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Author Topic: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)  (Read 16163 times)

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Asper

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+3

First of all, sorry for opening a new Thread on the same set. Old Thread was mostly discussion about two cards not (anymore) present here, and the biggest part is new, anyway.

Magic was designed as some kind of expansion-expansion, featuring mechanics from Seaside, Intrigue, and the two small sets Cornucopia and Alchemy (Hinterlands just happened to smuggle itself in) all kinds of sets. The main idea are cards that somehow help defend against attacks and cards that change the balance of existing cards as a sub theme (you'll see what i mean).



Swamp
+ 2 Actions
Discard a card.
When you play or buy this the first time in a turn: + 2 Buys

While this is in the supply, when you would gain a card, you may gain this instead.
0$ Action



Shaman
+ 1$
Each other player gains a Curse. Each player (including you) may put a card from his hand back in the supply and gain a card costing exactly 0$.
If you gain a card this way, put it in your hand.
0$P Action - Attack



Dwarf
+ 1 Action
Discard the top card of your deck. Look at the bottom card of your deck. You may put it in your hand. You may put a card from your hand to the bottom of your deck.
2$ Action



Ranger V3
+ 1 Action
Look at the top two card of your deck. Put one of them in your hand and discard the other one.
$2 Action



Wizard
+ 3 Cards
Discard any number of Action cards and Potions from your hand. +2$ per card discarded this way.

When you gain this, gain a Potion.
2$P Action



Artefact
1$

If you just resolved an Action Card, you may discard this. if you do: + 1 Action
3$ Treasure - Reaction



Elf
+ 3 actions
+ 1 Buy

When you buy this, you may overpay for it. If you do, for each $ overpaid, put a card from your hand back in the supply and gain another card costing at most the same as the returned card, putting it on top of your deck.
2+$ Action



Seer
Discard a card. Reveal cards from your deck until you reveal an Action Card. Immediately discard all other cards revealed and play the revealed Action Card.
$3 Action



Sunken City
+ 2 Actions
Reveal the top card of your deck. If it is an Action card, put it in your hand. If it is not, discard it.

At the start of your next turn:
+ 2 Actions
3$ Action - Duration



Incantation
+ 1 Card
+ 1 Action
You may trash a Card from your hand. If you do and it is an Action Card, Victory Card or Treasure Card: Reveal Cards from your deck until you reveal a Card of the same type that costs more than the trashed card and put it in your hand. Discard all other revealed cards.
$3P Action



Poisoner
+ 1 Action
Each other player with four or more cards in hand reveals a card from his hand. You decide whether he has to discard it or put it on the top of his deck.
Choose one:
+ 2$;
+ 1 Virtual Potion;
3$P Action - Attack



Amazon Village
+ 1 Card
+ 1 Action

At the start of your next turn:
+ 1 Action

While this is in play, if another player plays an Attack Card, you may immediately gain a copy of the played Attack Card.
4$ Action - Duration



Expedition
+ 1 Card
+ 1 Action
+ 1$
Each player (including you) takes a coin token.
4$ Action



Grand Vizier
+ 1 Action
If you have no more than 2 cards in hand, gain a Treasure Card costing up to 6$.
Trash a card from your hand.

When you trash this, each other player gains a Copper.
$4 Action



Troll
+ 2$
At the start of your clean-up phase, put four Embargo Tokens on any piles in the supply. Every time a player buys a card, he gains one Curse per Embargo Token on that pile.

At the start of your next turn:
Remove four Embargo Tokens from any piles in the supply.
4$ Action - Duration



Dragon
+ 3 Cards
Each other player chooses one: He gains a Curse; Or: He reveals his hand. You decide whether he has to discard it and draw 5 new Cards;
$5 Action - Attack
Swamp already had its own tread. I don't think i want to change much about it for now.



Maze
Each other player gains a Curse.
Value 2 VP for each three Curses in the set of the player with the most Curses in his set at the end of the game (rounded down).
5$ Action - Attack - Victory



Temple
Trash up to three cards from your hand. + 1 Card per card trashed this way.
Value 1 VP per 10 cards in the trash at the end of the game (rounded down).
5$ Action - Victory



Vampire
+ 2 Cards
+ 1 Action
+ 2$
Each other player may reveal a Silver from his hand. If any player does, gain a Curse. If you would gain a Curse, but the Curse pile is empty, trash this.
6$ Action



Enchanted Forest
Value 4 VP
In games using this, you may reveal your hand at the start of your buy phase. During that buy phase, this costs 2$ less for any Curse revealed this way, but never less than 0$.
7* Victory



Palace
Value 1 VP for each three cards in your set that cost 6$ or more and are not Palace cards.
8$ Victory
« Last Edit: June 19, 2013, 02:06:21 pm by Asper »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (not exactly)
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2013, 03:25:07 pm »
+3

Text versions of the cards would be nice, especially for those of us who browse on our phones.
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enfynet

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (not exactly)
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2013, 03:41:13 pm »
+1

^ What he said. It is almost impossible to critique cards in art form.

