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Author Topic: Tag-lines for cards  (Read 29529 times)

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Watno

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #50 on: April 05, 2013, 12:15:44 pm »
0

What's the Navigator-Royal Seal synergy?
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SirPeebles

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #51 on: April 05, 2013, 12:23:13 pm »
+1

Navigator is nice when you want to quickly cycle through to a key card, and don't have much draw.  I recently found it to be quite useful in a Rebuild deck.  The terminal silver helps you reach $5, and the navigation helps me skip past hands that either have no Rebuild or in which Rebuild and my lone Duchy collide.
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #52 on: April 05, 2013, 12:44:28 pm »
0

What's the Navigator-Royal Seal synergy?
That's the most fascinating thing about it. I don't know. I have absolutely no idea what's the synergy, but it's damn powerful, at least when taking into account how weak both cards are on their own and how they seemingly don't interact with each other at all. It doesn't win strong big money cards such as JoaT, Wharf and Courtyard, but it wins when none of those are available and there is no engine support or stronger combos. Once a 40-something player pulled it off against me in Iso and won. Ever since I have been winning games with it, though the situation where it's viable isn't very common.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #53 on: April 05, 2013, 12:45:21 pm »
0

Navigator is nice when you want to quickly cycle through to a key card, and don't have much draw.  I recently found it to be quite useful in a Rebuild deck.  The terminal silver helps you reach $5, and the navigation helps me skip past hands that either have no Rebuild or in which Rebuild and my lone Duchy collide.

I think this is very true in the rare cases where your key card is not a terminal Action (Rebuild being a great example). In my experience, if I'm trying to cycle to my Witch or Mountebank more often, Chancellor and Navigator tend to do more harm than good.

I recently had a single Tactician deck where Navigator came in very handy on my Tactician turns. Many Tactician hands start with an empty discard pile, so it was nice to skip past five cards, getting me to my next shuffle—and my next Tactician hand—much faster.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2013, 12:54:03 pm by LastFootnote »
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markusin

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #54 on: April 05, 2013, 02:10:54 pm »
+1

Navigator is nice when you want to quickly cycle through to a key card, and don't have much draw.  I recently found it to be quite useful in a Rebuild deck.  The terminal silver helps you reach $5, and the navigation helps me skip past hands that either have no Rebuild or in which Rebuild and my lone Duchy collide.

I think this is very true in the rare cases where your key card is not a terminal Action (Rebuild being a great example). In my experience, if I'm trying to cycle to my Witch or Mountebank more often, Chancellor and Navigator tend to do more harm than good.

I recently had a single Tactician deck where Navigator came in very handy on my Tactician turns. Many Tactician hands start with an empty discard pile, so it was nice to skip past five cards, getting me to my next shuffle—and my next Tactician hand—much faster.

Navigator reminds me of Chancellor, and yet I feel that it is still fundamentally different from Chancellor. The situation above is an example where Navigator is definitely better than the alternative.

Thing is, if you play Chancellor when you've reached the end of your draw pile, it's basically a terminal silver. If you play Navigator in the same situation, it's a terminal silver that also triggers a reshuffle. Whether that's a good thing or not depends on the quality of cards in the clean-up that turn, but it does mean that you tend to see the Navigator itself less often. 

The way I see it, you have less control of your deck reshuffles with Navigator, especially when you choose the discarding option. The rearrangement option of Navigator is nice, but it's hard to make use of it since the card is terminal, unlike Cartography and Apothecary. At best, Navigator is a good support card when you have actions to spare and draw capabilities. Otherwise, it really tends to get in the way of the power terminals.

Personally, I feel it's discard option is better, but using the discard option of the oracle and catacombs somehow feels more rewarding. The tag-line "Navigator: As bad as it looks" was meant to be more of a stab at it's card art than the effect itself.
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SirPeebles

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #55 on: April 05, 2013, 02:46:42 pm »
+2

markusin, I feel like you're looking at Navigator as nothing more than a terminal Silver which cycles and provides some terminal deck rearrangement.  Yes, it has those things, but you're missing probably the biggest feature, which is that it lets you peek at your next hand and toss it if it looks subpar.  Yes, this can be a bit of a gamble; the next hand may be no better.  But it's certainly nice to be able to do. 

I think this is very true in the rare cases where your key card is not a terminal Action (Rebuild being a great example). In my experience, if I'm trying to cycle to my Witch or Mountebank more often, Chancellor and Navigator tend to do more harm than good.

