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Author Topic: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia  (Read 26234 times)

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LastFootnote

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Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« on: November 08, 2013, 10:52:46 am »
+9

The sixth contest is to design a card that would fit well in Cornucopia.

Submission Rules

• Submit no more than one card per challenge.
• You are not obligated to submit a card for every challenge.
• Submit your card to me via this forum's messaging system.  Submissions made after each week's deadline cannot be accepted.
• Each card you submit must have a name, a cost, a list of types, and the exact wording that should appear on the card.  Also include a brief description of any special design considerations (e.g., Stash having a unique back), but do NOT include any other information, such as strategic commentary or examples about it would play.
• Unlike the previous set design contest, the name you give your card will appear on the ballot. If multiple cards with the same name are submitted, I will differentiate them with letters in a randomly chosen order, e.g. [Card Name] A, [Card Name] B, etc. Cards themselves will likewise be listed in a random order on the ballot.
• I will accept revisions to your contest entries provided they are submitted to me before the deadline.  If you submit a revision to an entry you have previously submitted to me, resubmit your revised card(s) in their entirety.  That is, don't tell me "Oh, can you make that +2 Cards say +3 Cards instead?"  Just resubmit the full card.
• Only submit cards that are your own design.
• You may submit cards that have been previously posted here in this forum, including those that have been refined by the community as a whole, provided you can still claim that the central conceit of the card -- and the majority of its final version -- is yours.
• A single card might conceivably qualify for multiple challenges within this series. If your card doesn't win the first challenge you submit it to, you may submit it for any and all future challenges (until it wins), provided the card fits those challenges. This is particularly pertinent for cards that don't win the first of two slots for a large expansion, although depending on which card does win, your card may not qualify for the second challenge.
• Do not disclose your submissions publicly, either in this thread or elsewhere!

For this Treasure Chest set, you may not submit cards that combine certain mechanics from multiple expansions. The idea is that you could simply slot the cards into their respective sets without needing components or rules specific to another set. Specifically:

• Duration cards may only be submitted as candidates for a Seaside slot.
• Potion-cost cards may only be submitted as candidates for the Alchemy slot.
• Cards that use VP tokens or cost $7 or more may only be submitted as candidates for a Prosperity slot.
• Cards that use Coin tokens and cards that use overpay may only be submitted as candidates for the Guilds slot.
• Cards that use Ruins (Looters) and cards that use Spoils may only be submitted as candidates for a Dark Ages slot.

Many mechanics are fair game for any submission. The following is an incomplete list.

• Victory/Action and Victory/Treasure hybrid cards.
• Cards that allow you to choose an ability from a list.
• Cards with on-buy, would-gain, on-gain, and on-trash abilities.

I will be putting some constraints on the set as a whole.

• The raw number of cards (including randomizers) must not exceed 150.



Challenge #6 : Cornucopia

Design a Kingdom card that would fit into the Cornucopia expansion. Such a card could have one or more of the following qualities:

• Encourages you to have a variety of cards (in your deck, hand, etc.).
• Helps you get a variety of cards in your deck.
• Has ridiculous power creep. (kidding!)

There is an additional stipulation! Your card may not use or reference Prize cards. That's Tournament's schtick! Let it keep it.

Submissions are due by the end of Friday November 15th, 2013.

If you have any questions, please post them here or send me a private message and I will endeavor to answer them in a timely manner. Good luck! No, seriously. I will.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2013, 11:14:21 am by LastFootnote »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2013, 10:52:59 am »
+5

Quote
Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.


Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.


Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.


Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.


Quote
Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).


Quote
Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.


Quote
Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.


Quote
Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile without one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

Clarification: Each player has a set of identical tokens that are distinguishable from other players' tokens. Tokens are not artificially limited.


Quote
Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.


Quote
Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.


Quote
Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.


Quote
Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.


Quote
Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.


Quote
Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
+1 Card. +1 Action. The player to your left chooses a card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

EDIT: Carnival now gives [+1 Card; +1 Action].

Quote
Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.


Quote
Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.


Quote
Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.


Quote
Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.


Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.


Quote
Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.


Quote
Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.


Quote
Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.


Quote
Potluck
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently named cards in play (counting this): +2 Cards, +$1, discard 2 cards.


Quote
Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.


Quote
Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.


Quote
Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.


Quote
Barter Shop
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand. You may discard a card from your hand that is not a duplicate. If you do, gain a card costing up to $6 that is not a copy of a card in your hand.


Quote
Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.


Quote
Scythe
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Trash any number of differently named cards from your hand. Gain a card with cost less than twice the number of cards trashed.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2013, 05:38:58 pm by LastFootnote »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2013, 10:53:10 am »
+1

Scarecrow15
Showman15
Field14
Harvest Queen11
Storyteller10
Flea Marketjpople028
Side ShowShowdown358
Dairyawildnoobappeared8
IngotHeavyD7
Wine CellerJean-Michel7
RaffleXerxesPraelor6
Vanguardsoulnet6
TheaterA Drowned Kernel6
PariahNoMoreFun5
CarnivalEggplantation4
NomadSaucery4
Potluckmarkusin4
Barter Shopandwilk4
Sharpening Stoneignorentmen4
ScytheRobertJ4
BountyPolk54403
GrocerSchneau3
KaleidoscopeJack Rudd3
Traveling CircusMatt_Arnold3
Old Gafferyuma3
Wheat Fieldangrybirds3
Outcastscott_pilgrim3
Player Kingjamespotter2
Hydrajackelfrink1
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 11:07:10 am by LastFootnote »
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Robz888

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2013, 12:24:01 pm »
0

tag
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Tables

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2013, 12:40:29 pm »
0

Design a Kingdom card that would fit into the Cornucopia expansion. Such a card could have one or more of the following qualities:

• Encourages you to have a variety of cards (in your deck, hand, etc.).
• Helps you get a variety of cards in your deck.
Has ridiculous power creep.

ALL my +1's to you, sir.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.
I hereby declare myself the best dominion player in the world. Obviously.

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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2013, 01:37:47 pm »
+1

tag

OK, I give up. I have no clue what this "tag" business is about. Is it a mafia thing?
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2013, 01:45:06 pm »
0

tag

OK, I give up. I have no clue what this "tag" business is about. Is it a mafia thing?

People post "tag" in a thread so that that thread will show up on their "show new replies to your posts".
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2013, 01:54:07 pm »
0

tag

OK, I give up. I have no clue what this "tag" business is about. Is it a mafia thing?

People post "tag" in a thread so that that thread will show up on their "show new replies to your posts".

Wow, that is awful. So the forum really needs a Watch Thread button, huh?
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sudgy

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2013, 01:54:51 pm »
0

Is that what the "notify" button is?
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   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

soulnet

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2013, 01:58:15 pm »
+2

Is that what the "notify" button is?

Sadly, no. Thanks for giving me a good excuse to reply.
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Schneau

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2013, 02:00:43 pm »
0

Submitted!
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SirPeebles

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2013, 02:06:28 pm »
+3

tag

OK, I give up. I have no clue what this "tag" business is about. Is it a mafia thing?

I'm pretty sure it means you're it.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2013, 02:10:39 pm »
0

I'm pretty sure it means you're it.

Yes, this was my initial reaction!
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Warfreak2

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2013, 02:59:13 pm »
0

I thought it was a German greeting. Moin!
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XerxesPraelor

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2013, 03:09:52 pm »
0

Great, this is up again! Thanks a ton, LF.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2013, 06:10:03 pm »
0

The contests I'm most interested in submitting to are Alchemy and Guilds, so of course Cornucopia is the next one.  ::)

I actually have a decent concept for Cornucopia, but the wording is difficult to nail down and I think someone posted a similar fan card recently.  Hmmm.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2013, 06:20:27 pm »
0

The contests I'm most interested in submitting to are Alchemy and Guilds, so of course Cornucopia is the next one.  ::)

I actually have a decent concept for Cornucopia, but the wording is difficult to nail down and I think someone posted a similar fan card recently.  Hmmm.

Alchemy was next on my list but I opted for Cornucopia instead so that I could post the extra Prize contest by way of apology for my absence.
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2013, 06:28:59 pm »
0

Cornucopia is one set I have almost no ideas for. Just...blank brain.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2013, 06:35:22 pm »
+9

Blank Brain
Action--$3

Trash an idea from your brain. If you do, you may...

...uh...

...I forget.
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Eggplantation

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2013, 06:19:32 am »
0

Been looking forward to this one for a while. Thanks LFN!
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #21 on: November 09, 2013, 10:49:22 am »
+2

Alright, I was ready for Cornucopia. What I wasn't ready for was a prize contest.
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ConMan

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2013, 07:56:58 pm »
0

A few possible card names, based on harvests, festivals (particularly those celebrating the start or end of harvest season) and some of the entertainment that might appear at such festivals (in the vein of Jesters and Fortune Tellers):
Thanksgiving
Plough
Yield
Banquet
Corn dolly
Lammas
Samhain
Beltane
Effigy
Bonfire
Corn-mother
Yule
May Bush
Mummers
Harlequin
Pantomime
Soul cake
Punchman
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jamespotter

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2013, 10:51:30 am »
0

Just noticed that there is not a specific time deadline on this contest…am I correct in taking the "end" of Friday to mean midnight, CT?
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #24 on: November 13, 2013, 11:02:18 am »
0

Just noticed that there is not a specific time deadline on this contest…am I correct in taking the "end" of Friday to mean midnight, CT?

Yeah, more or less. I'll be lenient if it's still Friday in your timezone, or whatever.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #25 on: November 13, 2013, 11:06:41 am »
+2

Quote
Soul cake

"Powered by science, of course!"
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #26 on: November 15, 2013, 10:33:03 am »
0

Just a reminder: Cornucopia cards are due today-ish. I have 24 entries so far. And while I'm perfectly happy to have a smaller number of entries this time (less work for me!), I just wanted to make sure everyone who wants to submit a card has done so.
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Polk5440

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #27 on: November 15, 2013, 11:05:38 am »
+1

Ok, ok.... I'll submit something. Just give me a sec.  ;)
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #28 on: November 15, 2013, 11:14:44 am »
0

Ok, ok.... I'll submit something. Just give me a sec.  ;)

There's no huge rush. As long as you get your entry in before I compile the entries tomorrow, you're golden. So you have the rest of the day, plus another few hours depending on your time zone.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #29 on: November 18, 2013, 09:29:39 am »
0

Is there an ETA on when the ballot is going to be up for this one?
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #30 on: November 18, 2013, 09:49:11 am »
+1

Is there an ETA on when the ballot is going to be up for this one?

Should be up in a few hours. I'm on my way to work now, but we have new offices, so I may need time to settle in.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #31 on: November 18, 2013, 01:40:29 pm »
+2

The ballot is up! We have only 29 entries for this contest, which seems appropriate for a smaller expansion. I'll put a poll up in a day or two. In the meantime, I encourage you to talk about your favorites.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #32 on: November 18, 2013, 02:10:25 pm »
0

I'm going to give a shout-out to my favorite submissions here.

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I like the simplicity of this one. Donald tried a $5 version of this that revealed 5 cards. It eventually turned into Harvest. I have no idea why that version didn't work out, but I'm willing to give this version a shot.


Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

I'd try it with just [+1 Card. +1 Action.] on top and see if that was too crazy. In general I like the idea.


Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

I like this one, too. When I was trying to come up with my own card, I came up with this except with +4 Cards instead of +2 Cards and +2 Actions. I like Scarecrow way better.


Quote
Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.

I like the simplicity of this one as well. Can be really nice, but you have to work for it. It's possible that it could cost less.


Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

A cool take on Village/Golem. It really plays toward the hand theme that Cornucopia used to have. Can combo really nicely with a lot of cards, such as Menagerie, Hunting Party, Tactician, draw-up-to-X cards, etc.


Quote
Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

The silly cost is the author's attempt to get feedback on the card itself, since he's sick of just hearing "too expensive" or "too cheap". As for the card itself, I think it could work. I have a similar card I've been testing for my own set. I appreciate that it has an alternative way to get Hydras, since once you start amassing them, you want to get them as fast as you can. I'm not sure this reaction is the best option, but I think it's definitely worth playtesting.

Special bonus points to Side Show and Harvest Queen for costing $5. Cornucopia has a terrible dearth of $5 cards. It's get 5 $4 cards and only 4 $5 cards. Also, it already has more Attacks than it needs, so I may be dismissing the Attack submissions out of hand.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2013, 02:11:31 pm by LastFootnote »
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #33 on: November 18, 2013, 03:05:35 pm »
0

Hopefully I'll have time to comment on all the cards later, but this one jumped out at me:

Quote
Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.

I assume the idea is that it's a great card with a drawback that encourages diversity, but I'm not sure the drawback is a drawback.  It gives you an extra buy so that you can easily pick up a Copper with it, clearing probably 3-4 Coppers out of your deck (but adding one back in, so netting a loss).  It quickly loses utility as you trash down, and it's not something you'll want to spam, but I think it's a must-buy in every engine game, and probably a huge advantage for a 5/2 opening.

I'm not sure if the author intended for it to be able to trash bad cards, but it wouldn't be hard to fix; maybe change it to "when you buy a card costing $3 or more".  Removing the +buy is probably a good enough nerf actually, since it means you'll have to combo with other +buy to trash Copper, or spend your turn bypassing a good buy to trash instead.
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Aidan Millow

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #34 on: November 18, 2013, 03:11:35 pm »
+1

Quote
Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

The silly cost is the author's attempt to get feedback on the card itself, since he's sick of just hearing "too expensive" or "too cheap". As for the card itself, I think it could work. I have a similar card I've been testing for my own set. I appreciate that it has an alternative way to get Hydras, since once you start amassing them, you want to get them as fast as you can. I'm not sure this reaction is the best option, but I think it's definitely worth playtesting.

You probably want to note this in the ballot so no-one dismisses it as a joke card.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #35 on: November 18, 2013, 03:14:27 pm »
0

Quote
Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

The silly cost is the author's attempt to get feedback on the card itself, since he's sick of just hearing "too expensive" or "too cheap". As for the card itself, I think it could work. I have a similar card I've been testing for my own set. I appreciate that it has an alternative way to get Hydras, since once you start amassing them, you want to get them as fast as you can. I'm not sure this reaction is the best option, but I think it's definitely worth playtesting.

You probably want to note this in the ballot so no-one dismisses it as a joke card.

I replaced $999 with $???.
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soulnet

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #36 on: November 18, 2013, 03:37:44 pm »
+4

Quote
Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

The silly cost is the author's attempt to get feedback on the card itself, since he's sick of just hearing "too expensive" or "too cheap". As for the card itself, I think it could work. I have a similar card I've been testing for my own set. I appreciate that it has an alternative way to get Hydras, since once you start amassing them, you want to get them as fast as you can. I'm not sure this reaction is the best option, but I think it's definitely worth playtesting.

You probably want to note this in the ballot so no-one dismisses it as a joke card.

I replaced $999 with $???.

Not a huge deal, but I don't think that is fair with the other cards. Either everyone should be subject to an a priori pricing or it should be optional. It would be possible to just remove pricing of every card to avoid too strong/weak comments, or at least making pricing submissions optional (for some cases it may be important to know weither the card is gainable through workshop variants, for instance).

Asking for feedback is fine, but as long as we are voting, rules should be uniform.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #37 on: November 18, 2013, 03:41:12 pm »
0

Not a huge deal, but I don't think that is fair with the other cards. Either everyone should be subject to an a priori pricing or it should be optional. It would be possible to just remove pricing of every card to avoid too strong/weak comments, or at least making pricing submissions optional (for some cases it may be important to know weither the card is gainable through workshop variants, for instance).

Asking for feedback is fine, but as long as we are voting, rules should be uniform.

Yes, you're right. Back to $999 it is.
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markusin

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #38 on: November 18, 2013, 04:20:37 pm »
0

Quote
Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile wihout one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

Quote
Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
The player to your left chooses are card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

Quick question about these two cards: Do Copper/Silver/Gold, Curse, Ruins, and Estate/Duchy/Province/Colony count as supply piles?

If so, the Grocer appears to be slow, but is supercharged with TR/KC. Carnival, I think it was designed with that in mind.

Grocer, I'm curious to know how strong it can be. Carnival has elements of Jester, Indulgence, and Overseer. It's interesting that the Carnival tokens are communal. You can be pretty sure that the on-play effect of Carnival will help you in some way, but it's terminal nature does a good job at limiting its strength, so that's good.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #39 on: November 18, 2013, 04:23:38 pm »
0

Quote
Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile wihout one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

Quote
Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
The player to your left chooses are card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

Quick question about these two cards: Do Copper/Silver/Gold, Curse, Ruins, and Estate/Duchy/Province/Colony count as supply piles?

Yes, they count. At least, the authors said Supply piles, not Kingdom card piles, so they count. If that wasn't the intent, they should have worded them differently.
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soulnet

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #40 on: November 18, 2013, 04:27:48 pm »
+4

Yes, you're right. Back to $999 it is.

Ok. Then I think its too weak.
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Polk5440

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #41 on: November 18, 2013, 04:36:15 pm »
+2

So, after reading through the cards, I decided that my favorites overlap with LastFootnote's favorites quite a bit.

I'm going to give a shout-out to my favorite submissions here.

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I like the simplicity of this one. Donald tried a $5 version of this that revealed 5 cards. It eventually turned into Harvest. I have no idea why that version didn't work out, but I'm willing to give this version a shot.


Agree 100%.

Quote
Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

I'd try it with just [+1 Card. +1 Action.] on top and see if that was too crazy. In general I like the idea.

Agree 100%. The card is not as polished as some of the others. The card name is very flavorful, though. What kind of story are we telling today? Well, a Young Witch (+1 Action) was at the Tournament (+1 Action) watching Sir Micheal (+1 Action) compete on his Trusty Steed (+1 Action)....

I don't like the rest of the cards LastFootnote mentioned, nearly as much though.  :P

While these aren't my favorites, I do have a couple comments on some of the other cards:

Quote
Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

You want comments? Ok. The name suggests that you made this card for a mythical re-theme of Dominion, not an addition to Cornucopia. I think the best feature of the card is the cost (once it's in your deck -- how it gets there in the first place, I have no idea). This would be great Apprentice fodder and at least a double Province with Salvager (Hopefully you have some more buys to go along with that!). Or possibly 999 silvers with a Trader in hand, instead? Bishop-Hydra might be a winning strategy. The reaction is ridiculously good. Who would ever want to play an Attack when that means you can give your opponent a free $999 card???

The cost is part of the concept, especially for a card which gains copies of itself (see e.g. Rats). This card is incomplete until we at least get a more complete idea about what the author was thinking. Do you think people should be able to open with 2 copies of it? Should I be able to get it early at all? How powerful do you think that stacking ability is, anyway? Maybe you've tested it. As a designer, you actually have to do some of the thinking by giving a complete instance of the concept. We're voting on cards, after all. Getting the cost wrong a little is not a big deal, but you at least need to set a starting point for discussion.

But setting that aside, I suspect the top combined with the reaction can't work at any cost. What about eliminating the reaction?

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

Scarecrow + Menagerie = !!! This could be fun. I don't know if the card is balanced, though.

Quote
Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.

Interesting. I might like it better if it was a village that gave you an extra card for revealing a Patron card. I don't get why the Patron card has to be so expensive. I can see an argument for allowing any card to be a Patron (well, as long as it's a person.  ;))

Quote
Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.

I just don't know about swapping your cards out. As is, it feels like a card to correct your own strategic missteps. Or an activator for Menagerie. Or a pile emptier. Eh. I don't know. It needs a little more excitement. Maybe allow gaining up to one more than the cost of the trashed card? Edit: Bad idea. I guess I just don't like the card that much. Sorry.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2013, 04:50:48 pm by Polk5440 »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #42 on: November 18, 2013, 04:39:47 pm »
0

Yes, you're right. Back to $999 it is.

