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Author Topic: Ironmelter + Expansion  (Read 2782 times)

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KingZog3

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Ironmelter + Expansion
« on: March 19, 2013, 12:22:19 am »
+2

I've extended to original post and added 9 new cards. Still need a lot of testing, but some are showing to be fun and interesting. The theme is Card Types, with a sub theme of hybrid action and treasure decks and moving between them. For clarification, card types are Actions, Treasure, Victories, Curses, Shelters, Ruins, Reactions, Attack etc.

Names are themed on a Dominion world moving toward industry, or early factories. Not modern machines, but pulleys or advanced metal working. Something like that. You'll see.

Edited a lot of things.

Cog - Action:
Costs $2
+1 Action
Trash a card from your hand. If it’s an…
Action card gain a Silver into your hand.
Silver gain a Duchy.

EDIT: Changed the effects of trashing. It now works well with itself. It may not be a 2$ card anymore.

Smithing Village – Action:
Costs 2$
+3 Cards
+2 Actions
Discard 4 cards.

Simple card. Just wanted a +2 action in the mix of cards. EDIT: Changed the +cards and discard amount.

Scrap Metal - Action:
Costs $3
Discard 2 Action cards or 2 Treasure cards. If you do, gain a card equal to their combined costs.

EDIT: Removed Self-Trash. Added "only treasures or actions"

Pulley – Action
Costs $3
+1 Card
+1 Action
Reveal your hand. Reveal the top card of your deck. If it does not share types with any cards in your hand, put it into your hand. Otherwise put it back or discard it.

A cantrip that can be a lab. Pulls up things usually in a way you don't need though, hence the $3. One silver won't help much, and 1 action isn't great, unless it's a power card or attack. The discard ability is so that it doesn't have to put VP back on top if you have VP in hand (or whatever you don't need on top of your deck). Still needs some testing, but $3 seems right. Maybe $4, not 100% sure yet. Has a likeness to Wishing Well. EDIT: Changed wording.

Iron Melter  -  Action:
Costs $3
Trash a card from your hand. Gain a differently named card costing the same amount.
If it’s an…
Action +2 Actions
Treasure +$2
Victory +2 Cards

This is from the original post. I changed the price down to $3. Still feels it needs a change since it's only really good in specific setups. As mentioned in the comments, I had an idea to make it a sort of Transmute that isn't so bad.

Laborer – Action – Reaction:
Costs $4
+1 Action
+1$
+1 Buy
-----------------
When another player plays at least 4 cards of one type you may discard this from your hand. If you do, gain a Silver on top of your deck.

EDIT: On hiatus. Other cards are more interesting and probably more useful, so I'll just leave this here unfixed for the world to see. I may come back to it at some point.

Tax – Treasure:
Costs $4
Worth $1
You may trash a treasure card from your hand. Gain an action card costing up to $2 more.

Remodel is $4 and is terminal. This doesn't take an action as it's a treasure and is worth $1. However, it can only trash treasure into actions. Good for turning silvers in $5's, but I feel it's too rigid. I would consider taking out either "Trash only treasure" or "gain only actions." Depends how it plays in future and what people say.

Paper Boy – Action – Attack:
Costs 4$
+$2
Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand reveals the top card of their deck, discards it, and places a card from their hand that does not share types with the discarded card on top of their deck. If all cards share one type, they reveal their hand put a card back on top of their deck.

Strong at the start of the game. It'll either Bureaucrat you, or sort of Cutpurse you, putting the copper back on top. It's good late game too, but in money heavy decks, players will probably just have all money and put their lowest one back on top, or in action heavy decks just be able to draw what ever they put down. Like Cutpurse, good early, ok late but probably better off trashing it depending on what other people do.

Lead Figurine – Action:
Costs $5
Discard any number of cards. +$1 per different card type discarded.
---------------
When you gain this, immediately have a buy phase with +$2 and +1 Buy in which you may use treasure cards that were used to buy this card. This cannot cause you to have more than two consecutive buy phases.

