Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Kuildeous]

Audience: *applaud*

Welcome to Room 25, the exciting new game show where you are the star! In this episode, we will be exploring teamwork, but watch out! Two of you are working against the common goal.

Audience: *gasp*

For those of you playing the game at home, the rules will help you follow along.
You may also find the map of interest. Through this, we can follow the players' progress. Be sure to visit our sponsors; try the new Soylent Blue—now with vitamin U!

I bet you're asking, "How does the game work, Wink?"

Audience: How does the game work, Wink?

I'm glad you asked. Each player will have his own QuickTopic mailed to him. This QuickTopic not only tells the player whether he is a prisoner….er, I mean contestant, or a guard, but it also allows the player to submit his moves. Remember that your two moves must be unique, and you may choose to pass the first, second, or even both phases. But the clock is ticking!

We'll pause now for a commercial break. When we return, our intrepid contestants will be ready to begin, armed with foreknowledge of one of the room adjacent to the start chamber.

Audience: *cheer*

Roster:
1. Qvist
2. Tables
3. TwistedArcher
4. hyramgraff
5. liopoil
6. mail-mi

Colors

The colors of the rooms for future reference are:

1    Vortex Room
1    Vision Chamber
2    Trapped Chamber
1    Moving Chamber
1    Control Chamber
6    Empty Chamber
2    Mortal Chamber
1    Illusion Chamber
2    Flooded Chamber
2    Acid Bath
2    Cold Chamber
2    Dark Chamber

[Twistedarcher]

In

[mail-mi]

C
O
N
F
I
R
M
E
D
!

[Qvist]

/confirm

[Tables]

Well... I've been trying to avoid playing too many forum games at the moment, but I think I can stretch to this one. /in

[liopoil]

/confirm in!

[Twistedarcher]

What mode are we playing? Suspicion?

[Kuildeous]

Yes, suspicion. So this game will have two traitors for sure.

I'll choose the advanced setup and not quite the fully crazy random setup.

I'll get things rolling pretty soon.

[liopoil]

awesome!

[Kuildeous]

First post has been updated.

I will send you your QuickTopic information soon. If you played in the first Room 25, I'll reuse those QTs. You may begin discussing your strategy now. Post in the QT when you have decided on which room to look in. This is a free look and does not count against your actions in Turn -10.

I'll be out of town Tuesday evening until after this weekend. I will not start the main part of the game until I get back. If you are able to determine which rooms you want to look in before tomorrow evening, I can resolve those. Otherwise, we'll pick back up when I return. 

[liopoil]

question: do the guards know who their partner is? can they talk to that player? and there are definitely 2 guards right? and no, I'm not asking these questions because I'm a guard (I'm not)

I have a plan. So, four of us look at each of four different rooms. the other two look at two random rooms. Then, the four people reveal what they saw, and then the other two confirm stuff. This way the guards cannot lie.

The player list:

1. Qvist
2. Tables
3. TwistedArcher
4. hyramgraff
5. liopoil
6. mail-mi

I'm going to role a 6-sided die and a 5-sided die. The two numbers rolled will correspond to who are the people who look at a room of their choosing. For the five sided die, I'll adjust the player-list excluding the player chosen by the first die.

Rolled 1d6 : 2, total 2
Rolled 1d5 : 5, total 5

[liopoil]

So tables and mail-mi each look at a room of their own choosing.

And to decide where the other four should look:

Qvist: C2
TA: D3
hyramgraff: B3
Liopoil: C4

I chose these myself because they don't really matter.

sound good?

[Twistedarcher]

So mail-mi and Tables look at rooms of their choosing.

Kuildeous, do you allow verifiable-random in your games?

[Twistedarcher]

Are we sure this is better than letting the 5th and 6th player choose which rooms to verify?

The first four players look at all 4 rooms. Whichever ones are green, get confirmed by the 5th and 6th player.

When we program moves, do we program "Look", or "Look - C2"?

[liopoil]

just "look" same for push, move, and control.

I'm pretty sure we all have to look at the same time.

[Twistedarcher]

From the rulebook:

"The first player reveals his first action and resolves it immediately". Then, following the turn order, the next player does the same and so on until all players have resolved their first actions."

So it seems like we'd be able to have each player announce what room they're looking at, and the results, in turn. So I'm thinking we might want Lio and Mail-mi to choose to confirm safe rooms to go into?

[liopoil]

that's for the actions, during the bulk of the game. This is just the pre-game free-look.

[Twistedarcher]

Ohh I missed the part about the pre-game free look. Ok nvm then!

[mail-mi]

So tables and mail-mi each look at a room of their own choosing.

And to decide where the other four should look:

Qvist: C2
TA: D3
hyramgraff: B3
Liopoil: C4

I chose these myself because they don't really matter.

sound good?

sounds good.

[Tables]

Eh, I don't see any reason to not go with something like this. Honestly I think it'd be a little better if the first four look at four different rooms (doesn't really matter which), then the last two confirm rooms we want confirmed.

[Tables]

These looks are all done sequentially after all, right?

[Kuildeous]

To confirm some things….

question: do the guards know who their partner is? can they talk to that player? and there are definitely 2 guards right?

There are two guards and four prisoners. The guards are not aware of who the other is. For all a guard knows, he might be sending his compatriot into a trap.

Kuildeous, do you allow verifiable-random in your games?

Not sure the nature of this question. Do you mean will I accept the roll tag? Sure. It's obvious if someone tampers with it, right? I seem to recall that discussion. Random numbers shouldn't matter too much in here.

When we program moves, do we program "Look", or "Look - C2"?

As confirmed, you only program the action. The object of your action is declared when you reveal the action. You can choose to program only one action and then choose to activate it in slot 1 when it comes up or wait until slot 2 (where it must then be executed).

If you are the first player in a turn, I would appreciate if you do indicate the target of the first action unless you really don't want to commit to it due to table talk.




As far as the initial look, I'm going to replicate what would happen in a real game. Each player chooses the room in order. The rules say that the player secretly looks, so I am going to rule that you cannot talk about your room until everyone has looked. Then during the programming phase, you may discuss accordingly. But everyone should know who has looked where, since that's something you can't really hide in the real game.

Oh, and since guards are a new addition to this game, keep in mind that guards are beholden to the same rules as the prisoners. The exception is when a guard reveals his role (whether voluntarily or not). Once that happens, all future turns are not programmed. The guard chooses the action he wants, but he still cannot duplicate an action.

[Tables]

I think that 'secretly looks' probably just means they don't show it to anyone or say what it is (in the normal rules way). Also there's definitely 2 guards, right?

[liopoil]

...so really, we should wait for qvist to announce where he looks, then tables, and so on.

[Kuildeous]

I would think it'd be faster if you agree on which rooms to look at and commit to them. If you suspect someone then you could send me a conditional message in the QT that you're going to change your intent. But right now, nobody has reason to suspect any specific person.

If you'd rather do the peeking one at a time, I can oblige.

[Kuildeous]

Also there's definitely 2 guards, right?

Yes.

[liopoil]

I'm fine with that. so pretty much:

qvist: C2
Tables: "If qvist looks at C2, look -blank-"
TA: If Qvist - C2, look D3
Hyramgraff: "If Qvist - C2 and TA - D3, look B3
and so on.

[Tables]

I think who looks at what shouldn't really matter much, but it's more I think, if you are allowed to say things afterwards (green/yellow/red), that could affect where the 5th and 6th person check. On the other hand, it seems very risky for a guard to lie on turn 1 so, eh.

For the record, I'm going to look at whatever's clockwise from the one Qvist looks at.

[Twistedarcher]

And I'll look at the next one.

[hyramgraff]

I'll look at B3.

[mail-mi]

I'll look at something that i won't tell you yet (since I'm last).

[Qvist]

Sorry I missed, that Kuildeous reuses the same QT.

I look into C2 like suggested.

[Tables]

In which case I look into D3.

[Twistedarcher]

I'll look in C4.

[Twistedarcher]

Bump

[liopoil]

so hyramgraff's turn? he said he was going to look in B3 I think.

[Kuildeous]

I do not see anything from liopoil about which chamber he's looking in before the start. Liopoil? Got a preference?

Others have received their free looks, but do not share that yet until liopoil makes his decision.

[liopoil]

oh, I thought we were going in order. Assuming hyramgraff looks at B3, I'll look at C2 I guess. If he doesn't, I look at B3.

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff does indeed look in B3. Considering that it's obvious who looks where at the start, there is no chicanery yet. I'll send you your QT.

The rooms that people looked at are:
Qvist: C2
Tables: D3
TwistedArcher: C4
hyramgraff: B3
liopoil: C2
mail-mi: D3

Remember that you can give the color of the room (possibly even truthfully) but not the name. From within the Central Chamber, you can only program Look and Move. You do not have to program actions in both slots.

Discuss and post your actions for Turn -10 in the QT when you are ready. When all six have programmed, then I'll process the actions.

[liopoil]

It doesn't really matter which of qvist-lio and mail-mi-tables reveals first.

C2 is red.

qvist can confirm this, and everyone else can reveal what color their room is.

[Qvist]

It doesn't really matter which of qvist-lio and mail-mi-tables reveals first.

C2 is red.

qvist can confirm this, and everyone else can reveal what color their room is.

I confirm.

[Twistedarcher]

C4 is green. At least 2 people should go that way, probably.

If Tables or Qvist push me in there, I could get moving towards one of the corners.

[Twistedarcher]

Or whoops, can't push. Nvm.

[liopoil]

no pushing in the central chamber, otherwise the guards would just push us into red rooms at the start.

I agree with splitting up as much as possible.

[Twistedarcher]

Depending on B3 and D3, we should maybe split up 2/2/2, that seems to make the most sense.

[Tables]

D3 is Green. I think move and look are probably orders of the day.

[liopoil]

mail-mi can confirm that, then we wait for hyramgraff on B3.

I agree that everyone should program a move, then a look.

[mail-mi]

Yeah it's green.

[hyramgraff]

B3 is yellow.  Another look action could confirm that.

Depending on B3 and D3, we should maybe split up 2/2/2, that seems to make the most sense.

Let's not split 2/2/2.  Four out of five times the guards will be split and then they would just kill each the other person they are with.

[liopoil]

let's not spend a look to check hyramgraff. I think we should all program a move, then a look, and move where we each see fit. then we should coordinate our looks.

[Kuildeous]

Waiting for hyramgraff's programs.

Then Qvist will lead us off.

[Twistedarcher]

We have 2 green rooms, so we could check out all 6 adjacent rooms to those 2.

[Tables]

Well, some Green Rooms do other various things.

[liopoil]

and it is sometimes a good idea to move into red or yellow rooms if you know what they are.

[Kuildeous]

Welcome back to another episode of Room 25. The stakes are higher in this round, as these two of the six prisoners harbor a dark secret. They are actually guards sent to prevent the contestants from escaping. How exciting! Who will it be? We'll tell you at the end of this program.

