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Author Topic: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 3)  (Read 29063 times)

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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #250 on: June 22, 2013, 03:32:33 pm »

Well that's too quick of a wagon for him to be scum. Although that was a suspicious post.
you can't possibly assume stuff like that. nkirbit, robz and I could very well all be townies who jumped on scum!mcmc's scummy first post. Maybe not, but it could very well be.
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #251 on: June 22, 2013, 03:52:58 pm »

I think some people here are trying extra hard to read scum into mc's post. If you think that was a Vt claim, you are sadly mistaken imo.  And why the hell would his first post be exactly like his first post before the reset?!?!  No one should b making the same post over again....that would just be scummy
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #252 on: June 22, 2013, 03:55:08 pm »

well of course. I'm saying that I agreed with what he was saying last time, and strongly disagree with many of the things he said this time.
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chairs

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #253 on: June 22, 2013, 04:11:03 pm »

Well now, I was very excited to actually get to do something with my awesome pr for once and no I don't get too so I understand the frustration. I did notice robz could have been playing it up, in fact I think he was playing up the frustration(the posting about felt out of character) I'm just not sure that means he's scum again.

Spirit got a bit screwed, now we all know what he looks like as scum...exactly the same...so my constant fear of him being scum is still a legitimate fear. For now I am going to continue to find him towny.

Yuma and liopoil have "reacted" the most I think about the reset and hange to a new game. I think liopoil comes off looking scummy and Yuma looking townie.

I'm kind of intrigued, as I really feel Yuma comes off scummy this game, as well as you and spiritbears.  Robz could be coming off scummy (I don't know him well enough to know if this kind of petulant whining is normal), but I'm leaving him neutral in my mind for now.

So my current list of potential scum, in descending order of confidence, is:
Vote: Yuma
mcmcsalot
spiritbears

nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #254 on: June 22, 2013, 04:12:16 pm »

Why do you think Yuma is scummy?
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chairs

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #255 on: June 22, 2013, 04:12:56 pm »

Well now, I was very excited to actually get to do something with my awesome pr for once and no I don't get too so I understand the frustration. I did notice robz could have been playing it up, in fact I think he was playing up the frustration(the posting about felt out of character) I'm just not sure that means he's scum again.

Spirit got a bit screwed, now we all know what he looks like as scum...exactly the same...so my constant fear of him being scum is still a legitimate fear. For now I am going to continue to find him towny.

Yuma and liopoil have "reacted" the most I think about the reset and hange to a new game. I think liopoil comes off looking scummy and Yuma looking townie.

I'm kind of intrigued, as I really feel Yuma comes off scummy this game, as well as you and spiritbears.  Robz could be coming off scummy (I don't know him well enough to know if this kind of petulant whining is normal), but I'm leaving him neutral in my mind for now.

So my current list of potential scum, in descending order of confidence, is:
Vote: Yuma
mcmcsalot
spiritbears

Errr, add liopoil into that "potential scum" list, at the bottom, but he's got effectively a neutral case as well.   And Nkirbit I was writing this as you replied, let me find the relevant yuma quotes And I'll throw it in as a new post.

chairs

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #256 on: June 22, 2013, 04:15:02 pm »

Why do you think Yuma is scummy?

On further inspection, the scummy post from Yuma was in the prior game.  Thanks for asking for the clarification!

Vote: mcmcsalot

liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #257 on: June 22, 2013, 04:16:09 pm »

woah, that's L-1. Probably not a good idea when the guy has exactly one post...
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #258 on: June 22, 2013, 04:21:47 pm »

Yeah, geez, unvote for now.

Chairs throwing out the fact that he has scumreads on half the other players makes his scumreads kind of meaningless at this point.

Why exactly do you find mcmc scummy, chairs?  And lio, and SB?  You didn't really provide reasons for any of your reads.
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #259 on: June 22, 2013, 04:23:22 pm »


Errr, add liopoil into that "potential scum" list, at the bottom, but he's got effectively a neutral case as well.

