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[ycz6]

Coin tokens in general are excellent in Double Tact engines, as they allow you to do stuff on Tact-playing turns that pays off later. CM and Plaza are the best for this. Baker, while very good, competes with other engine components at $5 and is often worse than Plaza in Double Tact; Merchant Guild and Butcher are terminal and also $5.

The best comparisons for CM are probably Lighthouse, Squire, and Pawn, as all can function as cheap non-terminal Coppers. The others are probably better in general, as CM's +Buy is more or less useless in a Double Tact engine, but the flexibility could come in handy. Plaza, in a Double Tact engine, is basically a better, cheaper version of Bazaar, which is amazing. While neither of these two cards is enough to sustain a Double Tactician deck by itself, like Vault or Black Market are, both are excellent components in a more complex engine.

I don't have much else to say, honestly, because this is mostly a theorycrafting post; I noticed the synergy with Candlestick Maker in a game on Goko against -dg-. That game also featured Vault and me accidentally trashing a Tactician to his Bishop, so it's not the best example game. Have any of you guys noticed any other interactions with double Tactician and Guilds? We all know about the Herald thing by now, but I'm sure there's more to explore.

[Warfreak2]

I think lots of +buy does fit in with this particular double-Tactician deck, since you'd rather save up coin tokens and have all your buys in one megaturn, so your deck doesn't have any green cards. Also, the threat of three-piling can keep your opponent from buying any of the good cards themselves, even if there are plenty left.

[cluckyb]

Not sure about Plaza (might help with terminal silvers on the board) and how it helps more than Baker, but Candlestick Maker + Double Tactician is awesome.

Was playing a random game vs bots that had all of these on the board and quickly found Candlestick maker was actually probably better than Plaza for this.

Managed to trash down to 7 CM, 2 Tact, 1 Plaza, 1 Copper, 1 Chapel, ensuring I got 8 coin tokens every turn (except I guess if the plaza was the 11th card, which never happened). Bot was doing random bottish stuff, only snagged one province before I was like "bam. I play 60 coin tokens and buy all the other provinces with the +buy from my Candlestick Makers."

So yeah - Plaza or Baker / Double Tactician -- maybe useful. Has the advantage that you can save the coin tokens if you don't hit your buy target. Should certainly be mentioned in the Double Tactician strategy page.

Candlestick Maker / Double Tactician -- As long as you have the generic draw/trashing support needed to ensure you draw your whole deck this seems like one of the stronger Double Tactician partners. You claimed the +buy is "more or less useless" but in reality it means you need fewer engine components (and can survive just on trashing alone) because you can do all your buying at the end.

[philosophyguy]

Not sure about Plaza (might help with terminal silvers on the board) and how it helps more than Baker[…]

Well, in both cases you're getting +1 Action, +1 Card. Baker gives you a coin token for free; Plaza lets you discard a treasure card for a coin token. Since you were going to be discarding the treasures with Tactician anyway, it's not really a loss. Yes, it reduces your handsize, but that's negligible since you're starting with 10 cards. So, Plaza is all but superior since it also allows you to play terminal silvers or terminal draw.

[flies]

We all know about the Herald thing by now

Um... what's the Herald thing?

[eHalcyon]

We all know about the Herald thing by now

Um... what's the Herald thing?

In context, it's something related to double Tactician.

I will guess: TR-Herald activating two Tacticians on the same turn. 

[clb]

I don't think Herald can activate 2 Tacticians like Golem can - it only plays a single action.
If you overpay for Herald, you can put your Tac on top of your deck to ensure your double-Tac chain continues, but that requires buying a lot of Heralds (need more $ and +buy to get what you want and overpay Herald).
I would think Herald + Tac would be a nombo for those instances where you play Herald and discard your hand prematurely. I guess you could always play the Herald last, but I don't see the value it is providing for you at that point.

[Powerman]

I don't think Herald can activate 2 Tacticians like Golem can - it only plays a single action.
If you overpay for Herald, you can put your Tac on top of your deck to ensure your double-Tac chain continues, but that requires buying a lot of Heralds (need more $ and +buy to get what you want and overpay Herald).
I would think Herald + Tac would be a nombo for those instances where you play Herald and discard your hand prematurely. I guess you could always play the Herald last, but I don't see the value it is providing for you at that point.

That's why it's TR-Herald.  Herald draws one, looks at Tac, discards hand.  Herald is played again, draws a card, etc.

[eHalcyon]

I don't think Herald can activate 2 Tacticians like Golem can - it only plays a single action.
If you overpay for Herald, you can put your Tac on top of your deck to ensure your double-Tac chain continues, but that requires buying a lot of Heralds (need more $ and +buy to get what you want and overpay Herald).
I would think Herald + Tac would be a nombo for those instances where you play Herald and discard your hand prematurely. I guess you could always play the Herald last, but I don't see the value it is providing for you at that point.

That's why you pair it with TR or KC.

TR-Herald:
- Herald draws a card, then flips and plays Tactician.
-

Herald draws another card, then flips and plays another Tactician. I now vaguely recall there being a more impressive log, but I may be mistaken.  A quick search turns up this log (linking to the post if you are inclined to +1 it). PPE: ninja'd, but I provide a log.

[clb]

That makes sense. Somehow I missed the KC/TR+Herald+Tac discussion and thought the OP was referring strictly to Herald + Tac. Thanks for clearing that up.

[blueblimp]

Too bad all the multi-tac tricks are inherently nombos, because they rely on cards that play actions out of your deck (Herald, Golem), and the pay-off is drawing most of your deck at the start of your next turn, so you don't have much left for the Heralds/Golems to play.

[flies]

Not sure about Plaza (might help with terminal silvers on the board) and how it helps more than Baker, but Candlestick Maker + Double Tactician is awesome.

Was playing a random game vs bots that had all of these on the board and quickly found Candlestick maker was actually probably better than Plaza for this.

Managed to trash down to 7 CM, 2 Tact, 1 Plaza, 1 Copper, 1 Chapel, ensuring I got 8 coin tokens every turn (except I guess if the plaza was the 11th card, which never happened). Bot was doing random bottish stuff, only snagged one province before I was like "bam. I play 60 coin tokens and buy all the other provinces with the +buy from my Candlestick Makers."

So yeah - Plaza or Baker / Double Tactician -- maybe useful. Has the advantage that you can save the coin tokens if you don't hit your buy target. Should certainly be mentioned in the Double Tactician strategy page.

Candlestick Maker / Double Tactician -- As long as you have the generic draw/trashing support needed to ensure you draw your whole deck this seems like one of the stronger Double Tactician partners. You claimed the +buy is "more or less useless" but in reality it means you need fewer engine components (and can survive just on trashing alone) because you can do all your buying at the end.

This is an interesting example of how coin tokens can warp the game similar to VP tokens.  this engine effectively earns a province every turn without junking the deck.  Engines that bank coin tokens can be really strong.