But for now, Qvist bolts for one of the door. He enters room D3. Uh oh! Looks like he triggered something. The room is now moving to a new location. But Qvist is in control here. He'll choose the location, and the room there will swing over to fill the gap.

So, Qvist, which space would you like the room (and yourself) to move to?

[liopoil]

cool! can he go anywhere? I suggest C5.

[Kuildeous]

Any hidden room, which pretty much gives him free reign at this juncture.

And any time someone enters the room, it moves again, as long as there is at least one hidden room on the board.

[liopoil]

cool. I heavily suggest C5, and I think Qvist will agree.

[liopoil]

I suppose B5 or D5 are good too.

[liopoil]

Whoops! sorry. Scratch all that. I suggest B1, C1, or D1, but probably C1. I got the map messed up in my head.

[Qvist]

Shouldn't I go to one of the corner rooms to explore and find Room 25 faster?

[liopoil]

Okay, I guess I can say this:

I plan on moving into C2, which is red. That's why I think qvist should go to C1, so that I know there is a green room right there. I will move into C1 with my first action next round (qvist will be going last at that point, so it will be before him, and we'll go somewhere else.)

So qvist and I will go off to explore. I agree that a 2-2-2 split is bad. So, I think we should split 2-3-1. Qvist and I will be the 2. 3 people should go into the other green room, and the last person goes to the yellow room?

[liopoil]

I guess you could go to B1 or D1, and then we look at C1 and you look in the corner. Then somebody needs to look at D3 though, because it might become room 25.

[Qvist]

I guess you could go to B1 or D1, and then we look at C1 and you look in the corner. Then somebody needs to look at D3 though, because it might become room 25.

I can't do two look actions right? So, this won't be possible. I'm not sure if I feel safe with you in the same room. Exchanging the room with one of the possible exit rooms seems like the way to go. All are still in the center and someone can look there for sure.

Any thoughts from the other people?

[liopoil]

except that I think everyone programmed a move first.....

No, we each do one look. And I'm the one entering the room with you. You will have the next action, and can leave the room, or try to push me to my death.

B1 and D1 are possible exit rooms, you can exchange with those.

[hyramgraff]

Okay, I guess I can say this:

I plan on moving into C2, which is red. That's why I think qvist should go to C1, so that I know there is a green room right there. I will move into C1 with my first action next round (qvist will be going last at that point, so it will be before him, and we'll go somewhere else.)

So qvist and I will go off to explore. I agree that a 2-2-2 split is bad. So, I think we should split 2-3-1. Qvist and I will be the 2. 3 people should go into the other green room, and the last person goes to the yellow room?

I'm willing to go into the yellow room, but that's because I actually know what it is.

[Kuildeous]

I can't do two look actions right?

You are correct that you cannot do two Look actions in the same turn.

It is possible to Look twice in a row if you program Look as the second action of one turn and again as the first action of the subsequent turn.

Got an idea of where you're going, Qvist?

[Qvist]

I wanted to more chime in, but let's go to B1. Someone has to look now into the room I exchanged.

[Twistedarcher]

I'm fine with that. I think it's better that he starts to as close to one of the corners as possible, right?

If Lio wants to go into the red, and Hyramgraff wants to go into the yellow, I'm fine having us split I guess 3/1/1/1 at this point. Lio can start heading up to Qvist, as well.

[Tables]

Hm, I didn't think you'd move straight into that. I was intending to go there. Ah well, not a big loss.

Move to C4. It's green, right? C'mon vision chamber.

[Kuildeous]

All right! We're moving now. With a whir of gears, Qvist is whisked away to a different part of the map altogether.

And Tables strides into an empty chamber.

Looks like TwistedArcher is about to make his move. Let's find out where he's going.

[Twistedarcher]

Should I also go to C4 with Tables? Or split up from him?

I'm thinking C4, as well.

[Kuildeous]

C'mon vision chamber.

Just to clear up something; the vision chamber is shuffled in with the last 12 tiles, so it has the same restrictions in placement as Room 25.

[Tables]

Oh... I must have missed that rule.

[Twistedarcher]

Well, no one else answered, so Move to C4

[Tables]

Oh, sorry. Eh, moving to C4 seems reasonable.

[Kuildeous]

An empty room is better than a trapped room, so in goes TwistedArcher.

It is now hyramgraff's turn. Where is he moving to?

[hyramgraff]

Move to B3

[Kuildeous]

Things are getting exciting now!

Hyramgraff moves to B3. Oh brr! He's looking a bit sluggish in there. He'll only be able to program one action next turn, but at least he can choose which slot.

Liopoil walks into C2. Oh no! The room is flooding. It's flooding so quickly that the doors can't open from the outside. Fortunately, liopoil is able to push on a door to get out of there, but can he make it to a door before the room completely fills with water?

And the water is still flowing…

And still flowing…

You know, it's going to take a while to drown liopoil. Let's switch to mail-mi. He has a few choices. Audience, please take the voting doohickey from under your seat and vote on what liopoil should do. Should he a) enter the safe, quiet room with Tables and TwistedArcher; b) enter the freezing room with hyramgraff; or c) try his luck with an unknown room. Vote now!*

*Contestant not beholden to audience votes. Void where prohibited. Soylent Green is people.

[mail-mi]

What should I do guys?

[liopoil]

Audience, please take the voting doohickey from under your seat and vote on what liopoil should do

I can't do anything! I'm drowwwwnnnnninnggggg....

mail-mi should go with tables and TA.

[hyramgraff]

I can't think of a good reason for you to not go into the empty room.

[mail-mi]

Move to C4

[Tables]

I don't hugely like this. There's reasonable odds of scum in here now, is the main issue. 70% chance one of you two is a guard, but a 10% chance both are. Which I think makes it too dangeous to announce look results immediately.

Does anyone (especially you two in the room with me) have any thoughts on that? Should we risk the guards killing us, or focus on self preservation?

[mail-mi]

I don't hugely like this. There's reasonable odds of scum in here now, is the main issue. 70% chance one of you two is a guard, but a 10% chance both are. Which I think makes it too dangeous to announce look results immediately.

Does anyone (especially you two in the room with me) have any thoughts on that? Should we risk the guards killing us, or focus on self preservation?

If you feel that your look should be said, say it. Otherwise, don't.

[Twistedarcher]

I don't hugely like this. There's reasonable odds of scum in here now, is the main issue. 70% chance one of you two is a guard, but a 10% chance both are. Which I think makes it too dangeous to announce look results immediately.

Does anyone (especially you two in the room with me) have any thoughts on that? Should we risk the guards killing us, or focus on self preservation?

I had the same thought.

Obviously, I think Tables is the most dangerous. I'm not TOO concerned with mail-mi, since he's after me next round. But, say, I look at the death room, no way in hell I'm saying anything about it until after Tables has programmed his actions. If there's a green room, though, I might go ahead and say it, and then Tables could possibly push me in and I could program a look move first?

[Twistedarcher]

Tables, since you go first out of all of us, you're in the least vulnerable position. Our moves for this round have already been programmed, and you go first next round. That being said, when we reveal room results, if we're doing that, you should go first, followed by me, followed by mail-mi.

Should we look at 3 different rooms, or try to confirm some of the rooms?

If Tables looks at a green room -- maybe it's worth looking at that to confirm? I don't see the harm of revealing a green room, if that's what it is. I'd be more scared of him looking into the death room, then being able to push me or mail-mi in and us being unable to do anything about it.

[liopoil]

yeah, at this point, don't say you found a yellow or red room if you can be pushed in there. It's okay to give away that it's yellow/red, because many of those aren't dangerous.

[Tables]

I hadn't really considered I was going before all of you, that's probably good for me. I agree with TA that we should say things (if anything) in turn order.

[Kuildeous]

Board has been updated. Qvist looks for his second action. Where do you look, Qvist?

[Kuildeous]

Qvist takes a look in C1. Aha, interesting.

Now it's Tables's turn to look.

[liopoil]

I'll look at B2 on my turn.

[mail-mi]

Ill take whichever ones TA and Tables don't look at.

[Qvist]

C1 is green.

[hyramgraff]

I'll look at B2 on my turn.

I'll be looking there first.  You already have C1 as a possibly safe exit so you could either confirm what I say, confirm what Qvist said or look at D2.

[Tables]

Look at B4

I think is probably most useful, although there's no reason we can't check every room around here.

[Kuildeous]

Well, the nice thing about people being split up is that I had a nice line of conditional orders waiting for me. I processed a few actions.

It's now liopoil's turn to choose the target of his look action.

[Twistedarcher]

Wait, why did Qvist look in C1 rather than A1? A1 could be room 25, C1 can't be...wouldn't it be better to check out A1 there?

[hyramgraff]

B2 is Red.

[Qvist]

Wait, why did Qvist look in C1 rather than A1? A1 could be room 25, C1 can't be...wouldn't it be better to check out A1 there?

So that liopoil could go in there and not drown.

[Kuildeous]

Speaking of liopoil...

[liopoil]

oh, hi. my turn to look somewhere? just a sec.

[liopoil]

so, should I doublecheck C1 or look at D2? D2 can't be room 25, so we don't need to see it... I'm leaning towards checking C1.

[liopoil]

Look: C1

[Kuildeous]

And now it's mail-mi's turn to look.

[mail-mi]

Where did tables and twisted look?

[Twistedarcher]

Tables did B4, I did D4.

[mail-mi]

Any info that you guys have said regarding them?

[Tables]

I haven't said anything. I guess it's safe for me to speak: It's yellow.

[Twistedarcher]

Mine's red, but not the end of the world to go in there. I wouldn't be opposed to Tables pushing me in next move, if he doesn't have better actions, actually.

[Tables]

Well... if you WANT me to push you in there, I will, but you should probably let me know to avoid any potential confusion.

[mail-mi]

I'll Look: c5 then.

[Twistedarcher]

I'd be fine with you pushing me in there. It would save me time for finding rooms. On the other hand, it would cost you a move finding rooms in your corner. Not sure if me saving time is worth the expense of you effectively losing an action -- I would just need to know what you're programming before I program, so I'd know what to program first!

[Kuildeous]

And mail-mi looks in C5.

That concludes turn -10. Please program your next two actions (or only one) in the QuickTopics. I'd be fine with a format like:

Turn -9
Move Look

Tables begins Turn -9. Tables may indicate in his QT any targets to speed things along.

[Twistedarcher]

Tables, want to push me or should I move myself?

[hyramgraff]

It looks like we ended up with a 3/2/1 split with me as the loner.  I'm thinking that I should move back to the central room and eventually look at the new D3.

[Tables]

I'm gonna push you into D4.

[liopoil]

I agree with going back to the central chamber. I think I'll move to C1, then look somewhere. Qvist can look at A1, then move.

[mail-mi]

Probably shouldn't go into C5. It's red.

[mail-mi]

Should I go in with Twisted or go into the Yellow room?

