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Author Topic: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?  (Read 5720 times)

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TrojH

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2013, 12:58:49 am »
+2

http://dominionlogs.goko.com//20130912/log.505c6195a2e6c78ad2ed5a99.1379013631048.txt

My opponent (no disrespect to him) had over a 5K rating on Goko, so I was expecting some reasonable competition.  I do a simple Remake-BM, getting 4 Provinces in 15 turns, while my opponent gets two Bureaucrats and attempts to empty the City pile.  How do you make it to such a high rating without realizing the power of trashing?

I have about 4000 games of Dominion under my belt.

I'm in the top 200 on the Isotropish leaderboard. (Barely.)

I still have games where I act like a total noob. Sometimes, my brain just doesn't work right.

Your opponent had an off game. Simple as that.
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Ratsia

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2013, 01:56:46 am »
+3

Wrong! I am having a devil of a time staying above 5000, but Isotropish says I'm level 24 and I think I was level 22 when iso went down. Now, I know for the elite players here a level 23ish person is not competition, but I'd hardly call them "new to Dominion"!
I'd have to agree here. I'm constantly below 5000 in Goko ranking, but I was around level 30 in Isotropic and currently I'm level 32 in the Trueskill ranking for Goko. I wouldn't say I'm good and I will definitely miss obvious strategies fairly often, but after some 2k games since 2008 I'm not that new to the game. :)

It's simply that the rating system in Goko is not a good estimate of one's skill. There are ways for good players to have low rating (e.g. infrequent playing, playing against others around specific skill levels), and consequently there are ways for not so good players to have high ratings as well.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2013, 02:07:39 am »
0

Do folks generally see a point swing of 50-100 points per game?  That, plus the time off factor, can really tank your rating.

We all have good and bad streaks -- I drop 500 rating points in a single sitting, after losing 6 of 7 games.  Then I had a turn of fortune in my unranked Gokdom games, then regained the points over two more sittings, winning 6 games in a row.

I mean, I get that I won and lost basically the same amount of games over the time period, so my rating "staying" the same makes sense.  But because of the instantaneous changes, going from ~5300 to ~4700 to ~5300 in a three day period just feels wacky.  And depressing, since I'm never going to break into the "good" category.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2013, 05:15:05 pm »
+22

My opponent (no disrespect to him) had over a 5K rating on Goko, so I was expecting some reasonable competition.  I do a simple Remake-BM, getting 4 Provinces in 15 turns, while my opponent gets two Bureaucrats and attempts to empty the City pile.  How do you make it to such a high rating without realizing the power of trashing?

I understand this sentiment, but I strongly disapprove of posting it like this. Saying "no disrespect intended" doesn't magically make it polite to say "look how badly my high-rated opponent played."

If I had seen a post like this about me when I first joined f.ds, I probably wouldn't have stuck around. And I had huge holes in my game then because (duh) I hadn't started reading Dominion strategy.

Your opponent appears to have joined Goko about three weeks ago. He's also in my automatch server logs, which means he has the extension and is probably either a new forum member or a lurker who may soon join. Hopefully he won't find this post and decide that f.ds is a bunch of assholes.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2013, 07:15:52 pm »
+1

Goko ratings are essentially like this:

<5000: New to Dominion.
5000 - 6000: ? ? ?
>6000: Good.

I guess that depends on your definition of good... I mean, 6000 on Goko is higher than top 100.  I'd call that better than just good.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #30 on: September 13, 2013, 07:17:18 pm »
+11

My opponent (no disrespect to him) had over a 5K rating on Goko, so I was expecting some reasonable competition.  I do a simple Remake-BM, getting 4 Provinces in 15 turns, while my opponent gets two Bureaucrats and attempts to empty the City pile.  How do you make it to such a high rating without realizing the power of trashing?

I understand this sentiment, but I strongly disapprove of posting it like this. Saying "no disrespect intended" doesn't magically make it polite to say "look how badly my high-rated opponent played."

If I had seen a post like this about me when I first joined f.ds, I probably wouldn't have stuck around. And I had huge holes in my game then because (duh) I hadn't started reading Dominion strategy.

