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[Twistedarcher]

Scumslip? Really? I thought in big games there are three and in small games there are two. Is this incorrect?

I don't find the scum slip that compelling -- we did this same thing in innovation and it came from town, not scum -- but I DO find this response from Andrew scummy. It's too...calm?

vote:Andrew

It just reads scummy to me. Sorry, I can't give you better than that right now, and I'm not saying you are super duper 100% scum or anything, but I get a scummy vibe from it.

I'd like an update on this please. The initial vote was because you thought I was too calm. I've had some pretty frustrated posts since then. How do you feel about those?

All previous 13 player games with only one scum team have had 3 scum. But ash you are arguing over whether the assumption is correct, not if its reasonable. You are the only person who has said it's not. You have at least 4 people saying it is. All 4 of those people can't be scum therefore it's reasonably likely for town to have that assumption, therefore Andrew isn't necessarily scum.

See what I did there? By saying all 4 of those people can't be scum, I assumed a 3 person scum team. Lynch me next!

I don't get how you can have this kind of post right after voting for me. This is probably the most straightforward, to the point argument for me not being scum, certainly better than anything I could post or have posted. So why keep your vote on me after this? What has changed or stayed the same to influence your vote?

The thing is this isn't an argument for you being town, it's an argument that I don't think you scum slipped. It doesn't mean the post made you town it just means that I don't get anything from the "scum slip"

I am worried that the new stuff I am finding is self-confirming but I agree with shraeye's point that we both simultaneously brought up. Sudgys giving me worries but I think I am comfortable leaving my vote on you for now.

I read most of your posts and they all seem to be you just saying the same thing again (not to minimize them). I am not super secure in my read on you but it's the best I have so far, even though sudgy is giving me caution.

Shraeye is a townier read, simply because I don't remember a game where scum!shraeye hasn't tried to push my mislynch. He is tough for me to read though simply because of his posting style (lots of summary posts and reactions to other things, due to having more of a life than the rest of us). Regardless I don't wanna lynch there today. Beyond Andrew and sudgy I don't have any major scum reads I can think of, I am null on quite a few people (don't really buy the adk argument but don't find anything towny about him either, nothing on jimmm/arch, unsure on ash, towny on Yuma, towny on xerxes due to his claim, null on xeiron and witherweaver, and can't remember who else is in the game)

[Archetype]

From most intensity to least...

Towny:
Myself
Yuma
Shraeye
ashersky

Scummy:
A Drowned Kernel
Xeiron
Sudgy
AndrewFTTW

Null:
Everyone else

[Twistedarcher]

What do you find scummy about xeiron/sudgy? Sorry if you have stated this already

[xeiron]

Caught up on the latest pages, and I am left with a scummy feeling of both AndrewisFTTW and A Drowned Kernel. Actually slightly more on ADK, but the interesting part is the chance of them being scum together.
They share some assumptions, and they are defending each other. Something to remember if one flips scum.

As for actually lynching someone, I am not ready to vote for any of them without rereading once more. It will have to be another day, as i am quite busy right now.

Where have I ever defended ADK?

I was sure you had, but upon rereading I see that he defended you, and not the other way around.

[xeiron]

...
. Has xerion even posted since this whole mess started?

Not much, and I will not contribute much until after the weekend.

[xeiron]

I'll ask...

ash... if I am not going to shoot Andrew who would you suggest I shoot instead?

I think at this point i am interested in hearing opinions from everyone--well everyone that has a solid opinion on this. Don't just create an opinion for me. I only want solid opinions and I am not demanding everyone give one just for the sake of giving one.

I think you should should shoot whoever we would lynch. That way, it is more like as town can doubblelynch, whitch is good.

[Twistedarcher]

I'll ask...

ash... if I am not going to shoot Andrew who would you suggest I shoot instead?

I think at this point i am interested in hearing opinions from everyone--well everyone that has a solid opinion on this. Don't just create an opinion for me. I only want solid opinions and I am not demanding everyone give one just for the sake of giving one.

I think you should should shoot whoever we would lynch. That way, it is more like as town can doubblelynch, whitch is good.

I can't believe I didn't think of this, I agree. You definitely should, although if you disagree with the lynch vehemently we can't make you.

[Witherweaver]

I'll ask...

ash... if I am not going to shoot Andrew who would you suggest I shoot instead?