Ok. Then I think its too weak.

Cool. Sounds good.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #43 on: November 18, 2013, 04:47:17 pm »
+1

Quote
Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.

I just don't know about swapping your cards out. As is, it feels like a card to correct your own strategic missteps. Or an activator for Menagerie. Or a pile emptier. Eh. I don't know. It needs a little more excitement. Maybe allow gaining up to one more than the cost of the trashed card?

Then it would be better than Upgrade. For $4. I think [+1 Card; +1 Action; Trash a card from your hand] is already pretty strong for $4. Nomad here is better than that. In general I also agree that the swap-for-the-same-cost is pretty niche, but potentially quite powerful. Overall I'm not in love with the card, although I respect the attempt in creating a swap-for-the-same-cost card. It's not easy. Butcher is an elegant way to go about it, but of course that's a very different card.
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Aidan Millow

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #44 on: November 18, 2013, 04:48:15 pm »
0

My opinions on the cards (none of them is mine) I found myself not liking many of them but that might just be a case of me not really liking conucopia's mechanics.

Quote
Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.

Even with the nerf I feel like tributing yourself (given that you can control your own deck) is a large problem.


Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.
Nice smithy variant, rather weak if not going for a diversity deck but that's fine.

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

Giving +1 action to subsequent plays of cards is very scary and not something I think we should be able to do for $4. I feel like this would be better costing 5 with a small buff.


Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
Seems a bit too similar to menagerie.


Quote
Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).

Turns games into a lottery.


Quote
Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.
I don't feel this hoop is hard enough to jump through for $4 and a buy.


Quote
Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.
The fact that this invalidates other sources of +buy is a large problem.


Quote
Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile wihout one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.
Having distinct grocer tokens is a minor logistical problem. Furthermore (given that the first two tokens go on copper and curse) I feel that this is a bit of an all in on one strategy card and those aren't fun.


Quote
Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.
This potentially gets a lot better than market and seldom gets worse, it should cost 5 for starters but even then it seems possibly too swingy.


Quote
Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.
Seems like playing treasure cards in the action phase for the sake of itself. Not something I like.

Quote
Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.
I like that the "drawback" can be turned to your advantage but it might be too strong in doing so. Also worth noting that the drawback is pretty much irrelevant for greening.


Quote
Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.
Not hugely cornucopia esque but just a good card.


Quote
Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.
I like the idea but it's probably too strong to be able to have a single patron card activate all the theaters.

Quote
Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
The player to your left chooses are card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.
This seems very strong to me, too strong for 3.


Quote
Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.
I feel like this could easily give $3 or $4 each play, that's too strong.


Quote
Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.
The buy restriction is actually pretty harsh and the card is probably fine without it given that you'll usually either be topdecking victory cards (making your next hand worse) stuff that reduces the value of the $4 you're getting.


Quote
Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.

The Vp part is worded extremely awkwardly; it's reasonable to interpret it as saying that each distinct pair of cards with different types is worth a point. I feel like you need to remove mention of the cards to fix this but it'll still be awkward. The on play is rather swingy as it'll allow you to largely clear your deck of victory cards whenever you play it. Overall I don't like the card.

Quote
Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.
Band of misfits is a balanced $5 and I feel that this is much better than it.

Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.
I don't like this. Usually either it'll only be playing a couple of actions (in which case village is better) or you've already got a fairly good draw engine going and don't really need it.


Quote
Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.
This is really cute; I like it.


Quote
Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.
I feel like having a not terrible bonus along with very likely cursing is too good for 4. Either increased cost and maybe a further bonus or a decreased bonus.


Quote
Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.
Kind of anti-cornucopia esque but that's okay because hunting party.


Quote
Potluck
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently named cards in play (counting this): +2 Cards, +$1, discard 2 cards.
I don't think +2 cards, discard 2 cards is the bonus you want when you already have at least 3 other actions in play (barring certain shenanigens of course). I'd like it better as +1 Card, +$1.

Quote
Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $???
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.
I don't like cards that directly scale off the number you've played because they get very swingy. Here the scaling is have 1 hydra= nothing, 2 hydra=1 lab, 3 hydra= 3 labs, 4 hydra=6 labs. As a 5 cost I think this is about as well as you can implement the idea but I still don't like the idea.

Quote
Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.
Giving coppers, this is weak, giving curses I like it (this is one of the ways old gaffer could go).

Quote
Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.
The name is a bit too modern but the card is interesting.

Quote
Barter Shop
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand. You may discard a card from your hand that is not a duplicate. If you do, gain a card costing up to $6 that is not a copy of a card in your hand.
This is possibly too strong.

Quote
Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.
The general form is for this to be 5 including this.  Otherwise I feel this might be too strong, possibly at 5 with 2 base worth and 1 bonus.

Quote
Scythe
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Trash any number of differently named cards from your hand. Gain a card with cost less than twice the number of cards trashed.
[/quote]
I feel like this is pretty weak the vast majority of the time. Surely doesn't need to cost 4.
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jpople02

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #45 on: November 18, 2013, 04:48:47 pm »
0


Quote
Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.

I just don't know about swapping your cards out. As is, it feels like a card to correct your own strategic missteps. Or an activator for Menagerie. Or a pile emptier. Eh. I don't know. It needs a little more excitement. Maybe allow gaining up to one more than the cost of the trashed card?

So... Upgrade, basically?  I dunno, I quite like it in its current form.
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Polk5440

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #46 on: November 18, 2013, 04:49:51 pm »
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Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.

I just don't know about swapping your cards out. As is, it feels like a card to correct your own strategic missteps. Or an activator for Menagerie. Or a pile emptier. Eh. I don't know. It needs a little more excitement. Maybe allow gaining up to one more than the cost of the trashed card?

Then it would be better than Upgrade. For $4. I think [+1 Card; +1 Action; Trash a card from your hand] is already pretty strong for $4. Nomad here is better than that. In general I also agree that the swap-for-the-same-cost is pretty niche, but potentially quite powerful. Overall I'm not in love with the card, although I respect the attempt in creating a swap-for-the-same-cost card. It's not easy. Butcher is an elegant way to go about it, but of course that's a very different card.

Of course that's right. I was trying to say something nice about a concept that keeps coming up. But I guess I really just don't like it either....
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #47 on: November 18, 2013, 05:18:31 pm »
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Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.
I feel like this could easily give $3 or $4 each play, that's too strong.

I think you underestimate how much work goes into making this activate. If you have only one other Action in your hand (not unusual), you get [+2 Actions; +$1], which is pretty bad. If you have two, you get a Festival minus the +1 Buy, which is a pretty mediocre $5. Getting three or more Actions in your hand reliably means you've either worked to trim everything else out of your deck or you built a really nice engine. And don't forget that at $5, you may have trouble building an engine that doesn't use Side Shows as its primary village, in which case the first few you play may not generate much coin at all.

I haven't playtested it myself, but I think it's likely within the acceptable power range for a $5 card.

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Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.
I don't like this. Usually either it'll only be playing a couple of actions (in which case village is better) or you've already got a fairly good draw engine going and don't really need it.

Although I agree that the card looks weak in a vacuum, and that it could end up indeed being weak, I think it's a unique idea that deserves playtesting. If its only problem is that it's weak, there are two very easy fixes: Cost it at $4 or give it +1 Card. Or both!
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #48 on: November 18, 2013, 06:03:42 pm »
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Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.

Self-Tribute.  The big difference is that you flip your own cards instead of an opponent's.  Minor differences are that Victory cards only give +1 Card instead of +2, and Curses now give +Buy.  I believe that this is usually better because you have far more control of your own deck than an opponent's.  You can reliably use Bounty as a +4 Actions village if you build your deck appropriately.  It also combos better with deck inspection and hybrid cards.

Better does not mean it won't work.  It isn't strictly better anyway.  But the main thing I don't like is that it just feels too similar to Tribute for me.

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Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

This is a Smithy variant that draws 1-4 cards.  Definitely fits the theme of wanting variety in deck, to allow you to draw more.  I quite like this.

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Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

The wording on this one is a bit awkward; it's a little confusing to parse.  OK, so it's a village variant.  It basically allows you to play action cards for free if they haven't yet been played that turn.  What happens when you have more than one Storyteller in play?  Playing a new action will actually give you net actions (e.g. two Storytellers in play, playing my first Goons will trigger the clause on both and give me +2 actions).  I can see that giving a LOT of extra actions, which could make it a really powerful village even for duplicate cards.  The Crossroads mechanic makes it harder to get multiples into play though.  I think it's interesting, but the wording needs work.

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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

This is kind of odd.  Suppose you open with Scarecrow.  That would actually be really bad, I think.  OK, yeah, playing this gets you to a hand of 6 with an extra action... but then you discard down to 2, or 3 at most.  Copper, Estate, your other opening.  Or maybe you get a bigger hand full of shelters.  Hmmm.  This reminds me of Inn, actually.  +2 Cards, +2 Actions, discard.  But you can build your deck to mitigate how much you have to discard.  $3 actually seems appropriate.  It has filtering over regular Village, and you can actually increase your hand size, but you might also have to decrease it sometimes.  Pretty neat.

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Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).

I don't like the name.  Is it a reference to something?

The action is stupidly powerful.  Trash an Estate and gain two Wharves?  It costs $10, which is prohibitive, but you can get it for cheaper if you have no duplicates in hand.

Trying to think of the best usage... you want it early because it lets you gain $5 cards quickly.  But it is also really difficult to get early.  $10 is generally too much; by the time you can make that kind of coin you would probably be better off buying Colonies, Plats or Provinces.  The reduced price is helpful, but it can actually be more difficult to get no duplicates than it is to get $10 in hand.  Trashing is pretty much required or else you will be gambling with Coppers and Estates.  So maybe it could be used as an engine building slingshot after you've trashed down significantly.  Yes, it is possible to get a hand without duplicates even without trashing, but that hand also needs to produce $5... and without trashing, getting to this stage requires significant luck.

It's broken with Black Market, I think.  Playing all your treasure in the action phase makes it much, much easier to have no duplicates in hand at the start of your buy phase.

I don't think this concept really works at any price.  It is so powerful that it has to be tough to get, but "tough to get" depends entirely on the board.  On many boards this will be impossible to pick up in time for any strategy, so it becomes a complete non-factor in the game.

On boards where you CAN reasonably get it, I feel like it would be dominating.  It empties piles incredibly quickly.  You can play it on another Player King to gain 10 cards at once.  If one of those cards is Border Village or IGG... oh man. 

I don't know.  I appreciate that this is a wild and unique idea, but I don't think it can work.  Props to the creator for submitting something so far out there.

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Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.

This is a Silver+.  At the least, it provides +Buy.  At best, it provides an extra $2 to be worth more than Gold.  To get there, you need to also have 3 other unique treasures in play.  This is always possible with Copper, Silver and Gold, but it appreciates alt Treasures.  There is a bit of a conflict with HoP because they both want to be played last.  HoP actually seems like a really good comparison.  HoP also, in a sense, gives money based on you having non-duplicate cards in play.  According to the Secret Histories, it was turned into a Workshop variant (gainer) so that you couldn't mix HoP's income with the rest of your coin, which was too powerful in earlier testing.  Ingot lets you do that, but it's more limited in that it only looks at Treasure and it only ever gets $2 extra.

This is most powerful when you can trigger it consistently.  This is pretty easy to achieve if you have decent draw.  I think it's too powerful as is.  Some possible tweaks would be to increase cost to $6 or to remove the +Buy.  Maybe even both, because I think it would be pretty easy to activate it every time.

I think it works though.  Looks OK.  Not super exciting to me.

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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.

"While this is in play" would probably be better wording.  I like it.  It's simple and thematic.  My main concern is that Flea Market could become a real detriment in the late game.  You can't double-Province!  The +Buy is quite good for building up the engine (assuming you need many different parts; you can't get two Villages with this) but not so good in the late game when you just want to green.  Quite possibly you would have to skip playing this at all.

But this could be a good thing -- it forces players to play differently.  I would be interested in seeing how it plays out.  I think that it could probably cost $4 because the drawback seems big to me.

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Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile wihout one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

The wording is awkward.  As I understand it, the restriction simply forces you to put the token on the cheapest card possible that doesn't already have a token on it.  So the question is, how many tokens do you have? 

I assume infinite.  With that in mind, this card always plays the same way.  You put tokens on Copper, Curse, Estate, Silver, Duchy, Gold.  Sometimes you also have to hit Ruins and Potion.  Along the way you also put a token on each of the 10 kingdom cards (sometimes 11 with Young Witch).  And then you get to put a token on Province.  So that's usually 16 cards before Province, sometimes ranging up to 19 cards.  In some Prosperity games, two more plays will let you reach Colony.

So... how quickly can you play Grocer?  Can you play it enough times that you can gain Provinces fast enough?  Combos with cycling, TR, KC.

This card is like a time bomb.  If one person goes for it in a non-mirror, the other player has to gain enough VP before the Grocer player is gaining Provinces every round.  Note that the Grocer can gain other things on the way.  Grocer could gain more Grocers, or cycling cards (Warehouse!), or Duchies.  It reminds me of Rebuild with different pacing.  I don't know what the pacing is though.

I'm not fond of the concept.  Maybe Grocer was meant to be Kingdom cards only, rather than Supply cards.

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Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.

This is almost always at least a Market Square, and quite often a full-blown Market.  It isn't too terribly difficult to hit the last two bonuses either.  You only need 5 differently-named cards, and I know that this is quite simple to do from playing HoP games.  Probably needs to cost $5.

I think it works, but I am cooling on the variable/growing bonus concepts.

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Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.

"Reveal and set aside" might be better.  I would have suggested just playing the cards directly, but perhaps that gets confusing with multiple Raffles.  Actually, you could probably just go "Reveal any number" without setting them aside.

This is probably too powerful.  One Treasure in hand and this is a Lab (other draw notwithstanding).  It just gets better if you have differently-named treasures, which is very likely.

I am not a fan because it seems too good for Big Money.  Throw in a +Buy and you're golden.  It can work in engines too, but I think it works better with money just to take advantage of that fixed draw.  Maybe I'm overestimating it though.

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Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.

I don't know if the drawback is really that much of a drawback.  You can use it to clean out Copper from your deck!  It doesn't stop you from buying Provinces.  I just think it would be quite easy to play around the restriction.  I think it would be too powerful at any reasonable price, even with the forced trashing.

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Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.

I don't know how this plays out.  Might be worth it to take the Curse to gain a free Gold?  Probably worth it for power 5s like Wharf.  Maybe worth it late game for Duchies.

I don't think it fits Cornucopia very well.

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Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.

I don't really like the Treasure Map/Tournament mechanic of rewarding you for matching cards.  The card design looks decent though.  As a village, there is still a reason to buy Theater even if the Patron card is Adventurer.  That's nice.  I worry that it becomes way too strong with $5s that you want to spam -- Minion, Torturer and Wharf stand out to me.

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Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
The player to your left chooses are card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

This is pretty weird.  If my opponent plays this, what do I pick first?  It's usually pretty obvious whether it would be better to take a card for yourself or to give it to opponents.  Maybe it gets tough with Silver?  A good terminal when you don't have enough village support?  I don't know.  But eventually, this card lets somebody gain a Province.  Or a Colony, if those are available.  That's a bit much, I think.

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Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.

I think it works.  Looks very reasonable.  Might be a bit too expensive because it takes a lot to get it working.  Note that you need to reveal 3 differently named actions before this beats Festival.

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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.

Not sure about this.  Horse Traders has you discard any 2 cards and gives +$3 and +1 Buy.  This can gives +$1 more, but no +Buy, and you have to top-deck.  I suppose top-decking can be helpful fairly often though.

The on-buy restriction definitely seems extraneous though.  It's a very minor restriction and I don't think it's worth the space on the card.  The main thing it does is it makes it more difficult to open with Wine Cellar.  You would need $5, so you can keep Copper and Estate in hand.  But then this gets foiled in Shelter games.  Not to mention, Wine Cellar would be a weak opening anyway.  Yeah it's a +$4 card, but to get that you are probably top-decking a Copper and Estate.  That's terrible for you!

Ignoring the on-buy, the rest of it does seem pretty reasonable.  But I think it is quite similar to Horse Traders and it's not that interesting to me overall.

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Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.

I feel like the action would slow down the game a lot.

The VP is interesting.  What value can we get out of it?  Games will always have Curse, Victory and Treasure, almost always Action, and Action-Victory is guaranteed with this.  That's 5 types for 2VP.  Some other possible typings are Action-Attack, Action-Reaction, Victory-Reaction, Victory-Treasure, Treasure-Reaction.  That's another 5 possible types.  10 types is still just 5VP, and it takes a fair bit of work to get that into your deck.  Then there are Shelters, which pretty much add 3 types to your deck from the start.  There are Looters, which are worth up to two types (Action-Attack-Looter and Action-Looter).  There are Knights, with Josephine (Victory Knight) having a different typing than the rest.

Hmm... I think the VP value is reasonable.  Even with a bunch of unique cards in the kingdom, the value does not sky-rocket into ridiculous numbers.  However, I think the end effect comes out very similar to Fairgrounds.  You want a bunch of unique typings, which translates very close to unique cards.

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Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.

Hasn't this been submitted endlessly already?  It also doesn't seem particularly Cornucopish to me.

And hey, broken with Fortress.  Trash Fortress, gain Nomad to hand.  Repeat.  This has been pointed out in past submissions, so why isn't it dealt with in this one?

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Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

Similar to Storyteller above, but restricted to your current hand.  I believe it is weaker as a single copy, but much stronger when played in multiples.  The price feels appropriate, and the simple wording is a plus.  I like it.

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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.

I think this is usually a Peddler with a chance of whiffing.  The chance is greater at the start of the game, and it does encourage variety so you can further lower the chance of a match.  Peddler is generally agreed to be worth $4; this is $3 with only a minor drawback.  Not sure if it's enough to justify the low cost.  Feels weak at $4 though, so... I don't know.

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Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.

Man, it's pretty tough to have 5 non-duplicates.  This is pretty much always cursing unless somebody gets lucky, Knights and Black Market notwithstanding.  Maybe if it were $5, in which case it is generally weaker than Mountebank but more difficult to block.

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Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.

Although it looks for differently named cards, it also asks for duplicates of them.  That lowers the Cornucopia feel, especially because you're better of getting 4 of one thing than 1 each of four different things.

4 copies is significant for most cards.  With Wheat Field, you're probably counting on Copper and Silver to hit 2VP.  That's not so interesting, like a nerfed Feodum.  It's hard to count on anything else though.  If there is a good, cheap action card, then it will be contested.  With three players, it's possible that only one hits the requisite 4.  Even with two players you could lose the split if you're unlucky.  You don't want to load up on bad cards because it's just too much investment.

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Potluck
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently named cards in play (counting this): +2 Cards, +$1, discard 2 cards.

This just doesn't appeal to me, but for no particular reason.  I like the name though!  Sorry I don't have better feedback than that for this card. :(

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Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

This is too expensive!

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Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.

This is a copper junker that can be blocked by discarding duplicates.  That makes it stronger than Militia and Cutpurse in the early game, but much weaker in the late game.  Well, maybe not much stronger even early.  It might be stronger because people will often have hands full of Copper, in which case their whole turn gets destroyed when Militia/Cutpurse would only sting a bit  But Outcast lets you just take a Copper instead of discarding at all.  The choice to opponents makes this really weak.  Late game it hurts even less.  In general, you will have a greater variety of cards so you won't have to discard as much.  And if you choose to gain the Copper, the junk matters less because you won't be seeing it as much with the game close to ending.

I don't find this attack very compelling.

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Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.

