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[Robz888]

We should and will and must lynch ash today.

[Jimmmmm]

So, here's Jimmmmm's reread:

I'll just colllect everything noteable and give post numbers, since I don't want to quote all of it. In the beginning, we have the famous refusal to give Robz town points (#167). Then, early on, he has an exchange with ashersky (around #206). He then accuses mcmc of being vague (#245) and votes for him (#381). Note that he never says that he is no longer suspicious of mcmc.

My suspicion of mcmc is still there, and I will have more to say about him before the Day ends.

During the e discussion, he defends e (#459, #491) and then is the first to vote Jorbles (#493). He then again has a conversation with ashersky (around #503). The next post, after e's claim, is interesting enough to quote it:

I think, although he probably shouldn't have claimed at this point, his claim does get him some Town points. If he is scum, Town probably don't have many PRs, since if they do that would be too great a risk to take.

This could be PR breadcrumbing (if he is scum, town doesn't have many PRs. I have a PR, so e is more likely town), but it's far from clear.

No that wasn't breadcrumbing, although it was probably influenced by having a PR.

He is then suspicious of how quickly the Jorbles wagon grew (#536) and votes manda for her scummy Jorbles vote (#587). What follows, his whole opposition to the Morgrim wagon, is already well-discussed.
Now something big: At the start of D2, he posts this:

Hey people: It was a joke! ashersky was joking. We here at f.ds do that sometimes. Maybe it was scummy joking, I don't know. We do that too. But it was a joke.

By that time, according to his claim, he already knew that ashersky was scum. Why defend known scum?

Yeah, at that point I still wasn't sure the best way to approach my result. Mostly I saw what ash was doing (joking) and didn't want to waste pages on people misunderstanding it.

(fixed quoting)

[faust]

Right now, I would say ashersky has a 0% chance of flipping town (see what I did there?). There is no need to lynch him now, let's try and find the scum PR instead.

Do you mean try to find his partners in-game today and lynch ash at the end of it, or do you mean lynch someone else today?

I mean lynching someone else today. We can lynch ashersky when we're at LyLo. He's only a Goon, after all.

[faust]

The Unclaimed:

Voltaire
Robz
manda
Teproc
mcmcsalot

Everyone, please order these players from least scummy to most scummy.

[Teproc]

I'm not sure we would be in that good a position, because Morgrim wouldn't be confirmed PR, and, being Morgrim, he would probably be saying weird stuff that makes us think he's scum. Think about the last post you made faust, the situation would be insanely confusing if we didn't know about 2 PRs for sure.

Of course this is rather pointless discussion. I'm trying to think of the fakeclaiming Jimmmm/Walrus scenarios, and I think I agree with faust's post. It's either Jimmmm/Walrus/ash without daychat, or ash/Walrus/X with daychat in those scenarios.

Actually, doesn't ash/Walrus with daychat + Traitor work pretty well ? It also helps that I personally think Walrus is scum (see my vote on him earlier).

Or they could just be both telling the truth. That would put us in an insanely good position, but there's no way to be sure unfortunately.

PPE: 9 replies.

[Voltaire]

The Unclaimed:

Voltaire
Robz
manda
Teproc
mcmcsalot

Everyone, please order these players from least scummy to most scummy.

Voltaire
Robz
manda
Teproc
mcmc

[faust]

Daychat for sure.  Man, daychat would be awesome.  It's a strong power.  As mentioned, if I was scum, I'd definitely go full on or zero, as much for wifom purposes as anything else.  So Daychat/Joat/Recruit?  BP is LAME-O and I see no use for a Role Cop whatsoever.  Otherwise, roll with two goons.

How much you want to bet ash's team took daychat/JOAT/recruit? He did a "claim reality" thing in the latest RMM game.

Possible. But consider ash might have been the Traitor and got recruited, in which case he had nothing to say in the power choosing process.

[Robz888]

Right now, I would say ashersky has a 0% chance of flipping town (see what I did there?). There is no need to lynch him now, let's try and find the scum PR instead.

Do you mean try to find his partners in-game today and lynch ash at the end of it, or do you mean lynch someone else today?

I mean lynching someone else today. We can lynch ashersky when we're at LyLo. He's only a Goon, after all.

I think this is a bad idea. I mean, if Walrus and Jimm knew we would do that, then their plan would have actually made sense and they could be the scum.

[Robz888]

The Unclaimed:

Voltaire
Robz
manda
Teproc
mcmcsalot

Everyone, please order these players from least scummy to most scummy.

Robz
manda
mcmcsalot
Voltaire
Teproc

[Teproc]

The Unclaimed:

Voltaire
Robz
manda
Teproc
mcmcsalot

Everyone, please order these players from least scummy to most scummy.

Voltaire
manda
mcmcsalot
Robz

Haven't really had time to reevaluate after the claims though.

[faust]

Right now, I would say ashersky has a 0% chance of flipping town (see what I did there?). There is no need to lynch him now, let's try and find the scum PR instead.

Do you mean try to find his partners in-game today and lynch ash at the end of it, or do you mean lynch someone else today?

I mean lynching someone else today. We can lynch ashersky when we're at LyLo. He's only a Goon, after all.

I think this is a bad idea. I mean, if Walrus and Jimm knew we would do that, then their plan would have actually made sense and they could be the scum.

