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Author Topic: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 3)  (Read 29190 times)

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mail-mi

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #100 on: June 17, 2013, 11:19:52 pm »

I definitely agree with getting us out of vla quickly and down to scum hunting. I just don't know lio that well, so I'm wondering whether that's a good read on his metta. Mai seems to think so, but then inexplicably votes chairs!?!
Eh, vote: chairs is just for fun. I mean, what's not fun about vote:ing chairs?
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #101 on: June 17, 2013, 11:43:59 pm »

Vote Count 1.3

chairs (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): chairs
Voltaire (1): liopoil
spiritbears (1): Voltaire
liopoil (1): yuma

Not voting: mcmcsalot, nkirbit, Robz888, spiritbears
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #102 on: June 18, 2013, 08:16:55 am »

Hm. Liopoil.

Do you know what I am going to say about you?
hmmm. I don't. Now I'm curious. What are you going to say to me?

Do you really not see it? You're behavior is extremely off. You're very jokey and smiley. Obviously, you aren't the only one, but I think of you generally as a more serious player.
I am generally more serious, see my first post of this day. That post said all the serious stuff I have to say right now. After that, I just talked and was "jokey and smiley" because I had nothing to say. I assure you as soon as there's stuff to talk about (like right now) I'm gonna "put my game face on".
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #103 on: June 18, 2013, 08:19:44 am »

In fact, I think if you look at the one game where I was scum I was especially reserved. Obviously I will probably try to play differently the next time I am scum though...

Unvote
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #104 on: June 18, 2013, 09:52:18 am »

OK, cool, no more RVS. unvote. I do not, however, know lio enough to know if this is a change.
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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #105 on: June 18, 2013, 09:58:03 am »

OK, cool, no more RVS. unvote. I do not, however, know lio enough to know if this is a change.
I agree.  I really don't know if lio wss being "jokey" just for fun or whether he's scum!lio trying to switch up his game. So I'm just going to keep an eye on him for now
But where the hell is MC!!! Hey man don't lurk! We could reslly use you in here.... (Unless your scum!)
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #106 on: June 18, 2013, 10:52:36 am »

OK, cool, no more RVS. unvote. I do not, however, know lio enough to know if this is a change.
I agree.  I really don't know if lio wss being "jokey" just for fun or whether he's scum!lio trying to switch up his game. So I'm just going to keep an eye on him for now
But where the hell is MC!!! Hey man don't lurk! We could reslly use you in here.... (Unless your scum!)
Actually then he should just stay away, and then we can lynch lurkers, and it's realllllllllly simple.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #107 on: June 18, 2013, 11:18:35 am »

Okay, I'm here, going to vote:yuma. As I was reading everything at once a few things struck me.

Town:
Robz - Number one thing I look for when I am looking for town!robz is his do something and wait for people to jump on it in a way that is advantageous for scum(and thus the player is more likely to be scum)

Spiritbears - So going to be screwed once this guy is scum, hes gotten good enough at this game that his usual content is really townie but I think could be faked. But for now the town read stands.

Slight Town:
Chairs - He has handled himself very well in the beginning, something I think is difficult for first timers as mafia(I now it was for me) so to clarify what I was looking for was a "what should I be doing" attitude and I think he was coming up with ideas and original content posts(not just commenting on others thoughts). The reason he is not town is this little piece here
I'm still afraid my relative shobon status to what's apparently a pretty developed theory of Mafia has me throwing massive (and inaccurate) tells :(
Quote
Being worried about people thinking your scum and feeling the need to vocalize that is a typically scum trait. Now I think recently town has shot itself in the foot using these type of posts as bulletproof ways to "catch" scum and allow actually scum to push things hard without repercussions. We gotta get back to noting its something that has been done and noting it helps develop a scum!chairs narrative, but it doesn't mean he's auto scum.

Null:
nrkbit - has one post so far.
voltaire - has 4 posts, mainly rvs.