This doesn't feel cohesive to me, and the name doesn't make sense to me.  OK, so it is always at least a Smithy if you want it.  Sometimes you can can make it non-terminal by discarding 3 different cards.  It can be a gainer too, but it's hard to get anything really wortwhile out of it.  I don't know, it doesn't work for me.  It's like a less-focused Vault.

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Barter Shop
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand. You may discard a card from your hand that is not a duplicate. If you do, gain a card costing up to $6 that is not a copy of a card in your hand.

Cantrip discard an Estate, gain a Gold?  Not always, but fairly often.  I can see how it fits Cornucopia, but it doesn't feel like a great fit to me.  The card wants a bit of variety so you have a non-duplicate to discard, and it gives you variety by having you gain something not in your hand.  But it also doesn't want too much variety in your hand, lest you get locked out of gaining what you want.  Very weird.

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Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.

Pretty much on the same lines as Ingot, above.  Differences:

Ingot is worth $1 more, and always comes with +1 Buy.  This is only a Copper base, and the +Buy is tied to the condition.  Sharpening Stone doesn't count itself, but it counts cards in general rather than Treasure only like Ingot.

I think I like this version more than Ingot, but the concept still isn't thrilling.

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Scythe
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Trash any number of differently named cards from your hand. Gain a card with cost less than twice the number of cards trashed.

I think this is only good against Ruins.  When you trash, you mainly want to trash junk.  This card is very weak for clearing out starting junk -- at best, you can remove 1 Estate and 1 Copper at once.  Granted, you can trash up to 4 cards at once with Shelters, if you get a perfect draw.  So how is this as a gainer?  Trashing 2 cards is the most likely situation, in which case you can gain a card costing up to $3.  Not that amazing.  If you trash 3 cards, you can get a $5 card.  If you trash 4 cards, you can get a $7.  That's not that great.  If you are trashing 3 or 4 differently named cards, you are probably trashing a Silver at least.

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Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

OK, first response to this was just a joke. ;)

The reaction is fitting for the card name, but the card name does not fit Cornucopia IMO.  And actually, this card as a whole does not fit Cornucopia.  Not even slightly.  It's a self-stacking card, so you want multiple Hydras, and the reaction gains you more Hydras... that's the antithesis of "variety".

Anyway, I don't like self-stackers very much in general.  It stacks quickly too.  First one is a cantrip, second one is a lab.  $5 would probably be too expensive (3 Labs are still better than 3 Hydras that need to collide, and Labs are more reliable overall) but $4 might be too cheap.  Maybe $4 would be OK.

But again, this isn't even close to fitting the theme.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #49 on: November 18, 2013, 06:19:09 pm »
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Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

Giving +1 action to subsequent plays of cards is very scary and not something I think we should be able to do for $4. I feel like this would be better costing 5 with a small buff.

Is it really so scary?  It only gives +1 action for non-duplicates.  In the ideal case, Storyteller is the very first card you play.  If you want to play two duplicate cards, it's no better than Village.  You have to play two different cards for it to be better than Village, and a third differently named card for that advantage to matter at all.  And this is the ideal case -- it doesn't help you much at all if you play it after other action cards.  They are also junk if multiples collide, unlike Village which is always a cantrip.  Given that most engines like to play duplicates (e.g. multiple draw cards), this doesn't really seem so scary to me.


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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
Seems a bit too similar to menagerie.

Did you misread it?  It's almost the opposite of Menagerie.  Scarecrow is "draw, then discard until you have no duplicates".  Menagerie is "if you have no duplicates, draw".  Those would not play similarly at all.


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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.
The fact that this invalidates other sources of +buy is a large problem.

It doesn't invalidate other +Buy because of that gigantic drawback.


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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.
The buy restriction is actually pretty harsh and the card is probably fine without it given that you'll usually either be topdecking victory cards (making your next hand worse) stuff that reduces the value of the $4 you're getting.

Am I underestimating this restriction?  It seems like a very weak restriction to me, not harsh at all.  It's not terribly difficult to keep 2 differently named cards in your hand.
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #50 on: November 18, 2013, 06:30:43 pm »
+2

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Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.

Kind of like Tribute, but it does it to yourself, so it encourages diversity a little there.  It can give +buy, but I don't think that's nearly enough to make up for only one card on victory card.  You can also stack your own deck more easily than you can stack your opponents', but I think it's still just really really weak.  Probably the "best" case is +1 card, +$2, which is not amazing for $5, and it's generally unreliable.  I suspect it's worse than Tribute.  It might be okay at $4, but I still don't think it's different enough from Tribute to be exciting.

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Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I think I like this a lot, though I'm not sure I understand it correctly.  If I reveal Copper, Copper, Estate, Silver, do I get one of the Coppers, or neither of them?  If it's the former I think it's fine at $4 (though it probably tends to compare favorably to Harvest, but Harvest doesn't see much play anyway), if it's the latter I suspect it's too weak, though often times the duplicates will be Copper, so maybe it's good still.  It's really simple though and it gives us a terminal drawer that rewards diversity, which fits right into Cornucopia.

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Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

I didn't like it on first reading but the more I think about it the more I like it.  It turns Witch into a painful lab, except not really because it only works the first time.  I wonder if it might be too strong, or if it will be terribroken, but I think I like it enough to vote for it.

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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

It's a nice concept, but I think it will generally be very weak.  The combo with Menagerie is probably fun but not strong.  If it gave virtual coin instead of cards I think it would be an interesting card, but the strength of the card-drawing is so heavily mitigated by the discarding that it will be hard to make good use of it.

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Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).

Wow, this has to be terribroken.  Or maybe just broken.  Being able to stack 10 $5 cards on top of your deck is pretty ridiculous.

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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.

I think this is too similar to vanilla Market most of the time, but it's an interesting concept.  I wonder how often Flea Market would shine while Market would not?

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Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile wihout one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

I think this is terribroken.  Most of the time it will be really slow, but in the games where the game has already been slowed down (by strong attacks or something) then it gets crazy good, especially because it's non-terminal.

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Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.

So it's usually at least a Market Square, often times a Market, and possibly up to a Level 2 City.  It feels a little strong at $4 to me, but it's probably not much stronger than Ironmonger (rhyme) so maybe it's fine.

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Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.

This sounds bonkers strong.  It's at least a Lab (assuming you have a treasure in hand) and often times better.  I'm not really sold on rewarding for treasure diversity either, I feel like Cornucopia's diversity theme is intended to encourage whacky engines and slogs; in BM you usually have differently named treasures anyway.

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Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.

It's interesting, but I think in the absence of heavy trashing it's too strong, and in the presence of heavy trashing it will never be purchased.  Hard to say for sure though.

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Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.

I'm not against the idea of adding a new supply pile YW-style, but I don't really think this does it in an exciting way.

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Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
The player to your left chooses are card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

I think this is mostly a more complicated way of doing what Jester does, without as much Copper junking.  While the choice that you make in deciding what to take can be interesting, I don't like that it can potentially force you to gain a Province later on.  Maybe it would be more fun if it was limited to kingdom piles?

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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.

It's seems like a kind of funky Mandarin variant, but I don't like it because the diversity theme seems forced.  The on-buy tries to push the diversity, but it just doesn't feel elegant to me.

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Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.

I think +1 card, +1 action, trash a card is already too strong for $4.  I'm not really a fan of the "swapping out cards for equal cost cards" concept either.

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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.

I think this will hit too often to cost only $3.  Maybe it would be okay at $4?

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Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.

I don't really think Cornucopia needs another curser, especially at $4.  I like the concept of an attack card that punishes for lack of diversity, but I think you would need another way to do it...

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Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.

This sounds like it's trying to do what Fairgrounds did in a different way.  It rewards you for having a lot of cards of which you have a lot of copies.  I'm not really sure how well that would work, but I think Fairgrounds has already covered the territory of "victory card that rewards diversity".

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Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

I suspect it's pretty weak at $999.  If you manage to get one and your opponent plays an attack, you can net yourself a lot of TfB fodder, but I'm not sure how you will ever get the first one.

Okay, seriously, the price is an integral part of the card.  If you want feedback on your card, we need a price before we can tell you how it will play out.  What you're doing is you're asking each person who critiques the card to consider how it would play at every possible price point in the $2-$6 range, which in theory is 5 times as much work as considering the card at one price point.  (In practice it's not that much worse, but it's still a lot harder.)  I don't think you're going to fix the problem of "not enough feedback" by asking people to take more effort in critiquing your card.  As the designer, you've thought about your card a lot more than we have, so you will be better able than us to give us a rough idea of how much it should cost.

I personally had a lot of trouble deciding on a vanilla bonus for my card.  But I gave it my best shot, rather than just saying "+999 cards" and letting everyone else decide for me.  If people don't like the vanilla bonus on my card then they can change it (if it wins, which I doubt it will), but since I know that I've thought about my card a lot more than everyone else, I felt well-qualified to announce to everyone a rough estimate of what I think is the best vanilla bonus for the card.  We are all aware that the winner of the contest can be tweaked as appropriate.  If you are getting comments that just say "too weak" or "too strong", then those either mean that "the card is too weak/strong at the current price point, but after that's fixed I like it" or that "the card is too weak/strong at any price point", both of which are valuable pieces of feedback on the card.

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Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.

This looks a lot like Old Gaffer, but fixes some of the problems I had with it.  For one, it's not a curser, which Cornucopia doesn't need.  Additionally, it's easier to block the junking, by letting other players discard first.  However, I worry that it might be too weak, and I also think it may be too similar to Jester as a Copper junker (and again, Cornucopia doesn't really need another attack).

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Barter Shop
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand. You may discard a card from your hand that is not a duplicate. If you do, gain a card costing up to $6 that is not a copy of a card in your hand.

I think this will generally be really strong.  A cantrip that easily gains Gold?  I would think it's also pretty swingy; sometimes you'll have a single Estate, sometimes two.  Even discarding Gold to gain Gold is probably not bad a lot of the time, but the flexibility to gain other $5's and $6's I think makes the reward a lot greater than the cost.

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Scythe
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Trash any number of differently named cards from your hand. Gain a card with cost less than twice the number of cards trashed.

I think it's probably really weak and really swingy.  It's weak because after you use it to trash Estates it's pretty much dead, and it's swingy because if it misses Copper/Estate, it's completely dead for that shuffle.  It also seems really similar (and compares unfavorably) to Remake, except that it goes bonkers with Shelters.
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Aidan Millow

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #51 on: November 18, 2013, 08:56:30 pm »
+1

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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
Seems a bit too similar to menagerie.

Did you misread it?  It's almost the opposite of Menagerie.  Scarecrow is "draw, then discard until you have no duplicates".  Menagerie is "if you have no duplicates, draw".  Those would not play similarly at all.
I mean more aesthetically than in actual gameplay.

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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.
The fact that this invalidates other sources of +buy is a large problem.

It doesn't invalidate other +Buy because of that gigantic drawback.
Maybe overide is a better word. The problem I'm seeing is that is you play this then you can't buy multiples of the same card even if you have other +buy.

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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.
The buy restriction is actually pretty harsh and the card is probably fine without it given that you'll usually either be topdecking victory cards (making your next hand worse) stuff that reduces the value of the $4 you're getting.

Am I underestimating this restriction?  It seems like a very weak restriction to me, not harsh at all.  It's not terribly difficult to keep 2 differently named cards in your hand.
To get around the restriction you'll usually need to not play something you otherwise could, this increases its effective cost to $5 at least in most situations.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #52 on: November 19, 2013, 01:23:02 am »
+1

I did it! I made a video review of the Cornucopia cards! Hooray!

A couple disclaimers:

1) I tried to go fast, and may have misread a number of cards. (I know at one point I said the one that makes unique cards nonterminal wrong.)
2) I may have rejected cards for arbitrary reasons.
3) I grew tired of tokens on piles.
4) One of these cards is mind.
5) I spent too much time on a card that's sort of like my Dark Ages card, Renovate.

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GwinnR

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #53 on: November 19, 2013, 01:40:46 am »
0

Again the cards I like the most:

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Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.
Simple and well fitting to the theme. Seems to be not the strongest card, but I think it is not too weak.

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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
This looks cool. You really have to think about playing it or not. Also not so strong, but if you could trash down, you get a level 2 City.

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Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.
Nice idea of a Treasure Card that benefits from varity.

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Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile wihout one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.
It depends on the board ;-) If there are no cheap Supply cards, this is really strong. If there are some of them you need to play some Grocers to make them usefull. I like this mechanism.

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Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.
Nice idea to use the variety of the other players.

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Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.
I don't know how good this will be. But an interesting card for deck-trackers ;-)

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Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.
Same idea as Ingot. I think Ingot is a little better balanced, but it is the idea, not the cost, what I vote for.
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Robz888

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #54 on: November 19, 2013, 01:56:10 am »
0

Quote
Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.

This looks a lot like Old Gaffer, but fixes some of the problems I had with it.  For one, it's not a curser, which Cornucopia doesn't need.  Additionally, it's easier to block the junking, by letting other players discard first.  However, I worry that it might be too weak, and I also think it may be too similar to Jester as a Copper junker (and again, Cornucopia doesn't really need another attack).

This card is pointlessly weak. It's basically Noble Brigand, except it doesn't steal Treasure, ever. Which is obviously terrible. The attack on your opponent is weaker than NB (and blockable!), and the benefit to you is much worse (you get +1 buy, but you don't steal Treasure!).
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #55 on: November 19, 2013, 08:55:55 am »
0

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Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I've seen this card get a lot of love, and it's probably a fine, balanced card. But, to be honest, it's pretty boring compared to many of the other options. It's a terminal draw that's going to play slightly better than Smithy in diverse engines and usually worse for BM. It's a "safe" vote, but I hope we get a more interesting winner.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #56 on: November 19, 2013, 09:09:40 am »
+2

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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.

This is an interesting concept, but I think I don't like it mainly because of the problems it produces when greening. But, there might be some subtle problems with things like cost reduction. Imagine you play 5 Highways and a Flea Market, and Knights are on the board. That means you can drain the entire Knights pile (since they're all different), as well as grab one of every other card costing $5 or less! That's pretty nuts. Even without Knights, Highway + Flea Circus just feels too crazy.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #57 on: November 19, 2013, 09:14:06 am »
0

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Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.

I like this card, though I agree that it's too strong as-is. I think if it instead drew to 4 cards in hand it would be reasonably balanced. I think in that context it would be more of an engine card than BM.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #58 on: November 19, 2013, 09:44:06 am »
+1

Quote
Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.

I think this card as is, is incredibly strong for any price. With a single Treasure in hand is kind-of equivalent to Lab (may be better or worse depending on what other actions are there, it is worse for other Treasure-interactions like Stables, it is better for draw-to-X). But, most significantly, with 2 different Treasures in hand, this is already double-Lab, which is crazy strong. And 2 different Treasures in hand is not incredibly rare (Copper+Silver/Gold). And, it can even get better. I think it should draw to 4 or even to 3 or forbid Copper or some important nerf. If it is going to be better than Lab in many cases, it has to be worse than Lab in some others. Plus, this combos with disappearing actions in a way Lab does not, so I think it is much better. Not having Treasure in hand is probably an too narrow case.

A good nerf to try would be "+1 Action. Do this any number of times: Play a Treasure differently named from Treasures you have in play. Draw up to 5.". This is still a good card, but it does not stack with itself all that well, so it is less directly comparable to Lab, which is a good thing. And I think it feels a lot more Cornucopia-y.

BTW, in the text, I don't see the need to set aside Treasures and then play instead of playing them directly. If the idea is to set them aside until the Buy phase to avoid Black Market ackwardness, then it is not working.

EDIT: This is probably even better:
"+1 Action. Do this any number of times: Play a Treasure differently named from Treasures you have in play. If you do, +1 Card."
« Last Edit: November 19, 2013, 09:45:42 am by soulnet »
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #59 on: November 19, 2013, 12:24:15 pm »
+1

Ballot update: Carnival now has [+1 Card; +1 Aciton].

On a side note, Robz, I loved your video. However, due to your token fatigue, you appear to have missed the fact that when you play Carnival, the player to your left chooses the Supply pile, then you choose whether you gain the card or they do. So you can't just play it and choose to hand out Curses.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #60 on: November 19, 2013, 12:36:03 pm »
0

Ballot update: Carnival now has [+1 Card; +1 Aciton].

On a side note, Robz, I loved your video. However, due to your token fatigue, you appear to have missed the fact that when you play Carnival, the player to your left chooses the Supply pile, then you choose whether you gain the card or they do. So you can't just play it and choose to hand out Curses.

Ah, yes. Okay, that's more interesting then. More interesting. Well, I think now it's almost starting to encroach on the strategic landscape of that first card we approved, Indulgence or whatever it ended up being called.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #61 on: November 19, 2013, 02:08:52 pm »
+6

Hello Everyone, this is my first time commenting on submissions, and I figured I would take a different approach to provide a little variety, and look at the cards from a new angle.  If you've read some of my other posts on the forum, then you probably guessed that the new angle is flavor!

Yes, I know flavor should not determine the winner and is not the most important part of card design, but sometimes a top-down flavor design can turn into a great card that is a ton of fun to play. Also, since everyone else mostly comments on mechanics and such, I figure having one guy comment on flavor seems about right. And since these contests are now including card names, why not have some constructive comments about the name choices too!?

For those who maybe don't know or haven't heard the term "flavor" used, it is essentially the story of the card. How the card expresses, through mechanics and gameplay interaction, what it is.  How does the card use it's rules and text to represent it's real life name or behavior.

Using Festival as an example, a festival has lots of stuff going on (represented by +2 Actions), it generates money for the people who run it (+$2), and there's usually multiple vendors and things to purchase (+1 buy).  A complex thing represented by some simple actions to create a "flavor" that makes the game more interesting, and helps tell the story of what you are doing on your turn.
Some cards use a different (but equally, if not more impressive) approach to find flavor in specific mechanics, rules, and behaviors.  An example of a great flavor card is Pearl Diver.  While it may not be the best or most useful card to buy, it certainly is clear how the card represents it's name. Using your deck to represent the oceans, the Pearl Diver scours the bottom and looks for a Pearl (a good card) and can retrieve it for you.

Anyway, on to the cards.  I hope you find these comments useful, or at least enjoyable.  I think flavor is an important part of the game, and at least one person will be voting with that in mind (don't worry, I won't vote for flavorful cards that are absolutely terrible or that wouldn't make sense to play with).


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Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.

Not too sure I understand the name. I'm guessing it's the greater bounty that you receive as a reward that you reap for having two different cards, as in a bountiful harvest.  Not the bounty you get for capturing a criminal.  I suppose I could accept that the mechanic is like reaping your crops, and you collect the bounty depending on what kind of crop you reap.


Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

It fits Cornucopia's flavor theme, and I'm thinking it's using the top of your deck to rep a Field, which you plow and reap.  The more different cards you have, the bigger your field.


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Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

This makes perfect sense to me.  The Storyteller keeps talking as long as he's got new stories to tell (rep'd by the different actions). If you have a deck full of the same story, the teller won't have much to do.  An interesting design that may need some smoother text.  I like this one.


Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

I've thought a while about this one, but can't quite make the connection.  It's a cool concept, with a nice risk/reward ratio, but I just don't see what makes it a Scarecrow... I can't even come up with a guess that makes sense.  Feel free to help me out.


Quote
Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).

I'm thinking Player King is referring to the actual Dominion player that can manage to manipulate his deck to be so diverse (Treasure/Victory-wise anyway, since actions you play aren't in your hand at your buy phase) that he can show a hand with no duplicates?  Doesn't really make me love it from a flavor standpoint... Unless the author meant Player as in a Stage Actor??? In which case, I like this card much better!  It's the actor showing off his many talents (auditioning, if you will), and if he's diverse enough, he gets paid. Although the trash mechanic doesn't really fit that interpretation... hmmm...