[Tables]

Hmm... I was planning to not go into the room I looked at, but did want to move forward as my second action. Is that looking like a bad plan, then?

PPE: I don't recommend the yellow room.

[Twistedarcher]

Don't come in the room with me, mail-mi.

[mail-mi]

Well, I really really really shouldn't go into my room so Tables, would it be the end of the world if I went into the yellow room?

[Tables]

No yellow room is THAT bad . It would be okay.

[Twistedarcher]

Ok, how about:

Tables pushes TA to D4
TA looks at E4
Mail-mi shifts Row 4 to the right
Tables looks at D5
TA looks at E5
Mail-mi looks at D3

That way, we have someone looking at all 3 rooms in the corner.

[Twistedarcher]

Mail-mi could also doublecheck D5 for Tables instead of D3.

[mail-mi]

I like it.

[Tables]

TA would have to program two look actions for that, which isn't possible.

[Tables]

Hmm...
Tables pushes TA to D4
TA looks at E4
Mail-mi shifts Row 4 to the right
Tables looks at D5
TA shifts column 5 up
Mail-mi looks at D3

This would be my suggested change. It makes that corner tile more accessible to everyone else, as well as the other corner tile.

[Tables]

Although it leaves TA out of position, so might be a bad idea. Uhh... no he would know two rooms next to him, actually, so that's not too bad.

[Twistedarcher]

All these silly rules....Yeah, Tables' changes work for me.

[Kuildeous]

Waiting for actions programmed by Qvist and mail-mi.

[Qvist]

Waiting for actions programmed by Qvist and mail-mi.

Sorry. Done.

[Kuildeous]

Resolving a question I had about a move.

If you don't have your QT on e-mail notification, please check your QT to see if I asked you for clarification. 

[Kuildeous]

Tables has announced he is pushing someone. Who will that someone be? Where will that someone be pushed into?

Let's find out.

[Tables]

Okay guys I want to make something clear.



Okay, do you see?



Guys srsly?



I mean come on, it's been staring you all in the face, and you didn't notice for all this time? You deserved this.

Push Twisted Archer into C5

I am a guard

[Tables]

(Oh yeah and thanks Kuildeous for pointing out my title was Saboteur )

[liopoil]

nice

[Twistedarcher]

Boo that's why we should have been more careful with revealing rooms. Oh god I hope it doesn't make me die!

[Kuildeous]

Oh, betrayal!

TwistedArcher was all ready to be pushed toward one room, but Tables pushes him through a different door.

Hmm, the room seems safe enough. TwistedArcher gingerly steps toward a door to look through. Oh no! Spikey mashy things erupt from the ceiling and pound him into a pulp!

But wait! Was TwistedArcher a prisoner or a guard? Did Tables advance the guard plot or merely secure himself a cushy promotion?

After this turn, Tables no longer needs to program actions.

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff goes next, but he only programmed one action. Waiting to learn when he'll execute it.

Nice try, TA. That fatality happened sooner than I expected.

[Twistedarcher]

Do I still get a chance to perform my action, though?

[Tables]

Oh, yay, it was actually a deadly room! Thanks for the heads up, Liam! Mmm, blood.

PPE: This is actually a good point... firstly the rules don't say you have to stop playing when you're executed, and depending on how you figure Trapped Chamber to be executed, maybe he does get his action.

[Twistedarcher]

Well, I'm pretty sure I stop playing when I get executed!

But it says that I "must leave on my next action or be executed". Shouldn't I get a chance to perform the action, because until I perform the look action, the room's not sure that I HAVEN'T moved, so I haven't been executed yet. Once I perform the look action, then it's clear I haven't moved out of the room, so THEN I'm executed.

[liopoil]

you're not dead yet!

who's up for shoving tables with TA?

[Kuildeous]

I grouped both your turns in that message. Your action was to look which was not a move, so the trap triggered.

That's how I interpret it. I'm up for suggestions.

[Qvist]

Wow, this went fast. Looks not very good for us.

[mail-mi]

Crap. Man, I hope Tables doesn't push me in too!

[Tables]

Your reverse psychology won't work on me! I WON'T push you in! Haha, now what are you going to do? Panic?

(Also I'm still bound by the 'different action each time' rule. I can't push twice in a turn.

[Kuildeous]

You are also bound by the second action you programmed. You don't get to pick your actions freely until next turn.

[Kuildeous]

Does that make sense what I did there? It's not that TA died immediately upon entering the room. It's that his turn was immediately after Tables, so he died upon revealing that his next action was not a move. It just so happened that it happened sequentially with no one else in between.

Hopefully I was clear on that. If so, then I just need hyramgraff to respond in the QT when he plans to take his sole action.

Although, if TA wishes to know what he saw before getting mutilated, I'll oblige him in the QT. But yeah, once you're executed, I would say you can't reveal what you know. Rules are indeed vague on that, but it would make sense that death stops all further play.

[Kuildeous]

Sooooo…. cold……
Hyramgraff shivers in the cold room, seemingly unable to act.

Liopoil springs into action and moves into C1. Oh, look at all these levers. And liopoil bumps into one, sending some row or column moving along. Which line of rooms gets moved, liopoil?

[liopoil]

so, what do you guys think I should do?

[hyramgraff]

I don't have any great ideas, just some mediocre ones.

• Shift columns A or E (aka do nothing because I don't think we know about them.
• Shift row 5 to move the deadly room away from Tables.
• Shift row 1 right.
• Shift column B up (because Qvist is my #1 suspect for the second guard).

[Tables]

I suggest option 2. I don't like being near deadly rooms either.

[Qvist]

I think it doesn't really matter as long as you don't move Tables' row so that mai-mi can savely go to the central room if necessary.

[mail-mi]

I think it doesn't really matter as long as you don't move Tables' row so that mai-mi can savely go to the central room if necessary.

I have to control anyway. Shoot.

[Twistedarcher]

Whatever you do, I hope you will avenge me. I'm a ghost, and I'm STILL trapped in this dang prison!

[liopoil]

Control row 5 right
mail-mi will control row 4 left, then maybe push tables next round?

[Kuildeous]

And row 5 moves to the right. It has to keep moving that direction if it gets shifted again this turn.

Mail-mi reveals his action as controlling a row or column. Well, it has to be row, since he can't move that column. Which direction are you shifting row 4, mail-mi?

[mail-mi]

Left I think would be best.

[Kuildeous]

And the rooms move some more.

Qvist looks warily around. The screams of TwistedArcher still reverberates throughout.

Where is Qvist looking?

[mail-mi]

And the rooms move some more.

Qvist looks warily around. The screams of TwistedArcher still reverberates throughout.

Where is Qvist looking?

+1 for 911 posts.

[Kuildeous]

Prodding Qvist.

[Qvist]

Prodding Qvist.

Hey, it's not even 24 hours, some people work and sleep.

I look at A1

[Kuildeous]

Prodding Qvist.

Hey, it's not even 24 hours, some people work and sleep.

I look at A1

Sorry, I thought I saw activity from you. And I know some people don't get notifications that consistently.

[Kuildeous]

And now it's the dastardly Tables's turn to move. Where to?

[Qvist]

Alright guys, A1 is green.

[Tables]

I'll move to... B3.

[hyramgraff]

I'll move to... B3.

Well, that's good for the prisoners.  The known guard only gets one action the next round.

[Tables]

But when will it be, and what ? And is it really better for you than the guard exploring new rooms for you?

[Kuildeous]

Tables moves into B3. Man, did it just get colder in that room? Hyramgraff seems to think so as he moves to C3.

Liopoil takes a little time to explore his surroundings by looking into an adjacent room. Which room is he looking into?

[liopoil]

Look: D1

[Kuildeous]

Liopoil takes a look into D1.

Now mail-mi gets to look around. Where at?

[mail-mi]

I think I'll check A4

[Kuildeous]

And mail-mi takes a peek.

Meanwhile, Qvist is on the move!

[liopoil]

shall I say what color D1 is?

[Tables]

I would recommend for or against it.

[Kuildeous]

Qvist, where are you moving to?

[Qvist]

Qvist, where are you moving to?

A1

[Kuildeous]

And off Qvist goes.

And that concludes Turn -9. What an exciting turn it was too!

Time to program for Turn -8.

I'll need to look up if I need to remove TA from the timeline or not. I don't think it matters in the end.

[Kuildeous]

I'll be at a convention this weekend, so no hurry on programming your actions. I can probably still process them this weekend, but if I'm silent for a while, you know why (it's because Tables secretly killed me; that's how much of a traitor he is!).

[Tables]

Kekekeke

[liopoil]

suggestion: I move to B1 and swap it for a corner, then qvist can look at B1 and I look at something.

[mail-mi]

I'm gonna control (again) then look at A5.

[liopoil]

What if I swap to A5, then we can each look at the ones we are both adjacent to,  then you can move?

[mail-mi]

What if I swap to A5, then we can each look at the ones we are both adjacent to,  then you can move?

Sounds good.

[hyramgraff]

I can look at either C4 or D3.  TA looked at what is now C4 and said it was red but that he could be pushed there.  I'm going to stick with my original plan and look at D3.

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff looks in D3.

And liopoil darts through a door. Which door is it?

[liopoil]

Move: B1. swap to A5

[Kuildeous]

As liopoil enters the moving chamber, there is a grinding of gears, and a new room takes its place. Liopoil finds himself in new surroundings.

Mail-mi is up. He takes a gander at another room. Which room will it be?

[liopoil]

also, D1 is yellow

[mail-mi]

Look at A4

[Kuildeous]

mail-mi has a looky-loo.

Now Qvist gets to look too.

[mail-mi]

A4 is yelliw

[mail-mi]

Bump

[Kuildeous]

Qvist has been offline for a week. There's been no warning, so hopefully it's nothing serious.

I hate to boot him. If this continues a few more days, then I suppose I'll look for a replacement. I would ask TA to fill in, but that could cause a conflict if the two roles are opposite.

[Kuildeous]

FYI, I placed a request in the replacement thread to replace Qvist.

And if any spectators are watching this thread, consider this an invitation to join in. The bright note: You're still alive right now.

[theorel]

I've watched a little bit of both Room 25 games, and have some idea what's going on.  I'll replace QVist.

[Kuildeous]

Awesome sauce!
I'll send you the QT link.

[theorel]

Alright, I still need to go through things and actually try to figure things out, but...
Any suggestions?
I can look at A2 or B1 right?  And then I have to move to one of them?  Hopefully they aren't both mortal chambers.  I think I'll be okay as long as they're anything else right?

[theorel]

mail-mi: why did you look at A4 twice?

Also, I'm leaning towards looking at B1.  I'll let people weigh in before I finalize my choice.

