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Author Topic: Preview #1: Baker  (Read 61994 times)

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Davio

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #200 on: June 05, 2013, 02:59:30 am »
0

True, but coin tokens are cooler.

Definitely. I was just saying maybe there is something wrong with getting +$ on a Reaction other than the specific mechanic to get the +$.

Possible, but I doubt it. I'm guessing that coin tokens are the cleanest way to do it and therefore I'm really hoping we'll see such a Reaction.
I like this idea and the card can be pretty straightforward: Okay, the attack (or whatever it reacts to) happens, but you get a Coin in return, that's not so bad.

You could tack all sorts of things onto the Action part.

About the art: I don't think it's bad, I would like it if it were a card from another game, but it just doesn't fit in well with the rest.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2013, 03:17:03 am by Davio »
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brokoli

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #201 on: June 05, 2013, 05:15:53 am »
+2

Well, I like what Lynell Ingram did for princess, but sorry baker is just awful. Cartoon art can be great, but not in that "amateur" way.
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RTT

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #202 on: June 05, 2013, 05:56:52 pm »
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I just played a game with baker.
we took the treassury instead and the pirate ship tokens.
it was pretty fun.

there was allways the temptation to save the coins for later and build up a bigger amount of them as well as allways having some in petto.

we are just too economical =)
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Qvist

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #203 on: June 06, 2013, 07:40:56 am »
+4

Previews are out and I missed it. :(

Time to catch up.  :D Most of the things were probably already mentioned, but I just mention what I notice.

At first the card seemed boring, too vanilla, but the more I thought about it, it's a great card and I'm excited to play with it.

I think Baker is much stronger than Treasury and Market, not a power $5 though, but for certain above average, maybe on par with Highway if you compare all those Peddler variants.
Saving coins is a huge benefit, more than some people might realize. I think it will fit great in both engines and BM-ish strategies and will perform similar to Bandit Camp which might be the most comparable card. Pure Baker-BM is probably not super strong, but on weak boards still not ignorable, I think.

Let's have a look at some interactions. The virtual money might be good in getting to Grand Markets as you can buy one with 2 Silvers and 2 tokens now. It's of course great with Tactician as you can play it when you discard your hand and save the coins for later. I think in slower games with strong attacks it might be pretty good too as you can play it after were hit by a Ghost Ship and save the coin for later. In cursing games you can get to crucial cards and late Provinces also more easily. Although it could even out the money in Duke games, I don't think it will be great in Alt-VP games as it has a high opportunity cost. Maybe one copy early is great, though. Still, this makes it a very good versatile card in general.

Now about the setup instructions: Wow, what a game changer. It has a great impact to the game and especially to the opening buys although you might end up never even buying it. Now you could open $4/$4, so maybe Double Sea Hag, and wow Double Treasure Map, maybe even Double Potion on a Scrying Pool or University game. What do you think about double Remake? Also, you are guaranteed a crucial $5 with Baker on the board (with Baker probably not being one itself) and aren't screwed with no $2s on the board. Also you could now open with Goons, Altar or Hunting Grounds or Hoard and of course Gold!

Even after one card spoiled I agree with Donald X. that this seems the most skill-intensive expansion. Let's say you have $5 and at least 3 coin tokens. Do you buy another Baker, a Gold or a Province? For that you have to take into account the composition of your deck, your position in the current shuffle and the current turn number. I like that focus in skill although I dislike that games with Baker or other coin token cards will or might slow down games as you have so much more options each turn.

Other stuff: The art is horrible (sorry!) and the expansion icon is a sextant (?). Maybe a card named Astronomer will come out!?

brokoli

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #204 on: June 06, 2013, 08:49:46 am »
+1

Baker will be excellent for edge cases.
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Just a Rube

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #205 on: June 06, 2013, 12:42:15 pm »
0


Other stuff: The art is horrible (sorry!) and the expansion icon is a sextant (?). Maybe a card named Astronomer will come out!?
Expansion icon appears to be a compass, which is the symbol of the Freemasons. As such, and since "Mason" is certainly a reasonable occupation to be a guild, I expect to see a "Mason" card, or at least (to follow-up the Simpson's reference in the flavor paragraph) a "Stone-cutter"
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RD

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #206 on: June 06, 2013, 01:54:12 pm »
+1

Qvist's Ghost Ship talk gets me thinking about an interesting (semi-)subtlety about Baker and probably coin token producers in general.