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Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.

An ingot can certainly be rep'd as a treasure card, but I don't see how it relates to being more valuable by having other kinds of treasure next to it.  If anything, an ingot (essentially an un-crafted bar of metal) would lose value when placed next to other valuables.  Treasures may be the most difficult cards to design with flavor, so this card still gets points in my book.


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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.

Makes perfect sense.  It has the market mechanic, but a Flea Market is usually an assortment of odds and ends, and is not where you buy items in bulk (rep'd nicely by the "no copies" restriction).


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Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile wihout one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

I can't even comment on the flavor of this card because I find it WAY too confusing the way it is worded.  Also, shouldn't it have a set-up rule? How many Grocer tokens does each player have?


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Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.

Ok, I can accept the name.  You show your hand and get rewarded based on how pretty it is.  It's fun.


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Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.

Oooo, playing Treasures in the Action phase... Dangerous (Hello Tactician!)... Anyway, I'm not getting how this is a raffle at all. There's not really any kind of randomness to the action.  You aren't paying anything for a chance at a reward.  You get to play the treasures you set aside, and you replace them with more cards... and it's not terminal!  Feels more like a Gift than a Raffle.


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Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.

A pretty interesting card, but not fitting the Cornucopia theme (flavor-wise). Vanguard is a part of a military, and Cornucopia is not really about war, but about farming and celebrations.  I guess the card represents the vanguard (kind of like scouts that lead an army into battle and secure battle positions) by branching out and helping you secure different positions (rep’d by cards that you don’t already have), but I think there could be a better name for this action.


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Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.

Hmmm. Pariah... one who is hated or despised... so you get cursed when you copy what he does because you hate him so much?  Not too sure about this one.


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Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.

Ok. It fits the theme, and it is pretty clear how it is a Theatre.  You get rewarded for having more patrons show up to your theatre when you put on a show.  Flavor-wise, I think the reward should be $ instead of cards, since a theatre would generate revenue.  Card drawing (especially more than one card) can represent many things (like knowledge/learning, building things, etc.) but generating revenue is not usually one of them.


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Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
+1 Card. +1 Action. The player to your left chooses a card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

I think this card needs work to prevent some shenanigans that I don’t think the author intended.  But after some tuning, I guess I could see how this card reps the games at a carnival. It’s as if you are running the carnival, and the player to your left plays the games, he has a choice, but whatever he chooses, you ultimately decide who benefits from that choice (kind of representing a shady carny or rigged games).


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Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.

The flavor makes sense on this one.  It’s a break off from the main festival (which would explain why it’s worse than festival), but you can generate more revenue based of the variety of acts you can exhibit.  A side show is essentially an exhibition of variety acts, so it could even be called that Variety Show and still work.


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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.

So you need a variety of vintage wines (different cards in your hand) to even purchase a Wine Cellar, then once you do, you can generate revenue by stocking the wine and letting it age? As in, let the wine (cards) sit on top of your deck for a turn... I guess that makes sense.  Although, I would’ve liked it to be a closer variant to Cellar, since that’s already an established flavor mechanic.  I guess trading in cards for money is kind of close.  I actually like this card quite a bit.


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Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.

This is a tough one.  Seems kind of over-complicated, but I’ll take a stab at the flavor.  The Traveling part makes sense since it lets you traverse over different lands (rep’d by the fact that is filters out different named victory cards).  Not sure what makes this a Circus though.  A circus would usually mean +Actions or +$, I don’t see the VP connection.  Maybe the author was thinking the Circus rewards variety? Since the reward is VP though, I think it would be better with a different name. Traveling Diplomat maybe, or Traveling Noble?


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Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.

A Nomad is someone who survives by constant travelling and exploiting of limited resources.  I supposed that could be rep’d by the trashing of one resource (once you’re done with it) and finding another, which you get to use right away because Nomads are good at getting use out of what they gather.


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Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

This makes some sense in that a harvest generally suggests rewarding a variety of crops (differently named cards).  So the Queen of the Harvest lets you reap a piece of each of your fields, the more fields you have, the more you can reap.  Not the strongest flavor, but the card is one of my favorites (I’m a bit of an action whore).


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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.

This is hands down my favorite card submission.  Flavor-wise, it makes perfect sense.  The Showman (would also work with a name like Magician or Entertainer) puts on a show, tries to do a little trick and wow the audience.  If he pulls off his trick, he gets praise and money, if his trick fails, he get’s nothing.  It’s a cute little mechanic that helps tell the story of the card, and seems like it would be fun to play with.  Well done.


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Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.

Gaffer, huh?  There are few different meanings for a Gaffer (this is where art is extremely helpful for flavor), but I don’t think any of them makes sense as a curser.  Whether it’s a sailor, a glassblower, an electrician on a film set, or just an old man, what gives him the ability to curse people who don’t have variety in their life?  Don’t get me wrong, I actually like the card itself, but I think it needs a new name, or a different penalty for having duplicate cards.


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Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.

I’m not quite sure about this one.  It rewards for having a VARIETY of DUPLICATES!  It does create an interesting strategy, I guess.  For flavor, a Wheat Field makes sense as a victory card, but specifying the crop in the field kind of contradicts the “differently named” part.  I think a name like Crop Fields would make more sense.  You get VP based on the number of different crops you grow, but each field has to be big enough to provide a substantial gain.


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Potluck
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently named cards in play (counting this): +2 Cards, +$1, discard 2 cards.

If you name a card Potluck, it really should have a mechanic that includes all players contributing to the effect.  You could probably just call this one a Stew.  Sorry if that sounded mean, it’s more of a joke than a serious criticism.  I guess the idea is that you get a reward for having a wide variety of dishes brought to your potluck?  Feels like a stretch, and the mechanic is interesting enough that it could benefit from having a name that easier relates to what it does.


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Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

I love the controversy this card has caused, and I agree with others that have said cost can be an important part of critiquing a card. (I believe it is up to the critiques to provide suggestive feedback if they believe a card is over or under priced, not just simply say it’s too weak or strong).  Flavor-wise, Hydra makes perfect sense.  The reaction mechanic reps a head being cut off and two growing back, and the action mechanic reps each head multiplying the ferocity (cards and actions) of the monster.  The only thing is, it doesn’t fit the Cornucopia theme at all!  Not that there has been an expansion where monsters have been a theme... this card would need an entirely new expansion to fit in! Maybe a greek mythology expansion? (Hello, Theros!)


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Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.

I like the idea of this card, but I need help figuring out what makes it an Outcast?  How does an outcast give you money and extra buys, and why does he look at other players and give them copper if they own two of the same item?  I’m lost of the flavor.


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Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.

So a Dairy harvests milk from animals, which fits Cornucopia, and I’m thinking you get paid more if you have more types of milk?  Like, I can trade for more expensive items if my Dairy is producing cow, goat, and buffalo milk? So differently named cards are representing different types of animals.  Interesting...


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Barter Shop
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand. You may discard a card from your hand that is not a duplicate. If you do, gain a card costing up to $6 that is not a copy of a card in your hand.

Ok, you trade unique items for other unique items, seems legit that this sort of thing would happen at a Barter Shop.  The name fits.


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Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.

The name confuses me a little.  So, ok, it’s a stone, and it has a little value, but how does having lots of variety represent sharpening?  Maybe you get rewarded for having lots of different weapons to sharpen?  I don’t see it.


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Scythe
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Trash any number of differently named cards from your hand. Gain a card with cost less than twice the number of cards trashed.

I’m thinking Scythe was chosen as the name just because it fits Cornucopia’s theme.   I guess the action can kind of be related to what a scythe does; reaping lots of crop and trading in a large quantity of it for a single item of quality.  I feel like the name needs to be something more representative of the action though.  A scythe doesn’t do much on its own; you need a skilled worker to do the mowing (or scything).  Maybe Crop Scythers, or Field Mowers?


Well, that’s it.  Some really good flavorful names in there.  I’m sure I derived some flavor connections in there that weren’t intentional by the authors, but that’s all part of the game.  The players are going to make their own connections whether they were intentional or not.   Hopefully some of you will take a little of what I’ve offered and add it to the mix of things you consider when voting on a card.  Please respond with your own interpretations of flavor if you’d like, especially on the ones I had no idea about.

Thanks!
« Last Edit: November 19, 2013, 02:21:46 pm by Showdown35 »
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #62 on: November 19, 2013, 04:05:05 pm »
+1

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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
Seems a bit too similar to menagerie.

Did you misread it?  It's almost the opposite of Menagerie.  Scarecrow is "draw, then discard until you have no duplicates".  Menagerie is "if you have no duplicates, draw".  Those would not play similarly at all.
I mean more aesthetically than in actual gameplay.

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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.
The fact that this invalidates other sources of +buy is a large problem.

It doesn't invalidate other +Buy because of that gigantic drawback.
Maybe overide is a better word. The problem I'm seeing is that is you play this then you can't buy multiples of the same card even if you have other +buy.

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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.
The buy restriction is actually pretty harsh and the card is probably fine without it given that you'll usually either be topdecking victory cards (making your next hand worse) stuff that reduces the value of the $4 you're getting.

Am I underestimating this restriction?  It seems like a very weak restriction to me, not harsh at all.  It's not terribly difficult to keep 2 differently named cards in your hand.
To get around the restriction you'll usually need to not play something you otherwise could, this increases its effective cost to $5 at least in most situations.

Not sure what you mean by "aesthetic" in this context.

The override point is fair.  It actually doesn't bother me that much, but I see why people might be put off by that.  I see Flea Market as a building card only, after which it is actually a big hindrance.  It might still be useful in some situations, but whether that's worth the drawback is something you have to figure out.  Schneau points out a scary interaction with cost reduction and Knights though.

I talked about the restriction on Wine Cellar in my own big review post, but it still doesn't seem that big to me.  It seems like it would be most hindering in the early game, but it's a bad card in the early game anyway because the anti-cycling is worse for you.  But in the end, we both came to the same conclusion anyway -- the card would be better without that restriction.



Ballot update: Carnival now has [+1 Card; +1 Aciton].

Doesn't really change much for me.  I didn't think it was too weak before, and my biggest concern was just that it would eventually give somebody a Province or even a Colony.



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Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.

Not too sure I understand the name. I'm guessing it's the greater bounty that you receive as a reward that you reap for having two different cards, as in a bountiful harvest.  Not the bounty you get for capturing a criminal.  I suppose I could accept that the mechanic is like reaping your crops, and you collect the bounty depending on what kind of crop you reap.

I believe it's just a riff on Tribute.  The card is similar to Tribute, and a Tribute from the giver is a Bounty to the recipient.  Something like that.

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Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.

This is a tough one.  Seems kind of over-complicated, but I’ll take a stab at the flavor.  The Traveling part makes sense since it lets you traverse over different lands (rep’d by the fact that is filters out different named victory cards).  Not sure what makes this a Circus though.  A circus would usually mean +Actions or +$, I don’t see the VP connection.  Maybe the author was thinking the Circus rewards variety? Since the reward is VP though, I think it would be better with a different name. Traveling Diplomat maybe, or Traveling Noble?

Well, the VP is similar to Fairgrounds, and Fairgrounds are somewhat related to the Circus.



Thanks for your thoughts on the flavour.  I like considering flavour too, but I generally only call it out when it stands out to me (fitting really well, or not fitting even slightly).  Sometimes I omit those thoughts anyway because the mechanics are interesting to consider, and I feel that they are a bit more important because the card name can always be changed afterwards.  But it's fun to think about it, for sure!
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #63 on: November 19, 2013, 05:40:34 pm »
0

Ballot update: I added a clarification to Grocer.

Quote
Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile without one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

Clarification: Each player has a set of identical tokens that are distinguishable from other players' tokens. Tokens are not artificially limited.

Also, the author has affirmed that it is indeed supposed to be "Supply pile", not just "Kingdom card pile".
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Showdown35

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #64 on: November 19, 2013, 05:44:07 pm »
+2

I agree that flavor is not the most important factor, and yes, names can be easily changed, but so can costs or vanilla bonuses, and everyone seems concerned with critiquing those!  The fact that names are even required is a similar to the fact that costs are required. I think peoples votes are swayed by flavor more than they admit. If you have a personal tie to, say acting, you are probably more apt to look for positives in a card called Theatre, or Stage Show, more so than a card with a negative name (negative to you personally). I'm not saying nobody can rise above that and give purely unbiased comments, but we are all human, and our personal interests are bound to leak into our thought process.

I digress. Since nobody else really comments on flavor, aside from "I don't know if I like that name" type comments, and considering card names are now a part of the submissions, I've taken it upon myself to act as the resident flavor guy to get sone ideas on how the cards can be tweaked or improved to be a little more fun from a flavor standpoint.
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Robz888

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #65 on: November 19, 2013, 05:49:11 pm »
+2

I agree that flavor is not the most important factor, and yes, names can be easily changed, but so can costs or vanilla bonuses, and everyone seems concerned with critiquing those!  The fact that names are even required is a similar to the fact that costs are required. I think peoples votes are swayed by flavor more than they admit. If you have a personal tie to, say acting, you are probably more apt to look for positives in a card called Theatre, or Stage Show, more so than a card with a negative name (negative to you personally). I'm not saying nobody can rise above that and give purely unbiased comments, but we are all human, and our personal interests are bound to leak into our thought process.

I digress. Since nobody else really comments on flavor, aside from "I don't know if I like that name" type comments, and considering card names are now a part of the submissions, I've taken it upon myself to act as the resident flavor guy to get sone ideas on how the cards can be tweaked or improved to be a little more fun from a flavor standpoint.

Showdown, you should watch my Youtube video. I do some flavor critiquing as well!
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Showdown35

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #66 on: November 19, 2013, 07:10:58 pm »
0

I agree that flavor is not the most important factor, and yes, names can be easily changed, but so can costs or vanilla bonuses, and everyone seems concerned with critiquing those!  The fact that names are even required is a similar to the fact that costs are required. I think peoples votes are swayed by flavor more than they admit. If you have a personal tie to, say acting, you are probably more apt to look for positives in a card called Theatre, or Stage Show, more so than a card with a negative name (negative to you personally). I'm not saying nobody can rise above that and give purely unbiased comments, but we are all human, and our personal interests are bound to leak into our thought process.

I digress. Since nobody else really comments on flavor, aside from "I don't know if I like that name" type comments, and considering card names are now a part of the submissions, I've taken it upon myself to act as the resident flavor guy to get sone ideas on how the cards can be tweaked or improved to be a little more fun from a flavor standpoint.

Showdown, you should watch my Youtube video. I do some flavor critiquing as well!



I actually did watch some of your video, but 45 mins is a bit too long for me to stare at a screen and listen to someone talk. I esentially skipped to your critique of my card, which is what I assume most people do!... but I did catch a few cards you ceitiqued, and it was a comment you made that I was referring to when I said "I don't know if I like the name"!!

I will take another try at watching your vid, maybe I'll do it in 9 minute shifts!


Sorry, just realized I may have sounded rude. I'm just poking fun at the length of the vid, light-heartedly of course. I actually think your vids are pretty cool. Certainly doesn't take up as much space on the forum!
« Last Edit: November 19, 2013, 07:14:19 pm by Showdown35 »
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Eggplantation

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #67 on: November 20, 2013, 05:42:27 am »
0

I thought I might as well give all the cards a review for the first time. I have entered the contests but haven't reviewed them yet, better late than never! Note one of these cards is mine, I will try and be fair.



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Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.
Unfortunately reminds me a little too much of Tribute. You could potentially set this card up with cards like cartographer, but it still compares a little unfavourable to Tribute for me.

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Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.
Looks pretty cool. It will often just be a smithy, but hey smithy costs $4 too, then sometimes better or worse. Nice.

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.
Seems like an interesting village variant. You might but able to get away with making it a cantrip, but testing needed. However it might be needed because it is pretty powerful otherwise... I am undecided. I think it good how it is.

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
I like it. I also like the little combo with Menagerie. Powerful if used correctly, but unlike menagerie it can hurt your hand.

Quote
Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).
It has interesting stuff going on, but it seems a too crazily powerful. You can gain a whole kingdom pile of $5 by trashing a Player King, which is super powerful. I can imagine this being hilarious though.  :P
The mechanics are pretty interesting, it just might need to gain $4 cards, and maybe half as many as the trashed cards price or something. I do like the idea of a jackpot of cards at a hefty price.

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Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.
Looking pretty hot. It is good that it is always possible to activate this. Not quite sure how how the name make sense thematically, besides just being currency, but hey, super minor detail.

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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.
I think this would be too similar to market in most games to get my vote. Interesting idea.

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Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile without one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

Clarification: Each player has a set of identical tokens that are distinguishable from other players' tokens. Tokens are not artificially limited.
Cool idea, but I am not sure how it would play out. After you play this 17 times you could gain provinces every play. I am not against cards gaining provinces if it is done in a balanced way, which this might be. 17 times is nothing to be laughed at. But neither are provinces. I think it is interesting, I can't say much more without testing.

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Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.
Mechanics wise, it definitely goes along with the variety theme of Cornucopia. It is pretty nice, but I think it is overshadowed by some of the other cards in my personal opinion. Might be a little too expensive since the end bit is hard to control, but I am not judging it on its price.

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Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.
Wow, power! yeah I can definitely sense the power of this one... I think it is probably too good for its cost, but I don't mind the actual ability. I think it would have to be nerfed or cost more, but I like cards that increase the power of draw-to-X engines because they are cool, and a relatively unexplored mechanic.

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Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.
Not too bad, just I think it might be a little annoying. Probably fine balance wise though. Pretty nice for the early game. Engines dislike it, I would think, which seems to be the type of deck you would want to build with it, which is an odd mix.

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Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.
So essentially it gives you opponent/s a curse and leaves you both at similar deck quality, or gains you a $6 card. Seems  fairly reasonable. You can be tactical and gain an expensive card that your opponent doesn't want so this is just an awesome gainer.

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Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.
I think this is decent. Probably not quite rocking my excitement-meter enough for me to vote for it though.

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Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
+1 Card. +1 Action. The player to your left chooses a card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

EDIT: Carnival now gives [+1 Card; +1 Action].

Mechanics wise I think this is fairly cool. At the start especially, and a lot of the time it will gain you cards you don't really want, or give your opponents cards you don't really want them to have, but would rather not have yourself, so that helps balance it a little. However sometimes it jackpots like with a gold or a province. They can only be gained every 17 plays though, which is a lot of plays! I think this card is too cheap, especially since it was cantrip-ified, but makes it more spammy which is helps the card. Again voting on  mechanics though.

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Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.
Pretty cool, can be like an almost super festival which is fun times for the engine player. Again not sure if I am excited enough to vote for it but it is interesting. Oh, it would be a little tricky to keep track of how much each of these are worth, especially is you have heaps in an engine, so this might be a problem.

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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.
Sorta comparable to horse traders. This give you more coinage, but the 'self attack' is more nasty, like a ghost ship instead of a militia (in a sense). Not too bad, but I think Harvest covers the space for variety-based-virtual-money.

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Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.
I like this. The top is considerably nerfed by the fact that you can only set aside differently named victory cards, which makes it pretty balanced. And the bottom is cool. Similar to Fairgrounds, but different enough to make me happy. The type thingo is cool, even though similar to fairgrounds. Thinking about it, it might be fairly hard to make it worth heaps though? Very kingdom dependant, with the chance of being worth heaps like fairgrounds!

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Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.
Pretty handy, you can flip you $5 to duchys in the endgame, and pile drive other piles pretty hard. Adds some interesting strategies, and would quicken games. Sold on it? I am not sure yet. I don't think cantrip cards trash is too good $4. Junk dealer has it, and a +$1 at $5. +$1 is worth a fair bit, so I think it is fairly priced at $4.