Your opponent appears to have joined Goko about three weeks ago. He's also in my automatch server logs, which means he has the extension and is probably either a new forum member or a lurker who may soon join. Hopefully he won't find this post and decide that f.ds is a bunch of assholes.

In fairness, some of us *are* assholes.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #31 on: September 14, 2013, 09:05:04 am »
0

My opponent (no disrespect to him) had over a 5K rating on Goko, so I was expecting some reasonable competition.  I do a simple Remake-BM, getting 4 Provinces in 15 turns, while my opponent gets two Bureaucrats and attempts to empty the City pile.  How do you make it to such a high rating without realizing the power of trashing?

I understand this sentiment, but I strongly disapprove of posting it like this. Saying "no disrespect intended" doesn't magically make it polite to say "look how badly my high-rated opponent played."

If I had seen a post like this about me when I first joined f.ds, I probably wouldn't have stuck around. And I had huge holes in my game then because (duh) I hadn't started reading Dominion strategy.

Your opponent appears to have joined Goko about three weeks ago. He's also in my automatch server logs, which means he has the extension and is probably either a new forum member or a lurker who may soon join. Hopefully he won't find this post and decide that f.ds is a bunch of assholes.

My beef was mainly with Goko's rating system.  I hope he continues to play Dominion and improves.  Also, if you ever watched any of my Let's Plays, I kind of really am an asshole.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #32 on: September 14, 2013, 09:19:09 am »
0

Also, if you ever watched any of my Let's Plays, I kind of really am an asshole.
But you're a charismatic one!
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SirPeebles

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #33 on: September 14, 2013, 09:57:13 am »
+2

Also, if you ever watched any of my Let's Plays, I kind of really am an asshole.
But you're a charismatic one!

Wait, which video did you watch?  ::)
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werothegreat

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #34 on: September 14, 2013, 02:41:38 pm »
0

Also, if you ever watched any of my Let's Plays, I kind of really am an asshole.
But you're a charismatic one!

Wait, which video did you watch?  ::)

Probably one where I was randomly shouting card names at the screen.
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SirPeebles

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #35 on: September 14, 2013, 03:19:43 pm »
0

Also, if you ever watched any of my Let's Plays, I kind of really am an asshole.
But you're a charismatic one!

Wait, which video did you watch?  ::)

Probably one where I was randomly shouting card names at the screen.

I rewatched one of your earliest videos, the "treasure eating bishops" one.  You seemed completely oblivious to this as it was happening, but at least a few times your opponent accidentally trashed his good cards to your Bishop.  I saw him trash a Bishop, and later on a Grand Market.  At one point you count the Grand Markets and conclude that your opponent had 3 to your 2, but he had accidentally trashed one already.
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Polk5440

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #36 on: September 14, 2013, 05:49:49 pm »
+1

Also, if you ever watched any of my Let's Plays, I kind of really am an asshole.
But you're a charismatic one!

Wait, which video did you watch?  ::)

Probably one where I was randomly shouting card names at the screen.

I rewatched one of your earliest videos, the "treasure eating bishops" one.  You seemed completely oblivious to this as it was happening, but at least a few times your opponent accidentally trashed his good cards to your Bishop.  I saw him trash a Bishop, and later on a Grand Market.  At one point you count the Grand Markets and conclude that your opponent had 3 to your 2, but he had accidentally trashed one already.

Wow! Dramatic irony in a Dominion video! Who knew?
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SirPeebles

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #37 on: September 14, 2013, 05:59:40 pm »
+4

Not just for tillers anymore.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #38 on: September 18, 2013, 07:21:15 pm »
0

Goko Pro ratings are essentially like this:

<5000: New to Dominion.
5000 - 6000: ? ? ?
>6000: Good.

Fixed that for you. Getting above 5000 on the casual ladder is tougher.
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ashersky

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #39 on: September 18, 2013, 08:04:09 pm »
0

Goko Pro ratings are essentially like this:

<5000: New to Dominion.
5000 - 6000: ? ? ?
>6000: Good.

Fixed that for you. Getting above 5000 on the casual ladder is tougher.