EDIT: As pointed out to me, this card wants to be annoying and confusing. I'm going to remove it.

Protest – Action – Attack:
Costs $5
+$2
Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand reveals two cards that do not share types and discards them. If all their cards share types, they reveal their hand and discard two cards.

This is definitely a strong card. Looks sort of, kind of, like Ghost ship. While you'll probably discard a VP as your first card, you'll have to discard a good card after (or at least something that could be used this turn). Otherwise it's always just a militia, which is usually not a bad card to play. I think it still needs a little boost though, so I may give another small bonus to the attacker, like maybe +buy, not sure. EDIT: Fixed wording.

Otherwise, I still plan to add 2 cards to make 12. I would like a curser, but it's been hard to get one in theme with card types. Any feedback or suggestions will be much appreciated, even if it's negative. Seriously, it's probably the best kind =P
« Last Edit: March 22, 2013, 12:54:46 pm by KingZog3 »
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Kirian

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2013, 12:35:35 am »
0

This with Graverobber and Band of Misfits, plus a village and a $4 drawer (or $4 curser) in the kingdom, could get really, really messy.

Man, where's Celestial Chameleon on this?
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NoMoreFun

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2013, 06:16:04 am »
+1

Very interesting idea. It probably would be ok at $3. I can imagine it being good for gaining Silvers from early terminals, and Duchies late game, or for setting up engines, but it's not exactly a spammable card or an early power card, except in some kingdoms, like with Fool's Gold.
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2013, 02:41:23 pm »
+1

Very interesting idea. It probably would be ok at $3. I can imagine it being good for gaining Silvers from early terminals, and Duchies late game, or for setting up engines, but it's not exactly a spammable card or an early power card, except in some kingdoms, like with Fool's Gold.

It's not spammable like Minions, but many Ironmelters could trash a $5 card and Duchy over and over again to draw an entire deck (since the card goes into your hand). Similar to a level 2 City but requires some setup and is limited to #of cards in the Kingdom.

This with Graverobber and Band of Misfits, plus a village and a $4 drawer (or $4 curser) in the kingdom, could get really, really messy.

Man, where's Celestial Chameleon on this?
That's a pretty specific setup. Nothing is like BoM, so without it this wouldn't work. There are also not many $4 Cursers, so while this specific combo can get crazy (and there are other messy/crazy combos with the published cards), I don't think  it would really affect the card enough to change it much.
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heron

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2013, 03:04:50 pm »
0

Your level two city comparison isn't quite right; If you alternatively trash actions and victories with ironmelters you get no net gain of cards. Also it would only work once. I agree that three is probably a good price; it's essentially choose one: +2 Actions/Cards/$2 with a mainly neutral effect added.
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2013, 04:00:18 pm »
0

Your level two city comparison isn't quite right; If you alternatively trash actions and victories with ironmelters you get no net gain of cards. Also it would only work once. I agree that three is probably a good price; it's essentially choose one: +2 Actions/Cards/$2 with a mainly neutral effect added.
Upon reflection I see your (and NoMoreFun) point. $3 would be good. The effect may be neutral in some cases, but the ability to change a card in hand can be quite good. Change a $5 like Junk Dealer into a +card, or something else that help and gain the two actions can be cool, but yes, not more than a $3.

Although it would be quite strong when changing $3 cards to silver, giving a $4 bonus and getting rid of a no longer needed card.
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2013, 04:03:52 pm »
+1

As I've been trying to make cards based on card types, I've also thought of a variant with the same principle.

Trash a card from your card. Gain a card of a different type costing at most $2 more.
If it's an...
Action - +1 Action
Treasure - +$1
Victory - +1 Card

Changed from 2 to 1 for the bonuses because the remodel is now a part of it. This would definitely be a $5 card.
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TWoos

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2013, 06:20:00 pm »
+2

Trash a card from your card. Gain a card of a different type costing at most $2 more.
If it's an...
Action - +1 Action
Treasure - +$1
Victory - +1 Card

Reminds me of a Transmute that doesn't suck.
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2013, 08:18:20 pm »
0

Trash a card from your card. Gain a card of a different type costing at most $2 more.
If it's an...
Action - +1 Action
Treasure - +$1
Victory - +1 Card

Reminds me of a Transmute that doesn't suck.

