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Author Topic: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion  (Read 29893 times)

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andwilk

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #75 on: April 18, 2013, 08:53:11 am »
+1

Avin vs andwilk 4-2-0 => Avin wins

Game 1:
Tunnel, Baron, Island, Scout, Thief, Bandit Camp, Ill-Gotten Gains, Trading Post, Tribute, King's Court, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estate, Duchy, Province, Curse
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130417/log.50d27829e4b00e9b124212b1.1366243951760.txt
My comment: Pretty much dominated by IGG
1-0-0

Game 2:
Haven, Vagrant, Farming Village, Nomad Camp, Talisman, Golem, Counting House, Graverobber, Venture, King's Court, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estate, Duchy, Province, Curse, Colony, Platinum, Potion
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130417/log.50804653fca2b99a1806c3c1.1366244565727.txt
My comment: I've never seen Havens used so strongly. Nice work. I missed a buy once where I bought a third Platinum instead of a colony, and had I had that colony I would have bought the penultimate colony as well ... not sure if it would have made the difference but I was definitely regretting my decision.
1-1-0

Game 3:
Pawn, Alchemist, Rats, Market, Merchant Ship, Rabble, Torturer, Wharf, Adventurer, Harem, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estate, Duchy, Province, Curse, Potion
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130417/log.50d27829e4b00e9b124212b1.1366244935938.txt
My comment: I thought for sure I'd be able to pull off a double province buy to offset my investment in alchemists, but it never came together and I was too slow.
1-2-0

Game 4:
Moat, Develop, Oasis, Oracle, Village, Warehouse, Alchemist, Remake, Explorer, Mine, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estate, Duchy, Province, Curse, Potion
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130417/log.50804653fca2b99a1806c3c1.1366245311594.txt
My comment: I think the biggest difference in our games was I started with a silver instead of a warehouse, which allowed me money sooner (in particular I bought a Mine mostly so I could remake it into a Gold shortly afterward, and use it a couple times until it coincided with the remake)
2-2-0

Game 5:
Beggar, Duchess, Pearl Diver, Scheme, Ironworks, Quarry, Bandit Camp, Cache, Minion, Possession, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estate, Duchy, Province, Curse, Potion
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130417/log.50d27829e4b00e9b124212b1.1366246156289.txt
My comment: I was afraid you would win the Minion split early on. But my extra Bandit Camps allowed me to get more spoils faster for the late game province buying power.
3-2-0

I had played first on Game 1 so we played a 6th game.

Game 6:
Herbalist, Apothecary, Swindler, Farming Village, Moneylender, Salvager, Apprentice, Jester, Stables, Hoard, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estate, Duchy, Province, Curse, Potion
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130417/log.50804653fca2b99a1806c3c1.1366247114845.txt
My comment: My first swindler hit copper, yours hit estate. In fact you never hit copper at all (probably didn't help that I opened Moneylender with the clearly better 4/3 opening). So I think luck heavily favored me this game.
4-2-0

Thanks for the games!

These games made me miss veto mode!  My 3 least favorite cards showed up in this match (IGG, Minion, Swindler) and the sets were rather uninteresting as at least 5 out of the 6 games were BM or race-type games.  Here are some thoughts:

Game 1: IGG race and I start as 2nd player.  There is no good way to handle the curses and I lose the race 6-4 and the game by 2 points.

Game 2: Probably my best game.  I play BM+Nomad Camp with lots of Havens to line up my turns for Colonies and it works out well.

Game 3: I play strictly Wharf/BM against his Alchemists.  Had my opponent invested a little more in his economy, I think he would have pulled it off.

Game 4: As 2nd player, I open Remake/Warehouse hoping to line up Remakes better and accelerate the opening portion of the game.  After I play Warehouse on Turn 3, and I end up with 4c/3e in my hand with no Remake, I realize my gamble did not pay off.

Game 5: I despise Minions.  That is all.

Game 6: I played suboptimally here.  I should have realized that with Swindler on the board, Coppers were dangerous to keep around.  I purposely kept them for Stables, and I ended up swimming in Curses.
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Kahlebb

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #76 on: April 19, 2013, 04:07:00 pm »
0

Kahlebb lost to gman314 in some of the worst play ever!

Congrats man.

We were bad about keeping logs, but I can dig 'em up if they're required (though play was embarassing enough I wouldn't mind avoiding it).

I went first on game one. Sequence was (from my perspective) loss, loss, win, loss.