I think by tough you mean easy.

I've seen a lot of casual rankings above 5000 (up to 13000, I think).  The reason it is easy is because you can hand-pick the kingdom.

Check the kingdoms that are on offer in casual games from high-ranked casual only players.  That's a lot of KC/GM/Wharf/Masq stuff there.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #40 on: September 18, 2013, 10:49:02 pm »
0

I did find it quite easy to get up to 5000. Like, I had a few wins in a row and went up by 1000 or so each time.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #41 on: September 18, 2013, 11:22:35 pm »
0

I've seen a lot of casual rankings above 5000 (up to 13000, I think).  The reason it is easy is because you can hand-pick the kingdom.

Check the kingdoms that are on offer in casual games from high-ranked casual only players.  That's a lot of KC/GM/Wharf/Masq stuff there.

Oh, I'm sorry. I meant it's tough to do without being a dirty cheater.

For reference, there are 392 players right now with a Pro ranking of 5000 or higher. There are 38 players with a Casual rating of 5000 or higher. I don't know how or why, but they seem to scale differently.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2013, 11:23:42 pm by LastFootnote »
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ashersky

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #42 on: September 18, 2013, 11:48:41 pm »
0

For reference, there are 392 players right now with a Pro ranking of 5000 or higher. There are 38 players with a Casual rating of 5000 or higher. I don't know how or why, but they seem to scale differently.

Could be fewer "skilled" players play the casual games?

How many players are on both lists?
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #43 on: September 19, 2013, 12:01:28 am »
+1

For reference, there are 392 players right now with a Pro ranking of 5000 or higher. There are 38 players with a Casual rating of 5000 or higher. I don't know how or why, but they seem to scale differently.

Could be fewer "skilled" players play the casual games?

How many players are on both lists?

I know I have spent a lot of time building up my casual ranking.  I am all the way up to 8
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #44 on: September 19, 2013, 05:22:06 am »
0

Quote
Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?

I sometimes wonder that too. Like yesterday, when I opened Baron with Hovel in hand.
I'm pretty sure I open with Baron in shelters games more often than in estate games.

I think it's perfectly normal for high-rated prop people not to know hermit-market square. It's really hard to get that idea without reading the article.

Also, I wish I had never told AI about this site, maybe it's still be able to beat him a in.a reasonable portion of games. OTOH, we wouldn't have such an awesome extension and drunken sailor in that case, so maybe it's better.
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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #45 on: September 19, 2013, 03:07:49 pm »
0

Quote
Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?

I sometimes wonder that too. Like yesterday, when I opened Baron with Hovel in hand.
I'm pretty sure I open with Baron in shelters games more often than in estate games.

I think it's perfectly normal for high-rated prop people not to know hermit-market square. It's really hard to get that idea without reading the article.

Also, I wish I had never told AI about this site, maybe it's still be able to beat him a in.a reasonable portion of games. OTOH, we wouldn't have such an awesome extension and drunken sailor in that case, so maybe it's better.

Hey, I beat him the last time I played him!
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Polk5440

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Re: Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?
« Reply #46 on: September 19, 2013, 03:34:15 pm »
0

Quote
Um... how do people get such high Goko ratings?

I sometimes wonder that too. Like yesterday, when I opened Baron with Hovel in hand.
I'm pretty sure I open with Baron in shelters games more often than in estate games.

I think it's perfectly normal for high-rated prop people not to know hermit-market square. It's really hard to get that idea without reading the article.

Also, I wish I had never told AI about this site, maybe it's still be able to beat him a in.a reasonable portion of games. OTOH, we wouldn't have such an awesome extension and drunken sailor in that case, so maybe it's better.

Hey, I beat him the last time I played him!

Well, if AI hadn't mentioned that he didn't appreciate that other brag thread of people beating him, I would mention that I am 13-6-1 against him.  ;)

But I haven't played him the last couple of months. Being one of the "questionable 5000s" who (sometimes) completely misses or botches obvious strategies (Workshop-Gardens is my nemesis) I guess he's out of my league now!
« Last Edit: September 19, 2013, 03:37:04 pm by Polk5440 »
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