vote: No Lynch

No lynch is no information though?

I know, but I'm bored!

Vote Bright with me!!

[EFHW]

We don't have to wait for Friday. vote: No Lynch

No lynch is no information though?

I know, but I'm bored!

Vote Bright with me!!

I don't think he's scum, though. He's almost single-handedly keeping the game going!

[shraeye]

Players with Flips:

Awaclus discarded Vengeful Townie – Cop of all Trades
jotheonah discarded Mason – Town Day Vig
Glooble discarded Mason Lover – Alpha Werewolf
pingpongsam discarded One-Shot Unlynchable Townie – Town Doctor
sudgy discarded Werewolf – Town Conspiracy Theorist
Archetype discarded Mafia Reflexive Doctor – Town Mason Doctor
faust discarded Werewolf Miller – Alien Sympathizer

MiX discarded Lynchbait -  Alien Vanillaiser
E discarded Retired werewolf hunter - Jack of all Trades

What we are Assuming/Been Told to Assume:

Galzria discarded Bodyguard – Investigative Role

Brightgalrs discarded Wrong Place at the Wrong Time Townie – 1 Shot Vig

DatSwan discarded Nurse – Turned Vanilla Night 1 - I chose 1-Shot Kingmaker. I did not use my shot Night 1.

Skum to Chum Discard List:

SpaceAnemone discarded Innocent Child - So this is skummy. Not saying it isn't. But also, as it is exactly Space, I could see them discarding IC for a good investigative role, or even like Tracker. That seems like a very "Space-y" choice in roles imo.

EFHW discarded Alien One-Shot Unlynchable - This one just sticks out for me. There is a town unlychable role that is potentially present in the game, so if they had to use it, they even would have an out. This is the type of throw away I could see for any sort of other skum role, mainly for the image it would give of throwing away a solid skum role already. I suppose my thought process would be something like "I assume the Mafia faction will have more players than the Alien faction, so I will throw away this Alien role for a Mafia role for a better chance to win". Or whatever, obviously I suppose it could also be just so they could play for Team Town.

shraeye discarded Compulsive Childkiller - I personally think that this role has the potential for a HUGE amount of positive utility. Also, that utility is dependent upon someone NOT throwing away IC (which, while it did happen, could not realistically be expected to happen). Shraeye is smart, so I doubt they did not also consider this same utility. This is a sore thumb for me. I do not know if I could of taken most cop roles over this is given the choice.

pubby discarded Conspiracy Theorist - Pubby is the second time that Conspiracy Theorist popped up (which if I understand correctly, means there can be no more of them?). There is a gap between the previous two players and Pubby for me, based on the same logic that I threw Nurse away (I had no way of knowing if there was going to be a town doc, and even if there were, no idea if I would be alive after they were). It is the same for pubby and Aliens - they had no way of knowing if Aliens would be in the game. Obviously, they could of tossed it for a stronger town PR. That being said I would of totally tossed this role for essentially any sort of skum role as well. 

Uncleeurope discarded Mafia Goon - Passing up Mafia just seems not fun to me, which makes me suspicious. Not a lot suspicious, just more than like the VT comparison.

Eevee discarded Vanilla Townie - Could be anything, it's VT.

Raerae discarded Vanilla Townie - Could be anything, it's VT.

Joseph2302 discarded Vanilla Townie - Could be anything, it's VT.

mail-mi discarded Hirsute Townie - VT but worse. Could be anything.

WestCoastDidds discarded Underdog - Kind of nothing worse than being solo survivor role in a game like this.

LaLight discarded Lyncher - I can't imagine anyone taking this role.

[raerae]

We don't have to wait for Friday. vote: No Lynch

No lynch is no information though?

I know, but I'm bored!

Vote Bright with me!!

I don't think he's scum, though. He's almost single-handedly keeping the game going!

That is not a town trait. What do you make of him coming after both DatSwan and I for the simple fact of being vanilla?

[shraeye]

Found this; thanks DatSwan.  Wanted to repost it to get more eyes on it.

Bright, what are your thoughts on DatSwan's discard vs. pick decision?

And have we given up on wondering why Space discarded IC??