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[Voltgloss]

Vote: Voltaire

[Voltaire]

Vote: Voltaire

?

[Galzria]

This was the peak of the EFHW wagon. She was tied with our eventual lynch, mcmc. I've colored our flips.

Vote Count 1.33:

liopoil (7): Robz888, shraeye, AHoppy, Dsell, faust, sudgy, Galzria
nkirbit (1): bocaJ
sudgy (1): Eevee
mcmc (5): EFHW, Walrus, mail-mi, Archetype, chairs
chairs (1): nkirbit
EFHW (5): Voltgloss, Voltiare, mcmcsaolot, liopoil, Twistedarcher

Not Voting (0):

With 20 alive, it takes 11 to lynch.

Day 1 ends on September 23 at 9:22 p.m.

OneHalf hour to deadline.

And again, I've got a town read on EFHW.

I do not believe mcmc's lynch was scum free.

I do not believe that all 5 on EFHW's wagon are town that switched from one town to another (well, 4, discounting mcmc himself).

Voltgloss is town.

That leaves you, TA and liopoil.

[Voltaire]

Galz, can you please direct me to your Dsell read.

[Voltaire]

And again, I've got a town read on EFHW.

I do not believe mcmc's lynch was scum free.

I do not believe that all 5 on EFHW's wagon are town that switched from one town to another (well, 4, discounting mcmc himself).

Voltgloss is town.

That leaves you, TA and liopoil.

This is not unreasonable. It does however rely on the assumption that EFHW is town, which is why I am not ok going along with it.

[Galzria]

Voltgloss has done some things well, and he's done some things terribly. I'll be happy to discuss where his mistakes were after the game.

Love you too, Galz.  :p

Man, I typed this response flippantly but the more I think about it the more this comment makes me legit angry.  Like, unrelated-to-alignments and unrelated-to-the-game angry.  Just angry.  Like yuma-spiritbears angry.

I'll be back Monday.  No, this doesn't mean Galz is scum.  It does mean he's making me not want to play.

Volt, I didn't mean it as a personal attack on you. I just think that I've tried very hard to give you advice on MANY occasions, and I've felt rather ignored. D1 I felt like you were incredibly blind to people that sheeped you and it was incredibly frustrating because it felt like you were dismissing good evidence based on the fact that these same people gave you warm fuzzy feelings.

The fact that you tried to blame me for the results at the end of the day didn't help.

[Robz888]

Vote: Voltaire

I'm just voting for whichever lynch is most likely at all times between Voltaire and Eevee.

[Galzria]

Galz, can you please direct me to your Dsell read.

Can you direct me to your case on AHoppy from before post #350 in this game? Or any of the players you "got town vibes from"?

He's made a lot of sense to me this game. I've agreed with many, if not most, of his points. Further, the people that have consistently found him scummy are people that I myself have scum reads on. The combination of those two leave me unwilling to vote for him at this time.

[Voltgloss]

Volt, I didn't mean it as a personal attack on you. I just think that I've tried very hard to give you advice on MANY occasions, and I've felt rather ignored. D1 I felt like you were incredibly blind to people that sheeped you and it was incredibly frustrating because it felt like you were dismissing good evidence based on the fact that these same people gave you warm fuzzy feelings.

The fact that you tried to blame me for the results at the end of the day didn't help.

Galz:

I DO NOT KNOW YOUR ALIGNMENT

[Voltaire]

Voltgloss has done some things well, and he's done some things terribly. I'll be happy to discuss where his mistakes were after the game.

Love you too, Galz.  :p

Man, I typed this response flippantly but the more I think about it the more this comment makes me legit angry.  Like, unrelated-to-alignments and unrelated-to-the-game angry.  Just angry.  Like yuma-spiritbears angry.

I'll be back Monday.  No, this doesn't mean Galz is scum.  It does mean he's making me not want to play.

Join the club.

Vote: Voltaire

Voltgloss, my comment above was not directed at you. It was a very poorly expressed expression of support for you about Galzria's comments on your play quality. I am very frustrated with Galzria, and trying hard to separate what could be a player of unknown alignment in a game and what is personal. I felt Galz putting a fake quote from me in actual quotes crossed a "fair play" line and legitimately upset me, outside of the game. Hence my "Join the club" statement, which I regretted pretty much right after I posted it.

Galz, again, I think we have the same goal in this game and I am trying very hard to work with you. I do not claim to be doing a very good job of it unfortunately.

[Robz888]

Hey guys, everybody take a deep breath and chill. No escalation!

[Voltaire]

Galz, can you please direct me to your Dsell read.