[theorel]

And, I don't have any information that isn't general to everyone.  Given the gap, and all I thought this might be helpful for everyone:
E X N Y X
X R F X X
X O C ? X
Y E R X X
M X X T X

F=Flooded Chamber
M=Moving Chamber
E=Empty Chamber
O=Cold Chamber
N=Control Chamber
T=Trapped Room

D1=Y according to liopoil
A4=Y according to mail-mi and Tables(pre-reveal).
B2=R according to hyramgraff
C4=R (but okay to spend some time in) according to TwistedArcher
D3=? hyramgraff has looked here, but not told us anything.

[mail-mi]

mail-mi: why did you look at A4 twice?

Also, I'm leaning towards looking at B1.  I'll let people weigh in before I finalize my choice.

Because I forgot I had. Then after I got the message in the QT I did a mental facepalm.

[hyramgraff]

mail-mi: why did you look at A4 twice?

Also, I'm leaning towards looking at B1.  I'll let people weigh in before I finalize my choice.

B1 seems like a decent place to look.

[Tables]

mail-mi: why did you look at A4 twice?

Also, I'm leaning towards looking at B1.  I'll let people weigh in before I finalize my choice.

It's because he's a guard making intentionally suboptimal moves. I suggest locating a nearby mortal chamber for him with maximum speed.

[mail-mi]

mail-mi: why did you look at A4 twice?

Also, I'm leaning towards looking at B1.  I'll let people weigh in before I finalize my choice.

It's because he's a guard making intentionally suboptimal moves. I suggest locating a nearby mortal chamber for him with maximum speed.

Is this sarcastic? I define my mistake as the term "brain fart."

[theorel]

Note that Tables is a guard.  So it's probably a combination of sarcasm and suggestion that we should kill you since chances are you're a prisoner and then he'd win

[mail-mi]

Note that Tables is a guard.  So it's probably a combination of sarcasm and suggestion that we should kill you since chances are you're a prisoner and then he'd win

Another facepalm. I forgot he was a guard. I have been away from this game for too long.

[Tables]

Note that Tables is a guard.  So it's probably a combination of sarcasm and suggestion that we should kill you since chances are you're a prisoner and then he'd win

You have no evidence of this. I'm an honest to goodness prisoner. No, the namebadge and identification documents were stolen, from, uh mail-mi.

[theorel]

Look B1

[Kuildeous]

And welcome back to the season premiere. Last season, Theorel moved himself into a corner. What? What do you mean this contestant looks different from the last season? Nonsense. Go buy some Tasty-O brand cereal. Theorel's been here all along. And he starts off this new season by looking into a room. Yes!

Now it's Tables's turn. Look at that confidence. It's like he can do anything he wants now that he's revealed himself as a guard. Oh, but he's shivering so much in that cold, cold room. Let's find out if Tables is going to act now or later. And then he'll tell us what he'll be doing. Man, you have to admire that man's chutzpah!

[Tables]

I'll Move to C3

[Kuildeous]

And Tables returns to the central chamber.

Now hyramgraff is off to a new destination.

[hyramgraff]

So, how do things look in B1?

[theorel]

B1 is green...I'll be moving there shortly.

[hyramgraff]

Move to D3

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff enters the next room, and he looks a little disoriented. It's just an empty room. No wait; he peers carefully and sees past the hologram to discover a visioning apparatus! He can even see another room on the monitor. With a quick fiddle of the controls, hyramgraff can show the whole audience which room he's examining. Which will it be?

This doesn't bode well for Theorel, who indicated that he was going to enter the chamber. Illusions are tricky things. We'll see what he decides to do on his turn later.

[hyramgraff]

Finding the vision chamber is a pleasant surprise.  I'm considering looking at one of the three adjacent rooms.  Any preferences as to which one?

Theorel: you can safely swap the illusion chamber with B2.

[hyramgraff]

Hmm, we have a very talkative game here.

Look D4

Tables: should I tell you what color it is?

[liopoil]

Tables: should I tell you what color it is?

whaaaaat?

[Kuildeous]

[I think a couple of people are on VLA right now, so things may be progressing a little slowly for a bit.]

And hyramgraff now knows more than he knew before. Behold his newfound wisdom.

Speaking of which, liopoil is also going to take a look at some unknown room. Which room will that be, liopoil?

[liopoil]

Look: B5

[liopoil]

to double check, the guards don't know who each other are, right?

[Tables]

If you're claiming guard Hyrmgraff, nah, keep it hidden.

[Kuildeous]

to double check, the guards don't know who each other are, right?

Correct. The guards are just as ignorant on the identity of the other players.

So it would suck for Tables if TwistedArcher is the other guard, but that won't prevent him from winning if he can off two of the prisoners.

[Kuildeous]

And now that liopoil has looked, it is time for mail-mi to make his move. Where do you move to?

[mail-mi]

A4

[Kuildeous]

Mail-mi moves into the next room. Hey, who turned out the lights?

Now Theorel gets to move to a room. Where does he go?

[theorel]

Move B4 exchange C4

[Kuildeous]

Move B4 B1 exchange C4

Is that what you meant?

[theorel]

indeed.

[Kuildeous]

Theorel walks into B1, not quite sure what to expect. He's no stranger to danger, and he knows that this room is not as it appears. Suddenly, he falls through the floor. A hologram? Sneaky! Theorel lands with a splash. And that roaring sound is the result of gallons upon gallons of water pouring into the room. The doors are blocked off already, but lucky for him they open out. Can he escape the flooded chamber before the second action of the next turn?

And speaking of next turn, our intrepid contestants have survived another round…well, mostly survived. It's time to program your next moves. Right now, the only additional restriction is that mail-mi cannot use a Look action in the Dark Room. He can program it, but it won't do any good if he's still in the dark.

Please post your actions in the QT (except for Tables). Be sure to label it as Turn -7. Liopoil will start us off.

[hyramgraff]

Warning, I will be programming a control move.

[theorel]

Alright, so chances are reasonably good that hyramgraff is the other guard.  He wanted me to switch the illusion chamber that he stuck in front of me with B2 which only he had seen.  If I can look into B2 I could confirm it.

Right now:
B5 and D1(Yellow) are known by only liopoil, and B2(Red) and D4 are known by only hyramgraff.

In order for B2 to be safe and red it has to be an acid bath.

Also hyramgraff wasted a free look at ANY room in order to look at the room next to him.  It seems like a prisoner would have been more interested in looking farther away trying to find room 25.

Anyways, anyone have any good ideas about what we should do?
I have some ideas, not sure how open to be about stuff here.  Telling hyramgraff that B1 was green was obviously a mistake, and I don't want to screw things up again.  Fortunately liopoil/mail-mi are the only ones who act before my first action, and I think you're both more likely to be prisoners.

[mail-mi]

I'm going to move into the Moving chamber, switch with D2, then take a look-see.

[hyramgraff]

Alright, so chances are reasonably good that hyramgraff is the other guard.  He wanted me to switch the illusion chamber that he stuck in front of me with B2 which only he had seen.  If I can look into B2 I could confirm it.

Right now:
B5 and D1(Yellow) are known by only liopoil, and B2(Red) and D4 are known by only hyramgraff.

In order for B2 to be safe and red it has to be an acid bath.

Also hyramgraff wasted a free look at ANY room in order to look at the room next to him.  It seems like a prisoner would have been more interested in looking farther away trying to find room 25.

Anyways, anyone have any good ideas about what we should do?
I have some ideas, not sure how open to be about stuff here.  Telling hyramgraff that B1 was green was obviously a mistake, and I don't want to screw things up again.  Fortunately liopoil/mail-mi are the only ones who act before my first action, and I think you're both more likely to be prisoners.

Will I be less likely to be the other guard if B2 is an acid bath?

As a prisoner, I am much more concerned about staying a step ahead of Tables.  I have to be alive for finding room 25 to be useful.

[hyramgraff]

I'm going to move into the Moving chamber, switch with D2, then take a look-see.

Moving to D2 seems to be a bit too close to Tables for comfort.  Maybe D1, E1 or E2 would be better instead.

[mail-mi]

I'm going to move into the Moving chamber, switch with D2, then take a look-see.

Moving to D2 seems to be a bit too close to Tables for comfort.  Maybe D1, E1 or E2 would be better instead.

Well I was gonna look in those rooms to find room 25.

[liopoil]

I too suspect hyramgraff. Vote: Hyramgraff

Vote Count 1.1:

Hyramgraff (2): theorel, liopoil

not voting (3): mail-mi, hyramgraff, tables

with 5 alive it takes 3 to....??


I am going to move to B5 and then look in C5. I have looked in B5. That's all I will say.

[Tables]

Vote: Tables

I don't know what this vote does but I want in on it!

[Kuildeous]

And we're back!

Liopoil is on the move. But where to?

The dark chamber or the hidden chamber? Let's find out, shall we?

[hyramgraff]

I'm going to move into the Moving chamber, switch with D2, then take a look-see.

Moving to D2 seems to be a bit too close to Tables for comfort.  Maybe D1, E1 or E2 would be better instead.

Well I was gonna look in those rooms to find room 25.

I've got a control programmed.  You might not be next to those rooms for very long.

[mail-mi]

I'm going to move into the Moving chamber, switch with D2, then take a look-see.

Moving to D2 seems to be a bit too close to Tables for comfort.  Maybe D1, E1 or E2 would be better instead.

Well I was gonna look in those rooms to find room 25.

I've got a control programmed.  You might not be next to those rooms for very long.

Well okay ill move somewhere else then.

[liopoil]

Move: B5

[Kuildeous]

Liopoil moves into....an empty chamber. Well, that's anticlimactic.

Maybe mail-mi will make things more exciting. Where are you moving to?

[mail-mi]

move to A5 and switch with D1

[Kuildeous]

With a grinding of gears, mail-mi moves to a new location. That was definitely more exciting.

Now theorel gets to move. Where does he move to?

[theorel]

Move C1, move column B up

[Kuildeous]

With a grinding of gears, column B moves.

And now, ladies and gentlemen, the moment you're waiting for. What is Tables going to do? Even the good folks in the control booth don't know what he's got planned. The sky's the limit for this upstart. Well, except for the flooded chamber. That's still inaccessible.

What does Tables do?

[Tables]

I need to actually work out what's been going on these last two turns, barely been paying attention since I got my kill. Let's give things a reread.

[Tables]

Walk into D3 and look at D2

[Kuildeous]

And the guard is on the hunt. Look at him strutting confidently into the Vision Chamber with hyramgraff.

But hyramgraff will have nothing to do with that. He's on the move. Where does he move to?

[hyramgraff]

Move to D4.

[Kuildeous]

And hyrmgraff heads into an empty chamber. He's safe….for now.

It's liopoil's turn to look, but he's now surrounded by known rooms. Pick a direction to look in, liopoil, but you already know the answer.

Mail-mi, however, will get to look into a room. Which room will it be?

[mail-mi]

E1

[Kuildeous]

Mail-mi takes a look at E1. Interesting, I'm sure.
Theorel takes a look at B1. Also interesting, I'm sure.
And now it's Tables's turn again. He's already moved once this turn, so he'll have to choose a different action. Which action will it be?