Except Transmute 1) costs potion 2) can turn estates into Gold, so this wouldn't EXPLICITLY better...but pretty much yeah.
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TWoos

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Re: Ironmelter
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2013, 09:00:07 pm »
0

Trash a card from your card. Gain a card of a different type costing at most $2 more.
If it's an...
Action - +1 Action
Treasure - +$1
Victory - +1 Card

Reminds me of a Transmute that doesn't suck.

Except Transmute 1) costs potion 2) can turn estates into Gold, so this wouldn't EXPLICITLY better...but pretty much yeah.

I was thinking more of the changing types through an upgrade.  Yeah, it's not really exactly similar.
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ednever

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2013, 09:09:17 pm »
0

Smithing Village is completely worse than Hamlet.

(Only edge case I can think of is when possessed. But that would be true of any worse card)

Ed
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2013, 09:09:57 pm »
0

Smithing Village is completely worse than Hamlet.

(Only edge case I can think of is when possessed. But that would be true of any worse card)

Ed

True. I just added it fast for a +2 actions. I'll put something to make it different.
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One Armed Man

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #12 on: March 20, 2013, 09:23:46 pm »
0

Quote
Scrap Metal - Action:
Costs $3
Discard 2 cards. Gain a card equal to their combined costs.
Much worse?! Discard a province and a copper/curse/ruins to flat out gain an extra province is pretty amazing. With an Estate in hand, this like +$3 when you have a silver (or other one of this) and +$5 when you have a gold. That makes this a Baron analog. It is a bad opener, but great later.
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heron

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #13 on: March 20, 2013, 09:32:24 pm »
+1

An idea for smithing village is +3 Cards, +2 Actions, Discard 4 Cards.
Lead Figurine needs a rewording. I don't understand it.
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #14 on: March 20, 2013, 09:54:01 pm »
0

An idea for smithing village is +3 Cards, +2 Actions, Discard 4 Cards.
Lead Figurine needs a rewording. I don't understand it.
I like that smithing village. Almost better than warehouse, so it's not longer a $2. As for Lead Figurine I'll work on it. To explain now, when you gain it, you immediately get a buy phase with $2 and an extra buy, whether it's your turn or not. So $2 and 2 buys. Any treasures that were used to buy the card can be used in the second buy. If no treasures were used (you gained it through Border Village or something) means you have a buy with just the $2 and extra buy. If I played 3 Silvers and bought LF, then my second buy is 3 Silvers +$2 +1 buy. Instant province, but the regular action is not that great.

It's a subtle difference between "gaining" and "buying." Buying is gaining, but gaining isn't always buying.

Quote
Scrap Metal - Action:
Costs $3
Discard 2 cards. Gain a card equal to their combined costs.
Much worse?! Discard a province and a copper/curse/ruins to flat out gain an extra province is pretty amazing. With an Estate in hand, this like +$3 when you have a silver (or other one of this) and +$5 when you have a gold. That makes this a Baron analog. It is a bad opener, but great later.

Yes I have noticed this. I will adjust for the ridiculousness. I have thought of a "trash Scrap Metal" clause on it and up the price.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2013, 10:00:52 pm by KingZog3 »
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heron

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #15 on: March 20, 2013, 10:55:30 pm »
0

Is it intended that you can buy up the lead figurines for +$20 once you have $5?
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2013, 11:14:46 pm »
0

Is it intended that you can buy up the lead figurines for +$20 once you have $5?

I could add an Outpost-like clause or a "cannot buy LF" clause to fix that.