Gg gman and good luck in the future.
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gman314

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #77 on: April 19, 2013, 04:15:58 pm »
0

More details on Kahlebb vs. gman314.

I got logs for all the games except game 2.

Game 1 - I go for pretty much nothing but IGG which bogs down his Alchemist approach.
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130413/log.5072a0b151c30da02a09ac84.1365874523656.txt

Game 2 - I got a 5/2 against his 4/3 so I got Cultist vs. Marauder, and then went Cultist-BM with a couple of random Pearl Divers for the win.

Game 3 - This was a really fun one to play with Possession, Apothecary and Horn of Plenty. Neither of us really fired up our HoPs, and then Kahlebb won. http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130413/log.5072a0b151c30da02a09ac84.1365874523656.txt

Game 4 - I went for Alchemist while he went for Margrave and Embassy. I also picked up a Margrave and did some really weird (and probably ill-advised) Procession shenanigans, but somehow pulled off a win anyways.

Gg Kahlebb, better luck in future matches.
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AHoppy

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #78 on: April 19, 2013, 05:15:11 pm »
+1

AHoppy vs. Loppo 3-2
We got a little confused on when to play the sixth game, so I will post that log when we play the game, probably tomorrow.  In the mean time:

So far we have played 5 excellent games!  It was enjoyable to be able to play online again, especially with all the cards.  Thanks Loppo and good luck in the 6th game, and the rest of the tournament!

game 1: AHoppy 24 - Loppo 33
Chancellor, Forager, Sage, Cartographer, Embassy, Ghost Ship, Ill-Gotten Gains, Merchant Ship, Mine, Rebuild
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366397784797.txt
I go IGG early, but his Forager doesn't mind.  Forager played a big role to my loss here.  Shelters made me not want to go for rebuild.  We actually both only got Foragers, Sages and IGG.  Well deserved win on Loppo's part.  Note turn 9:  I have not had a chance to play much on Goko, and this was the result.  Ah well.

game 2: AHoppy 24 - Loppo 12 (Resigned)
Duchess, Squire, Ambassador, Shanty Town, Wishing Well, Woodcutter, Ironworks, Harem, Hoard, Forge
http://dominionlogs.goko.com//20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366398914514.txt
Ambassador game, my Shanty Towns and Wishing Wells somehow work out quite well with squire to help get silver, Loppo resigns when I'm gaining golds from hoard and buying provinces

game 3: Loppo 28 - AHoppy 51
Native Village, Fortune Teller, Hermit, Loan, Watchtower, Armory, Worker's Village, Apprentice, Cultist, Fairgrounds
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366400634566.txt
This was probably the most interesting game of the match thus far.  We both go for Cultists using Armory to pick up all the cheap actions and some silver along the way, then we transition into using Hermits/Madmen to draw.  Loppo does more aggressive trashing, I don't to keep variety and manage to win the Fairgrounds split with a triple Fairgrounds turn due to Madman. 

game 4: Loppo 42 - AHoppy 34
Chapel, Moat, Lookout, Oasis, Smugglers, Procession, Cache, Duke, Margrave, Tactician
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366401575536.txt
Another pretty interesting one.  I snag Caches early on and a Tactician to help counter Margrave and in hopes of going Duchy-Duke.  Loppo builds a nice deck incorporating procession.  I still really don't understand how to use Procession correctly, but Loppo does and combos it with Smugglers to steal Dukes and Duchys, winning the Duke split, further establishing my hatred for Smugglers...  I probably should have dived for Duchys earlier, but overall it was a good game.

game 5: AHoppy 92 - Loppo 0
Cellar, Squire, Sage, Woodcutter, Envoy, Scout, Horn of Plenty, Inn, Farmland, King's Court
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366402658283.txt
I'm sorry.  I'm so sorry... turn 3 gold, early HoP, early KC, snowballs into a triple KC-Envoy and HoP megaturn ending with 6 Colonies and 2 Provinces.  This was all luck...
BTW: Picked up a scout to get me 11 differently named cards.  So in a way, a King's Courted Scout won me the game...

Thanks for the games so far, I really enjoyed them and I'll post our 6th game when we play it.

AHoppy

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #79 on: April 20, 2013, 02:30:30 pm »
0

Loppo vs. AHoppy ends in a draw

game 6: Loppo 40 - AHoppy 30
Transmute, Vineyard, Poor House, Embargo, Apothecary, Pirate Ship, Spy, Young Witch, Cultist, Horn of Plenty, Mystic
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130420/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366481149169.txt
Scratch game 3 being the most interesting.  THis was the most interesting game tactically.  YW with embargo as bane makes for a pretty strong YW.  Vineyard seems to be a good counter to cultist however, so I open YW embargo, even with the 5-2.  However, having the more valuable vineyards didn't help since I lost the vineyard split so badly.  My second transmute should have been a vineyard.  If you are going to analyze one game of the series, check this one out.

