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[sudgy]

Sudgy you say this is the same wagon he gets every game, but it seems decidingly not.  You're called out for specifically acting unusual.

Half of it is that, and half was "he seems overly cautious".  The second is what I always am, and I always have a slightly different playstyle depending on factors such as availability.

[Robz888]

Caught up--sort of? I skimmed--and I don't know. Probably, I like a sudgy lynch better than chairs lynch. Vote: sudgy

[sudgy]

Caught up--sort of? I skimmed--and I don't know. Probably, I like a sudgy lynch better than chairs lynch. Vote: sudgy

It doesn't have to be me or chairs, we still have some time left.  Why do you like my lynch, and why do you not like chairs'?

[scott_pilgrim]

Right now I think I'm at:

100% town: Eevee, scott_pilgrim
Moderate town: azadin
Slight town: sudgy
Null: WW, ADK, faust, chairs, mcmc
Slight scum: ashersky, Robz, EgorK

So I'm happy with my vote on EgorK, I think he is the best lynch.  Lynching someone who's null isn't bad here though, and I would probably even vote sudgy to get a lynch through, but I prefer chairs (but not going to hammer now since we still have time).

[Robz888]

Right now I think I'm at:

100% town: Eevee, scott_pilgrim
Moderate town: azadin
Slight town: sudgy
Null: WW, ADK, faust, chairs, mcmc
Slight scum: ashersky, Robz, EgorK

So I'm happy with my vote on EgorK, I think he is the best lynch.  Lynching someone who's null isn't bad here though, and I would probably even vote sudgy to get a lynch through, but I prefer chairs (but not going to hammer now since we still have time).

I don't feel like this can honestly be based on anything, this early.

[scott_pilgrim]

Right now I think I'm at:

100% town: Eevee, scott_pilgrim
Moderate town: azadin
Slight town: sudgy
Null: WW, ADK, faust, chairs, mcmc
Slight scum: ashersky, Robz, EgorK

So I'm happy with my vote on EgorK, I think he is the best lynch.  Lynching someone who's null isn't bad here though, and I would probably even vote sudgy to get a lynch through, but I prefer chairs (but not going to hammer now since we still have time).

I don't feel like this can honestly be based on anything, this early.

It's based on my reads up to this point.  Obviously I'm aware it's D1 and they're not going to be very accurate, which is why everyone (except azadin) is in the slight town-slight scum range (and mostly null).

[EgorK]

Caught up--sort of? I skimmed--and I don't know. Probably, I like a sudgy lynch better than chairs lynch. Vote: sudgy

I find this change on L-1 kinda fishy. It could be scum partner thinking "crap, they can lynch him". I'm happy with where my vote is and if chairs would flip scum Robz would be on top of my scum list

PPE: 1

[Eevee]

Right now I think I'm at:

100% town: Eevee, scott_pilgrim
Moderate town: azadin
Slight town: sudgy
Null: WW, ADK, faust, chairs, mcmc
Slight scum: ashersky, Robz, EgorK

So I'm happy with my vote on EgorK, I think he is the best lynch.  Lynching someone who's null isn't bad here though, and I would probably even vote sudgy to get a lynch through, but I prefer chairs (but not going to hammer now since we still have time).

If you want to leave your vote at egor (which in itself is actually great), you should make much much more or an effort to get others to join. This just reads as "you may mislynch either of sudgy or chairs, I'm staying out of it and keeping my hands clean". This is actually so scummy that I'm tempted to switch my vote to you, but I'd like to reread you first and I can't do it now. I encourage others to do it and consider you though.

[scott_pilgrim]

Well, I already gave my case for EgorK (which wasn't amazing, but I think it's a lot better than the cases on sudgy and chairs), and I guess I assumed by saying "I'm leaving my vote there for now" it was implied that "I would really like others to join me", because obviously I can't lynch him by myself.

[Witherweaver]

Interesting:

Hehe I don't know what makes me happier that ash brought back mom salon or that teproc has no idea it's me.