That's a fair point.  Another key card it works with is Familiar, both for getting to Familiar and for getting to the Potion.
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Axxle

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #56 on: April 05, 2013, 03:02:14 pm »
+1

So... Taglines!

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markusin

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #57 on: April 05, 2013, 03:28:54 pm »
0

markusin, I feel like you're looking at Navigator as nothing more than a terminal Silver which cycles and provides some terminal deck rearrangement.  Yes, it has those things, but you're missing probably the biggest feature, which is that it lets you peek at your next hand and toss it if it looks subpar.  Yes, this can be a bit of a gamble; the next hand may be no better.  But it's certainly nice to be able to do.

That is probably its biggest feature actually. I guess I was focusing more on the subtleties of the card rather than the ability that sticks out the most. I did really want to point out the non-optional top-deck inspection can mess things up when it comes to the reshuffle.

It's kind of indiscriminate when it discards 5 cards, but that's totally okay. It's usually obvious when a hand is going to be bad. I do feel that, In games where +2 actions is scarce or non-existent and it has to compete with a lot of other terminals, it's a big gamble to play it over other terminals whose potential benefits are perhaps smaller but more reliable. Maybe I'm not being fair enough, but to me it doesn't stand out above most of the other $4 terminals.
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #58 on: April 05, 2013, 04:11:22 pm »
+3

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #59 on: April 05, 2013, 04:15:29 pm »
+27

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AdamH

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #60 on: April 05, 2013, 04:17:04 pm »
+4

Peddler: I'm a cheap date, but only if you promise me a lot of action.

Brilliant! And she can help you get her friends, too  :P
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dondon151

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #61 on: April 05, 2013, 10:36:25 pm »
0

Goons: The Victory cards don't matter.
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SCSN

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #62 on: April 06, 2013, 06:03:09 am »
+3

Possession: RTFM
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #63 on: April 06, 2013, 06:28:36 am »
+1

Treasure Maps - don't put me in the setup while playing against luckers
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #64 on: April 06, 2013, 07:00:58 am »
+2

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markusin

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #65 on: April 06, 2013, 10:24:30 am »
0

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chwhite

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #66 on: April 06, 2013, 04:48:23 pm »
0

Navigator: As bad as it looks.
It must look pretty good to you! Navigator's not bad.
It's not next to useless like Thief or Scout, but realistically speaking it is pretty bad. It has some nice synergy with Royal Seal, Native Village, Wishing Well, Mystic and probably some others, but that's pretty much it.

Kirian: Not true. KC-Warehouse at the start of your turn leaves you with three cards in hand, because KC is -1 card, Warehouse is -1 card and every Warehouse effect is +3 -3 which is 0.

Navigator's mediocre, but it's better than most people think.

In particular, I like it quite a bit as an early-game accelerant when you're swimming in actions and there's not a whole lot of harmful Attacks which you need to prioritize instead.  (And, in that use, it is indeed quite similar to Chancellor.)
« Last Edit: April 06, 2013, 04:50:00 pm by chwhite »
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chwhite

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #67 on: April 06, 2013, 04:51:23 pm »
+2

Hamlet: +Buy or not +Buy, that is the question.

Check my sig. :P
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #68 on: April 08, 2013, 10:54:38 am »
+1

Vagrant: the fixed Scout.
Ambassador: just keep thinning!
Curse: at least you can't Swindle it into anything worse.
Curse: Swindle this!
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #69 on: April 08, 2013, 04:30:45 pm »
+1

"Tournament is my name, variance is my game."
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #70 on: April 09, 2013, 02:08:31 am »
+12

Bureaucrat: perhaps, the most powerful card in all of Dominion.

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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #71 on: April 09, 2013, 07:29:46 am »
+1

Pillage: Your opponent will make this face.
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Count: 2 Minutes later...
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #72 on: April 10, 2013, 02:19:19 pm »
0

Treasury: it is just as effective this turn as it was last turn.

Hoard: looking for an excuse to load up on duchies?

King's Court: make your friends wish they were playing Settlers of Catan.
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #73 on: April 10, 2013, 07:18:31 pm »
+1

Black Market: Have I got a deal for you ...
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Re: Tag-lines for cards
« Reply #74 on: April 11, 2013, 01:07:54 am »
+1

Ambassador: just keep thinning!

Only in 2-player...
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