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Voltaire

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #225 on: March 06, 2014, 10:50:35 am »
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Oh I'm aware of the way it "makes sense". It's clever. Everything Moffat does is clever. Not interesting, but clever. Like, seriously, how is this a "great twist". It's just "hey, you know how we hyped up the Doctor's death for a bunch of episodes and you always knew we would find a reason to wiggle our way out of it because we obviously can't kill the Doctor ? Here's how we did it !". A great twist is something that surprises you, that shocks you, that makes you see everything differently, this was just... weirdly predictable. Not in the way that I could have predicted the details of it, but the place we end up in is exactly what I expected (basically status quo).

Which is fine, really. But the fact that Moffat is so enamored with his own cleverness makes the show feel unbelievably smug.

Well I'm exaggerating a bit, but I've obviously grown quite tired of the Moffat era. It's more consistent (and much better looking) than the Davies era, but it kinda lost its heart along the way. Even season 5 which is the best of his tenure lacks a great episode of the calibre of Midnight, Blink or Dalek. Hopefully a new doctor will help shake things up a bit, but really I'm hoping for a change of showrunner more than anything.


And I can't say I disagree with anything you've said here.
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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #226 on: March 09, 2014, 07:07:01 pm »
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Oh I'm aware of the way it "makes sense". It's clever. Everything Moffat does is clever. Not interesting, but clever. Like, seriously, how is this a "great twist". It's just "hey, you know how we hyped up the Doctor's death for a bunch of episodes and you always knew we would find a reason to wiggle our way out of it because we obviously can't kill the Doctor ? Here's how we did it !". A great twist is something that surprises you, that shocks you, that makes you see everything differently, this was just... weirdly predictable. Not in the way that I could have predicted the details of it, but the place we end up in is exactly what I expected (basically status quo).

Which is fine, really. But the fact that Moffat is so enamored with his own cleverness makes the show feel unbelievably smug.

Well I'm exaggerating a bit, but I've obviously grown quite tired of the Moffat era. It's more consistent (and much better looking) than the Davies era, but it kinda lost its heart along the way. Even season 5 which is the best of his tenure lacks a great episode of the calibre of Midnight, Blink or Dalek. Hopefully a new doctor will help shake things up a bit, but really I'm hoping for a change of showrunner more than anything.


Dito.

It was obvious the Doctor would not die, so the only thing in question was who (pun intended) would get shot in his place: The Flesh or that Robot. I would have expected them to do something clever about it, maybe show how it couldn't be any of those and have another solution suddenly. That they didn't at all, even tried to make it look like something clever, gave me what i'll call my worst Dr Who impression up to now. Let's hope it stays that...
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Axxle

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #227 on: May 28, 2014, 10:16:24 pm »
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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #228 on: August 04, 2014, 05:47:47 pm »
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So, I was bored and looking for stuff to do, and realized that I hadn't seen the Dr. Who Christmas specials (just the Matt Smith ones) that are free on Amazon Prime, so I thought to myself, "myself, let's watch them."  Which I did. 

And then I did some looking and learned that the new season starts up this month.  Unfortunately, I have yet to watch the 50th Anniversary special "The Day of the Doctor" and the Christmas special "The Time of the Doctor" so I feel as though I should catch up there a bit before diving into the next season.

So really I just wanted to necro this thread a bit so Voltaire could post how excited he is for the upcoming season and also ask, if I were to go back and watch some old Doctor, which season(s) or episodes are the best.  I am just afraid that I will be let down a bit because I hear that some of the older Doctor seasons aren't quite on par with the Matt Smith seasons.
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Kuildeous

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #229 on: August 05, 2014, 08:42:14 am »
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I'm not much into the old Doctors yet. I saw bits of the first and second. I wasn't too thrilled with the second, but I think it may have been the episodes themselves and not the Doctor. He seemed pleasant enough.

I did enjoy the third Doctor, though I really disliked his relationship with Jo. As I understand it, early companions mostly served to show how brilliant the Doctor was and allowed him the opportunity to explain what's going on in terms the audience can understand (by making the companion not understand a single thing). But the way that Jo was portrayed just really got on my nerves. They made her too useless, I feel—not quite as bad as Willy from Indiana Jones at least.

I barely started the fourth Doctor, so I can't pass judgment just yet. I know that Tom Baker is a favorite among many geeks. From what I saw, he was capable of getting irksome at his companions' hijinks. So another notch for clueless companion. I haven't gotten to the Sarah Jane Smith episodes yet, so I trust that will change.

I watched one series of the fifth Doctor (the one where a companion dies). He seemed okay but nothing to excite me. I haven't seen six through eight yet.