On helpful news, I agree with robz and ash and like that Yuma is ic, do not want to lynch there, two newbies Azadin and egork, barring super scummyness don't want to lynch there.

Faust, Adk, ww, chairs, scott, sudgy

Scott and ww both posted helpful stuff that I agreed with

Adk's over cautiousness is scummy(robz mentioned). Adk what was your reason for the blitz wagon?

Faust, Scott already said wha you said in your post, did you miss it or feel like saying it anyway because you can't figure anything else out to post you scummy scum scum(that got out of hand)

Sudgy why the change to ww, the Scott vote seemed random enough, so a quick random change makes no sense.

Hi chairs!

And:

Fixed

Adk what was your reason for the blitz wagon?

I felt like it.

If this is all you can give me I am asserting intent to L-1 once Yuma has at least confirmed he has read everything and he doesn't scream no

I mean I'm not suggesting you have to have had a master plan, but you gotta be able to give me what went through your head, no one makes a post with zero though or because they felt like it.

Calls overcaution scummy and then acts overcautiously.  Does this make sense as scum?  Usually when scum tries to push a mislynch they have their reasoning/argument pretty well in mind.. at least I do.. I definitely notice if I'm about to do something that I'm using to call someone else scummy and stop myself from doing so.  So, this gives me a town impression on McMc.

[Witherweaver]

I saw ADK's blitz wagon as RVS.  I jumped on for fun, then jumped to WW as part of RVS as well, so yeah.

Vote: EgorK for bringing ADK to L-2.  He didn't even really give a reason.  I've also never really liked "Are we out of RVS yet?" posts.

This doesn't make all that much sense.  How often does scum just bring someone to L-2 without a reason? 

(I feel like someone might have brought this up already, but I'm rereading and posting thoughts as I see them.)

[Witherweaver]

I will probably lurk for at least a little bit, mostly because I really have no idea what sorts of things to say or do.

Though I've gone through some of the wiki that ADK posted to me earlier (Thanks, by the way!) and in the first post of the thread, so hopefully it won't take long for me to start catching on to some scummy tells!

In the meantime, I also jumped on the ADK wagon as more of a joke, but will Unvote for now until I can get a better feel for what's going on.

Everyone kind of let this one go after responding with "no don't lurk"... weird that this was the first time anyone brought up lurking.  Have you played forum mafia or those games before, Azadin? 

When has someone ever announced the intent to do something distinctly anti-town/scummy?

[Witherweaver]

Chairs serious vote followed by an unserious vote is very unsettling. Do you still think Azadin is scummy?

I'm not sure I follow.

I think azadin's "I'm going to lurk" was, in fact, scummy.

Also I think I follow now, just realized I'd voted WW for smiley face.  Obviously that wasn't terribly serious 

That said, I'll say azadin has clearly decided to take my suggestion not to lurk to heart, and so I'll go back to vote: A Drowned Kernel because I still think the "let's blitz lynch" statement was scummy, even though he's kind of backed off of that a little.

What's scummy about it, though? A blitz wagon, even if it fails, gets the game going at least.

I think a request for a blitz wagon gives scum a lot of incentive to hop on early and see if you can get town to derphammer somebody.

I have a very hard time seeing this as a possible scenario.  Looks like another case of someone trying to act very cautious. 

[Witherweaver]

I explained earlier why I thought ADK's blitz wagon was scummy, but the more I've thought about it the more I think it's null.  I think there's good enough reason to do it as town or scum, that it's hard to conclude anything from it.

I think mcmc is slightly scummy.  Faust pointed out an inconsistency he had, but also I think "wait for the IC to tell me what I'm doing is okay" is a really scummy approach, and he had said something to that effect earlier.  I understand why town would be tempted to say that, because you feel like you can trust the IC, but it makes taking that approach makes it very easy for scum to hide behind known town.



I'll probably be gone all day tomorrow (Tues) and Thursday as well but I will be here and post on Wednesday.

This was my reason for voting Scott in the first place.. it still strikes me as scummy. 

