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[HiveMindEmulator]

I can't believe Black Market is winning. I thought it was the most universally despised Dominion card. The fact that very few people have it is like Goko's one advantage over Isotropic, in fact.

I always got the feeling that the most universally despised cards were Possession, Governor, Tournament, and various attacks. At least that's what I heard people on iso complain about.

Before I played online, I didn't like Black Market, mostly because it was too much trouble to set up. And also because I avoided playing with it, which resulted in me not using it enough to really understand it. But now that I've played with a lot, I really enjoy it.

[Stealth Tomato]

I can't believe Black Market is winning. I thought it was the most universally despised Dominion card. The fact that very few people have it is like Goko's one advantage over Isotropic, in fact.

I think it gets the same sort of love-it-or-hate-it reaction that Goons, Possession, or Tournament does, where a lot of top-flight players despise the luck factor and/or the sheer brokenness of the card in certain situations, while others both top-flight and otherwise enjoy the interesting situations it causes and/or the sheer brokenness of the card in certain situations.

[soulnet]

I like Governor the most, but I find Black Market interesting. Sure, its something with a lot of strange holes, but is interesting, and that's neat for a promo. Much better than Stash, which adds almost nothing interesting to the game, even its good combos with Scavenger or Chancellor are weak.

[StrongRhino]

My favorite is Black Market, it's just so wacky in a fun sort of way. Must admit I have little experience with governor though.

[Witherweaver]

Speaking of Black Market and the weird things it can do, has anyone effectively gotten Black Market + Poor House to work out particularly well?  Seems like it has a high opportunity cost to set up and needs a lot of enablers, but so does Black Market and double Tactician.

[eHalcyon]

Speaking of Black Market and the weird things it can do, has anyone effectively gotten Black Market + Poor House to work out particularly well?  Seems like it has a high opportunity cost to set up and needs a lot of enablers, but so does Black Market and double Tactician.

Black Market + double tac doesn't really need any support other than those two, does it?  BM-PH needs Village support, potentially +Buy as well.  Tactician comes with both already.

[Witherweaver]

Speaking of Black Market and the weird things it can do, has anyone effectively gotten Black Market + Poor House to work out particularly well?  Seems like it has a high opportunity cost to set up and needs a lot of enablers, but so does Black Market and double Tactician.

Black Market + double tac doesn't really need any support other than those two, does it?  BM-PH needs Village support, potentially +Buy as well.  Tactician comes with both already.

Well I meant in terms of opportunity cost.  Though maybe it also needs some kind of drawing/filtering to get it going?  I've never actually done it.

I would think Black Market + Poor House would need some drawing, too.  You need at least village, poor house and black market in hand (or a previous fishing village), as well as some treasure (or else the black market would be moot). And I would think definitely +buy or there wouldn't be a return of investment.

[ftl]

Black Market/Poor House isn't a strategy all on its own. It's a good combination that you can stick into an engine of any sort to provide you with a lot of money, but you need an engine to make it work - so you need all the other components of an engine (villages, card draw, +buy, possibly light trashing to get it going, especially estate trashing. But not heavy trashing like chapel, because then the black market is redundant and you can just trash all your treasures).

[Schlippy]

Black Market, although it could have slightly less swingy implementation, like a seperate BM-deck for every player or something.

[Beyond Awesome]

I am going to guess that Prince will be my favorite promo, but I haven't had a chance to play with like pretty much everyone here. The more and more I play with Envoy though, the more I enjoy it. It is great for both BM and engines. Honestly, since DA came out, I have no idea how to properly play Governor anymore. Black Market is cool, but can also be quite swingy like Tournament.

Stash is meh....
Walled Village is another village, which isn't bad, but not great either.

For now, Envoy is my favorite until I experience playing with Prince.

[silverspawn]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

[SirPeebles]

I am going to guess that Prince will be my favorite promo, but I haven't had a chance to play with like pretty much everyone here. The more and more I play with Envoy though, the more I enjoy it. It is great for both BM and engines. Honestly, since DA came out, I have no idea how to properly play Governor anymore. Black Market is cool, but can also be quite swingy like Tournament.

Stash is meh....
Walled Village is another village, which isn't bad, but not great either.

For now, Envoy is my favorite until I experience playing with Prince.

I suspect that Prince will prove to be the swingiest of all the promos, due to it's highest price (favoring lucky spikes) and the combination of its one shot nature with needing to be paired with an Action card.  Sure, a T3 Rats out of the BM during an otherwise trashless Sea Hag slog may be swingier, but I still see Prince's swinginess being decisive in more games.

[LastFootnote]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

You know what I realized recently? I wish that Walled Village were this:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +2 Actions.
At the start of Clean-up, you may spend an Action put this on top of your deck.

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

[pacovf]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

You know what I realized recently? I wish that Walled Village were this:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +2 Actions.
At the start of Clean-up, you may spend an Action put this on top of your deck.

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

I don't like "spend an action", but that may just be me (also, it might be a bit too crazy with diadem?). What about the wackier and somewhat stronger:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I also like it thematically: the village is staying behind its walls until you call it to your help.

[LastFootnote]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

You know what I realized recently? I wish that Walled Village were this:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +2 Actions.
At the start of Clean-up, you may spend an Action put this on top of your deck.

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

I don't like "spend an action", but that may just be me (also, it might be a bit too crazy with diadem?). What about the wackier and somewhat stronger:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I also like it thematically: the village is staying behind its walls until you call it to your help.

