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Author Topic: Why Guilds is only for English Language people  (Read 15653 times)

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theory

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #50 on: February 26, 2014, 08:09:32 pm »
+1

If you're interested in this subject, I can highly recommend Le Ton Beau de Marot by Douglas Hofstadter.
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SCSN

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #51 on: February 26, 2014, 11:31:11 pm »
+1

And Nabokov's essay The Art of Translation
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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #52 on: February 27, 2014, 04:08:53 am »
+1

I think usually British English gets translated in to American English. Like Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy has things like "lorry" and "torch" changed to truck and flashlight. Personally I don't get it, because it then loses a certain feel that the original had, and it's not like it's not understandable either. It's still English!

It's more English.  :P
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Kirian

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #53 on: February 27, 2014, 10:18:50 am »
0

If you're interested in this subject, I can highly recommend Le Ton Beau de Marot by Douglas Hofstadter.

Hofstadter, the Mark Danielewski of nonfiction.
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SirPeebles

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #54 on: March 22, 2014, 07:21:05 pm »
+1

I now begin to wonder about books translated into other languages.  Do the translators get "creative" for those as well?  Does the Dutch version of Harry Potter have an invincibility cloak instead of an invisibility cloak?  Is the French version of a Dan Brown book actually readable?  Is the Russian version of Twilight three times as long and contain two hundred pages of commentary on economic systems?

And going the other direction, is the original Italian version of Foucault's Pendulum actually as crazily messed-up as the English version was?  Because that was pretty trippy.

For what's it worth, Harry Potter is translated from British English into American English.
Does British English usually get translated into American English, or the other way around?

I think usually British English gets translated in to American English. Like Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy has things like "lorry" and "torch" changed to truck and flashlight. Personally I don't get it, because it then loses a certain feel that the original had, and it's not like it's not understandable either. It's still English!

Lorry?  Americans have enough trouble with truck.
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Kirian

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #55 on: March 22, 2014, 07:55:49 pm »
0

That would have been so much better if it were five slides long... the joke wore really thin after that.
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Awaclus

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #56 on: March 22, 2014, 08:06:27 pm »
+2

That would have been so much better if it were five slides long... the joke wore really thin after that.
Well, I was tired enough to not notice I was reading The Onion until the 7th slide.
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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #57 on: June 05, 2014, 08:23:09 am »
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And Nabokov's essay The Art of Translation

Very interesting reading!

As an offtopic, I've read one of his books both in Russian and in English, and the latter was the most complicated English text I ever dealt with (hmm, barring some Edgar Allan Poe prose, probably).

SCSN

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #58 on: June 05, 2014, 08:59:03 am »
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And Nabokov's essay The Art of Translation

Very interesting reading!

As an offtopic, I've read one of his books both in Russian and in English, and the latter was the most complicated English text I ever dealt with (hmm, barring some Edgar Allan Poe prose, probably).

Cool, which one? I've read every English word the man has written (save for some of his poems and plays) and he's my favorite writer by far. His linguistic precision is at times exhausting but always rewarding. It wouldn't surprise me if Ada alone doubled my English vocabulary.

I'm insanely jealous of your ability to read Russian. Learning that language is still one of my goals, but I never seem to be able to find the time. I'm particularly interested in reading Bely, Gogol and Pushkin in their native tongue. Are you familiar with their work?
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Burning Skull

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #59 on: June 05, 2014, 09:32:21 am »
+1

Cool, which one?

I was talking about his most famous book, Lolita.
My personal favorite of his works is Laughter in the Dark.
It's so strong emotionally and so dark and full of misanthropy you just want to lay down and die after reading it.

I'm particularly interested in reading Bely, Gogol and Pushkin in their native tongue. Are you familiar with their work?
           
Gogol is one of my favorite writers indeed!
And yes, it's really hard to image his books in some other language than Russian (some of them are with a lot of Ukrainian words in 'em actually).
I think he must be one of the most difficult Russian writers to translate to some other language (not talking about poets here).

When I run out of something new to read, I always take Gogol's "Evenings on a Farm Near Dikanka" and happily reread it.
It is considered by some as a book for children, but it's so awesome on so many levels! Think I've read it like five times or so haha :)

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #60 on: June 10, 2014, 10:05:13 am »
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My personal favorite of his works is Laughter in the Dark.
It's so strong emotionally and so dark and full of misanthropy you just want to lay down and die after reading it.
I've got to check that out later. I just happened to read Lolita last week and it while I did enjoy it a lot, it was quite challenging on many levels — I had trouble understanding the language, then I had trouble getting the references (and probably missed most of them too), and then I had trouble dealing with the emotional impact. Definitely want to read more of Nabokov's books, but not right now.
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ipofanes

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #61 on: June 12, 2014, 03:43:33 am »
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My only encounter with Nabokov was reading Pnin in a German translation, and I stopped halfway through because the book didn't grip me at all.

A question to the boardgamers among you: Is The Luzhin Defense worth a read?
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SCSN

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Re: Why Guilds is only for English Language people
« Reply #62 on: June 12, 2014, 05:01:17 am »
+1

Absolutely, and I can fully understand not liking Pnin—I did not like it myself after a first read, and only began to appreciate it (though it's still far from my favorite) upon returning to it after reading most of his other works.

To people new to Nabokov I generally recommend Laughter in the Dark first, as it's one of his easiest books in terms of vocabulary and there's something about it that makes it a really smooth read, and The Defense second.

Unless your English is really poor I'd take the English translations over the German ones. Not because the latter are necessarily bad (I have no clue), but because Nabokov was personally involved with the English translations of all his Russian works: he made copious corrections to and rewrites of early drafts so that every word appearing in print bears his stamp of approval.

My personal favorite of his works is Laughter in the Dark.
It's so strong emotionally and so dark and full of misanthropy you just want to lay down and die after reading it.
I've got to check that out later. I just happened to read Lolita last week and it while I did enjoy it a lot, it was quite challenging on many levels — I had trouble understanding the language, then I had trouble getting the references (and probably missed most of them too), and then I had trouble dealing with the emotional impact. Definitely want to read more of Nabokov's books, but not right now.

If you ever feel like rereading Lolita, I can recommend "The Annotated Lolita" by Alfred Appel, it's just the book with a whole bunch of notes at the end explaining various references, and the Foreword is nice too.

I'm particularly interested in reading Bely, Gogol and Pushkin in their native tongue. Are you familiar with their work?
           
Gogol is one of my favorite writers indeed!
And yes, it's really hard to image his books in some other language than Russian (some of them are with a lot of Ukrainian words in 'em actually).
I think he must be one of the most difficult Russian writers to translate to some other language (not talking about poets here).

Yeah, I have Bely's "Gogol's Artistry" in English translation and it really stresses how much I'm missing. It's a study of Gogol's style and most of what he discusses pertains to particular patterns in Gogol's use of the Russian language, a significant part of which loses its meaning in translation. I still love it, but expect to love it a whole lot more when I finally learn Russian.

Nabokov has written a little book on Gogol too, and that's in fact how I first heard about him. I especially love his discussion of the short story The Overcoat.
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