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Author Topic: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 3)  (Read 97248 times)

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mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #600 on: July 01, 2013, 07:37:05 am »

what??

nkirbit DID defend himself, I can quote his posts for you. I don't think it was his fault he got mislynched, it was the fault of the people on the wagon and the fault of everyone off wagon not defending him. No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance. This excuse it just way too convenient for spiritbears. If we let people state huge townreads on someone and then hammer them then we are giving scum a huge advantage. It's quite simple: town should never hammer their townread. Scum might want to.

Hopefully the same reason I am going to vote: liopoil we just went over how much town needed to stop shooting itself in the foot with statements like this (bolded above) That is way too weak a reason to push a D2 wagon and is not  scum hunting or analyzing its theorizing about what is "towny" which has not worked for town recently.
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Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #601 on: July 01, 2013, 08:48:00 am »

what??

nkirbit DID defend himself, I can quote his posts for you. I don't think it was his fault he got mislynched, it was the fault of the people on the wagon and the fault of everyone off wagon not defending him. No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance. This excuse it just way too convenient for spiritbears. If we let people state huge townreads on someone and then hammer them then we are giving scum a huge advantage. It's quite simple: town should never hammer their townread. Scum might want to.

Hopefully the same reason I am going to vote: liopoil we just went over how much town needed to stop shooting itself in the foot with statements like this (bolded above) That is way too weak a reason to push a D2 wagon and is not  scum hunting or analyzing its theorizing about what is "towny" which has not worked for town recently.
I didn't think it was a fair statement, so I'm glad you weighed in. Although I'm sure he will think I'm OMGUS'ing here (I'm not)
Vote Lio
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #602 on: July 01, 2013, 09:24:24 am »

Vote Count 2.2

spiritbears (1): liopoil
liopoil (3): yuma, mcmcsalot, spiritbears

Not voting: chairs, mail-mi, Robz888, Voltaire

With 8 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch
Deadline is 11am forum time on Wednesday, July 15th
« Last Edit: July 01, 2013, 08:42:37 pm by shraeye »
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #603 on: July 01, 2013, 09:30:42 am »

Shouldn't that be Yuma instead of volt on lio?
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #604 on: July 01, 2013, 10:19:12 am »

Shouldn't that be Yuma instead of volt on lio?
Yeah, I think so. Just in case, unvote.
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #605 on: July 01, 2013, 10:27:35 am »

hi guys, I'm here. I see I have some votes, I'll go find out why that is...
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #606 on: July 01, 2013, 11:26:53 am »

vote: liopoil

Alas I do not have time to give complete reasonings as to why. I have been at work all day--following along via e-mail's--and will be there again tomorrow until evening when I will be able to post something a bit more substantial.

I'll let you all hypothesize as to why I am voting for him though, that sounds like fun...
well, okay...

nkirbit DID defend himself, I can quote his posts for you. I don't think it was his fault he got mislynched, it was the fault of the people on the wagon and the fault of everyone off wagon not defending him. No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance. This excuse it just way too convenient for spiritbears.
Hopefully the same reason I am going to vote: liopoil we just went over how much town needed to stop shooting itself in the foot with statements like this (bolded above) That is way too weak a reason to push a D2 wagon and is not  scum hunting or analyzing its theorizing about what is "towny" which has not worked for town recently.
no. it's the opposite:

"we just went over how much town needs to stop shooting itself in the foot with statements like this: (No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance.)"

I'M town shooting myself in the foot? well if I'm town, why are you voting for me? more importantly, how do you know I'm town? clearly you don't think I'm town though, so I don't understand why me "shooting myself in the foot" (which I only "am" according to you if I'm town) is scummy. Are you saying that if I'm town, I'm shooting myself in the foot, but if I'm town, I wouldn't shoot myself in the foot, so I'm scum? That would make perfect sense if I was shooting myself in the foot, but I'm not.

I say that town should never hammer their townread, which I believe to be true. Based on this, spiritbears, if town, wouldn't hammer his townread. because he did something I don't think would happen if he is town, I think he is scum. It's just logic, and I think it's valid logic and a quite strong reason for a lynch on D2.  The only potential flaw I see is that perhaps SB did shoot himself in the foot. It seems everyone thinks that he did. I am giving him the assumption that he would not do what I see to be a mistake.

"That is way too weak a reason to push a D2 wagon and is not  scum hunting or analyzing its theorizing about what is "towny" which has not worked for town recently."

I don't think it is weak. I think it is a good line of reasoning. It's scumhunting, because I'm town who thinks SB is scum. I'm theorizing about what town would and wouldn't do. the reason it has not worked for town is that town has been playing badly and doing things that town shouldn't do. If town started acting like town it would be a lot easier to lynch scum.

mcmc, why do you think I am scum? the only line of reasoning I can sort of find in your post is that "If liopoil is town he is shooting himself in the foot, he wouldn't shoot himself in the foot, so he's scum". And that, as it happens, is the exact same reasoning I am using to find SB to be scum, which you disagree with yourself.

