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Author Topic: Is border village a trap?  (Read 8859 times)

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painted_cow

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #25 on: November 03, 2011, 03:04:02 pm »
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I mean how can Border Village be a trap??? Its such a great card, that gives me the good 5s and a village. When I have 6 cash I will go for the good 5 card anyway and get a Village for free. Allowing some 3-pile-endings is just the icing on the cake :-) 
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Davio

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #26 on: November 03, 2011, 05:00:32 pm »
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Border Village + Wharf killed me last night.

I was dorking around with just Wharf and Tournament, I landed the Trust Steed, but it was way to late. He murdered me. Actually Tournament is a card I've NEVER won with. NEVER. Weird huh? Buying it too early I guess, or simply not reading the board right when its there.
I think a lot of people make the mistake of grabbing the Trusty Steed automatically, also in cases when any of the other cards is better. And then they use it for +2 Cards / +2 Actions and draw some crap and have no more Action cards...

Border Village can easily be a trap, because you're forgoing Gold. This can be good for critical early $5's like Mountebank, but later in the game and close to a reshuffle there are a lot of times you're better off taking the Gold.
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ChaosRed

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #27 on: November 03, 2011, 05:23:38 pm »
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As an aside, I think its that Tournament is a curse for me. I bought Tournament before my opponent, right after I bought a Province (which I bought before him). I had 3 Provinces in my hand fairly early, do you think I could get Tournament and Province together? Nope, not even with a Village+Smithy in my deck. Opponent had all the prizes and killed me in the later rounds. Another ChaosRed defeat :) But let's not dwell on that, I have learned I am just bad playing on isotropic. The pace is too fast, the boards are overwhelming and diverse and many of the players are impatient.

It's a shark tank. I enjoy it, but I can't last long there, two games and I'm so demoralized, I go back to playing with friends and family. :)

Border Village is great when there's a superb 5 terminal on the board. Even Border Village+a free Smithy is a nice trade, because you didn't need the +buy to get both of those complimentary cards. It's a fun card, balanced and well-thought out.

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popsofctown

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #28 on: November 03, 2011, 06:53:56 pm »
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Wow, ehunt was the one who made this thread??

I got tempted by a border village in a tournament match against ehunt.  I thought about this thread trying to talk myself out of it, but I failed.  If I'd known ehunt had made this thread it probably would have been too ironic for me to make the mistake.


I made lots of mistakes that game though. 
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Jack Rudd

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #29 on: November 03, 2011, 07:40:04 pm »
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Border Village is great when there's a superb 5 terminal on the board. Even Border Village+a free Smithy is a nice trade, because you didn't need the +buy to get both of those complimentary cards.
As an aside, that should be complementary. The Smithy is the only one of those cards that is complimentary; you had to pay for the Border Village.  :D
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theory

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #30 on: November 03, 2011, 07:58:45 pm »
+4

He's just referring to the fact that his Smithies and Border Villages praise his good looks whenever he plays them.
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ChaosRed

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #31 on: November 04, 2011, 12:06:21 am »
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Heh, my apologies for the typo, in my defense I can show you threads I had written earlier where I used the correct spelling. Damn homonyms.
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guided

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #32 on: November 04, 2011, 06:03:15 am »
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Homophones ;)
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Jimmmmm

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #33 on: November 04, 2011, 09:15:19 am »
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Which are a type of homonym. :P
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LastFootnote

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #34 on: November 04, 2011, 12:36:16 pm »
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No, homonyms are a subset of homophones, not the other way around.
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ChaosRed

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #35 on: November 04, 2011, 01:10:47 pm »
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Wow, I mistype one letter and suddenly the thread is ruined. Is it possible I am akin to that purple card in a very special, cleverly-designed card game?

What must I do to atone? :)

For the record, homonym is correct, if you aren't overly technical or pedantic.

Also, perhaps I was just saying that the second card was free?

Quote
Even Border Village+a free Smithy is a nice trade, because you didn't need the +buy to get both of those complimentary cards.

Definition of COMPLIMENTARY

1 a : expressing praise or admiration : expressing or containing a compliment <a complimentary remark>
   b : favorable <the novel received complimentary reviews>

2 : given free as a courtesy or favor <complimentary tickets>

To be fair, I wasn't using it in this context, I meant to use complementary, a word I had used correctly in other threads before this one.