Also, Tournament will win you PRIZE cards, not PRICE cards. Prize is a reward, Price is how much something costs.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (not exactly)
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2013, 03:45:29 pm »
0

^ What he said. It is almost impossible to critique cards in art form.

Also, Tournament will win you PRIZE cards, not PRICE cards. Prize is a reward, Price is how much something costs.

Thanks for pointing this out, english is not my mother language. ^^'
I'm working on the text versions, it's just a lot to do... Have a bit of patience.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (not exactly)
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2013, 04:39:17 pm »
0

Added text versions of the cards now :)
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eHalcyon

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2013, 04:55:21 pm »
+2

Your font for the main card text looks very... off.  Part of it is that you are using small caps.  For the body text, you can just use Times New Roman and it looks fine.

Some of the card images seem to have different text than your transcriptions.  Also, several have minor wording issues.  I'll try not to pick at most of them.


Dwarf -- interesting.  Probably on the weak side, but that's OK.

Wizard -- initial impression is that it is too powerful and should be $3P.  But I am not sure.

Elf -- transcription doesn't include top decking.  But it should say "put it on top of your deck".

Sunken city -- Why not use the construction, "Now and at the start of your next turn"?  Fishing Village deviates from it because the bonus now and next turn are not the same.

Poisoner -- Wording issues... refer to cards like Pawn and Steward for how to do choices.  Note the use of semi-colons.

Expedition -- Interesting.  Not at all sure how it would play.

Necromancer -- I don't like how this is a targeted attack.

Troll -- I'm just not a fan of this. 

Amazone Village -- Should be "Amazon", right?  This looks way, way too powerful.  It is already worth about $5 as a cantrip trasher, like Upgrade.  But it is also a village, and a duration village at that... and it makes other players think twice before playing any attack.

Maze -- With just 2 players, this is worth only 2VP if Curses split evenly.  If they don't, then it just lets the player who is already winning run away with the game.  With more than 2 players, it feels very swingy (e.g. maybe the player on your left is lucky and has a Watchtower whenever you play Maze, so the third player ends up taking on lots of Curses and the player on your left has Mazes worth 6VP while yours are worth nothing).

Temple -- Too expensive to be an early game trasher.  If you make it worth a lot, your opponent can take advantage easily.  This is also much weaker than Gardens simply because with Gardens you only need to gain a lot of cards... with Temple, you need to gain a lot AND trash them.  And it's more expensive.  Granted, your opponent may be helping... or they could just piggy-back off of your work.

Vampire -- Werewolf would be more thematic.

Enchanted Forest -- OK, I think.

Palace -- Odd.  Not sure how it would play.  It would probably be best in games with gainers like Tunnel and Market Square.

Magic Sword -- I don't like reactions like this, even as a prize.  It just punishes others for playing attacks.  You can pretty much always claim to have this in your hand because there is no penalty to you for bluffing.

Grand Vizier -- Looks too strong.  Non-terminal trashing (of more than one card!) that not only lets you gain Gold (or Venture or what have you) but puts it directly into your hand... man.  Not being able to trash Estates hurts a little, but this is still really, really good.

Seer -- Half Golem.  OK, I guess.

Dragon -- Attack sounds overpowered, like a Pillage-Minion.  I don't know about it.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2013, 05:03:50 pm »
0

Thank you very much for the input. The Prizes are not considered very "serious" cards, actually.
About the others, i'll see what i can do to make them better.

Probably i should change Necromancer to be non-directed. It wasn't originally intended to be a directed attack, but i see it is.

Wizard might be too strong, it originally was too weak, and i'm still testing.

Troll originally was even worse, gicing out Curses to anyone who even bought any card. Well, i like it, but thanks for the feedback.

Amazon Village is too strong, you're right. I don't know what i was thinking.

Temple never seemed too bad to me. But i see how it is a card that other players profit from while you do the work. Didn't think of that.