Thanks for the games Loppo, it was still a great series! 

Stealth Tomato

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #80 on: April 20, 2013, 02:36:57 pm »
+1

Stealth Tomato 3 - 2 attrill (attrill goes 1st 3x)

We played in Pro mode, and held serve through four games (attrill going first in the first two, me going first in the next two) before I took the decisive Game 5 on the road. We had some really, really neat boards show up. It's difficult to realize just how great Dark Ages is until you have to play it competitively and it's so fucking difficult and mindbending and oh god there are so many strategic and tactical options here

Game 1 attrill 38-17 http://dominionlogs.goko.com//20130420/log.50f5dcbde4b03946044c889a.1366479312593.txt
I try a weird Rats thing, he doesn't. He plays well, I don't. He wins.

Game 2 attrill 54-40
We forgot the log, but attrill went first, opened Apprentice-Embargo with 5/2 (with Fortress on the board!), embargoed the Apprentices before I could get any, and picked up 5/4 on turns 3/4. The decks after Turn 4:
attrill: 7 Copper 2 Estate Apprentice Rabble Potion
Stealth: 7 Copper 3 Estate Curse Apprentice 3 Silver
Also of note, Goons was available, and no trashing besides Apprentice.
What followed was an immensely frustrating game for me. He played well from ahead, picking up four Goons and using them to rack up a ton of points before killing the piles.

Game 3 Stealth Tomato 30-29http://dominionlogs.goko.com//20130420/log.50f5dcbde4b03946044c889a.1366480847036.txt
Ambassador, Fool's Gold, Council Room, and Mining Village. We both open double-Amb, I get a quick lead in Ambassador tennis and some Fool's Golds, he gets to the Provinces first and picks up a 14-point lead with two Provinces remaining going into Turn 15. I trash both my Mining Villages to pull off exactly $21 a relatively lucky Province-Province-Duchy buy to win by a dollar and a point with the turn edge.

Game 4 Stealth Tomato 45-21
http://dominionlogs.goko.com//20130420/log.50f5dcbde4b03946044c889a.1366481529286.txt
I put together a neat University-Bazaar-Hunting Grounds-Forge thing that pulls 4 Provinces and 4 Duchies on turns 14-15 with no +buys.

Game 5
http://dominionlogs.goko.com//20130420/log.50f5dcbde4b03946044c889a.1366482308478.txt
Hamlet-Tunnel-Wharf. I sell out for Wharves, he doesn't, he overloads a bit on Tunnels, and he ends up struggling to put up $8 as I methodically drain the Provinces and Great Halls.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2013, 01:58:40 pm by Stealth Tomato »
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loppo

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #81 on: April 21, 2013, 05:14:35 am »
+1

thanks AHoppy for this 6 games. I felt some games were decided by luck (this is luck on both sides), and in general i got the feeling you made the better decicions im most of the games. I'm still not sure what was correct in 6th game.

game 1: AHoppy 24 - Loppo 33
Chancellor, Forager, Sage, Cartographer, Embassy, Ghost Ship, Ill-Gotten Gains, Merchant Ship, Mine, Rebuild
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366397784797.txt
I go IGG early, but his Forager doesn't mind.  Forager played a big role to my loss here.  Shelters made me not want to go for rebuild.  We actually both only got Foragers, Sages and IGG.  Well deserved win on Loppo's part.  Note turn 9:  I have not had a chance to play much on Goko, and this was the result.  Ah well.
here you hit a series of 5 for IGG on turns 3,5,6 while i get my first 5 on turn 8 definitely a good start for me. When i realised you dont intend to gain a forager i pump them up to 3, and they help me come back. rebuild was no real option with shelters / no +buy. Forager is a strong card.

game 2: AHoppy 24 - Loppo 12 (Resigned)
Duchess, Squire, Ambassador, Shanty Town, Wishing Well, Woodcutter, Ironworks, Harem, Hoard, Forge
http://dominionlogs.goko.com//20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366398914514.txt
Ambassador game, my Shanty Towns and Wishing Wells somehow work out quite well with squire to help get silver, Loppo resigns when I'm gaining golds from hoard and buying provinces