Confused by this.. if lipoil has a neutral case, why is he "potential scum"?
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #260 on: June 22, 2013, 04:23:49 pm »

...we're all potential scum...
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #261 on: June 22, 2013, 04:25:03 pm »

Well, yeah, but we all didn't make it onto chairs' list.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #262 on: June 22, 2013, 04:35:29 pm »

Vote Count 1.3

liopoil (1): spiritbears
mcmcsalot (3): liopoil, Robz888, chairs

Not voting: mail-mi, mcmcsalot, Voltaire, yuma, nkirbit

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch
Deadline is 10:30pm forum time on Wednesday, July 3rd
« Last Edit: June 24, 2013, 11:39:55 am by shraeye »
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mail-mi

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #263 on: June 22, 2013, 04:39:47 pm »

Well that's too quick of a wagon for him to be scum. Although that was a suspicious post.
you can't possibly assume stuff like that. nkirbit, robz and I could very well all be townies who jumped on scum!mcmc's scummy first post. Maybe not, but it could very well be.
Okay, I think that's too quick of a wagon...
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chairs

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #264 on: June 22, 2013, 04:50:33 pm »

Yeah, geez, unvote for now.

Chairs throwing out the fact that he has scumreads on half the other players makes his scumreads kind of meaningless at this point.

Why exactly do you find mcmc scummy, chairs?  And lio, and SB?  You didn't really provide reasons for any of your reads.

I'm going to try to make sure I don't miss any quotes this time, and I'll try to detail my suspicions.

First off: mcmcsalot seems to be making a VT claim in what I had quoted; as there's no reason to make a VT claim ever, it seems reasonable to believe that he is more likely than not scum.  As this is Day 1, my normal strategy (with folks that I play with IRL) is to head towards a no-lynch, but as I've been advised this is a terrible idea in practice by folks who have played this game more often than myself, I felt that as the one who the argument could be made most strongly for, he'd have my vote.  That being said, forum Mafia's a bit of a different beast than I'm used to (we're making decisions in days, rather than minutes) so I can see the justification/argument made for an Unvote until we can attempt to gather more evidence.

Second: spiritbears.  His liopoil voting seems... odd.. and his posting in general somewhat erratic (which in my IRL games has usually suggested someone trying to sound random enough that any potential scumpost comes off as just random).  He's also potentially covering for mc's VT claim - see:
Quote from: spiritbears
I think some people here are trying extra hard to read scum into mc's post. If you think that was a Vt claim, you are sadly mistaken imo.  And why the hell would his first post be exactly like his first post before the reset?!?!  No one should b making the same post over again....that would just be scummy
.  That being said, the arguments I have against spiritbears are softer ones than the argument that a soft VT claim implies scum, so I rated him lower than mc.

Third: liopoil.  It kind of feels like the below quote is to the detriment of our game, if RVS was useful in the first iteration, why wouldn't it be useful in the fresh game?  We've lost effectively all knowledge gained from the prior game other than perhaps something to compare posters to, so I don't understand why a little RVS wouldn't simply garner us additional information.  That said, this is (in my mind) still a very weak argument, but made him less neutral in my head compared to those who I didn't list.
Quote from: liopoil
I feel like the incident was handled well. You can't just kick out Yuma for accidentally seeing whatever he saw. It sucks for Spiritbears and Robz888 because they lost a chance to be scum (if they're town this time), and any PRs too. But reset was really the only option I can think of besides Yuma being replaced. And how would shraeye explain the need for Yuma to be replaced? He couldn't say that he found out someone's alignment, because that means that he was town (scum already know everyone's alignment).

anyway, it's good to be back, that lull was boooooring!

I'm fine with skipping RVS, we did that last time, no need to do it again.

Does that clear up my position at all?

liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #265 on: June 22, 2013, 04:57:31 pm »

I don't think RVS helped us last time...

apart from that, very nice post. I think saying that mcmc claimed VT is an exaggeration.
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #266 on: June 22, 2013, 06:37:18 pm »

I'm not covering for a Vt claim. I'm saying it Isnt a Vt claim.
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #267 on: June 22, 2013, 06:38:37 pm »

Is that vote count actually right? I didn't see mc vote for himself and can't fathom a situation where he would....
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #268 on: June 22, 2013, 06:41:46 pm »

Is that vote count actually right? I didn't see mc vote for himself and can't fathom a situation where he would....

I think robz and mcmc should be swtiched. 
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #269 on: June 22, 2013, 08:09:35 pm »

couple of things:

First about mcmc's post:

Well now, I was very excited to actually get to do something with my awesome pr for once and no I don't get too so I understand the frustration. I did notice robz could have been playing it up, in fact I think he was playing up the frustration(the posting about felt out of character) I'm just not sure that means he's scum again.