Palace works nicely as far as my playtesting goes. Either the game becomes longer or shorter, it's weird ^^

Actually Grand Vizier was about having a smaller handsize. I could make it trash only one card.

Many Dragons probably are something very mean... I'll rethink that. Thank you.

With Sunken City, i don't know. If i wrote it at the top, it would seem like i could get that additional card both times. If i write it under the text, it looks awkward.

Btw. Vampire used a Bane Card originally - i wanted it to be less swingy, as Silver is something nice in almost every game, while some Bane Cards are not.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 06:12:30 pm by Asper »
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zahlman

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2013, 06:06:34 pm »
+1

I have almost no idea how the card effect is tied to the card name in most cases.
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SirPeebles

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2013, 06:15:49 pm »
+1

I have almost no idea how the card effect is tied to the card name in most cases.

Really?  I thought that they were rather thematic.  Especially by Dominion standards.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2013, 07:18:37 pm »
0

I have almost no idea how the card effect is tied to the card name in most cases.

Temple has a religious theme, as Chapel and Bishop have a religious theme.
Grand Vizier can gain Harem and spares Victory cards, as he is an Intrigue-afine character.
Sunken Village is a Magic Seaside village.
Amazon Village is a Village you can use to attack more often.
The prizes are rewards for winning a Tournament (Crest stands for a noble title, though).
Vampire is a strong, corrupting card that is scared of Silver, which is said to help against evil forces.
Necromancer makes cards come back from the graveyard trash.
Wizards brew Potions.
Poisoner is a mean, game-poioning card (much meaner than it seams, especially when played several times) and gives you something not too trustworthy in a bottle.
Shaman has a pseudo-religios theme and is a pseudo-trasher.
Palace wants riches.
Enchanted Forest is cursed.
Maze is admittedly a pun in german, where "Irrgarten" means Maze, but also can be translated to "Twisted Garden".
Artefact is valuable and has a strange power.
Troll is an anti-bridge and lives under one.
Dwarf diggs to the bottom of your deck and hoards things there.
Incantation "summons" a good card by sacrificing a bad.
Seer finds your Action from "the future" and, by the way, counters Fortune Teller.

EDIT: Tried some fixes to the things eHalcyon pointed out.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 10:15:02 pm by Asper »
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eHalcyon

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2013, 07:21:29 pm »
+1

Maze is admittedly a pun in german, where "Irrgarten" means Maze, but also can be translated to "Twisted Garden".

Oh, neat.  Maybe "Hedge Maze" would make it sound a bit more Garden-like.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2013, 07:41:06 pm »
0

Maze is admittedly a pun in german, where "Irrgarten" means Maze, but also can be translated to "Twisted Garden".

Oh, neat.  Maybe "Hedge Maze" would make it sound a bit more Garden-like.

I will do that if i find a fitting picture, thanks :)
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 07:43:03 pm by Asper »
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2013, 07:31:20 am »
0

Thanks for your points, eHalcyon. I changed most of the cards you criticized.

I'll keep the Prizes as are, though, at least for now. That doesn't mean i won't ever come to my senses ;)

And even though i'm aware Werewolf would be more fitting, i've just grown attached to Vampire with that name.

Here are the other changed Cards:


Wizard
+ 3 Cards
Discard any number of Action cards and Potions from your hand. +2$ per card discarded this way.

When you gain this, gain a Potion.
2$P Action
(Killed the + 1 Buy, too)



Elf
+ 3 actions
+ 1 Buy

When you buy this, put a card from your hand back in the supply. If you do, gain another card costing at most the same as the returned card and put it on top of your deck.
3$ Action



Grand Vizier
+ 1 Action
You may trash a card from your hand that is not a Victory Card. If you now have 2 or less cards in your hand, gain a Treasure Card costing up to 6$ and put it in your hand.
$4 Action
(Only one card trashable)



Necromancer
Reveal the three top cards of your deck. Trash as many of them as you like. Discard the rest. Name a card. If such a card is in the trash, each other player must gain a copy of it. He may choose to gain it from the trash, if it still is there.
4$ Action - Attack
(Attack is not directed anymore. Opponents can gain cards from the trash to stop it hitting - theoretically)



Amazon Village
+ 1 Card
+ 1 Action
Trash a card from your hand.




At the start of your next turn:
+ 1 Action

While this is in play, if another player plays an Attack Card, you may immediately gain a copy of the played Attack Card.
5$ Action - Duration
(Nerfed, so it's weaker than Junk Dealer without the "While in play" aspect)



Dragon
+ 3 Cards
Each other player chooses one: He gains a Curse; Or: He reveals his hand. You decide whether he has to discard it and draw 5 new Cards;
$5 Action - Attack
(Added Torturer choice, and now it resembles that card quite a bit. I don't know if i like that, maybe something fitting the alternative would be nicer.)