I think at this point i am interested in hearing opinions from everyone--well everyone that has a solid opinion on this. Don't just create an opinion for me. I only want solid opinions and I am not demanding everyone give one just for the sake of giving one.

I think you should should shoot whoever we would lynch. That way, it is more like as town can doubblelynch, whitch is good.

I can't believe I didn't think of this, I agree. You definitely should, although if you disagree with the lynch vehemently we can't make you.

If it turns out we're wrong about Andrewis and he's town, we would get that information, right?  That could shed some light on who is scum. 

[Twistedarcher]

If Andrew is town, who do you think is scummiest on wagon, ww?

[Witherweaver]

If Andrew is town, who do you think is scummiest on wagon, ww?

Ash.  My first instinct was that one of the two was scum.  I'm not really so convinced on there being a slip, it's only Andrewis' reaction to the accusation that I find untrustworthy. 

[Jorbles]

Vote Count 1.5:

Jimmmm (1): xeiron
sudgy (1): Jimmmmm
AndrewisFTTW (4): Twistedarcher, XerxesPraelor, faust, Witherweaver
A Drowned Kernel (1): Archetype
Twistedarcher (1): AndrewisFTTW
Witherweaver (1): yuma

Not voting (4): A Drowned Kernel, sudgy, shraeye, ashersky

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch..

Day 1 ends April 3 at 8 PM forum time (mail-mi won't be home at that time, but no more votes will be accepted after that time. Jorbles may be around and will try to get online asap if it comes right down to deadline.)

[sudgy]

Everybody's been freaking out about my L-1.  The fact that you freaked out proves my point that there are more reasons to put someone to L-1 other than to lynch them.  If someone did end up lynching you, I would have argued for his lynch because that is anti-town to do.  L-1 isn't lynching, hammering is.  I unvoted because I didn't think it might kill a townie as well if someone hammered (instead of just Andrew).

Here are my reasons for your vote:

1. I think you overreacted (and are still overreacting) to the votes.
2. Your play is different than in Adventure Time (I think meta arguments are some of the biggest arguments out there).
3. Your play reminds me of mine as SK in MXXXII (Dynasty Warriors).

[AndrewisFTTW]

I overreacted based on what? Based on the meta that accumulated over 2 1/2 games? Again, I don't think you can compare my reaction in Adventure Time to this but in the end, we an sit here and argue about what constitutes overreation forever and it'll get us nowhere. If that's what you think I did then so be it.

[Twistedarcher]

Sudgy please prove points #2 and #3

[sudgy]

I overreacted based on what? Based on the meta that accumulated over 2 1/2 games? Again, I don't think you can compare my reaction in Adventure Time to this but in the end, we an sit here and argue about what constitutes overreation forever and it'll get us nowhere. If that's what you think I did then so be it.

You overreacted for any player is what I was saying.

[sudgy]

Oh, wait, when you said you were only there for the first day in Adventure Time I thought that meant you got lynched.  That puts a wrench in things...

[sudgy]

I was rereading myself in MXXXII, and while I wasn't making long posts, I was getting really frustrated.  I actually don't agree with my last post I made there now (where I claimed).  If you want to reread me, it's simple enough.  I got voted for acting like myself, then I reacted too strongly and got lynched for it.  If I hadn't reacted as strongly, I might not have been lynched.  Here's the link to the game if you want it.  I think this quote applies here:

Sudgy, there's no such thing as catching someone for the wrong reasons, although believing you have been caught for the wrong reasons is a classic scum tell.

[Archetype]

What do you find scummy about xeiron/sudgy? Sorry if you have stated this already

Xeiron was when he was acting defensive about saying Jimmmmm was getting defensive. Sudgy was for the L-1 thing. Neither of them are huge scum reads. None of my scum reads really are.

[ashersky]

I was rereading myself in MXXXII, and while I wasn't making long posts, I was getting really frustrated.  I actually don't agree with my last post I made there now (where I claimed).  If you want to reread me, it's simple enough.  I got voted for acting like myself, then I reacted too strongly and got lynched for it.  If I hadn't reacted as strongly, I might not have been lynched.  Here's the link to the game if you want it.  I think this quote applies here:

Sudgy, there's no such thing as catching someone for the wrong reasons, although believing you have been caught for the wrong reasons is a classic scum tell.

I was having this exact thought.

Andrew is pissed that we've "caught him for the wrong reason."