Slight Scum:
liopoil - As well as being jokey and smiley he has also been driving conversations and posting a fair bit of original content. The reason he is a slight scum read instead of town is that his first post was far to "aware" to give him town status at this point.
In previous games, I've gotten too caught up in theory talk and didn't do enough scumhunting. I dislike D1 because there is so little of any material at all, so that's part of why I don't scumhunt as much. I have also somehow generally been in the top few posters at all times during games. I'm not sure why that is, we'll see if it continues. I think I've been accused of trying to inflate my postcount before by posting multiple things that could have just been one post.
This post is completely covering his tracks and saying hey you shouldn't find me scummy for X Y and Z.


Scum:
Mail-mi - I think anti town players are a good place to look for scum, mail has done nothing but extend rvs as well as inflate his post count(which should be zero based on content) he even went as far as to quote an interaction between other players and say it doesn't matter its rvs.

Yuma - Remember how I said town!robz tries to see who will jump on his vote in a scummy way. Let me show the way I usually cast votes as scum and try to help explain what I mean by a scummy vote. As scum I look for 4 things before I vote; 1) has the player done something that could be construed as scummy without need for concrete facts; 2) Am I the only one, or one of a select few who has pointed this out; 3) Can I get enough people to vote with me for a lynch; 4) Is this going to look bad on my when that player flips town. Now lets apply that to yuma and liopoil, he is suspected for having too jokey of posts(not concrete), robz pointed this out but noone else so yuma gets to be early on the wagon in a safe position, I have a history of finding liopoil scummy, yuma and robz are vets thus their opinions are valued, i think it would be easy to get 2 people after a robz/yuma/mcmc wagon, finally it's D1/robz started the wagon/those 2 that hop on the end of wagon will come under the most suspicion/ yuma will not look bad at all after the flip.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #108 on: June 18, 2013, 11:20:16 am »

Okay, I'm here, going to vote:yuma. As I was reading everything at once a few things struck me.

Town:
Robz - Number one thing I look for when I am looking for town!robz is his do something and wait for people to jump on it in a way that is advantageous for scum(and thus the player is more likely to be scum)

Spiritbears - So going to be screwed once this guy is scum, hes gotten good enough at this game that his usual content is really townie but I think could be faked. But for now the town read stands.

Slight Town:
Chairs - He has handled himself very well in the beginning, something I think is difficult for first timers as mafia(I now it was for me) so to clarify what I was looking for was a "what should I be doing" attitude and I think he was coming up with ideas and original content posts(not just commenting on others thoughts). The reason he is not town is this little piece here
I'm still afraid my relative shobon status to what's apparently a pretty developed theory of Mafia has me throwing massive (and inaccurate) tells :(
Being worried about people thinking your scum and feeling the need to vocalize that is a typically scum trait. Now I think recently town has shot itself in the foot using these type of posts as bulletproof ways to "catch" scum and allow actually scum to push things hard without repercussions. We gotta get back to noting its something that has been done and noting it helps develop a scum!chairs narrative, but it doesn't mean he's auto scum.

Null:
nrkbit - has one post so far.
voltaire - has 4 posts, mainly rvs.

Slight Scum:
liopoil - As well as being jokey and smiley he has also been driving conversations and posting a fair bit of original content. The reason he is a slight scum read instead of town is that his first post was far to "aware" to give him town status at this point.
In previous games, I've gotten too caught up in theory talk and didn't do enough scumhunting. I dislike D1 because there is so little of any material at all, so that's part of why I don't scumhunt as much. I have also somehow generally been in the top few posters at all times during games. I'm not sure why that is, we'll see if it continues. I think I've been accused of trying to inflate my postcount before by posting multiple things that could have just been one post.
This post is completely covering his tracks and saying hey you shouldn't find me scummy for X Y and Z.

Scum:
Mail-mi - I think anti town players are a good place to look for scum, mail has done nothing but extend rvs as well as inflate his post count(which should be zero based on content) he even went as far as to quote an interaction between other players and say it doesn't matter its rvs.