The ninth Doctor is the first in the resurgence of Who. No real complaints about him. He's not as whimsical as the ten and eleventh. He's a little bit jaded and conceited, which is what you'd expect from someone centuries old.

I think the tenth is my favorite. He has a pretty good balance of whimsy and emotional baggage.

My nonexpert opinion.
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Voltaire

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #230 on: August 05, 2014, 09:19:39 am »
+1

So really I just wanted to necro this thread a bit so Voltaire could post how excited he is for the upcoming season and also ask, if I were to go back and watch some old Doctor, which season(s) or episodes are the best.  I am just afraid that I will be let down a bit because I hear that some of the older Doctor seasons aren't quite on par with the Matt Smith seasons.

1. Excited, but not as much as you think - partly because I can't use the internet to get excited, because the scripts for episodes 1-6 leaked, and unfinished (missing some CGI) versions of the first 5 episodes leaked, so the internet is a saddening den of spoilers right now (most of which I have avoided).

2. So what has that driven me to? I'm leafing through EW's Doctor Who cover story from this week (WHAT IS WRONG WITH ME)

3. So yes, the "classic" (Doctors 1-8) Doctors are very, very different, because the show is different. I grew up listening to old-time radio (and people at the meetup wondered why they thought I was older), so classic Doctor Who fits me like a glove - slow, methodical, unnecessarily long, and occasionally featuring entire episodes that are pointless (there is a First Doctor episode where they start in jail, break out of jail, and are recaptured. Nothing of consequence happens during this time). If you've only seen 11 (Matt Smith), watch some 9 or 10. If you're trying to get in to classic Doctor Who, start with the very first episode ("An Unearthly Child"). Part 1 is all about the first companions discovering the Doctor and his granddaughter. Parts 2-4 are a pretty bad historical story with cavemen. If you sit through the entire thing, and enjoy it, you'll like any and all classic Doctor Who. Otherwise, you're best finding some random well-regarded episodes and just watching those ("Genesis of the Daleks", "Caves of Andronazi (sp)", etc.).
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jsh357

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #231 on: August 05, 2014, 09:49:42 am »
+1

So, I was bored and looking for stuff to do, and realized that I hadn't seen the Dr. Who Christmas specials (just the Matt Smith ones) that are free on Amazon Prime, so I thought to myself, "myself, let's watch them."  Which I did. 

And then I did some looking and learned that the new season starts up this month.  Unfortunately, I have yet to watch the 50th Anniversary special "The Day of the Doctor" and the Christmas special "The Time of the Doctor" so I feel as though I should catch up there a bit before diving into the next season.

So really I just wanted to necro this thread a bit so Voltaire could post how excited he is for the upcoming season and also ask, if I were to go back and watch some old Doctor, which season(s) or episodes are the best.  I am just afraid that I will be let down a bit because I hear that some of the older Doctor seasons aren't quite on par with the Matt Smith seasons.

If you are mostly interested in the reboot, I'd say just watch it from the start through release order.  Nothing in the reboot is completely unwatchable. (which can't be said for the classic series)  There are some bad episodes, but they're short enough that they are tolerable.  In the classic series, if you hit a bad episode you either have to sit through hours of it or skip on to the next one.
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EFHW

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #232 on: August 11, 2014, 05:40:37 am »
0

So, I was bored and looking for stuff to do, and realized that I hadn't seen the Dr. Who Christmas specials (just the Matt Smith ones) that are free on Amazon Prime, so I thought to myself, "myself, let's watch them."  Which I did. 

And then I did some looking and learned that the new season starts up this month.  Unfortunately, I have yet to watch the 50th Anniversary special "The Day of the Doctor" and the Christmas special "The Time of the Doctor" so I feel as though I should catch up there a bit before diving into the next season.

So really I just wanted to necro this thread a bit so Voltaire could post how excited he is for the upcoming season and also ask, if I were to go back and watch some old Doctor, which season(s) or episodes are the best.  I am just afraid that I will be let down a bit because I hear that some of the older Doctor seasons aren't quite on par with the Matt Smith seasons.

If you are mostly interested in the reboot, I'd say just watch it from the start through release order.  Nothing in the reboot is completely unwatchable. (which can't be said for the classic series)  There are some bad episodes, but they're short enough that they are tolerable.  In the classic series, if you hit a bad episode you either have to sit through hours of it or skip on to the next one.