[Witherweaver]

Would vote for Scott if that was going through, pretty even on terms of scummyness with chairs in my eyes.

Faust we never agree on anything. My post just make no sense as ww pointed out they never do.

I was simply saying the effects of starting a blitz wagon is anti town, once it is started since it is unlikely to go through whether you support the blitz wagon or not is irrelevant in terms if alignment.

Also want to note Adk is not even in my top two potential scum at this point this was just my reasoning for finding him scummy at the onset, scummier things have happened.

Lastly anyone voting me for "waiting for the ic to tell me what to do" is bs. There is a difference between waiting for him to tell me what to do and saying I find someone scummy and would normally vote them but I don't want to put someone to L-1 this early when our ic hasn't even had time to read. That logical not scummy.

Well this is a good point about not moving the game along too fast when the IC hasn't had time to read.. but.. would putting someone to L-1 that quickly be good anyway?  Would you have done it with no IC?

[Witherweaver]

Okay, re-read.  Basically we've had:

1.  ADK's quick lynch plan.  He started it on SP.
2.  No theory talk please.
3.  Some odd mcmc thing.
4.  My point on chairs.
5.  Dead zone.

So, my thoughts are...if ADK is scum, so is SP.  Otherwise, ADK is town and SP is unknown.  I say this because, if ADK's thing was a scum ploy, he's definitely going to try to run it up on scum.  It's basically f.ds meta that if you can get a scum buddy close to lynch on D1, they'll survive until like D4.  I think it is most likely just a town joke that went a bit wild.

Still no theory talk please.

I don't get the mcmc thing.  He's getting a pass from me today, as he's been more active than others.  I think we'll end up on a lurker lynch today (for better or worse).


My case on chairs.  See next post.

Dead zone needs to end.  Let's get some chatter going.

This is a good point about ADK's relation to SP.  This post gives me a town feeling on Ash.

[Witherweaver]

Here are the two posts from chairs that made me suspicious:


#1:

(This is a game. We are supposed to be having fun.  I am taking Mafia less serious-face-modo-mojo-jojo so anticipate that I will, occasionally, crack a joke.)

Also to take a page from Robz's book, vote: ww for using smiley.

#2:

I'm not sure I follow.

I think azadin's "I'm going to lurk" was, in fact, scummy.

Also I think I follow now, just realized I'd voted WW for smiley face.  Obviously that wasn't terribly serious 

That said, I'll say azadin has clearly decided to take my suggestion not to lurk to heart, and so I'll go back to vote: A Drowned Kernel because I still think the "let's blitz lynch" statement was scummy, even though he's kind of backed off of that a little.

I explained #2 earlier, but it was #1 I think, that started it for me.  That "less serious-face-modo-mojo-jojo" joke feels forced, and he even says he'll crack jokes right after he cracks a joke, which is an "overcompensation" or overexplanation of himself.

Imagine someone doing the following:

---I'm going to do something scummy for a reasons guys
---does something scummy
---Hey guys I just did something scummy, but there was a reason

That's what I mean by "overcompensating" for something.  It's like he really feels like he needs to make sure EVERYONE is aware that he's a jokey guy because, see, jokes!  Then in #2, he following with a smiley face joke, and overexplains himself about azadin.

So that's my small chairs case.

I don't buy this particularly because you lost some context.  Before these quotes from Chairs was Chairs making a joking post where he brought up aliens, me responding with question marks, and him explaining that he was joking.  So the order in your scenario is off.

Full context (sorry for long posts):

I will probably lurk for at least a little bit, mostly because I really have no idea what sorts of things to say or do.

Though I've gone through some of the wiki that ADK posted to me earlier (Thanks, by the way!) and in the first post of the thread, so hopefully it won't take long for me to start catching on to some scummy tells!