I didn't think it was a fair statement, so I'm glad you weighed in. Although I'm sure he will think I'm OMGUS'ing here (I'm not)
Vote Lio
I don't think you're OMGUSing. however, I am unclear on why you think I am scum. is it because you disagree with "No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance."? If so, I have two questions for you:

1. Why do you disagree? aka, why would hammering a townread ever help you achieve the town wincon? not asking you to change your mind, just wondering.
2. Why does me holding a belief you disagree with make me more likely to be scum?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #607 on: July 01, 2013, 11:30:19 am »

Um, I find it EXTREMELY weird that yuma says he has a case against liopoil, doesn't give it, and mcmc and SB vote without even hearing the case! Okay, sheeple.

Vote: mcmc
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #608 on: July 01, 2013, 11:33:47 am »

Um, I find it EXTREMELY weird that yuma says he has a case against liopoil, doesn't give it, and mcmc and SB vote without even hearing the case! Okay, sheeple.

Vote: mcmc
Except mcmc gave a reason and sb sheeped that one. Just to be clear.
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #609 on: July 01, 2013, 11:35:45 am »

vote: liopoil

Alas I do not have time to give complete reasonings as to why. I have been at work all day--following along via e-mail's--and will be there again tomorrow until evening when I will be able to post something a bit more substantial.

I'll let you all hypothesize as to why I am voting for him though, that sounds like fun...
well, okay...

nkirbit DID defend himself, I can quote his posts for you. I don't think it was his fault he got mislynched, it was the fault of the people on the wagon and the fault of everyone off wagon not defending him. No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance. This excuse it just way too convenient for spiritbears.
Hopefully the same reason I am going to vote: liopoil we just went over how much town needed to stop shooting itself in the foot with statements like this (bolded above) That is way too weak a reason to push a D2 wagon and is not  scum hunting or analyzing its theorizing about what is "towny" which has not worked for town recently.
no. it's the opposite:

"we just went over how much town needs to stop shooting itself in the foot with statements like this: (No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance.)"

I'M town shooting myself in the foot? well if I'm town, why are you voting for me? more importantly, how do you know I'm town? clearly you don't think I'm town though, so I don't understand why me "shooting myself in the foot" (which I only "am" according to you if I'm town) is scummy. Are you saying that if I'm town, I'm shooting myself in the foot, but if I'm town, I wouldn't shoot myself in the foot, so I'm scum? That would make perfect sense if I was shooting myself in the foot, but I'm not.

I say that town should never hammer their townread, which I believe to be true. Based on this, spiritbears, if town, wouldn't hammer his townread. because he did something I don't think would happen if he is town, I think he is scum. It's just logic, and I think it's valid logic and a quite strong reason for a lynch on D2.  The only potential flaw I see is that perhaps SB did shoot himself in the foot. It seems everyone thinks that he did. I am giving him the assumption that he would not do what I see to be a mistake.

"That is way too weak a reason to push a D2 wagon and is not  scum hunting or analyzing its theorizing about what is "towny" which has not worked for town recently."

I don't think it is weak. I think it is a good line of reasoning. It's scumhunting, because I'm town who thinks SB is scum. I'm theorizing about what town would and wouldn't do. the reason it has not worked for town is that town has been playing badly and doing things that town shouldn't do. If town started acting like town it would be a lot easier to lynch scum.

mcmc, why do you think I am scum? the only line of reasoning I can sort of find in your post is that "If liopoil is town he is shooting himself in the foot, he wouldn't shoot himself in the foot, so he's scum". And that, as it happens, is the exact same reasoning I am using to find SB to be scum, which you disagree with yourself.

I didn't think it was a fair statement, so I'm glad you weighed in. Although I'm sure he will think I'm OMGUS'ing here (I'm not)
Vote Lio
I don't think you're OMGUSing. however, I am unclear on why you think I am scum. is it because you disagree with "No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance."? If so, I have two questions for you:

1. Why do you disagree? aka, why would hammering a townread ever help you achieve the town wincon? not asking you to change your mind, just wondering.
2. Why does me holding a belief you disagree with make me more likely to be scum?
1) you're asking the wrong question. The question is exactly how did I hurt town by hammering a player that had been at l-1 for quite a while, had plenty of chances to fight for his life and refused, had plenty of chances to give reads, claim etc. And didn't, etc.  Exactly how was nk helping us? The answer is he wasn't. And you defending that kind of play...and going further declaring it scummy to EVER hammer a player in that situation is just not good fir us...it's scummy
2. See above
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #610 on: July 01, 2013, 11:36:00 am »

Um, I find it EXTREMELY weird that yuma says he has a case against liopoil, doesn't give it, and mcmc and SB vote without even hearing the case! Okay, sheeple.

Vote: mcmc
Except mcmc gave a reason and sb sheeped that one. Just to be clear.

