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[flies]

http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20131118/log.50b20dc3e4b0c9ce0cf27eb3.1384812856848.txt

Code: [Select]

Transmute, Beggar, Apothecary, Scrying Pool, Scheme, Spy, Horn of Plenty, Journeyman, Mine, Outpost
So I'm looking at this board and thinking, no +buy, no virtual money, no +action, no trashing, SP is out.  That leaves apothecary/beggar, but that probably needs +buy too.  Big Money it is.  Plus, I'm playing against Stef, so I probably can't beat him at engine building anyway (note that this is a terrible reason not to go engine).

However, there is pseudo+buy in horn and outpost, and scheme really really helps the outpost.  And there is trashing in transmute which is really a key card in this engine.  Stef never buys/gains a treasure besides the potion and the Horns, so without the golds from transmuting estates, he'd never get to $8.  Later, he uses the transmute on a scheme at the end for a duchy, which gives him the win that turn.  (If that hadn't been enough right at that point, he had an outpost in hand whereas I could only buy an estate on my next turn, leaving up to 4 effective turns he'd have had to make up the difference.)

Thanks to some decent luck (his spying attacks never really hurt me - the one time he skips a journeyman i'd have drawn it dead anyway), I get four provinces by T12, but it's not enough.  He gets the horns up to 8, cashes out, and wins by a nosetransmute.  "Such a powerful card," he says.

PS: Stef said he hadn't even noticed the possibility of Journeyman/BM.  I guess when you set your sights high...

[Polk5440]

So with him picking up Scrying Pools, would a couple of Beggers (for Silver and late game Coppers for Provinces) have helped you more than it hurts Journeyman's draw?

[Robz888]

Yeah, I see why you might be tempted by BM + Journeyman, but really the Scrying Pool thing has to be better here. The possibility for Horn gaining, Scheme to make sure you always have Scrying Pools to start off with, and Spy is actually most useful when fighting a money strategy (and you have Spy AND SPool to do that). Plus Outpost for like double turns (remember you are sticking back Pools with Scheme)... yeah. Another route would be using Mine to trash Coppers into Horns. I actually don't see that 'Mute helping out that much.

Alternatively, I like the idea of Beggar/Apothecary a lot, though. I would think that might actually have a good chance at winning.

Very interesting board.

[flies]

So with him picking up Scrying Pools, would a couple of Beggers (for Silver and late game Coppers for Provinces) have helped you more than it hurts Journeyman's draw?

the main problem with beggar is that the top-decking effect would mostly be moot due to all the spying.  I could try and keep real good track of which was his last spy... 

[terminalCopper]

Plus, I'm playing against Stef, so I probably can't beat him at engine building anyway (note that this is a terrible reason not to go engine).

Depends on what you aim for: Do you primarily want to improve your skills or do you want to win?
To become a master player, BM is usually a poor choice. But if you want to beat a better player, your pragmatical reasoning is correct: On an engine board, a player who is 10 Levels ahead will probably win 80% of the games, but not much more than, say, 55% on a board where money dominates.
Thus, if you're the underdog, and if you aren't sure which is the theoretically best strategy, going BM will improve your winning rate.

PS: Stef said he hadn't even noticed the possibility of Journeyman/BM.  I guess when you set your sights high...

Very interesting. I still wonder which is the best approach to understand a random kingdom asap. Maybe, if there are some handsome nonterminals, the first question shouldn't be "Which is the correct strategy?", but rather "How do I build my engine?" (and just in case you don't find an appropriate answer, think about BM).

[SCSN]

Plus, I'm playing against Stef, so I probably can't beat him at engine building anyway (note that this is a terrible reason not to go engine).

Our doubts are traitors
And make us lose the good we oft might win
By fearing to attempt.

PS: Stef said he hadn't even noticed the possibility of Journeyman/BM.  I guess when you set your sights high...

Very interesting. I still wonder which is the best approach to understand a random kingdom asap. Maybe, if there are some handsome nonterminals, the first question shouldn't be "Which is the correct strategy?", but rather "How do I build my engine?" (and just in case you don't find an appropriate answer, think about BM).

Properly reading the board is definitely the thing I struggle with most. Not infrequently I completely overlook obvious combos or possibilities until T5 or later (I've missed Hermit/Market Square twice, thinking both times "Double Hermit? Really? I don't like that here...").

I've tried my hands at some sort of checklist/deliberate thought process to go through before each game, but then when the game starts I'm always like "yah, fuck this shit, this card looks good here, let's just buy it". In his videos, AdamH does a great job of verbally going through each basic aspect of the board before he starts. It sounds obvious and unnecessary, but it prevents having to wreck your brain for a back-up plan when mid-game you suddenly notice the absence of +buy. Maybe I should start making videos just to become more disciplined lol.

[flies]

Maybe I should start making videos just to become more disciplined lol.

This was one of the main reasons I started making videos.