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Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.
This looks like it would be fun. It embraces the diversity theme too. I also like how you can make engines out of this with no +actions, which is nice. Might be a little overpriced, but that is easily fixed.

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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.
I think this is balanced, but not heaps exciting. It would be a good peddler variant for this set as a whole though. I think it is reasonably priced, because +1 card, +1 action +$1, is commonly accepted to cost about $4, and this would sometimes be that, and sometimes miss, especially early game when it is important.

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Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.
I think it is a decent card idea, but I think it would be a little powerful at its price point because will most of the time just hit early game and will hurt a lot. IMO it would need a drawback, or to cost more with a slight bonus. I don't think I would vote for it because of the presence of young witch in Cornucopia, unfortunately.

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Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.
Not too bad. Just not quite exciting enough, or different enough to fairgrounds for my vote.

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Potluck
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently named cards in play (counting this): +2 Cards, +$1, discard 2 cards.
This looks quite fine. In engines with variety it would work very nicely, especially as the only source of +buy.

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Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.
You are probably sick of people telling you to give costing it a go, but I reckon it is good to have a stab at it. The actual card looks fine, I think it would be fun building a big chain of these. Maybe it would cost $5? That is my guess. The attack reaction is cool too.

Quote
Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.
This is pretty funky. It offers a decision of, 'ahh do I discard heaps? maybe more then 2?!', or 'ah do I gain a copper?'. I think it has a pretty cool inbuilt tension.

Quote
Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.
I like that this can mainly be used as just +3 cards, or can be used as a gainer. I also have a bit of a thing for non-terminal gainers ever since ironworks... It has nice self synergy since you will need to be discarding lots of cards to gain expensive cards, and this gives +3 cards! I will consider this one because it is a cool idea that has been executed well. Can't see much wrong with it balance wise, needs play testing.

Quote
Barter Shop
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand. You may discard a card from your hand that is not a duplicate. If you do, gain a card costing up to $6 that is not a copy of a card in your hand.
I am thinking this is too powerful for the price as it is soo strong early, but again, mechanics are key. Mechanics: yeah it is ok. It doesn't seem super out there or anything, not quite to my taste.

Quote
Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.
I do like this idea, unfortunately I think that Ingot executed it in a slightly better way.

Quote
Scythe
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Trash any number of differently named cards from your hand. Gain a card with cost less than twice the number of cards trashed.
Yeah compares a little too unfavourably to remake. I can't see much wrong with it balance wise. It would be a fairly slow trasher, except for in shelter games.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2013, 05:47:12 am by Eggplantation »
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HeavyD

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #68 on: November 20, 2013, 12:53:56 pm »
0

I don't want to critique all the cards, but I chose the ones I like or stood out to me… still a lot of them…

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I know there are a lot of terminal draw cards, but I really like how simple and thematic this is. Come to think of it, Cornucopia doesn't have a terminal draw (outside Followers, which I don't count), so this could easily be a worthy addition.

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

I like LFN's idea of simply making it a cantrip itself. Certainly makes it easier. Plus 2nd Storyteller just plain sucks if it is a terminal +1 Card. I really like the idea though! One of my favorites.

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

Other than paring it with Menagerie, I don't really see a situation where this shines. Someone please enlighten me.

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Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.

I know there were a lot of $4 treasure ideas in the Prosperity contest, which I still think is a good idea. This one fits in well with Cornucopia's theme. (See other note on Sharpening Stone)

Quote
Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.

I want to say this is a huge trap. Why buy a card if your going to trash a copy of it netting you nothing? Maybe that's the point… So basically it taboos all the cards you have in play, and if that is including my precious Gold, Wharves, and Hunting Parties… I may be a little upset. However, I do see its end game potential. I suppose Vanguard is great if you get a few for a mega turn buying out the Provinces, but it seems like that would take to much work.

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Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.

Looks like a "fixed" Monastery. I was a fan of an "expensive" Workshop variant before, so I am a fan of this one as well. Although it doesn't fit Cornucopia's theme too much.

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Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.

I'm back and forth on this one… I don't really want another village in Cornucopia. I do enjoy the extra pile mechanic, but if you are playing with Theater AND Young Witch… then you are dealing with a 12 card Kingdom. Not sure how I feel about that. It may be fun… maybe once… It may not fun and be a pain…

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Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
+1 Card. +1 Action. The player to your left chooses a card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.

I'm not a big fan. It is Jester-ish. I don't like the idea of eventually having to put a token on the Province pile. I would like it more if it were Supply piles that weren't Victory piles, but I don't think that would make me like it enough too vote for it.


Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

This looks intense. I like the Tactician interaction, but am I right in saying this is basically a village that gives +? Actions for each different action card? A $5 card that only gives +Actions doesn't sound that great. Any thoughts on that?

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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.

Like Showdown said, it is thematically a fantastic card. It is simple and fits Cornucopia's theme. Plus I always like the guessing type cards in Wishing Well, Mystic, etc. One of my favorites.

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Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.

This is a good card… However, I don't like it for two reasons:

1) It is a terminal Silver that is already found in Fortune Teller and Jester.
2) It is a Cursor… and we already have Young Witch and Jester

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Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.

I laughed so hard at this… Yet, I (as well) could not give a fair evaluation. I don't think I like this because it almost forces you to rush to win the Hydra split at least to deny your opponent getting the majority. I see this most fair at $5 because it would take a while to buy/gain enough in order to be effective (similar to Duke).

Quote
Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.

Not a fan. This also looks like a "fixed" Monastery. It doesn't look like it would consistently be better than Workshop/Ironworks/Armory. I know there is a chance to gain cards costing more than $4, but I don't think this will play as well as the author intended. I like Pariah more.

Quote
Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.

Very similar to Ingot. I like Ingot more because it can cost up to $4. Also, I feel like this is too easy to activate making it a $4 gold with a buy mid-late game, I wonder if $5 would be a better cost. Maybe I'm wrong, as I am awful with pricing as well. Concept wise, it is the same as Ingot. Ingot rewards just treasure diversity, Sharpening Stone rewards action/treasure diversity. I wonder if neither will win and steal votes from the other. I agree with Eggplantation that Ingot it slightly better executed.
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Showdown35

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #69 on: November 20, 2013, 04:13:07 pm »
+2


Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

Other than paring it with Menagerie, I don't really see a situation where this shines. Someone please enlighten me.


Quote
Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.

I want to say this is a huge trap. Why buy a card if your going to trash a copy of it netting you nothing? Maybe that's the point… So basically it taboos all the cards you have in play, and if that is including my precious Gold, Wharves, and Hunting Parties… I may be a little upset. However, I do see its end game potential. I suppose Vanguard is great if you get a few for a mega turn buying out the Provinces, but it seems like that would take to much work.

Scarecrow has an absolutely awesome effect for $3 in 2 cards and 2 actions, but is offset by a drawback. I dont think the drawback is there to be exploited, but rather to make the cost lower, and create a chance for strategy. You wind up with an awesome card for only three if your deck is varied enough that the drawback hardly hurts you.

Vanguard can trash a bunch of coppers for you. If you have 4 in play, and you buy one, you net -3 coppers, which is pretty sweet deck trimming. And you don't even have to waste the 4 coppers you played because it gives you an extra buy. Too bad you can't play Curses!... yet.
Also, you can still buy provinces and duchies with this in play, or action cards you didn't play this turn, and the "drawback" won't effect you, so its noy really a trap, it just forces you to diversify the actions you buy, as do many Cornucopia cards.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2013, 04:17:39 pm by Showdown35 »
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #70 on: November 20, 2013, 04:20:42 pm »
+1

Too bad you can't play Curses!... yet.

I feel this is your next card you post :P Playing curses somehow.
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Nic

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #71 on: November 20, 2013, 04:58:07 pm »
+1

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I know there are a lot of terminal draw cards, but I really like how simple and thematic this is. Come to think of it, Cornucopia doesn't have a terminal draw (outside Followers, which I don't count), so this could easily be a worthy addition.
Cornucopia is a small set, so it's kinda supposed to have a different distribution of cards than a standalone. It's a good card, but my thought is still that if it wins, fully half of our winning cards will have been 'terminal draw with limited filtering'. +1s to the designer, but I'm not gonna vote for it for that reason alone. Sorry.  :-[

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Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

I like LFN's idea of simply making it a cantrip itself. Certainly makes it easier. Plus 2nd Storyteller just plain sucks if it is a terminal +1 Card. I really like the idea though! One of my favorites.
Think about what would happen if you played four Storytellers in a row, followed by a Smithy or Hunting Grounds, and then get back to me.

I wouldn't be opposed to making it a cantrip if the effect was edited to "If you have a Storyteller in play . . .", but that would still take out a lot of the excitement in the card. Buy or gain a bunch of Storytellers so you can play one every turn, and if they collide then spam them until you get to your strong terminals (most of which will now be strong non-terminals). It  looks like the designer thought hard about this one, and I wouldn't fiddle with anything that looks important.

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Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

This looks intense. I like the Tactician interaction, but am I right in saying this is basically a village that gives +? Actions for each different action card? A $5 card that only gives +Actions doesn't sound that great. Any thoughts on that?
'Interaction' seems like kind of an understatement. Black Market has an interaction with Tactician; this card could be scary. Golem is the only card in the game that can trigger multiple Tacticians in a single turn, and it requires a lot of luck to do so, and it costs $4P.
Aside from that, it seems disingenuous to say it only gives +Actions, when it gives you exactly as many actions as you as you would need to play a bunch of terminals. Harvest a Harvest Queen and some terminal draw, and you could play a megaturn without villages or nonterminal cards. This is a card where you want terminals to collide, and it allows you to build decks which couldn't really exist before. I feel like the cost might work, but it would be a whole lot safer at $6.

That's it for now! Stay tuned to hear my opinions on Scarecrow and Showman.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2013, 05:01:42 pm by Nic »
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #72 on: November 20, 2013, 05:11:32 pm »
+1

Golem is the only card in the game that can trigger multiple Tacticians in a single turn, and it requires a lot of luck to do so, and it costs $4P.

Herald can do it too now!  For example, TR-Herald could activate two Tacticians.
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Showdown35

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #73 on: November 20, 2013, 06:31:42 pm »
0

Too bad you can't play Curses!... yet.

I feel this is your next card you post :P Playing curses somehow.

Hahaha... no, wasn't planning on designing a card that lets you play Curses. I just try to be careful whenever saying thay you can't do something, because there were many things you "couldn't" do before some expansions. And I thought I'd put the idea of being able to put non-action, non-treasure cards into play somehow into the heads of all the fan designers reading.
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LibraryAdventurer

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #74 on: November 21, 2013, 01:51:59 am »
0

I just found this forum and these contests.  I'll probably enter the next one.  Can I still vote if I've never made a submission to a contest?

Anyway, my thoughts on a few I like:

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.
The wording could use a tweak to get rid of the need for the clarification, and I think it should say "if there's a storyteller in play" (like Nik suggested) to keep them from stacking, but I really like this card.

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Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.
I think it would be good if you added some minor limitation, maybe "If ...and no more than
one treasure that matches another".  I think it'd be too good as-is.

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Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.
Should cost $5, but I like it otherwise.

Quote
Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.
Building off Soulnet's suggestion, here's what I would put on it: "+1 Action. Play now any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand. Then +1 card for each differently-named treasure you have in play."
I really like it, but only after tweaking (and maybe a different name), so I don't know if I'd vote for it.

Quote
Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.
Looks a bit strong, but the benefit with drawback to other players is interesting.  Maybe that balances it out.  Would have to see how it plays out.

Quote
Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.
I kinda like it.  It could easily be very strong if the patron card is a good one to get multiples of (like minion/labratory/market...)

Quote
Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
+1 Card. +1 Action. The player to your left chooses a card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.
Not sure how well it would work. Could turn out to be cool, but it's hard to tell.

Quote
Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.
The bottom is a little awkward but I like it anyway.  I kinda like the top, but I don't like having many cards that force a reshuffle.  I like playing IRL much better than online, and reshuffling takes time.

Quote
Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.
My main problem with it is that it can empty supply piles way too fast with multiple nomads.  I think it'd be much better if it said "Return a card from your hand to the supply."

Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.
I like it.  Obviously similar to storyteller, but I kinda like storyteller better.  Then again, this has the benefit of being simpler.

Quote
Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.
Seems like this could be easy to exploit if there's a couple cards that you just buy one copy of.  Just reveal one of them from your hand and you know you won't get a match.  Combine with mutiple showmen, and this could be really powerful for $3.  I like the idea though.

Quote
Potluck
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently named cards in play (counting this): +2 Cards, +$1, discard 2 cards.
Same as what I said about Kaleidoscope: Probably should cost $5, but I kinda like it otherwise.

Quote
Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.
Probably could cost $3.  I don't particularly like it anyway.

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Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.
I think I'd either make it +2 cards at the beginning or lose the +1 action clause.  Kinda like it otherwise.

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Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.
I think both this and Ingot activate too easily.

Others that I like, but don't have much to say about: Field, Flea Market, Side Show.

I wish I'd found these forums earlier so I could vote for Investment and Drift bottle from the Seaside contest.  I don't generally like cards with mats, but I thought Drift Bottle looked really cool. Hard to believe it didn't get any votes.

Jean-Michel

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #75 on: November 21, 2013, 10:19:05 am »
0

Thoughts on my favourite entries:

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Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.
Nice terminal draw variant. This is probably nice in engines, as you can find the most important cards more easily compared to Smithy, but this is overall a bit weaker than it. Not every card needs to shine in all possible kingdoms though.

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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
As it's already been mentioned, this card is especially nice with Menagerie. What I also find interesting in this is that even if it's a reversed Menagerie, it's still as its best in same kind of situations, where you have trashed your starting cards or have strong shifting.

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Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.
While this might be too good for a 5-2 opening and have balance issues, it's at least very interesting. It makes you do some tough decisions - do you want to play that Market, if you are aiming to buy one this turn?

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Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.
This is a very interesting gainer. Its best use would probably be to gain some cards your opponent doesn't want, especially 5's - for example if you're going for an engine and your opponent is going for a terminal draw Big Money, he might not want to gain a Bazaar for the cost of a Curse.

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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.
This is also one of my favourites. It's simple but strategic - and it really encourages variety in your deck.

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Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.
This card has many uses. It can be used for terminal draw, gaining or shifting - and it has that ability in a cool way.
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soulnet

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #76 on: November 21, 2013, 10:36:46 am »
0

Diclaimer: I am not commenting on every card. I feel like I don't have enough time (or maybe patience) to do them all justice. So, I will only post come commentary on some cards when I gave it some thought. That may be due to some randomness, and most likely, the card being commented by others first.

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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.

I like the simplicity of the card. I also like giving Cornucopia a true Peddler variant (clearly Tournament's main thing is not its Peddlerness). However, I feel like deciding which card to flash would induce too much Analysis Paralysis. I can imagine spamming a lot of these a good strategy many times, but then, unless you have a clear unique card, you may need to rethink what is the best choice for revealing with every play. These being non-terminal makes this a resonable scenario. I think there is some interest in the card, though, I wish it could be implemented in a less AP-inducing way. I understand that revealing two cards from the deck instead would remove a lot of the interest from the card and also make it weaker, which it does not need, and also make it even more similar to Harvest's mechanics.

This kind of AP already happens with the "name-a-card" in Guilds, especially with Journeyman, and I must say I don't like it.
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XerxesPraelor

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #77 on: November 21, 2013, 11:19:28 am »
0

I don't think having showman in the same set as tournament is a good idea. Both have +1 Action, if __, +1 Card, +$1. I think a $5 card would fit into the set better, and my favorite of those is raffle. But even that has some major problems, like OPness and bad flavor. Here's what I suggest to change it to if it wins:

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Trinket Show
Action - $5
+1 Action
Play any number of treasure cards from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in your hand.
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HeavyD

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #78 on: November 21, 2013, 11:42:47 am »
+1

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Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

I like LFN's idea of simply making it a cantrip itself. Certainly makes it easier. Plus 2nd Storyteller just plain sucks if it is a terminal +1 Card. I really like the idea though! One of my favorites.
Think about what would happen if you played four Storytellers in a row, followed by a Smithy or Hunting Grounds, and then get back to me.

I wouldn't be opposed to making it a cantrip if the effect was edited to "If you have a Storyteller in play . . .", but that would still take out a lot of the excitement in the card. Buy or gain a bunch of Storytellers so you can play one every turn, and if they collide then spam them until you get to your strong terminals (most of which will now be strong non-terminals). It  looks like the designer thought hard about this one, and I wouldn't fiddle with anything that looks important.


Oooh… didn't see that. For what ever reason I assumed each card could only get a +1 Action bonus to it. I think I like the "If you have a Storyteller in play…" better. But now I see why the author made it terminal though, so you can build an engine to where you may be able to play a Smithy with +3 Actions as well… Hmmm… I'd be fine with either. Still really like this card though.  ;D
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #79 on: November 21, 2013, 12:04:05 pm »
0

I don't think having showman in the same set as tournament is a good idea. Both have +1 Action, if __, +1 Card, +$1. I think a $5 card would fit into the set better, and my favorite of those is raffle. But even that has some major problems, like OPness and bad flavor. Here's what I suggest to change it to if it wins:

Quote
Trinket Show
Action - $5
+1 Action
Play any number of treasure cards from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in your hand.

Trinket Show doesn't fit the Cornucopia theme at all.
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #80 on: November 21, 2013, 12:05:15 pm »
0

I don't think having showman in the same set as tournament is a good idea. Both have +1 Action, if __, +1 Card, +$1. I think a $5 card would fit into the set better, and my favorite of those is raffle. But even that has some major problems, like OPness and bad flavor. Here's what I suggest to change it to if it wins:

Quote
Trinket Show
Action - $5
+1 Action
Play any number of treasure cards from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in your hand.

Trinket Show doesn't fit the Cornucopia theme at all.

And how does Raffle not fit? Maybe a bit modern sounding but still.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #81 on: November 21, 2013, 12:09:49 pm »
0

I don't think having showman in the same set as tournament is a good idea. Both have +1 Action, if __, +1 Card, +$1. I think a $5 card would fit into the set better, and my favorite of those is raffle. But even that has some major problems, like OPness and bad flavor. Here's what I suggest to change it to if it wins:

Quote
Trinket Show
Action - $5
+1 Action
Play any number of treasure cards from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in your hand.

Trinket Show doesn't fit the Cornucopia theme at all.

And how does Raffle not fit? Maybe a bit modern sounding but still.

Nobody said that about Raffle? The complaints are that the name sounds too modern and it is likely too powerful. I also think Raffle pushes Big Money too much.
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #82 on: November 21, 2013, 12:48:26 pm »
0

I don't think having showman in the same set as tournament is a good idea. Both have +1 Action, if __, +1 Card, +$1. I think a $5 card would fit into the set better, and my favorite of those is raffle. But even that has some major problems, like OPness and bad flavor. Here's what I suggest to change it to if it wins:

Quote
Trinket Show
Action - $5
+1 Action
Play any number of treasure cards from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in your hand.

Trinket Show doesn't fit the Cornucopia theme at all.

And how does Raffle not fit? Maybe a bit modern sounding but still.

Nobody said that about Raffle? The complaints are that the name sounds too modern and it is likely too powerful. I also think Raffle pushes Big Money too much.

I just meant about the name. I read that the card was too powerful before.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #83 on: November 21, 2013, 01:49:56 pm »
0

I don't think having showman in the same set as tournament is a good idea. Both have +1 Action, if __, +1 Card, +$1. I think a $5 card would fit into the set better, and my favorite of those is raffle. But even that has some major problems, like OPness and bad flavor. Here's what I suggest to change it to if it wins:

Quote
Trinket Show
Action - $5
+1 Action
Play any number of treasure cards from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in your hand.