Yuma - Remember how I said town!robz tries to see who will jump on his vote in a scummy way. Let me show the way I usually cast votes as scum and try to help explain what I mean by a scummy vote. As scum I look for 4 things before I vote; 1) has the player done something that could be construed as scummy without need for concrete facts; 2) Am I the only one, or one of a select few who has pointed this out; 3) Can I get enough people to vote with me for a lynch; 4) Is this going to look bad on my when that player flips town. Now lets apply that to yuma and liopoil, he is suspected for having too jokey of posts(not concrete), robz pointed this out but noone else so yuma gets to be early on the wagon in a safe position, I have a history of finding liopoil scummy, yuma and robz are vets thus their opinions are valued, i think it would be easy to get 2 people after a robz/yuma/mcmc wagon, finally it's D1/robz started the wagon/those 2 that hop on the end of wagon will come under the most suspicion/ yuma will not look bad at all after the flip.

Fixed formatting
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #109 on: June 18, 2013, 11:41:54 am »

Okay, I'm here, going to vote:yuma. As I was reading everything at once a few things struck me.
[big snip]
Yuma - Remember how I said town!robz tries to see who will jump on his vote in a scummy way. Let me show the way I usually cast votes as scum and try to help explain what I mean by a scummy vote. As scum I look for 4 things before I vote; 1) has the player done something that could be construed as scummy without need for concrete facts; 2) Am I the only one, or one of a select few who has pointed this out; 3) Can I get enough people to vote with me for a lynch; 4) Is this going to look bad on my when that player flips town. Now lets apply that to yuma and liopoil, he is suspected for having too jokey of posts(not concrete), robz pointed this out but noone else so yuma gets to be early on the wagon in a safe position, I have a history of finding liopoil scummy, yuma and robz are vets thus their opinions are valued, i think it would be easy to get 2 people after a robz/yuma/mcmc wagon, finally it's D1/robz started the wagon/those 2 that hop on the end of wagon will come under the most suspicion/ yuma will not look bad at all after the flip.
Is your vote on Yuma RVS or based on this case? Since it came at the top of the post and your yuma read at the bottom, I want to make sure (I assume it is case-based).
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chairs

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #110 on: June 18, 2013, 11:54:28 am »

So what I'm hearing is that my kneejerk "vote: mail-mi" reaction is completely justified.

mcmcsalot

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #111 on: June 18, 2013, 11:58:05 am »

Okay, I'm here, going to vote:yuma. As I was reading everything at once a few things struck me.
[big snip]
Yuma - Remember how I said town!robz tries to see who will jump on his vote in a scummy way. Let me show the way I usually cast votes as scum and try to help explain what I mean by a scummy vote. As scum I look for 4 things before I vote; 1) has the player done something that could be construed as scummy without need for concrete facts; 2) Am I the only one, or one of a select few who has pointed this out; 3) Can I get enough people to vote with me for a lynch; 4) Is this going to look bad on my when that player flips town. Now lets apply that to yuma and liopoil, he is suspected for having too jokey of posts(not concrete), robz pointed this out but noone else so yuma gets to be early on the wagon in a safe position, I have a history of finding liopoil scummy, yuma and robz are vets thus their opinions are valued, i think it would be easy to get 2 people after a robz/yuma/mcmc wagon, finally it's D1/robz started the wagon/those 2 that hop on the end of wagon will come under the most suspicion/ yuma will not look bad at all after the flip.
Is your vote on Yuma RVS or based on this case? Since it came at the top of the post and your yuma read at the bottom, I want to make sure (I assume it is case-based).

Yes, 100% based on the case.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #112 on: June 18, 2013, 12:20:28 pm »

See...this is exactly why im glad mc made or in. He really does scum hunt like no one else I know.

I'm having a very hard time typing today (for those here that dont know me, I'm disabled and have pretty limited use of my hands. I try to type on a phone, but sometimes even that is too much. I have s hard time correcting my posts so please forgive my many typos. I'm not lazy, I try my best)

I think mc may be right about Yuma.  And town read on mc. Bigtime
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #113 on: June 18, 2013, 12:22:59 pm »

So what I'm hearing is that my kneejerk "vote: mail-mi" reaction is completely justified.
I think it was just omgus...retaliation
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #114 on: June 18, 2013, 12:27:27 pm »

It is a little odd that Lio had to announce that he was going to scum hunt more this game as opposed to just, you know, doing it.  I'm not sure that's necessarily scummy though.. Trying different things in different games can be a good idea, and making it clear that's what you're going to do is not a bad idea.  So maybe it's not that odd
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spiritbears

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #115 on: June 18, 2013, 12:30:27 pm »

Nk-- whst about the quote mc pointed out about lio. Do you think that was scummy?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #116 on: June 18, 2013, 12:35:15 pm »

I'm really confused by what mcmc said. I don't get it at all, actually. Looks like I find lio scummy, yuma agrees and votes, and that makes me town, yuma scum, and lio?? In mcmc's view. I don't follow.