Homonyms 1: This Thread: 0

And I'll do push-ups for penance if you think it will help. :)
« Last Edit: November 04, 2011, 01:13:06 pm by ChaosRed »
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guided

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #36 on: November 04, 2011, 01:27:57 pm »
0

Wow, I mistype one letter and suddenly the thread is ruined. Is it possible I am akin to that purple card in a very special, cleverly-designed card game?
Dude I am just messing around. I promise you I am in no actual way bothered by any of the technical English mistakes you have made ITT.
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ChaosRed

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #37 on: November 04, 2011, 01:29:50 pm »
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I should have put more smilies in my last post to make the tone of the post more obvious. :)
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ehunt

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #38 on: November 04, 2011, 01:39:10 pm »
+1

@pops I think the consensus is (and I now think) that I was pretty wrong - BV is not a trap and there are many 5-cost cards satisfying my condition that

card < gold < card + free village

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popsofctown

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #39 on: November 04, 2011, 05:29:50 pm »
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Dude I BVed a city in a Jack game.


There's no forgiveness in heaven or hell for that.
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biopower

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #40 on: November 04, 2011, 10:32:19 pm »
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Wow, I mistype one letter and suddenly the thread is ruined. Is it possible I am akin to that purple card in a very special, cleverly-designed card game?

YuGiOh? :P
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kn1tt3r

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #41 on: November 26, 2011, 07:03:52 am »
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Border Village is also a great defence against Swindler. Swindle it into a Gold? Or another Border Village plus a $5 card?
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popsofctown

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #42 on: November 28, 2011, 01:36:17 am »
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I dunno.  You probably gained a 5$ action with your BV, and those are an especially vulnerable class of card. 
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dondon151

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #43 on: November 28, 2011, 01:46:28 am »
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Border Village is also a great defence against Swindler. Swindle it into a Gold? Or another Border Village plus a $5 card?

BV is about as good of a defense against Swindler as Gold is.

Which is to say, it's about the same as Gold. I mean, if I'd be leery of hitting your Golds if BV and a decent $5 card were in the kingdom.
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Kahryl

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #44 on: November 28, 2011, 01:04:22 pm »
+1

Border Village is also a great defence against Swindler. Swindle it into a Gold? Or another Border Village plus a $5 card?

BV is about as good of a defense against Swindler as Gold is.

Which is to say, it's about the same as Gold. I mean, if I'd be leery of hitting your Golds if BV and a decent $5 card were in the kingdom.

I think what he's saying is: if you swindle a gold, you can always just turn it into another gold.  Doesn't hurt your opponent and doesn't help him either (plus he just effectively discarded a gold)

If you swindle a border village, then you either have to turn it into another border village - giving your opponent a free $5 card - or turn what is effectively a $3-value village into a $6 value gold.  Either way your opponent wins big.
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popsofctown

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #45 on: November 29, 2011, 02:03:28 am »
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Close inspection of dondon's post leads me to believe he's had a mental slip and thought the victim chooses the replacement card.  So maybe he doesn't disagree all that much.
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dondon151

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #46 on: November 29, 2011, 03:05:30 am »
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I, in fact, did not have a mental slip, and knew quite well what I was talking about.

Perhaps you and I have different opinions as to what constitutes a "defense." In a kingdom with BV and Swindler, I'm not going to get BV + $5 card with my $6 purchases just to deter my opponent from playing his Swindler, and if getting BV + $5 card is not as beneficial to my deck as getting a Gold, then I will sure as hell get the Gold, Swindler or not. I don't think it significantly deters anyone from playing Swindler either because in early turns the density of BVs in one's deck is small and Swindler has an equally likely chance to turn that Witch or Wharf into a Duchy.

It certainly puts your opponent in a more awkward position than usual, but BV is not nearly as much of a deterrent to Swindler as Peddler is. And if your opponent is trying to chain BVs with other actions, turning those into Golds instead has the potential to mess him up.
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Tables

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #47 on: November 29, 2011, 12:09:29 pm »
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I think it does serve as a defence, but in general a very minor one. Certainly if your opponent plays Swindler and hits your Border Village, you're very likely to benefit from it, but what's the chance of that happening? Perhaps about 25% of it happening at all as a crude estimate over the course of a game (it depends a lot obviously on many factors)? I'd personally say that's deterrent enough to pick up a Swindler if BV looks good on the board.

As an aside, Hey Dondon. Didn't know you were on here.
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rinkworks

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Re: Is border village a trap?
« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2011, 02:41:05 pm »
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This is a very strange debate to me.  The original claim was that it was a "great defense against Swindler."  While "great" is subjective and therefore unprovable, it doesn't seem very controversial to me that a deck with Border Villages is better off against Swindler than one without.

It doesn't have to be the best defense (i.e., better than Peddler) to be a defense.  It doesn't have to be a deterrent either.  It merely needs to mitigate the damage that Swindler does.  If Swindler is played against a deck with 20% Border Villages, the Swindler will be a significant help, rather than a possibly-significant-but-probably-mild hurt, about 1 out of the 5 times.  That qualifies as mitigating the damage.  Border Village is therefore a defense against Swindler.
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