Maze
Each other player gains a Curse.
Value 2 VP for each three Curses in the set of the player with the most Curses in his set at the end of the game (rounded down).
5$ Action - Attack - Victory
(All Mazes are now equally much worth - you might even happen to be that player yourself.)



Temple
Trash up to three cards from your hand. + 1 Card per card trashed this way.
Value 1 VP per 10 cards in the trash at the end of the game (rounded down).
5$ Action - Victory
(Reduced the price and pushed it to trash up to three cards)
« Last Edit: June 19, 2013, 02:07:48 pm by Asper »
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One Armed Man

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2013, 09:45:11 am »
+1

I have to give you credit for accepting suggestions well.

Grand Vizier: I am still worried. One disappearing village and this is a non-terminal to-hand Gold gainer for $4. Look at Explorer, which requires a more-difficult combo (Province), is terminal, and offers a consolation prize. The more I think about it, I like the +1 Action to discourage BM-this, so it would be something else that changed. If my wording was cleaned, I would like a version that said: "Gain a Treasure card costing 8-X or less and put it in your hand, where X is the number of cards in your hand" and to weaken it you change it to 7-X.

Amazon Village: Like many fan-expansions, this set has a high trash-ratio. I would like a version of this that was cheaper ($3?), didn't have the "trash a card from hand", and required you to trash itself from play to get the action card.

Elf: People may not know that you can still buy an Elf with no cards in hand. "You may" on the on-buy may also improve the power-level.

Temple: Doesn't scale well for multiplayer. In a 4 player game, it is worth (on average) 2x as much VP. It is wordy and confusing, but would some version of "5 cards in the trash per player" work?

Magic Sword: I used "Legendary Sword" as a card in the filling out the box thread. http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=4758.0 I also used "Royal Guard" as an attack-stopping Reaction, be it a Moat-like one. This is the wordiest and most problematic card here.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #14 on: March 07, 2013, 10:25:29 am »
0

I have to give you credit for accepting suggestions well.

I want them to be good, that's all. But thanks. I'm very glad if people care to suggest things, so i would be a fool not to take them into consideration.


Grand Vizier: I am still worried. One disappearing village and this is a non-terminal to-hand Gold gainer for $4. Look at Explorer, which requires a more-difficult combo (Province), is terminal, and offers a consolation prize. The more I think about it, I like the +1 Action to discourage BM-this, so it would be something else that changed. If my wording was cleaned, I would like a version that said: "Gain a Treasure card costing 8-X or less and put it in your hand, where X is the number of cards in your hand" and to weaken it you change it to 7-X.

The point of the card is that i want it to reward small handsize. Explorer can gain silver with a big hand and buy something afterwards. The Gold in hand often is not that useful to Grand Vizier as it is gained at a low handsize. I could think about making the trashing mandatory. I'll try your scaling suggestion in a playtesting session today, though. Thanks for it.


Amazon Village: Like many fan-expansions, this set has a high trash-ratio. I would like a version of this that was cheaper ($3?), didn't have the "trash a card from hand", and required you to trash itself from play to get the action card.

The trashing is quite new to the card, and it's not that i have grown attached to it :)
actually, originaly it was a trash for benefit, but it's been a Village for some time now, and i think it's better, as you can play the attacks then. At 3$ it will resemble Sunken City very much, i fear - but maybe i can weld them together or something

Elf: People may not know that you can still buy an Elf with no cards in hand. "You may" on the on-buy may also improve the power-level.

Probably. I'll change that, it's not as if it was a Power card with that added.


Temple: Doesn't scale well for multiplayer. In a 4 player game, it is worth (on average) 2x as much VP. It is wordy and confusing, but would some version of "5 cards in the trash per player" work?

It never occured to me that you could word this as easy as that. I'll try that, thank you :)


Magic Sword: I used "Legendary Sword" as a card in the filling out the box thread. http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=4758.0 I also used "Royal Guard" as an attack-stopping Reaction, be it a Moat-like one. This is the wordiest and most problematic card here.