Can you direct me to your case on AHoppy from before post #350 in this game? Or any of the players you "got town vibes from"?

He's made a lot of sense to me this game. I've agreed with many, if not most, of his points. Further, the people that have consistently found him scummy are people that I myself have scum reads on. The combination of those two leave me unwilling to vote for him at this time.

So you...don't have one? Thank you, at least, for expressing one in this post.

[Galzria]

Volt, I didn't mean it as a personal attack on you. I just think that I've tried very hard to give you advice on MANY occasions, and I've felt rather ignored. D1 I felt like you were incredibly blind to people that sheeped you and it was incredibly frustrating because it felt like you were dismissing good evidence based on the fact that these same people gave you warm fuzzy feelings.

The fact that you tried to blame me for the results at the end of the day didn't help.

Galz:

I DO NOT KNOW YOUR ALIGNMENT

You don't know the alignment of any of the people who have been sheeping you either.

[Voltaire]

You don't know the alignment of any of the people who have been sheeping you either.

Shraeye also made this case against me. So if you are town, this case is a null tell at best.

[Galzria]

Hey guys, everybody take a deep breath and chill. No escalation!

I agree. I'm not at all overly frustrated right now, but I get that Voltgloss is. I worded something that came across as personal to him, and I didn't mean it that way. He's done things as he see's best and fit. In some instances I've agreed with him. In others I have not. I'm not saying he's bad because he's done things I disagree with. The word "terribly" was the wrong one to use. I just think he's made mistakes this game. While he doesn't know my alignment (and thus don't expect him to take everything I say as gospel), I have at times felt like he's dismissed orignored the things I've said because I haven't supported him like others have at all times. And I think this has hurt town.

[Galzria]

You don't know the alignment of any of the people who have been sheeping you either.

Shraeye also made this case against me. So if you are town, this case is a null tell at best.

This wasn't supposed to be a "case".

[Voltgloss]

I was typing angry, and curse words were involved, and it felt cathartic, and then I deleted it all.

Galz:  can you please accept that I am aware of people sheeping me, and if I agree with something a sheeper is saying, it is NOT because they are sheeping me, but because I genuinely think it's correct or likely correct?  I could be wrong, yes, but please don't accuse me of playing "terribly" and lynching independent thought. 

And if you think I "blamed" you specifically for the end of Day 1 lynch:  I do not, and I apologize if you got that idea.  I was angry that you seemed to say "nah I won't help" by refusing all viable lynch candidates and voting ahoppy with ~15 minutes to go.  If you'd done that with 30 minutes to go, it'd be a different story.  But there was just.  No.  Time.

But that doesn't mean I "blame" you for the lynch.

Unless you're scum, in which case I fucking blame you for everything that's gone wrong this whole fucking game, because fuck, you're scum and deserve it. 

[Jorbles]

Why is everyone so mad?  Don't answer that, it happens sometimes. I find it frustrating that people get so emotional, but there's little I can do about it.

Anyhow I'm at a point where I am starting to develop some reads. They are shallow at this point. More of a could-lynch than a I am convinced of anything feel, anyhow here's some thoughts.

On people's claims:
People who have claimed and are still alive are (to the best of my recollection) are sudgy (now useless doctor), Galzria (scum enabler), chairs (seminaive cop), Eevee (survivor).
-I tend to believe Galzria and chairs. I'm not sure about sudgy, still holding judgement there.

Survivor is actually a pretty good claim for scum. He has a reason to still be alive late game. Scum wouldn't kill off a Survivor because they can win with him. Therefore it's a relatively safe claim to make. I don't specifically disbelieve Eevee, but there's a decent chance that he's lying, and if he's not we might actually be saving ourselves from some trouble downtheline in a situation where it's beneficial for Eevee to switch sides.

For now I am willing to lynch Eevee, I probably will be for the rest of the game.

Vote: Eevee

[Robz888]

Hey Voltaire: If we leave you alive one more night, will you shoot Eevee for us?

[Galzria]

I was typing angry, and curse words were involved, and it felt cathartic, and then I deleted it all.

Galz:  can you please accept that I am aware of people sheeping me, and if I agree with something a sheeper is saying, it is NOT because they are sheeping me, but because I genuinely think it's correct or likely correct?  I could be wrong, yes, but please don't accuse me of playing "terribly" and lynching independent thought. 

And if you think I "blamed" you specifically for the end of Day 1 lynch:  I do not, and I apologize if you got that idea.  I was angry that you seemed to say "nah I won't help" by refusing all viable lynch candidates and voting ahoppy with ~15 minutes to go.  If you'd done that with 30 minutes to go, it'd be a different story.  But there was just.  No.  Time.