So, I don't get why yuma comes off looking the most scummy here, from your perspective. Or why I look like town to you, actually.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #117 on: June 18, 2013, 12:36:07 pm »

Hm. Liopoil.

Do you know what I am going to say about you?
hmmm. I don't. Now I'm curious. What are you going to say to me?

Do you really not see it? You're behavior is extremely off. You're very jokey and smiley. Obviously, you aren't the only one, but I think of you generally as a more serious player.
I am generally more serious, see my first post of this day. That post said all the serious stuff I have to say right now. After that, I just talked and was "jokey and smiley" because I had nothing to say. I assure you as soon as there's stuff to talk about (like right now) I'm gonna "put my game face on".

If you have nothing to say, say nothing. Scum feel pressure to talk anyway, and so they resort to jokey an smiley, you see? (That's been my theory forever, at least. It could be wrong.)
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #118 on: June 18, 2013, 12:37:06 pm »

In fact, I think if you look at the one game where I was scum I was especially reserved. Obviously I will probably try to play differently the next time I am scum though...

Unvote

You were pretty non-jokey in Mafia XIX, when you were town. That's like my main game of reference on you. And I don't remember you being silly in XXIII, when you were also town.
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #119 on: June 18, 2013, 12:37:53 pm »

Robz - because one of mcmcs scum criterion is to jump on a case that others support. You didn't do that, but Yuma did. I wouldn't apply that this early day1, but that's probably what mcmc is thinking
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Voltaire

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #120 on: June 18, 2013, 12:38:18 pm »

Hm. Liopoil.

Do you know what I am going to say about you?
hmmm. I don't. Now I'm curious. What are you going to say to me?

Do you really not see it? You're behavior is extremely off. You're very jokey and smiley. Obviously, you aren't the only one, but I think of you generally as a more serious player.
I am generally more serious, see my first post of this day. That post said all the serious stuff I have to say right now. After that, I just talked and was "jokey and smiley" because I had nothing to say. I assure you as soon as there's stuff to talk about (like right now) I'm gonna "put my game face on".

If you have nothing to say, say nothing. Scum feel pressure to talk anyway, and so they resort to jokey an smiley, you see? (That's been my theory forever, at least. It could be wrong.)
It's not foolproof. I had no idea of what to say early on, so I voted for everyone and yadayadayada. Then you got the game started properly. So now we have stuff to do. Like reply to mcmc's post, which I will do in a bit.
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #121 on: June 18, 2013, 12:41:13 pm »

I don't think it necessarily has to be, sb.  I don't subscribe to the school of thought that preemptively defending yourself = scum.  I think both scum and town could do something like that.
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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #122 on: June 18, 2013, 12:41:44 pm »

OH, I get what mcmc is saying now. Mcmc is analyzing what yuma did from the perpsective of whether mcmc would do that as scum.

Yeah. Not buying the case at all, though. I think mcmc's scum voting explanation maybe makes sense when scum is deciding about a serious vote, but these early votes, even when informed by real evidence, are pretty unaccountable. So it's not like scum has to worry too much about making the wrong vote here. I don't see it as very opportunistic.
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nkirbit

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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #123 on: June 18, 2013, 12:42:25 pm »

Oh and Nk---still glowing on that perfect blitz!

I just now saw this :). Me too.
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Re: Mafia XXVI: Back to Basics (Day 1 start)
« Reply #124 on: June 18, 2013, 12:44:22 pm »

I agree with you, robz. It's just too early for a vote like that to matter... I think it's a good metric, but scum aren't going to do it this early without having a broader knowledge of what people would or wouldn't support and a better case to make
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