The first episode with No 10 is really funny, but ends serious - Series 2 episode 1.  "Runaway Bride" - the first episode with Donna - is also good. And the first one with Martha, "Smith and Jones".  They put extra effort into introductory episodes in general, it seems.
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EFHW

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #233 on: August 11, 2014, 05:45:48 am »
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My pet peeve with Dr. Who is how they treat large numbers.  A million or 10,000 years (the amount of time humans have been around so far) is quite long enough -- when they say "this is humans 5 billion years from now" that's too absurd.  The only episode where it makes sense is when the universe is dying, but New Earth didn't need to be billions of years later.  And when did the Earth explode - that episode with Cassandra?  Wasn't she the last human, before 5 billion years in the future?
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Kirian

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #234 on: August 11, 2014, 09:44:04 am »
+2

And when did the Earth explode - that episode with Cassandra?  Wasn't she the last human, before 5 billion years in the future?

She claims to be the last unmodified human.

One should also take her claims with an incredibly large grain of salt.  Well, and moisturizer.
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Voltaire

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #235 on: August 11, 2014, 11:14:02 am »
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My pet peeve with Dr. Who is how they treat large numbers.  A million or 10,000 years (the amount of time humans have been around so far) is quite long enough -- when they say "this is humans 5 billion years from now" that's too absurd.  The only episode where it makes sense is when the universe is dying, but New Earth didn't need to be billions of years later.  And when did the Earth explode - that episode with Cassandra?  Wasn't she the last human, before 5 billion years in the future?

The Doctor specifically says in Utopia that humans have returned to their "original" form at that point, so it's not actually a contradiction. It's just even stupider than you thought!
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Axxle

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #236 on: August 11, 2014, 03:11:57 pm »
+1

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #237 on: August 11, 2014, 03:32:13 pm »
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Reminds me of Gravity Falls.
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Axxle

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #238 on: August 11, 2014, 03:45:20 pm »
+4

Reminds me of Gravity Falls.
Gravity Falls No More.


(Comment shamelessly stolen from somewhere... reddit maybe?)
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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #239 on: August 12, 2014, 11:50:37 pm »
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Voltaire

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #240 on: August 24, 2014, 02:38:47 pm »
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I don't think I have the energy to completely describe how much I hated the premiere last night.

Let's get the most significant part out of the way - Capaldi did well, and I think I'll like his performance as the Doctor. The alley/bum scene and the bit at the restaurant where he first showed up were the only good parts of the episode.

The plot was pointless. Everything was underdeveloped. And the characterization/tone/meta-ness made me want to scream.

I had a moment where I thought Moffat was going to fix everything when I realized that our three main characters for this episode were going to be female (with the Doctor out of commission). I was optimistic, like an idiot, because what did Moffat do? Make their scene all about whether or not Clara likes the Doctor when A THIRD OF THE PEOPLE IN THE ROOM ARE ATTRACTED TO NON-HUMANS and TWO THIRDS OF THE PEOPLE IN THE ROOM ARE ATTRACTED TO FEMALES. It's like he was trying to fail the Bechtel test with a score lower than zero.

And the worst part? After being so preachy about how the Doctor isn't supposed to be sexy, blah blah blah (never mind that the SHOW is the reason this became the view because they MADE THE DOCTOR SEXY AND KISS PEOPLE AND WROTE SCRIPTS AND DEVELOPED ENTIRE PLOT ARCS WHERE THIS WAS THE POINT), even after all of that! They end the episode with Mrs. Generic Sexy Villainess talking about how she's the Doctor's boyfriend.

I don't have a big enough face or palms to properly convey my reaction.

If sitting through a preachy episode is what it was going to take to get back to a non-lovey companion/Doctor relationship, it would have been worth it. But I have no faith they're actually going to stick to that, because they pretty much told us they weren't going to stick to it at the end of the episode.

Also why all the pratfalls/stupid physical humor?

Also why the HORRIBLE moment of the Doctor LOOKING AT THE FREAKING CAMERA? Oh I dunno, MAYBE THIS DOCTOR WILL KILL A GUY. Wooooooo oh no he's so dark Moffat you're a genius.

I think this has been building up inside me for a long time. Last season was just so bad, and I honestly forgot that the Doctor Who premiere was this weekend until Thursday. I'm not kidding.

The show may lose me this season. I hate the idea that I'm going to be that dramatic guy on the internet, because I hate those dramatic people on the internet, but I will definitely move from hard-core superfan to casual viewer if this season is as terrible as I think it's going to be.
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Voltaire

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #241 on: August 24, 2014, 02:48:24 pm »
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Honestly I'm more sad than anything. I just want to have fun watching the show, that's all I want! It's supposed to be a bit campy and a bit bad. It just can't be moronic and sexist and pointless.
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Kuildeous

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #242 on: August 25, 2014, 08:33:12 am »
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I didn't have as visceral a reaction as you did, but I did find the premiere a bit lacking. The buildup seemed to move along too slowly.