But that doesn't mean I "blame" you for the lynch.

Unless you're scum, in which case I fucking blame you for everything that's gone wrong this whole fucking game, because fuck, you're scum and deserve it. 

It was the accusation over AHoppy at the time - because I WAS on liopoil prior to that, and was responding in the moment to the question about EFHW, going with "If you like her lynch, then you should like AHoppy's (based on the criteria you're saying is important). Here, let's do AHoppy, we've got time". Once it became clear that wasn't happening, I WENT BACK to liopoil - and it was after THAT when I felt "blamed".

Still, that aside (as I think Voltaire was protecting AHoppy for reasons he still has not bothered to explain), I don't even feel his lynch failure was your fault. I think it's telling who was and wasn't even willing to consider it, but those are minor points really.

The biggest issue I've had is your first point above. And while what you say may very well be true (well, I think it probably is), that doesn't change the fact that I see many of those same things as wrong or unreasonable, and that puts me at odds with your beliefs if you see them as reasonable points. You may agree with them. I still think they're wrong.

And sure, if I flipped scum down the line, you can bitch me out all you want. But I won't.

[Voltgloss]

OK, serious question time.

This was the peak of the EFHW wagon. She was tied with our eventual lynch, mcmc. I've colored our flips.

Vote Count 1.33:

liopoil (7): Robz888, shraeye, AHoppy, Dsell, faust, sudgy, Galzria
nkirbit (1): bocaJ
sudgy (1): Eevee
mcmc (5): EFHW, Walrus, mail-mi, Archetype, chairs
chairs (1): nkirbit
EFHW (5): Voltgloss, Voltiare, mcmcsaolot, liopoil, Twistedarcher

Not Voting (0):

With 20 alive, it takes 11 to lynch.

Day 1 ends on September 23 at 9:22 p.m.

OneHalf hour to deadline.

And again, I've got a town read on EFHW.

I do not believe mcmc's lynch was scum free.

I do not believe that all 5 on EFHW's wagon are town that switched from one town to another (well, 4, discounting mcmc himself).

Voltgloss is town.

That leaves you, TA and liopoil.

Galz: 

I understand your townread on EFHW.  I agree there was likely scum on mcmc's wagon.

Here's where I need help following your reasoning:

Put yourself in the shoes of scum on mcmc's wagon.  The IC, one of the people on that wagon, suddenly starts a new wagon on another person.  Assume for the sake of argument that the target of that wagon (EFHW) is also town.

Do you switch?  If so, why?

Now, flip it around.  Put yourself in the shoes of scum on liopoil's wagon.  The IC, one of the people on the competing wagon, suddenly starts a new wagon on another person.  Assume for the sake of argument that the target of both that wagon (EFHW) and the wagon you're on (liopoil/Jorbles) is town.

Do you switch?  If so, why?

[yuma]

Vote Count 2.4:

Walrus (3): Archetype, AHoppy, faust
Eevee (2): EFHW, Jorbles
TA (1): Galz
Dsell (2): Voltaire, Robz
Voltaire (1): Voltgloss

Not Voting (7): Eevee,  chairs, Twistedarcher, sudgy, WalrusMcFishSr, Dsell, bocaJ, mail-mi

With 17 alive, it takes 9 to lynch.

Please note, Jorbles replaced liopoil.

Day 2 ends on October 6th at 9:30 p.m.


Will Dede be at Haley's Party?

Invite Dede (6): Twistedarcher, Archetype, bocaJ, sudgy, chairs, Jorbles
Not Invite Dede (2): Walrus, AHoppy

Not Voting (9): Eevee, Robz888, Voltgloss, mail-mi, Galzria, Voltaire, EFHW, Dsell, Faust

[Voltgloss]

Also:  Remember I also proposed Archetype as a possible lynch.  Similar to your proposing ahoppy, almost nobody responded to that (the only one I remember is Robz).  Do you draw the same conclusions vis-a-vis Archetype as you do vis-a-vis ahoppy?  If not, what is different?

[Voltaire]

Voltgloss, is your vote on me serious? Or was it an in-the-moment thing?

[Galzria]

Also:  Remember I also proposed Archetype as a possible lynch.  Similar to your proposing ahoppy, almost nobody responded to that (the only one I remember is Robz).  Do you draw the same conclusions vis-a-vis Archetype as you do vis-a-vis ahoppy?  If not, what is different?

I just started work. I'll have a break between class in an hour and a half.