[AndrewisFTTW]

I was rereading myself in MXXXII, and while I wasn't making long posts, I was getting really frustrated.  I actually don't agree with my last post I made there now (where I claimed).  If you want to reread me, it's simple enough.  I got voted for acting like myself, then I reacted too strongly and got lynched for it.  If I hadn't reacted as strongly, I might not have been lynched.  Here's the link to the game if you want it.  I think this quote applies here:

Sudgy, there's no such thing as catching someone for the wrong reasons, although believing you have been caught for the wrong reasons is a classic scum tell.

I was having this exact thought.

Andrew is pissed that we've "caught him for the wrong reason."

You guys haven't caught anything so no, that's not why I'm frustrated.

[Witherweaver]

I was rereading myself in MXXXII, and while I wasn't making long posts, I was getting really frustrated.  I actually don't agree with my last post I made there now (where I claimed).  If you want to reread me, it's simple enough.  I got voted for acting like myself, then I reacted too strongly and got lynched for it.  If I hadn't reacted as strongly, I might not have been lynched.  Here's the link to the game if you want it.  I think this quote applies here:

Sudgy, there's no such thing as catching someone for the wrong reasons, although believing you have been caught for the wrong reasons is a classic scum tell.

I was having this exact thought.

Andrew is pissed that we've "caught him for the wrong reason."

Then if you believe that, why did you unvote?  I don't understand removing the pressure when you were the one so gung-ho about him slipping up and being guilty.

[yuma]

Right now I have a very similar feeling to this game as Toy Story*. For those of you not around this is basically what went down...

faust accused sudgy of doing something scummy. Based off that sole post he received a bunch of votes from people who thought he was scummy and then other people pilled on because his "reactions to pressure" were scummy. Sound familiar?

I maintained that faust was a bad lynch throughout all of this, saying he was being voted on for a reason that someone shoudln't be voted on. I then, like a complete moron, gave up on town and hammered faust despite my read on him because I saw no reason to prolong the inevitable.

So to all of you who are calling out to me to Dayvig Andrew (despite my previously stating there was no way I am going to do this) can rest assured that I learned my lesson in Toy Story and I will not be shooting Andrew.

*The comparison isn't perfect. One situation was a scum read based off something faust did and said, here it is a supposed scum slip. So actually I think the faust reason was better than the one we have here, but my feeling of being the lone voice of reason feels the same.

**Also this game reminds me a lot of Arch's game where town lynched Voltgloss for his "slip" but of course there I was a SK, so the feeling isn't exactly the same. But again I feel like the sole voice of reason.

[yuma]

At this point I want to shoot WW.

I would like people to discuss whether or not WW should claim.

[sudgy]

Right now I have a very similar feeling to this game as Toy Story*. For those of you not around this is basically what went down...

faust accused sudgy of doing something scummy. Based off that sole post he received a bunch of votes from people who thought he was scummy and then other people pilled on because his "reactions to pressure" were scummy. Sound familiar?

I maintained that faust was a bad lynch throughout all of this, saying he was being voted on for a reason that someone shoudln't be voted on. I then, like a complete moron, gave up on town and hammered faust despite my read on him because I saw no reason to prolong the inevitable.

So to all of you who are calling out to me to Dayvig Andrew (despite my previously stating there was no way I am going to do this) can rest assured that I learned my lesson in Toy Story and I will not be shooting Andrew.

*The comparison isn't perfect. One situation was a scum read based off something faust did and said, here it is a supposed scum slip. So actually I think the faust reason was better than the one we have here, but my feeling of being the lone voice of reason feels the same.

**Also this game reminds me a lot of Arch's game where town lynched Voltgloss for his "slip" but of course there I was a SK, so the feeling isn't exactly the same. But again I feel like the sole voice of reason.

And this game also reminds me of Dynasty Warriors, where I was accused for something stupid, then reacted strongly to it, then got lynched for it.

At this point I want to shoot WW.

I would like people to discuss whether or not WW should claim.

Why WanderingWinder Witherweaver?

[ashersky]

At this point I want to shoot WW.

I would like people to discuss whether or not WW should claim.

I like this.

Is there a claim that changes your mind?  If not, no need to claim.  If so...why?  It's RMM, everyone has roles.  Maybe he claims strong or weak, or says if he's okay being vigged relative to how he sees his role?

I don't want anyone to be able to just say "cop!" and skate by.