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[pst]

If Iso continued running for free, no one was going to switch to Goko.

It seems like in discussions about Goko here there's always a risk that people read things into posts that aren't there, but I'll take that risk and write what I think would have happened in this parallel universe anyway. I agree that those that used Isotropic a lot wouldn't have switched. They (we) were happy there. But that certainly wouldn't mean that no one would use Goko! A lot of new players who never were interested in Isotropic would have joined Goko anyway, and probably a lot of those who only played a little at Isotropic as well. That was seen already during the short co-existence there was.

[AJD]

The book publishing world equivalent would be to suggest that anyone can take a copy of the latest Stephen King novel, package it themselves, and sell or give it away to anyone.  That's not how publishing works.

Not addressing the aptness of the simile you intended, but you might want to consider rephrasing this.... Taking a copy of the latest Stephen King novel, packaging it yourself in a nice box or paper wrapper, and giving it away to anyone is a very common type of birthday present, for example.

[bedlam]

This game I played today, my opponent was two Colonies ahead of me. But man, my strategy was better, I had just taken the rest of the Curses thanks to my opponent's Torturers, I had finished draining the Farming Village pile with Workshop, and I had just used 3 Horns of Plenty to pick up King's Court/City/City. These Level 2 Cities were the only source of +buy, and my opponent had none. Which means I could safely drain the City pile to 2 if I wanted--he had no way to gain more than 1 thing per turn. Which also means I had him totally defeated; I could afford perhaps 2 more turns of building before a huge Horns/Kings/Cities/(and Bishop!) megaturn got me all the rest of those points. And I had planned this, I hadn't panicked when I fell behind in Colonies, or when I had accepted 3 Curses.

To play Devil's Advocate here...

An opponent who is already going Colonies who just gave you all the curses on a torturer board without buying any cities is probably newb enough to not recognize what you are building up to as an epic comeback. I know I wouldn't. I would think I've got this game in the bag. My first thought is that it was just a disconnect rather than a quit...maybe. Still your point about getting a rating boost when your opponent quits is tops on my complaint list too.

BTW

Devil's Advocate
$6 Victory - Reaction

4VP

When another player plays an attack card you may reveal this. If you do, you are unaffected by that attack, trash this card and gain a Duchy.

Edit: changed cost and VP

[eHalcyon]

If Doug had been willing to turn Iso into a pay-to-play site, then maybe we could discuss actual competition, but that really doesn't seem to be his thing.

But was it ever an option to have iso co-exist with Goko, but behind a Goko paywall? Like, did Goko propose that? From what I've read Dougz was just offered to work for Goko (which he didn't want because he preferred his Google job), and Goko still wanted Iso down no matter what. Now that is a very rotten mindset to me, to force a superior product to close shop even though they could just have let it be and profited from it (I'd easily pay $5-10/month for Iso, and I think many other iso-enthusiasts would as well).

I can rationalize all day long that this is just how stuff works in the publishing world, but that doesn't stop me from experiencing disgust on a primal, emotional level.

I think you've got it wrong. When RGG approached dougz, Goko (or rather, funsockets at that time) in was not even in the picture.

Now possibly they had certain requests that dougz world not have had the time to handle - making ios and android apps, creating an extra shiny ui - we don't know. But dougz turned it down and that's when Goko picked up the contact.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong!

[SCSN]

If Doug had been willing to turn Iso into a pay-to-play site, then maybe we could discuss actual competition, but that really doesn't seem to be his thing.

But was it ever an option to have iso co-exist with Goko, but behind a Goko paywall? Like, did Goko propose that? From what I've read Dougz was just offered to work for Goko (which he didn't want because he preferred his Google job), and Goko still wanted Iso down no matter what. Now that is a very rotten mindset to me, to force a superior product to close shop even though they could just have let it be and profited from it (I'd easily pay $5-10/month for Iso, and I think many other iso-enthusiasts would as well).

I can rationalize all day long that this is just how stuff works in the publishing world, but that doesn't stop me from experiencing disgust on a primal, emotional level.

I think you've got it wrong. When RGG approached dougz, Goko (or rather, funsockets at that time) in was not even in the picture.

Now possibly they had certain requests that dougz world not have had the time to handle - making ios and android apps, creating an extra shiny ui - we don't know. But dougz turned it down and that's when Goko picked up the contact.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong!

Fair enough, though my main point was that Goko wanted iso down while they could just have built a paywall.

[Watno]

I doubt dougz would have agreed to such a paywall system.
Also, people from Goko are convinced their product is superior.

[Polk5440]

This may be relevant from jqs on getsatisfaction. Key line:

Hi ... yes, we're releasing part of it tonight... quitting will count as a loss and we're going to start aging the leaderboards a bit faster for a bit.

[Watno]

And it was actually posted today.

[SCSN]

Also...

Rejoin is a different enchilada and we don't have that yet.

I'm not sure how I feel about quitting counting as a loss without a rejoin option. The one thing more frustrating than a computer crash in the middle of a winning game is it counting as a loss...

[Polk5440]

Also...

Rejoin is a different enchilada and we don't have that yet.

I'm not sure how I feel about quitting counting as a loss without a rejoin option. The one thing more frustrating than a computer crash in the middle of a winning game is it counting as a loss...