- Nope, I'll put an Outpost-like clause to stop KC and TR stuff.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2013, 11:16:53 pm by KingZog3 »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #17 on: March 21, 2013, 11:51:40 am »
+1

Cog - Action:
Costs $2
+1 Action
Trash a card from your hand. If it’s an…
Action card gain a Treasure costing equal or less than the trashed card
Treasure card gain an Action card costing at most $1 more than the trashed card

Strange card that I don't really know if it's too strong or too rigid. I gave it  +1 action because of the rigidity. It doesn't really serve much use other than going to silver or to $4 action cards. Of course this changes with special treasures. Need to test it out, but I have a feeling it's definitely a $2.

This is way, way too weak at any price. I think you severely underestimate how much it hurts to discard or trash useful cards from your hand. The main use you foresee, trashing a Silver from your hand to gain a $4 Action card, barely increases the value of your deck, and it drops that turn's spending power by $2! With or without +1 Action, I'd never buy Cog.

Smithing Village – Action:
Costs 2$
+3 Cards
+2 Actions
Discard 4 cards.

Simple card. Just wanted a +2 action in the mix of cards. EDIT: Changed the +cards and discard amount.

It's an average amount of cycling and an extra action in exchange for lowering your handsize by 2. I don't foresee that being a good idea in most circumstances. If you really, really need to play your power card as often as possible and there's no other cycling available, I could see maybe using this. Even then, the costs might outweigh the benefits.

A $2 price tag on a card doesn't mean the card has to be really weak. There's lots of reasons a card might cost $2. Here are some of them:

  • You need lots of them in order to make them good (Fool's Gold, Native Village)
  • You need to build a specific type of deck before it becomes powerful (Cellar, Secret Chamber, Poor House)
  • The card grants a marginal benefit that won't be overpowered if spammed (Pearl Diver, Vagrant)
  • The card is cheap so that you can attempt to make a comeback when you're being hammered by Attacks (Moat, Lighthouse, Chapel)

Scrap Metal - Action:
Costs $3
Discard 2 cards. If you do, gain a card equal to their combined costs. Trash Scrap Metal.

Like a Forge, but much worse. It can't trash huge amounts of junk and gain a super card in one turn. It discards your good cards to get a better one in your deck. Can be used to get Golds from early actions or silvers, so it has a clear purpose, especially in BM decks. Should there be a "If Scrap Metal is discarded by this card, you may trash Scrap Metal?" Pleasing aesthetically though, since many scarp metal can be used to make something nice. EDIT: Added self trashing

The reason that type-agnostic trash-for-benefit cards work is that, generally speaking, you're sacrificing more when you trash a more expensive card. Discard-for-benefit cards don't work that way. The reason is that discarding an expensive Treasure or Action card is usually a big sacrifice, but discarding a Victory card is something you're happy to do. That's why Vault-type cards give a benefit based on the number of cards discarded, rather than their cost. Making Scrap Metal a one-shot doesn't fix this issue. It just makes the card really luck-based.

Pulley – Action
Costs $3
+1 Card
+1 Action
Reveal the top card of your deck. If you do not have a card of that type in your hand, draw the card. Otherwise discard it or put it back on top of your deck.

A cantrip that can be a lab. Pulls up things usually in a way you don't need though, hence the $3. One silver won't help much, and 1 action isn't great, unless it's a power card or attack. The discard ability is so that it doesn't have to put VP back on top if you have VP in hand (or whatever you don't need on top of your deck). Still needs some testing, but $3 seems right. Maybe $4, not 100% sure yet. Has a likeness to Wishing Well.

Pulley has wording ambiguities. You can't say 'card of that type' when you're talking about cards that can have multiple types. Your "clarification" at the top of the thread is counter to the rules of Dominion. There are no "sub types". Every card type in the game is a full-fledged type. Even with your arbitrary dichotomy, there are several cards that have more than one "type": Great Hall, Nobles, Harem, Necropolis, and Overgrown Estate. You could say, "if that card doesn't share a type with any card in your hand."

Also, the card should require a hand reveal so that we know you don't have a card of that type in your hand.

Iron Melter  -  Action:
Costs $3
Trash a card from your hand. Gain a differently named card costing the same amount.
If it’s an…
Action +2 Actions
Treasure +$2
Victory +2 Cards

This is from the original post. I changed the price down to $3. Still feels it needs a change since it's only really good in specific setups. As mentioned in the comments, I had an idea to make it a sort of Transmute that isn't so bad.

