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[eHalcyon]

19 tiles for that one

[shraeye]

ahhhhhh!!!1 rawrrrr!!! I just got with three stars the puzzle that makes 1 turn into 37.  I've been playing with that one for ages, and got stuck at 17 tiles.  A new idea gave me 16 tiles, with an obvious optimization to 14 tiles.

Oh gosh. Am I sorry to say this. But this discussion made me look back at my solution for this level, and thought hey, wait a second, can't I get rid of that tile right there...
So I now have a 13 tile solution for 4 stars and we'll both lose a star pretty soon.

This is good; I was wondering just today if there shouldn't be some thing available, like when somebody reaches something like 165+ stars or so, a database of "current bests" (and there may be multiple methods for a single level) is available.  This way people can use others' tweaks and ideas in combination and make things even better.

[shraeye]

Hey a friend of mine just beat the highscore for #26.  Shall I PM you her solution, David?  Her name is Mckenzie.

[David]

Cool! Sure, and let me know what she would like to be called so I can mention her here: http://xorballs.dskl.net/scores.html

[AHoppy]

I found the 6 tile solution to 48!

I'm straight up stuck on 48... do you use the 4 tile solution to 47?

There are a number of 4-tile solutions to 47 that all work on the same principal. Any should work as a starting point for 48, but some will be more efficient I think. My first solution for 48 had like 20 tiles and balls moving all over the place.

I finally got it 25 tiles and balls going all over the place...

[-Stef-]

Hey a friend of mine just beat the highscore for #26.  Shall I PM you her solution, David?  Her name is Mckenzie.

Nice!

For now, I'm clueless. Over the past two weeks some other solutions were improved, but that was only 1 tile on levels I didn't really try to hammer down, and I found them reasonably quickly afterwards. This one however I already tried to improve many many times in the past. That got me lots of 16-tile solutions and a very few 15-tiles. And now I'm looking for 10... eek.

I'm afraid it will take a long time. *sniff*, only 2 stars for now. I like this feeling. And I don't. Well, I guess I do.

[shraeye]

I understand exactly.  The excitement of knowing something is just beyond the corner, mixed with the utter frustration of not knowing how to walk around that corner.

[shraeye]

Whoa, I love #32. 

I was stuck up at 27 tiles for a long time.  Then I tried a totally new method, and got down to 18, and instantly pushed it down to 14 tiles.  I love it when you remove 13 tiles in one fell swoop.

[-Stef-]

Hey a friend of mine just beat the highscore for #26.  Shall I PM you her solution, David?  Her name is Mckenzie.

Nice!

For now, I'm clueless. Over the past two weeks some other solutions were improved, but that was only 1 tile on levels I didn't really try to hammer down, and I found them reasonably quickly afterwards. This one however I already tried to improve many many times in the past. That got me lots of 16-tile solutions and a very few 15-tiles. And now I'm looking for 10... eek.

I'm afraid it will take a long time. *sniff*, only 2 stars for now. I like this feeling. And I don't. Well, I guess I do.

Ahhh... got it. Amazing how I can't get below 15 for several months, and then a few days after you find 10 I find it as well.
Apparently this guarantee that it's possible really helps. I tried faking it but that doesn't work.

ahhhhhh!!!1 rawrrrr!!! I just got with three stars the puzzle that makes 1 turn into 37.  I've been playing with that one for ages, and got stuck at 17 tiles.  A new idea gave me 16 tiles, with an obvious optimization to 14 tiles.

Oh gosh. Am I sorry to say this. But this discussion made me look back at my solution for this level, and thought hey, wait a second, can't I get rid of that tile right there...
So I now have a 13 tile solution for 4 stars and we'll both lose a star pretty soon.

This is good; I was wondering just today if there shouldn't be some thing available, like when somebody reaches something like 165+ stars or so, a database of "current bests" (and there may be multiple methods for a single level) is available.  This way people can use others' tweaks and ideas in combination and make things even better.

I don't think so... making it too easy to get a list of all the current bests probably spoils more then it helps. However, if there's a specific problem you want to get my solution for in order to improve upon... feel free to ask in a PM. In the past combining Davids solutions with my own has indeed lead to better ones.

[shraeye]

Yeah, there is the other argument of course, the same reason that it took you only this long to get to 10 tiles on #26.  Once you know it's possible, it becomes easier to push towards it.  Can seem a bit daunting when there's the possibility that you're already at the optimal place and you're just wasting time.

[David]

Apparently this guarantee that it's possible really helps. I tried faking it but that doesn't work.

Maybe we can help.

[Tables]

Apparently this guarantee that it's possible really helps. I tried faking it but that doesn't work.

Maybe we can help.

Has anyone else managed the solution to level 0 in -1 tiles, or is it just me?

[shraeye]

Oh wow.  I just got the 3-star solution to #20.  Now my head explodes with the possibilities.

[David]

Your solution is interesting. My 3-star solution doesn't use that technique but otherwise looks very similar.
Hope you understood that, trying not to give too much away . PM me if you want to see my solution.

[shraeye]

Your solution is interesting. My 3-star solution doesn't use that technique but otherwise looks very similar.
Hope you understood that, trying not to give too much away . PM me if you want to see my solution.

Stef just showed me something that looks pretty similar, just embedded a different way.  Is your's similar to Stef's "alternate" solution?

[David]

I'm not sure which alternate solution you mean. But Stef knows my solution.

[-Stef-]

Funny, it happened again. I heard McKenzie beat my lvl 55 (Storage 1) solution with a 23-tile solution (was 26), and less then an hour after that I found it too.
And this was exactly the level I tried to improve upon for the last week!