I agree. This was the reason why they had not counted it as a loss in the first place, as I understand. But maybe quitting for ranking is becoming too prevalent. Hopefully they will post some kind of timeline for a "rejoin" feature.

[Robz888]

This may be relevant from jqs on getsatisfaction. Key line:

Hi ... yes, we're releasing part of it tonight... quitting will count as a loss and we're going to start aging the leaderboards a bit faster for a bit.

That's interesting. Does anyone know if they've implemented this?

[WanderingWinder]

Refreshing now results in a loss, at least on casual. Haven't had it come up on pro, but I imagine it's the same.

[Robz888]

Great, thanks.

[loppo]

Refreshing now results in a loss, at least on casual. Haven't had it come up on pro, but I imagine it's the same.

its a loss in pro-games as well. Had this happen yesterday. so at least this annoying problem is solved.

[Lashof]

I protect my pro rating by only playing pro with people I know won't quit.  I play casual mostly, and so when someone DCs, I just resign.

My casual rating is ~2000 points lower than my pro rating


I also play against my SO, when we are both logged into my account.  Somehow, when I play vs. myself (which you can do on goko), I lose rating points.  Goko math.

[Polk5440]

I also play against my SO, when we are both logged into my account.  Somehow, when I play vs. myself (which you can do on goko), I lose rating points.  Goko math.

I would be concerned if this allowed you to gain points indefinitely. That would be a pretty bad exploit.

[SCSN]

Here I quit at turn 4 as it downed on me that my Minion/King's Court plan would be outgunned by his Hamlet/Tunnel engine.

http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130409/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1365518665567.txt

RIIIIIGHT. -49 RATING POINTS, FU GOKO!

[ftl]

Here I quit at turn 4 as it downed on me that my Minion/King's Court plan would be outgunned by his Hamlet/Tunnel engine.

http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130409/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1365518665567.txt

RIIIIIGHT. -49 RATING POINTS, FU GOKO!

Wait, I don't get what's wrong with that. You played a game and you lost and lost rating for it. What are you angry at goko for?

[Stealth Tomato]

Here I quit at turn 4 as it downed on me that my Minion/King's Court plan would be outgunned by his Hamlet/Tunnel engine.

http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130409/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1365518665567.txt

RIIIIIGHT. -49 RATING POINTS, FU GOKO!

Lag-out-and-lose is going to be a side effect of any system that punishes quitters. It's not possible to separate lag-outs from quits. I had this problem on Iso sometimes as well. You just have to deal with it.

On a side note, this post is a great example of how end-of-day leaderboard updates can actually be much better than real-time--you don't get the chance to agonize about how that one unlucky draw cost you X rating points.

[SCSN]

On iso I was always able to rejoin after a computer crash, and Goko has been promising for ages that they'll implement that too... In fact, that was the very reason that they put off punishing quitters for so long (which I agreed with btw, as I think the current situation is worse).

[theory]

I think that's really far down the list of priorities tbh.  I am habituated to the fact that in most online games, if I disconnect, I lose, and such is life.

[SCSN]

Here I quit at turn 4 as it downed on me that my Minion/King's Court plan would be outgunned by his Hamlet/Tunnel engine.

http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130409/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1365518665567.txt

RIIIIIGHT. -49 RATING POINTS, FU GOKO!

Wait, I don't get what's wrong with that. You played a game and you lost and lost rating for it. What are you angry at goko for?

I really can't tell whether you're serious or not

[Robz888]

Here I quit at turn 4 as it downed on me that my Minion/King's Court plan would be outgunned by his Hamlet/Tunnel engine.

http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130409/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1365518665567.txt

RIIIIIGHT. -49 RATING POINTS, FU GOKO!

Wait, I don't get what's wrong with that. You played a game and you lost and lost rating for it. What are you angry at goko for?

I'm also confused. You SHOULD lose points in that situation. I want you to lose points for that exact thing.

[ftl]

Here I quit at turn 4 as it downed on me that my Minion/King's Court plan would be outgunned by his Hamlet/Tunnel engine.

http://dom.retrobox.eu/?/20130409/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1365518665567.txt

RIIIIIGHT. -49 RATING POINTS, FU GOKO!

Wait, I don't get what's wrong with that. You played a game and you lost and lost rating for it. What are you angry at goko for?

I really can't tell whether you're serious or not

I was being serious. Were you joking and I was just not getting it? Sorry if that's the case.

[SCSN]

@Rob/Ftl I "quit" because my computer crashed and was being sarcastic about it in my post. This would have been one of the easiest wins ever against a player of much lower rank whom I only played because I didn't feel like waiting any longer.

I think that's really far down the list of priorities tbh.  I am habituated to the fact that in most online games, if I disconnect, I lose, and such is life.

Huh, well, I'm so completely not used to this! The only two games I've played online prior to Goko dominion are poker at many different sites and Isotropic dominion. Every single time my computer has ever crashed or my connection went down or whatever, I've been able to reconnect and rejoin the games. I probably played about a million hands of poker or so, so that's saying alot!

I found the quitters frustrating, but losing because of a computer crash really puts me on lifetilt and makes me reluctant to play again.