The restaurant scene captured some of the whimsy of Doctor Who, but even that seemed to move like molasses in some areas. I did enjoy the Three's-Company-level of misunderstanding between the Doctor and Clara, though.

The tension at the end felt artificial to me. I just didn't really care who was going to do what.

The teaser didn't explain a whole lot, but I suppose that's the purpose of teasers. This is obviously something that will be revealed as the episodes go on. It didn't do much to whet my appetite.

Hoping for more later. A couple of my friends and my wife are going to see it in a cinema tonight, but I don't see a need to buy a ticket to see this premiere again.
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jsh357

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #243 on: August 25, 2014, 10:17:42 am »
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This episode really didn't need to be feature-length.  There was a lot of superfluous dialogue in there.  It might have made a really strong 45 minute episode, though.  On the bright side, Capaldi is awesome as expected.
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Polk5440

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #244 on: August 25, 2014, 05:54:36 pm »
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I really enjoyed it. I liked Capaldi, the slower pace, the new (fan-inspired) opening, and the new cinematography/direction (I think that's new...). It reminded me of how Tennant was introduced, except better. I am hoping the slower pace continues for the whole season. There needs to be more slower moments in order to chew on what's really happening.

I have never really liked Clara, so no change there. Unlike Voltaire, I thought her reactions and role in the story made perfect sense given her established character, even if I don't particularly care for her.

I am so over Vastra, Jenny, and Strax, though. They are just Whovian Sherlock Holmes fan-fiction stand-ins. I wouldn't be surprised if they lived on Baker Street, and I wouldn't be disappointed to never see them again. My biggest hope for the new Who was there would be a cleaner break from the past, much like the Eleventh Hour did. You have to clean out the old to make room for the new. There was some, but I am a little worried that without a clearer break the series will continue to devolve into the convoluted nonsense that permeated the end of the RTD era. 
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EFHW

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #245 on: August 26, 2014, 11:02:00 am »
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I agree it would have been better as a 45 minute episode.  I liked Capaldi.  Character-wise, I didn't understand his leaving Clara behind with the robot aliens.  I suppose that's the sliver of ice in his heart, but it never gets explained.  He comes back for her, but usually we find out there was some method in his madness.  I also wanted to see some carry-over from the previous doctors in his mannerisms or expressions.  Like Tennant had that cheesy grin which was like Eccleston's, and Matt Smith walked funny like Eccleston.  I thought Capaldi could have done the shy, sad looking away that Smith did sometimes when expression of feelings was called for, especially while Clara was scrutinizing him after the phone call.  There should have been something that revealed his Doctor-ness to her, that the same person was still in there.  That was a real missed opportunity. The "what is a bedroom for" scene was really funny - the Doctor never did answer Rory's question about where he slept.  It was an improvement that they stopped idealizing Clara so much - Vastra got her mad, Capaldi thought she was egotistical, and they stopped playing the dreamy music every time she showed up.
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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #246 on: August 28, 2014, 03:19:09 pm »
0

Sometimes I enjoy Dr. Who episodes better the second time I see them.  Then the pacing doesn't matter as much b/c I know what will happen, and I catch more of the dialogue.  They talk so fast!
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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #247 on: August 28, 2014, 05:36:36 pm »
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They talk so fast!

That's partly why I am hoping for a slower pace. Sometimes I am still figuring out what just happened and we're on to the next thing....

Maybe commercials fill that role more and more these days. Has anyone else noticed that (at least BBC America) reruns of old Doctor Who episodes are shorter? I saw a rerun of The Eleventh Hour a couple months ago and the 50th Anniversary Special before the season 8 premiere and they both had at least one line/short scene stripped to make way for even more ads.
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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #248 on: August 28, 2014, 07:39:50 pm »
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...and I catch more of the dialogue.  They talk so fast!

Did you not watch Buffy, or Firefly, or Gilmore Girls?  To me at least, the speedy dialogue is what makes these shows actually work.
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Kuildeous

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Re: Dr. Who
« Reply #249 on: August 29, 2014, 08:20:06 am »
0

Also, closed captioning helps immensely for those moments when your brain is trying to catch up to what your ears just heard. Depending on the timing of the captions, you can even get the joke before it's said.

I rely on captioning on nearly everything. We had a "team-building" exercise where we watched Hoosiers. I had to request captioning because the sound system was such that I wasn't able to adequately isolate the dialogue from the background noise.

So, captioned Who is a default for me.
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