Interesting idea. It's hard to see how it'll play.

Laborer – Action – Reaction:
Costs $4
+1 Action
+1$
+1 Buy
-----------------
When another player plays at least 4 cards of one type you may discard this from your hand. If you do, gain a Silver on top of your deck.

This one needs testing, but the top part is a $4 card as a Market without the +card. The reaction gives you an edge when your opponent has either a mega turn, or simply plays lots of money. It can be really good at the start though since people often play 4-5 coppers, so I may change this to "Gain a copper in hand" or something similar.

The reaction is ambiguously worded. You should probably say, "When another player plays their 4th Action or their 4th Treasure in a turn…". The Reaction effect itself seems really weak.

Tax – Treasure:
Costs $4
Worth $1
You may trash a treasure card from your hand. Gain an action card costing up to $2 more.

Remodel is $4 and is terminal. This doesn't take an action as it's a treasure and is worth $1. However, it can only trash treasure into actions. Good for turning silvers in $5's, but I feel it's too rigid. I would consider taking out either "Trash only treasure" or "gain only actions." Depends how it plays in future and what people say.

Strange card, but worth playtesting. It's hard to see how this would play.

Paper Boy – Action – Attack:
Costs 4$
+$2
Each other player reveals the top card of their deck, discards it, and places a card from their hand of a different type on top of their deck. If they do not have a different type of card, they put any card from their hand back on top.

Strong at the start of the game. It'll either Bureaucrat you, or sort of Cutpurse you, putting the copper back on top. It's good late game too, but in money heavy decks, players will probably just have all money and put their lowest one back on top, or in action heavy decks just be able to draw what ever they put down. Like Cutpurse, good early, ok late but probably better off trashing it depending on what other people do.

I get that you're trying to use card types in creative ways, but this seems really arbitrary. Again, 'different type' needs to be reworded.

Lead Figurine – Action:
Costs $5
Discard any number of cards. +$1 per different card type discarded.
---------------
When you gain this, immediately have a buy phase with +$2 and +1 Buy in which you may use treasure cards that were used to buy this card. This cannot cause you to have more than two consecutive buy phases.

I was having trouble really balancing this card. It's probably still a bit unbalanced, but the on gain can be really good. With $6, you can buy this, then a Province in one turn. It's not a card you want to gain, since you'll just have $2 to spend, which is what makes it interesting. However, if someone does ambassador it you, you could buy the last estate before his turn is done to end the game. Just a fun point that'll never happen, but interesting. EDIT: Tried to fix wording, will still work on it. Added Outpost-like clause.

Treasure cards are not 'used' to buy cards. Treasures (usually) produce coins when played, and the coins are used to buy cards. Also, adding an additional Buy phase is just begging for lots of rules confusion.

Protest – Action – Attack:
Costs $5
+$2
Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand discards 2 cards. The cards must be of different types. If they have only 1 type, they reveal their hand and discard two cards of the same type.

This is definitely a strong card. Looks sort of, kind of, like Ghost ship. While you'll probably discard a VP as your first card, you'll have to discard a good card after (or at least something that could be used this turn). Otherwise it's always just a militia, which is usually not a bad card to play. I think it still needs a little boost though, so I may give another small bonus to the attacker, like maybe +buy, not sure.

Pretty brutal. Again, 'different types' is ambiguous. "The cards may not share a type" would work. The cards must be revealed before being discarded in order to show that they aren't the same type.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 02:17:55 pm by LastFootnote »
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #18 on: March 21, 2013, 04:47:02 pm »
0

Thanks for the feedback. The harshness is good, keeps my ego in check =). I agree with almost everything you say. The exception may be Smithing Village. I do agree that it is weak, but it cycles similar to Warehouse, gives the extra action at the price of 1 more card. I can try to change it, but really it's the other cards that need more attention.

I already changed some cards. Cog I kept the idea, changing the trashing effects. Some I just completely won't bother with, like Lead Figurine, now that you mention how it is rather rule bending and confusing.