Trinket Show doesn't fit the Cornucopia theme at all.

And how does Raffle not fit? Maybe a bit modern sounding but still.

Nobody said that about Raffle? The complaints are that the name sounds too modern and it is likely too powerful. I also think Raffle pushes Big Money too much.

I just meant about the name. I read that the card was too powerful before.

I'm talking about mechanics.  Trinket Show doesn't do anything with variety.
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Nic

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #84 on: November 21, 2013, 03:03:11 pm »
0


I don't think having showman in the same set as tournament is a good idea. Both have +1 Action, if __, +1 Card, +$1. I think a $5 card would fit into the set better, and my favorite of those is raffle. But even that has some major problems, like OPness and bad flavor. Here's what I suggest to change it to if it wins:
Quote
Trinket Show
Action - $5
+1 Action
Play any number of treasure cards from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in your hand.
I think it should definitely be nerfed to 'draw up to four cards in hand' but keep the restriction to differently named treasures. If that makes it a $4 card, then we can do that. As for the name, "Money Changer" would be super thematic both for the card and for Cornucopia's festival setting, but it might be confusing next to Moneylender. The thesaurus was unhelpful, and any historical synonym I might find would probably just be the Italian word for money changer.
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markusin

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #85 on: November 23, 2013, 04:34:53 pm »
0

Let's comment on these Cornucopia cards while I'm in the mood for it.

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Bounty
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Reveal then discard the top 2 cards of your deck. For each differently named card revealed, if it is an… Action card, +2 Actions; Treasure card, +$2; Victory card, +1 Card; Curse, +1 Buy.
I think Ironmonger already covers this design space. The differently named card thing isn't so much a variety mechanic as it is a balancing mechanic.

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Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.
Simple. It let's you possibly draw the 4th top card of your deck, so it's not necessarily worse than Smithy when it only draws 3. This blows Harvest out of the water unless the card that weren't drawn are placed back onto the deck instead of discarded. That would help balance the sheer cycling power of this card.

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Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.
If this simply turned terminal actions into non-terminal ones the first time they were played, this would probably work. My issue with it is that it also gives cantrips the village effect. The result is that one of these turns your first Smithy-variant into a Double Lab and then your cantrips give you more actions to play your other copies of the Smithy-variant. It's too easy, and I feel this card is too strong even with the top part being the way it is. You only need to play one of these every turn anyway.


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Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
This could potentially work. The only way to be sure is to playtest this. Like many Cornucopia cards, this will probably get better as the game goes on.

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Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).
I don't like that bottom effect. The only thing worse about a super card that is prohibitively expensive is one that you can still get if you have a starting hand of 5 Coppers. How can one possibly balance this. And watch out in games with this, Border Village, and cost reduction. Mega pileout potential.

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Ingot
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently-named Treasures in play (including this), +$2.
This is sort of like a mini Horn of Plenty that combines with your other treasures. There's nothing wrong with it, really.

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Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.
I would imagine the super-buy effect working better on a card that does something cool without needing to be spammed, like peddler, but whatever. It's kinda game changing, but in the end I wouldn't consider it broken, at least not very often. Personally, I like it.

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Grocer
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Put one of your Grocer tokens on a Supply pile; this pile must not cost more than any pile without one of your tokens. You may gain a card from any pile with one of your tokens on it.

Clarification: Each player has a set of identical tokens that are distinguishable from other players' tokens. Tokens are not artificially limited.
This will be really strong in the presence of KC/TR/Procession. It kinda supports a monolithic strategy of sorts. One fix would be to make you lose all your tokens once every pile has a token on it, like Carnival below. If that upsets people because they can't get more than one province with this, than the variety-gain use of this card is lost on you. Either that or this excludes Victory Cards.


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Kaleidoscope
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand and note the number of differently-named cards revealed. If you revealed at least: Two, +1 Buy; Three, +$1; Four, +1 Action; Five, +1 Card.
I like that there is a cap on the variety-based bonus. Anything like "+1 X for every Y differently named card" would be annoying and possibly nuts with Dark Ages. It's another take on the Menagerie idea.

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Raffle
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Set aside any number of differently-named Treasure cards from your hand, then play them in any order. Draw until you have 5 cards in hand.
You can change the numbers of this, and just have the set aside cards go into hand at the start of the Buy phase if playing them immediately is not something you want more of. This is like a stronger Menagerie. That's not a deal breaker though for me. Hmm...

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Vanguard
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, trash each copy of that card you have in play.
This lets you trash copper really easily. Afterwards, whether or not you get more of these depends on what else is on the board. The copper trashing makes this almost a must-buy. I have issues with that.

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Pariah
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Gain a card costing up to $6. Each other player may gain a Curse. If he does, he gains a copy of the card you gained.
So I want to like this one. You probably don't want it in games with other cursers. It just worry that this forces your opponent in a really bad situation when you use this to get a spammable action like Minion or Highway whose effectiveness is very sensitive to junk.

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Theater
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. You may reveal a Patron card from your hand. If you do, +2 Cards.
[hr[
Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or $6 to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Patron cards.
This is kind of messed up if the patron card is awesome. There are some pretty good cards from $5 to $6

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Carnival
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $3
+1 Card. +1 Action. The player to your left chooses a card in the Supply without a Carnival token on it. Either gain a copy of it or each other player gains a copy of it, your choice. Put a Carnival token on that pile. If each Supply pile has a token, remove all the tokens.
As I said, this is a mash-up of Jester and Indulgence. It's so accessible though. Why wouldn't you get one of these every game.

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Side Show
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+2 Actions. Reveal your hand. +$1 for each differently named Action card you revealed.
Where have I-

I want to like this one. Having lots of actions in your hand at any one time is something you generally have to work for most of the time. The exception is Scrying Pool, but it is what it is. Even in that case though, this just gives you lots of money. I prefer when here is a cap on the bonus, for the sake of the person who has to count all the differently named actions in a large hand (and possibly with some knights in there too). Maybe if you can reveal up to 5 cards or something for the effect?

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Wine Cellar
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal up to 2 differently named cards from your hand and put them on top of your deck. +$2 per card revealed this way.

When you buy this, reveal your hand. If you don't reveal at least 2 differently named cards, trash this.
I'm glad this card was submitted, as I thought of submitting a card that was just like this, but as a prize. Instead, this card has the bottom clause to limit its power. However, the similarity to Mandarin (and part of Count) takes away from the novelty of the idea.

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Traveling Circus
Types: Action – Victory
Cost: $5
Look through your deck and set aside any number of differently named Victory cards from it. Put them into your hand. Shuffle your deck.

Worth 1 VP for every 2 differently typed cards in your deck.

Clarification: Each unique combination of types counts as a unique type. For example, an Action card and an Action – Attack card count as differently-typed cards.
With one more hybrid type, this can be worth 3VP. But it's so close to both Duchy and Fairgrounds, and the on-play effect is not exactly super stackable.

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Nomad
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. +1 Action. Trash a card from your hand. You may gain a card with cost exactly equal to the cost of the trashed card, putting it into your hand.
I'm not averse to the card-swapping idea. I feel like this is missing something. Compare to the Dark Ages submission that could exchange cards of equal price.

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Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.
This is basically a necropolis that scales with the number of action cards in your hand. I like it for the most part, except it's pretty scary with Scrying Pool.

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Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.
This one is neat. It rewards deck tracking and variety. I imagine that it will activate pretty frequently though. Just selecting a card you have one copy of turns these into $3 peddlers.

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Old Gaffer
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+$2. Each other player may reveal a hand without duplicate cards. If he doesn't, he gains a Curse.
This card will hit very often the way it is now. Maybe the other player can reveal 4 differently named cards instead. Even with that, Young Witch already has this kind of thing covered.

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Wheat Field
Types: Victory
Cost: $4
Worth 1 VP for every each differently named non-Victory card of which you have at least 4 copies.
Getting 1 copy of something is reasonable, but 4 copies is difficult, especially in games with 3 or more players. This just leads to 3-pile endings when you try to power these up. It just don't think it will work out so well in the end.

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Potluck
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+2 Actions. +1 Buy. If you have at least 4 differently named cards in play (counting this): +2 Cards, +$1, discard 2 cards.
This reminds me of Conspirator, except this goes a bit further to help you power them up. It at least gives you extra actions, so this isn't totally useless if every other action on the board is terminal. The +Buy can help pick up extra actions too. The activated form of this is an Inn that gives +$1 and +Buy. Kinda good, but it looks pretty difficult to activate it, and it still needs a deck with good draw capabilities in order to be truly useful even when activated.

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Hydra
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $999
+1 Action. +1 Card per Hydra you have in play (including this).

When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard this. If you do, gain a Hydra.
I can actually understand why this card was made to cost $999. It's just so good when stacked that I don't think it works at any price point. This is the kind of card that should not even be in the supply and should just have every player start with one copy of it. You get more through whatever way the bottom effect lets you and that's it.

I don't get how this fits into Cornucopia. Maybe this could have been an Alchemy card submission.

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Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.
As it's been said, this is like a Noble Brigand that almost always gives out Copper. When it doesn't, then gosh won't you feel silly. Not sure what to think about this, actually.

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Dairy
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+3 Cards. Reveal then discard any number of cards. If you discarded any cards, gain a card with cost up to $1 plus the number of differently named cards discarded. If you discarded at least 3 differently named cards, +1 Action.
I would be okay with this card if it didn't give the possibility of giving +1 Action. This is already a Smithy/Workshop hybrid. That's good enough for me.

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Barter Shop
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal your hand. You may discard a card from your hand that is not a duplicate. If you do, gain a card costing up to $6 that is not a copy of a card in your hand.
Really pushing the variety theme here. It seems a bit too good though. Play this, discard your Hovel (or even a lone Estate), then gain whatever you want because the rest of your hand is 4 Coppers. By the time the not-a-copy clause takes effect, you're probably doing great already.

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Sharpening Stone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. If you had at least 4 differently named cards in play (not including this), +1 Buy and +$2.
Even simpler than Potluck above, except this can count treasures in play as well. I expect that it will be pretty easy to activate this once you get your deck rolling. You set up your engine-y deck, then just save money getting these instead Golds.

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Scythe
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Trash any number of differently named cards from your hand. Gain a card with cost less than twice the number of cards trashed.
So this is like a super nerfed Forge. How many cards besides Copper, Estate, Curse, and Shelters do I want to trash anyway? I mean, I'd trash a gold with Salvager if it means I get a province out of it, but what are the odds that I can trash a Gold and 4 other differently named cards at the same time to get a Province. Remake blows this away, I'm afraid.
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Showdown35

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #86 on: November 23, 2013, 04:52:05 pm »
0

I think you are misreading Player King. How can you buy it with a 5 copper opening? At the start of your buy phase (I'm assuming before you are able to play treasures), you would reveal 4 duplicate coppers and Player King would still cost $10.

Am I missing something?
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #87 on: November 23, 2013, 05:48:04 pm »
0

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.
Simple. It let's you possibly draw the 4th top card of your deck, so it's not necessarily worse than Smithy when it only draws 3. This blows Harvest out of the water unless the card that weren't drawn are placed back onto the deck instead of discarded. That would help balance the sheer cycling power of this card.

So you're suggesting that the cards get put back on top of the deck instead of being discarded?  If you optimize your deck for Field, then you'll be drawing almost everything anyways, so top-decking a card means very little.  If you have a bunch of duplicates, then the card is already poor draw and you don't need to further nerf it with anti-cycling.  Top-decking cards isn't necessarily a nerf though.  If you build your deck to make Field a good card, then your duplicates are probably good cards, in which case top-decking duplicates is actually a benefit.  The current design is clean, simple and fast.

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.
If this simply turned terminal actions into non-terminal ones the first time they were played, this would probably work. My issue with it is that it also gives cantrips the village effect. The result is that one of these turns your first Smithy-variant into a Double Lab and then your cantrips give you more actions to play your other copies of the Smithy-variant. It's too easy, and I feel this card is too strong even with the top part being the way it is. You only need to play one of these every turn anyway.

Yeah, it turns the first of each cantrip you play into a village.  I don't think that's problematic.  You still have to build your deck properly and line the cards up to make that trick work.  If you can pull it off, you deserve that little benefit.  It's not that easy.  Yeah you just want to play one of this each turn, but that's why the top is so weak.  If you buy a bunch of Storytellers, then they will collide and be nothing but Ruined Libraries.  If you buy only a few, you won't see them often enough to rely on them for +actions.

Quote
Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).
I don't like that bottom effect. The only thing worse about a super card that is prohibitively expensive is one that you can still get if you have a starting hand of 5 Coppers. How can one possibly balance this. And watch out in games with this, Border Village, and cost reduction. Mega pileout potential.

Player King has some design issues, but not the ones you describe.  As Showdown says, you cannot buy it with 5 coppers because if you have 5 coppers you have duplicates in hand and there is no cost reduction.  Also not quite sure what you're getting at with Border Village -- you can pile as quickly with BV and any card costing less than $5.  Unless you are talking about Player King's on play effect?  But that is just as much an issue without BV.
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markusin

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #88 on: November 23, 2013, 06:54:44 pm »
0

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.
Simple. It let's you possibly draw the 4th top card of your deck, so it's not necessarily worse than Smithy when it only draws 3. This blows Harvest out of the water unless the card that weren't drawn are placed back onto the deck instead of discarded. That would help balance the sheer cycling power of this card.

So you're suggesting that the cards get put back on top of the deck instead of being discarded?  If you optimize your deck for Field, then you'll be drawing almost everything anyways, so top-decking a card means very little.  If you have a bunch of duplicates, then the card is already poor draw and you don't need to further nerf it with anti-cycling.  Top-decking cards isn't necessarily a nerf though.  If you build your deck to make Field a good card, then your duplicates are probably good cards, in which case top-decking duplicates is actually a benefit.  The current design is clean, simple and fast.
I'm still not so sure here. Say your top 4 cards are Copper>Estate>Copper>Copper (top card). Playing Smithy gives you 2 coppers and an Estate. Field gives only 1 Copper and 1 Estate, but discards the other 2 Coppers. It's not THAT MUCH worse that Smithy even in the early game. I feel like most the time, this will be at least as good as Smithy for the same price point. This is still nitpicking though.

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.
If this simply turned terminal actions into non-terminal ones the first time they were played, this would probably work. My issue with it is that it also gives cantrips the village effect. The result is that one of these turns your first Smithy-variant into a Double Lab and then your cantrips give you more actions to play your other copies of the Smithy-variant. It's too easy, and I feel this card is too strong even with the top part being the way it is. You only need to play one of these every turn anyway.

Yeah, it turns the first of each cantrip you play into a village.  I don't think that's problematic.  You still have to build your deck properly and line the cards up to make that trick work.  If you can pull it off, you deserve that little benefit.  It's not that easy.  Yeah you just want to play one of this each turn, but that's why the top is so weak.  If you buy a bunch of Storytellers, then they will collide and be nothing but Ruined Libraries.  If you buy only a few, you won't see them often enough to rely on them for +actions.
I agree that it's not always easy to get a bunch of actions into your hand at once. I mean, a hand of two Militias and 2 storytellers probably won't get very far even if the first Militia is non-terminal. I just felt is was worth pointing out the boost it gives to decks with a bunch of Peddler-variants and cheap cantrips like Vagrant and Pearl Diver, because I for one didn't catch on to that on my first reading of it. This is why I like the top as is.

Quote
Player King
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Trash a card from your hand. For each $ in its cost, gain a card costing up to $5 that is not a Victory card, putting it on top of your deck. If you gained 5 or more cards this way, trash this card.

In games using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may reveal your hand. If there are no duplicate cards in it, Player King costs $5 less this turn (but not less than $0).
I don't like that bottom effect. The only thing worse about a super card that is prohibitively expensive is one that you can still get if you have a starting hand of 5 Coppers. How can one possibly balance this. And watch out in games with this, Border Village, and cost reduction. Mega pileout potential.

Player King has some design issues, but not the ones you describe.  As Showdown says, you cannot buy it with 5 coppers because if you have 5 coppers you have duplicates in hand and there is no cost reduction.  Also not quite sure what you're getting at with Border Village -- you can pile as quickly with BV and any card costing less than $5.  Unless you are talking about Player King's on play effect?  But that is just as much an issue without BV.
Yeah, I totally misread it when making my comments. Funny, I didn't make that mistake when I read it the first time earlier this week. So the clause makes this more of a mid-game to late-game card. There is an inherent swinginess to this card, both due to the prohibitive cost and the need to line this up with an expensive card, but maybe not so expensive that it trashes itself. It's hard to really know where it lies balance wise right now.

About Border Village now. Say, If Border village costs $5, and you trash a Province at $7, you can gain 7 Border Villages and 7 of a cheaper card at the same time (like Duchy). It's easy to end the game on piles right there. Those Duchies wouldn't even get top-decked. But yeah, that's a 3-card thing.
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yuma

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #89 on: November 25, 2013, 07:47:06 pm »
0

Well I think I am ready to vote!
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Showdown35

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #90 on: November 25, 2013, 10:53:54 pm »
0

Well I think I am ready to vote!

Second.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #91 on: November 30, 2013, 08:11:51 pm »
0

So is this all done?  No discussion for 6 days and no poll...
« Last Edit: November 30, 2013, 08:13:01 pm by Showdown35 »
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #92 on: November 30, 2013, 08:17:39 pm »
0

Yeah, we need LFN!
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #93 on: November 30, 2013, 09:22:45 pm »
+1

Last Footnote lives in the US, and this past week had a major holiday which frequently involves traveling, seeing family, and just general falling out of one usual rhythm.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #94 on: December 02, 2013, 10:52:07 am »
0

Sorry, guys! Thanksgiving week ate my life. We were visiting my wife's family out of state. Polls up soon and new contests up later or early tomorrow.

EDIT: This ballot is up. I gave a full week this time, since last time people were caught by surprise when the poll ended after 3 days. This is the preliminary poll. I'll take the top 5-ish cards and make up a final poll next week so that we can focus talk on those cards.

The next two contests are Alchemy and Guilds, which I'm going to run concurrently.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2013, 10:57:44 am by LastFootnote »
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #95 on: December 04, 2013, 06:46:51 pm »
+1

For some reason, there has been much less discussion on Cornucopia than on past contests.  Is it just because of all the holidays?

I think these are the cards I will be voting for.

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

Very simple, very elegant.  Interesting.  A minor con is that 2 of the 5 winners so far (Diviner and Prefecture) also feature terminal draw.  However, those two are more about filtering than drawing, and Field has a very different mechanic.

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

Despite the somewhat tricky wording, the concept appeals to me.  It's a very different kind of village.

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

I like that this has such a big draw back.  I think it would be really fun to use this and still keep a large hand because you built your deck accordingly.  It's a nice pay-off.

Quote
Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.

The restriction is still very interesting to me.  It's such a powerful card in the early game but it becomes a huge nuisance when it comes time for the engine to bring in the green.

Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

I like this for the same reason I like Storyteller, as a kind of different village.  A pro is that Harvest Queen has much simpler wording than Storyteller, though it is a bit more limited in scope (actions in hand versus actions in the whole turn).  A possible con which I just thought of is that it can probably cause more tracking issues as you nest it, e.g. with King's Court, Golem, and other Harvest Queens.  However, that kind of confusing nesting is still possible with just KC and Golem.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #96 on: December 04, 2013, 11:38:29 pm »
0

For some reason, there has been much less discussion on Cornucopia than on past contests.  Is it just because of all the holidays?
Well, I've put my votes in, but I find it hard to make much comment on things that doesn't copy what others have already said.