My ambassadors dont find cards to return, or miss the reshuffle. That totally turns the game around. Your wishing well/shanty towns work out, on my side they refuse to work properly. So i resign when there is no hope to come back, mainly to save time.

game 3: Loppo 28 - AHoppy 51
Native Village, Fortune Teller, Hermit, Loan, Watchtower, Armory, Worker's Village, Apprentice, Cultist, Fairgrounds
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366400634566.txt
This was probably the most interesting game of the match thus far.  We both go for Cultists using Armory to pick up all the cheap actions and some silver along the way, then we transition into using Hermits/Madmen to draw.  Loppo does more aggressive trashing, I don't to keep variety and manage to win the Fairgrounds split with a triple Fairgrounds turn due to Madman. 
This was a fine kingdom. Unfortunately i have 4/4 on turns 3+4, while AHoppy gets a cultist turn 5. I try to catchup with more aggressive trashing, but it just doesn't happen.

game 4: Loppo 42 - AHoppy 34
Chapel, Moat, Lookout, Oasis, Smugglers, Procession, Cache, Duke, Margrave, Tactician
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366401575536.txt
Another pretty interesting one.  I snag Caches early on and a Tactician to help counter Margrave and in hopes of going Duchy-Duke.  Loppo builds a nice deck incorporating procession.  I still really don't understand how to use Procession correctly, but Loppo does and combos it with Smugglers to steal Dukes and Duchys, winning the Duke split, further establishing my hatred for Smugglers...  I probably should have dived for Duchys earlier, but overall it was a good game.

here the luck is on my side. My game plan was some double tactician with oasis + marggrave. I totally overlooked duke/cache. So when AHoppy goes for it, my plan goes out of the window. And i go for procession/smuggler. Due to a trim deck and shuffle luck, i play 3 Procession of smugglers for 2 duchies and 4 dukes. My deck has fallen to pieces afterwards, and i'm happy to be able to pile out before AHoppy can mount a comeback. This was merely falling over the line.

game 5: AHoppy 92 - Loppo 0
Cellar, Squire, Sage, Woodcutter, Envoy, Scout, Horn of Plenty, Inn, Farmland, King's Court
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130419/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366402658283.txt
I'm sorry.  I'm so sorry... turn 3 gold, early HoP, early KC, snowballs into a triple KC-Envoy and HoP megaturn ending with 6 Colonies and 2 Provinces.  This was all luck...
BTW: Picked up a scout to get me 11 differently named cards.  So in a way, a King's Courted Scout won me the game...

Boah, what a spanking i received here. Early gold, HP, Plat,.. and i never get a bite at the cherry. Very well played from AHoppy as well. Not even my clever scout buy saved me

game 6: Loppo 40 - AHoppy 30
Transmute, Vineyard, Poor House, Embargo, Apothecary, Pirate Ship, Spy, Young Witch, Cultist, Horn of Plenty, Mystic
http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130420/log.50955175e4b013548a3d58f0.1366481149169.txt
Scratch game 3 being the most interesting.  THis was the most interesting game tactically.  YW with embargo as bane makes for a pretty strong YW.  Vineyard seems to be a good counter to cultist however, so I open YW embargo, even with the 5-2.  However, having the more valuable vineyards didn't help since I lost the vineyard split so badly.  My second transmute should have been a vineyard.  If you are going to analyze one game of the series, check this one out.   

yeah, i would lve to hear community thoughts on this game as well. I open 4/3 and open Silver/Young witch. AHoppy opens 5/2 and take Young witch over cultist. Do you agree?

I take a cultist later, while Ahoppy takes a 2nd Young witch. My reasoning is "more Junk is his deck is better", even though it pumps the vineyards. I load up on potions just before every reshuffle,  and this pays off. Even though i lose the curse split 3/7, my potion advanatge pays off and i manage to snag up 6 vineyards.

It was a crazy game where we both buy every action card possible. Even transmute plays a role here.

The big question remains. There must be a better strategy available, than we both played. What would you have done here?

Thanks for the games Loppo, it was still a great series! 

ditto, a great series and a result i can live with. Actually i feel you deserved to win. Given the 6 games +1 we played for fun, you were the stronger player. I definitelyneed to get some training sessions in.
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Kirian

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #82 on: April 21, 2013, 03:27:28 pm »
0

Just waiting on the results from our last match.
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Kirian

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Re: GOKODOM I: Round 1 Results and Discussion
« Reply #83 on: April 22, 2013, 08:16:39 am »
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Second round pairings are posted!
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