The reason mcmc gave is paper thin.
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #611 on: July 01, 2013, 11:36:18 am »

I saw that too. I mean, everyone sheeps Yuma sometimes, but that's a pretty big extreme there... I don't think they were just taking his word for it though, they have their own reasons. What they are, I am not sure yet.

oh hey, voltaire, can you explain to me why mcmc thinks I'm scum?
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #612 on: July 01, 2013, 11:36:55 am »

I don't think SB sheeped mcmc.
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #613 on: July 01, 2013, 11:37:09 am »

Um, I find it EXTREMELY weird that yuma says he has a case against liopoil, doesn't give it, and mcmc and SB vote without even hearing the case! Okay, sheeple.

Vote: mcmc
Except mcmc gave a reason and sb sheeped that one. Just to be clear.
The reason mcmc gave is paper thin.
Agreed.
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #614 on: July 01, 2013, 11:37:33 am »

oh hey, voltaire, can you explain to me why mcmc thinks I'm scum?
Why do you think I could do that?
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #615 on: July 01, 2013, 11:38:07 am »

That the kindof uncareful thinking we are used to you promoting robz...or should I say scumrobz...
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #616 on: July 01, 2013, 11:38:52 am »

That the kindof uncareful thinking we are used to you promoting robz...or should I say scumrobz...

What?
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #617 on: July 01, 2013, 11:40:19 am »

That the kindof uncareful thinking we are used to you promoting robz...or should I say scumrobz...

What?
What do you mean what...you only made one statement
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #618 on: July 01, 2013, 11:40:57 am »

I have two questions for you:

1. Why do you disagree? aka, why would hammering a townread ever help you achieve the town wincon? not asking you to change your mind, just wondering.
2. Why does me holding a belief you disagree with make me more likely to be scum?
1) you're asking the wrong question. The question is exactly how did I hurt town by hammering a player that had been at l-1 for quite a while, had plenty of chances to fight for his life and refused, had plenty of chances to give reads, claim etc. And didn't, etc.  Exactly how was nk helping us? The answer is he wasn't. And you defending that kind of play...and going further declaring it scummy to EVER hammer a player in that situation is just not good fir us...it's scummy
2. See above
spiritbears, that lynch wasn't a done deal. It was still possible for us to lynch somebody else that day. nkirbit didn't play perfectly, and maybe could have done more to prevent his lynch, but up until your hammer, there wasn't a 5th person to vote for him. chances are he would've been lynched anyway, but you made it certain.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #619 on: July 01, 2013, 11:41:11 am »

That the kindof uncareful thinking we are used to you promoting robz...or should I say scumrobz...

What?
What do you mean what...you only made one statement

I'm not promoting uncareful thinking.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #620 on: July 01, 2013, 11:41:44 am »

I have two questions for you:

1. Why do you disagree? aka, why would hammering a townread ever help you achieve the town wincon? not asking you to change your mind, just wondering.
2. Why does me holding a belief you disagree with make me more likely to be scum?
1) you're asking the wrong question. The question is exactly how did I hurt town by hammering a player that had been at l-1 for quite a while, had plenty of chances to fight for his life and refused, had plenty of chances to give reads, claim etc. And didn't, etc.  Exactly how was nk helping us? The answer is he wasn't. And you defending that kind of play...and going further declaring it scummy to EVER hammer a player in that situation is just not good fir us...it's scummy
2. See above
spiritbears, that lynch wasn't a done deal. It was still possible for us to lynch somebody else that day. nkirbit didn't play perfectly, and maybe could have done more to prevent his lynch, but up until your hammer, there wasn't a 5th person to vote for him. chances are he would've been lynched anyway, but you made it certain.

I do agree with that, actually.
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #621 on: July 01, 2013, 11:42:09 am »

oh hey, voltaire, can you explain to me why mcmc thinks I'm scum?
Why do you think I could do that?
because:
Except mcmc gave a reason and sb sheeped that one. Just to be clear.
so apparently you saw a reason that he gave!
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #622 on: July 01, 2013, 11:42:55 am »

what??

nkirbit DID defend himself, I can quote his posts for you. I don't think it was his fault he got mislynched, it was the fault of the people on the wagon and the fault of everyone off wagon not defending him. No way should town EVER hammer somebody they have a townread on under any circumstance. This excuse it just way too convenient for spiritbears. If we let people state huge townreads on someone and then hammer them then we are giving scum a huge advantage. It's quite simple: town should never hammer their townread. Scum might want to.

Hopefully the same reason I am going to vote: liopoil we just went over how much town needed to stop shooting itself in the foot with statements like this (bolded above) That is way too weak a reason to push a D2 wagon and is not  scum hunting or analyzing its theorizing about what is "towny" which has not worked for town recently.
It's in his post, right after his vote!
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #623 on: July 01, 2013, 11:44:13 am »

It's in his post, right after his vote!
well yeah, I saw that, but it sounds more like he's scolding me for voting for what he thinks is a bad reason, not saying why he thinks I'm scum.
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #624 on: July 01, 2013, 11:46:22 am »

It's in his post, right after his vote!
well yeah, I saw that, but it sounds more like he's scolding me for voting for what he thinks is a bad reason, not saying why he thinks I'm scum.
And this gets into why I can't explain his vote/reasoning, but I think it's important to note that he did give reasoning (even if one thinks it's bad/flimsy).
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