In the meantime, I also jumped on the ADK wagon as more of a joke, but will Unvote for now until I can get a better feel for what's going on.

vote: azadin

No lurking.  If you're Town, then just posting "So here's what I think of this" even if it's "Well, I thought this was interesting and it makes me feel like X is more scummy/less scummy/posting too little/possibly an alien" is great.  The more that you post about what you're reading and what you think of what you read, the more interactions we get from you, the more we can in turn state what we think about your opinions, creating interactions of our own that you can then read into - which is how you get to say "Aha! Based on all these people talking, and what they're talking about (and ignoring), I can say that I think this one is the Mafioso plaguing our fair city!"... and eventually we lynch one, and find out if we were right, and that gives us more data to go through and refine our opinions of everyone else based on the interactions that occurred.

In other words, not talking is giving Mafia the excuse to not talk, and if they can get away with not talking, their Days are easier.

(This is a game. We are supposed to be having fun.  I am taking Mafia less serious-face-modo-mojo-jojo so anticipate that I will, occasionally, crack a joke.)

Also to take a page from Robz's book, vote: ww for using smiley.

[Witherweaver]

Chairs serious vote followed by an unserious vote is very unsettling. Do you still think Azadin is scummy?

I posted this before ash or robz said anything about chairs. My next posts were a back and forth about the Adk blitz lynch thing and then I voted chairs. I think the vote jumping combined with the overcompensation as robz and ash put it is pretty scummy.

Also my reiteration of the Scott case was not meant as a new revelation I was just answering ash as the what the case was. I have said I would vote for either.

As for egork and Azadin, Azadin seems to just genuinely agree with the case and reads towny. Egork's post feels more forced as though he wants to vote for chairs but feels like he needs to make up a new reason. I lean scummy on him already so this strengthens that, however I can see this coming from newbie town who just didn't want to vote with no new reason.

I believe EgorK would have come up with a better reason if he felt the need to make up a reason.  Azadin seems scummier for looking like he has all his bases covered.

[Witherweaver]

Question for sudgy though -- how come you didn't vote chairs if he screams scum to you? You mention your vote on EgorK was a serious one, but I guess I'm failing to see why. If you think chairs is scummy, why not vote? Also, the post from chairs he quoted here just re-enforces my vote on him. He doesn't really give any reasons whatsoever for his vote on sudgy except that he's a reasonable D1 lynch. And he supposes. That tells me he's trying to be non-chalant about the post and not be too assuming, which is scummy.

I knew he was close to being lynched and I didn't want to accidentally hammer.  I asked, and nobody answered.  Teproc posted a vote count, so Vote: chairs.  This is L-1

Here is overcaution again.. you could have looked at the votes yourself and decided if you wanted to put Chairs to L-1... no need to ask us if it's okay.

(Well, by "here" I actually mean the original post up there that Azadin was calling out.)

[Witherweaver]

Sudgy you say this is the same wagon he gets every game, but it seems decidingly not.  You're called out for specifically acting unusual.

Half of it is that, and half was "he seems overly cautious".  The second is what I always am, and I always have a slightly different playstyle depending on factors such as availability.

I guess I've only been in one (I think?) game with you, but I didn't get an impression of overcautiousness  there at all.

[Witherweaver]

Caught up--sort of? I skimmed--and I don't know. Probably, I like a sudgy lynch better than chairs lynch. Vote: sudgy

So, like.. just vote whomever has a wagon at the moment?

[Eevee]

 Yeah, robz isn't putting in too much effort yet, but there isn't a whole lot we can do about that. Has scott ever been scum?

[Teproc]

Vote Count 1.9:

chairs (5) : ashersky, mcmcsalot, azadin, EgorK, sudgy
sudgy (5): A Drowned Kernel, Eevee, faust, chairs, Robz888
EgorK (1) : scott_pilgrim
Robz888(1) : Witherweaver

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Day 1 ends at 07:00 p.m. on July 7, 2014.

[ashersky]

2 days to deadline?  I've seen nothing compelling as I've followed along over the holiday weekend.

[Eevee]

2 days to deadline?  I've seen nothing compelling as I've followed along over the holiday weekend.

What do you think of scott?