Making Scrap Metal a one-shot doesn't fix this issue. It just makes the card really luck-based.
Scrap Metal self-trash was not meant as a fix. I knew it was still a luck driven card, but couldn't think of a fix, so I just put that on. My mistake for not saying. However, I have added a "only 2 treasures" or "only 2 action cards clause. That will fix it a bit.

Iron Melter accidentally lost the "gain into you hand" part from the original post, but it's ok like this. I think I should put it back in though. Either way I still don't fully know when it's most useful, aside from needing many cards of one price that do a variety of things.
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RTT

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2013, 03:09:09 am »
+1

Quote
Paper Boy – Action – Attack:
Costs 4$
+$2
Each other player reveals the top card of their deck, discards it, and places a card from their hand of a different type on top of their deck. If they do not have a different type of card, they put any card from their hand back on top.

this has lockdown potential if played multiple times. Either in a engine or in a 4 player game. Not to mention Kings Court ... :o

with a limit to every Player having more than 4 cards in hand it might be balanced.
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Asper

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2013, 10:58:16 am »
+1

Quote
Paper Boy – Action – Attack:
Costs 4$
+$2
Each other player reveals the top card of their deck, discards it, and places a card from their hand of a different type on top of their deck. If they do not have a different type of card, they put any card from their hand back on top.

this has lockdown potential if played multiple times. Either in a engine or in a 4 player game. Not to mention Kings Court ... :o

with a limit to every Player having more than 4 cards in hand it might be balanced.

Like RTT said. Paper Boy is a mix of Ghost Ship and Cutpurse, and it combines the strengths of those two. The type probably won't matter that often, and if anything, it makes the attack even stronger. The 4-card clause is a nice and easy way to balance this more.

KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2013, 12:50:59 pm »
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Quote
Paper Boy – Action – Attack:
Costs 4$
+$2
Each other player reveals the top card of their deck, discards it, and places a card from their hand of a different type on top of their deck. If they do not have a different type of card, they put any card from their hand back on top.

this has lockdown potential if played multiple times. Either in a engine or in a 4 player game. Not to mention Kings Court ... :o

with a limit to every Player having more than 4 cards in hand it might be balanced.

Like RTT said. Paper Boy is a mix of Ghost Ship and Cutpurse, and it combines the strengths of those two. The type probably won't matter that often, and if anything, it makes the attack even stronger. The 4-card clause is a nice and easy way to balance this more.

Indeed. I don't know why I didn't put that in before.
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jonaskoelker

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2017, 07:38:15 am »
+2

Nice work! If I had a copy lying around, I would definitely play with your cards.

In terms of weight and importance, that was already 90% of my post. The remaining 10% are my thoughts about how you could improve the wording.

Scrap Metal - Action:
Costs $3
Discard 2 Action cards or 2 Treasure cards. If you do, gain a card equal to their combined costs.
Pedantic wording issue: it's the card's cost, not the card itself, which should be equal to their combined costs.

Suggestion: "gain a card with cost equal to [...]".

Pulley – Action
Costs $3
+1 Card
+1 Action
Reveal your hand. Reveal the top card of your deck. If it does not share types with any cards in your hand, put it into your hand. Otherwise put it back or discard it.
If I reveal Fool's Gold and my hand is {Tunnel, Harem}, do I put the Fool's Gold in hand? In other words: what, exactly, does "share types" mean—an equal set of types, or just a set of types with a non-empty intersection?

Suggestion: "If it does not share a type with any card in your hand, [...]", in case Tunnel blocks Fool's Gold. Maybe "Put it into your hand unless you have a card in hand which has all the types of the revealed card and vice versa" for the other interpretation. But only maybe, because this looks very wordy.

Iron Melter  -  Action:
Costs $3
Trash a card from your hand. Gain a differently named card costing the same amount.
If it’s an…
Action +2 Actions
Treasure +$2
Victory +2 Cards
Is "it" the trashed or gained card? I'm 73% confident it's the gained card, but I would like that number to be much higher. (The Ironworks template works for Ironworks because Ironworks only does stuff to a single card.)

