Dominion Strategy Forum

Dominion => Dominion General Discussion => Topic started by: werothegreat on May 07, 2015, 10:44:25 pm

Title: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: werothegreat on May 07, 2015, 10:44:25 pm

Took the bottom 2 in the Qvist rankings of $2-$5, and the bottom $6 and P cards.

What would you do in this kingdom?

(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/2/22/Transmute.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Transmute) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/d/df/Duchess.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Duchess) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/b/b3/Secret_Chamber.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Secret_Chamber) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/b/b7/Chancellor.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Chancellor) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/d/d6/Woodcutter.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Woodcutter)
(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/f/f5/Thief.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Thief) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/4/46/Scout.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Scout) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/1/1c/Harvest.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Harvest) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/5/5d/Counting_House.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Counting_House) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/7/71/Adventurer.jpg) (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/Adventurer)

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: nate_w on May 07, 2015, 10:46:18 pm

Chancellor big money?

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: XerxesPraelor on May 07, 2015, 11:07:43 pm

Thief is OK versus Big Money - the main question is Thief vs Chancellor, I think.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: c4master on May 08, 2015, 03:20:14 am

I would do something like Chancellor-BM with maybe 1-2 Harvests at exactly $5. Maybe even Secret Chamber at exactly $2. You could try to slog around with it. Maybe.

It would really be a boring board.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: tailred on May 08, 2015, 03:23:49 am

Clearly the answer is it rush duchies with transmute support, piling transmute/duchy/duchess.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Eevee on May 08, 2015, 03:31:40 am

Thief is atrocious here. Open chancellor-silver, get an opportune harvest at 5 or don't, then just yellow yellow and eventually green.

The board is actually sort of amusing as far as big money boards go.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Titandrake on May 08, 2015, 03:35:20 am

There's no bravery here.

Chancellor/Silver, get Woodcutter the first or second $3 after it, get Counting House on the first $5 you get. Pick up extra Coppers with Woodcutter as you see fit. Balance Chancellor/Counting House appropriately, but don't overbuy either. Win in style or lose in style.

Edit: After thinking about it a bit more - ideally buy your first and only Woodcutter the shuffle you get Counting House, then 1 more Chancellor ~2 shuffles after that, and then you're probably good on terminals.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: pubby on May 08, 2015, 04:30:11 am

Quote from: c4master on May 08, 2015, 03:20:14 am

I would do something like Chancellor-BM with maybe 1-2 Harvests at exactly $5. Maybe even Secret Chamber at exactly $2. You could try to slog around with it. Maybe.

It would really be a boring board.

Harvest seems like the best card here. I would buy 2 and then consider buying a duchy+duchess or a scout to increase my Harvest chances.

Counting house looks bad relative to Harvest and Chancellor.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Zappie on May 08, 2015, 07:49:24 am

the last two post:
what is the idea behind a woodcutter, the +buy is better than the shuffle effect of chancellor?
and what is the idea of the scout (foregoing silver)?

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Awaclus on May 08, 2015, 08:16:41 am

Quote from: Zappie on May 08, 2015, 07:49:24 am

the last two post:
what is the idea behind a woodcutter, the +buy is better than the shuffle effect of chancellor?
and what is the idea of the scout (foregoing silver)?

The idea is that you get more Coppers for Counting House to draw. I don't think it's a good idea.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Co0kieL0rd on May 08, 2015, 08:29:12 am

Wow, 3 or 4 different strategies suggested so far. Who would have guessed? I'm so out of practice, I honestly have no idea which one is the best BM enabler here. Maybe Harvest? The Transmute/Duchy/Duchess thing seems cute and may be fast enough but I'm not sure. Thief is very bad, if for no other reason than Secret Chamber being there.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Robz888 on May 08, 2015, 10:44:12 am

What Eevee said: Just play Chancellor BM and consider Harvest on exactly $5. Secret Chamber is maybe okay on an unlucky $2 hand, or if your opponent stupidly goes for Thief.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: swedenman on May 08, 2015, 02:45:04 pm

So is Thief ever actually good without KC or something? I guess in Feodum mirrors.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: AJD on May 08, 2015, 04:43:16 pm

Quote from: swedenman on May 08, 2015, 02:45:04 pm

So is Thief ever actually good without KC or something? I guess in Feodum mirrors.

It's good against Fool's Gold / Spice Merchant decks. And it's likely good Gardens support in 4-player games.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: popsofctown on May 11, 2015, 08:20:56 pm

I feel pretty sure Chancellor is wrong here.  You want to open Silver/Silver.  You don't want to have to pass up any Harvests because you bought a Chancellor.  You also don't want to pass up any free Duchessess because you have too many terminals.  You can buy Silvers early and get Duchesses for free later, can't buy terminal Silvers now and get nonterminal silver for free later.

Chancellor's value will be diminished when both players want to get Duchies earlier than usual for Harvest variety and free Duchesses.  You don't want to put your deck into your discard and draw your Duchies faster.  And heck Harvest is half a Chancellor anyway during the positive cycling period.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: liopoil on May 11, 2015, 08:31:43 pm

Quote from: popsofctown on May 11, 2015, 08:20:56 pm

I feel pretty sure Chancellor is wrong here.  You want to open Silver/Silver.  You don't want to have to pass up any Harvests because you bought a Chancellor.  You also don't want to pass up any free Duchessess because you have too many terminals.  You can buy Silvers early and get Duchesses for free later, can't buy terminal Silvers now and get nonterminal silver for free later.

Chancellor's value will be diminished when both players want to get Duchies earlier than usual for Harvest variety and free Duchesses.  You don't want to put your deck into your discard and draw your Duchies faster.  And heck Harvest is half a Chancellor anyway during the positive cycling period.

No no no chancellor/silver all the way. I'm not getting two harvests, and I'm not getting just one terminal either. A chancellor and a harvest is perfectly fine. I don't care about duchess at all. Chancellor is really significantly better than silver for the first couple shuffles.

This board needs shelters.

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Elanchana on May 11, 2015, 09:25:18 pm

Adam and I already played this board, except with Farmland instead of Transmute. It was um... painfully entertaining (http://www.twitch.tv/elatalkstoherself/c/5775682).

Title: Re: The Worst Kingdom Ever
Post by: Nevermind on May 11, 2015, 09:33:33 pm

Well, they can't all be the best kingdom forever.