[Tables]

I'll Look in E3

[Kuildeous]

And Tables takes a look. It's like he didn't believe us when we told him that all the rooms are filled with puppies.

And hyramgraff is up. Oh, he's moving rooms around. He's got a couple of choices here. What is he going to move?

[theorel]

It looks to me like moving Row 4 right is your best move here.  Puts you in a position to scout a couple more rooms, puts Tables out of position.

[hyramgraff]

It looks to me like moving Row 4 right is your best move here.  Puts you in a position to scout a couple more rooms, puts Tables out of position.

That's what my original plan was and it still sounds good to me.  Since it affects liopoil as well, I'd like to hear his thoughts before committing to it.

[hyramgraff]

I guess I'm getting the cold shoulder because everyone thinks I'm a guard.  Shift right.

[Kuildeous]

And look at those rooms go!

It's time for a commercial break, but when we return, mail-mi gets to begin this round. I can't wait!

Everyone program your moves in your QT, except for Tables. If mail-mi can include the target of his first move, I'll process that when everyone is ready. Please indicate that this is for turn -6.

[mail-mi]

If I move into the control chamber, which line should I move?

[hyramgraff]

Moving into the control room would make it possible for you or theorel to push the other person into a red room.  Because of that, I would shift column B to avoid that.

[mail-mi]

Moving into the control room would make it possible for you or theorel to push the other person into a red room.  Because of that, I would shift column B to avoid that.

The flooded chamber is locked isn't it?

[theorel]

B-1 is the red room right now.

[Kuildeous]

Moving into the control room would make it possible for you or theorel to push the other person into a red room.  Because of that, I would shift column B to avoid that.

The flooded chamber is locked isn't it?

Yes, once someone enters the Flooded Chamber, that room is now locked for the rest of the game. And hopefully the person inside is able to get out in time. But no one else may enter.

[mail-mi]

Well I was going to look in that room.

[theorel]

Right, the danger would be that I could push you into that room.  It is highly improbable that I would do so and it would be immediately deadly.
But if it is, say, an acid chamber, I could push you in and then move after you.

I wouldn't do that because I'm not a guard...
you can't do that because I'll act before you get a chance to move in.  That said, it's pointless for me to stay here.

It would be better for you to look at E-1 or D-2, than to look at B-1 which has been looked at by both me and hyramgraff when we can't both be guards, and I didn't just say: "hyramgraff's a guard, he tried to kill me."

[Kuildeous]

BTW, liopoil is on leave for now. I believe he will return next week. Then there's GenCon, so my own time will be limited, but we'll burn that bridge when we get to it.

Unless liopoil gets a long stretch of internet time to allow him to plot and plan accordingly, expect this game to languish just a bit.

[liopoil]

oh hi. what's going on? my turn to look?

[Kuildeous]

Sorry, I left that a question mark, but in actuality, when it was your turn to look, there was nothing new to see. Someone moved the rooms so you were no longer surrounded by hidden rooms. So for that reason, I skipped that part of your turn.

We are now at the programming phase. I'll change that question mark so that you looked at whatever. It didn't matter. Your look action became obsolete through someone else's actions.

[Kuildeous]

Liopoil, are you back now? It's time to program for turn -6.

[liopoil]

Will be this afternoon - can't see map from mobile. it'd be nice if people would talk about what their doing... or did I already miss that?

[liopoil]

dangit, forgot again. taking turn right now.

[liopoil]

I'm gonna look in C5 then move to the illusion chamber.

[Kuildeous]

Welcome back, folks. It's been a tense race so far. Poor TwistedArcher got taken out early on, but the others are still struggling. Only one guard has been revealed, and we do not yet know if his accomplice is on the move or is actually the corpse. I'm sure we'll find out soon enough.

Mail-mi takes a bold leap into…an empty chamber.

Now it's Theorel's turn to move. Where is he going?

[theorel]

Move D1, swap A4

[Kuildeous]

And Theorel moves around the board. Look at him go!

And now it's Tables's turn. We can't tell him what to do, so he'll tell us instead.

[Tables]

Shift Column D down

[Kuildeous]

Tables plays a giant game of Rubik's Cube (okay, it's not really a game, shut up).

Hyramgraff peeks into an adjacent room. Which room will it be?

[hyramgraff]

Look E5

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff takes a lookie-see into E5.

Now it is liopoil's turn to looks. Where does he look?

[liopoil]

Look: C5

[Kuildeous]

And now it's mail-mi's turn in the exciting new game, "What's in that room?" Where do you look?

[mail-mi]

look: E2

[Kuildeous]

And now Theorel looks in...oh wait, no, Theorel is shifting something. What is he shifting? It'll be either A or 4, and either direction is good for him this turn.

[theorel]

Shift Column D down seems like the best option to me.

[mail-mi]

Shift Column D down seems like the best option to me.

You're not in column D

[theorel]

Oh, right...darn, the control room got me all thinking control was better than it is.
Um...
Shift Column A Up

[Kuildeous]

And now it's Tables's turn to do that thing that Tables does.

[Tables]

Let's move into E4

[Kuildeous]

Tables strolls into the seemingly empty chamber. Huh, he could have sworn that there was another person in here. Where could he have g....

Suddenly, hyramgraff leaps from behind the door and grabs Tables arm, wrenching it painfully behind his back. With a crazed gleam in his eye, hyramgraff shoves Tables into E5. Hyramgraff barely leaps out of the way as a jet of flame belches from the room. When his eyes adjust the sudden dimness, he sees that Tables has been incinerated.

We will now break for commercial as we mourn the passing of Tables the guard. And also verify if a dead guard is still enough to reveal TwistedArcher's identity. Please hold.

[Kuildeous]

And per hyramgraff's CO, he shouts at Tables: "Hey tables! E5 is blue. You should guard it."

[Kuildeous]

The rules state that the first dead player's allegiance is revealed when a second player dies. There is no exception listed if that second player is a revealed guard.

So, who did Tables kill early on in the game? TwistedArcher was a prisoner.

With that knowledge, the remaining prisoners know that they cannot escape unless all three of them get Room 25 out of the complex on the last turn.

But who is the second guard?

[liopoil]

nice one!

[Kuildeous]

And welcome back from break. Boy, was that exciting!

The smell of charred Tables still fills the air, but that won't stop liopoil from moving. Where does he move to?

[liopoil]

Move:C5 D4. has D3 been looked at? if it hasn't, I'll look there I think. or should I look somewhere else, to find room 25.

btw, C5 is a rather mediocre place to be. I don't really recommend it.

[Kuildeous]

Liopoil moved. Now it's just a matter of where he's directing the Vision Room.

[Tables]

Well that was very unexpected.

[mail-mi]

There's nothing interesting in the E corner, so I think I'll control myself down to you guys. Okay?

[Twistedarcher]

Nice job!!

[theorel]

Anybody happen to know what rooms we currently know?

I know hyramgraff and myself have looked at B1. (known Red)
liopoil's looked at C5 (mediocre, not recommended)
mail-mi's looked at E2 (Not interesting)

I'm pretty sure some other rooms have been looked at and not divulged.  I can go back and track them tomorrow if needed, but if people remember that would be easier.

[liopoil]

Look: D3

[Kuildeous]

And that concludes turn -6.

Make your preparation to program turn -5. Remember to include -5 in your programming so I can more easily find it in the QTs.

Also, I'll be flying out to GenCon in a matter of hours, so I likely won't be able to mod this as much. When I'm back at the room with my laptop, I'll likely be reading an RPG I'll be running. That's not to say that I won't update anything, but there's no hurry.

[Kuildeous]

Also, Theorel will lead Turn -5. Please include your first action's target.

[mail-mi]

Look: D3

Is C5 safe?

[hyramgraff]

Anybody happen to know what rooms we currently know?

I know hyramgraff and myself have looked at B1. (known Red)
liopoil's looked at C5 (mediocre, not recommended)
mail-mi's looked at E2 (Not interesting)

I'm pretty sure some other rooms have been looked at and not divulged.  I can go back and track them tomorrow if needed, but if people remember that would be easier.

Tables looked at what are now D3 and E3.  Perhaps those are the extra looks you're remembering.

[hyramgraff]

Well that was very unexpected.

If you're not being sarcastic, then what were you expecting?  It was fairly obvious (to me) that you were targeting me.

[theorel]

Okay, retracked everything.  For everyone's reference:
X R N T E
X O F X ?
M E C ? X
Y D E V E
E F ? I A

B1=red-not instant death-according to theorel/hyramgraff
A4=yellow-according to liopoil.  Back when it was D1, like turn 3.
E2=mail-mi has looked here
D3=liopoil has looked here
C5=liopoil has looked here

Other letters are revealed rooms, you can check the map for those.
There are a total of 4 rooms no one has looked at.

Mostly liopoil has seen stuff that's not revealed.

liopoil and mail-mi both claim to have seen a non-interesting room.
liopoil: you've looked at 2 rooms, could you tell us the colors of those 2 rooms in no particular order?

[liopoil]

No reason to go into C5. D3 is red.

[Tables]

Well that was very unexpected.

If you're not being sarcastic, then what were you expecting?  It was fairly obvious (to me) that you were targeting me.

I wasn't targeting anyone. I didn't have any kind of long term plan. I was two spaces away from you with three people around me, I could have easily gone for anyone.

[mail-mi]

No reason to go into C5. D3 is red.

But can I? I'm going to control myself down there, then move into the illusion chamber and switch.

[liopoil]

No reason to go into C5. D3 is red.

But can I? I'm going to control myself down there, then move into the illusion chamber and switch.

don't go into C5.

[theorel]

Even if liopoil HAD said that it was safe, I would advise against moving into the illusion chamber, unless you're switching with something you've already seen.

One of the 4 of us is a guard, if he kills 1 prisoner he wins.  Do NOT move based on trust until the guard is revealed.

Also note: there are almost NO completely safe rooms left.

Why don't you contro 1 right and look at what is now A-1?

[hyramgraff]

Okay, retracked everything.  For everyone's reference:
X R N T E
X O F X ?
M E C ? X
Y D E V E
E F ? I A

B1=red-not instant death-according to theorel/hyramgraff
A4=yellow-according to liopoil.  Back when it was D1, like turn 3.
E2=mail-mi has looked here
D3=liopoil has looked here
C5=liopoil has looked here

Other letters are revealed rooms, you can check the map for those.
There are a total of 4 rooms no one has looked at.

Mostly liopoil has seen stuff that's not revealed.

liopoil and mail-mi both claim to have seen a non-interesting room.
liopoil: you've looked at 2 rooms, could you tell us the colors of those 2 rooms in no particular order?

The rooms that are left unrevealed are:
1 Empty Chamber
1 Vortex Room
1 Cold Chamber
1 Dark Chamber
1 Trapped Chamber
1 Mortal Chamber
2 Acid Baths
Room 25

The X's on the map are the rooms we still haven't looked at.