Suggestion: "if the [gained/trashed] card is...".

Laborer – Action – Reaction:
Costs $4
+1 Action
+1$
+1 Buy
-----------------
When another player plays at least 4 cards of one type you may discard this from your hand. If you do, gain a Silver on top of your deck.
If I were a pedantic m*f'er, I would point out that you never play 4 cards, you always play your cards one at a time, so the reaction can never trigger :P

Less tongue-in-cheek, suppose another player plays: Village, Spy, Spy, Minion, Relic, Silver, Counterfeit trashing Copper.

After which play may I react? I'm thinking Minion (4th action), Relic (4th attack) and Copper, 1st play (4th play of a treasure).

The template "when <condition> is true, do <effect>" has problems. I think "when <event>, if <condition>, do <effect>" is better.

In this particular example, I suggest "When another player plays a card, if they have at least 4 cards in play which have a type in common, <effect>" or "When another player plays a card, if they have played at least 4 cards this turn which have a type in common, <effect>".

Tracking is much easier with the first template. The difference may matter for King's Court (1+3 plays, 2 cards in play) and Embargo (1 play, 0 cards in play), among many other edge cases. I think the number of plays will always be at least as large as the number of cards in play—and I can't wait for people to tell me how wrong I am :D

Tax – Treasure:
Costs $4
Worth $1
You may trash a treasure card from your hand. Gain an action card costing up to $2 more.
If you choose not to trash a card, you gain an action card costing up to $2 more than... what, exactly?

Suggestion: "[...] hand. If you do, gain [...]".

Also, since it is different from the Tax from Empires, giving it a new name would make the sets more compatible. I don't think anything breaks if a card and a card-shaped object have a name in common, but you never know :)

Paper Boy – Action – Attack:
Costs 4$
+$2
Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand reveals the top card of their deck, discards it, and places a card from their hand that does not share types with the discarded card on top of their deck. If all cards share one type, they reveal their hand put a card back on top of their deck.
For accountability purposes, if they don't reveal their hand they should reveal the card they topdeck.

Just like earlier, I still think "share types" is unclear.

Lead Figurine – Action:
Costs $5
Discard any number of cards. +$1 per different card type discarded.
---------------
When you gain this, immediately have a buy phase with +$2 and +1 Buy in which you may use treasure cards that were used to buy this card. This cannot cause you to have more than two consecutive buy phases.

I don't think the rules define what using treasure cards means; I suppose you meant play.

The rules also don't define what "using a treasure card to buy a card" means. Suppose I play Counterfeit (trashing nothing), Gold, Gold, Copper, then buy a Silver and this. Am I using Counterfeit to buy this? I could buy it just off of 2xGold, but only if I don't buy a Silver first (which I do) unless I have more +buy from some other source.

Suppose I Crown a Woodcutter, am I using Crown for my second and third buy this turn? Am I using it for the first buy? Does it depend on whether I need the money from the second play of Woodcutter for my first buy?

Suppose I play Silver, and Counterfeit trashing Copper; am I using the Copper to buy this? If I choose to (re)use the Copper, do I play it from the trash, and then put it in my discard pile in my next clean-up phase?

Protest – Action – Attack:
Costs $5
+$2
Each other player with 5 or more cards in hand reveals two cards that do not share types and discards them. If all their cards share types, they reveal their hand and discard two cards.
"share types" vs. "have a type in common" again.

And that's all. Let me reiterate: nice work, would definitely play with these if I had them lying around.
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KingZog3

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2017, 11:07:25 pm »
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Talk about Necro-ing a thread :P I made these during my first few months playing Dominion. Maybe Ill read through these again, see what I even did 5 years ago.
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jonaskoelker

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Re: Ironmelter + Expansion
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2017, 02:39:17 pm »
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Talk about Necro-ing a thread :P
*Looks at calendar*
*Looks at Nocture release schedule*

Necromancy is in season ;)
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