It's terrible, i know ^^
It's just that some friends of mine have grown attached to it and i tried to save it. I'll just remove it for now.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2013, 06:38:36 pm »
0

Thanks for those further suggestions, i guess it's time for round 3:
I did not change Amazon Village, though. A version for 4$ did terrible today and i'll playtest before i make a change - if i do, as i feel it's okay the way it is right now. Well, there's no accounting for taste :)

Version 3


Elf
+ 3 Actions
+ 1 Buy
When you buy this, you may put a card from your hand back in the supply. If you do, gain another card costing at most the same as the returned card and put it on top of your deck.
3$ Action



Grand Vizier
If you have two or less cards in hand, gain a Treasure costing up to 6$ and put it in your hand. Choose one: Discard a Treasure card. If you do: + 1 Action; Or: Trash up to two cards from your hand.
4$ Action
(Didn't really playtest it yet, probably it's still not exactly what i want. But i think the way the card is constructed works - only give the Action if you choose the weakest option, still this option will bring you closer to Gold. Also checks for handsize before any chance to do something about it. Note that disappearing Villages alone can not trigger GVs Gold anymore.)



Dragon
+ 3 Cards
Each other player chooses one: He reveals the top three cards of his deck and discards those you choose, putting the rest back in the order he chooses; Or: He reveals his hand and you decide whether he has to discard it and draw 5 new cards.
5$ Action
(This is now a mix between a mean Minion and a mean Rabble instead of a Witch and a Militia as with Torturer. Is it too wordy? I like how players with an allready bad hand are not hurt, but players with a good one decide if their actual or next turn might get damaged. In this aspect, the Rabble is more fitting than a Curse. Also it's more hurtful than original Rabble, as the attacker can leave Copper or Ruins on your deck. This compensates the victims can choose what hurts them less.)



Temple
Trash up to three cards from your hand. + 1 Card per card trashed this way.

Value 1 VP for each 5 cards in the trash per player at the end of the game (rounded down).
5$ Action - Victory
(Thanks for the brilliant idea with the per-player-counting, OneArmedMan.)
« Last Edit: June 19, 2013, 02:08:11 pm by Asper »
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One Armed Man

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2013, 08:51:48 pm »
+1

You are welcome Asper:

I thought about Dragon. I like the curse version better than the Rabbley version, since Rabble is already a mediocre $5 attack and already has +3 cards, it will be the most frequent choice, especially if the top cards are provably weak. I had an idea for that part of the card: "he gains a card costing $2 or less of your choice". If Ruins are available from a Looter, you can choose them. You can choose Estates or Coppers when Curses are out. The "$2 or less" bit is to prevent team-ups where you give a friend a province. It is a little more powerful than the curse bit, admittedly.

Switching the order of the effects is the right call on Grand Vizier. I don't think the Grand Vizier's optional +1 Action needs to be dependant on having a treasure in hand. Like Throne Room, it is unaccountable (meaningless because you can choose the other option). My updated wording is ambiguous; you shouldn't use it: "Choose one: Trash up to 2 cards from your hand; or +1 Action and you may discard a treasure card"
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #17 on: March 08, 2013, 09:16:17 am »
0

You are welcome Asper:

I thought about Dragon. I like the curse version better than the Rabbley version, since Rabble is already a mediocre $5 attack and already has +3 cards, it will be the most frequent choice, especially if the top cards are provably weak. I had an idea for that part of the card: "he gains a card costing $2 or less of your choice". If Ruins are available from a Looter, you can choose them. You can choose Estates or Coppers when Curses are out. The "$2 or less" bit is to prevent team-ups where you give a friend a province. It is a little more powerful than the curse bit, admittedly.

Switching the order of the effects is the right call on Grand Vizier. I don't think the Grand Vizier's optional +1 Action needs to be dependant on having a treasure in hand. Like Throne Room, it is unaccountable (meaningless because you can choose the other option). My updated wording is ambiguous; you shouldn't use it: "Choose one: Trash up to 2 cards from your hand; or +1 Action and you may discard a treasure card"

I like your solution for Dragon. But maybe some will argue that the choice makes it an directed attack, as i can choose Curse for one player (who uses Baron) and Estate for another one (who uses Enchanted Forest)... I don't mind it's more powerful that usual Cursers, as it's an option.

I don't think i wholly understand your point on Grand Vizier, though. Maybe it's my fault that the wording is confusing, i allready wrote i'm not perfectly happy with it. You only get one Action if you discard the treasure. So if you do not discard a treasure, it's the same as choosing the trashing option and trashing 0 cards.