• I can look at E3.
• I can move to the vision chamber and look at D2.
• Theorel can look at A2.
• Mail-mi can control right and look at B1 (currently A1) (or A2).
• I can control down and Mail-mi can look at D2.

But we still have one guard left on the field, and that makes planning a little bit risky.  I'm thinking that programming control (down) will be my safest course of action.

[liopoil]

A4=yellow
D3=red
C5=don't go there

but if I'm a guard, you better believe C5 is blue

what's E2 again?

how exactly does the illusion chamber work? I don't move, but I switch with a hidden room? dangerous...

[hyramgraff]

how exactly does the illusion chamber work? I don't move, but I switch with a hidden room? dangerous...

Yes, that's how the illusion chamber works.  It's red because of the possibility of becoming one of the other red rooms.  You should be safe if you swap it with A4.

[Kuildeous]

I've been asked if there's a spectator discussion QT. So I created one. Anyone who is spectating may request a link from me.

I suppose dead players could request as well. I trust the integrity of the dead players to not reveal what they know.

[Kuildeous]

Everyone is programmed. Theorel starts us off by looking into a room. Which room do you look at, Theorel?

[theorel]

Look at A2

[Kuildeous]

Theorel takes a look in A2.

Meanwhile, hyramgraff shifted column E down.

Now it's liopoil turn to move. But where to?

[Kuildeous]

Prodding liopoil. Don't make me push you somewhere.

[liopoil]

ugh.  Move: D5, switch with A4

[Kuildeous]

Liopoil moves into a seemingly innocuous room. Oh, no, it's a cold room! So cold. Brr! Though, one has to wonder just how awesome our illusions are to not feel that one coming.

It is time for mail-mi to act. He is shifting something. What is he going to shift and in which direction? He can shift row 2 in either direction, but he could only shift column E down this turn.

[hyramgraff]

ugh.  Move: D5, switch with A4

You had the choice of moving into an empty room or a cold chamber and you chose the cold chamber?!  Why?

[mail-mi]

Shoot I was gonna shift E up. Well, I guess I'll just shift 2 left.

[Kuildeous]

And row 2 moves over a little bit.

Time for theorel to make his move. Where does move to?

[theorel]

Move A4, switch E2

[Kuildeous]

And Theorel comes roaring through the door. Oh man, look at all those traps. Look at those flames shooting out. Man, this room looks nasty. No, wait, turns it the room is really empty, but man did those illusions look super scary!

And now it's hyramgraff's turn. He's going to take a look. There's only one option for him to look that is meaningful, so I'll jump to the chase on this one. He looks in E4.

Liopoil takes a look. Again, he has one option, so he looks in C5.

That takes us to mail-mi and the end of this round. Mail-mi moves somewhere. Where to?

[mail-mi]

Well shoot. I was not expecting E to move down. Are. C2 and D3 safe?

[theorel]

You can move through the Trapped Chamber if needed. (as long as you move as your first action next turn)

Let's see where we're at...
You can use the illusion chamber to swap with B1 (safe according to hyram and myself)
You know what's in E3 and whether that's safe.
liopoil claims D3 is not safe (red).
liopoil claims that C5 is not safe (red).

A1, C2, and E4 are complete unknowns.


X R N T A
O F X E I
M E C ? ?
E D E V X
E F ? O E

B1=red-not instant death-according to theorel/hyramgraff
E3=mail-mi has looked here
D3=liopoil has looked here (This is supposedly red)
C5=liopoil has looked here (He refuses to comment on color, but says it's bad)

[theorel]

Oh, hyramgraff just looked in E4.

[mail-mi]

I think I'll move to E2 and swap with B1.

[hyramgraff]

Oh, hyramgraff just looked in E4.

Yes, I can't decide if I should reveal the color because there is still one guard.  I will say that it's not green.

[Kuildeous]

Mail-mi enters the mysterious chamber. Aw, look, flowers and bunnies. How sweet. Oh, look at how everything melts. Wait, this is not the Disney Enchanted Forest Chamber. It's an Acid Bath. Better hope nobody else enters this room while mail-mi is in it.

And that concludes turn -5. We'll be back after this short commercial break.

Meanwhile, time for our contestants to program turn -4. Time is running out, and Room 25 is still hidden away. Did I even add that to the shuffle? Find out after a word from our sponsors.

[Kuildeous]

And a couple of reminders…

Hyramgraff goes first this turn, so please include the target of your first action.

Liopoil can only program one action this turn.

[theorel]

@hyramgraff: kudos for not obviously lying about the color of the room, since there are no green rooms left


X I N T A
O F X E B
M E C ? ?
E D E V ?
E F ? O E

E3=mail-mi has looked here (no info given)
E4=hyramgraff has looked here (no info given)
D3=liopoil has looked here (This is supposedly red)
C5=liopoil has looked here (He refuses to comment on color, but says we should *NOT* go there)

Rooms Left:
1 Acid Bath
1 Mortal Chamber
1 Trapped Chamber
1 Vortex Room
Room 25

I'm most suspicious of liopoil at the moment only because of his unwillingness to comment on C5.  If C5 is Room 25 then he might would say these kinds of things as a guard.  He would also say them if C5 is a vortex room or Mortal Chamber and he were trying to WIFOM us.  He might do it as a prisoner to try to WIFOM the guard?

So, we know very little about where room 25 is.  All of the question marks are unconfirmed locations (i.e. seen by only one player), and the X's are completely unseen.  We have 4 turns left to get everyone into room 25?  We might need to consider how we can get everyone in there once we find it even.

[liopoil]

It's red, the worst red. I was trying to not tell the guard, but oh well, that didn't work out.

[theorel]

Oh, hey there's a Dark Room somewhere too.  I left that one out.

@hyramgraff/mail-mi, maybe after programming moves, you could both share the color of your rooms?

[mail-mi]

I'm looking in C2 to check for room 25. Because of controlling, it might be there.

[hyramgraff]

I'm thinking that I'll head for the vision room, but to reach there this round I'll need to program a control as my first action.

[liopoil]

me too - control up, not sideways.

[theorel]

(non-guard) hyramgraff should obviously not go into the vision chamber if liopoil is going to be there, because liopoil goes before him next round.  This means liopoil should not expect to go into the vision room this turn (since hyram goes first)

[liopoil]

it will take hyramgraff two turns to get there, it will only take me one.

[theorel]

It will take hyram 2 actions = 1 turn to get there, it will take you 1 action=1 turn to get there.

Those are the same.

[liopoil]

well, okay, but I will get there first. besides, where else can I go?

[theorel]

Regardless of how he moves row 5 the position above you will be safe, unless the position to your left is currently safe.

There is only one hidden place left on the board that kills you instantly all others give you at least 1 action to escape.

If hyram controls E up, it's safe for a non-guard liopoil to move to the vision chamber because you get to move OUT before hyram can do anything to you.
But that's NOT safe for a non-guard hyram, so if he's not a guard (or concealing his guardiness) he shouldn't do that in the first place, which takes us back to the top.

[theorel]

I would prefer hyramgraff to use the vision chamber, because it would be nice to have a balance in the number of rooms looked at and unrevealed, and you currently have the most.  If hyramgraff has an option that lets him look at a room without moving to the vision chamber I prefer that (i.e. if there's a vortex room above him), but otherwise I'd rather hyram see 1 room than liopoil see 1 room.

[theorel]

Okay, actually, I kind of like the following plan, but obviously both hyramgraff and liopoil would need to be on board for it:

hyram controls 5 right, I control A up.
hyram looks in A5 (currently A1), and liopoil moves into whichever of D5 and E4 is "safe".

I think this requires minimal trust, and gets good use out of our turns.

If hyram doesn't move 5 right, then liopoil can move to the vision chamber.
If I don't move A up, hyram wastes an action.
If hyram doesn't look in A5, he could move into my space, and then I act before him and besides I'd be surrounded by empty/safe rooms.
liopoil is forced to move into D5 or E4 which could be trapped/acid bath.

liopoil goes first next round, so he can move into the vision chamber then.

Let's see, analyzing the situation where I'm a guard...
if I didn't move A up, I'd have 2 actions that I could use to mess things up...
If E4 is an acid bath, AND I control 4 left, I could move into the acid bath and kill liopoil.

So, if E4 is an acid bath, hyramgraff should not go through with this.  Otherwise though, I think it would work.

What's nice about this is, if hyram's a guard we reveal room E4 which might be an unannounced Room 25 (that would mean he wouldn't go along with it though).
If liopoil's a guard we might be forcing him to reveal C5, since E4 could be the mortal chamber.

Otherwise, this is essentially the same as hyram moving into the vision chamber and looking at A1.

[liopoil]

I can move into E4

[hyramgraff]

Okay, actually, I kind of like the following plan, but obviously both hyramgraff and liopoil would need to be on board for it:

hyram controls 5 right, I control A up.
hyram looks in A5 (currently A1), and liopoil moves into whichever of D5 and E4 is "safe".

I think this requires minimal trust, and gets good use out of our turns.

If hyram doesn't move 5 right, then liopoil can move to the vision chamber.
If I don't move A up, hyram wastes an action.
If hyram doesn't look in A5, he could move into my space, and then I act before him and besides I'd be surrounded by empty/safe rooms.
liopoil is forced to move into D5 or E4 which could be trapped/acid bath.

liopoil goes first next round, so he can move into the vision chamber then.

Let's see, analyzing the situation where I'm a guard...
if I didn't move A up, I'd have 2 actions that I could use to mess things up...
If E4 is an acid bath, AND I control 4 left, I could move into the acid bath and kill liopoil.

So, if E4 is an acid bath, hyramgraff should not go through with this.  Otherwise though, I think it would work.

What's nice about this is, if hyram's a guard we reveal room E4 which might be an unannounced Room 25 (that would mean he wouldn't go along with it though).
If liopoil's a guard we might be forcing him to reveal C5, since E4 could be the mortal chamber.

Otherwise, this is essentially the same as hyram moving into the vision chamber and looking at A1.

I'm not on board with this plan.  Mostly because E4 is red.

[liopoil]

I don't care - I know it won't kill me.

[Kuildeous]

Welcome back, audience. We still have two mangled and charred corpses out there. How's that for motivation!

Hyramgraff goes first. He throws a few levers and shifts his row left.

Liopoil is shivering in that room. He has an action programmed. Does he wish to execute it now or later? And if now, then what is the target of his action, if any?

[liopoil]

Prediction: hyramgraff=guard, E4=room 25. anyway, I don't use my move yet.

[Kuildeous]

So, so cold. It's so cold that liopoil doesn't do anything until the next action.

Mail-mi is nice and warm in that acid bath, though. Those fumes clear the sinuses right up! However, it looks like mail-mi is tired of breathing all that in and is on the move. Where does he move to?

[mail-mi]

To D2, my fine enemy.

[Kuildeous]

Oh good, mail-mi can breathe more easily—literally.

It's Theorel's turn. Looks like he's going to shake the cube up a bit. What's he shifting?