Hmm, I guess that would work pretty well. It wouldn't be as good with Conspirator, Peddler, etc., but whatever. That's a small price to pay for a better effect. The real issue is that you'd probably want a mat for it, since it might be set aside for several turns. And including a mat with a promo is probably not ideal cost-wise. Like, Prince doesn't have a mat, but it effectively becomes one itself once you play it. So with that in mind, I like my version a bit better as a promo. But if it were practical to include a mat, I think I like your version better.

[pacovf]

Good point about the mat!

It's true that my version doesn't work as well with conspirator/peddler/horn of plenty. It does (usually) work better against discarding attacks, so I guess it just depends on whether "spend an action" or "put into play" is wackier. But the mat would definitely help my version...

[SirPeebles]

I think the "spend an action" wording is way more straightforward.  Sure, it is technically a new mechanic, but it is one that is so natural and intuitive that most people would never need to look it up.

[prom_vrt]

I vote Black Market. It is interesting and colourful in casual games with friends where one doesn't mind losing so much. But in competitive play it is much less interesting.

Governor is a very good card for me but I think it's OP since gaining a gold/remodel is self-synergy.

[silverspawn]

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

or even other vw's. yea, I really like your version. I think it would be fine at $4, too. We have wandering minstrel, after all, and that doesn't break the game at 4$ either.

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I don't know, I guess I don't really see the problem with "spend an action". What happens if you procession it? If I understand the lose track rule right, you get +2 card, +2actions, a card costing 5$ but wv isn't trashed?

[pacovf]

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

or even other vw's. yea, I really like your version. I think it would be fine at $4, too. We have wandering minstrel, after all, and that doesn't break the game at 4$ either.

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I don't know, I guess I don't really see the problem with "spend an action". What happens if you procession it? If I understand the lose track rule right, you get +2 card, +2actions, a card costing 5$ but wv isn't trashed?

I don't know why I don't like "You may spend an action to put this on top of your deck", it's just instinctive, it feels off somehow I can definitely see why other people don't have a problem with it though. EDIT: @LastFootnote: minor quibble that is easy to fix, but is there any "You may ... to ..." card in Dominion?

With procession, same result than with island, so exactly what you said.


WALL OF TEXT!
EDIT: re-read the original rules. "+X Actions: The player may play X number of additional Actions this turn". This would lead me to believe that "spend an Action" doesn't mean anything, because you don't store Actions, you are simply allowed to play more than one Action card this turn. Note that here "Actions" means "Action cards", from context.
But then again, the only other card that refers to remaining Actions, Diadem, says "When you play this, +1$ per unused Action you have", which is not consistent with the definition of +X Actions as defined in the rulebook, but is still perfectly understandable. So eh.

Yes, I am being overly pedantic.

I am also sad because the rulebook says: "The action phase ends when the player cannot or chooses not to play any more action cards". Which means that, unless you go through aggressive rule-lawyering or add a faq to the card, my version cannot put a walled village into play after drawing cards dead with, say, smithy; a problem that LastFootnote's version doesn't have. One more point in the favour of his version as a promo.

In other news, I should say "put into your play area" instead of "put into play" if I want to be consistent with the rulebook.

Move along, nothing to see here 

[Witherweaver]

Instead of 'spend an Action to return to the top of your deck,' just say, 'if you have any unused Actions, you may return this to the top of your deck.'  Makes it more consistent with Diadem.

[pacovf]

But then you can topdeck them all if you have at least one unused action, which is definitely not what we want it to do.

EDIT: I would like it if it was possible to reuse Diadem's phrasing, but I don't see a way to do it that isn't really clunky.

[Awaclus]

Instead of 'spend an Action to return to the top of your deck,' just say, 'if you have any unused Actions, you may return this to the top of your deck.'  Makes it more consistent with Diadem.

But then you can return 10 Walled Villages with just one action.

EDIT: Dammit, Sarnath'd by pacovf.

[SirPeebles]

I am also sad because the rulebook says: "The action phase ends when the player cannot or chooses not to play any more action cards". Which means that, unless you go through aggressive rule-lawyering or add a faq to the card, my version cannot put a walled village into play after drawing cards dead with, say, smithy; a problem that LastFootnote's version doesn't have. One more point in the favour of his version as a promo.

My turn begins.  I play Remodel.  Since I am now unable to play additional Actions, the action phase has ended and the buy phase has begun.  I trash Rats, draw a card, and gain a Peddler.

[pacovf]

I am also sad because the rulebook says: "The action phase ends when the player cannot or chooses not to play any more action cards". Which means that, unless you go through aggressive rule-lawyering or add a faq to the card, my version cannot put a walled village into play after drawing cards dead with, say, smithy; a problem that LastFootnote's version doesn't have. One more point in the favour of his version as a promo.

My turn begins.  I play Remodel.  Since I am now unable to play additional Actions, the action phase has ended and the buy phase has begun.  I trash Rats, draw a card, and gain a Peddler.

Hence my comment about rule-lawyering. Since your action phase doesn't actually end until you finish resolving your last action (despite what is literally said in the rulebook), then I should be able to "put into my play area" a walled village in the magical metatime after I draw three card with smithy, but before I finish resolving smithy, whatever that means.

You could defend this interpretation, but just having a faq would be easier.