I'll work a bit more on it. I personally think there are two things that have improved with the newest version: 1. Checking your handsize before reducing it. 2. Making players work for that action to avoid too strong non-terminal trashing.
I think it's more than allright you get a Gold every time you have two GV in hand, if you compare it to Treasure Map. So maybe it should be like this:

A (might be too strong):
Grand Vizier
If you have two or less cards in hand, gain a Treasure costing up to 6$ and put it in your hand.
You may trash up to two cards from your hand.
You may discard a Treasure card. If you do: + 1 Action
4$ Action

B (Probably too weak):
Grand Vizier
+ 1 Action
If you have two or less cards in hand, gain a Treasure costing up to 6$ and put it in your hand.
Choose one: Trash a card from your hand; Or: Dicard a card;
4$ Action

C:
Grand Vizier
If you have at most two cards in hand, gain a Treasure costing up to 6$ and put it in your hand.
Choose one: Dicard two cards. If you do: + 1 Card, + 1 Action;
Or: Trash up to two cards from your hand that are not victory cards;
4$ Action

I'll playtest them as soon as i can and then decide which one i'll take, i guess...
« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 12:01:28 am by Asper »
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enfynet

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #18 on: March 08, 2013, 11:46:18 am »
+1

Why can't you just say "less than 3 cards"
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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2013, 11:48:26 am »
+1

Why can't you just say "less than 3 cards"
"Two or less" is better.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #20 on: March 08, 2013, 11:52:05 am »
0

Because with prices you're told to gain a card costing "up to 6", not "less than 7". Dominion usually specifies the inclusive.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2013, 11:53:38 am by Asper »
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eHalcyon

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #21 on: March 08, 2013, 12:15:37 pm »
+1

Because with prices you're told to gain a card costing "up to 6", not "less than 7". Dominion usually specifies the inclusive.

Dominion often says "less than" for prices. I don't think there is precedence for cards. Taking the less wordy option would be better, I think.

It should be "fewer" for cards, not "less".
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #22 on: March 08, 2013, 12:55:25 pm »
0

Because with prices you're told to gain a card costing "up to 6", not "less than 7". Dominion usually specifies the inclusive.

Dominion often says "less than" for prices. I don't think there is precedence for cards. Taking the less wordy option would be better, I think.

It should be "fewer" for cards, not "less".

Hmm... Catacombs and Border Village use that wording, you are right... But saying "up to one less than this" would be silly, there.

As i have proven on more than one occasion, english is not my mother language... Would "At most 2" be okay? It's the shortest i can think of, and in any case i like the inclusive option a bit more than the exclusive one.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2013, 12:59:19 am »
0

Grand Vizier, V 3
Now with fancy new wording instead of "less than 2" ;P

(I'll not post an image here again, there's no artwork for the card, anyway)


Grand Vizier
If you have at most 2 cards in hand, gain a Treasure card costing up to 6$ and put it in your hand.
Choose one:
Trash up to 2 cards from your hand;
Or: Discard 2 cards. If you do: + 1 Card, + 1 Action
$4 Action


Main question: Should the trashing exclude VP-cards again or would that be too weak? Right now i'm going for this version, and i'm much too tired for playtesting (05:41 o'clock here...). All i know is it would make the discard option more important.

Secondary question: I read in another thread how a Vizier is usually regarded an evil character, and so if the second option comes of too weak / trashing will exclude victories i might add a little attack. Is it obvious to you that would not work? I don't want the second option to seem much better than the first, either. Also, in case an attack seems okay to you: What do you think are weak attacks? Is giving out Coppers one?

I am grateful you for your advice and input :)
« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 01:01:06 am by Asper »
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Asper

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Re: Dominion:Magic - now with over 9000% more Images (and Text, too)
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2013, 11:25:56 am »
0

I think i found what i was looking for:




Grand Vizier
+ 1 Action
If you have at most 2 cards in hand, gain a treasure card costing up to 6$ and put it in your hand.
Choose one:
Trash 2 cards from your hand;
Or: Discard 2 cards. If you do: + 1 Card and each other player gains a Copper;
4$ Action - Attack


What do you think?
I like the symmetry (2 cards), and how you'll always end up with a smaller handsize. Its trashing is much stronger than Stewards, as it's nonterminal, but it offers no good choice if you allready have a good hand. So if you don't want to loose the good cards in your hand, discard them, cycle a bit, and attack. I think the attack is not too strong, as discarding two cards is a high price, especially as you discard before drawing. It still can gain Harem, and now also attacks Grand Market strategy. Only one can be truly grand, after all ;)
« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 11:28:23 am by Asper »
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