Ok now I'm going to use this improvement to beat my own score for the next level (Storage)

[David]

And again the independent solutions are very very similiar.
Are you Mckenzie?

[mcdizzle]

Oh, don't worry David, we are distinct. 

[mcdizzle]

I'm quite please that I finally wrapped my brain about what to do for #60...only 132 tiles.
How in the world Stef got it down to 26 or whatever is beyond me.

[-Stef-]

Congrats on solving it. And don't worry, I started out with a really long and tedious solution for 'binary' too. Probably not 132, but something around 70 if I remember correctly.
Try taking some distance. Getting a fresh look on a problem like this can really remove a ton of tiles. My first solutions all included some version of list and/or stack but eventually I let that all go.

I wrote down the numbers on a paper and just stared at them for a while...

Code: [Select]

   1
  10
  11
 100
 101
 110
 111
1000
... and then I realized what was happening in every column. I won't give hints unless you ask for it, but my first implementation of the new idea was 33 tiles and after that 7 more got removed by some local optimizations / better use of subtiles.

Funny, it happened again. I heard McKenzie beat my lvl 55 (Storage 1) solution with a 23-tile solution (was 26), and less then an hour after that I found it too.
And this was exactly the level I tried to improve upon for the last week!
Ok now I'm going to use this improvement to beat my own score for the next level (Storage)

The idea of 'leaving through the front door' was not just once but actually twice applicable to my 'Storage' solution. It helped improving it from 48 to 40

[sudgy]

So, sorry for necroing an old topic, but I randomly decided to play this again.  When Stef first mentioned it here, I almost beat it but stopped playing.  I beat it this time and wanted more...

So I built a Turing Machine.

Code: [Select]

http://xorballs.dskl.net/#3,end,[76,new:44bA],[72,Turing%20Machine:02704613614bF15716623725530633734bP40041bC42bB43A45bD46450553bH54B55461766572774bQ765837845],[75,Color%20Memory:12614415430634H35G40044aV45050I54J555807827846],[74,Write%20Test:01706611B14620721022423624A25630633C34D35F400413425434444454467817846],[73,Color%20Split:34C36737C38644A46A47F48754D56757D585],[77,Tape:00604405415J21722630731aG32bI34641bG42bJ43644bF45A47648751553A55756bD57463764bO67572774bN75976bM78580581I84887bK884],[79,Turing-1:00603904806610C11713D14716F17720721aG22623724aG25526727aG28631B34937540L43B46B479515534546574635644705784827846],[87,Turing-2:24526442D44745aG46565567484B875],[88,Mini-Tape:31734640G41543644bF457537555],[31,Color%20Memory%20Direction:03704105414718622724aW26430634735540042aP46A48050554458562764aX664],[16,init%20reset:217241254306337340354400443455487537540554635648677685815844],[78,Tape-1:44B480585],[80,Tape-2:04C40B41E44648750751C585],[81,Tape-3:43C44B54E],[82,Tape-4%20%28Delay%29:00704510918422723724725726727631732aG33aG34aG35aG36aG38B40bL41242843B44B45B46B481517577585705724],[84,Tape-5:116174217221262286306325357360400419426437447463475489527535557561584805864],[85,Tape-6:045084481585],[86,Tape-7:40G],[32,BR%20Partial%20Color%20Memory:04506416aU26aS27C28435645046348866aT67D68476aU846864],[25,Partial%20Color%20Memory:04506416aU26aS27C28435636aS37D38945046348856aT57E58B66aT67F68476aU846864],[33,YG%20Partial%20Color%20Memory:04506416aU26aS27E28435645046348866aT67F68476aU846864],[83,Tape-4-1:037040086487],[30,53-3:03704005443544B456837840854],[28,53-1:486837840884],[29,53-2:037041084485]
[EDIT: I accidentally misunderstood the definition of a Turing Machine and didn't make the head have states.  So, this is only a tape head.  Here is a better machine with states.]

Input is from the left, output to the left (in case you wanted to add commands, they're both in the same area to make it easier.  If you don't like it, you can change it.).  Each cell of the tape can have four states, one for each color (they default as blue).  Inputting a green ball reads the current state, inputting a yellow ball will make the next inputted ball write the current state (so inputting yellow then green will make the current cell green), blue moves the tape left, and red moves the tape right.

Just so you know, when programming, my code is really kludgy.  And it's the same thing here.  I use the earlier solutions to two levels, both of which are very complex.  And the Turing Machine itself is very complicated as well.  I don't even really remember what everything does (I know how it works, but not each individual tile), even though I made it all today.

[David]

This is awesome! Something like this was supposed to be the last level but I never go to it (and lost a bit of interest when usage declined...)

I'm looking forward to trying and studying it (I haven't yet) but may not have time immediately. But assuming it's really a Turing machine you've built: congratulations for finishing the game!

[sudgy]

This is awesome! Something like this was supposed to be the last level but I never go to it (and lost a bit of interest when usage declined...)

I'm looking forward to trying and studying it (I haven't yet) but may not have time immediately. But assuming it's really a Turing machine you've built: congratulations for finishing the game!

I was looking on the wikipedia page and it says that instructions are supposed to be a part of it.  There's no instructions, but you certainly could make them.  I was just pretty excited when I had managed to make it.

[sudgy]

Also, it's funny, when I first heard of a Turing Machine, I thought, "Moving an infinite tape?  That makes no sense!  Why not just move the head!"  And, when I make one, the tape moves and the head stays stationary...