I highly doubt that they could possibly have anticipated this.

[faust]

The thing is: I strongly suppose that scum has a JOAT. I strongly suppose they will kill me tonight. The only way to avoid this (and at the same time give us the chance to confirm e's claim) is to kill the JOAT.

[Robz888]

I think I would rather have ash dead and absolutely confirmed as scum, than you still alive.

[Jimmmmm]

Most scummy to least scummy:

mcmcsalot
Robz
manda
Teproc
Voltaire

Admittedly I have not paid much attention to Teproc or Volt. Volt gets to be at the bottom because I think he's been fairly active and nothing has jumped out at me as scummy from him.

[Voltaire]

I think I would rather have ash dead and absolutely confirmed as scum, than you still alive.

This.

[Jimmmmm]

Most scummy to least scummy:

mcmcsalot
Robz
manda
Teproc
Voltaire

Admittedly I have not paid much attention to Teproc or Volt. Volt gets to be at the bottom because I think he's been fairly active and nothing has jumped out at me as scummy from him.

Whoops, wrong way round.

From least scummy to most scummy:

Voltaire
Teproc
manda
Robz
mcmcsalot

[Robz888]

I think I would rather have ash dead and absolutely confirmed as scum, than you still alive.

This.

I mean, I can KIND OF see the argument for leaving ash alive, only because our IC is making it and I think that's a pretty unexpected plan, thus scum could not have banked on it, which was the only way this would make sense. But that's just a lot of ifs that would cause us to insta-lose the game.

I don't think we have to play risky. Ash is scum, and we should lynch him.

[Jimmmmm]

I think I would rather have ash dead and absolutely confirmed as scum, than you still alive.

I agree that you'd have to have a decent amount of trust in me at this point to keep ash alive and assume he's a Goon. Absent that, obviously lynching ash is the right move.

Tough work for e to work out who to protect Tonight if he's Town.

[Teproc]

Well it's unexpected except that Jimmmmm clearly had that plan when he claimed, scum or not. So it is actually very much expected if scum, you know, reads the thread.

[Jimmmmm]

Well it's unexpected except that Jimmmmm clearly had that plan when he claimed, scum or not. So it is actually very much expected if scum, you know, reads the thread.

I never actually expected we would lynch someone other than me or ash Today. Keeping ash alive probably helps me do my job better (if there's still a job for me to do), so that would be nice. And it would be nice if everyone would believe me and we would operate under the assumption that ash is a Goon. Obviously no one really trusts me enough to do that, which is fair enough, so it's best to lynch ash, and then operate under the knowledge that he's a Goon.

[WalrusMcFishSr]

It is my opinion that we should certainly lynch ash tonight.

First of all, it would go a long way towards corroborating my claim and Jimmmmm's, which I would obviously appreciate. It's not perfect information, I know, but it's something.

Second, having one goon down would boost the effectiveness of my PR by a fair amount. If there's only one goon alive, that means that I have a much better chance of actually blocking them, or at least getting a definitive result. Even if they've recruited the traitor, it's still an improvement. Who knows faust, maybe I even block them from killing you! Or maybe they just kill me or somebody else instead.

I'll do the scumminess ordering thing when I get to work

[faust]

Walrus, you don't block them from killing me. Strongman goes through your roleblocking.

[Teproc]

Well it's unexpected except that Jimmmmm clearly had that plan when he claimed, scum or not. So it is actually very much expected if scum, you know, reads the thread.

I never actually expected we would lynch someone other than me or ash Today. Keeping ash alive probably helps me do my job better (if there's still a job for me to do), so that would be nice. And it would be nice if everyone would believe me and we would operate under the assumption that ash is a Goon. Obviously no one really trusts me enough to do that, which is fair enough, so it's best to lynch ash, and then operate under the knowledge that he's a Goon.

Huh ? If you didn't expect it, why did you try to argue for it ? I mean I understand how it's beneficial for you but you thought you had a chance to convince us, otherwise you wouldn't have said to lynch someone else first in your initial claim, right ?

In any case, yes, we need to lynch ash today, that is pretty obvious.

[Jimmmmm]

Well it's unexpected except that Jimmmmm clearly had that plan when he claimed, scum or not. So it is actually very much expected if scum, you know, reads the thread.

I never actually expected we would lynch someone other than me or ash Today. Keeping ash alive probably helps me do my job better (if there's still a job for me to do), so that would be nice. And it would be nice if everyone would believe me and we would operate under the assumption that ash is a Goon. Obviously no one really trusts me enough to do that, which is fair enough, so it's best to lynch ash, and then operate under the knowledge that he's a Goon.

Huh ? If you didn't expect it, why did you try to argue for it ? I mean I understand how it's beneficial for you but you thought you had a chance to convince us, otherwise you wouldn't have said to lynch someone else first in your initial claim, right ?

In any case, yes, we need to lynch ash today, that is pretty obvious.

If there's enough support, from my point of view it's a great thing to do. From a neutral point of view it's a riskier thing to do. Still voting for ash.

[WalrusMcFishSr]

Shit. Forgot about the Strongman.

Well still. If we want to use the rest of the day for scum hunting and discussion, that's fine, but my vote isn't moving.