[theorel]

Control A up

[Kuildeous]

That happens. Now hyramgraff makes his move. Where to?

[hyramgraff]

Move to D4, look at A5.

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff moves into the vision chamber and looks at another room.

Now liopoil can finally move out of that cold chamber. Where do you move to, liopoil?

[liopoil]

Move: C4

[mail-mi]

look: C2

[Kuildeous]

We had a move and a look.

Theorel gets to move now.

[theorel]

Move A4

Okay, so we've seen everything now...
Anyone seen our exit?

[theorel]

And, if everyone claims to have NOT seen an exit, then I'm clearly a prisoner (since I've seen none of the rooms...I'm not the liar).

In that case...I think we should have everyone claim room colors to help figure out who's lying.

[Kuildeous]

Theorel made his move.

Time to program for Turn -3 now. You have three turns to find Room 25 and move it out of the complex with all three of you in it.

[liopoil]

okay, I don't think anyone should program anything until we've all agreed on a plan at least for this round. let's figure this thing out.

[hyramgraff]

okay, I don't think anyone should program anything until we've all agreed on a plan at least for this round. let's figure this thing out.

Now there's a plan I can agree with.

A5 is yellow.

[hyramgraff]

Move A4

Okay, so we've seen everything now...
Anyone seen our exit?

That's a known flooded chamber, you shouldn't be able to move there.

[Kuildeous]

Move A4

Okay, so we've seen everything now...
Anyone seen our exit?

That's a known flooded chamber, you shouldn't be able to move there.

Apologies. I should have caught that.

Hyramgraff is correct. That chamber is locked. You need to choose A2 or B3. At least neither of those will kill you.

[Kuildeous]

[The nice thing about D&D is that if the party gets wiped, the adventure can continue in the afterlife. *grin*]

[theorel]

Oh, good call...I'll Move A2 (Swap pending...)
(I didn't take into account that hyramgraff had controlled 5 left)

Are people willing to discuss colors of things they've seen before I swap, or are you all determined to wait?
(if you're willing to discuss, then we can know either where Room 25 supposedly is or at least have some idea of who might be lying...and I could swap accordingly)

[liopoil]

I am, as I'd said, B5 and D3 are both red.

[theorel]

Oh, and hyram's already claimed also...
So...that leaves mail-mi.  Seen Room 25?  Or is somebody lying?  (noting that if the guard hasn't seen Room 25 no one needs to lie)

[Kuildeous]

So noted. Pending the rest of this turn until Theorel is ready to swap rooms somewhere. Post it here and then plan your moves.

[mail-mi]

Oh, and hyram's already claimed also...
So...that leaves mail-mi.  Seen Room 25?  Or is somebody lying?  (noting that if the guard hasn't seen Room 25 no one needs to lie)

No. I have not. C2 is yeellow and E2 (3?) is red.

[theorel]

Okay, so I'm confirmed prisoner.

Room 25 could technically be anywhere from my perspective...but checking the rooms that have been claimed red makes the most sense, because one of those rooms is NOT red.
Either the guard claimed that Room 25 is Red, OR the guard claimed that a yellow room is red AND that Room 25 is yellow.

So, I still have my swap, then...can we figure out a good way for everyone to double check a red room without doing anything dangerous?

[theorel]

Okay, I'll swap to A5

The map looks like this then...

O I N T A
Y F Y E B
E E C R R
F D E V R
M R C E E

B5, D3=liopoil
A2, E5=hyram
C2, E3=mail-mi

[theorel]

So, let's see...
I think we should start by checking the red rooms...

I can check B5, and mail-mi can check D3 both trivially.  That will confirm liopoil as prisoner unless mail-mi lies (or liopoil is a guard) which would confirm hyram as prisoner.

liopoil should NOT move into D4 since hyram might be able to throw him into a variety of deadly places (though none mortal, in the situation where hyram would do that)

liopoil could control right which would let hyram look at E3.

That would confirm everyone except hyram's room...so if we don't have a contradiction by then, then we will know hyram is the guard.

Okay, that would work if everyone did it...but if liopoil didn't follow he could move to D4 instead and push hyram out.
So, hyram should move out of the vision chamber, and liopoil should move into it.

My proposed action then is that liopoil controls right and then moves into E4, while hyram moves to E5 and controls something depending on what is discovered by then.

(note I'm assuming liopoil shifts right for letters below)
If hyram doesn't leave the vision chamber, then he's the guard and we have a good idea of where Room 25 is, liopoil can move to D5.
If hyram moves into D4, liopoil can move out of it, hyram's the guard and liopoil can check A4 to see if it's Room 25.

If liopoil is the guard, then he might move into the vision chamber, but then hyram can move out of it...since he's already programmed a move.

Anybody have any further suggestions or problems with this suggestion?

[hyramgraff]

It's a bit hard to follow your logic.  I'm in general agreement with the parts I understand though.  Can you post what our orders would be if we followed your plan.

What I'm most worked about is getting all three prisoners into room 25 before the end of the next round.  I'm not sure that your plan has enough time for that to happen before the game ends and the guards win.

[theorel]

we have 2 more rounds after this right?
We have this round, then mail-mi starting, then me starting...then boom.

So, I think we'll have enough time, but it's worth checking if we need to take a chance somewhere.

Orders for this round would be:
mail-mi: look and whatever
me: look and whatever
liopoil: control and move (right and E4 respectively)
hyramgraff: move and whatever (E5)

Probably all of the "whatever"s should be controls.

I think with 2 rounds of control/moves from the prisoners we should be able to get to room 25, but an extra round of controls from most of us this round is probably good.

[Kuildeous]

we have 2 more rounds after this right?
We have this round, then mail-mi starting, then me starting...then boom.

This is correct.

[hyramgraff]

Ok, I'll program a move and a whatever.

[Kuildeous]

Just waiting for mail-mi to program his actions.

[Kuildeous]

And we're back!

Only three turns left before we pump neurotoxins into chambers. But don't worry; the lone surviving guard has built up an immunity to the poison. We think. Well, we'll find out soon enough.

It's liopoil's turn to begin. He is shifting the row. Left or right?

[theorel]

hey Kuildeous...you never moved the moving chamber.
I should be in A5.

[theorel]

Well, either mail-mi is the guard or he didn't like my plan and failed to comment on it.

So, if we assume mail-mi is the guard can we do anything more effective than our current plan?  I guess it depends on what he does...

[theorel]

Oh never mind...liopoil's shifting.  That's expected...I read mail-mi earlier and superimposed his name over liopoil in my brain.

ignore me.

[liopoil]

Control row 4 to the right

[Kuildeous]

Oops, the last action of the previous turn has been fully resolved. Theorel is now in A5.

And row 4 slides over. Mail-mi takes a gander at a nearby room.

Theorel is looking at a room. He has a couple of choices. Which room is it?

[theorel]

look: B5

[Kuildeous]

That happens. Hyramgraff now gets to move.

[hyramgraff]

So, what's over in B5?

[theorel]

B5 is NOT room 25.

mail-mi you looked at D3 right?  So...is it Room 25, or is liopoil confirmed prisoner?

[theorel]

Or rather, as far as I can tell liopoil was completely honest about B5.

[hyramgraff]

Move E5

[Kuildeous]

And hyramgraff makes his move.

It's now liopoil's turn. And just where is he moving to?

[mail-mi]

B5 is NOT room 25.

mail-mi you looked at D3 right?  So...is it Room 25, or is liopoil confirmed prisoner?

It is not.

[Kuildeous]

Is liopoil ready to move yet?

[liopoil]

Move: E4. Look: A4. Predict: Room 25

[Kuildeous]

Oh ho, such confidence. We like that in a contestant. Liopoil strides into the Vision Room to see what there is to see.

It is now mail-mi's turn. Looks like he's shifting things around. Is it a row or a column? Up, down, left, right?

[mail-mi]

2 right

[Kuildeous]

And row 2 trundles onward.

Theorel, not to be outdone, is shifting his own row or column. What is he shifting and where?

[theorel]

@liopoil: is prediction true?

[theorel]

O I N T A
B Y F Y E
E E C R R
R F D E V
M R C E E

B5 confirmed Red (me & lio)
D3 confirmed Red (mail-mi & lio)

B2(Y), A4=hyram
D2(Y), E3=mail-mi
[/quote]

So, either A4 is NOT Red, or E3 is NOT Red.  liopoil needs to confirm whether A4 is Red or not.  Then we can start figuring out what to do.
IF A4-Red
D2 OR E3 is Room 25 (the other is yellow)
IF A4-Yellow
B2 is Room 25
IF A4 Room 25 (then well, A4 is Room 25, duh)

lio is confirmed prisoner...so we can believe anything he says about A4.
Anyways, need that info to start planning this shift...

[liopoil]

A4 is not red, it's blue. I was wrong, sorry hyram.

So, that means mail-mi is the guard, and room 25 is D2 or E3

[liopoil]

whoops, sorry. it's red. typo .

not blue, it's red.

[theorel]

Okay, so I'm thinking of controlling 5 left.  Then I can use the Vision chamber to start next round and confirm the location of Room 25.

Then we just need to get everybody into Room 25 without mail-mi killing us right?

[liopoil]

Okay, so I'm thinking of controlling 5 left.  Then I can use the Vision chamber to start next round and confirm the location of Room 25.

Then we just need to get everybody into Room 25 without mail-mi killing us right?

and control it out of the prison.

[theorel]

No, that's a bad plan...mail-mi could do E down and I'd die if I moved.  Hmm...

I think I should get over there at any rate...so I think shifting left is still the right move.

maybe hyram could shift down, then I'm not in danger if I program a move, and hyram can use the moving chamber if mail-mi controls down...otherwise, hyram can use the control room to some positive effect?

That seems vaguely reasonable.  So, I'll make a control left tomorrow morning unless someone thinks I should do otherwise.

[mail-mi]

Muahahaha... You guessed it. I'm a freakin' guard. And you only have 2 rounds left.

[hyramgraff]

No, that's a bad plan...mail-mi could do E down and I'd die if I moved.  Hmm...

I think I should get over there at any rate...so I think shifting left is still the right move.

maybe hyram could shift down, then I'm not in danger if I program a move, and hyram can use the moving chamber if mail-mi controls down...otherwise, hyram can use the control room to some positive effect?

That seems vaguely reasonable.  So, I'll make a control left tomorrow morning unless someone thinks I should do otherwise.

I somehow thought that I would end up next to an unrevealed room so I have a look programmed for my second action.

[theorel]

Oh well, I think it still only makes sense to shift left...

So, where do we go from here?

[Kuildeous]

Shuffle, shuffle, shuffle goes the row. Theorel is now rejoined with his buddies.

Hyramgraff takes a look but, as he says, learns nothing new.

So, program your next turn. Mail-mi claimed he's a guard, but it's not official until he reveals his role on his turn (assuming he is indeed a guard).

Only two more turns to pull this off for the three prisoners.

