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Author Topic: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration  (Read 3323 times)

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Warfreak2

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Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« on: April 08, 2013, 08:58:44 pm »
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When you Throne Room a Duration card, the Throne Room remains in play along with it, to "explain" why the duration effect applies twice next turn. My question is, what if the Throne Room is trashed after being played, because of Procession? For example,
play Procession
-> play Throne Room
 -> play Laboratory
 -> play Laboratory again
-> play Throne Room again
 -> play Lighthouse
 -> play Lighthouse again
-> trash Throne Room

The Lighthouse would still be in play, and you get $1 twice this turn. But do you get $1 twice next turn, even though the Throne Room is no longer there to "explain" it?

This could get more complex if more Throne Rooms are played:
play Procession
-> play TR1
 -> play TR2
  -> play Lighthouse
  -> play Lighthouse again
 -> play TR2 again
  -> play Caravan
  -> play Caravan again
-> play TR1 again
 -> play TR3
  -> play Wharf
  -> play Wharf again
 -> play TR3 again
  -> play Fishing Village
  -> play Fishing Village again
-> trash TR1

Four duration cards are now played twice each, but only two Throne Rooms remain, unable to explain all of them. Are they all doubled next turn? Are only two of them, and if so, which two? Or are none?

(edit: changed Haven to Caravan, because why would Haven need to be explained next turn?)
« Last Edit: April 08, 2013, 09:04:30 pm by Warfreak2 »
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SirPeebles

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Re: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2013, 09:03:02 pm »
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The Throne Room tells you to play the Duration card twice, so the Duration card was played twice.  It does not matter if the Throne Room is trashed after or not.
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ftl

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Re: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2013, 09:06:13 pm »
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 The effect of a Throne Room still remains even if the throne room is trashed - the duration card was still played two times, even if you no longer have something out to remind you of that. You can use something from out of the game, like a token of some sort, to remind yourself, if you like (might be a good idea if there's lots of Processions going on!) .

So in your first example, you get $1 twice next turn, and in the second example, everything is "doubled".
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Warfreak2

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Re: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2013, 09:17:51 pm »
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OK, so the "explain" rule is really just to keep those Throne Rooms out of your discard pile for one extra turn, rather than because they continue to perform some function themselves? That sounds plausible enough, and it's clear that it can sometimes be significant (e.g. just before a reshuffle, or if you're drawing your deck, buying an Inn, playing Scavenger, or, I suppose, Hermit), but it seems a little unmotivated.
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ftl

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Re: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2013, 09:39:20 pm »
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Yes.

Trashing cards from play does generate a weird situations like that. Them's the breaks, weird things happen when cards get complicated. You follow all instructions on all cards to the letter, and with Procession combined with Durations that can result in cards having effects after they've already been trashed, and in the case of Procession->Throne Room->Duration it does have the result of revealing that the Throne Room isn't really "doing anything" on the next turn, it just stays out for show. (By the way, when you Procession a Duration directly, the Duration will still have its next turn effect twice, even though it's already been trashed and isn't in play anymore. Same thing there.)
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popsofctown

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Re: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2013, 09:52:52 pm »
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OK, so the "explain" rule is really just to keep those Throne Rooms out of your discard pile for one extra turn, rather than because they continue to perform some function themselves? That sounds plausible enough, and it's clear that it can sometimes be significant (e.g. just before a reshuffle, or if you're drawing your deck, buying an Inn, playing Scavenger, or, I suppose, Hermit), but it seems a little unmotivated.

It's really not motivated in any sort of elegant way.  My understanding is that Donald added a more or less arbitrary rule that keeps them out in order to make it easier to remember to play the card twice.

Actually, strictly speaking, the fact that DURATION cards themselves stay in play is also an arbitrary reminder.  (on cards like Wharf).  It's not necessary to the structure of the game for them to stay out, and if you removed them from play somehow, the effect would still happen on the following turn.
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Kirian

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Re: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2013, 10:31:59 pm »
+1

Actually, strictly speaking, the fact that DURATION cards themselves stay in play is also an arbitrary reminder.  (on cards like Wharf).  It's not necessary to the structure of the game for them to stay out, and if you removed them from play somehow, the effect would still happen on the following turn.

Nitpick:  their power is somewhat diminished by the fact that they can easily miss the shuffle, and you only get to play them about half as much.  Can you imagine what Wharf would look like if you dumped it into your deck instead of leaving it in play?
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HiveMindEmulator

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Re: Procession -> Throne Room -> Duration
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2013, 02:04:04 am »
+4

Can you imagine what Wharf would look like if you dumped it into your deck instead of leaving it in play?

No. Poor ability to visualize is the primary reason to leave it out :)
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