Quote from: eHalcyon
Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

Very simple, very elegant.  Interesting.  A minor con is that 2 of the 5 winners so far (Diviner and Prefecture) also feature terminal draw.  However, those two are more about filtering than drawing, and Field has a very different mechanic.
I agree, and I think it's ok if the contest winners have a few themes in common although it would be nice to see a winner fill a different niche.

Quote from: eHalcyon
Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

Despite the somewhat tricky wording, the concept appeals to me.  It's a very different kind of village.
Eh, I like the idea too, but the wording is fiddly enough that I'm not voting for it.

Quote from: eHalcyon
Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

I like that this has such a big draw back.  I think it would be really fun to use this and still keep a large hand because you built your deck accordingly.  It's a nice pay-off.
I agree. Like others have pointed out, it's a bit like the anti-Menagerie, while still really working best with the same kind of deck. It's definitely very strong on matching the Cornucopia theme.

Quote from: eHalcyon
Quote
Flea Market
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. This turn, you may buy any number of cards, but you may not buy more than one copy of any card.

The restriction is still very interesting to me.  It's such a powerful card in the early game but it becomes a huge nuisance when it comes time for the engine to bring in the green.
It's definitely an unusual card. It's Market, but more so, but less so. It's a bit like Contraband, in that it's really useful when you want a whole bunch of different cards, like in a fancy engine. It also has a very niche use in a Vineyards/Ruins deck.

Quote from: eHalcyon
Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

I like this for the same reason I like Storyteller, as a kind of different village.  A pro is that Harvest Queen has much simpler wording than Storyteller, though it is a bit more limited in scope (actions in hand versus actions in the whole turn).  A possible con which I just thought of is that it can probably cause more tracking issues as you nest it, e.g. with King's Court, Golem, and other Harvest Queens.  However, that kind of confusing nesting is still possible with just KC and Golem.
I like this one too, as a Cornucopia Throne Room. It's interesting that it functions very similarly to Scarecrow, but is a smidgen weaker while also having a much simpler wording to achieve it. And I agree that it will have some crazy tracking issues, just like the other TR variants, but it should be manageable - and fun when it works well.
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #97 on: December 05, 2013, 09:40:26 am »
0

For some reason, there has been much less discussion on Cornucopia than on past contests.  Is it just because of all the holidays?

Holidays + Exam time for people in university.
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Nic

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #98 on: December 05, 2013, 08:19:54 pm »
0

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
Good to see this guy getting some love. When I first saw it, I was worried it might be too strong: so what if I have to discard a bunch of Coppers and some Estates ad even a Silver or two, I'm cycling my deck and drawing my Attack cards more often than you are, and because of the +2 Actions I'm not gonna draw them dead.
But now that I've thought about it some more, the discard would make this very difficult to use by midgame, on the vast majority of boards. It really is the anti-Menagerie: you want these when you just have a few strong terminals in your deck, but it becomes a liability later on.

Quote
Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.
Like Showdown said, it is thematically a fantastic card. It is simple and fits Cornucopia's theme. Plus I always like the guessing type cards in Wishing Well, Mystic, etc. One of my favorites.
I like it too, and I'll vote for it, but there is an interesting difference between it and the existing 'name a card' crowd. With Wishing Well and Mystic, you wouldn't build a strategy around drawing a bunch of guessed cards (even though they combo with Scout!). Either you count cards and name the most likely thing in your deck to play the averages, or guess the card that would most improve your hand in that situation. Conversely, here you have a very good chance of guessing the wrong card, so it's just a smidgen strictly worse than a Peddler. What gives me pause is that the probability of it whiffing is small enough that it won't really affect your overall strategy, but when it does it's because you drew it with 4 Coppers or something else outside your control.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #99 on: December 09, 2013, 03:28:43 pm »
0

I forgot to vote here.  Oops!  I did vote on the prizes though... not sure how I managed that. :P
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jpople02

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #100 on: December 09, 2013, 04:45:50 pm »
0

So what's the threshold for making it into the next round of voting?  I assume it'll be the 5 that have 10+ votes?
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NoMoreFun

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #101 on: December 10, 2013, 08:45:49 pm »
+1

Not much love for Pariah :(

The comments were about how it was off theme, but I designed it specifically around the idea of variety between players. "Gain a 6" is probably overpowered at 5, but a curser with a "wash" is not. Thus, to get the most out of the card, you want to gain a card that nobody else wants. That's where the name comes from.

Thematically, you're being punished (cursed) for copying the other player, even though copying is often a good deal.

I wanted to make a card that rewarded variety in a different place. Deck (fairgrounds, harvest), hand (menagerie) and play area (HoP) have been explored well enough, so I thought "variety between players/of strategies" was an interesting area. A card that discourages mirror matches. Is pariah that card? I don't know.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #102 on: December 10, 2013, 09:19:21 pm »
0

Not much love for Pariah :(

The comments were about how it was off theme, but I designed it specifically around the idea of variety between players. "Gain a 6" is probably overpowered at 5, but a curser with a "wash" is not. Thus, to get the most out of the card, you want to gain a card that nobody else wants. That's where the name comes from.

Thematically, you're being punished (cursed) for copying the other player, even though copying is often a good deal.

I wanted to make a card that rewarded variety in a different place. Deck (fairgrounds, harvest), hand (menagerie) and play area (HoP) have been explored well enough, so I thought "variety between players/of strategies" was an interesting area. A card that discourages mirror matches. Is pariah that card? I don't know.

How does it discourage a mirror match?  You play Pariah and gain something.  Now I have a choice to gain the same thing, but with a Curse attached.  This actually encourages a mirror match because now I have an opportunity to gain the same card you did.  If I choose not to gain the card and curse, it doesn't mean that I have to play a different strategy.  On my turn, I can still play a Pariah myself and gain the same card you did.

Perhaps the card would be closer to your intention if it encouraged others to gain a different card.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #103 on: December 11, 2013, 12:22:38 am »
+5

Not much love for Pariah :(

It's uh

well named then
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #104 on: December 11, 2013, 09:09:51 pm »
0

Not much love for Pariah :(

The comments were about how it was off theme, but I designed it specifically around the idea of variety between players. "Gain a 6" is probably overpowered at 5, but a curser with a "wash" is not. Thus, to get the most out of the card, you want to gain a card that nobody else wants. That's where the name comes from.

Thematically, you're being punished (cursed) for copying the other player, even though copying is often a good deal.

I wanted to make a card that rewarded variety in a different place. Deck (fairgrounds, harvest), hand (menagerie) and play area (HoP) have been explored well enough, so I thought "variety between players/of strategies" was an interesting area. A card that discourages mirror matches. Is pariah that card? I don't know.

How does it discourage a mirror match?  You play Pariah and gain something.  Now I have a choice to gain the same thing, but with a Curse attached.  This actually encourages a mirror match because now I have an opportunity to gain the same card you did.  If I choose not to gain the card and curse, it doesn't mean that I have to play a different strategy.  On my turn, I can still play a Pariah myself and gain the same card you did.

Perhaps the card would be closer to your intention if it encouraged others to gain a different card.

The onus is on the user to pick a card the other players don't want, lest they get to have a faster version of their strategy for free. Admittedly with some cards the curse will have a disproportionately high effect, making it just a gainer, but every play will involve considering the other players.

I considered something like "gain 2 cards costing up to $4 each, each other player gains a card costing up to $4 that you didn't gain" but these cards inevitably have lots of problems, particularly running out piles. Those ideas are pretty well worn on these forums. It also doesn't encourage uniqueness from the person who buys the card.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #105 on: December 14, 2013, 01:37:39 am »
0

Will there be a second round to vote or is this the end-result?
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #106 on: December 15, 2013, 10:47:22 pm »
0

Will there be a second round to vote or is this the end-result?

There are 2 cards tied with 15, and one at 14 votes. My guess is that there will be a second vote at some point.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #107 on: December 16, 2013, 03:29:55 am »
0

Yeah, there's no reason to believe it'll be any different than Intrigue. Presumably the second ballot will go up when the entries for Guilds and Alchemy get posted.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #108 on: December 18, 2013, 11:36:38 am »
+1

Yes, there will be a second round. I've been busy, but also dragging my feet a bit. Compiling results in a spreadsheet is the most tedious part of these contests. Maybe Qvist can sympathize.  :D  I'll try to get the initial results and the next poll up soonish.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #109 on: December 18, 2013, 09:32:00 pm »
+4

Yes, there will be a second round. I've been busy, but also dragging my feet a bit. Compiling results in a spreadsheet is the most tedious part of these contests. Maybe Qvist can sympathize.  :D  I'll try to get the initial results and the next poll up soonish.

Let someone else help you with the tedious part.

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #110 on: December 19, 2013, 09:38:07 am »
+2

Yes, there will be a second round. I've been busy, but also dragging my feet a bit. Compiling results in a spreadsheet is the most tedious part of these contests. Maybe Qvist can sympathize.  :D  I'll try to get the initial results and the next poll up soonish.
Let someone else help you with the tedious part.
Seriously, anyone who says "this is too big a job to do in a timely manner" is failing to delegate. Effective people delegate, delegate, delegate. Thank you for all you do, LastFootnote! You don't have to do it alone. Tons of volunteers would jump at the job.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #111 on: December 19, 2013, 10:56:05 am »
0

Yes, there will be a second round. I've been busy, but also dragging my feet a bit. Compiling results in a spreadsheet is the most tedious part of these contests. Maybe Qvist can sympathize.  :D  I'll try to get the initial results and the next poll up soonish.
Let someone else help you with the tedious part.
Seriously, anyone who says "this is too big a job to do in a timely manner" is failing to delegate. Effective people delegate, delegate, delegate. Thank you for all you do, LastFootnote! You don't have to do it alone. Tons of volunteers would jump at the job.

I appreciate that, guys, but compiling the information to hand off to somebody is just as much work as compiling it to post here. Anyhow, new poll up momentarily. Alchemy and Guilds polls to follow later in the day (I have yet to compile those cards).
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #112 on: December 19, 2013, 11:08:50 am »
0

Results and new poll are up! Now to compile the Alchemy and Guilds ballots.
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Robz888

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #113 on: December 19, 2013, 11:26:20 am »
+2

Are authors going to submit lobbying, explanatory posts like last time?
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #114 on: December 19, 2013, 11:30:03 am »
0

Are authors going to submit lobbying, explanatory posts like last time?
Oh, yes! Thanks for the reminder.

Authors of the top 5, please do submit a blurb about your card if you have the time! Last round it was very informative.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #115 on: December 19, 2013, 11:44:42 am »
0

Commentary from the author of Field

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I thought of the card in Cornucopia which nobody uses. This is, I think, Harvest. Why? Because in decks where you can use it (most times engines), it mostly gives $3, which is not so cool for an action card costing $5. So how to change it to make it more useful? Let's make the same with +cards. In engines +cards are cooler than +coins, so it is more useful. As I think it will give +3 cards most of the time, it is just a gambling-Smithy, so it has to cost $4.

Now I think we could strengthen it a bit (e.g. +1 buy), because maybe it gives a little bit less than +3 cards on average, especially in the beginning. But we can do this after it has won ;-)

I know there are some other terminal-draw cards yet, that won on the other contests, but I hope this won't block you from voting for Field, if you like the card.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 04:58:42 pm by LastFootnote »
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #116 on: December 19, 2013, 12:12:11 pm »
+1

Yes, there will be a second round. I've been busy, but also dragging my feet a bit. Compiling results in a spreadsheet is the most tedious part of these contests. Maybe Qvist can sympathize.  :D  I'll try to get the initial results and the next poll up soonish.
Let someone else help you with the tedious part.
Seriously, anyone who says "this is too big a job to do in a timely manner" is failing to delegate. Effective people delegate, delegate, delegate. Thank you for all you do, LastFootnote! You don't have to do it alone. Tons of volunteers would jump at the job.
I appreciate that, guys, but compiling the information to hand off to somebody is just as much work as compiling it to post here. Anyhow, new poll up momentarily. Alchemy and Guilds polls to follow later in the day (I have yet to compile those cards).
Here's how to do it.

1. Create a new f.ds account just for the contest.
    All posts to f.ds will be done from that, rather than from your own account.
    All submissions are made as instant messages to that account.
2. Create a blank Google Spreadsheet where all spreadsheet work will be done.
3. Give access to log in to the f.ds account and the Google spreadsheet to everyone who administrates the contest.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #117 on: December 19, 2013, 12:45:16 pm »
0

Commentary from the author of Scarecrow

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

Scarecrow is a high-skill, high-reward card. Its benefit is that it's a really cheap Leveled Up City, always. The drawback is steep, though: You discard all your non-uniques. In practice, this probably causes you to pitch a few Coppers if you're playing it early in the game and kills your purchasing power. Not very good, don't open with this!

Of course, there are a lot of times where pitching all your extras is okay. The synergy with Menagerie is obvious, but Scarecrow should also work decently well with any draw-to-X engine (Library, Watchtower, etc.). In general, the card is a cheap engine lubricant, giving you a Village plus Lab effect for super cheap, which hopefully is enough for you to dig that Smithy out of your draw pile. Scarecrow gets your engine going, ideally, so you can re-draw all the stuff it made you discard. Then, once, you've drawn most of your deck, don't play this! Such a penalty.

Anyway, it encourages variety by steeply penalizing lack of variety, and it should be quite strong but hard to play optimally. Glad it was well received!
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 04:58:22 pm by LastFootnote »
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #118 on: December 19, 2013, 04:58:04 pm »
0

Commentary from the author of Storyteller

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

The basic idea of Storyteller is a village that lets you play one of each action card, but no more than that. Though simple in concept, it is tricky to implement.

One concern is that it can stack to generate a lot of actions. If you have two Storytellers in play, playing one new action card generates two extra actions. It gets better if you have even more Storytellers in play. Since it functions as a village, you would want a bunch of Storytellers anyway. To keep it from getting out of hand, I made Storyteller terminal after its first play. That makes it harder to stack and adds some tension in the gameplay. You want enough Storytellers that they can support your extra terminals, but you don't want too many because they are junky after the first.

I think that Storyteller would encourage players to build different decks and strategies than are currently played. Many strategies focus on using just one or two payload cards. Storyteller wants you to use a variety of terminal payloads instead. It can also allow cantrips to become one-time villages.

On theme, I chose the name "Storyteller" because it kind of parallels Wandering Minstrel as another person-village. Both entertain groups of people. Storyteller rewards variety and creativity, just as many of the best stories come from a wild imagination. A storyteller also fits right in with the "harvest celebration" setting of Cornucopia.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #119 on: December 19, 2013, 05:22:02 pm »
0

Commentary from the author of Showman

Quote
Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.

For some reason I totally forgot that I had submitted this. Like not a single recollection that I had submitted a card for Cornucopia. I only realized when I was sending in my card for Alchemy. I voted for my own card completely without bias because of this, which was a good sign I guess.

Anyway, the main thing behind the card is that there isn't really a Peddler variant in Cornucopia. Most expansions have one or more, but there definitely could be one based around variety. By revealing a card from your hand, then checking the top card, it means it'll mostly be a dud at the start of the game, but it would become simply Peddler quite fast. This was a concern for some, but I think it's not too crazy at $3. It's great if you get that unique card with your Showmen, but if you don't you just have Ruined Villages. In BM it's pretty bad, and in Engines you'll probably have a bunch of Villages and Smithy's or something, so variety isn't huge in those decks. Throne and KC are great cards, but still need to be paired up with something good. Throne Room Village is only good if you have terminals, and Showman is only good if it's paired up with a card you don't have a lot of.

There are some solutions I thought of, such as changing what you don't get (Like it could be terminal if it whiffs, like Conspirators) Again something could be figured out if it wins. Please vote for the variation mechanic, and not for the power level problems this may have.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #120 on: December 19, 2013, 05:22:51 pm »
0

Commentary from the author of Showman

Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

The idea for Harvest Queen was pretty easy to come up with, and it should be clear what it's meant to be - it's the Throne Room of Cornucopia. Well, maybe a little more like a Golem or a Herald, but the idea was always that it would fill the "cards that play other cards" niche.

Originally, I had it that you chose 3 unique cards from your hand, and had to choose the order to play them before resolving any effects, but feedback told me this was too weak (and maybe a bit too complicated), so it got changed to picking any number of unique cards, and choose them one at a time to resolve. Functionally it won't make a lot of difference most of the time, but it also simplifies things a little and I'm a huge fan of making cards as simple as possible (although there's a lower limit to how simple cards like this can get, as you will discover when you Harvest Queen your Harvest Queen).

Thematically, I did search around for a suitable name for a while, even after I'd come across the idea of the harvest queen, if only to avoid confusion with Harvest. In the end, though, it just works so well - as well as fitting in the Throne Room/King's Court naming pattern, the Harvest Queen is a symbolic character at some harvest festivals (which would make an even more confusing name for a card) who's meant to be the embodiment of the gods or somesuch, and can't you just imagine her giving her blessing to the various workers to help them go about their business?
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #121 on: December 19, 2013, 05:56:25 pm »
+1

Commentary from the author of Harvest Queen

Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

The idea for Harvest Queen was pretty easy to come up with, and it should be clear what it's meant to be - it's the Throne Room of Cornucopia. Well, maybe a little more like a Golem or a Herald, but the idea was always that it would fill the "cards that play other cards" niche.

Originally, I had it that you chose 3 unique cards from your hand, and had to choose the order to play them before resolving any effects, but feedback told me this was too weak (and maybe a bit too complicated), so it got changed to picking any number of unique cards, and choose them one at a time to resolve. Functionally it won't make a lot of difference most of the time, but it also simplifies things a little and I'm a huge fan of making cards as simple as possible (although there's a lower limit to how simple cards like this can get, as you will discover when you Harvest Queen your Harvest Queen).

Thematically, I did search around for a suitable name for a while, even after I'd come across the idea of the harvest queen, if only to avoid confusion with Harvest. In the end, though, it just works so well - as well as fitting in the Throne Room/King's Court naming pattern, the Harvest Queen is a symbolic character at some harvest festivals (which would make an even more confusing name for a card) who's meant to be the embodiment of the gods or somesuch, and can't you just imagine her giving her blessing to the various workers to help them go about their business?

This is commentary on Harvest Queen, not Showman. ctrl+c ctrl+v
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 06:04:58 pm by LastFootnote »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #122 on: December 19, 2013, 06:05:24 pm »
0

This is commentary on Harvest Queen, not Showman. ctrl+c ctrl+v

Fixed! Thanks for catching that.
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ConMan

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #123 on: December 19, 2013, 06:27:05 pm »
+1

This is a tough choice. Like I think I mentioned before, I'm not a fan of the complexity of Scarecrow, but all the others have a nice combination of simple wording, interesting effect, and good theme (and look, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with Scarecrow, I just don't personally like it). If I didn't vote for all of them in the first round, I certainly should have.

I do disagree with Showman's creator's comment that there's no Peddler variant in Cornucopia - Tournament is technically a Peddler variant in the early game, even if the main mechanic of it isn't really the Peddler but the Black Market variant aspect.

I think Scarecrow is a little lower risk than its creator makes it out to be - of course you can't use it effectively in the early game, but later on it has enough cycling as well as the Actions necessary to really benefit a well-designed engine, especially if there's a card like Menagerie (or even Library or Watchtower, in a pinch) to counter-balance the discard effect.

Actually, pretty much all the cards are really nice engine enablers, especially in decks where you build up a bit of variety in the cards (or in the case of Field and Showman, some deck inspection to set them up). If my main criterion is "Would adding this card to a Kingdom make it more interesting to play?" then I think all of these succeed because I'd consider buying just about all of them, but not in a Rebuild kind of "if you don't buy this you lose" way.
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #124 on: December 19, 2013, 06:30:03 pm »
+1

This is commentary on Harvest Queen, not Showman. ctrl+c ctrl+v

Fixed! Thanks for catching that.