[Kuildeous]

Pokity-poke-poke.

[theorel]

So, I've been trying to figure out if how we could win...
and I've got nothing.  There's a couple possibilities depending on what mail-mi does assuming E3 is Room 25.  But ultimately, I think he can stop us if he picks right.

Anybody else have any ideas?

[hyramgraff]

So, I've been trying to figure out if how we could win...
and I've got nothing.  There's a couple possibilities depending on what mail-mi does assuming E3 is Room 25.  But ultimately, I think he can stop us if he picks right.

Anybody else have any ideas?

No ideas.  I think I'm well out of position no matter which room is room 25.

[theorel]

Okay, how about this:
you both program control and move.
I'll program something which I don't announce.
If mail-mi guesses right, we lose...if he guesses wrong we might win (depending on where Room 25 is)

[hyramgraff]

I've programmed my actions.

[Kuildeous]

Waiting on liopoil.

[liopoil]

okay, figuring out stuff. Sorry for the wait.

[liopoil]

Unrevealed tiles:
1    Dark Chamber(y)
1    Vortex Room(y)
1    Trapped Chamber(r)
1    Mortal Chamber(r)
1    Acid Bath(r)
1    Room 25(b)

Unrevealed spots:

A4: red
A5: yellow
B2: red
D2: ??
D3: red
E3: ??

map (only includes rightmost three columns and lowermost 4 rows, those are the only ones that matter now):

S = room does nothing
blank = flooded chamber, you can't go here
R = red
V = vision chamber
M = moving chamber
B = room is either room 25, vortex room (sends you to C3), or dark chamber (does nothing)

   C   D   E
2      B   S
3 S   R   B
4 S   S   V
5 S   S   M

Turn Order:     Position:
Mail-mi:              E2
Theorel:             E5
Hyramgraff:        D5
Liopoil:               E4

(green = prisoner, red = guard)

[liopoil]

it'd be nice to know what A5 is, so that we know if it is safe to blindly walk into E3.

[theorel]

It's guaranteed "safe"...it's either Room 25 OR a yellow room.  If yellow it's either dark (safe), or vortex (safe, takes you back to central).

If you can figure out a plan that gets us into D2 AFTER moving blindly into E3 when it's dark but NOT vortex (or the other way round), I'd be impressed.

mail-mi goes before any of this turn...I'm 70% sure we can't come up with a plan that doesn't make us lose depending on mail-mi's action, even if we know which one is Room 25, much less which yellow room the other one is.

[liopoil]

getting vortexed to C3 is probably bad...

[theorel]

but, is it worse than the alternative?

If we can't win either way, it really doesn't matter.  I posit that if D2 is Room 25 we've already lost.  If E3 is Room 25, it's possible we've already lost depending on what mail-mi programmed.

[liopoil]

I'm trying to figure out all the ways we can do stuff, and all the ways mail-mi can respond, but it's too complicated. I'll just program my actions now.

[liopoil]

hopefully mail-mi forgot to reveal himself as a guard and he's stuck with whatever he programmed.

[hyramgraff]

So, program your next turn. Mail-mi claimed he's a guard, but it's not official until he reveals his role on his turn (assuming he is indeed a guard).

I'm assuming this means that Mail-mi had to program actions but I think that he's stuck with them for this round.  (Tables was stuck with his second action after all.)

[Kuildeous]

Keep in mind that the second guard's identity is not officially revealed until that guard's action. So if the guard wishes to make his identity known and reap the benefits in the following turn, he'll have to do it as one of his two actions this turn.

Mail-mi sets the gears in motion and shifts column E down.

It is now Theorel's turn. He's also shifting gears. Column E is already on its way down, so he can't shift it up, but he does have flexibility with shifting Row 1. What to shift and in which direction?

[theorel]

yay! I hope you both did controls...
shift E down

[theorel]

okay, so assuming you both went along with my suggestion and did control/moves...here's what my plan was (if old E3 was Room 25 it should work)

We all control down.  At the end of this old-E3 will be E1.  I'll be in E3, liopoil in E2 and hyram in D1.

mail-mi will be down at E5...he can't control only move/look/push all of which are useless.

I'll move into the vision chamber (E2) for my action, this nicely confirms that E1 is Room 25.  If not, well...we can try to work it out for D3 (old D2)

Then you can both move in there on your action.  Next round I move in and liopoil takes us out of the board.

Also, the result of all of my analysis was that I had to match mail-mi's action.  If he controlled I had to control, if he moved I had to move.  That was true if E3 was Room 25.  I never really analyzed the possibility for D2 as Room 25, because I couldn't even guarantee an E3-win...but splitting off from mail-mi seemed best regardless.

[Kuildeous]

And column E keeps grinding downward. It is now hyramgraff's turn. He gets to shift something too. Either column or row, both can be slid in either direction.

[hyramgraff]

Control down

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff does the shuffle.

It's now liopoil's turn to shift something. I'm sure I don't need to ask, but I'm contractually obligated by the networks to do so. Which are you shifting, liopoil?

[liopoil]

okay, so assuming you both went along with my suggestion and did control/moves...here's what my plan was (if old E3 was Room 25 it should work)

We all control down.  At the end of this old-E3 will be E1.  I'll be in E3, liopoil in E2 and hyram in D1.

mail-mi will be down at E5...he can't control only move/look/push all of which are useless.

I'll move into the vision chamber (E2) for my action, this nicely confirms that E1 is Room 25.  If not, well...we can try to work it out for D3 (old D2)

Then you can both move in there on your action.  Next round I move in and liopoil takes us out of the board.

Also, the result of all of my analysis was that I had to match mail-mi's action.  If he controlled I had to control, if he moved I had to move.  That was true if E3 was Room 25.  I never really analyzed the possibility for D2 as Room 25, because I couldn't even guarantee an E3-win...but splitting off from mail-mi seemed best regardless.

I looked at D2 being room 25 a lot, it looks bad if that is the case. I doubt it is.

[liopoil]

Control E down

[Kuildeous]

And the column just keeps on sliding.

Mail-mi then moves from E5 into D5. I'm making that call, because the alternative was to move into the Mortal Chamber, and I don't think he wants to throw his life away just yet.

Also, as he moves, mail-mi pulls off the mask and reveals his inner guardness. Next turn, he does not have to program his actions.

It's time for Theorel to move. Where to?

[theorel]

Move E2 look at E1

[Kuildeous]

Theorel moved and is looking.

Hyramgraff is next to move.

[theorel]

Annnd, the room is blue!

[hyramgraff]

Move to E1

[Kuildeous]

Hyramgraff leaps into the strange, mysterious room. And there is Room 25! There's cake and punch and possibly strippers. But he's not out of the woods yet.

It's liopoil's move now. Where does he move to, he asks knowingly?

[liopoil]

E1 sounds like a cool place.

[Kuildeous]

This is it, folks! The final round. Can our intrepid prisoners escape?

Mail-mi doesn't need to program anything this round. The others do. And then Theorel leads us off. Gentlemen, please program your final actions.

[hyramgraff]

So according to my calculations we need the following to happen:

Theorel moves up.
I control us to victory.

Am I missing anything?

[liopoil]

sweet!

Theorel should program a move, moving to E1
Hyramgraff should program a control
I'll program a control, because why not.

[theorel]

I programmed my move like 2 days ago...let's win this thing.

[Kuildeous]

Waiting for hyramgraff to program, though it does seem to be a foregone conclusion.

Unless…

Where is that rule for the super-secret double-double agent traitor?

[hyramgraff]

Actions programmed.

[Kuildeous]

Welcome back to the exciting conclusion of Room 25. One way or another, the game draws to a close.

First, Theorel goes. He runs into Room 25. No surprise there. With the majority of surviving players in Room 25, we would normally reveal the identity of mail-mi, but he's been very helpful in doing that for us.

It's hyramgraff's turn. Does he screw over the group and push Theorel right back out? Nope, doesn't look like it. Instead, he's controlling the room. He could still screw over the group. Where on earth is hyramgraff going to move the room?

[Voltgloss]

[Kuildeous]

Yes, quite right. I thought hyramgraff was still online, so I wanted to let him savor the moment where he announces that he moves the room out. He's not online yet, so I hope he doesn't mind pushing things to the conclusion. There are no more secrets. So here's the final act:

And with that, the room sails out of the complex, free from the nasty prison. The air smells so much better out here already.

Mail-mi stands alone in the prison, looking forlornly at the escaping room. He only has the corpses of Tables and TwistedArcher to keep him company.

There is an ominous alarm, and a garbled voice reverberates throughout the prison, "Attention. Attention. Immolation to commence in 10 seconds. Ten….nine…eight…you know what, forget it. Activate!"

And the whimper is cut off.

[Voltgloss]

Congrats, prisoners!!

I've been watching this whole game with great interest and would love to join if/when it revs up again.

[Tables]

Damn, so close as well. I hadn't been following very closely since my death (Which still was a big shock to me, since apparently hyram predicted what I would do before I'd even decided what was best), but thought the guards had a pretty good chance. Oh well.

[mail-mi]

 

[liopoil]

wow, I thought we were dead.

We looked pretty much everywhere before we did room 25... and still won. I think this might be a bit too easy? I dunno, I felt like the guards played well, and we messed up a bit.

[Twistedarcher]

Turns out starting the same direction as both guards didn't go well. Oh well!

Good job team!

[hyramgraff]

Go team prisoners.  And many thanks to Theorel for stepping as a replacement and then doing all the brain work for round -2 to secure the win.

I was quite surprised that mail-mi was the last guard.  I was expecting it to be anyone but him.

[theorel]

It was tight, if mail-mi had done move/control (into Room 25) instead of control/move we would have lost.  I was hoping that since I had already mentioned the control down for insta-win that he'd take it.  But then I thought he wouldn't because I had mentioned it.  I was back and forth all over the place there.  But by the time I told lio/hyram program the control/move I had decided.  I don't think I could have made it work with a move/control on my part after that.  I just needed the WIFOM of what I would do to push mail-mi into controlling.  (I also hoped that he would be reluctant to reveal Room 25 for us, which is what finally pushed me over the edge).

I think it's probably a bit easier PbF because you can plan out moves.  Face-to-face there's no way I could have done as much trial and error for the final move to figure out one that worked.  I'd probably have just programmed the move and lost the game

mail-mi certainly had me fooled here as well.  I think I accused both hyram and liopoil but never mail-mi, until it was necessary that he be the guard.

If he'd said that whatever room he checked was Room 25 we probably would have lost because we'd have believed him over whoever's room he checked.

[Kuildeous]

Congrats, prisoners!!

I've been watching this whole game with great interest and would love to join if/when it revs up again.

It's been fun modding the game. I'm sure there will be a third game. I'll make sure you have an /in. I'll place priority on new players, but if there aren't enough new players to fill the game, I would gladly take some repeats.

[Qvist]

Well done guys, interesting read. Thanks Kuildeous for moderating and sorry again for my disappearance.