People are calling this out as a VT-claim. It obviously isn't a claim. If anything it is a mistake saying that he is no longer able to use his PRs... But more importantly I now have a huge townread on him. Because I do think it is a mistake and it is a mistake that only town could do. If mcmc is mafia in this situation he is automatically going to be thinking about PRs... because if he is mafia he has cool prs this game--NKs!!! what is cooler than that--so he wouldn't be able to make that mistake and say that he had nothing awesome going on. As town, it is a very easy mistake to make. I don't mind talking about it, because hey... it is out there. Mafia obviously saw it and I am not pointing anything out that is new. It sucks a bit because we have one less person that could be a NK thus making their NKs perhaps slightly more effective. But I think it was worth it in the end, because I now strongly think that mcmc is town. Top town read for me at this point..

Thus I am now pretty suspicious of people who voted for mcmc.... lio, robz, nkirtib and chairs.

Lio voted, but not about the claim.
Robz has a policy vote... I get policy votes... I do them for self voting, but they are also a good place to cover yourself. I have voted for someone as mafia for self voting and it was nice because I could hide my vote that way.
nkirbit's is also a policy vote apparently, but he doesn't have the history of policy voting in such a way.
chairs.... his vote is the most suspicious.

This is why he thinks mcmc is suspicious:
Quote
First off: mcmcsalot seems to be making a VT claim in what I had quoted; as there's no reason to make a VT claim ever, it seems reasonable to believe that he is more likely than not scum.  As this is Day 1, my normal strategy (with folks that I play with IRL) is to head towards a no-lynch, but as I've been advised this is a terrible idea in practice by folks who have played this game more often than myself, I felt that as the one who the argument could be made most strongly for, he'd have my vote.  That being said, forum Mafia's a bit of a different beast than I'm used to (we're making decisions in days, rather than minutes) so I can see the justification/argument made for an Unvote until we can attempt to gather more evidence.

Lots of text... He starts off talking about mcmc, but doens't expalin why it makes him more likely to be scum but in the end says very little of the paragraph about mcmc.  I have done this before as mafia. Where I start out with a read and end up moving the topic of conversation away from that read within the paragraph... why? Because I actually don't have anything there and it is hard to make stuff up... so I just talk and talk and hope that no one notices that I am no longer talking about mcmc anymore...

and then there is this:
Well that's too quick of a wagon for him to be scum. Although that was a suspicious post.

This screams to me of mail-mi trying to get on the town side of mcmc's future flip (I think he will flip town, I think mail-mi perhaps knows he will flip town) but at the same time slightly advocating the votes and the lynch by admitting that it was a suspicious post.. (it wasn't...)

so right now I am most suspicious of mail-mi and chairs...

I'll vote for either... vote: mail-mi
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #270 on: June 22, 2013, 08:36:56 pm »

Vote: chairs

His mcmc voted struck me as wagoning, and was a little dangerous. Yeah, I didn't really think mcmc was claiming VT, I just wanted to gauge reactions. And we got one: a scummy one, from chairs.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #271 on: June 22, 2013, 09:51:21 pm »

Why do you think Yuma is scummy?

On further inspection, the scummy post from Yuma was in the prior game.  Thanks for asking for the clarification!

Vote: mcmcsalot

which post was it from the previous game?

Are we allowed to ask things about that? I can't think of a reason why not... but don't want to go into forbidden territory unawares...
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chairs

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #272 on: June 22, 2013, 11:43:50 pm »

Why do you think Yuma is scummy?

On further inspection, the scummy post from Yuma was in the prior game.  Thanks for asking for the clarification!

Vote: mcmcsalot

which post was it from the previous game?

Are we allowed to ask things about that? I can't think of a reason why not... but don't want to go into forbidden territory unawares...

TBH I don't recall, when I went back to find it and noticed I hadn't found it by beginning of fresh copy, I scrapped looking for it again and withdrew my statement.

spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #273 on: June 23, 2013, 08:09:04 am »

I really have to wonder about chairs.  Not just the folding kind.  But the kind here that keep bringing up a scummy move, even after they have been told we view it as beneficial to scum not town....trying too hard to make mc look scummy while deflecting it's (are chairs of the male persuasion?) scummiwh move (working toward no-lynch).
vote chase lounges
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #274 on: June 23, 2013, 09:10:55 am »

I don't think Chairs is working towards a no-lynch, once he realized we were all opposed to it.

Coming into a mafia game, it doesn't seem like the most ridiculous idea, either.  We have little information, wait for a kill, etc. etc.  But I don't get the sense that he's pushing for the no-lynch at all, SB.
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