Harvest Queen blurb still says it's from the author of Showman.
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #125 on: December 19, 2013, 06:43:17 pm »
+1

This is commentary on Harvest Queen, not Showman. ctrl+c ctrl+v

Fixed! Thanks for catching that.

Harvest Queen blurb still says it's from the author of Showman.

Maybe the author of Showman wanted to comment anonymously on Harvest Queen.

My thoughts on the top five:

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

This is my favorite, and probably the only one I'll vote for.  First, it fits very nicely into Cornucopia, it nails the diversity theme as a terminal drawer, which Cornucopia needs.  Remember we are voting based on how the cards fit into their respective expansions, not how the contest winners fit together as a whole.  It's very simple and elegant, and I think fits the $4 price point nicely.  The main concern is that it overshadows Harvest (+card is usually "better" than +coin, and Field is cheaper), but I think that's more just an illustration of how weak Harvest is and that it really didn't need to be printed as it is in the first place.

Quote
Storyteller
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Card. If this is the first time you played a Storyteller this turn, +1 Action.

While this is in play, when you play an Action card that you don't already have a copy of in play, +1 Action.

Clarification: The first Storyteller you play only gives you +1 Action, not +2 Actions, because it wasn't in play when you played it.

I like Storyteller, it's a unique concept, and I can't think of any problems with the current wording, which is good considering how whacky the concept is.  Still the wording is a little clunky, and I'm not sure it would be exciting in comparison to other Villages.  I think it's probably good balance-wise, and it's interesting enough that I would be happy if it won.

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.

I'm not sure what to think of this card, but it just doesn't feel right to me.  First, I think +2 cards, +2 actions is not the best vanilla bonus for it.  In the best case scenario, it's a level 2 City which is obviously fantastic for $3, but the best case scenario is really, really rare.  +2 cards, +2 actions, discard a card is also very good for a $3 card, but the lack of control over what you discard really hurts it.  +2 cards, +2 actions, discard two cards is Inn without the on-gain, which is supposedly decent at $4, but this is a lot worse than that because you have no control over what you discard.  In fact if you just discarded random cards it might as well be Necropolis.  I think discarding duplicates is probably generally worse than discarding random cards.  Discarding more than two cards is pretty bad.  I suspect most of the time you'll discard at least two cards, so if nothing else it's super-situational.  I think I would like it better if it gave coin rather than cards, maybe adjusting the number of actions it gives as well.  I guess the biggest concern I have is that it will be anti-fun, making you discard lots of stuff all the time.  The thing it has going for it I think is how it fits into the set.  The combo with Menagerie is fun, Young Witch, Horse Traders, and Hamlet already have you discarding cards anyway, and Hunting Party gives you a diverse hand.

Quote
Showman
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+1 Action. Reveal a card from your hand, then reveal the top card of your deck. If they don't match, +1 Card and +$1.

First off, the author mentioned that Cornucopia doesn't have a Peddler variant.  It does, Tournament, which is actually a pretty good reason to not want this in Cornucopia (two Peddlers in a small set is a lot, especially since they both have the hit or miss on +1 card, +$1 mechanic).  The bonus can be changed though, so that's not a big concern.  I think my main problem with this is that it activates too easily to be interesting, to the point where it's just frustrating when it misses.  At the beginning it's a little tougher to activate but still not too bad.  If you reveal Estate you usually have a pretty good chance of activating it, and it's easier with deck-tracking.  It gets even easier as the game goes on.  I don't think being easy to activate makes it too strong, a $3 Peddler that occasionally misses seems reasonable, but I think it will just be frustrating to miss since it won't happen so often, and will usually happen regardless of whether you made the "right" reveal.

Quote
Harvest Queen
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Set aside any number of differently named Action cards from your hand. Play them in any order.

I'm not sure if I'm missing something, or if this card is just really weak.  I think it would rarely be better than +3 actions, which is probably fine (but uninteresting) at $3 or $4.  At $5 I think I would only pick one up on a very strong engine board with no other villages.  Maybe I'm way off or maybe I'm just missing something, I don't know.  It just seems really weak to me.  I like how it interacts with draw-up-to-X cards though.  Maybe there are some other clever uses for it I'm missing?  Also, having to set the cards aside is a little awkward, especially since it can interrupt itself to set aside more cards, presumably in a different pile.  I don't think there's anyway with official Dominion cards to get two different set-aside or revealed "zones" to exist at the same time.
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AJD

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #126 on: December 19, 2013, 08:48:06 pm »
0

I don't think there's anyway with official Dominion cards to get two different set-aside or revealed "zones" to exist at the same time.

Well, Island is the first thing that comes to mind. Also Haven, which a less cheap example.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #127 on: December 20, 2013, 05:24:25 pm »
0

I'm not going to comment much on each of the cards up for voting.  Nothing new to add, really.  I think Showman is the only one I didn't vote for in the first round, and that's only because I find it a little boring.  I think it's solid enough anyway though.  I think Field, Storyteller and Scarecrow are all neat.  I like Harvest Queen too, though I like Storyteller just a bit more.
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Nic

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #128 on: December 26, 2013, 09:29:40 pm »
+1

Bumping because Storyteller

Congrats to the winning card! I was on Team Scarecrow myself, but I really liked this card as well.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #129 on: December 26, 2013, 09:40:58 pm »
0

Bumping because Storyteller

Congrats to the winning card! I was on Team Scarecrow myself, but I really liked this card as well.

Huh.  Wasn't Storyteller bottom of the five in round one?
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #130 on: December 27, 2013, 01:16:26 am »
+1

I think Storyteller did the least well round 1 (of the 5 here), but I guess people changed their minds.

Showman was my card. I really didn't expect it to do this well, but I'm glad it did. It really was just a simple idea off the top of my head.
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GwinnR

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #131 on: December 27, 2013, 02:52:19 am »
0

First I want to congratulate the designer of Storyteller.

Second I want to tell you the Secret History of my Field:
Most things I said in the commentary yet:
Commentary from the author of Field

Quote
Field
Types: Action
Cost: $4
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put one of each differently named card revealed into your hand. Discard the rest.

I thought of the card in Cornucopia which nobody uses. This is, I think, Harvest. Why? Because in decks where you can use it (most times engines), it mostly gives $3, which is not so cool for an action card costing $5. So how to change it to make it more useful? Let's make the same with +cards. In engines +cards are cooler than +coins, so it is more useful. As I think it will give +3 cards most of the time, it is just a gambling-Smithy, so it has to cost $4.

Now I think we could strengthen it a bit (e.g. +1 buy), because maybe it gives a little bit less than +3 cards on average, especially in the beginning. But we can do this after it has won ;-)

I know there are some other terminal-draw cards yet, that won on the other contests, but I hope this won't block you from voting for Field, if you like the card.
To be honest, for this card I had not much time to design, because I nearly forgot the deadline, so I designed a card, that is a mix of two existing cards (Smithy and Harvest). I didn't thought that this would be enough, but I'm glad, that you liked it. I personnaly like the card too (which is not the case for all my cards), because it is simple and (I think) usefull in most games.

And third I want to thank you for all the votes you gave my card. I would be happy if you vote for my other cards too ;-)
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #132 on: December 27, 2013, 04:06:36 am »
0

Okay, so for a while I've been wanting to talk about my card, Outcast.  (I'm never really sure if it's good to talk about your non-finalist card when there is still an open poll among the finalists.)

Quote
Outcast
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1. Each other player discards any number of cards, then reveals his hand. Each player who reveals duplicate cards gains a Copper.

So, I think as it is it's pretty bad for a number of reasons, but it took me a lot of thought to get there and I think the lesson to be learned is that the concept just can't be done in a balanced way.  (Actually, as it turns out I think it works as a Looter, giving out Ruins instead of Copper, but then it's no longer a Cornucopia card.)  It started off literally identical to Old Gaffer (+$2 curser, reveal Menag-hand as bane), but priced at $5 instead of $4.  The concept was, "What if there was an attack card that punished players for lack of diversity, instead of rewarding them for diversity".  It couldn't be a trashing attack, how would that work.  It couldn't be a spy-type attack either, and it could try to be a discard attack, like "each other player reveals his hand and discards until he has no duplicates", but that's just super brutal, and probably has pin potential.  So, it would have to be a junking attack, which naturally wants to be a curser, which is how I got to Old Gaffer.  I had it priced at $5 because that's just too strong at $4.  It didn't feel quite right that the bane would probably not activate ~80+% of the time (having five uniques is pretty rare, right?).  So then I got the idea to combine the brutal discard attack with a junking attack, so they would have the option and it would be easier to block the junking, but would still be an attack most of the time since they would have to discard cards (usually) when the junking missed.  Still, with +$2 and giving out Curses with a bane at $5, it felt too similar to Mountebank.  It couldn't draw cards without looking like Witch or Torturer, it couldn't be non-terminal, and a vanilla bonus of just +buys is pretty lame, so I just couldn't find a way to balance it at $5.  Plus, Cornucopia really doesn't want another curser.  So it really had to give out something other than Curses, and Copper is the next junkiest thing (Estate junking has problems even if it can be blocked; Copper not so much).  So then there was a question of what vanilla bonus to give it and how to price it, and in the end I screwed that up pretty bad, it was just way too weak at $4.  But I think that a Copper junker is awkward in Cornucopia anyway, and I was worried that if it was anywhere near dominating, it would be too un-Cornucopia-ish, so I erred on the weak side.  Cornucopia celebrates diversity, and now there's this card filling you up with what was already the most common card in your deck.

So if only Cornucopia came with a pile of Ruins, I think that this would actually be a pretty good fit as a Looter (again, sticking another junking attack in Cornucopia might be a little much, but I think Looting Outcast is interesting enough to be okay).  If it's a Looter, then the junking is stronger than Copper-junking, so that it's more okay power-wise; the vanilla bonus and price could be tweaked without overlapping with other cards, since there are only two other attacking Looters.  But more importantly, it also has this cool thing where it actually junks you with diversity, which means that your deck is now more Cornucopia-ish, and also that you'll have an easier time blocking future plays of Outcast.
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Robz888

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #133 on: December 27, 2013, 04:16:10 am »
+1

Congrats to Storyteller! I'm quite happy it won, I did like it better than the rest, except for my card, which was...

Quote
Scarecrow
Types: Action
Cost: $3
+2 Cards. +2 Actions. Reveal your hand. Discard duplicate cards one at a time until you have no duplicate cards in hand.
[/quote]

I was glad to see Scarecrow get a lot of love. It was definitely the card I designed with which I was happiest (and marks I think my fourth 2nd place finish in a Design Card Contest). I would be more devastated if my Prize, Wizard, hadn't already won--at least I win something!
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #134 on: December 27, 2013, 06:08:47 pm »
+1

it could try to be a discard attack, like "each other player reveals his hand and discards until he has no duplicates", but that's just super brutal, and probably has pin potential.

The solution to this is to soften the attack somehow.  I would suggest something like:

(Vanilla bonus of some sort)
Each other player reveals his hand, discards until no duplicate remains, and draws until he has 3 cards in hand.

If you have a diverse hand, then the discard attack might not do anything to you at all (other than revealing your hand).  If you have no diversity, then it can get a little worse than Militia (in that you lose potentially strong cards -- you don't get to choose what to discard -- and draw back average cards).

Another take on it could be something like:

Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand reveals his hand and chooses one: he discards until no duplicates remain; or he discards a card that you choose.

In this case, you can let yourself be Pillaged if discarding all duplicates would pin you.
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #135 on: December 27, 2013, 06:24:14 pm »
0

it could try to be a discard attack, like "each other player reveals his hand and discards until he has no duplicates", but that's just super brutal, and probably has pin potential.

The solution to this is to soften the attack somehow.  I would suggest something like:

(Vanilla bonus of some sort)
Each other player reveals his hand, discards until no duplicate remains, and draws until he has 3 cards in hand.

If you have a diverse hand, then the discard attack might not do anything to you at all (other than revealing your hand).  If you have no diversity, then it can get a little worse than Militia (in that you lose potentially strong cards -- you don't get to choose what to discard -- and draw back average cards).

Another take on it could be something like:

Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand reveals his hand and chooses one: he discards until no duplicates remain; or he discards a card that you choose.

In this case, you can let yourself be Pillaged if discarding all duplicates would pin you.

I actually had written down the first thing you mention, but I didn't think I could make it work.  Let's say you have a hand of 2 Coppers, 2 Estates, and a Curse.  Then you can discard Curse, Estate, Estate, Copper, and then draw up to three, since it doesn't specify that you have to discard duplicates, and you can take advantage of the "draw up to" afterwards.  You could say "Each other player reveals his hand, discards duplicates from it until he has no duplicates, and draws up to 3 cards in hand", but that sounds awkward.  The other thing is that I'm not sure how well it punishes you for lack of diversity, since you can actually benefit from a more uniform hand (a hand of 1 Copper and 4 Provinces is better than a hand of like, Copper, Estate, Duchy, Province, Fairgrounds).

The second idea is pretty interesting though and maybe the best way to make the concept work as a pure discarding attack.  It would have been a nice fit in Cornucopia as well, which has Followers as the only discarding attack.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #136 on: December 27, 2013, 06:33:05 pm »
+1

Hmm, interesting point about discarding non-duplicates to get an advantage.  One other variation would be:

Each other player reveals his hand, discards until no duplicates remain, and draws 1 card.

Now you can go ahead and discard extra things if you want, but you don't get any special benefit from it.  However, it also benefits opponents who are diverse.  If they had a hand of 5 different cards, they end up drawing a sixth.
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LibraryAdventurer

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #137 on: January 07, 2014, 01:52:23 am »
+1

Who's the author of Storyteller?  I don't think it was ever revealed in this thread or else I missed it.  I'm adding it to my list of fan-made cards that I want to playtest at some point and I make a note of the author of each card in the list.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2014, 07:05:23 pm by LibraryAdventurer »
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #138 on: January 07, 2014, 03:57:19 pm »
+3

Who's the author of Storyteller?  I don't think it was ever revealed in this thread or else I missed it.  I'm adding it to my list of fan-made cards that I want to playtest at some point and I make a note of the author or each card in the list.

It's me!  I have been too lazy to write up anything more about it.  For now I should just say, hooray and thanks to those who commented on the card, good or bad. :)
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Robz888

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #139 on: January 07, 2014, 04:19:10 pm »
0

Who's the author of Storyteller?  I don't think it was ever revealed in this thread or else I missed it.  I'm adding it to my list of fan-made cards that I want to playtest at some point and I make a note of the author or each card in the list.

It's me!  I have been too lazy to write up anything more about it.  For now I should just say, hooray and thanks to those who commented on the card, good or bad. :)

Shoulda known... the Fan Card Master himself!
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markusin

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #140 on: January 08, 2014, 03:34:43 pm »
0

Who's the author of Storyteller?  I don't think it was ever revealed in this thread or else I missed it.  I'm adding it to my list of fan-made cards that I want to playtest at some point and I make a note of the author or each card in the list.

It's me!  I have been too lazy to write up anything more about it.  For now I should just say, hooray and thanks to those who commented on the card, good or bad. :)
You made Storyteller, eHalcyon? Congratulations! I hope the others are aware of this now.
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Polk5440

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #141 on: January 09, 2014, 01:20:51 pm »
0

Quick note on Bounty (my card):

I came up with it on the fly. I think Tribute really belongs with Cornucopia, so I made a self-Tribute. The bonus for flipping your own Victory cards has to be less than flipping your opponents' victory cards, hence, only +1 card. Small bonus for Curse since +buy is always nice and then there are no whiffs.

My guess is that this self-Tribute would be stronger than actual Tribute, not weaker as many people guessed because there is the ability to better set it up and you have more control over the type of cards you add to your own deck.

I am not surprised it got few votes -- it really was more of a benchmark card. SOMEONE (i.e., eHalcyon) was bound to come up with something better.... but just in case, I submitted anyway.
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KingZog3

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #142 on: January 09, 2014, 05:39:14 pm »
+1

Quick note on Bounty (my card):

I came up with it on the fly. I think Tribute really belongs with Cornucopia, so I made a self-Tribute. The bonus for flipping your own Victory cards has to be less than flipping your opponents' victory cards, hence, only +1 card. Small bonus for Curse since +buy is always nice and then there are no whiffs.

My guess is that this self-Tribute would be stronger than actual Tribute, not weaker as many people guessed because there is the ability to better set it up and you have more control over the type of cards you add to your own deck.

I am not surprised it got few votes -- it really was more of a benchmark card. SOMEONE (i.e., eHalcyon) was bound to come up with something better.... but just in case, I submitted anyway.

Probably the reason it didn't do as well is not because it's a bad card. It's totally good. Just that Tribute isn't so exciting, so Bounty is more of a suggested fix rather than a new, unique card. Also why my card, Showman, didn't win. It's a good card, but it's just not super new in the same way the other finalists were.
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AJD

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #143 on: January 09, 2014, 08:09:54 pm »
0

Tribute really belongs with Cornucopia

Interesting observation. It's certainly one of the few "differently-named cards" abilities outside Cornucopia. But a thing that makes Tribute not really fit into Cornucopia is that with Tribute, having differently-named cards is a bad thing—the more homogeneous your deck, the less likely your opponent gets a good bonus from Tribute.

(On the other hand, Tribute also makes having Action–Victory cards a bad thing, and that doesn't make it not fit Intrigue.)
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Polk5440

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #144 on: January 09, 2014, 08:40:07 pm »
0

Tribute really belongs with Cornucopia

Interesting observation. It's certainly one of the few "differently-named cards" abilities outside Cornucopia. But a thing that makes Tribute not really fit into Cornucopia is that with Tribute, having differently-named cards is a bad thing—the more homogeneous your deck, the less likely your opponent gets a good bonus from Tribute.

(On the other hand, Tribute also makes having Action–Victory cards a bad thing, and that doesn't make it not fit Intrigue.)

I think Tribute fits Cornucopia in the same way Hunting Party fits -- it makes you CARE about variety in decks (either your deck because they buy Tribute, or their decks because you want Tribute) but it doesn't necessarily make you WANT variety.
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Polk5440

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #145 on: January 09, 2014, 08:42:52 pm »
+1

Quick note on Bounty (my card):

I came up with it on the fly. I think Tribute really belongs with Cornucopia, so I made a self-Tribute. The bonus for flipping your own Victory cards has to be less than flipping your opponents' victory cards, hence, only +1 card. Small bonus for Curse since +buy is always nice and then there are no whiffs.

My guess is that this self-Tribute would be stronger than actual Tribute, not weaker as many people guessed because there is the ability to better set it up and you have more control over the type of cards you add to your own deck.

I am not surprised it got few votes -- it really was more of a benchmark card. SOMEONE (i.e., eHalcyon) was bound to come up with something better.... but just in case, I submitted anyway.

Probably the reason it didn't do as well is not because it's a bad card. It's totally good. Just that Tribute isn't so exciting, so Bounty is more of a suggested fix rather than a new, unique card. Also why my card, Showman, didn't win. It's a good card, but it's just not super new in the same way the other finalists were.

Hey, now! I never admitted my card was BAD. I would never do such a thing.  ;)

I do agree it's not different enough and that's the reason why it didn't get votes. Though I would be very interested in taking playing Tribute as a self-Tribute (maybe with Bounty's wording) for fun sometime just to see how different it would really play.
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Polk5440

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #6: Cornucopia
« Reply #146 on: January 09, 2014, 08:45:28 pm »
0

Oh, I forgot to congratulate eHalcyon on a win. I voted for Storyteller in both rounds, so he successfully deceived me about which card was his. Otherwise, I totally wouldn't have voted for it.  ;) jk
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