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Author Topic: Some interesting games...  (Read 1533 times)

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AdamH

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Some interesting games...
« on: April 30, 2013, 10:08:38 am »
+3

I played a few games last night with Nick, the guy I usually record videos with, but I didn't feel like recording. I sort of wish I had, though, because a few of them were pretty interesting. Not included here was a Possession+Masquerade Colony game where he Possesses me, giving himself a Colony, and buying the last Colony (because the drew the only Platinum left in my deck off the Rats he passed me to trash) for a 30-point swing where he won by less than 20 points. Revenge can be sweet, eh? Yeah his last turn was pretty lucky but that whole game was SO swingy. Here's the log.

I usually title my games with a funny quote from the game; if I had recorded these, I would have used some titles for these games:

So I've just been feeding you points this entire time?

Vineyard, Duchess, Herbalist, Lighthouse, Forager, Loan, Oracle, Baron, Marauder, Adventurer

He goes Marauder and I see a million cheap actions and Vineyards, so I decide to give it a shot. I wait on the Lighthouses because I want to make sure I get hit with ALL the ruins! I get a little excited and buy them with extra buys just to make sure I get them all, which wasn't necessary and did a number on my economy, but it's OK because all I really need are potions anyways. I didn't play this perfectly, but he asked me what I was doing halfway through the game and I was like "I'm going for Vineyards." I was buying Ruins; when I told him that Ruins powered up Vineyards, he said the title quote and lamented about his early Necropolis+Double Marauder turn ("I thought that was so awesome!").

...where your hand size is messed up and the green cards don't matter.

Duchess, Lighthouse, Menagerie, Salvager, Treasure Map, Hunting Party, Stables, Border Village, Fairgrounds, Goons

This one is by far the most interesting game we played. With Lighthouse and Menagerie plus significant draw, the attack part of Goons doesn't shut down your opponent, so we both continued to build up until the end, where it all came down to first turn advantage. We both had 5/2 and I liked my Stables opening better than his Hunting Party opening and I get to Goons first, but he then takes a lead on me with both VP tokens and Goons (he's getting Double-Goons turns for a few turns while I'm not playing any). There has to be a little luck with my drawing two Stables and two Estates together, but I suspect it also has to do with my Salvager buy. However, I think the Salvager helped me continue to progress upward by enabling Menageries and allowing extra Copper buys not to hurt me as much (Stables was great for that too). I make a risky play leaving piles pretty low, but he's $1 short of ending it on his last turn with a win, and my extra turn was more than enough.

...I finally feel like I'm starting to get a grasp on Goons, but was there something I could have done better here?

Rats is clearly the key card here.

Scrying Pool, Woodcutter, Familiar, Procession, Rats, Remodel, Salvager, Throne Room, Bandit Camp, Tactician

I wasn't kidding. In fact, I was a little sad when the Rats pile ran out, because Salvager+Rats was the source of my economy. An interesting little board with three massive Rats enablers. I agonized over my opening for a while, and once the Rats ran out I realized there wouldn't be enough money to go around for me to keep using Salvager, so I switched to Remodels. Unfortunate because there was no $6 action card for me use, so I had to deal with drawing Golds, but he resigned before that became a real issue (ignoring Familiar had to have been a mistake). Also amusing was the fact that Throne Room was a better Village than Bandit Camp here because I didn't want those Spoils junking up my deck.
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AdamH

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Re: Some interesting games...
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2013, 01:41:58 pm »
+4

Played an IRL game last night with Marauder and Island. My opponent bought some Marauders and I bought some Islands, and late game I had a Survivors and an Island in hand. Clearly the move was to put aside the Survivors, and after I did I realized what I had just done and had a nerd-gasm. (my favorite TV show is Survivor)

...now all we need is a mechanic to vote them off :P
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dondon151

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Re: Some interesting games...
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2013, 04:53:11 am »
+1

In your second posted game, HP is much better than Stables as an opening. Stables is not very useful if you're going to trash out your Treasures. More importantly, you should be picking up a Salvager with your next $4+ hand (yes, even over Goons! - but in that case you should get BV + Salvager), and the HP will find the Salvager often and quickly improve the quality of your deck.

I'm sure you were thinking that being the first to get to Goons is important. It's actually not. Not only is Menagerie a great counter, but it's very easy to pick up on hands that have been hit by Goons. Here your focus should be on trashing out the Estates and steadily improving $/turn output, then pick up Goons when possible.

People fall into this trap where they think that the first player to Goons wins. This is not usually the case from my experience, and I find that in these situations, the person who buys the Goons first loses because his deck is not yet ready to use it to its full potential. Keep in mind that the points that you get from a single Goons play early on is going to be dwarfed by the points that you get from a megaturn.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2013, 04:54:49 am by dondon151 »
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AdamH

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Re: Some interesting games...
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2013, 05:26:27 am »
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I didn't intend to get rid of my treasures, I intended to draw past them with stables. I also thought that stables is in general a better opening than HP (assuming you wans the former in your deck); is that not the case?

I wanted to get multiple buys which is why I rushed to goons, but what you're saying makes sense about being first to goons. Without the presence of a counter like menagerie, would you say that changes?
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dondon151

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Re: Some interesting games...
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2013, 09:06:18 am »
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I didn't intend to get rid of my treasures, I intended to draw past them with stables.

But this is an antisynergy with Menagerie. In the end, you are going to start getting rid of the Coppers anyway (once the Estates are gone), and your deck is going to have a greater ratio of non-Copper cards to Copper cards.

(Also, if you think about it, HP is better at "drawing past" Coppers if you already have a Copper in your hand - at least, it is guaranteed to find non-Copper cards.)

I also thought that stables is in general a better opening than HP (assuming you wans the former in your deck); is that not the case?

It really depends. Stables is better at increasing hand value. HP is better at finding a card that you want to play often.

I wanted to get multiple buys which is why I rushed to goons, but what you're saying makes sense about being first to goons. Without the presence of a counter like menagerie, would you say that changes?

If the +buy is a necessary component of a village + terminal draw engine, then get the Goons by all means. If there is some good non-terminal draw, I usually prefer the non-terminal draw to Goons until I have several of the drawing card.

Consider for a moment if this kingdom didn't have Menagerie. Well, then I would prefer HP over Goons until I am fairly certain that I can play the Goons every turn.
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carstimon

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Re: Some interesting games...
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2013, 09:48:15 am »
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I think I usually want the hunting party. 

On turn 3, if you didn't have a $2 buy, hunting party is just a cantrip which flips your deck*, and stables is a net +2 cards.  Remember that the copper you're discarding to stables is not a relatively bad card at this point.

After turn 3, hunting party great if you want to hit your early buys.  Stables is just increasing your hand size and helping you get through your deck, but seems not so great compared to hp.

*In the most likely case, where your hand has copper, estate, hp.  Of course this is possible:
Hand: C,C,C,C,HP
Deck: CCCEEE
« Last Edit: May 03, 2013, 09:50:59 am by carstimon »
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