You never want to put Baker off for next turn, because hey you can still spend the coin next turn if you really want, so you're only restricting your options. Edge cases aside, you would always rather play it this turn or else you don't care. Okay most non-junk cards are better earlier than later, because you want to get them in before the next reshuffle. But Baker goes beyond that: it's considerably stronger on T3 than T4 in a way most cards aren't. (In fact if you open Baker/nothing, a T3 Baker guarantees a $5 turn.)

Does this mean that Baker is a deceptively strong target for Scheme, Scav, etc? Guess we'll see.
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StrongRhino

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #207 on: June 06, 2013, 08:15:44 pm »
+1

I just played this in a proxied up Guilds game, and wow it is good in terminal non-draw BM (specifically Merchant Ship). I crushed, the tokens helped so much, especially in the end game.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #208 on: June 09, 2013, 04:55:52 pm »
+5

Interesting note, Pirate Ship is now a card that doesn't fully function just by reading the text on the card.  That's because it says to "take a Coin token" but says nothing about putting it on the PS mat.  Without clarification from the rulebooks, you might expect to be able to spend the coin tokens taken by PS like you would spend the coin tokens received through Baker.  However, the text on the cards does not allow the reverse to happen; you would not expect that playing Butcher would increase the value of your Pirate Ships by $2 because the card specifies that it only counts coin tokens taking by PS itself.
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SirPeebles

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #209 on: June 09, 2013, 06:51:18 pm »
+3

Interesting note, Pirate Ship is now a card that doesn't fully function just by reading the text on the card.  That's because it says to "take a Coin token" but says nothing about putting it on the PS mat.  Without clarification from the rulebooks, you might expect to be able to spend the coin tokens taken by PS like you would spend the coin tokens received through Baker.  However, the text on the cards does not allow the reverse to happen; you would not expect that playing Butcher would increase the value of your Pirate Ships by $2 because the card specifies that it only counts coin tokens taking by PS itself.

Man, you could even spend those coin tokens without weakening your Pirate Ships.
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microman

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #210 on: June 09, 2013, 07:18:48 pm »
0

Well, I like what Lynell Ingram did for princess, but sorry baker is just awful. Cartoon art can be great, but not in that "amateur" way.
As horrible as some of this art is, I am just glad that guilds is finally here, and the cards are as sweet as they are.  Should be really fun cards, that also make you think about every card in your deck and where they are.  Super excited!
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RD

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #211 on: June 12, 2013, 10:16:46 am »
0

Interesting note, Pirate Ship is now a card that doesn't fully function just by reading the text on the card.  That's because it says to "take a Coin token" but says nothing about putting it on the PS mat.  Without clarification from the rulebooks, you might expect to be able to spend the coin tokens taken by PS like you would spend the coin tokens received through Baker.  However, the text on the cards does not allow the reverse to happen; you would not expect that playing Butcher would increase the value of your Pirate Ships by $2 because the card specifies that it only counts coin tokens taking by PS itself.

Man, you could even spend those coin tokens without weakening your Pirate Ships.

Hilariously enough, if you're a person who thinks Pirate Ship needs to be buffed then this might be about right. (I'm not one of those people though.)
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Pikanto

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #212 on: June 21, 2013, 12:44:50 pm »
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I don't have guilds yet, but when i saw the setup for baker, i was like "hey, we could play dominion irl and everyone gets a coin token that's usually used for pirate ship or trade route, and start the game from there!" :-)

I will get the german edition of it when it gets released, but cornucopia and intrigue first
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enfynet

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #213 on: June 21, 2013, 04:31:23 pm »
0

Interesting note, Pirate Ship is now a card that doesn't fully function just by reading the text on the card.  That's because it says to "take a Coin token" but says nothing about putting it on the PS mat.  Without clarification from the rulebooks, you might expect to be able to spend the coin tokens taken by PS like you would spend the coin tokens received through Baker.  However, the text on the cards does not allow the reverse to happen; you would not expect that playing Butcher would increase the value of your Pirate Ships by $2 because the card specifies that it only counts coin tokens taking by PS itself.
Man, you could even spend those coin tokens without weakening your Pirate Ships.
I want to try this just to see how obnoxious it gets...
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greatexpectations

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Re: Preview #1: Baker
« Reply #214 on: June 29, 2013, 03:39:14 pm »
0

baker's interaction with mint was discussed earlier in the thread in the context of fool's gold, but i think that the starting coin token has the power to make run of the mill mint openings far more powerful. being able to open mint/silver with either 4/3 or 5/2 strikes me as being quite useful. i would be curious to hear what the simulators have to say about whether baker's boost to simple mint strategies is able to offset it's boost to other strategies on the board.
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